"We can't even make a consistent prognosis of her fate, including... whether she is alive or dead."
UPDATE JANUARY 2010 THE MCCANNS COULD HAVE BEEN CHARGED WITH CHILD KIDNAPPING AND TRAFFICKING (Pt Prosecutor giving evidence in an ongoing case in Portugal where the McCanns are demanding ONE MILLION POUNDS IN DAMAGES FROM THE OFFICER WHO INVESTIGATED THEM!!!
5 Jun 2008
SUPERMUMMY RACHEL AND WHAT THE AMERICANS THINK
Supermummy Rachel steams in...where is your baby then Rachel, got a clue?
I would like to announce to you all that my family and I will be going away on holiday for a week soon.
Despite this news being nothing to do with anyone else (actually we are not going anywhere except the barristers chamber for extensive briefing + body language counselling) I thought I should let you all know.
Docmac In terms of the beast of a motorbike Kawasaki GPZ it was my Danish mate Jan's. I was too scared to ever ride it on my own. Far too heavy for me and far too dangerous. The picture was taken just opposite the mermaid in the sea at Copenhagen. Their is a park just right by there. These days I am very happy to potter around in my car an old Peugeout which has not let me down and keeps me warm thus keeping any early arthritis at bay !!!
Have a really nice break, and don't forget to have five drinks a week - apparently, according to today's news, it helps prevent arthritis; so enjoy yourself!!
PMSL after reading last nights posts on the other thread. Especially Doc - Never, ever, never...never...ever etc.
Dylan,
Your post from last night:
Don't worry though, I am deeply in love with my sofa. (did you read the story in the papers about the woman who 'married' her wall? it's called object - something - or other!!) xx
Wednesday, 4 June 2008 20:46:00 o'clock BST
I think I was conned nearly 26 years ago. Sometimes when I talk to my hubby it is as if I am talking to a brick wall!
Viv,
The new pics excellent. Now I can see the wardrobe the abductor possibly hid in it all makes sense. He just squeezed in amongst all the bags, clothes etc, there was plenty of room inside to hide and of course never made a sound.
I am starting to pack my blue tennis bag right now. I have lots of pens and papers and my wife has told me to remember my barristers manual that I am currently reading. In return I have reminded her to co-ordinate her dresses and accessories for the week we are being programmed by our legal team oops sorry for the week we are going on holiday.
I no longer need all that stuff on dogs and their role in forensics so I have more space in my 'holiday' bag now. Any ideas on what I could now take for that week?
Atardi, LVA is very interesting! Personally I think there is a lot of truth in it, more so than "lie-detector" tests. There are a lot of things on that Dutch website that we never, ever see here! Don't you think it has gone awfully QUIET recently?!
"We are not going to comment on anything" and rubs his ear at the same time, and Kate sitting by his side looking as though she'd rather fall through the floor, then you know he's lying or covering up!
If you are looking in can you let someone know on 3A's that my account on there looks to have vanished into thin air?? It no longer recognises me or my password, so I am not re-registering just yet?? Gremlins about I think..
Thanks for the 2 video links speaks volumes there must be body language exprets and speach experts all over the place watching what these two say and do. No wonder they never took a lie detector test like they said they would be happy to do.
Wouldnet any of us if inocent do one just to make people who doubt us shut up?
Then again anyone I know if they found themselves in the same tragic situation as the McCanns would be doing everything they could to assit the police and would certainly not be trying to call the shots or refusing to answer any questions.
Poor little girl did not stand a chance neglected and vanished and no one who should care about her wants her parents to answer any questions surely the NSPCC or some one who says they care about child saftey should be comenting on how this is not the way to raise children or is Madeleine not important?
I honestly think the Portugese should employ MOSSAD tactics and 'kidnap' the parents secretly 'bundling' them into a 'private jet' and then forcing them to appear in front of the world's media in a huge press conference where direct probing questions would be thrown their way before keeping them in separate cells for the courtcase whereby hey presto justice for maddie would be done. (IMO)
Sorry forgot to say that Clarence would be left deliberately behind in the Mossad style raid ensuring how pathetic his role has been throughout and what an unecessary character he is.
What a great idea. A pencil case seems the perfect size for storing your medicines such as sleeping tablets. And I mean, who goes on holiday these days without a spare shower curtain tucked away into their suitcase.
Firstly, I must apologise for my awful spelling last night, I cannot believe I said Knowhere instead of nowhere lol,, my excuse is we have workmen in at the moment, early starts late meals :o))
Just out of interest, does anyone know how to change spell check from American to English, not that I am making any excuses of course, it is just so frustrating :o((
I am pleased you enjoyed the light entertainment offered last night with of course our dear Doc in the lead role, sad we are never, ever, in fact ever, to see him on here again, now I wonder.
I love the top pic, it is so explicit. The huge SS McCann ship is sinking. Gerry has just one hand out of the water, but even so the PJ in their tiny boat have a gun trained at him, they have Popeye to help and he is invincible. It is a David and Goliath story where the good guys might have been a lot smaller but they win.
The picture of the McCanns backing an amber alert is particularly hard hitting because we should never forget this couple were prepared to become fabulously wealthy, out of people's pensions and pocket money and because their little girl died for which they knew all along they and they alone, were responsible.
At the end of the day, we are not joking. Rachel keeps mouthing off in the newspapers, but she committed not only a serious criminal offence but one that shows she is a mom who just did not care about her little baby. But she cares about herself, now..
Regarding your account on 3A's. I changed my email address and sign in name. My account was activated after a couple of hours.
Don't give up, remember, that is what they would all like us to do, but we will NOT forget Madeleine who should now be 4 years old and enjoying another holiday with her brother and sister.
Hi Di, I have not seen you mentioned but there is still a pornagraphic picture of an enormous fat woman on top of a naked, tiny man..paedophiles and pervents anon!
Thanks very much for the results of the voice analysist who looked tested the clip where Gerry is denying they used any kind of sedatives on their kids and pulling his ear, smirking etc.
"Highly stressed, probably false, inaccurate"
Confirms what worldwide opinion seems to be on this, they did sedate their kids and were then confident in the belief they never even needed to check to see if they were OK. In short sadistic maniacs who just wanted to dump their kids and shut them up, day and night. When one of them dies, again, they think only of themselves..and how much money they can make out of it. Even some pscyopaths would be appalled..
I know it is possible to analyse tapes for stressors in the voice and the police worldwide employ these techniques but certainly do not know about these techniques in any depth.
I believe it was with more up to date voice analysis techniques that they were assisted to locate the false Jack the ripper, who pretended he was carrying out Sutcliffe's murderous attacks and ultimately received 8 years for his trouble - "Weirside Jack"
Let's face it a holiday for the McCanns is not on the cards is it. I am intrigued as to what the next news out of the Portugese side of things may bring.
I think a good move now would be to make the dodgy Tapas 4 (Oldfields + OB + JT) arguidos and question them further.
ie Raise the heat and see if they are prepared to voluntarily dish the dirt fully to ensure their own survival etc.
I don't know whether anyone has been following the McCann's new appeal and helpline asking for witnesses to come forward and let them know what they have told the PJs and Police. On 3A's, a poster says he e-mailed the hotline several times, that was 3 weeks ago and he has still not had a reply. The way of thinking is this was just another sham. Let the public think we are trying to do everything to find Maddie.
Have to go now but will read and catch up tomorrow.
I wonder if there is any need to make Tanner, OB and The Oldfield arguidos to interview them further?
If the police now have a case against OB and Tanner in particular, I can see no reason why they could not just be charged alongside the McCanns at the end of the process. I still wonder if it is too late now to actually prosecute the Oldfields for child neglect. The reason they were not prosecuted in the early stages has always been obvious to me, at any rate, because it would have damaged the investigation of far more serious crime, i.e. murder/manslaughter, kidnapping, disposal of a corpse.
I do not think the new appeal was so much with the intention of just convincing people they are still trying. I think it was more to do with trying to find people who will be prepared to say something different to the mass of evidence the police have against them, so that they can create that element of doubt which is after all the only thing a defendant needs to do to secure an acquittal. An acquittal does not necessarily mean the person is innocent, it is far more technical than that, it means the prosecution have failed to prove their case beyond reasonable doubt. The more evidence the McCanns can obtain of spooky characters hanging around the more they seek to shake the prosecution case. However, I think this is quite pathetic and just like they tried to shake the dog evidence, doomed to failure. It is an example of them knowing just how bad the evidence against them is and just how desperate they are to try and shake it with the likes of Gail Cooper etc. - truly pathetic!
As you so rightly say an acquittal doesn't necessarily prove a person's innocence. There have been countless trials where guilty defendants have got off on a technicality only.
The McCanns have no doubt got very clever lawyers in Portugal who could get them off a charge by producing some technicality or other the prosecutors haven't spotted.
At the end of the day though, the public aren't fools and if the McCanns are charged and get as far as a courtroom and avoid a sentence due to a technicality, the shame will be with them forever.
Let's say the Portuguese charged them with something and they were convicted but then set free on some technicality, would they be liable under British law for fraudulent actions in setting up the Madeleine Fund that many members of the public contributed to?
The behaviour of the McCanns and their friends in refusing to attend a reconstructions speaks for itself and to the strength of the prosecution case against them.
They have a vast amount of direct witnesses who will say that they told blatant lies, including even, members of the TAPAS group. There is only one reason for Jane Tanner to immediately invent an abductor and it is a very sinister reason. What is more it can be conclusively proved that she was telling lies, in short she knew the McCanns killed Madeleine. On top of all this we have forensic evidence and the dogs. I actually believe PJ are going for a murder charge and that is why they wanted the evidence of those 14 texts from an unidentified number on 2 May, the day before Madeleine went missing. This is highly significant because it demonstrates planning, ie. murder. I feel that without this it is just possible the case may not be strong enough to support a murder conviction but that is what they feel actually happened. If they cannot prove murder, then clearly prosecution can and often do, go for manslaughter instead. The one big problem for the police has always been the fact that McCanns and possibly others deliberately concealed Madeleine's body, if they had found that, this case would have been over long ago. Looking at it another way, if they can prove the McCanns deliberately concealed Madeleine's body this may also go to proving intention for murder, they needed to conceal that evidence of deliberately causing her harm. If you put the two together of what seems very likely, wanting to leave her to go out drinking, wanting to stop her crying again, so oversedating her, that has to be extremely close to murder in itself, when you put all the other evidence to that of state of mind etc. you can see where this has taken the police. Naturally they will always wish to obtain evidence to actually prove what they believe happened, no one can blame them for that, but look what they came up against, including a deliberate trashing of the evidence and delay in calling the police.
Hi BT. I'm not staying, but thought I must post as you're here. It's best you were scared of that monster in Copenhagen. They were more dangerous than British doctors in a Portuguese resort.
Barn shrouds, sorry I mean towels. I stutter occasionally when typing . Yes, quite an uncommon species in Portugal I hear. All sightings are treated with great interest.
There is no prospect of the McCanns getting off on a technicality. The only prospect is they may avoid a murder rap. They have actually admitted leaving her alone every single night, and they have also actually admitted they did that again, even though she and her little brother had woken up crying. The police also have evidence Madeleine died and they concealed the body.
In Portuguese law, where there has been gross child negligence and as a result the child dies, the maximum penalty is 10 years in jail, so, as a minimum, that is what they are looking at.
The prosecutor currently has an immensely difficult job of looking at all the evidence and carefully considering what charges can be proved on that evidence. I am not in his position of knowing all this but I can say based on what I know the McCanns are definitely going to be convicted on the basis of the above but quite probably worse than that.
Thanks for your reply to mine. In my opinion the Prosecutor has a decidedly difficult job with this particular case. A case that has gained enormous interest worldwide and I can imagine lawyers the world over are waiting to either applaud or criticise whatever decisions he comes to. I wouldn't like to be in his shoes really because he'll be damned if he does and damned if he doesn't!
We'll just have to wait and see and keep everything crossed at the same time!
Het is zo ongekend rustig op dit moment dat je een naald kunt horen vallen.
I wonder why it's so quiet at this moment and why the public must know that the "remaining kids" like a Dutch paper reported this week, "need" a holiday.o the public must change their opinion, because 2 little kids want a holiday. Right!
They want us to believe that the Social Service in England is not watching them. That's one of the reasons that Kate stays at home(IMO). She has to.
I posted some time back that as we got to the stage where charges were imminent our press would have to go very quiet because otherwise the McCanns could complain they damaged their right to a fair trial. I know our press have been guilty of biased and unfair reporting on the McCann's behalf but now they will genuinely be fearful of our own Contempt of Court Act 1981 that could see them in real trouble if they do not watch what they print. It is pretty draconian against offending newspapers. It is very different in the States, they can accurately report the case against the accused and even offer opinion on guilt, our own press cannot.
The visit to the Pope arranged, I think by both McGuinness and Mitchell was self-serving and sickening, just like all their other media games. What I found even more repugnant was Kate reaching out to children in the crowd so they could grab her hand, just like Princess Diana. I find it deeply insulting to the memory of Diana that Kate tries to emulate her and also successfully got the public to give to a massive fund after the death of Madeleine, just like happened in Princess Diana's case, even trademarking the image, just the same. Cynical and horrible, but they will pay the price for this.
"Oh woe is me, I am in despair, these McCann trolls, are every flipping where, it matters not, how hard I try, they multiply they multiply"
The thing is though, the PJ do not give a toss about trolls and neither do I!!
However, I do wish the McCanns would spend the Fund on genuine lost and needy children, rather than sick greedy adults who care nothing for innocent and defenceless little ones.
They can play as many games as they like, and continue to cash in on the death of a beautiful little girl. At the end of the day, they have to look at what they see in the mirror.
They also need to remember what they do is so futile..
I see OldMum has been consulting her doctor about me. How sad is that? He apparently believes a doctor could not possibly find the time for blogging. There are thousands of medical blogs and fora out there, chum. I even run a couple myself. Get into the 21st century!
Hey Mum, I'm the main oke. I employ people to do the work. I work when I want to, because it's stimulating, que? I even find the time to run a couple of not very tiny businesses on the side. Phew, I'd better get some rest.
Love from the managing Director Of Cleaners, Maids And Chauffeurs. INC.
I read mum's consultant apparently told her you were breaking the law of medical ethics. The thing is law and ethics are two different things. A solicitor or doctor could be in breach of a professional code of practice but not breaking the law at all.
As you say there are all sorts of medical forums where doctors exchange views and seek advice on patient conditions. I have read many myself. I am sure that would be too heavy for Mum.
A consultant is obviously a heck of a lot brighter than "Mum21" and simply would not have made such an ignorant statement, it was the law according to Mum 21, and a fat lot she knows about "law" or "professional ethics".
Hiya Claudia, Hun, much quieter tonight, I think we are all tired:-))))))
I know that! I find it just as amusing when they try to explain criminal law, the law of evidence or the law of libel to me. They did not even understand those are three different subjects!
I have to catch some sleep now, Viv. Whatever happened to the mother and son retards from Spain by the way? I haven't heard anything about them for some time now. Spending the cash I suppose.
If they admit they are still paying the Retardos all that money and they have not come up with one credible lead, then that looks bad for them. If they admit they sacked them for failing to come up with one credible lead, then that looks bad for them as they whinge the police no longer look for Madeleine, neither do they.
They are backed into a corner with nowhere to go, but they know where they are going x
Something useful on the Pink Blog for a change including a very helpful post from 4Portugal (although I think he / she was wasting time trying to explain anything there).
Maths was never my strong point but the prosecutor wanted 10 mobiles from only 9 owners. That is odd! When I used to work with drug using offenders they quite often had more than one mobile. This was to evade the police and keep their drug dealing calls on a separate number etc. So to me someone who owned more than one mobile often does so for a criminal reason. Did Gerry McCann have two mobiles, I wonder? I think that is a very good question, and if so, why would that be!!! There clearly is a connection between Murat and this party and I still have an uneasy feeling here. The Exeter connection, the labour party rally/Leicester connection. I think I am probably wrong because they returned all Murat's property which clearly implies he is not involved but he is still an arguido and it was decidedly odd how angry Gerry got when asked if he knew Robert Murat. Whenever the questions get difficult he refuses to answer. My main thought has been he used him as a perfect Patsy, knowing full well he was there in PDL, but somehow, I cannot completely rule his involvement out, but the most obvious reason he really could not be involved is McCann friends SAYING HE IS X
Gerry Denies Receiving Mystery Texts
Updated:09:02, Thursday May 29, 2008 Sky News
Gerry McCann has denied he received a string of mystery texts the day before his daughter disappeared in the Algarve.
According to court documents issued by Portugal's supreme court, police applied to seize his phone records after learning of the alleged messages. Investigators claim 18 text messages were sent to Mr McCann from an unidentified number around the time Madeleine vanished in Praia da Luz on May 3 last year. It is alleged that 14 messages were texted on May 2 and four more on May 4.
But the McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell said Gerry had no knowledge of the texts and received a handful of calls on his mobile in the days before his daughter disappeared. The documents reveal that public prosecutor Magalhaes e Meneses also sought access to text and phone messages from 10 mobile telephones thought to belong to the McCanns and seven of their friends.
He also asked for a full list of all the calls made between the group from when they arrived in Portugal on April 28 and when the McCanns left on September 9. But the supreme court issued a detailed ruling rejecting the application.
It also revealed that Kate and Gerry McCann could face charges of neglecting their daughter on the night she disappeared. The police inquiry also covers possible abduction, homicide and concealment of a corpse, the documents say.
But Mr Mitchell emphasised the court papers did not mean such a charge would materialise. He said the couple vigorously denied neglecting Madeleine and welcomed the fact that abduction was also being considered by detectives.
He said: "This court document outlines the areas of the investigation and in no way suggests Kate and Gerry will be facing any such charges. Equally we have heard nothing officially to suggest any such area of investigation is being considered. However, we do note that abduction is apparently one of the parameters and we welcome that because that is what Kate and Gerry and their friends have said and that is what happened. If there is any suggestion of neglect charges being considered that will be vigorously denied because the legal advice that Kate and Gerry have received both in Portugal and Britain is that legally speaking everything they were doing that week was well within the bounds of responsible parenting."
A neglect charge carries a maximum penalty of 10 years. But it is understood for such a charge to stand up the prosecutors would have to show the McCanns intended to neglect Madeleine. Posted by Sass at 08:56 475 comments: «Oldest ‹Older 1 – 200 of 475 Newer› Newest» 4portugal said... The court document is not a leak. It is an official document covering a verdict by a judge on the ruling that content of messages (text and otherwise) prior to 3 May CANNOT be officially used. A ruling/verdict is no longer covered by secrecy laws, because, obviously if there is a ruling, the case is closed (on that particular matter - phones). In the document it states that the McCanns are arguidos (suspects) for homicide, exposure, abandonment, disposal of a body. Homicide in Portuguese can me manslaughter or homicide. The document does not specify. Also, it does not say if these are the charges, if any, that will be brought against the McCanns. However, another point anyone with sense would realize is that the judge would not be ruling on unexistant phone or text messages, making it impossible for them to be used in court. Had they not existed and the Prosecutor requested them, the Judge would have laughed him out of court with a reprimand.
Police are trained on the m.o. of dangerous stalkers who harass female victims, that they may well go on to kill, so time and time again, why do they let this happen. It is a terrible tragedy that victims cannot be protected before it is too late, my heart goes out to her poor mum who just cannot stop sobbing. The victim was black, IMO, they get an even worse service from the police due to this. When are our police going to realise that all human life is precious and do something to be proactive, rather than reactive?
Stabbed schoolgirl Arsema Dawit: Cops knew of stalker's threats By Robert Stansfield And Jeff Edwards 4/06/2008 Arsema Dawit (Pic:Getty Images) Related Articles Man charged over Arsema Dawit Murder MPs to discuss knife killings Mum shops son to cops for having knife Teenage girl stabbed to death had complained of previous assault
(What's this?)Police probing the savage murder of a girl in a lift were warned a stalker threatened to kill her - but failed to stop him, it emerged yesterday.
Arsema Dawit's terrified mum Tsehay raised the alarm after the knife maniac hit the schoolgirl, 15, in a McDonald's seven weeks ago and made his chilling vow.
Yet officers are said to have claimed they could do little - and were still investigating slowly when the church-going teenager was butchered near her home.
Yesterday, family friends blasted police for not taking action that could have saved her life.
One, Simon Tesfaghiorgish, raged: "I didn't know him but he had been harassing her. He beat her and threatened to kill her.
"The mother told police a number of times but they said they couldn't take any action. After things happen, they want to know. We're going to complain about this."
Tsehay was overcome with grief as she visited the scene near London's Waterloo station.
She is thought to have fled war-ravaged Eritrea in East Africa three years ago with Arsema, son Robel, 13, and daughter Faruz, 12, for what they believed was the safety of Britain.
A friend, Mrs Berekati Asfeday, said: "Her mother can't talk, just cry non-stop. She was a beautiful girl."
The friend is thought to have waited with Tsehay for Arsema to return from school on Monday.
But the girl was stabbed 10 times and left the blade in her back.
The attack was so frenzied that the handle snapped. Wayne Fort, whose partner discovered the body, said he had once seen Arsema's relatives warning the stalker off.
The killer, also believed to be Eritrean, grew infatuated with her after they met at church.
But she was so in fear of him that she stopped attending services.
Last night police confirmed that on April 30 they were told of "an allegation of assault and threats to kill" arising from the incident in a McDonald's two weeks earlier.
But they said that when they quizzed Arsema at school she denied all knowledge of it, a claim Simon furiously denied.
Scotland Yard added: "Despite this, we continued to investigate and Arsema's mother was subsequently contacted on May 19.
"The investigation was still being progressed when Arsema was tragically murdered."
A man, 21, was seized hours after the horror as he tried to leap off nearby Hungerford Bridge into the Thames. He was still being questioned last night.
16 number of teens killed violently in London this year
Yet more horrific news about a "mum" who just wanted to dump her little boy and go party..she wanted her friends to lie for her..I cannot imagine why the Judge did not remand her in custody...prison "almost inevitable" ..what?
Guilty: Mother who locked two-year-old son in flooded kitchen during weekend of partying By Andy Dolan Last updated at 10:37 PM on 05th June 2008
Kelly Tollerton has been convicted of child cruelty after she left her two-year-old son alone in a flooded kitchen for the weekend A mother was facing jail last night for leaving her toddler son alone in a flooded kitchen while she spent a weekend partying.
Kelly Tollerton, 22, was warned that prison was 'almost inevitable' after a judge heard how she left the two-year-old boy, caged in the kitchen by a baby gate, to fend for himself.
He had been forced to sift through bags of rubbish for food 'like a dog'.
The boy was discovered after three days when water from a running tap started pouring through the ceiling of the flat below.
Neighbours saw the boy, who cannot be named for legal reasons, through the letter box and called police.
Shocked officers found him standing in inches of water and shaking with the cold.
He was wearing a filthy babygro and had been using a pile of dirty washing as a bed.
Last night social services launched an inquiry into the case after it emerged that the little boy had been placed on the at-risk register at the age of two months because he was seriously underweight.
Social workers and health visitors later expressed concerns that both the boy and Tollerton's flat in Lincoln were unclean and that he spent a lot time strapped into a car-seat.
But social services ceased contact with him when he was 15 months old because he was attending a nursery where he could be monitored.
Prosecutor Felicity Gerry told Lincoln Crown Court it was 'unfortunate, and that is putting it mildly, that no social worker went to the flat' after that point.
Abandoned: The filthy kitchen where the two-year-old was left while his mother went out partying
The boy - whose fourth birthday on Monday coincided with the start of his mother's trial - is now in foster care and is expected to be adopted. Tollerton's other child is understood to live with his father.
Lincolnshire County Council said the county's Safeguarding Children's Board would be reviewing the case.
Tollerton, a trainee beautician, broke down in tears after being found guilty of two charges of child neglect and a third of attempting to pervert the course of justice.
Recorder William Harbage QC told her: 'This was the culmination of a period of wilful neglect. The parenting of this child was totally inadequate.'
Tollerton had told police she had left the child in the care of her friend Emma Barton while she stayed at her boyfriend's home in November 2006.
Tollerton's ex-friend Emma Barton was blamed for the toddler being left alone But Miss Barton, 22, denied the claim and told the jury that although she had looked after the boy as a favour for Tollerton in the past, the pair had not spoken for weeks after falling out over money.
Another friend, Rachael Manning, 28, told the court she and Tollerton had spent much of the weekend drinking in Lincoln city centre.
She said Tollerton told her she had to support her tale about Miss Barton - but Miss Manning refused.
Tollerton told the jury she had been with her boyfriend, Ken Hill, 20 years her senior.
She claimed they went to a pub for dinner on the Friday night and spent the rest of the weekend at his flat.
The court heard that Tollerton kept bags full of rubbish in the hallway of her flat on Lincoln's notorious Ermine estate because she did not have a dustbin - although she did have a £30-amonth mobile phone contract.
At the end of the four-day trial the jury took less than two and a half hours to dismiss Tollerton's story. She was bailed to return on June 27 for sentencing.
Last night Miss Manning said Tollerton was a flirt who spent her weekends downing alcopops in pubs and taking men home for one-night stands.
Miss Barton, 22, a trainee care assistant, told how she would arrive at Tollerton's flat to look after the boy only to find him strapped into a car seat. She often gave him crisps or biscuits for his breakfast.
She said: 'I would often see her on the bus taking him to nursery, and that is what he would be eating.
'Kelly would just be on her mobile phone, not interested in him in the slightest.
'Once when I accompanied Kelly to collect him from the nursery, Kelly picked him up but he instantly held out his hands to me for a cuddle.'
She said Tollerton took the boy along to her 21st birthday party - and left him strapped in the car outside, claiming he was asleep.
'But when I checked, he wasn't asleep,' Miss Barton said. 'He was sitting there wide awake.'
She said she would often have to supply electricity and gas tokens because Tollerton would leave them without credit in the meters.
Once Tollerton dropped the boy off at Miss Barton's home because she needed to visit a friend in hospital but Miss Barton later found her 'chilling out' at her flat. Tollerton also tried to palm the boy off on other friends.
One, Helen Radford, told the Daily Mail she was forced to call a halt to the arrangement when the boy began to see her as his mother.
Friends also claimed that Tollerton does not know who the boy's father is.
Tollerton is one of four sisters. Her father - whom she doted on - died when she was 15 and she ran away from home around the same time.
She was soon found but was pregnant by a 31-year-old man before she was 16.
Tollerton was supported in court by her mother, Lynn, a cleaner, and her latest boyfriend. They refused to comment.
Last night Christine Banim, Lincolnshire Council's assistant director of children's services, confirmed that the boy's name had been removed from the at-risk register and appropriate support offered through a comprehensive 'child in need' plan.'
She said: 'This involves all agencies who can support the family, and can include as an example health visitors, children centre staff and child minders.'
She said it would 'not be unusual' for a child to be removed from the register when such a plan was in place.
and here is yet another one, and failure by Social Services to properly protect. What more could they have done, removed a child they knew full well to be at serious risk of harm. What use having a review after the child has been murdered? How good of him to finally plead guilty to manslaughter, nevertheless it was murder. Why didn't the social services also ensure this stupid woman, who does not know how to protect either herself or her child got rid of this man?
Death by postcode: Baby killed after social workers lost touch with parents after they moved house By Paul Sims Last updated at 9:53 PM on 05th June 2008
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Claire Morton was found guilty of causing or allowing the death of her baby daughter Elisha A baby girl on the 'at risk' register was shaken to death by her violent father after he evaded social services monitoring by moving two miles to a different local authority area.
An urgent inquiry is under way into the care of Elisha Allen, who was classified as a 'vulnerable' child even before she was born.
At the heart of the investigation is whether vital case notes were forwarded to the new local authority after her parents moved from Penshaw, Sunderland, to Bournmoor in neighbouring County Durham.
It was there that the five-month-old's father, Gary Allen, 25, picked her up in a fit of rage and shook her. She was taken to hospital but died three days later.
Allen has pleaded guilty to manslaughter while his 30-year-old former partner Claire
Morton, who has since given birth to another child, has admitted allowing or causing the death of a child.
'Up until very recently, both defendants had denied responsibility for causing the fatal injuries sustained by Elisha,' said Paul Sloan QC, prosecuting, at Newcastle Crown Court.
'However, about a fortnight ago, Gary Allen finally admitted responsibility lay with him for the infliction of the fatal injuries.
'He admits as a result of a sudden loss of control, he caused Elisha's death by shaking her and that shaking clearly involved an impact as well.
'He denies at that moment he formed an intention to cause a really serious bodily injury.'
The court was told Morton's plea to a lesser charge was accepted on the basis that she was subjected to violence at the hands of Allen and was in fear of him at the time of Elisha's death.
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The couple were living on Avondale Road, Penshaw, Sunderland, when Morton became pregnant with Elisha.
Social services officers from Sunderland City Council visited and told them their unborn child would be placed on the 'at risk' register.
But two months before she was born they moved to Marigold Crescent, Bournmoor, between Chester-le-Street and Houghton-le-Spring.
Although only two miles away the property is over the local boundary in County Durham.
It was therefore down to Durham County Council's social services to monitor the couple and Elisha.
However, on January 21 last year she was admitted to Sunderland Royal Hospital with head injuries.
She was later transferred to Newcastle General Hospital where she was placed on a life - support machine but she died three days later. Durham Police immediately arrested the couple and after an eight-month investigation charged them with murder and allowing or causing the death of a child.
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Enlarge Elisha's parents moved two miles from Penshaw (top right) to Bournmoor (middle left), and into another local authority with a separate social services department
At the start of their trial on Wednesday, however, the Crown Prosecution Service said it accepted guilty pleas to the lesser charges. Allen and Morton, who split up in April last year, will be sentenced on August 1.
Child protection experts in Sunderland and Durham are conducting a Serious Case Review into whether more could have been done to protect the baby.
Local councillor Geoff Armstrong, from Ellesmere, Bournmoor, who sits on Chester-le-Street District Council, said: 'It is no more than ten minutes' walk from Marigold Crescent to the Sunderland boundary, but Marigold Crescent is part of County Durham.'
A spokesman for Durham County Council said: 'We will be happy to share the findings of the review at the appropriate time, at the end of the legal proceedings and following relevant discussions with the coroner.'
Those two awful cases of gross child neglect, one leading to the death of the baby, are just the tip of the iceberg of similar cases past and I'm sure in the future of what is happening to little children in the UK.
When are governments going to make the safety of vulnerable children top priority, such as they do to many other matters nowhere near as important? Neglected children often go on to do the same to their children and so perpetuates. I'm sure that much of the crime we see on the streets of Britain today are the result of negligence by the parents to do their job properly even if there was no direct cruelty. It is still child neglect in my opinion.
There are always going to be cases that slip through the net where there was no reason to believe a child was in danger from the parents, but when a child is on an at risk register the parents should be 100% monitored with a fine tooth comb.
I suppose the problem is the shortage of people wanting to work in this area, because it takes complete dedication and it must be heart wrenching to see children being neglected in any way shape or form.
It would be a good idea once the McCann case is over and done with to carry on with this blog trying to get justice for all the other children who deserve our attention.
Very early today, so I'm off for breakfast - back later.
FFS Viv! I bet that poor black family don't get half the support from celebrities and government that the Macs got!!!!! Of course, it's nothing to do with the fact that they are just poor refugees from Eritrea and not nice, white, middle class doctors with influential friends. My heart goes out to that poor mother, she has had > her fair share of tragedy.
One of the communities our charity worked with in Mozambique, the people lost every single thing they had - twice. The first time they had to flee their village because of civil war. 3 years later, their new village was entirely washed away in a flood. The family I corresponded with lost their wee boy. It was heartbreaking, they never got over it.
Then you get tossers like the bint in Lincoln, and the McCanns. It makes me so MAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The mother who left her child in the kitchen should be jailed for a very long time evil evil woman.
Children are not a right and should be cared for at all times and until the scum parents of this country start to do just that god help our future is it any wonder we have thugs on the streets when their parents (not in all cases) have treated them like they are nothing they have never been respected so respect no one else.
I hope this child is given a chance at life now with a caring family who will show him what love is and just how much fun childhood should be.
The McCann's must not get away with their arrogance and lack of childcare skills they are supposed to be inteligent people and if neglect is alive and kicking amongst educated people as well as uneducated people there are going to be many sad and lonley children who cry out for uncaring parents who dont come.
Stop the spin CM it is not working public opinion of this selfish pair has changed more and more people now see them for the lying selfish people they are they dont want the truth to come out as they are more important than their beautiful 3 year old daughter they left alone to cry
Hiya and thanks for your comments which are really heartfelt from all three of you.
There is an epidemic of serious child abuse in the UK and I agree it would be good to carry on this blog to see what we can do about that. Certainly, I would admire Gordon Brown and his government if he was brave enough to acknowledge this and announce measures to seek to tackle it, no matter how expensive. Just like any good businessman will tell you, you have to speculate to accumulate. What we would accumulate is a nation of safe happy children, who in turn can make their own children safe and happy, rather than perpetuating the cycle of cruel abuse.
We heard all of Tony Blair's talk back in 1997 about being tough not just on crime but on the causes of crime. Well all I can say, 11 years later is we are still waiting. It makes you really fed up with dishonest politicians who only talk the talk to gain election but do not have the guts to spend the money and actually walk the walk. Even the United Nations figures clearly setting out the UK is just about the worst place for little children in the so called civilised world seems to fall on deaf ears.
Maybe given the McCanns have gained such massive publicity, upon conviction of her wicked parents, little Madeleine will fight for all the other little children. We could help her do that.
JUSTICE FOR MADDIE AND ALL ABUSED LITTLE CHILDREN, BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE.
Changing the subject a little here - has anyone else noticed the chains around K's neck in the photo on top of the last Viv blog.
It has a large saw and large hatchet with blood on the end!!
Was this photo taken after Madeleine went missing or before I wonder. If it was after, then not really appropriate under the circumstances in my opinion!
No, that's not me. Not sure how the other bit works either, and I have tried and tried to work out how to put a smilie at the end of a message and cannot do that either. But I am not giving up, if I cannot get Stella by Starlight working again, I will register with something new.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who can't work out how to get a smilie or an abacus that is alive!! Never mind, you'll suss it in the end no doubt.
By the way, the Spanish name for Stella is 'Estrella' - you could try that! or Bella Stella - meaning lovely Stella!!
I shouldn't think it's the name that's the problem though because there are some really unusual and long name there already!
What do you think of the jewellery Kate is wearing in that picture by the way? Well out of order if it was taken after Maddie disappeared don't you think?
I am glad you brought the jewellery thing up. I thought it was just me. I have been watching what she has worn (gold) since the day it happened, and I have to say I have noticed something very odd.
When you look at what people wear, you can tell things about them. If they have style, good taste etc., also you can tell if something is not quite right, either. For an evening out, you may select a very nice necklace to suit your dress, but duing the day especially for a general day to day affair, you would wear the same "comfortable thing" that means a lot to you.
Kate wears a lot of statement pieces, which to me for someone in her position, does not make any sense. i.e.,
If she was a devout catholic, then only a cross and chain would be what she would wear.
If Madeleine had a piece that she had worn, she might think to put that on an adult chain and only wear that.
What possesed her to wear some of those horrible pieces, makes no sense to me at all. And the multi chains thing, is she turning into a Mr T ??
What she wears to me shows the state of her mind, and that is not very good. Not healthy at all...
I agree with you about jewellery - I tend to wear just stuff I've had for ages but always liked during the day, but in the evenings when we go out I choose something a bit more special.
Talking about the 3A's - I noticed someone wrote, I think it was Clear -
"re: the Amber Alert system. Let's not forget that Portugal was one of the 4 Member States already signed up to the system. A fact that K&G strangely neglected to mention in any of their addresses to the world on this subject. It wouldn't do for them to be showing Portugal in a positive light would it?"
If you look at all of Kate's interviews, one of her ears is always very, very red, she fiddles with her earrings all the time (off screen). It is usually the left ear, surprise, surprise.
I did not know that Portugal has already signed up for Amber Alert. Why did the McCann's not mention this?
No I hadn't noticed Kate's red ear I must admit, although considering the amount of fleas she gets in them with the public disquiet about Madeleine's disappearance, I can understand why she would be suffering with red ear syndrome!
The fact that they didn't mention about Portugal having already signed up to the system speaks volumes of how they feel about Portugal!!
Maybe they will, someday, whether they want it or not... -----------------------------------
McCanns: We will never go back to Portugal Daily Star (No online link, paper version only)
By Ian Trueman
05 May 2008
MADELEINE McCann's parents yesterday vowed that they will never return to Portugal.
Kate and Gerry spoke out amid rumours they are planning their first holiday since their daughter vanished in The Algarve last year.
Insiders claim the heartbroken couple, both 40, had earlier ruled out any talk of a vacation.
They are now planning to take their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, away on a "secret" break but refuse to visit Portugal.
Maddie disappeared nine days before her fourth birthday in Praia da Luz in The Algarve in May 2007.
The couple's spokesman Clarence Mitchell yesterday refused to confirm or deny that Gerry and Kate McCann were planning any trip in the "imminent" future.
But he confirmed: "One thing I can say is that it will not be Portugal. It would just create a huge bun fight and they don't want to do that." He added: "It will be incredibly painful to contemplate going away without Madeleine, but this is the reality they are faced with.
"Kate and Gerry have always felt that they did not want to have a holiday under the circumstances.
"But clearly at some point, as much for the twins as for themselves, they may choose to have a break.
"That decision, however, will remain entirely private."
A friend said doctors Kate and Gerry plan to "get away for a few days this summer".
The pal added: "After all they've been through they want to give the twins a decent break to try and enjoy time as a family." Madeleine disappeared from a holiday apartment on May 3 while her parents dined in a nearby tapas bar with friends.
Since they returned home to Rothley, Leics, in September, the McCanns have said they wanted to provide as normal an upbringing as possible for their other children.
The McCanns stayed on in the holiday resort for several months after Madeleine disappeared, but returned home after Portuguese police made them official suspects.
I just stepped out of a Cleaners' Union meeting, as things were getting a little dirty. I popped into the3arguidos to see how things are going, and especially wanted to learn more about what happened there. Along the way I ran into these pearls of wisdom:
Tony_Q I'm new here and I was convinced that dark powers had hacked the site for good when it vanished. I googled 'McCann Forum' to see if there was anywhere else I could go and to my astonishment I found this unbelievable place http://justice4mccannfam.forum.biz/ I joined without realising exactly what it was and made a post about how disgusting it was that the gruesome twosome and their mates had refused to return to Portugal for the reconstruction.....My post was instantly pulled, I was banned forever and I got a message telling me that what I had entered was libelous! On closer inspection I realised to my horror, that the forum I had posted on was actually PRO MCCANN! I have read some of the stuff on it and the gullibility of the people there is truly breathtaking.....That such a forum exists beggars belief. I bet Clarry would like us all to be that thick and easily manipulated.
Dumptruck MY EYES HAVE TOOTH DECAY!!! It's very pink and fluffy isn't it. :-%
Miffed Talk about getting lost in cyberspace and ending up in the wrong place.
TonyQ I'm still traumatised
Librarising You strayed into Rosiepops world - SassyP's blog I think. Check your back for sharpened knitting needles.
Ann-Chovey I'm not surprised! I clicked on the link (foolishly) as I'd never seen it before. The Portuguese in general come in for a hammering. I think I need a drink.
There, another post with no mention of the eldest of the McCanns' unwanted toys. About the only time I see her name mentioned in posts on the pink side is when they complain that her name is hardly mentioned here. Tripe.
//MADELEINE McCann's parents yesterday vowed that they will never return to Portugal.//
Perhaps vowed should read, PRAY LIKE CRAZY.
//They are now planning to take their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, away on a "secret" break but refuse to visit Portugal.//
"secret" break, The Mac's and Co will obviously know the location. Claudia. Will the PJ have to be informed as to where they have gone, whether it is less than 5 days or more? I just wonder if the location will be leaked, lots of photos taken and more outrage directed at the PJ as they are blamed for the leak. Only an opinion.
Doc, poor people. They weren't probably prepared to such a shock. For those who aren't aware of what the House of Filth consists of, it must be a scare! lololol Have a great day, my favourite floor cleaner in the whole world! :-)
Zodiac, I'm not sure but there is the possibility that if it is for less than 5 days they won't have to disclose the location. Which doesn't mean the PJ won't know, of course. And yes, that leak thing, extremely possible. As I said elsewhere, wherever they go, I hope the locals make sure that they are always in the company of 2 blonde kids. If they aren't, they should call the police!
I hope everything goes well. I would love if you could travel to Portugal and give us a lecture on cleaning products. You know those which remove everyhting. And I mean everyhing...
Am I the only one who feels that if I had a lost a beloved child in a certain location where I had my last memories of her,I would move heaven and earth to go back there and just be where I last saw her having a really happy day (as she is supposed to have told her Mum)! Madeleine deserves that much and her siblings too.
If you lose someone in a road accident for example, you leave flowers now and then at the spot where it happened because you hope by some chance it will give your loved one comfort, and yourselves too, knowing that was their last place on earth.
So why don't the McCanns go back and put some flowers in a spot where Madeleine had a particularly happy time, i.e. the pool, or the beach whatever!
If they are innocent they should have no qualms whatsoever of returning to PdeL! Only the guilty would let their fear of arrest overcome their natural loving feelings as parents.
JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE! AND FOR ALL VULNERABLE CHILDREN!
Right, Claudia. Lecture's over. The answer to the mop question was: 'any one that fits inside, but don't forget it also has to fit into the overhead bins on Easyjet'
Funnily enough I attended a 3 year course on cleaning products that will remove everything. I'll e-mail you the course notes if you'd like. Actually, I'll have to upload it to my sendspace account and send you the link, as it's a 412GB file, excluding attachments.
I reckon they should come to Cape Town for their hols Claudia. Gerry needs a smack, and I know someone that's in the mood to give him one. No, it's not me, multitalented OldMum.
Don't for one moment let the McCanns and Mr Pinky convince you they are going for a 'secret' break somewhere.
They love the cameras following them around - they have obviously been missing the celebrity feeling lately now that Kate is tied to the house - (who are they kidding)?
That's why they wouldn't go back for the reconstruction because they couldn't have it on telly via Crimewatch for all to see and probably miss out on a nice fat fee from the BBC!
Once infamous people get a taste of stardom they will rarely let it go and now things are going a bit quiet they decide to come out and tell us about the secret holiday,(well via their mouthpiece of course) bearing in mind they don't want their privacy invaded! Utter rubbish!
The 'high secret' destination will be published before you can say Jack Robinson! Do they really think the press are not going to be watching every move they make since this has come out of CM's ever open gob!
It's about time they got rid of that flunky and spoke up for themselves for a change - I'm sure the PJ's don't expect them take a vow of silence forever!! They've said enough on interviews with the television, radio and countless magazines all over the world,(you can't pick one up without seeing their faces on the front cover), so why can't they get up and speak without their paid flunky sounding their words? The money saved could be given to a children's charity - they are supposed to care so much for needy kids! It's ABSOLUTELY LUDICROUS!!
I would not be surprised if they leave home for their 'secret' short break with over sized cases, spades, pails, wearing shorts, flip flops & Tshirts, fake tan, sunglasses and singing 'WE'RE ALL GOING ON OUR 5 DAY SUMMER HOLIDAY' and have their muppet announce as they load the car and lock (or leave unlocked) the door 'that's it folks they are off on their 'secret' hol, please follow them...sorry...cough...allow them their privacy'.
Why annouce they are going on a holiday? Ooh everybody look over there! The Paynes, who, the Paynes. Webster, an on line Dictionary, Webster what, who. Portuguese New/Media what is that, never heard of it. IMO.
Somehow we need to know every move and thought of the couple who are being investigated for killing their own child. How perverse. Let's go on a "secret break" but tell the whole world we are going. Give the press a good head start. Clarence points out Kate and Gerry need a break and then adds the twins as an afterthought. He clearly has their way of thinking. I echo Claudia :
wherever they go, I hope the locals make sure that they are always in the company of 2 blonde kids. If they aren't, they should call the police!
Of course the real point is they hate Portugal and will not be going there no way. Positive spin or obvious enmity towards a country's police force who were way too smart for them and believe in justice for abused little children. They will be going to Portugal and if they do not like the idea of that, there is always a European Arrest Warrant where our police will hand them over!
In my honest opinion I offer these words to the parents. It is my standpoint and my assessment.
Hi Gerry & Kate
If you are reading this I would ask you, indeed urge you, to do the decent thing and admit all the wrongs of the last year or so.
I teach young children and as the year has progressed I have viewed the Reception children in my school and wondered about little Madeleine and how she would have settled into her first year at primary school.
It is clear to me that you are dressing opinions up as facts and impeding the investigation.
I am a Catholic primary schoolteacher who believes (along with the majority of my school community) that you were involved in her disappearance.
As a teacher you become embroiled in all sorts of issues around children and their parents Those of us who are parents as well as teachers understand very well how trying our children can be. But we get sickened to the core at some things we hear about especially those from what are perceived to be 'good' parents.
We also come across many parents who do awful things to their children intentionally. Not only physical abuse but the more common one that I have to try and unravel in the classroom is emotional abuse.
The bottom line is you left your children alone to enjoy a few thrills for yourselves and yet you didn't even go out to look for Madeleine that first night. You have even admitted that Madeleine raised this issue with you and let you know how bad it was.
Your own 3yr old had a better moral compass than you and yet we are led to believe you continued this exploitation and maltreatment.
If a child or more usually a child's sibling goes missing at the end of the day at school we all rush to search and cover as much ground as we can in the school as quickly as we can. We do this for as long as it takes. Somebody rings the office and the gates are covered etc etc. So (IMO) you gave it away right at the beginning by not searching and now one year on you are still dancing around facts and letting someone speak for yourselves when you could easily take open press conferences and answer the questions aired.
The reason you try to control the media is in case you slip up. (IMO)
As a Catholic I abhor your sort who use religion for their own means and as a parent I loathe your sort who do what you did in leaving very young children alone in a room so that you can engage in satisfying your own selfish needs. And as a member of the human race I shudder that you have more than likely hidden your eldest daughter and pretended that she has been abducted.
You have smiled freely and run smoothly across beaches allowing others (not you) to keep on looking for your 'lost' child. You even registered Madeleine's eye defect as a trademark within 2 weeks of her disappearance and allowed pocket money to pay for your mortgage.
So I ask you both to seek some inner peace. Look into your souls and think of what has happened.
Do not deny but embrace the facts deep down in your inner self and then the God that you claim to believe in will hopefully show you the way to turning yourselves in. If as I believe you do not actually believe in God then I ask you to seek forgiveness from Madeleine herself who you badly let down. That does not mean talking to her alone in the middle of the night and carrying on the charade it means stepping out and telling the world what an atrocious wrong was committed that night.
The truth has a funny way of rising to the surface.
What a great letter to the McCanns. Unfortunately I cannot see them listening. The man who shook and bashed his baby to death only admitted it just two weeks before he was put on trial. Zapata only admitting killing his wife when faced with a second murder trial. It is the legal reality, the court room, that makes such people confess, not their morals or their conscience, if they had those, they would never have done it in the first place.
Interesting choice of leader in The Telegraph today:
Neil Entwistle trial: Prosecution outlines case Last Updated: 4:56PM BST 06/06/2008 The trial of Neil Entwistle, the British man accused of murdering his American wife and baby daughter, opened today with claims that he intended to sell his story to the highest bidder.
wanted to sell his story to the highest bidder, just like Kate and Gerry McCann, it takes a psychopath to think that way.
I am inclined to agree with you. The fact that their own 3yr old had a better moral compass is telling isn't it. I am on my own with the children and it is now bath time so will be away for a while. My thoughts are on how important this next month is.
Not only did they fail to bother to look for Madeleine immediately as everyone else bar them was doing, and admitted by Kate McCann in their first BBC interview with Jane Hill, I would like to ask them this:
What did you do today, to look for Madeleine? I think I have the answer, vow they will never return to Portugal, not even to leave her some flowers.
There was a fatal accident just up the road from me about a week ago. There are loads of flowers on the corner of the junction. The other night I saw a couple standing there in the pouring rain, weeping, an example of normal grief.
You just brought back the most wonderful memories of bathtime with my own boys who used to have the most fantastic time and I used to get very wet! Also my lovely little grand-daughters playing in the bath and the little one coming to me to dry her eyes. Such precious moments that you never forget just how wonderful they are and how children just love to play and have fun.
I agree the next month is absolutely crucial and people (decent ones, not paid McCann mechanics) will start to see just what they wanted to see.
They have vowed never to return to Portugal. What if M turned up in PT, so they would not return to collect her or identify her then. Unbelievable behaviour.
It was yet another serious mistake they make wasn't it! A bit like Gerry talking about the one year anniversary event, just a few weeks after she disappeared. He has always been admitting what he did, although I do not think that was his intention.
As Bianca was feeling kind of lonely, I stopped by her whinning corner to have a chat. If you want to have some fun, go there! :-) P.S: Bianca doesn't love me or you anymore. If you help me getting over the pain, I'll help you! :-)
---------------------------------
children_deserve_protection said...
LOL, well aren't you lucky Claudia, you are able to have a view that slightly differs from Viv's and not get kicked off her blog (Viv openly states that Madeleine was physically abused and that the PJ plan to charge the McCanns with "murder").
You'd better watch out though. The more radical and farcical Viv's views become, the more at risk you will be (assuming you don't become equally as radical) of being kicked out!
Oh, I know you may be smug as Hell right now Claudia, but you wait until you're in my position (and of course you say that will be "never" .. LOL!). All I did was question the DNA evidence that was found in this case (not to question the PJ by the way, only to question the strength of DNA evidence in general) and that nut-case Stella came at me like an attack dog, and started accusing me of working for the McCanns! And, rather than come out and say how ridiculous this was and that she wouldn't tolerate personal attacks, not only did Viv tell ME not to upset STELLA, but then SHE personally attacked me herself (she didn't like my "tone"; it was apparently "disgusting" .. oh .. diddems!).
You just wait until YOU upset the precious "blog" Claudia.
Yes, I HAD been having doubts about it there, but I still liked a lot of the posters there (and still do) and was interested to read their ideas. I am still open to many theories, as long as they are presented clearly and logically, and as long as I am then allowed to argue against them if I feel it's necessary (which obviously, I was NOT!).
Anyway, back to the case itself: obviously, you know the in's and out's of Portuguese law better than I do, but it still seems a basic flaw of logic to keep a (supposedly) innocent man as a suspect. Obviously, the PJ have a reason for doing this, but it's not even really the PJ that intrigue me here, but more Viv, and her insistence that it is the McCanns that are at fault for Murat being a suspect, and not actually the PJ (who made him one and kept him one!). It's her seeming obsession to stick it to the Mccanns, even if it means flying in the face of logic, that bugs me so much! And NOT because I feel protective toward the McCanns in ANY way, but simply because it is arrogant, and assumes her audience are just fools!
In fact, I find you both increasingly smug, haughty, and precious (as in can't BEAR to hear anything you do not completely agree with!) and quite frankly, it is nauseating!
Cláudia said... Bianca, I will never be in your place. Because I am not a turn coat. And because I have integrity. You have no idea what I know. Viv and I go a long way back. And we don't slightly disagree. There is plenty we disagree on. We just aren't the kind of people that go the place where we have been called the most disgusting things because just because we are pissed off. In fact, I call that having no dignity, no integrety, being petty and vindictive. To sum up, Bianca, you sold yourself. That is, if Viv and other posters aren't right. And maybe they are. I'll leave you now so you continue to talk to yourself.
Hi, Marga. I'm still not done. If they keep it short, they won't probably have to inform them. If if they manage to take care of their two remaining children, their holiday this year may be less eventful.
I just wonder what sort of holiday can that be that last only five days. One to go, three days to stay and one to come back.
Poor children that will have it stressful. Not even the time to adapt. Again they are not thinkung of their children well-being but of their own instead.Unless their holiday is intended to be extended, just in case..
Cláudia, yesterday MFlores and R.Alves were on Sic commenting on fraud and famous characters that were caught after many years of fraudulent actions. I loved MFlores smile and face expression when the other one stated that there are famous criminals that have planned incredible hoaxes. Did you notice that, too?
He also let people know how he was himself a victim when someone pretended to be him and how some people were led to believe.
He stated that some people have a sort of inner power to convince gullible ones to give them money and contributions as if they were really saying the truth. It has happened all over the world.
I didn't even pick up on the Southern thing earlier :-)
I've been running about booting up all my kids' computers too but Gmail is not happening, not for me anyway. Claudia has not replied to my mail sent through my local ISP, so maybe it is a problem. I'm also getting certificate warnings - out of date and so on. I don't usually see any of this. I'm going to work on it now.
Another mistake, my opinion also. Did you get my e-mail today with a link to a photo. I did not want to put the link on here, thought you would put the photo here if you thought it appropriate. The satire speaks volumes.
Claudia,
I honestly do not believe that the Bianca posting at the moment is Bianca from the DE. If it is then something drastic has happened to her, the intellect of Bianca from the DE is just not there in the content of the posts at present. I remember Bianca debating with Elizabeth from the DE, she tore her to shreds, her art of debating and use of language was fantastic. The present Bianca is pushing the abduction scenario and ineptitude of the PJ in a dull monotonous way. A pro tactic, yes everyone the neglect is just awful, although the abduction and PJ are worse they are to blame, lets discuss that. Ooh come on look over here (LGC, I love that description). The pro's are only around to detract and distract. Luckily for M they are rubbish at it, IMO. BBFN
Zodiac, Bianca (the same or not the same)is the kind of person whose opinions change according with the direction the wind is blowing (that's a Portuguese saying but I'm sure you get the meaning). And such people are not to be trusted. In any circumstance.
I will go and check my emails for this site. Have you read Supertroll/Assassin actually describe how "mad over the top antis" have been used? This is a tactic of the McCanns trolls. Having failed miserably on that, "Bianca" now reverts to more typical tactics as you describe. I could publish 2345's emails to me but will not bother but she is another example and of course using multiple i.d's as we know. These people get very angry when they realise their devious little schemes are just not working and keep opening more and more blogs where they finish up literally talking to themselves. Why do the Pink Trolls have two blogs and how will having main threads about me achieve "justice" for the McCann family. Their kind of justice involves the McCanns getting clean away with what they did!
Your earlier post (6.10)says it all I agree with every word you have written. I can tell you are a compasionate person and it was not written out of spite or hate but with Madeleine in mind.
I dont think they realised on the 3rd May 2007 how hard it would be to keep every lie in check. I also dont think they realised that most people are not stupid or selfish enough to abandon children for a night in the bar and had they been in the sad situation that their daughter was missing when they checked on her would not have acted in such a cold way.
They are just plain nasty, IMO. I support Law and Order, I support Justice for Madeleine hence I support your blog, long may it continue. I think I read somewhere a certain person is never seen out of the house perhaps blogging to the so called 'nasty bloggers' all day.
Yes, Dolores posted information that a local sees Gerry going to work and into the local Co-op but he looks really ill, but that Kate never seems to leave the house.
I think Kate is only prepared to face a fantasy world of a camera set with a prepared script but when it comes to facing real people in her own locality, she just cannot.
It has also been said by the McCanns she spends her time emailing etc, particularly at night, yes we know!
There is sth interesting in the PT news today., Jorge Resende, a Portuguese immigrant, working as IT man in the Radio Suisse Romande, in Switzerland was fired two years after having repaired a computer of a colleague in the same radio station. He discovered his colleague had sites and images of children related to sex, etc.He denounced that to the administration, he began to have problems among his colleagues and finally he lost his job. The director stated in an interview that he violated the right of secrecy in the firm by denouncing his colleague. This one was also fired but the radio station has never informed the police. Now the Portuguese worker is striking outside the building and living in his car. He wants to raise attention to what happened to him and being himself a father he is doesn't regret what he has done in spite of the consequences he has been facing. I only hope decent people help him in his fight for justice, truth and integrity.
Haven't read about how "mad over the top antis" have been used. Can you enlighten me about that.
I was to busy reading about a shower curtain, a blue sweater and a colour pencil case,a tennis bag and a towel from The Ocean Club.
Do you remember the sick joke CM made about: "the only thing they didn't brought back was.........". Not that he stated this exactly but you can imagine how sick one can get when you read it.
I have been re-reading posts from the last week. It's so strange that people can change.
Leigh3 saying goodby. I always loved to read her posts. What is happenning?
Leigh3,
Goedenavond.
What's going on? I always thought that you was representing my voice also.
Docmac, I finally understand why you have a heart on your behind. It has to do with the pencil case that was found;)
Marga, I hope you will enjoy the next month/months. You deserve it.
Have read about the clothes and these 2 colours. Wow. Amazing.Green and Yellow.
Jon Gaunt comment, 06 June 2008 Comment The Sun (No online link, appears in paper version only)
Jon Gaunt
06/06/2008
The only holiday destination the McCanns should be flying to is Portugal where they should be taking part in a reconstruction to find more clues to what happened to their daughter last year.
How can they consider a holiday when they said they would do anything to find Madeleine?
Anything of course apart from return to the scene of the crime and face the very real possibility of being arrested for child neglect for leaving Maddie and the twin siblings home alone.
When Kate and Gerry asked the British public for donations the donors expected more from them.
That is a very sad case of the immigrant worker doing the right thing is reporting paedophilia but then being victimised because of it. In the UK we have a law called the Public Interest Disclosure Act. This says that in the first instance employees should report serious wrongdoing to their employer who should take appropriate action, i.e. report this man to the police. If the worker finds his employers do not take appropriate action he can then go to the authorities himself. If a worker is victimised because he did this, he can get tens of thousands in compensation in an Employment Tribunal. I am sorry this option does not seem to be open to him.
you were only about 100km from my place. I read your posts. Although I'm not a catholic anymore, I understand how people feel when they go to Fátima. It´s like being to Santiago de Compostela, Rome or Lourdes, in France.
The man is a decent person. He is having a great support. I'm also glad he had put his moral values above everything, sth that shoudn't have been easy to do in a foreign country, having in mind he has a family to care for, etc.
Some time ago you asked about a picture in my avatar. It was a lake. Now I have a sunset on the beach I use to go to.More or less 6 km away from where I live. The landscape here is diverse. Mountains, rivers,northwest and the sea on the coast.
Well, nice people, my bed is waiting for me.
Sweet dreams for all of you. In Portuguese: sonhos cor-de-rosa!
Detective Superintendent Stuart Prior, lead on Maddie case makes a Freudian slip when speaking of another case he is now heading "no stone will be left unturned"
So glad to hear that!
Shooting in Leicester - Can you help? Send photos or video to us by texting shooting to 07725 202020 Detectives investigating a shooting at student accommodation in Leicester at the weekend are urging witnesses to email or text with any information that could help their enquiries.
The incident happened at around 2.30am on Saturday (April 28) at the privately-run residential block at Filbert Village, on Lineker Road.
A 24-year-old man received gunshot wounds to the shoulder area. He is receiving treatment in hospital where his condition is described as stable.
While officers have spoken to many people who attended the event, they still believe that there are people yet to come forward who can help.
Please contact the police if you:
Were at the party. Were in the vicinity of Lineker Road around 2.30am and saw vehicles leaving the area at speed. Saw the shooting. Have photos/film from the party. Have any information about the weapon used or its current whereabouts. You can give information via email, by calling the incident room on Leicester (0116) 222 2222 or calling Crimestoppers on 0800 555 111.
If you captured any photograph or video of the party, including images showing the shooting itself on a mobile phone, then please send it to us by texting shooting to 07725 202020. (MMS messages charged at your operator's standard rate)
Detective Superintendent Stuart Prior, who is leading the investigation, said: "Every piece of information we receive helps us to build up a picture of the events leading up to the incident and the incident itself. Even the smallest piece of information could prove of vital importance to the investigation.
"The Force takes an extremely tough stance on gun crime - quite simply it won't be tolerated. We have a robust policy to investigate these types of incidents and no stone is left unturned.
"Thankfully, these types of incidents are extremely rare in Leicestershire. We are committed to doing everything possible to make sure they stay that way and we would anyone with information to help us by getting in touch."
I certainly do not think the McCanns smoke but they do like to drink an awful lot of alcohol and pictures of them several years ago confirm this is not a newly developed habit. It is just one they wanted to continue even after they had children to look after.
The mortgage on their home at £2000 per month is massive, even on the sort of salaries they were on, it would have over-committed them. Add to this Gerry's need for the lifestyle e.g. private golf club and of course the massive costs of private fertility treatment. Quite simply they were sending out more than they had coming in!
Hey guys did you know that Docmac and Ironside are the same person, well according to RavingmadRosieIkeephaving dreams and visions anyway.
Oh and by the way I think she could try being a little more muted, also checking if she wants to use a big word she got the right one...mooted Rosie dear! They call us stupid...ummmmmmmm x
So, the News of the World moved in to 5a, had it all nicely redecorated and then Rosie shows us the picture, I mean guys, nothing had changed, had it!
Liar Ironside by Rosiepops Today at 3:00 pm
Someone recently muted the question if notdoc is really Ironside, at firs I thought no, but since the I have read them both and the similarities are in fact quite striking, also they both have the propensity to play for the sympathy card. ie Boo hoo please John remove me from this site (Mad axe murderers site - true) followed by all the sops crying and begging him not to go, and you can almost envisage Ironside sitting back in *HIS* litter strewn room lapping up their stupidity, with his head swelling. Only one sensible voice more or less said if you want to go then go.
Of course Ironside didn't go, he had no intention of going, he only said that because he wanted the adulation.
I see that I got a mention in his post, hadn't done a thing to him, not bothered with him, had not read Ironside in ages , couldn't really care less about him, yet there he was mentioning me in his Boo Hoo post to an axe murderer!
Why? 1) could be one of two things, I get to him because he knows I am right 2) I get to him because he knows I am right AND he is really notdoc and we all know I annoy the hell out of notdoc and am never far from his mind, he can barely write one or two posts without mentioning me. (Another similarity with Ironside apparently)
BLOOD MARKS THE DEATH by IRONSIDE on Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:09 am
Hi Meadow,no in appartment 5a...the floor was wood...Have no time now ,but will post you the link to Diegos blog..it is spanish but translated into english...There are some U Tube videos you may find interesting...If Mercede posts she will maybe explain as she does all of the translation....
Have a good day
Just one thing wrong with this you bloody liar Ironside, there is NO wooden block flooring in apartment 5a. So STOP spreading deliberate lies with the intention to deliberately mislead. Wonder where those photographs with missing wooden blocks came from? Oh I know probably been *DOCTORED*!
Here is a picture from apartment 5a which the News of The World rented out and took video footage and photographs of. Proves LIAR Ironside is deliberately misleading people, is desperate to mislead people and he is also the Mercedes he mentions and well as Notdoc, when the hell are some people going to wake up and see what this man is doing? Ever wondered why he is sickeningly subservient to notdoc? Always trying to bolster up notdoc? Ooops because he IS notdoc. However, what interests me more is WHY? Why is he doing it? Why is he so desperate that he invents all of these different ID's, surfs the net, trying to convince people of blatant outrageous lies? Must be a reason, what is that reason?
ROTFLMAO Viv! Which pink one was that on? Oh dear! Did you see the poster from 3A who was concerned about getting dental decay in her eyes when looking at one of the pink sites?
Shut up, Ironside! Go and make my toasted sarmie you subservient fool! Shit, I've woken Mercedes now.
Thanks for the explanation. I received a very good explanation from one of your bloggers, but I still cannot understand why adults blogging think that Madeleine has no voice.
Hey Ironside can you get Mercedes to fetch me some TAPAS er now please, I am starving x
It was on their intelligent biz forum, Doc, you know the one with about 30 threads all about us, where they rave, cackle and spit - Justice for Kate and Gerry McCann I say to have a defence team as good as that!! tee hee xx
Viv, I just visited the place to see what was new (don't worry I was wearing my mask so not to be disturbed by the stench). Well, it took me about 30 seconds.
Hey, Ironside II! How could you call me and not tell me you were also Ironside?
Do you remember when Poopsypsych kept saying on the DE, I know it is a very short ride from PDL to Huelva because I have driven it many times myself, yes when she has been nicking other people's kids x
Supermummy Rachel steams in...where is your baby then Rachel, got a clue?
238 comments:
1 – 200 of 238 Newer› Newest»Hi all
I would like to announce to you all that my family and I will be going away on holiday for a week soon.
Despite this news being nothing to do with anyone else (actually we are not going anywhere except the barristers chamber for
extensive briefing + body language counselling) I thought I should let you all know.
WE SHALL OVERCOME
JUSTICE FOR MADDIE
Docmac
In terms of the beast of a motorbike Kawasaki GPZ it was my Danish mate Jan's. I was too scared to ever ride it on my own. Far too heavy for me and far too dangerous. The picture was taken just opposite the mermaid in the sea at Copenhagen. Their is a park just right by there. These days I am very happy to potter around in my car an old Peugeout which has not let me down and keeps me warm thus keeping any early arthritis at bay !!!
Batheory,
To you and your family have a lovely holiday.
Bath Theory -
Have a really nice break, and don't forget to have five drinks a week - apparently, according to today's news, it helps prevent arthritis; so enjoy yourself!!
Nx
Hi Viv -
Loved the Pied Piper playing there in the corner.
The name fits Gerry exactly - he who plays the piper calls the tune, which he certainly seems to be doing!!
Nx
Hi Viv
Hello BT
Pure and simple. All the tutoring in the world will not make a difference. Enjoy.
Hello Nancy
I like the Amber Alert one. It should be forwarded to every miserable useless parent, like G & M. Mr Himself is very talented. Isn't he?
Mariana
I agree with you, the Amber Alert one is very appropriate. The confidence tricksters have tried to fool everyone..
Stella
I think the bells are going to toll very soon and body language will not matter. They will be overwhelmed and bound to fall into pieces.
Morning all,
Viv, Claudia & Doc,
PMSL after reading last nights posts on the other thread. Especially Doc - Never, ever, never...never...ever etc.
Dylan,
Your post from last night:
Don't worry though, I am deeply in love with my sofa. (did you read the story in the papers about the woman who 'married' her wall? it's called object - something - or other!!) xx
Wednesday, 4 June 2008 20:46:00 o'clock BST
I think I was conned nearly 26 years ago. Sometimes when I talk to my hubby it is as if I am talking to a brick wall!
Viv,
The new pics excellent. Now I can see the wardrobe the abductor possibly hid in it all makes sense. He just squeezed in amongst all the bags, clothes etc, there was plenty of room inside to hide and of course never made a sound.
RAT,
Re your post from yesterday at 16.20.
Remember this video?
Kate & Gerry McCann's answer regarding sedatives
And than watch this one.
LVA 6.50 Analysis - McCann Sedatives Statement
Must go now.
I am starting to pack my blue tennis bag right now. I have lots of pens and papers and my wife has told me to remember my barristers manual that I am currently reading. In return I have reminded her to co-ordinate her dresses and accessories for the week we are being programmed by our legal team oops sorry for the week we are going on holiday.
I no longer need all that stuff on dogs and their role in forensics so I have more space in my 'holiday' bag now. Any ideas on what I could now take for that week?
BT, unlike the McCanns who didn't, if you take your brain, everything's going to be fine.
Atardi,
LVA is very interesting! Personally I think there is a lot of truth in it, more so than "lie-detector" tests.
There are a lot of things on that Dutch website that we never, ever see here!
Don't you think it has gone awfully QUIET recently?!
BT! DO NOT repeat DO NOT take the blue holdall, pencil case and shower curtain!
Hi Atardi -
Whenever Gerry says in an interview:
"We are not going to comment on anything" and rubs his ear at the same time, and Kate sitting by his side looking as though she'd rather fall through the floor, then you know he's lying or covering up!
Thanks for the links!
Nx
If ever there was a calm before the storm, it is now.
I cannot put my finger on it, but we have somehow entered a very different phase.
Good news very soon....
ROTB
If you are looking in can you let someone know on 3A's that my account on there looks to have vanished into thin air?? It no longer recognises me or my password, so I am not re-registering just yet?? Gremlins about I think..
Atardi
Thanks for the 2 video links speaks volumes there must be body language exprets and speach experts all over the place watching what these two say and do. No wonder they never took a lie detector test like they said they would be happy to do.
Wouldnet any of us if inocent do one just to make people who doubt us shut up?
Then again anyone I know if they found themselves in the same tragic situation as the McCanns would be doing everything they could to assit the police and would certainly not be trying to call the shots or refusing to answer any questions.
Poor little girl did not stand a chance neglected and vanished and no one who should care about her wants her parents to answer any questions surely the NSPCC or some one who says they care about child saftey should be comenting on how this is not the way to raise children or is Madeleine not important?
Children first every time.
I honestly think the Portugese should employ MOSSAD tactics and 'kidnap' the parents secretly 'bundling' them into a 'private jet' and then forcing them to appear in front of the world's media in a huge press conference where direct probing questions would be thrown their way before keeping them in separate cells for the courtcase whereby hey presto justice for maddie would be done. (IMO)
It's as simple as that.
Sorry forgot to say that Clarence would be left deliberately behind in the Mossad style raid ensuring how pathetic his role has been throughout and what an unecessary character he is.
ROTB
What a great idea. A pencil case seems the perfect size for storing your medicines such as sleeping tablets. And I mean, who goes on holiday these days without a spare shower curtain tucked away into their suitcase.
Hi Everyone
Firstly, I must apologise for my awful spelling last night, I cannot believe I said Knowhere instead of nowhere lol,, my excuse is we have workmen in at the moment, early starts late meals :o))
Just out of interest, does anyone know how to change spell check from American to English, not that I am making any excuses of course, it is just so frustrating :o((
Hi Guys
I am pleased you enjoyed the light entertainment offered last night with of course our dear Doc in the lead role, sad we are never, ever, in fact ever, to see him on here again, now I wonder.
I love the top pic, it is so explicit. The huge SS McCann ship is sinking. Gerry has just one hand out of the water, but even so the PJ in their tiny boat have a gun trained at him, they have Popeye to help and he is invincible. It is a David and Goliath story where the good guys might have been a lot smaller but they win.
The picture of the McCanns backing an amber alert is particularly hard hitting because we should never forget this couple were prepared to become fabulously wealthy, out of people's pensions and pocket money and because their little girl died for which they knew all along they and they alone, were responsible.
At the end of the day, we are not joking. Rachel keeps mouthing off in the newspapers, but she committed not only a serious criminal offence but one that shows she is a mom who just did not care about her little baby. But she cares about herself, now..
Di,
I think it is quite benevolent of us to make the odd spelling mistake, it gives Supertroll something to write about.
Excellant:-)))))))
Stella
Regarding your account on 3A's. I changed my email address and sign in name. My account was activated after a couple of hours.
Don't give up, remember, that is what they would all like us to do, but we will NOT forget Madeleine who should now be 4 years old and enjoying another holiday with her brother and sister.
Hi Viv
Oh please.. have I had a mention over there? I believe it is something to be proud of :o) but probably not :o((
I have cleared a space just in case the awards are forthcoming :o)))))) After all it saves dusting :o))
Bath Theory
Now please!! don't forget your watch and mobile, you just never know when you might need them :o))
Hi Di, I have not seen you mentioned but there is still a pornagraphic picture of an enormous fat woman on top of a naked, tiny man..paedophiles and pervents anon!
Hi Viv
Do you know more about what the LVA thing works on and whether it is a well known method etc
Hi Viv
I had better start eating more then, I don't want to miss out on the award!
Believe me, I don't clear out clutter for no reason :o))
Hiya Atardi
Thanks very much for the results of the voice analysist who looked tested the clip where Gerry is denying they used any kind of sedatives on their kids and pulling his ear, smirking etc.
"Highly stressed, probably false, inaccurate"
Confirms what worldwide opinion seems to be on this, they did sedate their kids and were then confident in the belief they never even needed to check to see if they were OK. In short sadistic maniacs who just wanted to dump their kids and shut them up, day and night. When one of them dies, again, they think only of themselves..and how much money they can make out of it. Even some pscyopaths would be appalled..
Hiya BT
I know it is possible to analyse tapes for stressors in the voice and the police worldwide employ these techniques but certainly do not know about these techniques in any depth.
I believe it was with more up to date voice analysis techniques that they were assisted to locate the false Jack the ripper, who pretended he was carrying out Sutcliffe's murderous attacks and ultimately received 8 years for his trouble - "Weirside Jack"
Let's face it a holiday for the McCanns is not on the cards is it. I am intrigued as to what the next news out of the Portugese side of things may bring.
I think a good move now would be to make the dodgy Tapas 4
(Oldfields + OB + JT) arguidos and question them further.
ie Raise the heat and see if they are prepared to voluntarily dish the dirt fully to ensure their own survival etc.
I don't know whether anyone has been following the McCann's new appeal and helpline asking for witnesses to come forward and let them know what they have told the PJs and Police. On 3A's, a poster says he e-mailed the hotline several times, that was 3 weeks ago and he has still not had a reply. The way of thinking is this was just another sham. Let the public think we are trying to do everything to find Maddie.
Have to go now but will read and catch up tomorrow.
Enjoy your evening everyone.
Hi BT
I wonder if there is any need to make Tanner, OB and The Oldfield arguidos to interview them further?
If the police now have a case against OB and Tanner in particular, I can see no reason why they could not just be charged alongside the McCanns at the end of the process. I still wonder if it is too late now to actually prosecute the Oldfields for child neglect. The reason they were not prosecuted in the early stages has always been obvious to me, at any rate, because it would have damaged the investigation of far more serious crime, i.e. murder/manslaughter, kidnapping, disposal of a corpse.
Viv x
Hiya Di
I do not think the new appeal was so much with the intention of just convincing people they are still trying. I think it was more to do with trying to find people who will be prepared to say something different to the mass of evidence the police have against them, so that they can create that element of doubt which is after all the only thing a defendant needs to do to secure an acquittal. An acquittal does not necessarily mean the person is innocent, it is far more technical than that, it means the prosecution have failed to prove their case beyond reasonable doubt. The more evidence the McCanns can obtain of spooky characters hanging around the more they seek to shake the prosecution case. However, I think this is quite pathetic and just like they tried to shake the dog evidence, doomed to failure. It is an example of them knowing just how bad the evidence against them is and just how desperate they are to try and shake it with the likes of Gail Cooper etc. - truly pathetic!
Viv x
You could be right Viv. I just see it as a way of ensuring the McCanns get nailed without a shadow of doubt.
Maybe the Portugese have shed loads or should I say barn loads of solid evidence already.
Hi Viv -
As you so rightly say an acquittal doesn't necessarily prove a person's innocence. There have been countless trials where guilty defendants have got off on a technicality only.
The McCanns have no doubt got very clever lawyers in Portugal who could get them off a charge by producing some technicality or other the prosecutors haven't spotted.
At the end of the day though, the public aren't fools and if the McCanns are charged and get as far as a courtroom and avoid a sentence due to a technicality, the shame will be with them forever.
Let's say the Portuguese charged them with something and they were convicted but then set free on some technicality, would they be liable under British law for fraudulent actions in setting up the Madeleine Fund that many members of the public contributed to?
Hiya Bath
The behaviour of the McCanns and their friends in refusing to attend a reconstructions speaks for itself and to the strength of the prosecution case against them.
They have a vast amount of direct witnesses who will say that they told blatant lies, including even, members of the TAPAS group. There is only one reason for Jane Tanner to immediately invent an abductor and it is a very sinister reason. What is more it can be conclusively proved that she was telling lies, in short she knew the McCanns killed Madeleine. On top of all this we have forensic evidence and the dogs. I actually believe PJ are going for a murder charge and that is why they wanted the evidence of those 14 texts from an unidentified number on 2
May, the day before Madeleine went missing. This is highly significant because it demonstrates planning, ie. murder. I feel that without this it is just possible the case may not be strong enough to support a murder conviction but that is what they feel actually happened. If they cannot prove murder, then clearly prosecution can and often do, go for manslaughter instead. The one big problem for the police has always been the fact that McCanns and possibly others deliberately concealed Madeleine's body, if they had found that, this case would have been over long ago. Looking at it another way, if they can prove the McCanns deliberately concealed Madeleine's body this may also go to proving intention for murder, they needed to conceal that evidence of deliberately causing her harm. If you put the two together of what seems very likely, wanting to leave her to go out drinking, wanting to stop her crying again, so oversedating her, that has to be extremely close to murder in itself, when you put all the other evidence to that of state of mind etc. you can see where this has taken the police. Naturally they will always wish to obtain evidence to actually prove what they believe happened, no one can blame them for that, but look what they came up against, including a deliberate trashing of the evidence and delay in calling the police.
Hi BT. I'm not staying, but thought I must post as you're here. It's best you were scared of that monster in Copenhagen. They were more dangerous than British doctors in a Portuguese resort.
Barn shrouds, sorry I mean towels. I stutter occasionally when typing . Yes, quite an uncommon species in Portugal I hear. All sightings are treated with great interest.
Hiya Nancy
There is no prospect of the McCanns getting off on a technicality. The only prospect is they may avoid a murder rap. They have actually admitted leaving her alone every single night, and they have also actually admitted they did that again, even though she and her little brother had woken up crying. The police also have evidence Madeleine died and they concealed the body.
In Portuguese law, where there has been gross child negligence and as a result the child dies, the maximum penalty is 10 years in jail, so, as a minimum, that is what they are looking at.
The prosecutor currently has an immensely difficult job of looking at all the evidence and carefully considering what charges can be proved on that evidence. I am not in his position of knowing all this but I can say based on what I know the McCanns are definitely going to be convicted on the basis of the above but quite probably worse than that.
Viv -
Thanks for your reply to mine.
In my opinion the Prosecutor has a decidedly difficult job with this particular case. A case that has gained enormous interest worldwide and I can imagine lawyers the world over are waiting to either applaud or criticise whatever decisions he comes to. I wouldn't like to be in his shoes really because he'll be damned if he does and damned if he doesn't!
We'll just have to wait and see and keep everything crossed at the same time!
Night Viv!
Nx
Rat,
Het is zo ongekend rustig op dit moment dat je een naald kunt horen vallen.
I wonder why it's so quiet at this moment and why the public must know that the "remaining kids" like a Dutch paper reported this week, "need" a holiday.o the public must change their opinion, because 2 little kids want a holiday. Right!
They want us to believe that the Social Service in England is not watching them. That's one of the reasons that Kate stays at home(IMO). She has to.
Viv,
Must go to bed now.
Trying to send a photo. Will again tomorrow.
I have sent you an article before about the Mc Canns visiting the Pope and that he blessed Madeleine's photo/picture.
Today I saw a video of Gerry kissing the Pope's hand. I don't think I have to tell you how I felt.
I still have the same feeling.
Hiya Atardi
I posted some time back that as we got to the stage where charges were imminent our press would have to go very quiet because otherwise the McCanns could complain they damaged their right to a fair trial. I know our press have been guilty of biased and unfair reporting on the McCann's behalf but now they will genuinely be fearful of our own Contempt of Court Act 1981 that could see them in real trouble if they do not watch what they print. It is pretty draconian against offending newspapers. It is very different in the States, they can accurately report the case against the accused and even offer opinion on guilt, our own press cannot.
See you all tomorrow.
Hi Atardi
The visit to the Pope arranged, I think by both McGuinness and Mitchell was self-serving and sickening, just like all their other media games. What I found even more repugnant was Kate reaching out to children in the crowd so they could grab her hand, just like Princess Diana. I find it deeply insulting to the memory of Diana that Kate tries to emulate her and also successfully got the public to give to a massive fund after the death of Madeleine, just like happened in Princess Diana's case, even trademarking the image, just the same. Cynical and horrible, but they will pay the price for this.
Viv x
Evenin' all!
Just going to bed now, but if you are looking in Ecolab, you may want to pop over here and see what I did with your troll!
See you all tomorrow! rat xxx
Hiya Rob
"Oh woe is me, I am in despair, these McCann trolls, are every flipping where, it matters not, how hard I try, they multiply they multiply"
The thing is though, the PJ do not give a toss about trolls and neither do I!!
However, I do wish the McCanns would spend the Fund on genuine lost and needy children, rather than sick greedy adults who care nothing for innocent and defenceless little ones.
xx
Exactly viv!
Night xxx
Night night darling
They can play as many games as they like, and continue to cash in on the death of a beautiful little girl. At the end of the day, they have to look at what they see in the mirror.
They also need to remember what they do is so futile..
Viv x
Hi, Viv and all.
Just wanted to wish you a good night. Have been translating but I do need some sleep now! :-)
Boa noite!
xxxx
Hi Viv
I see OldMum has been consulting her doctor about me. How sad is that? He apparently believes a doctor could not possibly find the time for blogging. There are thousands of medical blogs and fora out there, chum. I even run a couple myself. Get into the 21st century!
Hey Mum, I'm the main oke. I employ people to do the work. I work when I want to, because it's stimulating, que? I even find the time to run a couple of not very tiny businesses on the side. Phew, I'd better get some rest.
Love from the managing Director Of Cleaners, Maids And Chauffeurs. INC.
Nice, Rat. Tough game. It's hard to get rid of any troll obviously :-)
Goodnight to you and Claudia.
Hiya Doc
I read mum's consultant apparently told her you were breaking the law of medical ethics. The thing is law and ethics are two different things. A solicitor or doctor could be in breach of a professional code of practice but not breaking the law at all.
As you say there are all sorts of medical forums where doctors exchange views and seek advice on patient conditions. I have read many myself. I am sure that would be too heavy for Mum.
A consultant is obviously a heck of a lot brighter than "Mum21" and simply would not have made such an ignorant statement, it was the law according to Mum 21, and a fat lot she knows about "law" or "professional ethics".
Hiya Claudia, Hun, much quieter tonight, I think we are all tired:-))))))
Sleep well Hun x
I was never in breach, Viv. Trying to explain 'in the public domain' and 'permission' to these people is like trying to use a torch to poach an egg.
Hiya Doc
I know that! I find it just as amusing when they try to explain criminal law, the law of evidence or the law of libel to me. They did not even understand those are three different subjects!
Tell that to Clarence Mitchell Viv.
Hiya Doc
Of course there are some who breaks professional rules of conduct and the criminal law too.
Waves to Clarence Mitchell.
Mummy 21 :
LLB means Legum Baccalaureus (Bachelor of Laws).
See, dear, in the plural (Latin), learning all the time, but you just try doing an LLB, I know you could not even scrape a third x
I have to catch some sleep now, Viv. Whatever happened to the mother and son retards from Spain by the way? I haven't heard anything about them for some time now. Spending the cash I suppose.
Nite x
Ja Viv
Thick as the proverbial. And not the one that starts with 'b'. You have loads of mail :-)
See you next time.
Hiya Doc
If they admit they are still paying the Retardos all that money and they have not come up with one credible lead, then that looks bad for them. If they admit they sacked them for failing to come up with one credible lead, then that looks bad for them as they whinge the police no longer look for Madeleine, neither do they.
They are backed into a corner with nowhere to go, but they know where they are going x
Something useful on the Pink Blog for a change including a very helpful post from 4Portugal (although I think he / she was wasting time trying to explain anything there).
Maths was never my strong point but the prosecutor wanted 10 mobiles from only 9 owners. That is odd! When I used to work with drug using offenders they quite often had more than one mobile. This was to evade the police and keep their drug dealing calls on a separate number etc. So to me someone who owned more than one mobile often does so for a criminal reason. Did Gerry McCann have two mobiles, I wonder? I think that is a very good question, and if so, why would that be!!! There clearly is a connection between Murat and this party and I still have an uneasy feeling here. The Exeter connection, the labour party rally/Leicester connection. I think I am probably wrong because they returned all Murat's property which clearly implies he is not involved but he is still an arguido and it was decidedly odd how angry Gerry got when asked if he knew Robert Murat. Whenever the questions get difficult he refuses to answer. My main thought has been he used him as a perfect Patsy, knowing full well he was there in PDL, but somehow, I cannot completely rule his involvement out, but the most obvious reason he really could not be involved is McCann friends SAYING HE IS X
Gerry Denies Receiving Mystery Texts
Updated:09:02, Thursday May 29, 2008
Sky News
Gerry McCann has denied he received a string of mystery texts the day before his daughter disappeared in the Algarve.
According to court documents issued by Portugal's supreme court, police applied to seize his phone records after learning of the alleged messages. Investigators claim 18 text messages were sent to Mr McCann from an unidentified number around the time Madeleine vanished in Praia da Luz on May 3 last year. It is alleged that 14 messages were texted on May 2 and four more on May 4.
But the McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell said Gerry had no knowledge of the texts and received a handful of calls on his mobile in the days before his daughter disappeared. The documents reveal that public prosecutor Magalhaes e Meneses also sought access to text and phone messages from 10 mobile telephones thought to belong to the McCanns and seven of their friends.
He also asked for a full list of all the calls made between the group from when they arrived in Portugal on April 28 and when the McCanns left on September 9. But the supreme court issued a detailed ruling rejecting the application.
It also revealed that Kate and Gerry McCann could face charges of neglecting their daughter on the night she disappeared. The police inquiry also covers possible abduction, homicide and concealment of a corpse, the documents say.
But Mr Mitchell emphasised the court papers did not mean such a charge would materialise.
He said the couple vigorously denied neglecting Madeleine and welcomed the fact that abduction was also being considered by detectives.
He said: "This court document outlines the areas of the investigation and in no way suggests Kate and Gerry will be facing any such charges. Equally we have heard nothing officially to suggest any such area of investigation is being considered. However, we do note that abduction is apparently one of the parameters and we welcome that because that is what Kate and Gerry and their friends have said and that is what happened. If there is any suggestion of neglect charges being considered that will be vigorously denied because the legal advice that Kate and Gerry have received both in Portugal and Britain is that legally speaking everything they were doing that week was well within the bounds of responsible parenting."
A neglect charge carries a maximum penalty of 10 years. But it is understood for such a charge to stand up the prosecutors would have to show the McCanns intended to neglect Madeleine.
Posted by Sass at 08:56
475 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 1 – 200 of 475 Newer› Newest» 4portugal said...
The court document is not a leak. It is an official document covering a verdict by a judge on the ruling that content of messages (text and otherwise) prior to 3 May CANNOT be officially used. A ruling/verdict is no longer covered by secrecy laws, because, obviously if there is a ruling, the case is closed (on that particular matter - phones). In the document it states that the McCanns are arguidos (suspects) for homicide, exposure, abandonment, disposal of a body. Homicide in Portuguese can me manslaughter or homicide. The document does not specify.
Also, it does not say if these are the charges, if any, that will be brought against the McCanns.
However, another point anyone with sense would realize is that the judge would not be ruling on unexistant phone or text messages, making it impossible for them to be used in court. Had they not existed and the Prosecutor requested them, the Judge would have laughed him out of court with a reprimand.
29 May 2008 15:29
Just read this in the Daily Mirror..
Police are trained on the m.o. of dangerous stalkers who harass female victims, that they may well go on to kill, so time and time again, why do they let this happen. It is a terrible tragedy that victims cannot be protected before it is too late, my heart goes out to her poor mum who just cannot stop sobbing. The victim was black, IMO, they get an even worse service from the police due to this. When are our police going to realise that all human life is precious and do something to be proactive, rather than reactive?
Stabbed schoolgirl Arsema Dawit: Cops knew of stalker's threats
By Robert Stansfield And Jeff Edwards 4/06/2008
Arsema Dawit (Pic:Getty Images)
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(What's this?)Police probing the savage murder of a girl in a lift were warned a stalker threatened to kill her - but failed to stop him, it emerged yesterday.
Arsema Dawit's terrified mum Tsehay raised the alarm after the knife maniac hit the schoolgirl, 15, in a McDonald's seven weeks ago and made his chilling vow.
Yet officers are said to have claimed they could do little - and were still investigating slowly when the church-going teenager was butchered near her home.
Yesterday, family friends blasted police for not taking action that could have saved her life.
One, Simon Tesfaghiorgish, raged: "I didn't know him but he had been harassing her. He beat her and threatened to kill her.
"The mother told police a number of times but they said they couldn't take any action. After things happen, they want to know. We're going to complain about this."
Tsehay was overcome with grief as she visited the scene near London's Waterloo station.
She is thought to have fled war-ravaged Eritrea in East Africa three years ago with Arsema, son Robel, 13, and daughter Faruz, 12, for what they believed was the safety of Britain.
A friend, Mrs Berekati Asfeday, said: "Her mother can't talk, just cry non-stop. She was a beautiful girl."
The friend is thought to have waited with Tsehay for Arsema to return from school on Monday.
But the girl was stabbed 10 times and left the blade in her back.
The attack was so frenzied that the handle snapped. Wayne Fort, whose partner discovered the body, said he had once seen Arsema's relatives warning the stalker off.
The killer, also believed to be Eritrean, grew infatuated with her after they met at church.
But she was so in fear of him that she stopped attending services.
Last night police confirmed that on April 30 they were told of "an allegation of assault and threats to kill" arising from the incident in a McDonald's two weeks earlier.
But they said that when they quizzed Arsema at school she denied all knowledge of it, a claim Simon furiously denied.
Scotland Yard added: "Despite this, we continued to investigate and Arsema's mother was subsequently contacted on May 19.
"The investigation was still being progressed when Arsema was tragically murdered."
A man, 21, was seized hours after the horror as he tried to leap off nearby Hungerford Bridge into the Thames. He was still being questioned last night.
16 number of teens killed violently in London this year
Yet more horrific news about a "mum" who just wanted to dump her little boy and go party..she wanted her friends to lie for her..I cannot imagine why the Judge did not remand her in custody...prison "almost inevitable" ..what?
Guilty: Mother who locked two-year-old son in flooded kitchen during weekend of partying
By Andy Dolan
Last updated at 10:37 PM on 05th June 2008
Kelly Tollerton has been convicted of child cruelty after she left her two-year-old son alone in a flooded kitchen for the weekend
A mother was facing jail last night for leaving her toddler son alone in a flooded kitchen while she spent a weekend partying.
Kelly Tollerton, 22, was warned that prison was 'almost inevitable' after a judge heard how she left the two-year-old boy, caged in the kitchen by a baby gate, to fend for himself.
He had been forced to sift through bags of rubbish for food 'like a dog'.
The boy was discovered after three days when water from a running tap started pouring through the ceiling of the flat below.
Neighbours saw the boy, who cannot be named for legal reasons, through the letter box and called police.
Shocked officers found him standing in inches of water and shaking with the cold.
He was wearing a filthy babygro and had been using a pile of dirty washing as a bed.
Last night social services launched an inquiry into the case after it emerged that the little boy had been placed on the at-risk register at the age of two months because he was seriously underweight.
Social workers and health visitors later expressed concerns that both the boy and Tollerton's flat in Lincoln were unclean and that he spent a lot time strapped into a car-seat.
But social services ceased contact with him when he was 15 months old because he was attending a nursery where he could be monitored.
Prosecutor Felicity Gerry told Lincoln Crown Court it was 'unfortunate, and that is putting it mildly, that no social worker went to the flat' after that point.
Abandoned: The filthy kitchen where the two-year-old was left while his mother went out partying
The boy - whose fourth birthday on Monday coincided with the start of his mother's trial - is now in foster care and is expected to be adopted. Tollerton's other child is understood to live with his father.
Lincolnshire County Council said the county's Safeguarding Children's Board would be reviewing the case.
Tollerton, a trainee beautician, broke down in tears after being found guilty of two charges of child neglect and a third of attempting to pervert the course of justice.
Recorder William Harbage QC told her: 'This was the culmination of a period of wilful neglect. The parenting of this child was totally inadequate.'
Tollerton had told police she had left the child in the care of her friend Emma Barton while she stayed at her boyfriend's home in November 2006.
Tollerton's ex-friend Emma Barton was blamed for the toddler being left alone
But Miss Barton, 22, denied the claim and told the jury that although she had looked after the boy as a favour for Tollerton in the past, the pair had not spoken for weeks after falling out over money.
Another friend, Rachael Manning, 28, told the court she and Tollerton had spent much of the weekend drinking in Lincoln city centre.
She said Tollerton told her she had to support her tale about Miss Barton - but Miss Manning refused.
Tollerton told the jury she had been with her boyfriend, Ken Hill, 20 years her senior.
She claimed they went to a pub for dinner on the Friday night and spent the rest of the weekend at his flat.
The court heard that Tollerton kept bags full of rubbish in the hallway of her flat on Lincoln's notorious Ermine estate because she did not have a dustbin - although she did have a £30-amonth mobile phone contract.
At the end of the four-day trial the jury took less than two and a half hours to dismiss Tollerton's story. She was bailed to return on June 27 for sentencing.
Last night Miss Manning said Tollerton was a flirt who spent her weekends downing alcopops in pubs and taking men home for one-night stands.
Miss Barton, 22, a trainee care assistant, told how she would arrive at Tollerton's flat to look after the boy only to find him strapped into a car seat. She often gave him crisps or biscuits for his breakfast.
She said: 'I would often see her on the bus taking him to nursery, and that is what he would be eating.
'Kelly would just be on her mobile phone, not interested in him in the slightest.
'Once when I accompanied Kelly to collect him from the nursery, Kelly picked him up but he instantly held out his hands to me for a cuddle.'
She said Tollerton took the boy along to her 21st birthday party - and left him strapped in the car outside, claiming he was asleep.
'But when I checked, he wasn't asleep,' Miss Barton said. 'He was sitting there wide awake.'
She said she would often have to supply electricity and gas tokens because Tollerton would leave them without credit in the meters.
Once Tollerton dropped the boy off at Miss Barton's home because she needed to visit a friend in hospital but Miss Barton later found her 'chilling out' at her flat. Tollerton also tried to palm the boy off on other friends.
One, Helen Radford, told the Daily Mail she was forced to call a halt to the arrangement when the boy began to see her as his mother.
Friends also claimed that Tollerton does not know who the boy's father is.
Tollerton is one of four sisters. Her father - whom she doted on - died when she was 15 and she ran away from home around the same time.
She was soon found but was pregnant by a 31-year-old man before she was 16.
Tollerton was supported in court by her mother, Lynn, a cleaner, and her latest boyfriend. They refused to comment.
Last night Christine Banim, Lincolnshire Council's assistant director of children's services, confirmed that the boy's name had been removed from the at-risk register and appropriate support offered through a comprehensive 'child in need' plan.'
She said: 'This involves all agencies who can support the family, and can include as an example health visitors, children centre staff and child minders.'
She said it would 'not be unusual' for a child to be removed from the register when such a plan was in place.
and here is yet another one, and failure by Social Services to properly protect. What more could they have done, removed a child they knew full well to be at serious risk of harm. What use having a review after the child has been murdered? How good of him to finally plead guilty to manslaughter, nevertheless it was murder. Why didn't the social services also ensure this stupid woman, who does not know how to protect either herself or her child got rid of this man?
Death by postcode: Baby killed after social workers lost touch with parents after they moved house
By Paul Sims
Last updated at 9:53 PM on 05th June 2008
Add to My Stories
Claire Morton was found guilty of causing or allowing the death of her baby daughter Elisha
A baby girl on the 'at risk' register was shaken to death by her violent father after he evaded social services monitoring by moving two miles to a different local authority area.
An urgent inquiry is under way into the care of Elisha Allen, who was classified as a 'vulnerable' child even before she was born.
At the heart of the investigation is whether vital case notes were forwarded to the new local authority after her parents moved from Penshaw, Sunderland, to Bournmoor in neighbouring County Durham.
It was there that the five-month-old's father, Gary Allen, 25, picked her up in a fit of rage and shook her. She was taken to hospital but died three days later.
Allen has pleaded guilty to manslaughter while his 30-year-old former partner Claire
Morton, who has since given birth to another child, has admitted allowing or causing the death of a child.
'Up until very recently, both defendants had denied responsibility for causing the fatal injuries sustained by Elisha,' said Paul Sloan QC, prosecuting, at Newcastle Crown Court.
'However, about a fortnight ago, Gary Allen finally admitted responsibility lay with him for the infliction of the fatal injuries.
'He admits as a result of a sudden loss of control, he caused Elisha's death by shaking her and that shaking clearly involved an impact as well.
'He denies at that moment he formed an intention to cause a really serious bodily injury.'
The court was told Morton's plea to a lesser charge was accepted on the basis that she was subjected to violence at the hands of Allen and was in fear of him at the time of Elisha's death.
Scroll down for more
The couple were living on Avondale Road, Penshaw, Sunderland, when Morton became pregnant with Elisha.
Social services officers from Sunderland City Council visited and told them their unborn child would be placed on the 'at risk' register.
But two months before she was born they moved to Marigold Crescent, Bournmoor, between Chester-le-Street and Houghton-le-Spring.
Although only two miles away the property is over the local boundary in County Durham.
It was therefore down to Durham County Council's social services to monitor the couple and Elisha.
However, on January 21 last year she was admitted to Sunderland Royal Hospital with head injuries.
She was later transferred to Newcastle General Hospital where she was placed on a life - support machine but she died three days later. Durham Police immediately arrested the couple and after an eight-month investigation charged them with murder and allowing or causing the death of a child.
Scroll down for more
Enlarge Elisha's parents moved two miles from Penshaw (top right) to Bournmoor (middle left), and into another local authority with a separate social services department
At the start of their trial on Wednesday, however, the Crown Prosecution Service said it accepted guilty pleas to the lesser charges. Allen and Morton, who split up in April last year, will be sentenced on August 1.
Child protection experts in Sunderland and Durham are conducting a Serious Case Review into whether more could have been done to protect the baby.
Local councillor Geoff Armstrong, from Ellesmere, Bournmoor, who sits on Chester-le-Street District Council, said: 'It is no more than ten minutes' walk from Marigold Crescent to the Sunderland boundary, but Marigold Crescent is part of County Durham.'
A spokesman for Durham County Council said: 'We will be happy to share the findings of the review at the appropriate time, at the end of the legal proceedings and following relevant discussions with the coroner.'
Sunderland City Council declined to comment.
Hi Viv -
Those two awful cases of gross child neglect, one leading to the death of the baby, are just the tip of the iceberg of similar cases past and I'm sure in the future of what is happening to little children in the UK.
When are governments going to make the safety of vulnerable children top priority, such as they do to many other matters nowhere near as important? Neglected children often go on to do the same to their children and so perpetuates. I'm sure that much of the crime we see on the streets of Britain today are the result of negligence by the parents to do their job properly even if there was no direct cruelty. It is still child neglect in my opinion.
There are always going to be cases that slip through the net where there was no reason to believe a child was in danger from the parents, but when a child is on an at risk register the parents should be 100% monitored with a fine tooth comb.
I suppose the problem is the shortage of people wanting to work in this area, because it takes complete dedication and it must be heart wrenching to see children being neglected in any way shape or form.
It would be a good idea once the McCann case is over and done with to carry on with this blog trying to get justice for all the other children who deserve our attention.
Very early today, so I'm off for breakfast - back later.
Nx
FFS Viv! I bet that poor black family don't get half the support from celebrities and government that the Macs got!!!!! Of course, it's nothing to do with the fact that they are just poor refugees from Eritrea and not nice, white, middle class doctors with influential friends. My heart goes out to that poor mother, she has had > her fair share of tragedy.
One of the communities our charity worked with in Mozambique, the people lost every single thing they had - twice. The first time they had to flee their village because of civil war. 3 years later, their new village was entirely washed away in a flood. The family I corresponded with lost their wee boy. It was heartbreaking, they never got over it.
Then you get tossers like the bint in Lincoln, and the McCanns. It makes me so MAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Catch you all later, going to work now
rat xxx
Hi Viv
The mother who left her child in the kitchen should be jailed for a very long time evil evil woman.
Children are not a right and should be cared for at all times and until the scum parents of this country start to do just that god help our future is it any wonder we have thugs on the streets when their parents (not in all cases) have treated them like they are nothing they have never been respected so respect no one else.
I hope this child is given a chance at life now with a caring family who will show him what love is and just how much fun childhood should be.
The McCann's must not get away with their arrogance and lack of childcare skills they are supposed to be inteligent people and if neglect is alive and kicking amongst educated people as well as uneducated people there are going to be many sad and lonley children who cry out for uncaring parents who dont come.
Stop the spin CM it is not working public opinion of this selfish pair has changed more and more people now see them for the lying selfish people they are they dont want the truth to come out as they are more important than their beautiful 3 year old daughter they left alone to cry
Hiya and thanks for your comments which are really heartfelt from all three of you.
There is an epidemic of serious child abuse in the UK and I agree it would be good to carry on this blog to see what we can do about that. Certainly, I would admire Gordon Brown and his government if he was brave enough to acknowledge this and announce measures to seek to tackle it, no matter how expensive. Just like any good businessman will tell you, you have to speculate to accumulate. What we would accumulate is a nation of safe happy children, who in turn can make their own children safe and happy, rather than perpetuating the cycle of cruel abuse.
We heard all of Tony Blair's talk back in 1997 about being tough not just on crime but on the causes of crime. Well all I can say, 11 years later is we are still waiting. It makes you really fed up with dishonest politicians who only talk the talk to gain election but do not have the guts to spend the money and actually walk the walk. Even the United Nations figures clearly setting out the UK is just about the worst place for little children in the so called civilised world seems to fall on deaf ears.
Maybe given the McCanns have gained such massive publicity, upon conviction of her wicked parents, little Madeleine will fight for all the other little children. We could help her do that.
JUSTICE FOR MADDIE AND ALL ABUSED LITTLE CHILDREN, BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE.
Viv x
Viv - absolutely!!
Nx
I'll second that...
These politicians should have to put their money where their mouths are.
"let it be said, let it done"
And if they don't do as they said they would, then they should be forced to resign immediately..
Hi everyone -
Changing the subject a little here - has anyone else noticed the chains around K's neck in the photo on top of the last Viv blog.
It has a large saw and large hatchet with blood on the end!!
Was this photo taken after Madeleine went missing or before I wonder. If it was after, then not really appropriate under the circumstances in my opinion!
They definitely suit her though!!
Hi Stella -
Did you manage to get back on to the 3A's?
Hi Nancy
No. Have sent admin an email and waiting for a reply, so hopefully I will hear something soon.
Stella -
That's a bit strange. I noticed one blogger is called Starry Starry night - I wondered if that was you.
Why does everyone have a nickname after their blogger name - such as 'nicked' or 'paroled' for instance?
Just curious!
Nancy
No, that's not me. Not sure how the other bit works either, and I have tried and tried to work out how to put a smilie at the end of a message and cannot do that either. But I am not giving up, if I cannot get Stella by Starlight working again, I will register with something new.
Hi Stella -
I'm glad I'm not the only one who can't work out how to get a smilie or an abacus that is alive!! Never mind, you'll suss it in the end no doubt.
By the way, the Spanish name for Stella is 'Estrella' - you could try that! or Bella Stella - meaning lovely Stella!!
I shouldn't think it's the name that's the problem though because there are some really unusual and long name there already!
What do you think of the jewellery Kate is wearing in that picture by the way? Well out of order if it was taken after Maddie disappeared don't you think?
Nx
Nancy
I am glad you brought the jewellery thing up. I thought it was just me. I have been watching what she has worn (gold) since the day it happened, and I have to say I have noticed something very odd.
When you look at what people wear, you can tell things about them. If they have style, good taste etc., also you can tell if something is not quite right, either. For an evening out, you may select a very nice necklace to suit your dress, but duing the day especially for a general day to day affair, you would wear the same "comfortable thing" that means a lot to you.
Kate wears a lot of statement pieces, which to me for someone in her position, does not make any sense. i.e.,
If she was a devout catholic, then only a cross and chain would be what she would wear.
If Madeleine had a piece that she had worn, she might think to put that on an adult chain and only wear that.
What possesed her to wear some of those horrible pieces, makes no sense to me at all. And the multi chains thing, is she turning into a Mr T ??
What she wears to me shows the state of her mind, and that is not very good. Not healthy at all...
Yipee
I'm back on 3A's.....
Stella -
Congratulations Star!
I agree with you about jewellery - I tend to wear just stuff I've had for ages but always liked during the day, but in the evenings when we go out I choose something a bit more special.
Talking about the 3A's - I noticed someone wrote, I think it was Clear -
"re: the Amber Alert system. Let's not forget that Portugal was one of the 4 Member States already signed up to the system. A fact that K&G strangely neglected to mention in any of their addresses to the world on this subject. It wouldn't do for them to be showing Portugal in a positive light would it?"
Nancy
If you look at all of Kate's interviews, one of her ears is always very, very red, she fiddles with her earrings all the time (off screen). It is usually the left ear, surprise, surprise.
I did not know that Portugal has already signed up for Amber Alert. Why did the McCann's not mention this?
Stella -
No I hadn't noticed Kate's red ear I must admit, although considering the amount of fleas she gets in them with the public disquiet about Madeleine's disappearance, I can understand why she would be suffering with red ear syndrome!
The fact that they didn't mention about Portugal having already signed up to the system speaks volumes of how they feel about Portugal!!
Off for a coffee - see you later!!
Maybe they will, someday, whether they want it or not...
-----------------------------------
McCanns: We will never go back to Portugal Daily Star (No online link, paper version only)
By Ian Trueman
05 May 2008
MADELEINE McCann's parents yesterday vowed that they will never return to Portugal.
Kate and Gerry spoke out amid rumours they are planning their first holiday since their daughter vanished in The Algarve last year.
Insiders claim the heartbroken couple, both 40, had earlier ruled out any talk of a vacation.
They are now planning to take their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, away on a "secret" break but refuse to visit Portugal.
Maddie disappeared nine days before her fourth birthday in Praia da Luz in The Algarve in May 2007.
The couple's spokesman Clarence Mitchell yesterday refused to confirm or deny that Gerry and Kate McCann were planning any trip in the "imminent" future.
But he confirmed: "One thing I can say is that it will not be Portugal. It would just create a huge bun fight and they don't want to do that." He added: "It will be incredibly painful to contemplate going away without Madeleine, but this is the reality they are faced with.
"Kate and Gerry have always felt that they did not want to have a holiday under the circumstances.
"But clearly at some point, as much for the twins as for themselves, they may choose to have a break.
"That decision, however, will remain entirely private."
A friend said doctors Kate and Gerry plan to "get away for a few days this summer".
The pal added: "After all they've been through they want to give the twins a decent break to try and enjoy time as a family." Madeleine disappeared from a holiday apartment on May 3 while her parents dined in a nearby tapas bar with friends.
Since they returned home to Rothley, Leics, in September, the McCanns have said they wanted to provide as normal an upbringing as possible for their other children.
The McCanns stayed on in the holiday resort for several months after Madeleine disappeared, but returned home after Portuguese police made them official suspects.
Morning all,
Just off to read last nights posts.
For anyone with a sense of humour:
http://www.jibjab.com/sendables/share_view/F5HLypE1rDKIxtUzbrluRrbS
ROTFLMAO
From 3A's by Dial M.
Zodiac, the pros are going to freak! :-)
Hello and good day everyone.
I just stepped out of a Cleaners' Union meeting, as things were getting a little dirty. I popped into the3arguidos to see how things are going, and especially wanted to learn more about what happened there. Along the way I ran into these pearls of wisdom:
Tony_Q
I'm new here and I was convinced that dark powers had hacked the site for good when it vanished.
I googled 'McCann Forum' to see if there was anywhere else I could go and to my astonishment I found this unbelievable place http://justice4mccannfam.forum.biz/
I joined without realising exactly what it was and made a post about how disgusting it was that the gruesome twosome and their mates had refused to return to Portugal for the reconstruction.....My post was instantly pulled, I was banned forever and I got a message telling me that what I had entered was libelous! On closer inspection I realised to my horror, that the forum I had posted on was actually PRO MCCANN!
I have read some of the stuff on it and the gullibility of the people there is truly breathtaking.....That such a forum exists beggars belief.
I bet Clarry would like us all to be that thick and easily manipulated.
Dumptruck
MY EYES HAVE TOOTH DECAY!!!
It's very pink and fluffy isn't it. :-%
Miffed
Talk about getting lost in cyberspace and ending up in the wrong place.
TonyQ
I'm still traumatised
Librarising
You strayed into Rosiepops world - SassyP's blog I think. Check your back for sharpened knitting needles.
Ann-Chovey
I'm not surprised! I clicked on the link (foolishly) as I'd never seen it before. The Portuguese in general come in for a hammering. I think I need a drink.
There, another post with no mention of the eldest of the McCanns' unwanted toys. About the only time I see her name mentioned in posts on the pink side is when they complain that her name is hardly mentioned here. Tripe.
Have a great day everyone.
Stella and Nancy
That photo has had some work done. Forget about it.
Cheers.
Docmac-
Thanks for putting me right! What a silly billy I am - I thought it was rather a strange thing to be wearing!!
An apology to Kate McCann for that!!
I'll always admit to my mistakes!!
Claudia,
'Zodiac, the pros are going to freak! :-)'
LOL!LOL!LOL!
//MADELEINE McCann's parents yesterday vowed that they will never return to Portugal.//
Perhaps vowed should read, PRAY LIKE CRAZY.
//They are now planning to take their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, away on a "secret" break but refuse to visit Portugal.//
"secret" break, The Mac's and Co will obviously know the location. Claudia. Will the PJ have to be informed as to where they have gone, whether it is less than 5 days or more? I just wonder if the location will be leaked, lots of photos taken and more outrage directed at the PJ as they are blamed for the leak. Only an opinion.
Doc, poor people. They weren't probably prepared to such a shock. For those who aren't aware of what the House of Filth consists of, it must be a scare! lololol Have a great day, my favourite floor cleaner in the whole world! :-)
Zodiac, I'm not sure but there is the possibility that if it is for less than 5 days they won't have to disclose the location. Which doesn't mean the PJ won't know, of course. And yes, that leak thing, extremely possible. As I said elsewhere, wherever they go, I hope the locals make sure that they are always in the company of 2 blonde kids. If they aren't, they should call the police!
Zodiac
I was about to tuck into a free lunch. I know, scrounger and all. I've just lost my appetite thanks to you :-)))
I would have placed Bedboy's head on the dancer and Joe Public's face on Bedboy tbh.
Claudia hi! Can't stay right now, but you obviously don't know that many floor cleaners. Especially British ones. From Leicester.
Doc, I do know a few. But you're still my favourite.
Aw shucks, Claudia. Blush!
I'm just going into a lecture now. 'How to choose the right size mop for your favourite bucket'. I'm really looking forward to it!
Madeleine.
I hope everything goes well. I would love if you could travel to Portugal and give us a lecture on cleaning products. You know those which remove everyhting. And I mean everyhing...
by Sass Today at 11:11 am
Where could they go that would be really private?
----------------------------------
To hell?
Am I the only one who feels that if I had a lost a beloved child in a certain location where I had my last memories of her,I would move heaven and earth to go back there and just be where I last saw her having a really happy day (as she is supposed to have told her Mum)! Madeleine deserves that much and her siblings too.
If you lose someone in a road accident for example, you leave flowers now and then at the spot where it happened because you hope by some chance it will give your loved one comfort, and yourselves too, knowing that was their last place on earth.
So why don't the McCanns go back and put some flowers in a spot where Madeleine had a particularly happy time, i.e. the pool, or the beach whatever!
If they are innocent they should have no qualms whatsoever of returning to PdeL! Only the guilty would let their fear of arrest overcome their natural loving feelings as parents.
JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE!
AND FOR ALL VULNERABLE CHILDREN!
Hi, Nancy.
What you have just described is in fact the way grieving patents would behave.
Right, Claudia. Lecture's over. The answer to the mop question was: 'any one that fits inside, but don't forget it also has to fit into the overhead bins on Easyjet'
Funnily enough I attended a 3 year course on cleaning products that will remove everything. I'll e-mail you the course notes if you'd like. Actually, I'll have to upload it to my sendspace account and send you the link, as it's a 412GB file, excluding attachments.
I reckon they should come to Cape Town for their hols Claudia. Gerry needs a smack, and I know someone that's in the mood to give him one. No, it's not me, multitalented OldMum.
Now I really am gone!
Zodiac -
Don't for one moment let the McCanns and Mr Pinky convince you they are going for a 'secret' break somewhere.
They love the cameras following them around - they have obviously been missing the celebrity feeling lately now that Kate is tied to the house - (who are they kidding)?
That's why they wouldn't go back for the reconstruction because they couldn't have it on telly via Crimewatch for all to see and probably miss out on a nice fat fee from the BBC!
Once infamous people get a taste of stardom they will rarely let it go and now things are going a bit quiet they decide to come out and tell us about the secret holiday,(well via their mouthpiece of course) bearing in mind they don't want their privacy invaded! Utter rubbish!
The 'high secret' destination will be published before you can say Jack Robinson! Do they really think the press are not going to be watching every move they make since this has come out of CM's ever open gob!
It's about time they got rid of that flunky and spoke up for themselves for a change - I'm sure the PJ's don't expect them take a vow of silence forever!! They've said enough on interviews with the television, radio and countless magazines all over the world,(you can't pick one up without seeing their faces on the front cover), so why can't they get up and speak without their paid flunky sounding their words? The money saved could be given to a children's charity - they are supposed to care so much for needy kids! It's ABSOLUTELY LUDICROUS!!
Claudia -
Strangely enough, I had an e-mail attachment sent to me the other day that described in detail how many different stains LISTERINE could remove!!
I wonder what it does to your teeth and gums then!!!
Nancy, forward it to the celebrities, please! :-)
Doc, lolololol
Nancy,
I would not be surprised if they leave home for their 'secret' short break with over sized cases, spades, pails, wearing shorts, flip flops & Tshirts, fake tan, sunglasses and singing 'WE'RE ALL GOING ON OUR 5 DAY SUMMER HOLIDAY' and have their muppet announce as they load the car and lock (or leave unlocked) the door 'that's it folks they are off on their 'secret' hol, please follow them...sorry...cough...allow them their privacy'.
Why annouce they are going on a holiday? Ooh everybody look over there! The Paynes, who, the Paynes. Webster, an on line Dictionary, Webster what, who. Portuguese New/Media what is that, never heard of it. IMO.
Zodiac -
Precisely - if you want to keep something secret you would hardly tell big mouth would you?
LOL!!!
Zodiac you forgot the inflatable plastic dinosaur! :-) :-) :-)
Claudia -
Unfortunately I deleted it after sending it to everyone but you know they always look at this site so they'll be able to pick up the good tip!
Kills every known germ!!!
Rat -
You always give everyone a good laugh!!!
I bet the other side wish you were on their site - they could do with someone to tickle their spare ribs!!
ROTB,
Love how the little Rat has found success in 3 A's.
I did not forget the inflatable plastic Dinosaur:
Full of wind, phoney, looking rather haggard and old, sometimes sports orange hair.
******e is the Dinosaur, unfortunately not from our imagination.
Hi all
Somehow we need to know every move and thought of the couple who are being investigated for killing their own child. How perverse. Let's go on a "secret break" but tell the whole world we are going. Give the press a good head start. Clarence points out Kate and Gerry need a break and then adds the twins as an afterthought. He clearly has their way of thinking. I echo Claudia :
wherever they go, I hope the locals make sure that they are always in the company of 2 blonde kids. If they aren't, they should call the police!
Of course the real point is they hate Portugal and will not be going there no way. Positive spin or obvious enmity towards a country's police force who were way too smart for them and believe in justice for abused little children. They will be going to Portugal and if they do not like the idea of that, there is always a European Arrest Warrant where our police will hand them over!
In my honest opinion I offer these words to the parents. It is my standpoint and my assessment.
Hi Gerry & Kate
If you are reading this I would ask you, indeed urge you, to do the decent thing and admit all the wrongs of the last year or so.
I teach young children and as the year has progressed I have viewed the Reception children in my school and wondered about little Madeleine and how she would have settled into her first year at primary school.
It is clear to me that you are dressing opinions up as facts and impeding the investigation.
I am a Catholic primary schoolteacher who believes (along with the majority of my school community) that you were involved in her disappearance.
As a teacher you become embroiled in all sorts of issues around children and their parents Those of us who are parents as well as teachers understand very well how trying our children can be. But we get sickened to the core at some things we hear about especially those from what are perceived to be 'good' parents.
We also come across many parents who do awful things to their children intentionally. Not only physical abuse but the more common one that I have to try and unravel in the classroom is emotional abuse.
The bottom line is you left your children alone to enjoy a few thrills for yourselves and yet you didn't even go out to look for Madeleine that first night. You have even admitted that Madeleine raised this issue with you and let you know how bad it was.
Your own 3yr old had a better moral compass than you and yet we are led to believe you continued this exploitation and maltreatment.
If a child or more usually a child's sibling goes missing at the end of the day at school we all rush to search and cover as much ground as we can in the school as quickly as we can. We do this for as long as it takes. Somebody rings the office and the gates are covered etc etc.
So (IMO) you gave it away right at the beginning by not searching and now one year on you are still dancing around facts and letting someone speak for yourselves when you could easily take open press conferences and answer the questions aired.
The reason you try to control the media is in case you slip up. (IMO)
As a Catholic I abhor your sort who use religion for their own means and as a parent I loathe your sort who do what you did in leaving very young children alone in a room so that you can engage in satisfying your own selfish needs. And as a member of the human race I shudder that you have more than likely hidden your eldest daughter and pretended that she has been abducted.
You have smiled freely and run smoothly across beaches allowing others (not you) to keep on looking for your 'lost' child. You even registered Madeleine's eye defect as a trademark within 2 weeks of her disappearance and allowed pocket money to pay for your mortgage.
So I ask you both to seek some inner peace. Look into your souls and think of what has happened.
Do not deny but embrace the facts deep down in your inner self and then the God that you claim to believe in will hopefully show you the way to turning yourselves in. If as I believe you do not actually believe in God then I ask you to seek forgiveness from Madeleine herself who you badly let down. That does not mean talking to her alone in the middle of the night and carrying on the charade it means stepping out and telling the world what an atrocious wrong was committed that night.
The truth has a funny way of rising to the surface.
Hiya BT
What a great letter to the McCanns. Unfortunately I cannot see them listening. The man who shook and bashed his baby to death only admitted it just two weeks before he was put on trial. Zapata only admitting killing his wife when faced with a second murder trial. It is the legal reality, the court room, that makes such people confess, not their morals or their conscience, if they had those, they would never have done it in the first place.
Interesting choice of leader in The Telegraph today:
Neil Entwistle trial: Prosecution outlines case
Last Updated: 4:56PM BST 06/06/2008
The trial of Neil Entwistle, the British man accused of murdering his American wife and baby daughter, opened today with claims that he intended to sell his story to the highest bidder.
wanted to sell his story to the highest bidder, just like Kate and Gerry McCann, it takes a psychopath to think that way.
Viv x
Viv
I am inclined to agree with you. The fact that their own 3yr old had a better moral compass is telling isn't it. I am on my own with the children and it is now bath time so will be away for a while. My thoughts are on how important this next month is.
:)
Hiya Bath,
Not only did they fail to bother to look for Madeleine immediately as everyone else bar them was doing, and admitted by Kate McCann in their first BBC interview with Jane Hill, I would like to ask them this:
What did you do today, to look for Madeleine? I think I have the answer, vow they will never return to Portugal, not even to leave her some flowers.
There was a fatal accident just up the road from me about a week ago. There are loads of flowers on the corner of the junction. The other night I saw a couple standing there in the pouring rain, weeping, an example of normal grief.
Hiya again BT
You just brought back the most wonderful memories of bathtime with my own boys who used to have the most fantastic time and I used to get very wet! Also my lovely little grand-daughters playing in the bath and the little one coming to me to dry her eyes. Such precious moments that you never forget just how wonderful they are and how children just love to play and have fun.
I agree the next month is absolutely crucial and people (decent ones, not paid McCann mechanics) will start to see just what they wanted to see.
Viv x
Viv,
They have vowed never to return to Portugal. What if M turned up in PT, so they would not return to collect her or identify her then. Unbelievable behaviour.
Hi Zodiac
It was yet another serious mistake they make wasn't it! A bit like Gerry talking about the one year anniversary event, just a few weeks after she disappeared. He has always been admitting what he did, although I do not think that was his intention.
Viv x
Viv, they have very good reasons not to return.
Hi Claudia
They did not actually need to tell us they do not want to go back!
They do not want to go back for Madeleine because they were never concerned in the first place.
Criminals never want to face justice either but they will be taken back.
Viv x
Viv, I'm going to e-mail you.
Viv, I just e-mailed you.
As Bianca was feeling kind of lonely, I stopped by her whinning corner to have a chat. If you want to have some fun, go there! :-)
P.S: Bianca doesn't love me or you anymore. If you help me getting over the pain, I'll help you! :-)
---------------------------------
children_deserve_protection said...
LOL, well aren't you lucky Claudia, you are able to have a view that slightly differs from Viv's and not get kicked off her blog (Viv openly states that Madeleine was physically abused and that the PJ plan to charge the McCanns with "murder").
You'd better watch out though. The more radical and farcical Viv's views become, the more at risk you will be (assuming you don't become equally as radical) of being kicked out!
Oh, I know you may be smug as Hell right now Claudia, but you wait until you're in my position (and of course you say that will be "never" .. LOL!). All I did was question the DNA evidence that was found in this case (not to question the PJ by the way, only to question the strength of DNA evidence in general) and that nut-case Stella came at me like an attack dog, and started accusing me of working for the McCanns! And, rather than come out and say how ridiculous this was and that she wouldn't tolerate personal attacks, not only did Viv tell ME not to upset STELLA, but then SHE personally attacked me herself (she didn't like my "tone"; it was apparently "disgusting" .. oh .. diddems!).
You just wait until YOU upset the precious "blog" Claudia.
Yes, I HAD been having doubts about it there, but I still liked a lot of the posters there (and still do) and was interested to read their ideas. I am still open to many theories, as long as they are presented clearly and logically, and as long as I am then allowed to argue against them if I feel it's necessary (which obviously, I was NOT!).
Anyway, back to the case itself: obviously, you know the in's and out's of Portuguese law better than I do, but it still seems a basic flaw of logic to keep a (supposedly) innocent man as a suspect. Obviously, the PJ have a reason for doing this, but it's not even really the PJ that intrigue me here, but more Viv, and her insistence that it is the McCanns that are at fault for Murat being a suspect, and not actually the PJ (who made him one and kept him one!). It's her seeming obsession to stick it to the Mccanns, even if it means flying in the face of logic, that bugs me so much! And NOT because I feel protective toward the McCanns in ANY way, but simply because it is arrogant, and assumes her audience are just fools!
In fact, I find you both increasingly smug, haughty, and precious (as in can't BEAR to hear anything you do not completely agree with!) and quite frankly, it is nauseating!
Cláudia said...
Bianca, I will never be in your place. Because I am not a turn coat. And because I have integrity. You have no idea what I know. Viv and I go a long way back. And we don't slightly disagree. There is plenty we disagree on. We just aren't the kind of people that go the place where we have been called the most disgusting things because just because we are pissed off. In fact, I call that having no dignity, no integrety, being petty and vindictive. To sum up, Bianca, you sold yourself. That is, if Viv and other posters aren't right. And maybe they are. I'll leave you now so you continue to talk to yourself.
BT,
Excellent post.
Hi Cláudia and all.
Have just arrived home after my last school day in this school year.
What a good feeling!
As I can see there is no news about the 5-day MCCann holiday.
Hope they have already informed the PJ about their plans.
Hi, Marga.
I'm still not done.
If they keep it short, they won't probably have to inform them. If if they manage to take care of their two remaining children, their holiday this year may be less eventful.
I just wonder what sort of holiday can that be that last only five days. One to go, three days to stay and one to come back.
Poor children that will have it stressful. Not even the time to adapt.
Again they are not thinkung of their children well-being but of their own instead.Unless their holiday is intended to be extended, just in case..
*thinking
Hi all
Marga
If Kate & Gerry keep to five days for their holidays, they apparently do not have to let the PJs know.
A very interesting topic though, are they, arn't they, who knows, why has it even been mentioned by Clarence. The wider agenda maybe!!
Cláudia,
yesterday MFlores and R.Alves were on Sic commenting on fraud and famous characters that were caught after many years of fraudulent actions. I loved MFlores smile and face expression when the other one stated that there are famous criminals that have planned incredible hoaxes. Did you notice that, too?
Marga, I missed it. I just love Moita Flores! :-)
Di,
I know that. The questions is really that one: why did they let the press know about that?
I have my guess.
Cláudia,
Moita Flores is both a clever man and a passionate writer.
Not only a passionate writer, but also a very talented one. And a great academic eiter. The man collects degrees! :-)
Anybody else having problems getting into their Gmail account?
He also let people know how he was himself a victim when someone pretended to be him and how some people were led to believe.
He stated that some people have a sort of inner power to convince gullible ones to give them money and contributions as if they were really saying the truth. It has happened all over the world.
Cláudia,
yes. A very talented one.
Marga, it is easier if the people are thick! :-)
Doc, not really!
Doc,
no problem at all here in the north. It is perhaps sth occuring in the south PT.LOL
Well, family is starving.
Have to go. Read you later.
Thanks Claudia
I was expecting some very important mail on one of my accounts there, but I can't get in :-(
I'll be off to try and remedy the matter. May catch you later.
Tell you what, I'll e-mail you@gmail now and you answer if you get it OK? Thanks, chica.
Thanks Marga
I can get into my Google web pages, picasaweb, my own blogs etc. Just Gmail is a problem.
See you later, maybe.
Cláudia,
not necessarily.As he said there are hundreds of cases everywhere of people who have contributed to things that were proved to be a hoax.
Really have to go.
xo
Well, Doc a perfect excuse... you're naugthy...
Cláudia,
just kidding!
Sorry!
BBFN
lol Marga
I didn't even pick up on the Southern thing earlier :-)
I've been running about booting up all my kids' computers too but Gmail is not happening, not for me anyway. Claudia has not replied to my mail sent through my local ISP, so maybe it is a problem. I'm also getting certificate warnings - out of date and so on. I don't usually see any of this. I'm going to work on it now.
Doc, I got it. No problem!
I see so! I'm going to be a busy boy. Bugger.
Viv 18.35pm,
Another mistake, my opinion also.
Did you get my e-mail today with a link to a photo. I did not want to put the link on here, thought you would put the photo here if you thought it appropriate. The satire speaks volumes.
Claudia,
I honestly do not believe that the
Bianca posting at the moment is Bianca from the DE. If it is then something drastic has happened to her, the intellect of Bianca from the DE is just not there in the content of the posts at present. I remember Bianca debating with Elizabeth from the DE, she tore her to shreds, her art of debating and use of language was fantastic. The present Bianca is pushing the abduction scenario and ineptitude of the PJ in a dull monotonous way. A pro tactic, yes everyone the neglect is just awful, although the abduction and PJ are worse they are to blame, lets discuss that. Ooh come on look over here (LGC, I love that description). The pro's are only around to detract and distract. Luckily for M they are rubbish at it, IMO.
BBFN
Zodiac, Bianca (the same or not the same)is the kind of person whose opinions change according with the direction the wind is blowing (that's a Portuguese saying but I'm sure you get the meaning). And such people are not to be trusted. In any circumstance.
Hi Zodiac
I will go and check my emails for this site. Have you read Supertroll/Assassin actually describe how "mad over the top antis" have been used? This is a tactic of the McCanns trolls. Having failed miserably on that, "Bianca" now reverts to more typical tactics as you describe. I could publish 2345's emails to me but will not bother but she is another example and of course using multiple i.d's as we know. These people get very angry when they realise their devious little schemes are just not working and keep opening more and more blogs where they finish up literally talking to themselves. Why do the Pink Trolls have two blogs and how will having main threads about me achieve "justice" for the McCann family. Their kind of justice involves the McCanns getting clean away with what they did!
Viv x
BT
Your earlier post (6.10)says it all I agree with every word you have written. I can tell you are a compasionate person and it was not written out of spite or hate but with Madeleine in mind.
I dont think they realised on the 3rd May 2007 how hard it would be to keep every lie in check. I also dont think they realised that most people are not stupid or selfish enough to abandon children for a night in the bar and had they been in the sad situation that their daughter was missing when they checked on her would not have acted in such a cold way.
Your pupils are lucky to have you xxx
Viv, your last post, spot on! :-) And that's exactly why they hate you!
Already replied to your e-mail, by the way! :-)
Viv,
They are just plain nasty, IMO. I support Law and Order, I support Justice for Madeleine hence I support your blog, long may it continue. I think I read somewhere a certain person is never seen out of the house perhaps blogging to the so called 'nasty bloggers' all day.
Zodiac,
That certain person is so tired that needs some holiday. LOL
I,m glad you've enjoyed your stay here in PT. :-)
Hiya Zodiac
Yes, Dolores posted information that a local sees Gerry going to work and into the local Co-op but he looks really ill, but that Kate never seems to leave the house.
I think Kate is only prepared to face a fantasy world of a camera set with a prepared script but when it comes to facing real people in her own locality, she just cannot.
It has also been said by the McCanns she spends her time emailing etc, particularly at night, yes we know!
Viv x
There is sth interesting in the PT news today., Jorge Resende, a Portuguese immigrant, working as IT man in the Radio Suisse Romande, in Switzerland was fired two years after having repaired a computer of a colleague in the same radio station. He discovered his colleague had sites and images of children related to sex, etc.He denounced that to the administration, he began to have problems among his colleagues and finally he lost his job.
The director stated in an interview that he violated the right of secrecy in the firm by denouncing his colleague. This one was also fired but the radio station has never informed the police.
Now the Portuguese worker is striking outside the building and living in his car. He wants to raise attention to what happened to him and being himself a father he is doesn't regret what he has done in spite of the consequences he has been facing.
I only hope decent people help him in his fight for justice, truth and integrity.
No Viv,
Haven't read about how "mad over the top antis" have been used. Can you enlighten me about that.
I was to busy reading about a shower curtain, a blue sweater and a colour pencil case,a tennis bag and a towel from The Ocean Club.
Do you remember the sick joke CM made about: "the only thing they didn't brought back was.........".
Not that he stated this exactly but you can imagine how sick one can get when you read it.
I have been re-reading posts from the last week. It's so strange that people can change.
Leigh3 saying goodby. I always loved to read her posts. What is happenning?
Leigh3,
Goedenavond.
What's going on? I always thought that you was representing my voice also.
Docmac, I finally understand why you have a heart on your behind. It has to do with the pencil case that was found;)
Marga, I hope you will enjoy the next month/months. You deserve it.
Have read about the clothes and these 2 colours. Wow. Amazing.Green and Yellow.
sorry,
I meant privacy, not secrecy
* he doesn't regret
Jon Gaunt comment, 06 June 2008
Comment The Sun (No online link, appears in paper version only)
Jon Gaunt
06/06/2008
The only holiday destination the McCanns should be flying to is Portugal where they should be taking part in a reconstruction to find more clues to what happened to their daughter last year.
How can they consider a holiday when they said they would do anything to find Madeleine?
Anything of course apart from return to the scene of the crime and face the very real possibility of being arrested for child neglect for leaving Maddie and the twin siblings home alone.
When Kate and Gerry asked the British public for donations the donors expected more from them.
Marga,
I had a lovely time in PT.
Viv,
I got your e-mail, I have replied.
Hmmmm very droll at night as we know.
Such sad news that a little boy who was grieving for his Mum and Grandfather has killed himself. RIP little one. xxx.
BBFN
Atardi!!!
Thanks!
You'll see that you'll have it too as soon as you can't imagine.
Those colours, ribbons, logotype, etc, seem to have been planned before.
What's happening with Leigh?
Isn't she posting anymore?
I love her religious dimension and the sentence that will always be associated to her.
Leigh, if you're reading,
Abraço.
Hi Marga
That is a very sad case of the immigrant worker doing the right thing is reporting paedophilia but then being victimised because of it. In the UK we have a law called the Public Interest Disclosure Act. This says that in the first instance employees should report serious wrongdoing to their employer who should take appropriate action, i.e. report this man to the police. If the worker finds his employers do not take appropriate action he can then go to the authorities himself. If a worker is victimised because he did this, he can get tens of thousands in compensation in an Employment Tribunal. I am sorry this option does not seem to be open to him.
Viv x
Marga, it's incredible that such a thing would happen in Swizerland. And I am proud of that Portuguese citizen. I hope he is rewarded for his courage.
Zodiac,
you were only about 100km from my place. I read your posts. Although I'm not a catholic anymore, I understand how people feel when they go to Fátima.
It´s like being to Santiago de Compostela, Rome or Lourdes, in France.
Cláudia, have you also watched it?
The poor man had to suffer humility and discrimination during two years and finally he had to report it to the police.
I think he behaved like a real man.
Viv, that BR law is a good thing.
The man is a decent person.
He is having a great support.
I'm also glad he had put his moral values above everything, sth that shoudn't have been easy to do in a foreign country, having in mind he has a family to care for, etc.
No, Marga, I didn't see it. I just read your post.
Atardi,
specially for you:
Some time ago you asked about a picture in my avatar. It was a lake.
Now I have a sunset on the beach I use to go to.More or less 6 km away from where I live.
The landscape here is diverse. Mountains, rivers,northwest and the sea on the coast.
Well, nice people, my bed is waiting for me.
Sweet dreams for all of you.
In Portuguese: sonhos cor-de-rosa!
Cor-de-rosa= pink
For God's sake..LOL
Claudinha,
jinhos
Leigh,
the truth always set you free (John)
xo
Marga,
As you know the last weeks are very hectic. You survived it. I will try to survive the next 3 weeks.
Viv posted to you that Kate wears clothes that everyone can buy.
Is it because their way of living? Do they smoke? Because that costs a lot of money.
Detective Superintendent Stuart Prior, lead on Maddie case makes a Freudian slip when speaking of another case he is now heading
"no stone will be left unturned"
So glad to hear that!
Shooting in Leicester - Can you help?
Send photos or video to us by texting shooting to 07725 202020
Detectives investigating a shooting at student accommodation in Leicester at the weekend are urging witnesses to email or text with any information that could help their enquiries.
The incident happened at around 2.30am on Saturday (April 28) at the privately-run residential block at Filbert Village, on Lineker Road.
A 24-year-old man received gunshot wounds to the shoulder area. He is receiving treatment in hospital where his condition is described as stable.
While officers have spoken to many people who attended the event, they still believe that there are people yet to come forward who can help.
Please contact the police if you:
Were at the party.
Were in the vicinity of Lineker Road around 2.30am and saw vehicles leaving the area at speed.
Saw the shooting.
Have photos/film from the party.
Have any information about the weapon used or its current whereabouts.
You can give information via email, by calling the incident room on Leicester (0116) 222 2222 or calling Crimestoppers on 0800 555 111.
If you captured any photograph or video of the party, including images showing the shooting itself on a mobile phone, then please send it to us by texting shooting to 07725 202020. (MMS messages charged at your operator's standard rate)
Detective Superintendent Stuart Prior, who is leading the investigation, said: "Every piece of information we receive helps us to build up a picture of the events leading up to the incident and the incident itself. Even the smallest piece of information could prove of vital importance to the investigation.
"The Force takes an extremely tough stance on gun crime - quite simply it won't be tolerated. We have a robust policy to investigate these types of incidents and no stone is left unturned.
"Thankfully, these types of incidents are extremely rare in Leicestershire. We are committed to doing everything possible to make sure they stay that way and we would anyone with information to help us by getting in touch."
Hi Atardi
I certainly do not think the McCanns smoke but they do like to drink an awful lot of alcohol and pictures of them several years ago confirm this is not a newly developed habit. It is just one they wanted to continue even after they had children to look after.
The mortgage on their home at £2000 per month is massive, even on the sort of salaries they were on, it would have over-committed them. Add to this Gerry's need for the lifestyle e.g. private golf club and of course the massive costs of private fertility treatment. Quite simply they were sending out more than they had coming in!
Viv x
Marga,
Sweat dreams.
But who is John?
Hey guys did you know that Docmac and Ironside are the same person, well according to RavingmadRosieIkeephaving dreams and visions anyway.
Oh and by the way I think she could try being a little more muted, also checking if she wants to use a big word she got the right one...mooted Rosie dear! They call us stupid...ummmmmmmm x
So, the News of the World moved in to 5a, had it all nicely redecorated and then Rosie shows us the picture, I mean guys, nothing had changed, had it!
Liar Ironside
by Rosiepops Today at 3:00 pm
Someone recently muted the question if notdoc is really Ironside, at firs I thought no, but since the I have read them both and the similarities are in fact quite striking, also they both have the propensity to play for the sympathy card. ie Boo hoo please John remove me from this site (Mad axe murderers site - true) followed by all the sops crying and begging him not to go, and you can almost envisage Ironside sitting back in *HIS* litter strewn room lapping up their stupidity, with his head swelling. Only one sensible voice more or less said if you want to go then go.
Of course Ironside didn't go, he had no intention of going, he only said that because he wanted the adulation.
I see that I got a mention in his post, hadn't done a thing to him, not bothered with him, had not read Ironside in ages , couldn't really care less about him, yet there he was mentioning me in his Boo Hoo post to an axe murderer!
Why? 1) could be one of two things, I get to him because he knows I am right 2) I get to him because he knows I am right AND he is really notdoc and we all know I annoy the hell out of notdoc and am never far from his mind, he can barely write one or two posts without mentioning me. (Another similarity with Ironside apparently)
BLOOD MARKS THE DEATH
by IRONSIDE on Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:09 am
Hi Meadow,no in appartment 5a...the floor was wood...Have no time now ,but will post you the link to Diegos blog..it is spanish but translated into english...There are some U Tube videos you may find interesting...If Mercede posts she will maybe explain as she does all of the translation....
Have a good day
Just one thing wrong with this you bloody liar Ironside, there is NO wooden block flooring in apartment 5a. So STOP spreading deliberate lies with the intention to deliberately mislead. Wonder where those photographs with missing wooden blocks came from? Oh I know probably been *DOCTORED*!
Here is a picture from apartment 5a which the News of The World rented out and took video footage and photographs of. Proves LIAR Ironside is deliberately misleading people, is desperate to mislead people and he is also the Mercedes he mentions and well as Notdoc, when the hell are some people going to wake up and see what this man is doing? Ever wondered why he is sickeningly subservient to notdoc? Always trying to bolster up notdoc? Ooops because he IS notdoc. However, what interests me more is WHY? Why is he doing it? Why is he so desperate that he invents all of these different ID's, surfs the net, trying to convince people of blatant outrageous lies? Must be a reason, what is that reason?
Hi Atardi
I think John Lennon said that!
The truth will always set you free, not that he would have harmed his children x
Vivx
ROTFLMAO Viv! Which pink one was that on? Oh dear! Did you see the poster from 3A who was concerned about getting dental decay in her eyes when looking at one of the pink sites?
Shut up, Ironside! Go and make my toasted sarmie you subservient fool! Shit, I've woken Mercedes now.
ROTFL!! Thanks!
Atardi you have mail from Ironside ;-)
lololol!!!
Guys, you always make me laugh even when I'm as sleepy as I was having tapas with the Tapas lot! :-)
Madeleine
Madeleine II
Madeline, spelt the pink blog way.
Tapas, Claudia? How was the vin?
Maddie. x
Hi Viv,
Thanks for the explanation. I received a very good explanation from one of your bloggers, but I still cannot understand why adults blogging think that Madeleine has no voice.
I can't believe that they hate JFM.
Well, Doc, I actually hate wine (I know, I know he are supposed to have great wines here). But I would have to drink it to fit in, wouldn't I?
Hey Ironside can you get Mercedes to fetch me some TAPAS er now please, I am starving x
It was on their intelligent biz forum, Doc, you know the one with about 30 threads all about us, where they rave, cackle and spit - Justice for Kate and Gerry McCann I say to have a defence team as good as that!! tee hee xx
*we
Viv, you heathen!
I think Marga meant John the Baptist. John Lennon was a jealous guy.
Viv, I just visited the place to see what was new (don't worry I was wearing my mask so not to be disturbed by the stench). Well, it took me about 30 seconds.
Hey, Ironside II! How could you call me and not tell me you were also Ironside?
Doc, I know I am a heathen, but I really like John Lennon x
and yes just because someone is no longer here in the flesh, does not mean they cannot have impact
Claudia :-)
Viv, were all 7 of them in on it?
Maidline. Sorry, just plugging our hotline number. 0800-CLEANERS.
Doc,
I doubt it..dragged in !
Viv, can you ask Mercedes to come to Viseu (which is just around the corner like Tarifa) and bring me some Tapas too, please?
Claudia, I've read some stuff before about those old iron lungs, but iron sides is beyond my ken.
Doc, lololol
Hey Hun
well actually it is a very, very short ferry ride and 10 mins by car (jet propelled) but you still may need to pop in microwave hun x
Viv, I mean the 7 genuine members of pink2, in case we have our wires crossed here.
Huns
Do you remember when Poopsypsych kept saying on the DE, I know it is a very short ride from PDL to Huelva because I have driven it many times myself, yes when she has been nicking other people's kids x
Viv, no problem, darling.
Just tell Mercedes a few tapas and 10 bottles will be enough. I'm not that thirsty today.
Oh my!
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