26 Aug 2009

WHY IT'S GERRY MCCANN:-)) E-fit of suspect the Portuguese Police refused to release,



Very odd, for the second time I am putting this e-fit of Gerry McCann back into this post, I hope he does not do a mysterious disappearing act again! Good British Police did not rule him out too-))


Portuguese police drew up e-fits of men seen hanging around Praia da Luz, but did not release them. This image was created from one witness account, but the individual was later ruled out of the inquiry.
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44892000/jpg/_44892616_eeb9eee8-df40-4807-8aea-0f18465ac665.jpg&imgrefurl=http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/7542790.stm&usg=__CM5D0muFAJSPMWT9HEZCO6epOBs=&h=300&w=466&sz=23&hl=en&start=19&um=1&tbnid=ekH4i_7wCHB1SM:&tbnh=82&tbnw=128&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dmissing%2Bmadeleine%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1W1GPCK_en%26sa%3DX%26um%3D1


So this was the BBC on 5 August 2008 telling us the above individual was later ruled out of the enquiry, that image is clearly Gerry McCann. The BBC can paint us a picture, but the rest is up to you!



A second image in the police files was generated from the account of British ex-pat Lance Purser, who said he thought the man he saw may have had "psychological problems", but the sighting led nowhere.


Detectives went on to name the McCanns as formal suspects in the disappearance of their daughter. But officers announced they were were no longer suspects when they closed the case.


Lawyers for the McCanns, both 40, were given access to the police files last week. They are now studying the papers for fresh leads the couple's private detectives can follow up, their spokesman says.
Back
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12



Madeleine's parents 'left patio doors unlocked'Last updated at 16:53 13 May 2007Police in Portugal are working on the theory that Madeleine was snatched through patio doors left unlocked by her parents as they dined just 40 yards away.Until now, it was believed that shutters at the front of the apartment had been jemmied open by the little girl's abductors.But Chief Inspector Olegario Sousa, spokesman for the investigation, has confided in British former Chief Inspector Albert Kirby that neither the windows nor their shutters had been tampered with.Mr Kirby, who led the investigation into the abduction and murder of Liverpool-born toddler Jamie Bulger, revealed that it was the unlocked patio doors of the apartment that allowed Madeleine to be taken away swiftly and quietly.Sources close to the investigation also confirmed that police attention was solely focused on the back of the apartment, which leads on to a small garden easily accessible from a public path through a gateway.Gerry and Kate McCann would have used the patio doors as they checked on their daughter and her twin siblings during their meal near the Mark Warner holiday complex swimming pool and it is these doors that were left unsecured.The McCanns and all their friends on the holiday left their patio doors open throughout the evenings for fear of fire.Mr Kirby told The Mail on Sunday: "I had a very interesting chat with the officer in charge. The window shutters are not an issue."Their mechanism makes them almost impossible to open. The door was left unlocked. They did that every night."I think the police have a very specific understanding of what they are looking for."Mr Kirby believes Portuguese police will solve the case of the missing toddler within days. He said: "I am impressed by the investigation. I have a feeling we will have a result by the end of the next week."

72 comments:

viv said...

and the other male who the witness thought had psychological problems, image number 10 above, if you click on the link to BBC, is the image of Russell O'Brien.

viv said...

Page last updated at 17:55 GMT, Thursday, 7 August 2008 18:55 UK
E-mail this to a friend Printable version

Madeleine revelations offer few facts

By Steve Kingstone
BBC News



Portuguese prosecutors shelved their investigation last month
There was no shortage of compelling lines of inquiry to emerge from the Portuguese police files on the abduction of Madeleine McCann released this week.

One possibility was that Madeleine was abducted by a loitering stranger, whose description was not circulated by police.

Another claim was that she was seen being carried by her own father, shortly before 10pm on the night of her disappearance.

---


With the McCanns having only just been released from their Arguido status by the Portuguese Attorney General, due to lack of evidence as to what crime they committed etc. the BBC would have had careful legal advice as to what they could actually print, but even so, still refer above to the Smith family sighting, where Mr Smith in particular believes he saw Gerry McCann carrying Madeleine off. Our press could not outright accuse them, but they can tell us why they were under investigation, up to a point, without damaging the ongoing investigation by British Police.

Witnesses saw Gerry and Russell hanging around and behaving oddly, and other witnesses saw a man who looked just like Gerry carrying off a child who looked just like Madeleine. Now why do people insist there was no abduction when there seems to be clear evidence that there was?

I think the only issue is as to whether Madeleine was being carried off by Gerry, dead or alive. Hence the police always had those two scenarios. But it is highly inaccurate to insist, "there was no abduction". In fact downright misleading because the police quite obviously believed there may well have been.

If that is the case, that means Madeleine may still be alive and it is nothing short of wicked to just run a campaign, similar to the McCanns and almost as dishonest/money grabbing, insisting she is dead.

That demonstrates a wilful and wicked disregard for the "situation Madeleine finds herself in", to quote her own father, Gerry McCann.

hope4truth said...

Looking at that photo fit it shows how one sided the reporing is if this was any other person it would be all over the front pages like tooth man and posh spice...

viv said...

Hiya Hope

I think the issue is the Beeb would not be able to state in clear terms that Gerry was identified as a suspect. Both in terms of libel law and in terms of damaging the ongoing criminal investigation in UK/causing danger to the McCanns by harassment etc/ preventing a fair trial taking place. It is just now lawful to state in clear terms someone has committed a criminal offence until they have been tried and found guilty.

I also notice the McCanns are not pointing the finger at anyone who is actually within this jurisdiction!
xx

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I am not saying they should say it is Gerry but if we have photofits rammed down our throats why is it only the ones they want us to see.

A nice clear picture of the one at the top of this page saying suspect in Madeleine Case people can draw their own conclusions..

After all it was given by a witness and is just as important as all the other odd pictures we have had ramed down out throats...

xxx

hope4truth said...

It is all spin really when you look at it...

I was looking at a pro site earlier and there is a very sad picture of Kate and Gerry around Madelines 4th Birthday with some tosh about how could people be horrible about them. Looking at that web site I would have to agree how could I be so horrible and nasty not to belive them and worse still blindly put them down...

Then we look at the happy snaps of them around the same time and I think they are evil vile people for not helping to find their child by lying spinning and not answering questions.

I have to conclude that if their child were really missing they would look like the picture on the pro site all the time and NOTHING but news that their daughter had been found alive and well and was at that very moment comming back to them could make them look as happy as they did in all those photos for a very very long time to come. And even though they would laugh again one day the agony would be etched on their faces.

So I guess it is how you spin it that makes people belive what they want to.

Dont ya just love propaganda!!!!

Problem is most of us are educated enough these days to recognise propaganda when we see it....

xxx

viv said...

hiya Hope

Just signed in to notice that my lovely e-fit picture of Gerry at the top of this thread has disappeared. No one has permission to change this blog and so I wonder what is going on??

Most odd, will be putting it back, needless to say.

I am a bit sick of propaganda from the McCanns, and Tony Bennett!


xx

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

How strange now if I was wanting to save face (sorry no pun intended) I would be removing the happy snaps on Madeleines Birthday because I think they may convince anyone who thought about donating not to!!!

xxx

Keesha said...

I wonder if Clarence will try and spin this one..I can't find the link to Times Online / Chris Ayers but spotted this on anorak

http://www.anorak.co.uk/media/220948.html

"" CONGRATULATIONS to Chris Ayres, for linking the arrival of “Missing girl” Jaycee Lee Dugard to Madeleine McCann..attracted the same kind of media frenzy that Madeleine McCann’s disappearance generated two years ago..""

viv said...

Hiya Both

As I know Gerry has a penchant for being famous, I have restored the e-fit of him back at the top of this thread. Now I can understand him being so angry with those naughty PJs refusing to publish the e-fits they had of the suspects:-)) ..The other one being his best pal, Russell O'Brien..

Keesha, thanks for the link to this bizarre story, especially liked the comment:

"As for Madeleine McCann – well, she’s the media’s benchmark for all missing children…. Her parents are innocent."

I am sure they are not trying to suggest the British Press are handling this in a way that could only be described as ludicrous:-)))

Keesha said...

The Mail is showing the age progression image of Jaycee as per the NCMEC
For the 2 year anniversary, Kate and Gerry released the age progression pic of Maddy at 6 years old, produced by the NCMEC with Ernie Allen. A clip of this was filmed for the Oprah Show appearance, followed by worldwide release of the image.

Anyway, I am curious to see how accurately the NCMEC image matches reality.. if/ when we see interviews with 29 year old Jaycee in due course.

viv said...

hiya Keesha

I did wonder whether the McCanns decisions to get these age progressed images of Maddie were a reaction to me and many others complaining that the images we had been bombarded with of Madeleine were when she was aged just two.

It seems to be that when they realise they have made a very adverse publicity stunt they do take steps to rectify that. See my threads about the images they released for Christmas 2008 when Maddie would have been approaching six but she is clearly depicted in that video, aged two. Likewise their favourite pic with the red dress and short tinted red hair which actually looks nothing like any other images of Madeleine. I have noticed too people commenting that on official pages like Interpol detailing missing Maddie McCann, no mention is made of this so called colomboma.

We can see from the video getting onto the plane and the tennis balls pic that when Maddie disappeared she had long hair that could best be described as brown, rather than blond. Although I suppose brown hair is just not so cute and appealing. It seems to me that the last thing the McCanns actually wanted was for anyone to be able to accurately recognise Madeleine.

I think by the time they did produce those age progressed pictures it was just too late, and we jumped from being bombarded with images of a cute little toddler to one supposedly aged 6. My own take from discussing it with people was they were singularly unimpressed and most people just think she must be dead anyway or the McCanns got rid of her in some other way.

So, we see Maddie aged two, then we see imaginary pictures of Maddie aged 6, credible, well hardly!

But yes it will be interesting to hear more of the mystery of Jaycee now aged 29 and where she has been in the meantime!

viv said...

In clear terms, Mr Kirby who worked on the Jamie Bulger case is calling Kate and Gerry McCann a couple of liars. The windows are not an issue...their mechanism is impossible to open. The police are focussing on the rear of the apt, and the patio doors which enabled Maddie to be taken away quickly and quietly, the police know what they are looking at and should solve this very quickly. Presumably Mr Kirby believe the PJ would recover Madeleine from wherever the McCanns sent her. Sadly, that was not to be.

It is strange that Kate McCann has the audacity, only very recently, to go on Oprah, once again insisting the windows and shutters had been opened WHOOSH went the curtains. I really think she needs a mental health check! Notice Gerry was not so stupid as to repeat all this rubbish!
-----



Mr Kirby told The Mail on Sunday: "I had a very interesting chat with the officer in charge. The window shutters are not an issue."Their mechanism makes them almost impossible to open. The door was left unlocked. They did that every night."I think the police have a very specific understanding of what they are looking for."Mr Kirby believes Portuguese police will solve the case of the missing toddler within days.

viv said...

A very similar case to Frizl except it was not his own daughter but kidnapped Jaycee, full details here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8225621.stm

Keesha, thanks for this, Gerry has previously said how heartening he finds cases like Frizl and Kampusch, will he being doing so again, or has he learned from his mistakes?

viv said...

"Last year we sent home a record 5,395 foreign national prisoners including over 50 killers and attempted killers, over 200 sex offenders and more than 1,500 drug offenders."

Good riddance to some very bad rubbish, but still this man evaded being deported and committed two horrendous rapes:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/8224713.stm

Keesha said...

Yep, you can rely on The Sun to show a pic of of Kate and Gerry, encourged and drawing strength from Jaycee's story!

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2610789/Kidnap-girl-found-alive-after-18yrs.html

hope4truth said...

What wonderful news for Jaycee and her family. As for getting strength from it having her back is wonderful but what happpend to the poor child when she was taken must have damaged her very much giving birth at 14 for any girl is traumatic but without your Mother nearby and after being repeatedly raped with no medical attention is horific.

But a second chance for her and her children is something to be celebrated and I hope she is given the respect privacy and time she needs and people do not take advantage of her for a good story.

Viv I see you have 2 photofits at the top of the page now is one a spare???

xxx

hope4truth said...

hello again

Just read that the step father of the girl was a suspect in his words until yesterday. It would be intresting to look back over this and see how her Mother behaved as the Stepfather said it destroyed their relationship.

I wonder if any of them searched for her (although he did witness her being dragged into a car so knew she had not wandered off) but how many questions did the pair of them refuse to answer and just how happy were they in the days after she was taken???

Di said...

Hi all

When I saw the story of Jaycee on BBC News this morning I was convinced Madeleine's name would be mentioned, but no. Well done BBC for not allowing this tragic story to be hijacked by the McCanns. Hopefully they will be left in peace to rebuild their lives.

I can just imagine Clarence this morning, trying to work something to Kate & Gerry's advantage, which would be totally sickening.

viv said...

Hiya Both

Just eaten breakfast and now I feel like I want to throw up. Kate and Gerry are "drawing strength from this".

Hope, I can only see one photofit, are you seeing two?


The destruction of this couple's relationship sounds pretty typical. Apparently the step father gave chase on his pushbike which sounds desperate enough!

It must have been awful for him to be a suspect but given he is a stepfather in particular I suppose that was understandable.

Whilst respecting they have a life that they need to get on with, I agree with you, Hope, it will be very interesting if we get some more details of how this couple reacted to the disappearance.

viv said...

Hiya Di!

I was not ignoring did not see your post until after I posted:-))

Well yes, the BBC have shown due decorum and not sought to link this to the McCann debacle but, The Sun, just what we would expect, wait for it to be in The Mirror too, repulsive!

viv said...

Ah, Clarence has quickly got a call in to his friends at the Daily Mirror:

"Clarence Mitchell, spokesman for Kate and Gerry McCann, said it gave hope that one day daughter Madeleine, snatched in Portugal in 2007, could be found safe and well."

It remains to be seen whether this sickening comment appears in other newspapers stories about this case or whether The Sun and The Daily Mirror really do deserve the prize for scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Just how many more sick cases is he going to align to the McCanns over the years?

viv said...

Well done The Telegraph, Clarence was clearly unsuccessful there, just an expected comparison with Kampusch another case, Gerry said he took great comfort from:

But her case is already being compared to that of Natascha Kampusch, the Austrian girl held for more than eight years in a dungeon below the home of her abusive captor. Kampusch only secured her own freedom by escaping from her windowless cell in August 2006, after which her kidnapper Wolfgang Priklopil committed suicide.

viv said...

No mention for the McCanns in The Times either, their take on the story is to detail children "back from the dead". It would seem Mitchell only has the ear of the gutter press these days, will be checking the Daily Express and the Daily Mail to see which category they fit into:-))

Back from the dead

Katharine Farrand Dyer — also known as Boulder Jane Doe — reappeared in Australia this month after vanishing from Boulder, Colorado, in 1954. Investigators thought she had been a victim of Harvey Glatman, the so-called Lonely Hearts Killer, but Dyer, now 84, said that she had chosen to vanish for “personal reasons”

Natascha Kampusch disappeared in 1998 aged 10 and reappeared eight years later after escaping her kidnapper, Wolfgang Priklopil, who had kept her in a dungeon. She now hosts a TV talk show and owns the house where she was imprisoned

Elizabeth Smart disappeared from her family’s home in Salt Lake City, Utah, in 2002 when she was 14. But nine months later she reappeared a few miles away in the company of a married couple who said they could speak to God

Natasha Ryan, 14, ran away from home in Australia in 1998. After a huge police search a man was charged with her murder. Five years later police found her hiding in a cupboard in the house that she shared with her boyfriend. They have since married

John Barnes, from Michigan, claimed this year that he was really Stephen Damman, kidnapped at the age of 2 outside a bakery in New York in 1955. DNA checks with Stephen’s sister, who was also abducted but found soon afterwards, disproved his claim

Source: Times database

Di said...

Hi Viv

Yes definitely two e-fits.

It didn't take Clarence long did it, shame on him and the McCanns.

viv said...

Hiya di

I put another e-fit up because it had disappeared but it seems everyone else can see it and I cannot. Not being much of a techie I can offer no explanation for that other than it sounds like my computer is just rubbish:-))

I think the conduct of the McCanns getting Mitchell to do this is just dreadful, aligning to such shocking cases, that have absolutely no bearing on the disappearance of little Maddie. When we finally discover just what they did with little Maddie I would like to know what Mitchell is going to have to say for himself then!

Wizard said...

It’s not surprising the McCanns’ are drawing strength from the Jaycee story.

After over 2 years of trying to convince everyone they had nothing to do with their daughter’s disappearance a story like this appears.

Must be like a very early Christmas present which they can now use, when necessary, to contradict any views that suggest their daughter is dead – let alone by their hands.

viv said...

Hiya Wiz

I just don't understand how they think it is a good public relations exercise to actually tell the public they are drawing strength from such terrible stories of abuse.

I know I said it a long time ago on the DX, but, and maybe not everyone feels the same, I just have to say that if I was making a choice for my child, 18 years of rape and torture, imprisonment in a garden shed or underground bunker, or a quick death, I would choose the latter. I would feel happier knowing my child was not suffering. I just think to a normal parent the thought that your child was suffering this year in year out would drive you completely insane with grief. I am sure it would me anyway.

viv said...

So maybe the message they should be putting out is they hope she is not suffering any form of terrible abuse, rather than saying they draw comfort from the thought she may be suffering precisely that?

Again it is just the depiction of a couple who only have their own self preservation to consider, they have never demonstrated any love or compassion for little Madeleine and I find their need to latch onto such stories really quite horrifying in what it says about them as a couple. Also when considering they still have custody of those twins, and they really should not be allowed to keep them. Emotional abuse can be every bit as bad as physical and I have no doubt the twins will always suffer the most terrible and increasing emotional trauma because of those two sick excuses for human beings.

I remember my daughter in law saying, it would have been an act of love to hand those twins over to a loving relative. They are not capable of such a loving gesture. Kate could not even explain why she was thinking of handing over custody of little Maddie.

Di said...

The Jaycee case was the main subject on Jeremy Vine this lunchtime R2.

An expert in this sort of case was interviewed and asked why Carl Probyn the stepfather was considered a suspect. The reply was, not word for word, because in most cases of abduction the parents are involved.

Perhaps not what Kate & Gerry would want to hear.

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv and Di

of course the McCann's are hopeful again as they need the cash to flood in to pay thier directors and lawyers...

I cant help thinking that my Husband would wipe the floor with me if I sat through an interview and refused to answere a single question for our missing child.

In fact after he had walked out on me taking my other daughter with him his next stop would be back to the police asking them to investigate exactly what I was doing the night she vanished.

Wait for it Di the Expert on Jeremy Vine will be silenced soon just in case it makes Gerry and Kate look guilty...

It makes me shudder to think that poor girl had to endure god knows what and give birth twice without her Mum to hold her...

At least with the harsh American Justice system the scum who did this to her will not see the light of day again.

Di said...

Another statement from The McCanns.

Gerry and Kate McCann, whose daughter Madeleine vanished from the family's holiday apartment in Portugal in 2007, have passed on their best wishes to Jaycee Lee's family.

In a statement issued via their spokesman, Clarence Mitchell, the McCanns said: "Once again this shows that children can seem to disappear off the radar only to be found years later alive.

"It emphasises we should never assume that someone is not alive without any evidence to support this. We should never give up.

"This case only makes us more determined to find Madeleine. She is out there somewhere and somebody knows where.

"Our thoughts and best wishes are with Jaycee and all her family for a happier and peaceful future."

Di said...

Hi Hope

I agree with your comments. I have said before and I will say again if my child disappeared whilst on holiday with friends, I would want each and every one of them thoroughly investigated.

The fact that Madeleine's own mother refused to answer any questions says it all to me. No way did they want their friends interrogated before they had a chance to all get their stories straight. who knows what they would have revealed otherwise.

Wizard said...

Just reading back:

“Kate could not even explain why she was thinking of handing over custody of little Maddie.”

Plus of course Kate would not answer the pj’s questions.

Well, as we know the McCanns’ are er... hmm... being framed by the pj (lol) so for her to say she couldn’t cope with Madeline and had thought about handing over her custody would be very incriminating.

Similarly the pj questions she refused to answer - she couldn’t answer them because they would have been incriminating.

He silence on these points says it all really.

KM’s behaviour is not normal and as pointed out all innocent parents would have bent over backwards to help the pj answering their questions, going back for the reconstruction etc.

I think KM’s behaviour is perfectly normal if she is involved in her daughter disappearance.

Looking back over the past two years at the parents behaviour it only looks strange if you believe in a stranger abduction. If you don’t believe in their innocence their behaviour begins to look very normal for people covering up a crime imo.

Di said...

Hi Wizard

I think you have a good point there, digging a hole deeper and deeper comes to mind.

I wonder if we are going to see the microchip surfacing again. After all if Jaycee was abducted today and had been chipped she would have been found instantly.

What they fail to tell us is that these chips in animals, if they move as happened to one of our dogs, can cause cancer. Just imagine what it could do to a child!

Di said...

I am intrigued by Phillip Garrido's comment.


"I've completely turned my life around," he insisted.

"You'll find a most powerful story coming from the witness - the victim - if you just take this a step at a time, you'll fall over backwards."

He went on: "And in the end you'll find the most powerful heart-warming story, revealing of something that needs to be understood.

"That's as far as I can go."

hope4truth said...

Well Di that says it all...

"And in the end you'll find the most powerful heart-warming story, revealing of something that needs to be understood"

Another Peadophile insisting that sex with children need's to be understood.

Sick B****** can think about that when he is thrown in jail for the rest of his pathetic life...

Wizard

Good points on it not looking odd if they are guilty...

You would have to be a sick twisted person to play with the life of your child if she really had been taken and they proved that on day one by insisting that people belive it was an abduction???

Any other parent would assume and pray they had just wandered off and could be find but with the first thoughts being it was too dark to search they must have known there was no point.

Di said...

Hi Hope

Do you know that comment by Kate makes my blood boil. It was too dark to search, but not too dark for Maddie to perhaps be out there and lost, crying for her parents, whilst they spent the evening on their mobiles bringing in the troops. What normal parents of a lost child would even be able to hold a conversation, let alone ring all and sundry.

hope4truth said...

hi Di

I know but remeber they were working very hard!!!

I know to be brought to trial there need's to be concrete evidence but this has been un real...

If I change my mind and belive 110%that Madeleine was abducted and is out there somewhere scared to death waiting to be found it actually makes me hate her parents and all the people who worship them because to play a game of spin and lies when a little girl is lost is sick disturbing and the most evil thing any parent could do to their child.

Then parents who think neglecting their children all holiday and dumping them all day so they can enjoy "their" holiday are not people I would ever wish to mix with.

As Madeleine is now a ward of court it is about time whoever is now responsible for her insisted the case was reopend and the British Police also got involved.

Not sure why Madeleine does not deserve to be cared for it is every childs right.

Di said...

Hi Hope

What a good point, Madeleine is a ward of court can the case not be re-opened by the court?

Viv, we need your expertise here, could it be possible?

viv said...

Hiya Hope, Di, Wiz

IMO, this case only got closed in Portugal because it was decided it was not a case of a stranger abduction and they had investigated this matter just as far as they could.

If there was compelling new evidence that they were wrong in that conclusion and Madeleine really was abducted by a stranger then the process could be re-opened in Portugal. In fact it would have to be. That is a jurisdictional point. If the offence happened in Portugal, as it clearly did, and it was a stranger abduction that would mean that British Police had no jurisdiction to prosecute the case. All they could do would be to offer assistance as they clearly have.

But whilst British Police have been offering assistance, we can clearly see that a view was formed it was her British parents who are responsible for the disappearance of Madeleine. Due to that British Police became very actively involved in investigating various scenarios, ways in which the parents may have disposed of little Maddie. They know from much of the surrounding evidence they are involved but needed to find out precisely how. Getting the sniffer dogs over and conducting further searches for Maddie's body was part of that process. Because that scenario was investigated as a possibility as to what they did with her, does not mean that is what they did. Having decided upon their suspects, the police then have to investigate every way they may have disposed of her and try to find compelling evidence of that. I am quite certain that the issue of them being involved in Maddie's disappearance was the further scenario they were looking at. In terms we were often told this in various press reports. People wrong assumed this was a means of seeking to exculpate the parents, it was not!

I believe that via their lawyers, Kate and Gerry found out that the Pt Police would rule out any stranger abduction and would therefore shelve the investigation in Portugal. There being no compelling evidence of what they did with Madeleine, but pretty compelling evidence they are the culprits. This just cannot be challenged IMO. They lied about the most fundamental points from the outset, and they persist in those lies, i.e. as to the front window and shutter having been jemmied and then even when this was proved not to be the case, they have persisted in saying these were found opened. Something that is just not possible.

There are no grounds upon which Kate and Gerry could have sought to insist the Pt Police continue with the investigation of any stranger abduction. They knew this had been ruled out and they were the prime suspects. They also knew, because they had expert legal advice, that the Pt file would be released to them.

But what gives British Police jurisdiction against Kate and Gerry is the fact that they committed very serious offences against their child abroad. In UK law it does not matter if you go abroad to do so, you can and will be prosecuted in UK for that. That does not of course include just child neglect, but most certainly includes homicide and sex offending/kidnap. Those are effectively the two scenarios IMO and I believe the second one is considered more likely. But in either case the chances of Maddie still being alive are slim.

In order to continue to defend the serious position they found themselves in of British Police now taking over the investigation of them, what Kate and Gerry needed, in addition to the Pt Police file was the British agency file. This probably contains a lot of additional information that was not handed over to Portugal and may involve detail of a lot of linked offenders and the investigations into fraud.

cont'd sep post due to length

viv said...

Their defence of themselves, IMO, commenced at the very outset, with their application to the High Court obtaining an Order on about 20 May 2007 that they were entitled to information from the police as to sightings etc.

As we know the Ch Cons of LP was refusing to comply with that Order and supply any information to the McCanns. So, they made their ill fated application to force him to comply with the Order on 2 April 2008, on the same date Mrs Justice Hogg then decided to make Madeleine a Ward of Court. It is abundantly clear the McCanns have sought to second guess any investigation against them and denounce the evidence before they even look like being charged. A very proactive approach and clearly a good one if you are in their situation and have so much money available from the so called Find Maddie Fund, in reality the Defence Fighting Fund.

This has even extended to Clarence Mitchell stating they wanted to set their legal defence out to the Prime Minister. But in UK law and I am sure it is just the same elsewhere this is not the PM's job. We have judges who listen to evidence, in a serious criminal case, which the accused wishes to defend by a trial, aided by a jury. The judge rules on the law, the jury decide the facts from the evidence which them enables them to determine guilt or innocence of course assisted by the judge as to what the prosecution need to prove to establish guilt in relation to the specific offences(s) charged.

LP and other British agencies opposed the McCanns application on the fairly simple premise police investigations are confidential and those under investigation are simply not entitled to demand the police file. We saw the humiliating defeat of the McCanns having to back down and accept they are under investigation and simply cannot have British Agency Files. Mrs Justice Hogg reversed her earlier order to make it very plain the McCanns were not entitled to any information from any British Agency files.

So to finally get to answering your question more specifically, Mrs Justice Hogg would have been privy to confidential details, as at April to July 2008 of the police investigation into the McCanns. She could obviously require British agencies to continue their investigations into the disappearance of Madeleine, find her or her body and bring those responsible to justice.

So there is no need for her to order that the process gets re-opened, it could only be re-opened in Portugal if there was compelling new evidence that Maddie was subject of a genuine stranger abduction. But that is clearly never going to happen and the British investigation has never been closed. It clearly could not be in relation to a British Ward of Court who may have been murdered or kidnapped.

There is nothing more that people can do, as and when British Police have a case, they will be charged.

viv said...

Have people seen this extraordinary fake website, set up by Tony Bennett's mate, Stevo (US/ "Truth for Madeleine"!!!) seeking to blackmail him into issuing an apology to Debbie Butler.

I really think they have gone too far this time and even forced Mr Gunnill to take down his own legitimate website, damaging his livelihood as a freelance photographer.

Although this stuff has been posted on the Madeleine Foundation website, Tony Bennett is, predictably denying all liability and, you guessed it, making just a few more threats! If ever there was a human with an inbuilt magnet for trouble...

http://mikegunnill.info/

viv said...

Found it Di!

I knew it was not so long back when the Daily Mail last gave Team McCann a bit of a savaging:

Daily Mail

13 March 2009

Jan Moir

Gerry's complaints leave a bitter taste

How strange it was to see pale, pugnacious Gerry McCann back in the news this week. It serves as a reminder that while the world has moved on for the rest of us, time stands still for him.

For the McCann family, the clocks stopped nearly two years ago, on that terrible night in the Algarve when their three-year-old daughter slipped from public view and has not been seen since.

In their quest to find Madeleine, the desperate McCanns invited the world's Press into their lives. It was a relationship that was doomed to sour.

Grievance: Gerry McCann has complained about the Press

For months, the McCanns' efforts to keep their daughter's plight high on the news agenda were intense. Far from shrinking from the oxygen of publicity, what they feared most was the muffle of public apathy. In the process, they became experts at manipulating the media to their own advantage.

At one point, Mr McCann even returned to the family home in Leicestershire to tie his own yellow ribbon to the teddystocked Madeleine shrine that had been hastily erected in the centre of the village.

Then and now, watching Gerry McCann walking the red carpet of his grief, as knowing as a Cannes film star, can be an uncomfortable experience.

This week, Mr McCann took the opportunity to air his grievances about the Press and its treatment of his family in front of the House of Commons Culture Select Committee.

For what possible purpose? Certainly, some bad judgment decisions were made by the more excitable newspapers, who have been punished with hefty libel payments and widespread approbation for their troubles. Surely that is an end to the matter?

No. Mr McCann is not finished complaining. Yet the more and more he complains about what happened in the aftermath of his daughter's disappearance, the more I feel he is attempting to assuage his own guilt for failing to be there when she needed him most.

Still, it's not his fault that these useless Select Committees, stuffed with the third rate and the Parliamentary walking wounded, give an indulgent platform for anyone with a grievance.

viv said...

"I have no idea what it felt like", it is precisely that lack of normal human empathy that makes Rosie such an avid McCann supporter. I am sure I can be forgiven for thinking maybe even a close relative to Gerry McCann! Then we get the bold IF it was Madeleine, sex offenders, all serious offenders, minimise, justify, deny, obfuscate and confuse. Anything rather than admit the horror of what they did. Then of course, they hone in on anything they can seek to pick an argument about, most unfortunate behaviour. "Night after night". 1 May, Mrs Fenn says she was crying, 2 May Kate and Gerry say she was crying, 3 May she is gone altogether, now I think that perhaps does qualify as being "night after night".


Rosiepops Yesterday at 10:45 pm

.Autumn wrote:
So, putting the McCanns feelings to one side for a moment, I will ask you again. Rosiepops, how do you think that Madeleine and the twins felt being left alone, in the dark, niight after night in a foreign country? This is not about point scoring, Rosiepops, it is about finding out what happened to Madeleine - or have you forgotten?

Ah so you like to answer a question with a question?

*sigh* I have no idea what it felt like, I was not there and neither were you. Although I expect IF it was Madeleine crying, then she would have been upset and where do you get this crying night after night from? Who told you that Madeleine was crying night after night?

viv said...

Actually like any with a guilty conscience they hone in on what they perceive someone is criticising rather than what they are.


Autumn says left alone night after night, Rosie angrily responds who said anything about crying, night after night.

Yes, the truth hurst and the conscience clearly troubled. Not that it will admit that of course, but there are little signs..

I am sure leaving two and three year olds night after night is nothing to concern oneself about, not even when the 3 year old just disappears off the face of the earth it would seem!

hope4truth said...

Morning

Well thats the thing isnt it Rosiepops was not there, Autumn was not there, Hope4truth was not there and neither were Kate or Gerry McCann!

Children dont allways cry loudley sometimes when they are frightend they cry quietly. When the shaddow on the wall looks like a Monster they lay very still and whisper Mummy Daddy help me.

I can remeber doing this when I was a very young child I went through a terible phase of being convinced my Mum and Dad would die and it broke my heart night after night for ages. Then there were the shaddows on the wall that looked like monsters.

My own girls had nights where they would cry queitly and call us because something was trying to get in the window or the wardrobe had a monster in it.

But no matter how quietly I cried my Mum or Dad would always come and I would comfort the girls or thier Dad would.

Then of course there were the nights that I did not want to be in bed missing out on what my parents were doing and would need a glass of water or have a headache or my classic was I have an eyelash in my eye. But without exception every time I never once had to worry that I would cry or go downstairs and find the house was empty.

The McCann's tried to turn themselves into heros of neglect Clarance tried to tell the world we all do it but this is the first of many spin's from Clarances bag of tricks and it sticks in my throat.

If Madeleine was abducted she clearly would not have been if her parents had been doing what they should have been doing instead of having fun with their freinds.

Then looking back over 2 years if Madeleine had been abducted The McCann's have done everything they can to point the finger of blame elsewhere without ever helping the investigation.

I cant wait for the next Documentry the Reconstruction confirmed for many people who had doubts that there was no abductor. They even had to leave Kate out of it as it just did not fit in with what they were trying to sell...

They may never be prosecuted for what they have done but more and more people are of the conclusion that they are responsible for what happend to Madeleine. Two years on I actually think whatever happend to her they are far less evil than if she really had been abducted the thought of them laughing on her birthday and refusing to help the investigation leaving her with no way out sickens me to the core.

viv said...

http://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/main-maddie-thread-latest-news-f1/dirty-tricks-a-warning-to-all-our-supporters-about-a-fake-e-mail-t4328-180.htm

pages 11-13, Rosie in full rant, and just as sickening as ever, I have to say Tony Bennett did score with some points Rosie, "did not have time to answer":-))) Strange really considering she has clearly been spending very considerable time writing some very lengthy posts, only where it suits her (or is it him) of course!

viv said...

Morning Hope,

I too can recall being terrified by a clothes horse with washing on, not to mention and older sister who delighted in telling me plenty of ghost stories.

That was aged about 9, and living in a bungalow with my parents sitting in the very next room!

viv said...

and you are so right Hope, the more they do, the more they just convince people of what dreadful parents they really are, guilty parents, who cannot stop trying to excuse the inexcusable, and Kate still could not turn up for her daughter in Portugal.

They have had millions of pounds to look for Madeleine and they employed Metodo 3, Halligen and Edgar, what more can we say!

hope4truth said...

Millions of pounds and nothing from any of the detectives they have paid to search.

As a bereft parent if you thought for a second precious money was being wasted and the people demanding high payment to look for your child were wasting the money and not investigating all hell would break loose.

You do not play games when anyone is missing you get on with the task of trying to find them no matter what age they are.

When it is a child it becomes even more desprate.

When Madeleine went missing no one was allowed any other opinion other than she had been abducted. Gerry told relatives it was important to belive this?

The 9 Adults all insisted this is the only thing that could have happend but as they had to admit leaving a door ajar and unlocked the most logical solution is she got up and went looking for them. To rule this out and not bother to search for her (as it was too dark) is the first of the many odd things they have done.

No innocent parent would play such wicked games with their childs life if they thought their was a 1%chance they could find her.

Innocent parents would kick off that the investigation was shelved the detectives were rubbish and would have been dragged back to England after searching every area a child could be hidden. They would also recive counceling and given advice on what to tell the twins to limit the terror and damage from loosing their sister.

England cares more for parents who abuse and neglect their children than they do for the child.

I stopped my donations to the NSPCC a few months after Madeleine went missing as there was not a word about Neglect not being acceptable surley this should have highlighted a campaign to stop other unfit parents from neglecting their children. Not a word about how wrong it was?

At least the papers are now telling people just what the detectives are not doing and reading between the lines they are telling us as inteligent people Kate and Gerry are 100% behind them...

viv said...

hiya Hope

It is kind of hard to see where the Daily Mail are being so kind to Kate and Gerry. I can recall when the Daily Express copies their McCann story every day, having just dressed it up a bit more. The Mail articles are all still there!

"Still, it's not his fault that these useless Select Committees, stuffed with the third rate and the Parliamentary walking wounded, give an indulgent platform for anyone with a grievance.£ (Jan Moir above)

So when are these third rate MPs who Gerry did not mind sounding off to, as he "walked the red carpet of his grief" going to give us their expert opinion, I wonder?

Are they going to be smart enough to tell us papers must not go so far as to try and deny suspects the right to a fair trial, or really upset the Police with too much information?

viv said...

Gerry is much heartened by this, and Garrido wanted to distribute some leaflets.//

Jaycee Lee Dugard and Phillip Garrido's daughters 'like brainwashed zombies'
The campus police officer whose unease triggered the arrest of Philip Garrido for the kidnap of Jaycee Lee Dugard has described how his daughters looked like "brainwashed zombies."

By Paul Thompson and agencies in Antioch, Califiornia
Published: 1:29PM BST 29 Aug 2009

Police missed an opportunity to rescue Jaycee Lee when they visited her captor's house in 2006 Photo: REUTERS
Officer Ally Jacobs sat in on a meeting with Mr Garrido and his daughters after he requested permission to distribute leaflets on the Berkeley campus of the University of California.

But her suspicions were aroused by the strange behaviour of the two girls - and led to the eventual release of their mother, Jaycee Lee Dugard, after nearly two decades of captivity.


Related Articles
Secret world where Jaycee Lee Dugard was captive
Jaycee Lee Dugard kidnap in depth
Jaycee Lee Dugard: Phillip Garrido 'linked to murders'
Jaycee Lee Dugard: Police missed rescue opportunity
Jaycee: where were the snoopy old ladies?
Jaycee may have succumbed to 'Stockholm Syndrome' She said Mr Garrido arrived with the girls, aged 11 and 15, who stared at their father "like God" during the meeting. "They had this weird look in their eyes, like brainwashed zombies," she said.

She spoke out as police said that Mr Garrido's home has been searched for evidence of a link to the unsolved murders of several prostitutes in the early 1990s, and as Garrido, 58, and his wife, Nancy, 54, denied charges of kidnapping, rape and false imprisonment in connection with Miss Dugard's disappearance at their first court appearance.

It has also emerged that police missed an opportunity to rescue Jaycee Lee when they visited her captor’s house in 2006.

Officer Jacobs told ABC television that she spoke with both the girls, asking them what grade they were in at school. The girls replied that they were home schooled.

The girls wore drab-coloured dresses, were unusually subdued, had unnaturally pale complexions and appeared robotic and rehearsed when they spoke.

When Officer Jacobs asked the younger girl about a bruise near her eye, the 11-year-old said it was an inoperable birth defect.

Officer Jacobs said she asked the girls what they were doing with their father, but Mr Garrido interrupted and said: "I'm socialising them, showing them how it's done."

When Officer Jacobs queried the statement, asking "How what is done?" he replied, "By interacting with people."

The police officer told ABC television that there was not enough evidence to call in social workers, so instead she called Mr Garrido's parole officer - only to be told by him that the convicted rapist did not have any daughters.

Mr Garrido was arrested after a meeting with his parole officer, which Jaycee Dugard also attended - to reveal that she was the girl who had been missing, presumed dead, for 18 years since being kidnapped outside her home, aged 11.

The events that triggered the unravelling of the mystery began on Monday when Officer Jacobs decided to attend a meeting with Mr Garrido after a member of the college staff mentioned his erratic behaviour.

Mr Garrido had been seeking permission to hold a meeting on the campus but Lisa Campbell, who spoke with him. thought his behaviour was erratic. She said he told her he wanted to "discuss the Lord's work".

Ms Campbell expressed her concerns to Officer Jacobs, who ran a criminal check which revealed Garrido was on parole for rape. For that reason the police officer decided to sit in on the meeting with Mr Garrido when he returned the following day.

A day later, after the meeting with his parole officer, he was arrested - and Jaycee Lee Dugard and the children her abductor had fathered were finally freed.

viv said...

"I'm socialising them, showing them how it's done."

I really dread to think what that involved, exactly..

viv said...

Interesting interview, no doubt following a successful "bid" as Gerry would put it, just a few days before they were made arguidos. They were contacted well in advance by the PJ about this, by Ricardo Paiva, so when giving this interview, they knew what they were about to face. "Break in" a false concept Kate does not seem to have felt able to let go of..And of course Gerry just wants us all to focus on what he and Kate have suffered since Maddie just went, never mind Maddie. To say he is arrogant would be something of an understatement. I wonder when it occurred to him, the only reason we are interested in him and Kate is not because we like them and want every detail of their "suffering", it is because they are the parents of a little girl who they clearly caused immeasurable suffering and the most terrible harm. Why does he tell us how much he did with his "friends", only at night, it would seem, he did not want them in the day and they did not want him either!

Paris Match – Did you notice anything strange during your stay in the hotel?

Gerry McCann – Absolutely not, we had a very relaxing week. We were in a group of friends, we did plenty of things together, and at such times we don't pay attention to what is happening around us. We didn't see anything suspicious that week.

PM – Do you feel any guilt for having left your children alone on the evening of 3rd May?

Kate McCann – Of course we feel ourselves to blame for being at the restaurant when she disappeared. That will always be there, but the person who broke in and who took Madeleine is the most blameworthy, I think.

GM – We have no doubt, she was targeted.

KM – If we'd had to ask ourselves 'Are they safe?', we would never have left them. We never thought there was a risk. We thought we were being trustworthy and responsible. I did not think of the possibility of anybody breaking in. You never expect someone to come into where you are staying and take your child from her bed. The only reason for our comings and goings, it was in case they woke up.

in Paris Match, 04 September 2007 [no online link]

* Gerry's blog, 04 September 2007, Day 124

Kate and I did our first interview for a French Publication today. Any interviews we do now, of which we only accept a small percentage of bids, focus on the issues that we have faced since Madeleine's abduction.(...)



By Joana Morais

Keesha said...

have read the above comments with interest, especially about Justice Hogg and the open British investigation.

The case of Jaycee continues to unravel, I think the neighbour's property is also being searched.

In the absence of Gerry's pale, pugnacious mug in the news, there is an article from Mark Hollingsworth, Evening Standard (paper only) Fri 28 Aug 09

see: Mccannfiles and Joana's blog / comments

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id232.html

http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2009/08/mark-hollingsworth-investigatesthe.html

Wizard said...

Hi All,

I’ve just been reading the Evening Standard's article by Mark Hollingsworth on JM’s blog.

A précis of the article is that Hollingsworth’s investigation into all the detectives employed by the McCanns clearly indicates they were not up to scratch for such a difficult investigation. They all appeared very good at raking in high fees and expenses though!

Never having employed a private detective myself I just wonder how difficult it is to find one that will do a reasonable job at a reasonable price.

How unusual is it to employ not one outfit but 3 or 4 all of who failed to do the job properly. By that I do not necessarily mean find Madeleine but at least do a systematic investigation and not just pretendy one.

This poses the question was their selection intentional or is this just quadruple bad luck?

Of course some of these private investigators may not be as hapless as they seemed.

For example - were they being continually steered in the wrong direction?

Could they have had a strong feeling during their investigations on what really happened but could not pursue this line of enquiry because it fell outside their remit?

Did they not bother to investigate properly because they knew it was unlikely to lead anywhere and fail to get to the truth?

I find it extraordinary that none of the McCann investigators got anywhere and all, with the exception of the last hapless lot, had to have their contracts terminated.

viv said...

This has all proved to be the absolute truth! It must be very worrying for Team McCann that the Pt people in the area were so well informed, no wonder they asked them to "phone Isabel", but I suspect Isabel was lonely waiting for the phone to ring, just how stupid do these McCanns think people are!

Russell, Russell, what a finger pointing liar, now why?

http://retiredrambler.typepad.com/tonys_ramblings/2007/05/so_whats_claren.html

viv said...

Hi I'm from Portugal an I would like to add some stuff even though this seems a rather old post: "So what's Clarence Mitchell doing here?" - We in Portugal are outraged by the lies and manipulation the majority of the press and specially sky news, disgustingly biased, do about the case, the police, the country... man anything they could throw mud... First, and this is a FACT, the first thing kate did when she "realised" she lost her daughtert was to call sky news and underline abduction... only much later the police were called. Pamela Fenn, an english lady living above the mcscam's offered help and to call hte police herself. kate refused. In the GNR phone records they were phoned 40 minutes after this suggestion by mrs Fenn. kate and the so called tapas 9 people displayed unusual behaviour after the so called abduction.

viv said...

kate goes to the apartment and according to what she says she understood the daughter was missing, left the apartment, didn't check the other kids, closed the door, (funny stuff because they insinuated that the alleged abductor was probably inside according to their instinct) and WALKED, not RUNNED, to the restaurant. Over there informed the others. What do they do? They leave the tables and the insane number of bottles of wine, (perhaps they were trying to forget something) and EACH FAMILY GROUP goes to their own apartemnt. Testemonies from the resort staff, fenn and neighbors confirm that kate wasn't emotionally affected, she was in control, very calm... I would like to say here that in my view, completly different from your press and media that sell an image of a emotionally affected mother I see another type of person. The only word I can find to describe kate is "lifeless". I'm sorry but she is very weird. Very quickly they had the help of the english ambassador phoning to every police chief, the pressure was huge from the beginning to search an abductor. A-B-D-U-C-T-O-R!!! The media, the ambassador, your foreign minister, the family, the famous tapas 9, everybody pressured for the search of an abductor. Plus, in what regards to murat, this guy was so framed, one of the members of the tapas 9, janet, says she saw a man carrying a child covered with a blanket while she left the restaurant table. The problem is that an englishman, apparently works as a producer in London, was at precisely at that time on that street and didn't see a thing. And it's a narrow street. She claims he was headed to what we know now as murats house. russel o'brien, another member of the tapas 9, apparently husband of janet claims he saw murat sniffing around in the firts searches of madeline. And he is very convinced of that. The problem is that he was the only one claiming this. From the people envolved in the searches, resort staff, family, neighbors, police, GNR, etc - russel is the only one to see murats presence. These tapas 9 people are very odd characters. they avoid giving any sort of interviews and are apparently scared of media attention. They go to great lenght to avoid being seen or to be connected to the case. In England they have moved recently from house to house frequently. Man It maybe just me but if a friend of mine is searching for his daughter, man I am envolved, give interviews, say what I have to say, actively helping the cause etc. most recently, and I love this, cos I honestly didn't remember it, but obviously cops have, the cops asked kate why didn't the twins wake up during the noisy search inside the apartment? The cops were already inside and they were very noisy. And why, and this is the important question, didn't kate woke them up and asked them if they heard anything saw anything. Kate refuses to answer this question among others, delicate to answer like this one. In fact her status as arguida allows her not to answer if that's her wish... but isn't this weird that justine mcguiness and gerry and kate came out saying that they are cooperating with the police and then refuse to answer the questions. They don't confirm or deny, they simply refuse to answer as it is allowed them.

Posted by: El-Rey Lusitano | 09 September 2007 at 07:46 PM

Di said...

Hi Wizard

I read the article earlier and did not quite know what to make of it.

Other than the blame, on the one hand, seems to be put at Brian Kennedy's door, but as Joana points out, it also could be a way of showing where the fund money has supposedly been spent.

I think WHERE the money has gone is what most people would really like to know, it certainly has not been spent on searching.

Di said...

I have just remembered that TM said the fund would be empty by the end of the year.

Hmmmm maybe this is there way of justifying that statement, this is where all the money has gone!

The problem is TM, the public are not stupid, you will have to do better than that.

hope4truth said...

Hello All

Di You are right the Public are not stupid and the fund is a huge joke with money wasted from the second they appointed Uncle Jon as a Director.

Can you imagine a fund being set up for anything and running to help as a Director but first negoitaing a large fee to do so?

When it is your own Nice that is missing money should not come into it maybe somewhere down the line expenses should be disccused if you dont have much money of your own but Uncle Jon had a high paying job which he did not need to give up I would imagine he got sick pay and holiday pay and as Team McCann controlled the press his firm would have looked heartless not to give him time off.

Throw in the Lawyers (as Madeleine did not need a single lawyer) the expensive website detectives who were rubbish and now having the heartbroken parents on the board any other fund would have been shut down and investigated...

It makes me sick a few million pounds (if Madeleine was missing) could have been spent to actually find her and if as I suspect she is not missing could have helped 100s of children who really needed help and parents who's children that are not as Important as Madeleine but are still none the less missing would have cut off their right arm for some publicity via the fund to see if their precious child was "Findable"....

This pair and thier 7 friends must be the most heartless people in the country not calling the police for 40 minutes I guess would makes sense if they thought she had wandered off and any second she would be found.

But as they knew she had been abducted (how I dont know) it was more important to call SKY and not actually bother to look for her...

It is about time the facts of those first few hours were printed for the world to see after all if Madeleine was killed in an accident or a more evil way there are some very dangerous people out there or are their children not important either?

Wizard said...

It has always appeared to me the private investigators were just window dressing.

If the McCanns are culpable for their daughter’s disappearance the fund money has to be spent otherwise it would look suspicious.

What better way to spend large chunks of money than by misdirecting those they pay to search for their daughter.
Hmmm...

Di said...

Hi Hope & Wizard

I do hope there are people investigating where the fund money is REALLY going.

I am sure if it was you or I opening a fund like this, we would be watched to the hilt.

Hope, I agree, when Uncle J gave up a well paid job I knew something was not right. He had absolutely no idea,when or if Madeleine would be found,or did he!!

Wizard

It would be interesting to know if the McCann's mortgage has been paid off for a start.

hope4truth said...

Hi Di and Wiz

I agree the Detectives had to be hired on high retainers to make the fund look like it was doing something...

As for Uncle John the very next week Madeleine could have been found alive and well quiting his job was just strange...

Gerry saying they were planning a year anniversary was another ??? Moment then there have been so many...

xxx

viv said...

Fantastic scoop from the McCann files and Joanna Morais and thanks guys for bringing it here.

Copying your comments to new thread, this is exactly what Team McCann deserve, now hang your head in shame Eddie and oh, where is Mr Halligen:-)))

Gerry says I want my flipping money back you scoundrel:-)))

Now come on Stuart, you could finish up in an even topper job!!

Wizard said...

The Evening Standard article is a follow on from the Standards sister paper the Mail's recent piece.

The critical article in the Mail and now the Standard seems to be a way around direct criticism of the McCanns. As we know the Mcs will sue anyone who hints at them being in any way culpable for their daughter’s disappearance.

Could this be a way forward for the media to approach the story without the risk of legal action? I think it is and we are likely to see more along the same lines.

There is as sure as hell a lot of criticism to be level at Team McCann and using the backdoor, so to speak, to chip at the evidence surrounding those linked to them is a good start.

Wizard said...

A more predictable response to the Mccann story is an adage to the Jaycee Dugard 4 page spread in yesterday’s Mail. Dorothy Rowe, author and clinical psychologist analyses the situation.

At the end of her article she talks about the reappearance of Jaycee and links it to the Mccann story. She says:

“Her reappearance (Jaycee) will offer hope for Kate and Gerry Mccann. If she can return after so many years then, they must pray, there is every reason to hope that Madeleine is still alive.

But Jaycee’s return will also be a perhaps difficult reminder that, should Madeleine come back, she won’t be the little girl who disappeared, any more than they are the same couple who went on holiday with her.”

Although there is nothing wrong with Ms Rowe’s psychological analysis of the situation I just wonder whether she is aware of her own condition.

It appears that Ms Rowe is perpetuating the “Emperor’s New Clothes Effect”.

Madeleine was abducted, therefore, there is always a chance she could be still alive.

Although the British press have told us often enough about an abduction for fear of being sued if they flip the coin and look at other possibilities. Does Ms Rowe also believe this and perpetuates a possible lie. By definition Ms Rowe, a trained clinical psychologist, has taken on the Emperor’s New Clothes Effect, without apparently realising it.

Strange for someone purporting to be a clinical psychologist to fall pray to ENC’s and be blissfully unaware of it. Perhaps another case of not seeing the wood for the trees.

hope4truth said...

Wiz

What really disturbs me with the press and the Jaycee story is there is absoloutly no reason to mention the McCann's when reporting about it.

There are many parents in The United Kingdom who have a missing child and each of them must have read the story and thought Is there still a chance for my child? And I would imagine their normal reaction will be very mixed the Joy of finding thier child and the terror that their Son or Daughter could be being abused on a daily basis living in squalar and frightend for their lives.

I guess one of the most horifying thoughts is you child is growing up in the pits of hell being abused tortured and god knows what else and they may never be rescued and will die alone one day still deep down inside waiting for their parents to come and rescue them.

If there is hope there is also terror and 18 years later having your daughter come back to you is a big reason to celebrate but the pain and heartache for all of them will continue for many years to come.

Maybe what the papers should be reporting is how the Mother and Stepfather of Jaycee reacted to her abduction 18 years ago. The Stepfather was a suspect in his words until the day she was found and he and Jaycee's Mother divorced over the presure. I would like to know how unhelpful they were when she was taken how many questions were refused and how happy her Mother was on each painful anniversary she went through each of the 18 years Jaycee was missing.

Then lets take a look at the McCann's and how devestated they were on Madelines 4th Birthday because it is very easy to look sad put your hand in front of your face and shake as if you are crying. To produce tears is harder and keeping it up is very difficult indeed. Which is why on Madelines 4th Birthday I firmly belive they thought they had pulled it off good hearted people were there to cheer them on and they got caught up in it all they were the new celebs in town and their masks slipped and they showed the pure joy of it all working out for them.

I firmley believe the tide is turning the press are going about it by discrediting the detectives and soon I belive they will start to take the accounts apart (no doubt saying it the fault of everyone bar Kate and Gerry) and then there is Clarance he will come in for a huge battering after all he has told them what to say and was earning a lot of money out of a missing child...

xxx

hope4truth said...

My earlier post has vanished any one any idea where it went???

hope4truth said...

Test