3 Feb 2010


Let's not forget yet another McCann firm of detectives Hogan International and how the McCanns wanted to FOCUS ON THEIR DEFENCE  I would suggest by deflecting everyone from what they really did, had Maddie kidnapped to cash in.  Even within the last few days we have their idiot Mr Krugel back on the scene, looking for Maddie's body.  Then we had another who we know is in their pay, the barmy Mr Correia, attorney for Leonor Cipriano who says Goncalo's men beat her up and he turned a blind eye, do you believe that? The MuckCanns want you to!   My comments are in green. 

Oh the complex web we weave, when first we set out to deceive!...

Viv x

14 January 2008 | Posted by Joana Morais Leave a Comment
The court will decide today to extend the secrecy
The court of Portimão shall pronounce today on the request for the extension of the secrecy of Justice on the case concerning Madeleine McCann, the English girl that vanished last May 3, from the resort of Praia da Luz, in the Algarve, where she was spending her holidays with her parents.

The first suspect of the case, the Luso-British Robert Murat, has taken this legal status last year, in May 14, so it is today that the eight months deadline foreseen by the Law is ending. The Public Prosecution did advance the exceptional complexity of the process to justify the request for the extension of the deadline.

In addition to Robert Murat, the father and the mother of the child who are now in England, Gerry and Kate McCann were also made formal suspects.

New company questioned

Few days after having announced the replacement of the Spanish detectives, Metodo 3, by Hogan International, a British company, the McCanns are already criticized for their choice. It's the British company itself that reported to the British press that they have no experience in this type of investigation, being themselves almost exclusively devoted in the locating of missing heirs.  So they would be pretty good at "locating" witnesses for the McCanns.  They would also be very good at making inquiries into the assets of those people the McCanns would like to sue and make a load of cash out of.  The McCanns whole raison de etre!  But Mr Hogan is an ex officer with the Met and after suing a newspaper, quickly disappeared from Team McCann.  Do you think he might be a police witness against them?  I would not be the least surprised to hear that!

The McCanns bring in cold-case detectives to investigate

The McCanns have hired a detective who investigated a 7/7 suicide bomber. Noel Hogan is conducting a "cold case" review.
The former Met detective superintendent, who runs the agency Hogan International, in Farnham said: "I have been reinterviewing witnesses that were out in Portugal at the time."
It is understood these include friends of the McCanns.
Hogan International was investigating Jermaine Lindsay in the run-up to the 7 July attacks in London in 2005 after a bank became alarmed by his spending patterns

New detectives hired by the McCanns are criticized

A former Scotland Yard detective hired to search for Madeleine McCann is conducting a private murder investigation to discredit police evidence against her parents.  Now who could have guessed the McCanns were into smearing and discrediting the Police "evidence AGAINST them".  The Police have evidence that they were immediately telling lies about the shutter/window being jemmied open.  The Portuguese Prosecutor has just told us they were telling lies about checking their children every 30 minutes, THEY DID NOT.  Gerry McCann gave  a statement to the police the following day 4 May 2007 saying he and Kate entered the apartment to check on their children via the front door with their key.  But on 10 May gave another statement and said he was wrong about that, actually, they both entered by the rear patio door that THEY LEFT OPEN.  Careful Kate immediately contradicted Gerry the following day, she said she entered to check the children via the open patio door.  But in all other respects their statements read like the utterings of a couple of parrots, word for word entirely similar.  Including how Madeleine apparently complained to both of them with the same words at breakfast that morning, "why did you not come last night when me and the twins were crying".   Then we have the Smith family who believe it was Gerry McCann they saw carrying Madeleine off towards the beach around 10 pm that night.  Kate raises the erm "alarm" at around 10 pm, maybe Gerry was rather breathless at that point.  Now this is just a brief summary of some of the serious evidence against Kate and Gerry McCann that they were quite obviously involved in the disappearance of their daughter and were immediately telling the police contradictory and unhelpful lies.  So, how did they think Mr Hogan was going to DISCREDIT THIS EVIDENCE AGAINST THEM.  Their problem is they have always lived in a fantasy world of believing they can tell us all they are model parents, and we will all just say, Oh OK then, now how much would you like for your Defence Fighting Fund to fight all these odious policemen in Portugal and UK who are just trying to fit you up, quite obviously!
But last night fears were raised that Noel Hogan might not be up to the job.
Mr Hogan, who runs a private detective agency, has re-interviewed British witnesses including the McCanns holiday friends.

He is also understood to have gone through the McCanns’ own statements in minute detail with the couple.  That must have been a difficult taks for him.  Did he have both of Gerry's conflicting statements or a new one, written by?? When the McCanns attended their Brussels "seminar" (to lecture MEPs about how Amber Alert would obviously have "saved" Madeleine, apparently) their "statements" got mysteriously leaked at the same time.  The gloves are off with the Portuguese Police roars Clarence.  But this was at a time when Rebelo was in charge of the investigation and there as absolutely nothing being released to the press from the inquiry.  The statements were leaked from Spain and it later appeared to transpire that these were not actually the  police statements (how could they be, the PJ had those).  They were further statements that Kate and Gerry had given to Metodo 3.  So, I would suggest Mr Hogan was even being duped when he was going through these apparent statements with the McCanns.  He was not being allowed to see the duplicity and lies contained within the original statements taken by the Portuguese Police where Gerry even starts to argue with himself. 
In a startling twist, Kate and Gerry’s lawyers have ordered that their own inquiry into Madeleine's disappearance, while on holiday in Portugal last May, should focus on the theory that the three-year-old was killed and her body hidden.
Hogan International, which specialises in asset investigations,(the McCanns like detectives who can pry into other peoples' assets to see if they are worth suing. Bit like Metodo 3, we were all nonplussed, why "Fraud investigators" to look for a missing child, because actually they are good at smelling out money and getting some offensivev dirt on those they wish to discredit for their paymaster, like erm, Robert Murat and Goncalo Amaral, perhaps? Even me! )  is taking over the case after the McCanns benefactors voiced dismay at the lack of tangible progress made by the Spanish agency Metodo 3.  If you were only instructed to place listening devices to Robert Murat's  car, stalk Goncalo Amaral and gather some dirt on him, make criminal allegations against hm and try and get witnesses to back it up (like Leonor Cipriano for example, convicted child murderer )find some disreputable people who were prepared to say what the McCanns wanted to hear, you probably would not be making much progress in finding Madeleine!
Sources close to the inquiry say the two firms have a history of rivalry after previously clashing over conflicting investigations.  Maybe one attempting to be reputable (Hogan) and one who always saw things from Gerry McCanns point of view from day one, Mr Marco of Metodo 3.  I have never looked for a missing child and know nothing about paedophiles so I did some research on them on the internet!  It is almost like he was taking the McCanns ill gotten gains with one hand and having a good laugh at them /giving them a good slap with the other.  Did they actually instruct him to say he would bring Maddie home for Christmas or was he having another pop at his paymasters?  Maybe he was trying to blackmail them and say I do not want £50,000 per month for this, try trebling it.  Is that why we were being told at the time that Mr Kennedy and the Fund were paying him??

In an exclusive interview with the Sunday Express, Mr Hogan revealed that his previous experience of missing people cases was limited to tracing beneficiaries of wills. He also admitted that despite the high profile of the Madeleine investigation, his 12-strong team of former detectives and ex-SAS men were already handling around 5,000 cases.

Speaking from his office in a rundown tower block in Aldershot, Hants, Mr Hogan refused to say how much he was being paid. He said: ‘I don’t want to become part of the circus surrounding Madeleine. I am not allowed to go into operational detail and I just do what I am told.  Of course, Clarence Mitchell has always been very particular to point out that he will not discuss "operational detail" of what "our" investigators are doing.  Well that "our" would seem to mean, Clarence Mitchell, that you take ownership of fraudulent activities, that tell the public Maddie is being looked for with their money, but in reality, that is just a lie.  Bent witnesses and people to sue are being looked for, to discredit the police and make the McCanns/you too rich! 

‘We deal with all matters of investigation, but it is true that normally the missing people we deal with are those who have inherited something and then disappeared. We have never dealt with a missing child.

‘I am not going to boast about success rates like Metodo 3, because that did nobody a favour. We have one office and there are 12 people who work here. If I need to I can bring other people in.

‘When the police have a big case they do not stop investigating all the others they are working on.

‘I have a lot of people who I know who are ex-policemen and know how to handle a criminal investigation.

‘The Portuguese police have put a complete closedown on any facts. Well then who did keep briefing the press, or need we ask!  Normally in this country you would have a liaison officer with the family.’

Another former Scotland Yard officer, who has given unofficial advice to the McCanns, from Rothley, Leicestershire, last night voiced his concern at the appointment. He said: I cannot understand why they have chosen to go with Mr Hogan because he simply does not have the resources or the back-up to conduct a major investigation.

The advice I have given to the McCanns was to urge them to request a meeting with Scotland Yard and to ask them to take over the British side of the investigation. The Yard has a very sophisticated and well-resourced kidnap squad, which deals with more than 300 abductions a year, far more than any other force in Britain. Forces from around the world turn to them for advice.

My view is that the McCanns should not waste money with private investigators but should get the best police in Britain on the job.
Why have the McCanns never taken his advice and asked British Police to look for Madeleine, accepted the likes of Mr Hogan and all the others are just a waste of time?  Well we know the answer to that!
I think the role of Leicestershire Police is confused. At first they sent officers to Portugal to offer liaison assistance to the McCanns but now it appears they are investigating them on behalf of the Portuguese. It has become a mess.  What he is saying here is that liaison officers are given to families who are the victims of serious crime.  So Leicester Police went out there and they provided them.  Kate lost her temper with them after they asked her "Where is Maddie".  Of course that is not acting in the role of supporting her as a victim, that is acting against her as a suspect.  That is what this officer means by it has become "a mess".  It is difficult to a force to suddenly have to change tack in this way, hence SOCA being brought in to assist in what is obviously a very complex investigation including very major fraud.  CEOP too, the division specialising in sexual abuse of children.  None of this looks the least bit promising for what Gerry McCann repeatedly tells us "there is absolutely no evidence that Madeleine has come to any harm".  Coming from a man who a witness heard within an hour of her disappearance telling his relatives on his mobile, Maddie had been "abducted by a gang of Portuguese Paedophiles" and given that he has not seen his daughter (we assume) for three years, come May, that is a very perverse observation to make to say the least!

Last night Mr Hogan retorted: I was in Surrey Police for four years and the Met after that. I finished top of my CID course but decided to leave to start my own business.

I am not a disgraced former policeman. I deal in professional investigations and I have been doing this a long time.
Control Risks Group, which is advising the investigation on behalf of the McCanns billionaire backer Brian Kennedy, are also reported have taken on a larger role.
But no significant new lines of inquiry are being examined and, despite an overwhelming response to their Christmas appeal, the McCanns have been advised to focus on their own defence.
A source close to the family said: The investigation is working towards a resolution and we have to consider that Madeleine may have been murdered.  So maybe feeding the notion that Madeleine is dead, cashing in on that by suing people when you know that could never be proved  is a good means of defending yourself from an even more sinister crime, having your daughter abducted so that you can kill to birds with one stone, get rid of a child you no longer want and make a fortune in the process.  IMO this is the smokescreen, this is what the McCanns have been doing all this for. Including paying for a really sick "poster campaign" to feed some pretty sick killings scenarios to the public, all designed to throw them off the scent.  Believe in a stranger abduction, believe that abduction did not happen, but it did IMO and they arranged it.  
I would ask people to just ponder a few things, Tony Bennett stalking and harassing the McCanns and repeatedly insisting THERE WAS NO ABDUCTION THEY KILLED MADELEINE, then have a look at the reputation of Tony Bennett.  Buy my leaflets and READ THE TRUTH.  But when you read his leaflets it was a pack of ill judged lies!  Assertions with absolutely no evidence to back them up.  So who was getting a cut out of "sales" - Team McCann.  Just ponder one more thing, who is the most credible and reasonable witness you could listen to, who would not lie before a Portuguese Judge, Mr Menezes, the Prosecutor. HE SAID THERE IS A 50 50 CHANCE MADELEINE MAY  STILL BE ALIVE AND HE SAID THE MCCANNS COULD HAVE BEEN CHARGED WITH KINDAPPING / TRAFFICKING HER.  That, I would suggest is the truth and why there is an ongoing investigation in the UK as we try to find her, if she is still alive. 

We have been working to the theory she may have been killed and all the possible scenarios are being considered.
Of course we hope very much that she is alive but nothing can be ruled out.

Eight months after Madeleine vanished, Portuguese detectives have made it clear they think Kate and Gerry staged an abduction in an attempt to provide a smokescreen for a more sinister crime.


viv said...

Sadly of course, it is perfectly possible that even though Maddie was very likely still alive, but drugged when Gerry was seen carrying her towards the beach, the chances of her still being alive are very remote.

Is this a man who could have her killed to save himself and then get her bones found now, when there will be "absolutely no evidence" of any form of abuse?

I believe that he is.

But still, we must respect that there is just a chance this was nothing more than carrying her off to be "treated like a princess" whilst he became a multi millionaire.

There are no good prospects for little Maddie given the parents that she has, but we just have to hope that if she is still alive, if she is suffering something terrible, she will be rescued and that come what may, when the Police have finally assembled all their evidence in what has always been admitted to be a very complex case, they will make sure there is no weak evidence against the McCanns and their entourage. It is hard evidence that will LOCK THEM UP.

viv said...

The McCanns bring in cold-case detectives to investigate Madeleine's disappearance


Last updated at 00:48 03 January 2008

* Comments (21)
* Add to My Stories

Kate and Gerry McCann have hired a former Met Police officer to carry out a "cold case" review into Madeleine's disappearance.

Noel Hogan, a former CID detective, has spent hundreds of hours interviewing British witnesses in the case.

He has also gone through each witness's existing statements line by line. Among those he has interviewed include the socalled "Tapas seven" who were on holiday with the McCanns in Praia da Luz last May.

Scroll down for more ...

Gerry and Kate McCann

Kate and Gerry McCann have brought in a British cold-case detective to help find their daughter Madeleine

* Madeleine suspect Robert Murat tells police: 'Charge me or clear me'

He is also thought to have taken Kate and Gerry McCann through their own statements in minute detail.

Mr Hogan spent eight years in the Met where he reached the rank of detective superintendent.

Since 1986 he has run his own detective agency in Surrey, Hogan International, which claims to have extensive experience dealing with missing-person cases.

Mr Hogan had been investigating one of the 7/7 suicide bombers before the terror attacks in 2005 after the man's bank became suspicious of his spending patterns.

When contacted by the Daily Mail, Mr Hogan confirmed that he had spoken to many of the holidaymakers now back in Britain.

Scroll down for more ...

Madeleine McCann

Madeleine McCann has been missing since May, last year

He said: "I have been reinterviewing a number of the witnesses that were out in Portugal at the time."

He added that his investigation would tie in with the enquiry being conducted by the Spanish detective agency Metodo 3 in Barcelona.

Since four-year- old Madeleine's disappearance, well-wishers have contributed over £1million to the fund to help find her.

The McCanns have spent much of this money on Metodo 3, which is being paid £50,000 a month to lead the search for their daughter.

viv said...

However, the couple are understood to have become increasingly disillusioned with the firm, after its head detective Francisco Marco made a series of wild public statements.

Scroll down for more ...
police search for Madeleine McCann

Police make the initial search of the McCann's holiday apartment

Mr Marco claimed to know for a fact that the missing toddler was being kept in North Africa and would be home by Christmas.

But yesterday a source close to the family said that Kate and Gerry were keeping faith with Metodo 3 in spite of their concerns.

But the source confirmed that they have also authorised the employment of Mr Hogan to coordinate the UK end of the investigation.

The McCanns' official spokesman, Clarence Mitchell, declined to comment.

Metodo 3 are currently trying to re-interview an Irish family who said they saw a man carrying away a child on the night Madeleine disappeared.

Martin Smith and his family-from Drogheda in Co. Louth, told police about the sighting - which is strikingly similar to one by a friend of the McCanns, Jane Tanner.

They described a barefoot child and a man wearing beige trousers walking towards the beach in Praia da Luz, about 400yards from the McCanns' holiday apartment.

However, they said that the man was definitely not official suspect Robert Murat, whom they had met before and would have recognised.

Mr Smith even flew back to Portugal to give evidence but said he had not been contacted by police since making a statement in May.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-505779/The-McCanns-bring-cold-case-detectives-investigate-Madeleines-disappearance.html#ixzz0eRv87uLs

viv said...

So, during January 2008, the McCanns had Metodo 3 in Spain/Portugal on the case for them and Hogan International in UK, contacting witnesses etc as the McCanns were being investigated as PRIME SUSPECTS.

That sounds like a very clear attempt to pervert the course of justice and how much a month was THIS COSTING, TWO FIRMS CONCURRENTLY.
from the above report...
Metodo 3 are currently trying to re-interview an Irish family who said they saw a man carrying away a child on the night Madeleine disappeared.

I think that was actually a job for the police given Mr Smith is a serious and credible witness who says he saw Gerry McCann, that night, carrying little Maddie off. On the PJ file there is also a statement from Jez Wilkins where he states he became concerned about harassment from the McCanns and their investigators, leaving no stone unturned eh!

viv said...

Surely Mr Hogan would have been a lot nearer to Mr Smith in Ireland to go and give him the treatment. And yet, it fell to the Metodos in Spain?

Sounds to me like this was something Mr Hogan was not prepared to do!

It is strange how the McCanns are so quiet about him! Like they want us to just forget to add him to the long list of ahem, investigators they have engaged, as they so engagingly put it, to Find Madeleine!

viv said...

Extract from full report in The Times, 24 September 2007, interestingly entitled How they managed to turn the Campaign around..Were The Times trying to speak the unspeakable? !


Mr McCann first contacted private investigation companies less than three weeks after his daughter was reported missing on May 3 because of concerns that the Portuguese police were not properly checking out all reported sightings. But he had publicly to deny that they were using private detectives when Portuguese police said it would be against the law.

A source close to the couple’s legal team confirmed that CRG had been working with the family since May but refused to discuss how the company was being paid.

Other sightings reported in Spain, Malta, Belgium and Switzerland have been ruled out after investigations by local police. The McCanns hope that CRG will help to verify such reports as well as provide information on the type of people who might have abducted Madeleine and support networks that might operate in each country.

People like Hewlett and an apparent gang of Belgium paedophiles who steal children to order, I suppose! Basically anywhere they can point the finger away from themselves, and, as we now know, all this work, "looking for Maddie" has cost MILLIONS AND THE MCCANNS WANT MORE MILLIONS as they continue to "concentrate on their defence..that someone else stole her and then MURDERED HER" !

And just how much has Brian Kennedy paid out as well and just why would he be doing that!

hope4truth said...

Neglect your children and get millions what kind of sick messaged is that for the world?

Neglect your children set up a fund to find her and waste all the money on defending your good name all you want but people are not stupid and will see through you....

It will probebly be the fund that see's all of this come crashing down which is tragic really you would think a 3 year old child would have more rights than money yet people will be more annoyed they were ripped off than a child has been forgotten....

Wizard said...

It seems Leicestershire Police have time on their hands so perhaps they are now in the position to put more man power into the McCann case!

Yesterday someone forgot to log off from their twitter site and allowed the following important information to be published.

Leicespolice – favourite a YouTube video – How to Big Sexy Wavy Hair Tutorial
Leicespolice – subscribed to babystarangles’ channel on YouTube
Leicespolice – Hair Volumise Hair and There!
Leicspolice – subscribed to bubzbeauty’s channel on YouTube
Leicspolice – 5 Min Beach Waves Hair

viv said...

Clearly the work of some anti police pranksters Wiz, which I am sure you would not take seriously!

Hiya Hope!

Once again thanks for all your support for the blog last night as the sick McCann bloggers cloned you and Di, how desperate they must be!

I do think it will be the fraud that provides the police with the evidence they need, and this couple and their hangers on do need to come crashing down!

Their little party to celebrate Maddie being missing for 1000 days is clearly not going to continue to fund their spending habits, and just what could Mr Hogan have told British Police. Rest assured he will have been asked, and then of course Mr Halligen is in custody!

Their hyperactive Metodo 3 agent is also in the custody of the Spanish Police. It looks like game set and match to me for the Police in many different jurisdictions!


That is the message they have sent out to the public, behave like the parents from Hell and then make yourself millions to defend yourself!

viv said...

Maybe the McCanns should consider suing the Urban Dictionary for their interpretation of doing a McCann!

Very, very defamatory indeed to these innocent parents who are just peddling mugs and tacky t shirts for Maddie (the trademark) :-)))

viv said...

ku klux clan masks and t lights, what an embarassing and dangerous spectacle from a small but devoted gaggle of McCannites, in Portugal for the 1000 days "bash".


viv said...

The pictures seem to show that it is very many children who are behind this seemingly impossible quest to find Madeleine. Given how badly she was served by adults, her own parents, it seems so sad that innocent children are brought into the myth that she is out there somewhere with some mystery stranger and can be found, safe and well.

What is wrong with our Society that we allow children to be caught up in this, as some form of entertainment spectacle, releasing burning balloons, almost like cele brating bonfire night?

The myth of Maddie has become like some sick extra curricular entertainment for some families who think this is an appropriate thing to indoctrinate into their own children. When the McCanns are arrested will they be sorry for what they have encouraged their own children to believe in? This is not Santa Claus, is it?

Will those parents regret the heartache and mistrust they will create in their own children, just like the McCanns do with their twins?

viv said...

What an eloquent view from Anna Raccoon, not Pro McCann or Pro Goncalo, just Pro Madeleine and that is the way that it should be!

I too do not believe that anyone has the right to just keep on insisting this little girl is dead if there is just the slightest chance she is not!

I too, do not believe that the McCanns are entitled to any compensation whatsoever unless and until they recover the little girl they so terribly neglected on their own admission. But even if they do recover her, a British Court has already decided, they do not have the right to custody of her.


However, although the adversarial nature of law scarcely admits the fact, there is another participant, a Silent Voice, but a no less important voice for that, clinging to the legs of both parties, who will, God willing, turn this race for righteous victory into a three-legged race.

It is the oft-forgotten, unheard, voice of Madeleine.

Those who clamour noisily behind the banner of Free Speech and demand that ‘their man’ has the right to publish his theories based on his part-participation in the still incomplete investigation into her disappearance forget that if he is wrong, if his views that she is dead, bolstered by his apparent ‘professional expertise’, gain ascendancy, they are effectively curtailing the search for a small child who may be enduring unimaginable terrors. Madeleine’s ‘right’ to the benefit of doubt as to whether she is rescuable or beyond hope trump any adult right to Freedom of Speech for me.

Those who clamour noisily behind the banner of Reputation and Human Dignity and demand that ‘their champions’ deserve the right to a ‘clean reputation’ until a court can prove conclusively that they were complicit in her demise, forget that, if they are wrong, they are effectively curtailing the search for justice for a small child who cannot speak for herself. Madeleine’s ‘right’ to the benefit of doubt as to whether she was the victim of infanticide or not, trump any adult right to Reputation and Human Dignity for me.

The only outcome of this case which would appease my belief that this clash of the adult Titans is riding roughshod over Madeleine’s rights, would be one which ruled that a former policeman cannot use that platform to promote his personal beliefs as though they were facts, and former arguidos cannot sue for compensation for damaged reputations until such time as Madeleine is found.

Dead or Alive.

Read more: http://www.annaraccoon.com/madeleine-mccann/the-silent-voice/#ixzz0eVVb8lto

hope4truth said...

just looked at the link and there are not an awful lot of people with those lanterns...

Mrs Healy is photographed with a small child looking very pleased with herself nice big smile...

While I understand she was showing a little child the pretty lanterns it just seems sick that those lanterns are supposed to represent the fact that her 3 year old grandaughter has been living in a peadophile hell hole for the past 1000 days because her parents left her alone in an unlocked apartment....

This is where the whole sympathy for Gerry and Kate amazes me they have toured the world laughed their heads off and lied about everything or just refused to answer questions that did not suit them or do a reconstruction that could help find their child...

Pros may come here and try and distrupt but this is not about blame or who is right or wrong it is about a small child who is either dead and her death covered up by her parents (who could also be responsible for her death by accident or intent).... Or she is in the depths of hell while her parents spend her fund trying to make themselves look good which frankly is pure evil...

But let the people smile laugh and have fun raising money for the defence fund of parents who do not deserve that title....

My sympathy prayers and compasion are all for Madeleiene the forgoton victim of Team McCann

Di said...


My sentiments are with you.

Just where is Madeleine in all of this sorry saga Kate & Gerry?

Oh I forgot, an after thought, a good marketing ploy!!

viv said...

Lovely comment Hope and yes, we are united our sympathy will always be for the forgotten little victim of the materialistic Team McCann, the little girl that they could not be bothered to look for, could not be bothered they left her alone to cry, could not be bothered to spend any time with on that holiday.

The little girl they just dumped and then cashed in

Madeleine Beth McCann xx

viv said...

Hello Di

There might be only three of us here, but we are on the right side and have not forgotten what this is all about!


hope4truth said...

Hi Both (If it is really you) LOL

we may be small in numbers but we cant all keep going after so long I am sure there are a good many people who simply just dont know what more they can say...

The public are seeing what we saw from very early days now and no matter what anyone says the McCann's have acted in a very strange and uncaring way....

To have to buy your reputation and to purchase it use your missing childs fund is demented and very very wrong in itself yet they keep taking it and asking for more...

Do they think the public wont find this a strange and odd thing to do?

Seeing Mrs Healy smiling made me feel very sad I know she was with a child but what about Madeleine...

On the day of my Mother in Law's funeral when the girls were 2 and 4my Mum walked into my in laws house after the funeral and my girls went running towards her shouting NANNY at the top of their voices. I will never forget the look of horror on her face as she picked them both up and carried them into the garden hugging and kissing them...

She was so upset that their other Nanny was not at home to get the same welcome and would never get the chance to see any of her grandchildren again. Mum told me later it just felt so wrong for them to be calling out Nanny at my Mother in Law's house when she was not there and was worried it would upset my Father in Law...

I think that is what disturbed me with the picture of Mrs Healy and a replacement child and I know time has passed but if the public are to belive that maddie is in a peado hell hole for over 10000 days how can anyone be pleased with themselves for what they are doing???

viv said...

Lol Hope, it really is us! I can promised you that.

As you say, we have been pointing out the truth on this blog for a very long time now and I know a lot of people have read it.

With their ill advised and money grabbing action against Goncalo Amaral and the latest set of accounts all of the public can now see, we only ever spoke the truth.

That long stream of so called investigators, half of them in prison!

If the McCann thought their 1000 days bash would in any way seek to bury the bad news for them either from Portugal or from them having to publish these accounts they were every bit as mistaken as they have ever been. They have blown in millions of pounds to try and wash their reputation clean, but when Gerry McCann hatched that plot to get rid of little Maddie and Kate went along with it, instead of just telling the truth, they ruined their reputation and the right they formerly had to be considered normal and decent parents.

I do not know where Mrs Healy got the surrogate little granddaughter from to give a laughing pose for the cameras, but it looks to me like I know where her daughter got it from!

hope4truth said...

It will be intresting to see what happends on the 10th Feb when they go back..

If they go back????

Even if they win they have lost because people who belived them and went along without quesion what they were fed now dont have the raw emotion of a missing child they can just the McCann's as people begging for money and telling everyone to follow them and ask no questions...

As I said yesterday people hate child abuse neglect and anything that harms a child.... But they hate being ripped off and it is something that may bite them on the bum in the future...

viv said...

Hiya Hope

Well they have backed themself into a corner now in relation to 10 Feb and I like the way you say if they go back!

Firstly Clarence told us they would both be there for the whole of the trial. Then we see Gerry McCann looking like he wanted to punch dimunitive little Sandra Filgeuiras as she pluckily continued to put her questions to him, like the great reporter she is. That same day "business" calls him home. Yes, we know Gerry, the business of your furious temper when little women do not back down to you! I do think the picture of Kate closing her eyes in horror at that point was particularly graphic.

All the stops must have been pulled out to get Fiona Payne out there so fast to take his place but it seems clear there is just no way they wanted the clearly very ill and loose cannon Kate left there on her own. She might have felt the urge to start texting Ricardo Paiva again!!

You know I do not really approve of what Goncalo did, but it cannot be taken away from him that regardless his insistence Madeleine is dead is not borne out by the evidence in the case and even he and his witness now seek to call it a hypothesis rather than a fact, he has really damaged Kate and Gerry irreparably and I have to take pleasure in that.

The best bit for me was listening to Mr Menezes measure testimony but which still absolutely wiped the floor with Kate and Gerry. How they must rue the day, they went into battle against Goncalo. If what he was saying was a load of rubbish, why did they not have the good sense to just ignore it? But no, Gerry sees those million dollar lawsuits flashing before his eyes and he just cannot help himself. I got rid of Maddie but not how he says, so I can have him.

So will Mr Gerry McCann be able to show his face again in Portugal?

Will Kate want to face the next round of questions. Mrs McCann what do you have to say about the prosecutor saying you could have faced charges for kidnapping and trafficking Madeleine?

I would not like to be making the decisions now if I were Kate and Gerry and neither would I like to listen to the furious arguments the two of them must now be having about this disastrous decision they made to further cash in and "clear their name" given it has done exactly the opposite and let the Judge hear the other side of the story!!

viv said...

"They have taken her", what a strange thing for Kate to be immediately saying as she went back to the apartment with the group.

If she thought it was some strangers it is beyond belief she would have left the twins to the same fate. She must have known who "they" are, or she must have been completely faking it, which is it Kate?

viv said...

Leicestershire Police Force

From: DC443 J.N. HUGHES
To: SIO, Operation Task
Department: Main Criminal Unit
Date: 16th May 2008

Ref: Background Information– Kate McCann

Dear Sirs,

In response to your letter of request, I can provide the following information regarding the above-mentioned subject.

Kate McCann was born on March 5, 1968 in Merseyside.
Her maiden name is Healy, which she still uses in her clinical practice.
She is the bearer of British passport number **************.

She lives with her husband and children at Orchard House, 5 The Crescent, Rothley, Leicestershire, LE7 7RW. The house is subject to a mortgage for the amount of GBP 323.493 with the Northern Rock bank.

There is no report or statement of bank credit cards listed in the research carried out. However I was alerted to the fact that if an individual maintains an account open with the same bank or credit card accounts for a long period of time, these details do not appear in this kind of search.

She works for the local NHS as a GP in Latham House, Melton Mowbray, Leicestershire. She is currently on maternity leave.

Her phone number is ******* and she has a T mobile phone number ********.
There is no record of either of her surnames on the National Police Computer.

The search reference is NE84/0053/4.

A check of the location of the crime and information system is negative.

Inquiries made of local social services are negative.

Searches made of the local section of child abuse investigation shows a registration number 19309 in CATS (system of action location). A consultation with the DC Soand from the department in question confirms that this is just a file reference, but as a complement to Operation Task system for the purpose of reference, if any investigation should be necessary by the department. No work has been done on the basis of this file.

An examination of all other police files using a search system does not reveal any information about her.

Submitted for your information.

viv said...

The above rather brief background check on Kate McCann would suggest to me that this couple had real money problems.

It had been almost two years since the twins were born and yet it is stated she was still on maternity leave. Clearly after that length of time that would have been without pay.

And then the quite massive mortgage with Northern Rock, a society who had a reputation for lending in difficult cases, being prepared to take greater risks than other banks and building societies.

If you take Gerry's gross salary as a junior consultant to be in the region of £75K per annum, the usual lending criteria is treble that and once times the wife's salary. Kate had no salary and 75 x 3 equals £225,000 so that should have been the maximum borrowing this couple could get but they actually owed £323,000 whether that was due to substantial mortage arrears or substantial over committment I am not sure but they would obviously have been really struggling to pay £2000 per month mortgage out of just Gerry's salary. His gross monthly would be £6250 after tax, NI and pension at 6.5% net £3500. In other words, after paying their mortgage that left the McCann family just £1500 per month to live on and pay all of their other bills which I would suggest, particularly living in such a large house and with the bills that come with that, was nowhere near enough!!

viv said...

Checked loan for that amount over 25 years at 6 per cent which was the average rate at the time and it does work out to just over £2K per month, so unlikely to be including payment towards arrears, that was just what they needed to pay every month. I think it does place in context perhaps why the McCanns did this and why Gerry started as he meant to carry on, having that £2k per month paid out of the Fund. That would certainly take the pressure off. But someone clearly blew the whistle. Now we see from the McCanns accounts the Directors have a Whistle Blowing Policy. There are a lot of "friendly" directors on there now, John McCann, Kate McCann, Gerry McCann, Smethurst, Kennedy etc. Maybe other directors found themselves confronted with a policy that says they are not permitted to blow the whistle about how the Fund is being spent!

See briefly below, Public Interest Disclosure Act "PIDA" as to the legal provisions on whistle blowing to regulators and the press etc , not applicable to such a company... because it would appear they have no "employees" who could blow the whistle on them! Edgar is probably hired as a self employed contractor and made to sign a confidentiality agreement. It seems to me Gerry thought of everything and I am sure it was most expedient for him and kate to become directors! Oh and Jon Corner and and...no real scrutiny at all here is there!

viv said...

The UK's Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998 amends the Employment Rights Act 1996 to provide a framework of legal protection for individuals who disclose information so as to expose malpractice and matters of similar concern. In the vernacular, it protects whistleblowers from victimisation and dismissal.

The Act received Royal Assent on 2 July 1998 and came into effect a year later in 1999; need for such protection became evident from enquiries into disasters and crimes such as the 1987 capsize of the Herald of Free Enterprise, the 1988 Clapham Junction rail crash, and the 1991 Bank of Credit and Commerce International scandal. In each, employees could have prevented the occurrence had they felt that they would have received any support in raising allegations.

The scope of the Act extends to the raising of "genuine concerns about crime, civil offences (including negligence, breach of contract, breach of administrative law), miscarriage of justice, danger to health and safety or the environment and the cover up of any of these" and extends to all employees in almost all professions; some, such as the army, are excluded.

Protection in the event of infractions by employers is available through the industrial tribunal system; remedies include unlimited financial compensation and ordering companies to re-instate employees to their role.

viv said...

Cartas Rogatorias Vol III
Page 27

Leicestershire Police Force

From: DC443 J.N. HUGHES
To: SIO, Operation Task
Department: Main Crime Unit
Date: 16th May 2008

Subject: Background Information- Gerald McCANN

Dear Sirs

In response to your letter of request, I can provide the following information regarding the above-mentioned subject

Gerald McCann was born on June 5, 1968 in Scotland.

He is the bearer of British passport No **********.

He lives with his wife and children at Orchard House, 5 The Crescent, Rothley, Leicestershire, LE7 7RW.

The house is subject to a mortgage for the amount of GBP 323.493 with the Northern Rock Bank.

There is no report or statement of bank credit cards listed in the research carried out. However I was alerted to the fact that if an individuals maintains an open account with the same bank or a credit card for a long period of time, these details do not appear in this type of research.

He works for the NHS as a cardiologist at Glenfield hospital.

His previous address was 14 Queniborough Hall Drive, Queniborough, Leicestershire, LE7 3DZ.

His phone number is ******** and he has a mobile phone Vodafone No **********.

He is the owner of two vehicles registered in the PNC, a light blue Volkswagen Passat - R119 and a green BVV VW Touran, FM54 CXR.

No record was found in the National Police Computer. Search reference NE91/0031.

A search of the crime location and information system only indicates that Mr McCann was the victim of a theft of golf clubs from inside his car in the drive way to his home on 01/04/2006. Criminal Reference NQ/010145/06-9

A search of the local section of the child abuse shows a registration number 19309 in the CATS system. A consultation with the DC Soand from the department in question confirms that this is just a file reference, but as a complement to Operation Task system for the purpose of reference, if any investigation should be necessary by the department. No work has been done on the basis of this file.

An examination of all other police files using a search system does not reveal any information about him.

Submitted for your information.

viv said...

I wonder why a very similar report for Gerry McCann lists his previous address but this information is not given for Kate?

Could it be that for a period prior to buying this house they were not living together ?

Seems odd Kate was still on maternity leave in May 08 when the twins were 3, that is stretching it a bit!!

Seems rather obtuse to say no work has been done on the local file of the child abuse investigation it was just opened as a compliment, a reference point for Operation Task? Much higher level and of course confidential? File links have to be provided for information sharing purposes..on UK computer systems but at that stage nothing local? It does look like there was an unwillingness to disclose in print what was going on here!

viv said...

But of course LP would have known the disclosure rules in Portugal and would be making absolutely certain nothing got disclosed for us to read about an ongoing child abuse investigation. At least they advert to one and give us a file reference number, lol!

Our own law is in conflict with Portugal in that all investigations concerning child abuse must be kept from the public due to disclosing at risk children which simply cannot happen, they must not be identified.

viv said...

from the rog of Diane Webster, it is not Simon Payne (who arranged for them to have Portuguese mobiles) as I assumed on the mobile phone thread it is Simon Aldridge husband of Fiona's sister Louise NATES ?? who is in New Zealand, I wonder if that has anything to do with Kate going to NZ?

But if Louise is in New Zealand it seems very odd her husband has a business in Doncaster, that is one heck of a commute, lol, and it would be interesting to know who this ALAN MIDDLETON IS that the PC just suddenly asks her about whilst discussing her mobile calls?? :

(thanks to posters on JM for helping me with this!)

DW: "You see I don’t recall people’s mobile numbers so its (laughs).”

PC: "No. I don’t either. It ends in one, one, five that one.”

DW: "Yeah it ends in one, one, five.”

PC: "And they rang you at quarter past eleven in the morning on the fourth of May, so the morning after Madeleine had gone.”

DW: "Ah so that might have been Louise, my other daughter.”

PC: "It quite possibly was because that would match with what we have.”

DW: "Yeah.”

PC: "You’ve got two Doctor daughters have you?”

DW: "Yeah, well the one in New Zealand’s a Doctor as well but she’s a PHD Doctor, she’s a scientist. Yeah that’s, err Louisa NATES, yeah my middle daughter.”

PC: "Okay, and do you remember why she called?”

DW: "Err because her dad, well I would have phoned Tim to tell him what had happened and he I think probably would have got in touch with Louise.”

PC: "There actually are quite a high number of calls to and from that number that day. I’m sure they would all, all to have been to do with Madeleine’s disappearance.”

DW: "Yes, yeah definitely.”

PC: "And the last number then Dianne is x, xxxxx, xxxxx, xxxx, xxxx, xxxxx, one, eight, seven, one, three.”

DW: "One, three. Who else would I have called?”

PC: "Do you know a Dave MIDDLETON?”

DW: "Dave MIDDLETON? (Shakes head).”

PC: "No?”

DW: "No.”

PC: "Do you know anybody in Doncaster?”

DW: "Err no, but Louise, my middle daughter, she’s married to err Simon ALDRIDGE who, his company err Doncaster, I’m sure it’s around Doncaster where his business is.”

PC: "What’s his line of work?”

DW: "They’re err it’s a roof tiler.”

PC: "That’s the one yeah.”

DW: "Yeah.”

PC: "Yeah. Sandtoft Roof Tiles.”

DW: "Sandtoft yeah that’s it.”

PC: "The person that’s bought the phone or registered the phone must be called Dave MIDDLETON. Okay, so that’s your son in-law then?”

DW: "Yeah. Well not the Dave MIDDLETON, he’s not.”

PC: "No.”

DW: "No. My son in-law’s…”

viv said...

full copy Di Webster rog


viv said...

Check out this snotty "Bridget", on JM blog telling me he is NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS CASE AND IT IS NONE OF MY BUSINESS and then bless me we get anon poster just wanting to ahem reinforce what Bridget says!

Now when I get a post like that it always makes me think it is very much part of my business! Anything to do with the Payne family and I am finding I get this reaction:-))))

viv said...

03/02/2010 07:58
viv said... 93

Just another thought, why would David Payne's brother be called Simon Aldridge, surely they would have the same surname unless one of them changed their name due to having something to hide. I cannot remember where the name Simon Aldridge comes from, can someone give me a link? Is there a stmt on the PJ file?
03/02/2010 08:03
Anonymous said... 94

Viv -There is also a mention of Nicky Aldridge. I will try to give you refs. but I'm off to work soon, so will post later.
03/02/2010 09:44
Anonymous said... 95

"A woman was seen acting suspiciously outside Kate and Gerry McCann's apartment...... The slim, Portuguese- looking woman in a plum- coloured top and white skirt with long, dark, swept back hair acted furtively when she was spotted at 8pm on May 3 in 2007 near the Mark Warner Ocean Clib complex

Jane Tanner is not slim. She is normal size, but she is not slim. IMO.
03/02/2010 09:53
Bridget said... 96


With respect, you are getting completely carried away here. It makes me very uncomfortable when people start speculating on those who are nothing to do with the case. It makes them look obsessive and pretty creepy.

Fiona Payne does not refer to the man named as her husband's brother, but as her brother in law, so he could be her sisters husband, hence the different name. Even if he isn't to suggest that ''they would have the same surname unless one of them changed it due to having something to hide''is really unfair. Siblings can use different surnames for a whole host of reasons, none of which are frankly your business.

Sorry, but I just don't think that wild speculation like this puts anyone in a good light
03/02/2010 10:07
Anonymous said... 97

Viv- Simon Aldridge is referred to in the Payne's Rog. statements. Fiona says he is her brother-in-law, so he could be married to her sister, if she has one? It was friends of the Aldridges who supplied the phones.
03/02/2010 10:10
Anonymous said... 98

Anon 88- My thought too, when I posted the info about James Murray's article. She also made a phone call on her mobile at 8.30.
03/02/2010 10:21
Anonymous said... 99

maybe mr. aldridge adopted his wife's surname? shouldn't be too unusual in the 21st century? just a thought.
03/02/2010 20:01
viv said... 100

Thanks for your help guys and will have a look at the Aldridges. I find it pretty creepy that on a discussion board people cannot discuss what they are thinking and ask for the assistance of others without a personal attack. I have read an awful lot on this case "Bridget" but even so never professed to have such expertise as you, where you can state quite categorically who is "nothing to do with the case". Are you CID or PJ and in either event do you think you should be on here!!
04/02/2010 03:40
Anonymous said... 101

Just to endorse Bridget's comments on 'wild speculation' (post 96). The Diane Webster rogatory interview tells us who Simon Aldridge is, his occupation and his place of work. (A look at the website of that place of work would suggest that his name is in fact Simon Oldridge.) http://themaddiecasefiles.com/post449.html#p449
04/02/2010 05:54

viv said...

you know "Bridget" almost sounds like Fiona Payne herself, I am being really unfair, lol! and the further anon effort at 5 in the morning does make this person seem a bit concerned. Me I am a regular nightowler!

Hello Fiona, dont be too tired for work, lol! xxx

viv said...

on this thread:-))

last post 101


hope4truth said...

Morning Viv

GA IMHO wrote his book to set the record straight about his investigation and to let anyone know who wanted to read it his side of events.

The McCann's have been allowed to make it up it up as they go along even telling the world that they have been cleared of any involvment which is a huge lie...

Not sure why innocent people need to lie and spin but it is obvious we have to believe them....

Not sure if that was FP you were being "told of" by but that woman has alwasy come across as smug we are the little people who must not look her in the eye whilst daring to speak to her.. Sorry Fiona (if you are reading) you are nothing more than a self confesed child neglector who wont assist in the hunt for a child in the hands of a peadophile by attending a simple reconstruction had your friends not had such a worthy spin Dr I very much think you would be in jail now for neglecting your children.... I would not want to speak to you anymore than I would want to have a conversation with any other idiot who does not put their child first.....

As for GA you are right Viv there is no evidence that Madeleiene is dead.... Well none we know of but there are pages of the rogs that were not published and their may be very strong evidence in them that shows she is... Maybe they dont know how or who?

The dogs did a good job in Haiti no one doubted them there it is strange really as if lost we would welcome dogs to come and find us these dogs had a 100% record and sudenly the McCann;s are experts and their findings laughed at....

I was not laughing when the dog picked out a childs T Shirt and her Mothers Trousers it made me cry it was so tragic....

In my sick head I had an image of Madeleine dead after falling from the sofa and Kate finding her and holding her not wanting to let her child go what Mother would?

What do I know I still find it hard to belive they could have planned anything but with the amount being thrown at lawyers instead of searching they cant have cared much for her at all or know she is dead and they have nothing to loose...

viv said...

hiya Hope

Of course we cannot be certain that is Fiona Payne but it is clearly an arrogant person who seems to take things very personally and seeks to suggest I am "creepy and obsessive". It was the comment "you are not being fair" though that particularly alerted me. The second message is in the same educated but arrogant tone. Another possibility is Fiona's sister Louise who I see lives in New Zealand. I recall there used to be a regular poster to Rosiepops bog from NZ.

I believe this is yet further evidence that we have all of them blogging to "defend themselves". I recall that remark from the Daily Express from Rosiepops, "we are just trying to defend ourselves". It is the direct and personal way some of these posters make the issues that really give them away for me.

I can understand Goncalo feeling the need to act in the way that he did given all the lies that were being printed by them in the media including all of the personal comments that were directed at him in particular apart from the PJ as a whole.

IF YOU ARE READING FIONA I hope you will not think I am being unfair when I point out that you point blank refused to attend a reconstruction in Portugal to help find little Missing Madeleine. But the minute the McCanns need you in Portugal to try and sue Goncalo Amaral you are there like a shot. That makes you the sickest person. You are also sick to go out and leave tiny children in your apartment with a baby monitor. The whole lot of you just make me sick.

viv said...

see this video on Youtube, the McCanns reply to the allegations against them.

It states Goncalo Amaral has been convicted of beating a confession out of Leonora Cipriano which as we know is JUST A COMPLETE AND UTTER LIE

He was convicted of being nowhere near her, but failing to fill paperwork in!!

If these people think this continuing wicked lies and propaganda are going to improve their reputation they had better think again. It just makes people more angry towards them and more determined to just keep on pointing out what wicked liars they really are. If they had nothing to hide they would have no need to partake in this obscene behaviour. I now personally hope that Goncalo wins everything and after all, he did not start the case, the MONEY GRABBING MCCANNS DID and they back it up with lies like this:

When would they ever have time to actually look for Madeleine!!


viv said...

oh lol Hope, I have just been reading the comments of the author of this video, Messenger3, preaching God, the Lord Jesus and otherwise spouting pure Rosiepops. And there was me and you thinking it had shut up! It is arguing non stop on Youtube!

I think the likely identity of Rosiepops almost certainly just has to be accepted as pure nutcase having a bit of an episode:-)))

viv said...

On a more serious note, there is a really good and intellectual discussion going on here about Goncalo writing the book and the reasons why he did it.

People are now alluding to the fact that he mentioned the GASPAR statement but did not make any allegations against the McCanns on the basis of that statement. In fact he accused them of the most innocuous crime one could imagine on the facts, gross negligence manslaughter and then disposing of the body.

He has brought before the court a central witness, Mr Menezes, who has testified the McCanns could have been charged with kidnapping and child trafficking, i.e. what sex offenders do.

That, I believe, is what Dr Goncalo Amaral really wanted the public to know! And it was published on Sky News, the McCanns are finished!


viv said...

Interesting view from Then there were 4 and not beyond the realms of credibility, I certainly think Brown thought he could seize a political opportunity from this case and seriously came a cropper! :

Let's say Brown jumped in originally because he thought it was a chance to have his very own 'Diana Moment'. Being a control freak he very stupidly gets personally involved with the whole thing and with McCann directly. So Brown has the diplomatic service running around doing his bidding and supporting the McCanns. They send emails to Brown warning him that everything is not quite as it seemed at first and the parents could be involved. But Brown being Brown, he tears up the emails and carries on regardless. By now he has the Foreign Secretary, Miliband and Home Secretary, Smith also involved. To cut a long story short, Leicester Police were accused by Dr. Amaral of lack of cooperation with the PJ. This was at the time the McCanns were made Arguidos and did a runner. I can imagine that when the Leicester Police returned as well, that some questions were asked and they laid the blame for everything that had gone wrong at Amaral's door. I'm certain, Brown being Brown, that he got personally involved again and discussed Amaral's position with the Portuguese Premier Socrates. shortly after these events, Dr. Amaral was removed from the case. That is political involvement; IMO it simply happened because Brown was looking for a case where he could present himself as standing up for Brits' rights, and making sure that the swarthy police worked a bit harder than usual in searching for the missing child. Imagine how he would have basked in the limelight if Madeleine had been found - Brown welcomes McCanns and Madeleine to lunch at No. 10, pictured here on the steps of No. 10 etc. etc. Gerry McCann thanks Gordon Brown for his support. "Without Gordon's help, especially getting the UK police involved, who knows whether the Portuguese police alone would have been able to find her," he said, etc. etc. blah

viv said...

Statement by: Stephen Markley

Occupation: Police Officer

This statement (composed of 2 pages and signed by me) is true and in accordance with my understanding.

Date: 25th April 2008

I am police officer Markley of the Leicestershire Police currently working in the criminal unit.

In 2007 and in relation to the Portuguese investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, I was detached to Portugal in the role of family communication officer.

According to the Portuguese PJ Letter of Request, I was asked to respond to the following question:

Was there anything done or said by Kate or Gerry McCann in your presence or during your various meetings that could raise any suspicion that they had any knowledge about what could have happened to Madeleine, beyond the circumstances described to the Portuguese investigators?

My reply to the question was: No.

However, in relation to the above, I would like to add the following: At about 20.00 on Saturday 5th May 2007, I arrived at the apartment where Kate and Gerry were staying, with other officers. During the meeting Gerald and Kate had a number of questions to which they wanted follow up and responses from the PJ.

One of these questions was that they wanted the PJ to be aware of was Madeleine’s revelation about Wednesday night, when she said that she was left alone during the night. She told Kate and Gerry that she remembered the twins crying and that she wanted to know why neither her mother nor her father had gone to the room to see what was happening.

They also wanted to know whether the PJ had any evidence that would suggest that the person who took Madeleine had used any substance to facilitate the abduction.

This statement was made by me and is truthful in accordance with my understanding.

viv said...

The PJ are asking here, do they have "any knowledge" of what happened to Madeleine. That is much wider than suspecting they were involved in her death.

The day before seeing this UK police officer, the McCanns had both already stressed to the PJ in their evidence about the supposed crying of Maddie/the twins the night before. So why did they feel the need to reinforce this point so strongly? Particularly given it paints such a bleak picture of a couple of doctors who just leave their children alone to cry. But this seems to be a bit different "during the night". Were the McCanns now attempting to suggest that actually they were there but did not hear the cries, having regretted the impression they gave to the PJ the day before? During the night gives the impression it was not during the evening whilst they were out, but through the night when the McCanns would have been right next door.

So let us look at what we know to be the truth. In fact, the night before Kate slept in the childrens' bedroom. So, if that is what they decided to suggest it is not possible she could not have heard the cries "during the night". Did forensics find evidence of Kate having been in that bed and confront her with that? And why would she sleep separate and apart from Gerry? Does this not suggest conflict between the couple the night before Maddie was due to disappear, and all those bruises on Kate? Was she trying to protect her kids?

The second observation of this police officer is also very sinister. Straight away Kate and Gerry are aware the PJs have noted the twins could not wake up and so they are suggesting the abductor might have drugged all three children, a ridiculous suggestion. But it does demonstrate their guilty knowledge and how they are trying to stage the notion of some stranger coming into the apartment to remove Madeleine. We know that was Gerry!

viv said...

and of course we also know from Mrs Fenn that in fact it was Maddie who was bitterly crying for one hour and fifteen minutes, not on the Wednesday, the night before, as they suggest but on Tuesday 1 May. So what was happening to Maddie on that night that the McCanns wanted to provide an excuse for, knowing I believe that Mrs Fenn had heard and reported that to the police.

viv said...

and the McCanns forensic answer to all of this is, the abductor was not there on the Tuesday when Mrs Fenn heard her, he was there on the Wednesday, the night before, doing a dummy run?

And Madeleine or the twins did wake in the night crying?

And Gerry even suggests well it could have happened if we had been right there.

NO, I do not think so Gerry, there was no fantasy abductor in your apartment, only you and your friends..

hope4truth said...

The bruises on Kates arm look like grab marks to me maybe it was not Gerry hurting her but Kate lashing out and being restrained?

For people who like to defend themselves the T9 are an odd bunch...

they are all so proud about the fact they each neglected their children to go to a bar and their is information which describes a conversation between David and Gerry which is disturbing and sick if true yet they never try and defend it???

If they are blogging then they are desprate I would have thought it better they actually spoke to the police who will prosecute rather than try and bully control and put down people who dont agree that they have done anything other than cover up a childs death or left a child in hell for over 1000 days while they just worried about their reputations....

Then I guess if you wake every day wondering if one of your friends will crack must make you cranky,,

viv said...

Hiya Hope

I agree the grab marks to Kate may indicate that she killed Madeleine and he was restraining her explaining what was going to happen. But I do think he is far too intimidating for her to lash out at him.

New post -Astro has published full details of the temporary injunction against Goncalo, predictably the court upholding both theirs and the childrens' human rights. Pretty stern condemnation of Goncalo setting out his knowledge of the criminal process etc. Pre judging of any legal case is always considered a really bad idea!

I know people are going to see this as a terrible blow but it was predictable. It is OK for us to comment on the internet, but it is not OK to make books and television programmes so publically declaring them guilty ahead of any criminal process against them. That would make a mockery of the right to be considered innocent until proven guilty by a criminal court and the right to a fair trial.

viv said...

Always enjoy this poster on MM, he/she just talks plain common sense

fedrules Today at 8:18

Lizzy11268 wrote:
Thank you for your responses. Its a lot more clear now, that part of it anyway. '
Personally, unlike many, I have never believed the GB conspiracy theories. I think Brown was just wanting to be seen as caring like his predecessor when he initially got involved with the McCanns. I'm sure he grew to regret his decision when the suspicions about them started to emerge.
I don't know why Amaral was taken off the case, but it could be that it was considered to be wise knowing that he was going to have to stand trial in the Cipriano case. I believe Amaral has misunderstood the extent of the alleged government support for the McCanns. They were, due to their influential friends and relatives, given more support than an ordinary couple might have been given in such circumstances, but I don't see this as evidence of direct government involvement in the case. I really think that if forensic evidence had been stronger, they would have been charged.

viv said...

Speaking of forensic evidence, it was a catastrophic error of the Pt Police not to seize Madeleine's clothing worn that day. If she had been abused or killed the evidence would have been there, even if she had disappeared.

They did not have set procedures to deal with such a case and were undoubtedly getting an awful lot of pressure to treat the McCanns with kid gloves, Gerry made sure of that!

But if the McCanns wanted to clear their names, they would have known they were immediately under suspicion by operation of normal procedures and should have just made sure the police had everything they needed to clear them, every piece of evidence and every degree of co-operation. That, we can see, the McCanns were most adamant they were not going to provide, hence their permanent lacuna in the evidence as they struggle to tell us what we are not going to believe, their innocence and good parenting skills.