1 May 2010



This video on the Find Madeleine site is so sick and disrespectful to Madeleine I do not want it on here.  The McCanns finally have scraped the bottom of the barrel in their sick exploitation of little Maddie. 

Kate and Gerry,  THIS IS YOUR LIFE.   Who are these men that surround them?  Special Branch?  The one with the beads also looks like a man? UK agency that deals with exploited children abroad arrived in PDL immediately,  did they already know something about this group of "doctors" 

Not only are we told today, Kate seriously thought of suicide due to her "pain",  (never mind Madeleine and the twins of course), we even have Gerry "breaking down" and losing faith in his non existent faith.  

A couple of years ago they wanted to make Maddie the Movie to tell us all about their "pain" and pocket about £10M in the process, money making ventures are scaled down just a little now, but their attacks on the police as they demand we feel their pain clearly did not diminish.  

 I wonder how their action for at least ONE MILLION QUID off Goncalo is going and just what British Police are currently doing, something that is not to their taste, I will warrant!  


Gerry McCann breaks down as he tells how hunt for Madeleine 'is shaking his Catholic faith'

By Vanessa Allen
Last updated at 12:42 AM on 1st May 2010
Kate McCann longed for death after her daughter Madeleine’s disappeared, she admitted yesterday.
Choking back tears, she told for the first time how she had wanted her life to end but insisted she had never contemplated suicide.
Mrs McCann, 42, faced criticism because she appeared cold and did not break down. But she revealed how in her bleakest hours, she wanted to die to stop the pain.
Suffering together: Kate and Gerry McCann during their interview 
Suffering together: Kate and Gerry McCann during their interview yesterday
The former GP and her husband Gerry, 41, gave their most honest and moving
interview to the BBC World Service to mark the third anniversary of Madeleine’s disappearance on Monday.
Madeleine was three when she vanished from her parents’ rented apartment in the
Portuguese resort of Praia da Luz as they ate at a nearby restaurant with friends.
There have been no confirmed sightings since. But the couple, who also have twins
Sean and Amelie, five, have not given up.
The McCanns, of Rothley, Leicestershire, have launched a ‘holiday pack’ of stickers
and posters showing Madeleine’s face. They hope holiday-makers will distribute them
around the world to try to find Madeleine.

Longing for death:

GERRY: Really early on, there was a time when I was worried because Kate said she
wanted to go into the ocean and keep swimming and swimming and swimming. That
obviously caused great distress. The emotions are so raw early on.
KATE: I used to have thoughts like maybe we’ll get wiped out in the car on the motorway. So it would just happen, we’d all be gone and the pain would be away. But there’s always somebody left behind with that pain. We have got family who have been fantastic, friends who have been fantastic.
It was just so painful and it’s just so hard to describe, that heavy, suffocating feeling day in day out, that pain of missing Madeleine and anxiety for her.
There were times when I did want it to end. I wouldn’t have done anything, I have never
thought of doing anything, but what I do know now for sure is that I don’t want that.
Things have changed. I am desperate to be here with Sean and Amelie and to help find Madeleine.

What they believe has happened to Madeleine:

KATE: You just hope that it’s somebody who is looking after Madeleine. Who knows why they’ve taken her but I hope they’re looking after her and that she’s comfortable in the situation she’s in, that she is not at harm and that she’s getting love and happiness. That’s all I can hope for.
GERRY: Early on we couldn’t think of anything else but the worst case, where everything was negative, that she’d been taken, abused and killed and dumped, or maybe left seriously injured and dumped out in the freezing cold.

There have been individuals who, for whatever reason, have seemingly not wanted to find Madeleine. That’s how it appears to us… There are many people who’ve tried to derail what we’re doing along the way.

I can promise you we could think of almost no other scenario. Of course, that scenario is still possible… but there is no evidence of physical harm to Madeleine. As parents, we can’t accept she’s dead without absolute evidence of that.
KATE: In my heart, I feel she’s out there. I really do. And that, together with the feeling that I have of this not being over, of her still being there. The hardest thing, obviously, is how do we find her?

Sean and Amelie:

GERRY: Sean, in particular, talks about having an aeroplane and flying all over the world looking for ‘that man who’s taken Madeleine’ and when he gets him he’s going to rescue her and take his sword out.
KATE: At the moment they don’t show any signs of anger. A month or so ago, I went for a run and I suddenly started thinking about Sean and Amelie getting much older, they will understand more.
They’re going to feel the same kind of pain and loss and anger that we’ve felt over the last couple of years. I suddenly thought, ‘I don’t want them to feel that’.
I know how hard it has been for us, I don’t want them to have to go through that in addition to not having their sister with them.

Kate’s dreams:

I HAVE only had three dreams, all the same, they’re when I find her. It’s actually when I see her. They are actually incredibly painful.
The first one I was in Portugal and it was very tangible… I think I got rung by the nursery where she went to and they said ‘Madeleine’s here’. I went but then I was holding her and it felt like I was holding her and then I woke up and I was hysterical, actually, it was horrible.

Why they left children:

Torture of not knowing: Mr McCann said he will not accept 
Madeleine is dead until he has proof
Torture of not knowing: Mr McCann said he will not accept Madeleine is dead until he has proof
KATE: It just felt so safe, subconsciously, that was the restaurant for the apartments where we were staying. I think it took me 37 seconds to go back to the apartment.
The fact that I didn’t have to consciously think, ‘Is this right or is this wrong, is this safe or is it not?’, implies that I thought it was totally safe. I had a flashback recently of
that, of me and Gerry just holding each other and saying ‘We’ve let her down, we’ve let her down’, just because we weren’t there. I would never in a million years have anticipated something like that.
GERRY: If anything, prior to this, I would have said Kate was overprotective. The fact that she was so comfortable, we were all comfortable… It wasn’t a debate, we just didn’t perceive risk at all.

Police investigation:

KATE: If this was a murder inquiry there’d be an active investigation because they’d want to find the perpetrator. But as it stands we have a perpetrator who’s still at
large and therefore puts – potentially puts – other children at risk, and we still have a missing child.
So why is there no active investigation? I’m angry and frustrated really, this is our daughter, she’s still missing and there’s no investigation to find her. It’s a farce.
GERRY: Officially for 18 months and longer, law enforcement are not proactively doing anything to find Madeleine, and who took her, and I just think that is fundamentally unacceptable… There have been individuals who, for whatever reason, have seemingly not wanted to find Madeleine. That’s how it appears to us… There are many people who’ve tried to derail what we’re doing along the way.
KATE: I also think there’ll be some people who would be greatly embarrassed if Madeleine was found and that scares me. That might affect their want, or not, for Madeleine to be found.

Belief in God:

GERRY: If anything, when this first happened it strengthened my faith. I felt that there was such support and I really felt that may have been God’s work, that something good was going to come out of this.
I’m struggling much more now, without a doubt. I think that for one child to have been the recipient of so many millions of prayers, you think, ‘Well I do have my doubt’. If those prayers were going to work, they should have worked a long time ago.
KATE: I don’t hate God… I just can’t understand why so much could be allowed to land on one family and go seemingly unchallenged. So I would be angry with God but then I would voice that, I would let it out.

Prayers for abductor:

KATE: I usually pray for them to see the error of their ways, to have compassion and courage to come forward… The pain and the fear that it’s caused Madeleine and the
pain it’s caused to our family makes it incredibly difficult to sit here and say ‘Yes, I forgive him’. It would be important to know who’s taken Madeleine and why.
GERRY: Until we find Madeleine and who took her we don’t know what we will be asked to forgive.


viv said...

Thousands of hits on Google:

Kate: I thought of dying to end pain

How good of you to share that with us Kate, Gerry too, and continue to forget whose pain you should really be thinking about, your own children!


viv said...

even in the heavily moderated world of the Daily Mail, I am sure this is not what the McCanns wanted to hear.

They just do not learn how selfish and arrogant they sound, do they, they still think they can just pass off Maddie telling them about crying and them just going and doing it again, with the door open.

No normal parents would do that, let alone doctors, so why don't you just shut up Kate and Gerry and lay off the police! It is you and your friends who told incoherent lies to the police and refused to attend for a reconstruction of those incoherent lies. Only you who hold the key to finding Madeleine, dead or alive and we are heartily sick of your charade.

viv said...

'God help the McCanns and all who, like them, have lost a child to the global trafficking gangs.

- M Morton, Melbourne, Australia, 1/5/2010

M Morton - do you know that Madeleine has gone to a global trafficking gang? How can you possibly be so sure? There was no evidence of any abduction, and for all we know it is still possible that Madeleine could have wandered off somewhere looking for her parents.

Kate said they were '37 seconds away', yet they could not see or hear their children. 3 years on it is still beyond me how anybody can enjoy an evening out whilst their three young children are alone.

- IW, UK, 01/5/2010 12:46
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I don't believe in a doctrinated GOD: no GOD would allow this to happen: no GOD would allow the horrendous cruelty that man inflicts on his own and other living beings.

No: there is no GOD.

- Heather, Swansea, 01/5/2010 12:36
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I hope against hope that Madeleine is either dead and at peace or being cared for by a loving - but misguided - person/family. The worst outcome would be is if she is being held by people who are harming her, whether it be physically, mentally or sexually.

I heard this interview and I am really sorry to say, but the McCanns are now in danger of alienating everyone who has either sympathised or helped them.

They seem to think that they have some divine right for their daughter's case still to be making headline news. They have been afforded unprecedented publicity and money in their search. No amount of blaming others can absolve them of their own dereliction of duty as parents.

We all know how this story unfolded, but it wasn't a lapse in judgment once - they left them alone every night to dine with friends. I would be looking closer to home to apportion blame for the fate of Madeleine.

- Marie, Surrey, 01/5/2010 12:16
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Your pain and loss will only become manageable when you accept your guilt at leaving your child alone. You made a tragic error which you will never escape, all you can now do is live for your two other children and try not to let the dark clouds crowd out the joy of your remaining family. Wherever your daughter is, may she be at peace.

- Craig, Leeds, UK, 01/5/2010 11:47
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My heart aches for Madeline and whatever has happened to her, but she is one of thousands of children missing today and sadly Gerry and Kate thing the world should stop Just for Them! and they should be first always, no one has ever had the coverage and support given to them.

It is time to put the Twins first!

- John B, Manchester UK, 01/5/2010 11:47

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1270172/Gerry-McCann-breaks-tells-hunt-Madeleine-shaking-Catholic-faith.html#ixzz0mii1ITBL

viv said...

SB, this sounds like the sort of terrible case we were talking about where the father is the more serious offender but the mother also took part, three years for her is pretty lenient.

Sadly, social workers yet again, fail to protect!

viv said...

Social services missed SEVEN chances to save girl, 14, who was 'brainwashed' into having sex with her father

By Daily Mail Reporter
Last updated at 12:57 AM on 1st May 2010

* Comments (177)
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Enlarge Paedo parents

His Honour Judge Francis Gilbert QC sentenced the parents to a total of 13 years in jail

A teenage girl was 'brainwashed' into having sex with her father after social services repeatedly missed signs she was being abused, a court has heard.

The 14-year-old was groomed to take part in perverted acts with her parents even though the family were investigated seven times.

Her parents, who cannot be named, were yesterday jailed for a total of 13 years for the abuse and for trading vile images of her with an American paedophile.

The girl was 'brainwashed' into believing she deserved the abuse and developed 'accommodation syndrome' to her father's desires.

By the time she was 14 the girl was being repeatedly used 'as a sexual toy' by her father but this was not uncovered despite seven visits by social services.

The paedophile was only arrested after his daughter uploaded indecent images of herself onto a social networking site and he was identified by his distinctive tattoos.

The father, 43, was jailed for ten years after admitting sexual activity with a child, four counts of causing a child to engage in sexual activity, and making and distributing indecent images.

The mother, 39, was jailed for three years after she pleaded guilty to two counts of inciting a child to engage in sex acts, child cruelty, and making an indecent image.

Passing sentence yesterday, Judge Francis Gilbert QC described the case as 'very serious'.

He said: 'This is a case of very serious sexual abuse and neglect of your daughter.'

Speaking after the hearing Bronwen Lacey, director of services for children and young people for Plymouth City Council, claimed social services have improved since the case.

She said: 'This is a truly horrific case of abuse that will affect the young person involved for the rest of their life.
Browen Lacey

Lessons learned: Browen Lacey, Director of Children¿s Services at Plymouth City Council

'We have been and will continue to focus our efforts on ensuring all the support, guidance and counselling needed is provided and that we work with the young person to help them move on with their life.

viv said...

'While the conviction is recent, the social services case is historic - initial contact with the child took place in the early 1990s and the last contact with the then social services department was in 2002.

'We have since made massive strides in the standard of children's social care and safeguarding.'

The court heard that the couple moved to Plymouth in 1994, shortly before their daughter was born.

Her older brother had already been taken into care and was later adopted after he suffered serious physical abuse at the hands of his father.

When the girl was four she was found at home alone by police and told them her parents had gone to the pub.

She revealed her father would kick her if she did not eat properly.

The following year her father was seen smacking her across the face and in 2001 she arrived at school with bruising on her arm after her father hit her.

In 2002 the girl said she wanted to get away from her father and was taken into foster care but could not stay because of her 'inappropriate sexualised behaviour'.

Despite this warning sign she was returned to her father who continued to abuse her and removed her from school in 2007 - announcing she would be home-tutored.

Between 1994 and 2002 social services investigated her case seven times but failed to uncover the abuse that was taking place.

Several years later indecent images of the girl were traded on the internet and police proved the man in them was her father because of distinctive piercings and tattoos.

Some of the photos showed apparent acts of gross indecency with an animal whilst another picture showed the girl performing an indecent act with her mother.
Plymouth Crown Court

The harrowing case was heard at Plymouth Crown Court. The parents cannot be named to protect the 14-year-old girl's identity

The court was read a comment by Judge Miranda Robertshaw, who is hearing care proceedings in the Family Court.

She said: 'The assessment of the local authorities is almost incomprehensible given the previous family history and the vulnerability of such a child.' Detective Constable Andy Thorne, from Devon and Cornwall Police's Force Child Exploitation Unit, expressed his hopes that the victim 'can look to the future'.

He said: 'This was a very difficult but thorough investigation which started as a result of receiving a very small piece of intelligence.

'As a result of detailed, sensitive and lengthy detective work, a team of dedicated officers were able to gather enough evidence to bring about this successful prosecution and bring these two people to justice.

'This has been a multi-agency investigation and I would like to take this opportunity to thank all those involved. Hopefully, the victim of the case can start to look to the future.' The girl's father and mother were ordered to remain on the sex offenders register indefinitely and placed under a Sexual Offences Prevention Order.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1269966/Social-services-fail-save-14-year-old-girl-sexually-abused-parents.html#ixzz0mimNTjF8

viv said...

When the girl was four she was found at home alone by police and told them her parents had gone to the pub.

viv said...

I think the McCanns are increasingly desperate the public should not see them for what they really are.

Only serious and abusive criminals deliberately set out to abuse and defame the police, decent people look up to and respect those who seek to take care of us all. True there are some bad apples, that is inevitable, but as the above case shows the police will always do their very best for exploited children, like little Maddie.

viv said...

In 2001 and 2002 she was bruised and showing inappropriate sexualised behaviour but she was sent back to the parents who had taught her that for another 8 years of it which is just heartbreaking.

The shocking dereliction of duty that we see time and time again from British Social Workers really does need to change.

What does life have in store now for this damaged young lady aged 14 before she is finally rescued having published the sordid pictures of herself, no doubt as a further desperate plea for help.

viv said...

As I have been pointing out on here for some considerable time, the McCanns themselves are saying they want the case re-opened in Portugal. That is due to a jurisdictional issue IMO.

If, as the McCanns insist, Maddie had genuinely been abducted by a stranger from Portugal, then it would be the Portuguese authorities alone who could investigate and prosecute that.

But what we have actually seen is confirmation many times there is an ongoing investigation in UK. Unless that involves the McCanns and their friends or some other British offenders there is no way UK could be investigating.

CEOP have always been involved, they deal with sexually exploited children abroad, they shot over to PDL.

I am surprised why people still cannot see why the McCanns want the case re-opened in Portugal! They are horrified by the files right here in the UK, that they went to the High Court to get their hands on and just had to back down. Gerry has said the files need putting together, that is what he wants, re-open in Portugal, start looking for his fantasy abductors and put the British files with the Portuguese.

Just dream on Gerry and don't be so silly. This case will never be re-opened in Portugal.

viv said...

Missing Madeleine parents want to reopen inquiry

(AFP) – 9 hours ago

LISBON — The parents of British girl Madeleine McCann, who disappeared in Portugal almost three years ago, will ask police to reopen the case to follow new leads, they said in an interview published on Saturday.

"We are going to ask for the reopening of the case. This is what we have come to do in Portugal," the father Gerry McCann told the weekly Expresso.

Private detectives working for the McCanns have "identified a new line of investigation", Gerry McCann said, "the trails leads to other trails and we have to convince the police to follow them".

Madeleine McCann disappeared from her family's apartment in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz on May 3, 2007, a few days before her fourth birthday.

After a 14-month investigation, Portuguese police decided to shelve the inquiry.

viv said...

Oh the McCanns pain, three years on. They still cannot get the case transferred back to Portugal and all the British Agency files so they can read them. Gerry actually thinks he can get Ricardo Paiva the sack and then start telling Portuguese cops to follow his "trails".

This man is seriously deranged and desperate, what does he take them for!

viv said...

This is just utterly shocking, a very much slimmed down "Gran Cooper"
has been flown out to PDL by the Sunday Express to revitalise her goofy teeth man sighting. This bloke she saw on the beach and he called at her villa, just on that basis he is described as the number 1 suspect who abducted Madeleine!

I recall reading the police files and British Police had to warn this woman who is clearly enjoyng a bit more sick fame to stop talking to the Daily Mirror. She has and now it is the Express. Apparently in 2008 Mccann detectives found this man and filmed him! His hair and facial hair was different but Gran Cooper still recognised his goofy teeth, he was just unloading stuff for a market stall, that is if it was even the same man.

This sick and absurd nonsense needs to stop!


viv said...

One thing is for sure, as soon as May comes around Sean and Amelie will not be seeing much of Mummy and Daddy.

They are apparently in Portugal and have been interviewed once more by Sandra Filgueiras, she smirks and looks with disbelief but clearly the Mccanns get well paid for this. It is pretty much a rendition of Kate gesticulating with her hands and arms about slamming doors and whooshing curtains.

The only new thing appears t be an attempt to try and explain why Kate just ran off and left the twins alone with the door open to raise the alarm. Gerry says well yes it is drummed into in medical training got a problem shout for help, but still he says that is what any normal person would have done. Erm immediately realised an abductor had come in through the window and stolen Madeleine and made off with her, hit me with that one more time, Gerry, any normal mom would have gone running off and left the twins with the window and the door open so they could have been taken as well?

I am sorry but how can you expect the police or anyone to believe you!


viv said...

The reality is Gerry any normal mom would have screamed the place down but no way would you drag her away from the other two!

viv said...

But that is a purely hypothetical question because we are not talking about any normal mom here, let alone doctor.

We are talking about one who says she went out five nights in a row, leaving her three children under 4 alone in an unlocked apartment, with a huge drop down to the garden below from the patio door that was left open and then a swimming pool and then the sea.

We are talking about a mom who sat there that night and told her "friends" about how concerned she was leaving Madeleine alone with the door open but on her own admission waited until 10 pm to go and see if they were alright.

We are talking about a mom who told the police the next day and has gone on telly and said it too, Madeleine asked us that morning where you mummy when we were crying but in spite of that was cruel enough to just go and leave her again with the door open and completely alone in a strange apartment in the dark. A little girl who they knew had a sleep disorder and kept waking up.

A mom who is trained in anaesthetics and so is her mate, but when the twins just would not wake up they did not even bother to examine their pupils and try and see what was wrong with them, let alone get them to hospital for proper checks.

So we are not talking about just some normal mom, are we Gerry. If Kate was anything like a normal mom, Madeleine would be just fine.

viv said...

So we have the totally credible Gran Cooper and Kate and Gerry McCann getting paid to swan around in Portugal giving useless interviews for the Third Anniversary Special. I am sure that will be a real big help to little Maddie.

viv said...

Interestingly Gran Cooper was apparently staying in a "two million pounds villa" (it did not look quite that grand to me) with some friends, but she also visited the Ocean Club because she had some friends staying there as well, ummm. But did she go home just before they arrived?

hope4truth said...

Morning Viv

If Maddie was taken by a peadop and has been in hell for three years her parents deserve to spend eternity in hell....

The game playing spinning and twisiting of time lines is a discrace and can only have ensured she stays in hell longer than she needed to.

In one of the posts Kate was 37 seconds away from her child now I know she likes to run but that is some stretch of the imagination.... Also they have another video clip of the (few) steps Kate took to get to her child and a computer image of the apartment...

As the steps stop the lights go on and then I was horified (all over again) as it clearly shows the front entrence to the apartment would have been so easy for a child to walk out of or for someone to break into with no chance of viewing it from the tapas bar....

Rachel did not like retruning to her apartment as it was dark (and when she did she sniffed through the door to see if her baby had soiled itself) Mother of the Year material there.....

My sane mind wont let me belive it was pre planned before they got out there or that she was going to be handed over to a loving family...

Yet I would not be surprised if she turned up tomorrow morning with a note for her parents apologising and telling the world she had not been harmed....

This has never been about finding her it has been about proving her parents did not hide her body....

Well I hope she does turn up somewhere happy and well and has had the best three years of her life..... For Kate and Gerry if that is what they did they have to bring her back because deep down she will know who she was and they cant afford to have her shouting the odds when she is older about who she really is....

If she was adopted I think their well meaning friends really dropped them in it with all the media this would have gone away now and they could have lived the life they thought would be better in peace....

Now they have no choice but to defend themselves yet every time they do they look guilty all over again....

Di said...

Hi all

I can't believe Gran Cooper has been wheeled out again spouting utter rubbish it is just a rehashed old article, shame on DE.

Does anyone else remember someone on 3A's I think, saying Kate was in hospital after an attempted suicide?

I have watched the new video that has been released by the McCanns to mark the 3rd anniversary. I have to say if Jon Corner chose the pictures of Madeleine for the video I would be very concerned about his motive. Does anyone else think the chosen pictures are inappropriate or am I reading more into this than necessary.

Di said...

Just had a look around and it would seem I am not the only one questioning the photos. Interestingly even Mark William Thomas thinks the same and says they were ill advised.

viv said...

Hiya Hope

They certainly make it look as though this is about proving they did not hide her body, because the desperation of re-introducing a sighting, not of Madeleine, but of some creepy man, before Madeleine was even in PDL is palpable.

This is about them doing the rounds again to drum up some more hard cash, getting paid for telling us yet again how the curtains went whoosh, curtains that were behind the bed and the chair and so could not have gone whoosh. I do not think the McCanns care less how stupid all of this sounds, just so long as they get paid for it and can have a nice free jolly in Portugal at the same time, away from the twins. Me time is obviously still important.

Di, I think any reasonable person, looking at the genuine last pic of Madeleine, with the tennis balls from the Portuguese Police file and then looking at the red dress picture of Madeleine that is habitually used instead would just have to describe that as "highly inappropriate". They do not want Madeleine recognised and they just want to cash in and appeal to the wrong sort of people.

viv said...

Di, I wonder if they are now seeking to deal with any revelation that may be made about Kate's mental health?

She insists she does not think that way now?

The Camerons say Kate was "very ill" when she was having the twins and they had to keep on looking after little Maddie, going over to Holland for that purpose.

Gerry and Philomena clearly imply she could never be left alone to care for all three children. Someone had to make an airflight to be with them if Gerry was away, this is quite bizarre!

What caused Kate to be "very ill" when she was having the twins? Could it have been the prospect of having yet more children to try and cope with, the shock of knowing this time it was twins? You do not need a scan for that to be diagnosed!

viv said...

It would be nice if the Camerons decided to speak a little more frankly to the police, given they clearly spent a lot of time caring for little Maddie, even as a baby.

But it does pay to bear in mind it could have been some physical illness that happens to pregnant women, but I am struggling to think of one that could not be pre-existing and would make the mother "very ill".

Kate clearly has no serious physical illness..like high blood pressure or kidney disease.

viv said...

Di, I had a look on Twitter and I think Mark Williams Thomas is questioning the appropriateness of a sick fake picture of Madeleine.

There are some very sick people about, that is for sure!

S.B. said...

You may remember my post on Morais blog where I expressed my disgust at the way the media and populace always look for a scapegoat, usually by disgracing the police, social services the NHS etc. I do not refute my opinion generally but I entirely agree with your illustration highlighting the failure of social services, especially when a case of abuse has been known to them for so many years. I am aware of the inadequacy of the system in this respect but I think sometimes people are too hard on the authorities, especially when looking for someone to blame for their own shortcomings. Any dealings I have had with said authorities have always been on the periphery so my opinion is based purely on how I perceive any one situation, mostly extracted from the press whom leave a lot to be desired!

I was going to move on to ask your opinion as to why a child/teenager (assuming same to be of an age to understand right from wrong) would allow her/himself to be persistently abused without seeking help or refuge outside of the domicile. You pre-empted my question by explaining that the particular child was said to be brainwashed. How unbelievably tragic ~ what evil scum roams the earth!

In such cases, it is very difficult for me to understand why other family members or neighbours do not suspect something is wrong. I realise they would not open their doors to spectators nor chat about what they do to all and sundry but it nonetheless surprises me that people seem to be so complaisant about so serious a crime. Surely there are indications that can be spotted by outsiders! But of course paedophilia is a massive widespread problem ~ too massive to be eradicated!

viv said...

hiya SB

Actually this child did speak out in 2001 saying she did not want to go back to her father. That is a perennial problem when children say they do not like their parents they should be believed and not forced to return to them.

But paedophiles are manipulative and domineering. They will train the child to make them feel this is what they always wanted and if they tell anyone they will get themselves into big trouble and they will have no one to "love" them any more etc. To a sad child who has never known any better that can make a lot of sense.

It is just not right to fail to listen to the child or to blame the child at all when this happens to them. The only people who are to blame are the adults that subjected them to it and really do know better. They may try to convince themselves that is what the child wanted, they were not doing that child any harm, but they know the reality. These people are generally not mentally ill at all, just personality disordered. So they do have the capacity to know right from wrong.

I was just quering a new image that has been put out of Madeleine, I did not think it had originated from the McCanns it is so sick, but actually it does. She is plastered in blue eye shadow etc, it is just horrible.

viv said...

Social workers had clearly investigated this case many times and just not believe her.

I think by the time she got to 14 she knew perfectly well what was happening to her was sick and abusive and she desperately wanted to be believed and find a way out.

Publishing the pictures is the route she chose, that saved her having to speak to anyone and being called a liar again. I think it is just heartbreaking for this child.

viv said...

Neighbours are not usually experts in child abuse and so may not spot the signs.

But this may said he was withdrawing her from school in 2007 to home educate her, that coupled with bruises that had previously been noted upon her should have been more than enough to raise the most massive red flags and finally save her, but no, it went on for another three years.

It is incredibly common for abusive parents not to want to send their children to school. If social workers simply made it a golden rule that in each and every case of that type they did properly investigate, countless thousands of abused children could be saved. It is not always the parents fault, sometimes as a child grows older they just will not go to school, but so often it is, most particularly when it is coming from the parent, they want to educate the child at home.

Di said...

Hi Viv

Exactly, that is the picture of Madeleine with blue eye shadow that Mark W Thomas is talking about.

What is going on?

viv said...

Kyrah Ishaq and her siblings were withdrawn from school for home education.

By the time social workers burst in, Kyrah was dying through starvation and abuse, too late to save her life. The other siblings did survive.

There is simply no excuse for authorities saying they do not know this is one big red flag.

viv said...

Hiya Di

Judging by the attacks I have been getting, which are actually much worse than I publically disclose, I think the McCanns are very worried about me flagging up the changing hair colours, subtle makeup jobs, posed and carefully placed images of Madeleine at such a tender age.

This picture is maybe to try and address that, the makeup is so gary it could be said that Madeleine did it herself. This has often been an excuse the McScammers want to put forward, oh come come she has not been made up by adults she was just playing makeup as little girls do, now we have an image to fit that. But we know Gerry is rather good at photoshopping, who can say whether it is real or not?

Di said...

Hi Viv

I understand what you are saying. My daughter used to watch me putting makeup on when she was Madeleine's age, she would only ever want lippy.

Personally, I would say Madeleine did not apply that eyeshadow, it is too perfect, but as you say, maybe Gerry is playing games with photoshop.

viv said...

Hiya Di

Masses of thick blue eye shadow is a bit of a stereotypical image a prejudiced and angry male may hold.

I do not think the fashion conscious lady Kate would have that particular shade?

viv said...

I do also agree that a little girl only about 3 would not even make such a good job of it as that, it would be a real mess. I can remember having a go when aged about nine and it was a lot worse than that and I was very embarrassed when my Aunt saw me, lol!

viv said...

Horrified classmates defend 'hero' pupil arrested for killing neighbour 'who attacked his mother'

By Steve Farrell
Last updated at 2:23 PM on 2nd May 2010

* Add to My Stories

James Killen

Arrested: Sixth-former James Killen is accused of killing a neighbour who is thought to have attacked his mother

The friend of a teenager arrested on suspicion of murder described him as a 'hero' today for trying to defend his mother from a knife attack.

Schoolboy James Killen, 18, was held by police after next-door neighbour Jonathan London, 46, died of stab wounds.

It is believed Mr London attacked the teenager's mother, former air stewardess Sandra Crawford, at her home in St Alban's, Herts on Friday.

Mr Killen was arrested on suspicion of stabbing to death Mr London but later released on bail.

It is believed the teenager, a student at nearby Sandringham School, attacked Mr London after he discovered him slashing his mother.

Today his close friend Ben Riddell, 18, also from St Albans, said 'kind and gentle' James was desperately trying to defend his petite mother.

Ben, a fellow sixth-form pupil at Sandringham, said James came downstairs and initially thought his mother was being punched repeatedly by Mr London.

He said: 'James is one of the kindest, most gentle people I've ever known.

'I went to the station last night for when James was released. I spoke to him very briefly and we brought him a KFC and some clothes. He was crying.

'Apparently at 8.40am on Friday morning the man just walked in off the street and James came downstairs to his mum's screams and thought the man was punching her.

'He jumped on his back and got the knife and managed to kill him. James panicked and was running down the street and got arrested at the end of the road.

'James' dad was at the police station but no one saw James until he got let out 12 hours later. He can't go back to his house or get his clothes or his phone.

'He went to see his mum in hospital yesterday. She has had heart surgery and is still heavily sedated.

'There had been no problems before whatsoever. My grandmother knows the Londons and apparently they are the nicest family. It's horrible situation for everyone.

'I've known James and his mum since I was three and have played football with him in the same team for ten years.

'It was a freak tragedy and James was a hero for getting his mum's attacker off her and for killing him.'

Jonathan London's elderly parents Jack and Maureen lived next door, and was described by his sister-in-law Jane London as epileptic and on medication.

Yesterday, an au pair described the bloody aftermath of the fight.

viv said...

Livia Frakas, a 27-year-old au pair from Slovakia, was taking her employer’s two children to school when she heard a man’s ‘furious yell’ before finding Ms Crawford ‘covered in blood’ outside her £600,000 home in St Albans, Herts.

She said: ‘She was in a nightdress and pyjamas, blood was everywhere, all over her body and her face as well.’

She said a younger man, believed to be James, then emerged from the house looking ‘shocked and desperate’.

She added: ‘He was crying for help. He was in his school uniform. He was on the phone to the ambulance and I heard him give the name of the road.’

Police said there was no evidence of an ongoing dispute between the neighbours and they could find no reason for the attack.

Other neighbours described their shock as the drama unfolded.

One said: ‘Officers were getting out of the car with guns, there were paramedics on the scene – we just didn’t know what was going on.
st albans

Ambulances and police gather at the scene of the attack in St Albans

Then an air ambulance landed in a field at the local school – it was absolute chaos.’

He added that Ms Crawford and her son were ‘nice people, quiet, they keep themselves to themselves generally’.

Another nearby resident, who was walking his dog past the house as paramedics treated one of the victims, said: ‘I saw somebody on the lawn, they were trying to revive them.

‘There was a young lad there in a bit of a state.’

Police said Mr Killen had been bailed to ‘a date in June’ and they were not looking for anyone else in connection with the attack.

Sources at Hertfordshire Partnership NHS Foundation Trust said Mr London was known to take medication to control epilepsy. The source also revealed there were no records to suggest he had received any treatment at a mental health institution.

Another schoolfriend of James, who refused to give his name, said he is studying for his A-levels and is planning to go to university.

He said: ‘I have grown up with James and he is the nicest, most peaceful
person I know.

‘Nobody would have anything bad to say about him and I know he’s never had a violent encounter in his life.’

Ms Crawford is being treated at Addenbrooke’s Hospital, Cambridge.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1270395/First-picture-boy-killed-save-mother.html#ixzz0mnkdEw3s

viv said...

This sounds to me like a very brave young man who fought desperately to save his mother's life.

I hope he will be treated with care and sympathy and no criminal prosecution of him ensue. I would be honoured if one of my own children had saved me in that way.

viv said...

and another bizarre story from Leicester, in what sounds like perhaps a male going for the ex and getting the current one to assist in his murderous plans.

No one should really be surprised at what other humans may be capable of. Have you ever watched how incredibly savage chimpanzees can be to their own kind, not just other monkeys of a different species?

Man charged with kidnap and attempted murder after stabbing outside primary school

By Daily Mail Reporter
Last updated at 3:57 PM on 2nd May 2010

* Add to My Stories

A man has been charged with kidnap and attempted murder after a woman was stabbed outside a primary school, police said today.

Officers were called to Gwendoline Drive, in the Countesthorpe area of Leicestershire at 8.50am on Friday.

A spokesman for Leicestershire Police said a 31-year-old woman sustained 'a number of stab wounds' in the incident, near Greenfield Primary School.
Greenfield Primary School Countesthorpe.jpg

A 31-year-old woman was stabbed on Friday morning outside Greenfield Primary School (pictured)

She was treated in hospital and later discharged.

A 32-year-old man was charged with kidnap and attempted murder last night and will appear before magistrates in Leicester tomorrow.

Police said a 26-year-old woman was also arrested in connection with the incident.

She was later released on bail.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1270528/Man-charged-kidnap-attempted-murder-stabbing-outside-primary-school.html#ixzz0mnp4y3aN

hope4truth said...

I hope he is not put through a trial this boy is a hero who through no fault of his own has had to do the unthinkable and kill another human being...

I would imagine this poor boy will be haunted by what he has done for the rest of his life.

He saved his Mother and if I was in his position I hope I would have the strength to protect my family from anyone trying to hurt them...

Poor boy I hope his mother recovers very soon

Di said...

Hi Viv

I also hope James is treated kindly, I would be very proud if he was my son and fought for my life in that way.

Good on James friends for speaking up for him. I also wish his mum a speedy recovery.

S.B. said...


You took the words out of my mouth ~ or almost!

No doubting that the Mccanns follow blogs to ascertain what people are saying about them. Everytime there is a discussion topic that can be considered dangerous to their subterfuge, they counter-attack by issuing some fabricated explanation in an attempt to extricate themselves. My first thoughts about this photograph and it's origin ~ the inevitable "innocent explanation" for any evidence that the police may or may not have found!

Again I say, they have run out of options and are very desparate so their attempts at self preservation have become so predictable and more to the point transparent!

S.B. said...

Thanks for taking time out to elaborate on the subject of domestic violence and child abuse. It is indeed a very complex area of expertise and not something I should like to pursue.

You have helped me by clarifying certain points I raised but obviously there are so many different aspects to the subject it would be impossible for me to fully understand all the implications.

Di said...

Hello Hope

I cannot imagine what James is going through at this moment, as you say, through no fault of his own.

I agree, he is a HERO and should be commended for saving his mothers life.

hope4truth said...

Hello Di

Lets hope the police have quesioned him so they have all the facts and when it is passed to the CPS it is thrown out....

I dont want the world to thrive on vigalanties but what can you do when someome is hurting someone else especialy if you love them?

If somone broke in here I would do everything I could to protect my girls and I belive I have the right to do that in my own home even if the CPS may still prosecute me (but I would go to jail for life if my girls were safe)....

viv said...

hiya all

Let us hope we do not have to start a blog for Justice for James!!

I can understand him not being allowed back to the home address because the man who died parents live next door. He was allowed out on bail and go and see his mum who he is obviously devoted to, bless him.

He is bailed until a date in June and so it rather sounds like that is to give the Crown Prosecution Service time to make a considered decision as to what should happen in his case.

The law basically says you are allowed to fight fire with fire. That man was using a knife on his mother and so the means of defence was reasonable.

If that man had just been punching his mother and James had armed himself with a knife then he would be in trouble for using disproportionate force. But that is clearly not the case here, it is a genteel young man, just 18 years completely overtaken with fear for his mother and acting very bravely.

Di said...

Hello Hope

I totally agree, the problem we have these days is what is "reasonable force".

We live in a rural area and are quite isolated. Our alarm went off which goes through to the police. It rings silently so we had no idea it had gone off. They do ring but if no response send a response team out.

The police arrived at our gates and when they realised there was no threat, promptly told us that because our wrought iron gates had spears on the top we could be prosecuted if a burglar climbed over and fell on the spears.

A month later we had another false alarm, the police arrived again. My son went to the gate along with our dogs. The rule is the police have to enter the property, they took one look at our dogs and said, "we think you are in good hands"

This country has gone mad. As far as I am concerned if said burglar climbs over my 10 foot high gates and spears himself in the process tough.

viv said...

Hiya SB

Well yes it is true, the interaction between domestic violence and child abuse is a very complex one. But when you think about it, sexually abusing a child is a form of controlling violence. If you have the sort of makeup and personality that would allow you to do that to a child, you have the sort of makeup that would dominate and control anyone else that stood in your way or put you at risk of prosecution.

I did struggle to even accept at first that this new video came from the McCanns because I just find it so utterly appalling. That dreadful picture of Madeleine plastered in makeup right next to the one that I have always refused to put on this blog because it would be a turn on to paedophiles.

To me this is sick and it is very desperate. I would not like to hazard a guess really exactly who they are appealing to with this.

Di said...

Posted by HiDeHo worth a read as always.


hope4truth said...


The country has gone mad there is not a single reason anyone would need to climb over your gates....

Yes I can understand him not being allowed home as well if the man lived next door....

I wonder what happend??? What makes a neighbour attack a woman in such a way???

viv said...

Hiya Di,

Well I certainly think a burglar should think twice before attempting your property by the sound of things.

As far as the 10' spiked gates and the dogs go, a latin phrase springs to mind, volenti non fit injuria.

Roughly translated you voluntarily assumed the risk and so cannot seek to blame someone else for it!

Di said...


No idea in this case, but drugs I think plays a big part of the downfall of our society.

viv said...

It will be interesting to learn why this man attacked his neighbour as he did, a diminutive woman to boot! All we are told is he is known to be an epileptic and is not known to have had mental health treatment.

It certainly sounds like a premeditated attack and worse than the average neighbour dispute.

Di said...

Hi Viv

Can I quote you on that when we have another false alarm and the police arrive, LOL

viv said...

Thanks Di for the link to Hideho,

Immediately we can see the discrepancies coming out in the varying statements of the McCanns, the reality is, according to an independent and reliable police witness who point blank refused to talk to the press, Mrs Fenn, it was just Madeleine that was crying. I am afraid that, and their wish to suggest it was also the twins is terribly sinister and I think goes right to the heart of this case:

During breakfast, Madeleine asked Kate why she had not gone into her room when the twins were crying, (Kate told Fiona that Madeleine asked her why when Madeleine and Sean were crying)
however, Gerry claims Madeleine asked HIM why he hadnt gone in when the twins were crying (but 6 days later he changed it to Madeleine asking Kate why she didnt go in when Madeleine and Sean were crying )-

viv said...

No Di, please do not quote me to the police, you may get me into trouble, lol!

The police are all too fond of warning householders not to harm burglars, that latin phrase is actually used in civil law, but really what liability should occupiers owe to criminal trespassers?

I do think we live in an age where people need to take care of their property and themselves and the sort of deterrent you have is reasonable.

viv said...

I remember when having to learn about cognitive behavioural programmes, a psychological approach to modifying offending behaviour, offenders will come out with "seemingly irrelevant details", but actually these should not be ignored because if the offender thought it appropriate to mention it within the context of that conversation, it is, in some way, relevant. The trick is to learn in what way it is relevant.

So was Kate fearful of them finding some stain on Madeleine's clothing and noting that great effort had been taken to remove it and how did that stain get on the clothing? I would hazard a guess Kate and Gerry are very hygienic and do not put their children to bed in the same pyjamas they have previously worn as suggested here.

During breakfast. "She noticed a stain, supposedly of tea, on Madeleine’s pijama top, which she washed a little later that same morning. She hung it to dry on a small stand, and it was dry by the afternoon. Madeleine sometimes drank tea; the stain did not appear during breakfast, maybe it happened another day, as Madeleine did not have tea the previous night and the stain was dry."

viv said...

It is as you suggested above SB, for every piece of evidence that may be found, the McCanns need to come up with an explanation for it.

That does explain their obsession with knowing the contents of British Agency files. If they do not know what has been found out, how can they defend themselves?

viv said...

But this awful picture they have just released of Madeleine apparently plastered in makeup, crudely applied is absolutely no explanation for so many pictures of her with different coloured hair shades, vastly different, growing out roots and very subtly applied makeup to enhance her appearance. Posed pictures which are just not natural to require of a two or three year old having their picture taken.

Three years down the line they realise from reading blogs like this just how utterly damaging the pictures are that they have sought to use of Madeleine that look nothing like she actually was at the time of disappearance in the tennis balls pic with dark hair and eyebrows, simply not a cute babyblond face. And it is equally damaging to put this out, three years later!

viv said...

This sick video with a collection of lolita shots of Madeleine is actually their 3rd Anniversary Campaingn and on their official webpage, I just had to check because I still could not quite believe it, it is so utterly repulsive.

There is no longer any trace whatosever on that webpage of the genuine last shot of Madeleine, the tennis balls pic on there, just how sick are this couple?

I hope and pray that justice is just around the corner for these two and they have finally cracked.


Poor little Madeleine, this video is just pure abuse IMO.

viv said...

Cleaners psychologically distressed and losing their jobs, hundreds of other children gone missing in UK in just 6 months, the Ocean Club fear to comment due to distortions in UK media, but all Kate and Gerry want to keep telling us about is their pain?

viv said...

Part transcript from RTV Portugal on Jo Morais blog:

Voice Over: In the UK, 800 children were reported missing in the six months after Madeleine’s disappearance. Every day, hundreds of children disappear in the world, but until today only Maddie deserved such a huge magnitude from the media. Three years after, the mystery continues to be unsolved. The same difficulty appears also in establishing what was the impact in Praia da Luz after the disappearance. The events stage, the Ocean Club, suffered great financial consequences: in April 2009, 21 of the 49 workers were sacked. In 2007, the year of the disappearance, the company had 130 employees. Dora Silva was one of the cleaners who has lost her job. In the dismissal letter, there were two arguments.

Dora Silva (former Ocean Club employee) - The crisis, worldwide and in consequence of the girl’s disappearance.

Voice Over: The drama has afflicted the whole family. Her sister, who had worked for 11 years at the Ocean Club was also fired at the same time. Today, she is convinced there was an exploitation of the tragedy, since she never felt a collapse in the holiday’s bookings.

Fátima Espada (former Ocean Club employee) – I do not think so [referring to the arguments used in the dismissal letter], because we kept on working as normal, after the girls’ disappearance. We did not feel any fall down, with apartments being booked, and daily admission of clients. Then the other motive they have alleged besides the crisis, I don’t know…

Voice Over: Maria Júlia, the mother of the two sacked employees, ended up asking recently the dismissal from the Ocean Club, after 16 years of working there. It was her who cleaned for the last time the McCann family apartment, just the day before to the girls disappearance.

Maria Júlia (former Ocean Club employee) – When I went there on Wednesday [2nd May 2007], they were there. It was they who opened the door for me, they told me to get in and then they told me that they were leaving. They even told me something about the balcony… yes… I understood that they were going to the balcony, and even thought they were going to the balcony. But no, they really left. They went out from that door, that door…the door that gives access to the garden [the balcony double glazed door] and that was it, they went out, never again… It was the only time that I was with them.

Voice Over: Just like her two daughters, Maria Júlia was also heard by the Judiciary Police. Madeleine’s disappearance will accompany her for the remaining of her days. One of the main reasons to stop working [at the Ocean Club] was the fact of being psychologically distressed.

Maria Júlia - Very, very much. It was something that disturbed me a lot, because I was aggrieved, I had just lost my husband a few months before, and then that happened, in that house were I worked… and that troubled me. I had a good supervisor, the supervisor that was then there, she knew how I felt and she was very supportive for me.

Voice Over: The Ocean Club administration refused a request for an interview by RTP. In off, they explain delicately that they do not wish to revive the case and are afraid of the exploitation that the UK media might do of any statement they give.

viv said...

May 3, 2010
Three Years Later: Where's Madeleine McCann?
Parents Say Portuguese Police Not Following Up on New Leads; Criminal Profiler Pat Brown: Girl Should Have Been Seen By Now
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Madeleine McCann (CBS)


Where's Maddie?

Track the events since the May 3, 2007, disappearance of Madeleine McCann.
New Video Out in Search for Maddy McCann
Maddie McCann's Parents Keep Hope Alive
(CBS) This is the third anniversary of the disappearance of young British girl Madeleine McCann, who vanished from her family's holiday resort in Portugal in May 2007. She was three at the time.

But, in spite of a huge international police operation, there are still no real leads on what might have happened to Madeleine, according to CBS News correspondent Elizabeth Palmer.

Over the years, there have been hundreds of supposed sightings of Madeleine, but not one of them has panned out. Her parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, still hope she'll one day be found alive and have released a new video to mark the anniversary.

The video's focus is the McCanns' search for their daughter. Palmer says the family has long been handing out posters and photos, combing the Internet, and responding to tips from the public.

The couple has also spoken out in an interview on Portuguese TV about what they observed the night Madeleine was last seen.

Kate McCann said, "The shutters, which had been down all week, when I went in and there was the gust that blew the curtains open, that's when I noticed that the shutter had been pulled up."

On the night of May 3, 2007, the McCanns left their three children sleeping in the family's vacation condo, and went to dinner at a restaurant 100 yards away.

Around 10:00 p.m., when Kate McCann went to check on the children, she found Madeleine was gone.

The McCanns have dismissed a theory that she wandered off. They are convinced she was abducted.

Gerry said in the recently released video, "If you're saying is it theoretically possible that Madeleine left the apartment? Then yes. Do we believe it -- and do we believe she was capable of leaving the apartment the way it was found -- then I would say absolutely not."

Since 2007, several photos of Madeleine have been widely publicized. One shows her distinctive right eye, and another is a projection of how she might look two years on.

The McCanns say they will ask the Portuguese police to re-open the investigation into Madeline's disappearance to follow up what they say are new leads uncovered by private investigators hired by the McCann family.

viv said...

Pat Brown, a criminal profiler, said on "The Early Show" Monday that a combination of factors has contributed to where things stand in the McCann case.

"(One theory) was that the child was abducted. And another theory was that she died in the apartment, and this, of course, is the theory the McCanns aren't too happy about. And they don't want that one out there," Brown said.

"And so they're still angry at the Portuguese police. And this is one thing I don't think they should bring up at this point in time. After three years when they're looking to get the cooperation of the police, it's not the time to say, 'You're not following up our leads.' And they also mentioned that it's possible they aren't following up the leads because they don't want the child to be found alive, because that would be embarrassing. Not what you want to say. You want to keep it positive and ask for somebody's help and not bring anything negative into the conversation."

As for the McCanns' supposed leads, Brown said she hasn't heard of any actually getting anywhere.

"Ever since the very beginning, when they have believed that the private investigators had great leads that weren't being followed up on, I never saw that they panned out to be anything. And they're saying that there's other leads that aren't being followed up, and I don't know what those are, and I don't think anybody really does. I don't know what leads they could be finding at this point in time."

Brown added, if the McCanns are innocent of any wrongdoing, they will continue to search for Madeleine.

"They're always going to believe their child is out there. That would be normal for any parent whose child has gone missing. They're not going to give up on her. So they're doing the right thing in the sense that they're trying to keep her in the public eye."

However, Brown added, "Quite frankly, this child has been seen everywhere. I mean, as far as missing children go, she's one of the most publicized missing children in the world. So that's one of the most unusual things about this: With her picture out as much as it's been out there, she would have to be pretty well hidden for her not to have shown up at this point."

viv said...

Gerry McCann: The Portuguese Police certainly do not think we were involved. We were with a large group of people and there is absolutely no way we were involved in this abduction:


I notice that ITN are featuring the McCanns latest sick video but whilst the BBC do feature the blue eye shadow picture and mention the video they have no link to it on their webpage. It would seem that even UK media, in general find this just a step too far by the McCanns and are perhaps not happy to feature it?

Does being with a large group of people mean you can do no wrong?

viv said...

I still find it curious and fascinating the sheer number of times that Gerry in particular insists they were not involved in the abduction of Madeleine, sometimes he says "disappearance".

viv said...

He was certainly deluding himself telling us the Portuguese Police did not suspect him, he knew full well that they did and the British too!

viv said...

If the McCanns had just gone to Portugal as a family, rather than as part of that large group and Madeleine had just disappeared, the case would have seemed far more straightforward.

It is therefore interesting that when directly confronted on German TV the first words out of his mouth are we were in a large group of people. That tells me he thought that would be a good cover and a good way to obfuscate and confuse, spread the suspicion etc.

hope4truth said...

I have come to the conclusion that Gerry and Kate McCann are extreamly sick people....

They have been bleating on about the important clues they have and how they want the investigation re opened and yet have they asked for this to happen yet?????

How dare they leave their daughter a few more weeks days hours or minutes without the chance of being rescued as the clues they have had to be kept until the 3rd anniversary of the night they say she was taken...

Their peado video to mark the occasion has started me wondering just what they were up to on that holiday because if they think these images are acceptable of a 3 year old child it is no wonder they keep telling us she is in a peado hell hole but they have no reason to belive she has been harmed...

Do they belive that there is nothing wrong with being a Peadophile????

It is the only explanation I can come up with and I feel sick and discusted by it....

viv said...

Hiya Hope

In the Daily Mail it tells us it is a picture of Maddie playing dressing up, enjoying herself, but she does not look very happy, does she, as ever she seems to be adopting a wholly unnatural pose for a three year old. Was this picture actually taken as Maddie caught raiding her mother's things at Rothley? It does not look like it from the background.

But most telling of all, why is it just a picture of her face?

If you had just caught a child on camera playing dressing up you would not just catch their face, you would not catch them with that downwards looking strange expression and you most certainly would have to zoom in by a huge amount to miss the rest of a little girl just three in the shot!

But for me, it is not just this one shot that horrifies me, it is the association of shots in that film

hope4truth said...

This week has also been a week for the McCanns to tell the world that we bloggers (who are not paid by the keystroke) or the few genuine people for what ever reason really belive parents would act the way they have if a child is missing..... Would be embaresed if Maddie came back and I think there was a hint of some people in authority also dont want her to come back....

Then we are all placed in the same league as the sick idiots on facebook who have been telling sick jokes about Maddie.....

And to top it all off they launch a sick picture of her looking like a teenage chav and no doubt we will all be labled as perverted for finding it totaly wrong....

Yes they are now getting desprate and it is not to find their child they once again need to blame everyone else including it would seem God as poor Gerry the good Catholic Boy has had is faith tested.....

Yet still not a word on if Maddie will have had her faith tested and if she is frightend scared and all alone....

They are desprate to blame Hewlit yet have still not despaired that she may have starved to death while he was dying in hospital...

Still they have their clues and they want to re open the investigation I now just want to know when they think they can be bothered to share their hot clues and if the investigating police force they choose will think they are worth following up or will it be another Aussie Spice and the Private Dicks they have on the pay roll have not even bothered to investigate fully????

hope4truth said...

No Viv she does not look at all happy in that picture and does not look thrilled in a lot of them...

Just looked up and on a shelf in my lounge is a picture of my yongest aged 3 in a brides dressing up set she has her arms open wide and is laughing her head off in the picture no make up she was beautiful enough...

I think they played with my make up and tried it out but when they played dress up they did just that dressed up.... Actually the reason they did not have make up in their dressing up box was because I did not want them covering themselves and my house with it...

The picture of Maddie is of a child after an adult has put make up on her and there is nothing wrong with that but the picture is creepy....

To have the words "A grown up looking Maddie" underneath it on Sky was an insult and wrong but that was SKYs line not the McCanns....

S.B. said...

Hi viv....,

Yes, big question ~ why did they travel as part of this large group? I raised this very question on another blog some while ago but as usual I was bombarded with negative replies from apparent Mccann sympathizers!

A group from different parts of the country all join together for a one week holiday, on the surface a family holiday but with little or no evidence of this on the part of Kate and Gerry. All day, every day their children in the crèche and evenings spent alone in a dark, lonely apartment, not what I call a normal family holiday ~ but of course everybody does it don't they?

They were not all close friends; in fact some of them were comparative strangers so why go to all the effort of organizing such a diverse group to holiday for only 1 week. Maybe because I am not gregarious but I have always thought this to be very suspect. From their garbled statements they don't appear to have spent much time together as a group, apart from the nightly trips to the restaurant so again, why did they bother to holiday together?

S.B. said...


You said a few posts back that you think drugs form part of the decline of the U.K.

I am currently having a battle with the BBC about the standard of programming produced by the BBC and associated authors.

Living outside of the U.K. I am only able to subscribe to a BBC worldwide channel, therefore viewing is limited to say the least. However, judging by the standard of programmes I see I am convinced that half the country are social drug participants.

This is particularly relevant to this blog because one of my complaints is a so called comedy called 'The League of Gentlemen'. One night it was on in the background and I happened to look at the screen and to my horror, crudely painted on the side of a van were the words 'get inside a child today'! Is that not beyond belief? Apart from that I have seen cruelty involving animals, perverted sex acts and the use of children in many scenes.

Need I say more?

Di said...

Hi all


I have not seen the comedy but I am appalled by what you have witnessed. Good on you for taking it up with the BBC.

My sister-in-law teaches in a primary school, which is in quite an affluent area. Over the last two years they have had an alarming increase in children dealing drugs in the school and playground. When she was telling me I just assumed it would probably be the 11/12 year olds. No we are talking here of 5/7 year olds. When the parents are informed it is the same old excuse, they must have pinched them from their old brother/sister but they don't know what they are. I beg to differ when they are asking for money.

Sadly the school are powerless as the children are so young, but the parents attitude is beyond belief.

Di said...

If the McCann's thought their latest video was going to show the world they are still searching and need more money to continue the search, I think they are in for a shock.

Reading peoples comments has been interesting. Many posters who would not previously entertain the idea that Madeleine could have been an abused child are completely changing their minds after seeing the pictures.

hope4truth said...

Hello Di

I have wondered if something darker was going on with poor maddie the crying Mrs Fenn heard shouting Daddy Daddy is chilling...

Was Kate hurting her and she wanted her Daddy to stop it?

Was Gerry Hurting her and she was begging him to stop?

Was someone else hurting her and she was calling out to Daddy for help?

Then there is the Gaspers statement and if Gerry was comfortable with Payne talking about his child in such a way something is very very wrong....

I have tried to look at this as if Maddie had an accident and they panicked and tried to cover it up...

But their latest antics have disturbed me and I have to wonder if social services are doing what they should for the twins...

Too many children are let down by SS and I hope to god I am wrong...

viv said...

Hiya Hope

I know little girls love to play dressing up, my grand daughters certainly have loads of stuff for that purpose but it does not involve makeup. I have never actually associated the idea of makeup with a 3 year old at all, maybe I am just old fashioned. As you say, if you allowed a child that little to play with makeup it would be trashed and so would your house!

I know my sister and I used to have a great time at my nans as well, she had a business making wedding dresses and other finery, which we just loved to try on! It was a big old house with a yard leading down to my grand fathers business making wrought iron gates. It was one of those places children just adore, nooks and crannies in the house, the sheds, the garden, what a great mooch we used to have and a nan on that side (my father's mom) who simply never told us off.

I just do not get the scenario of Maddie being allowed to play with makeup at all, I do think this is to cover the fact that they have been producing a lot of very strange images of Madeleine with dyed hair and makeup, quite expertly done. I would not be surprised if that blue eye shadow actually got done on a computer by someone with the skill to do it, e.g. Jon Corner.

Just so they can say look see, it is not who make Maddie up, she used to do it herself.

The other really odd thing is, this is one of the oldest looking images we have ever seen of Madeleine, and again, looks nothing like the painted little two year old with the expertly tinted red hair.

I think they act out of desperation as as Di says, people are just even more shocked and further make the associations with paedophilia that presumably they are seeking to avoid.

In fact it is a pretty standard mentality, we cannot take the blame, blame the child, she was plastering herself in makeup, I really do not think so!

S.B. said...

I have just left the findmadeleine site having seen the latest Gerald "marketing ploy". No doubt he will soon be crowing about the number of hits since the video was featured, well sorry to disappoint you Mr Mccann but I only visited your site as I was curious to see how low you are prepared to go before you abandon the sick game you are playing.

But no! you won't do that will you, because you still believe you are smart enough to outwit anybody that tries to stand in your way. I think you have now proved to the world that you a capable of any ploy to avoid justice, including sensualizing your own daughter with total disregard for her memory or the well being of your remaining children.

Well Mr Mccann, I fear you have revealed the raw, ugly side of your personality which is something you will never be able redeem but I doubt if you care much about that either. However, dispite your obvious complaisance and self confidence you cannot escape the inevitable - think of this - 'you can run but you cannot hide'!

Bonne chance!

Di said...

Hello Hope

I always believed that Madeleine had an accident as well, but now when I read Mrs Fenn's statement about Madeleine crying for over an hour and the crying stopping immediately when her parents supposedly returned, I find that very odd.

I can remember leaving my children with a babysitter, known to them, when they were young. When we returned my daughter was extremely upset, she would have been about two at the time. After the babysitter left it look me at least half an hour to calm her down. I should also say my son was also up as he had been woken by the crying.

I still believe sedation went on, I also believe Mrs Fenn when she says it was only Madeleine crying. That is why I believe Kate & Gerry are saying Sean & me crying etc., because they know there is no way the twins would not have woken up had they not been sedated.

I dread to think what was actually going on that night and I hate myself for thinking something sinister was possibly happening to Madeleine, but one thing is for sure, T9 know. I hope one of them has a conscience and will tell the truth, it is never too late.

viv said...

hiya SB

Like Di, I have not see the comedy show you are referring to but it does sound rather shocking and good on your for complaining about it.

When you go back to the rogatories you can see the cops are very keenly interested in the rationale and thinking behind this group holiday. Just where was it all coming from and in the main it seems to be David Payne who was the main instigator with Fiona and Gerry having to persuade Kate it really was such a good idea.

Reading Payne's rog to the police is pretty fascinating. He seems to be admitting that he actually chose a holiday abroad where the all inclusive flights simply were not suitable and so Gerry paid the no doubt pretty substantial costs of booking additional flights to go from East Midlands.

Looking at it in that way and David saying how much pleasure he gets out of accommodating and pleasing everyone, I wonder if that is exactly what he was doing. The main four who were planning for Madeleine to disappear being the McCanns and the Paynes, undoubtedly very close friends.

But the thinking goes we can make this so much more confusing and less suspicious upon on if we include lots of others too. So accommodating David finds a holiday where the flights run from the London area. Now I quite regularly book holidays and the last thing I do, living in the Midlands is book a holiday where the flight is going from London, because I have been there done that and know what a hassle it is.

So what we are asked to believe is that David was the one choosing, booking and organising all of this, but he did so in relation to a holiday where the flights were simply not convenient at all. Did he do that because the Ocean Club itself was so perfect for their plans and they so desperately needed the rest of the group to come with them?

Why would Gerry, a canny Scotsman, with a wife who although potentially a high earner, was not in fact working, well would he be happy with having to pay all that extra because the flights were wrong? Would it not have made more sense to book some holiday where there are flights from East Mids or Birmingham, and I know there are plenty?

Of interest again here, David tried to explain to the Police why Portugal was chosen. He said it was early in the Season and so places like Turkey, Greece, Egypt were not yet open. That is just a blatant lie! He went at the end of April/beg May and all these venues are open at that time, most especially Egypt because it is actually pretty flipping hot there even at that time!

It rather looks like Mat /Rachel and Russ /Jane all decided to leave the Leicster area and head down South, why did they do that? It could simply be available consultant posts I suppose but there does seem to be a pattern of people ultimately having to move well away from Gerry McCann.

David used to work closely with him on research at the Leics Hospitals/University, but at the beginning of his rog is questioned by the police about his recent move. Uncanny, he had just stopped working in the Leics area and moved out to Derby, quite a hike to work if he still lived in Leics, but it would mean he no longer had to work with Gerry. Was this someone else who wanted to distance himself in early 2008 as both sets of police investigations were ongoing?

viv said...

Hiya Di

I am afraid I just completely agree with your last post, and yes, we want to be wrong, but most certainly that is not what it looks like.

Madeleine was due to start school and I have always felt that very sadly, in her particular case, that just could not be allowed to happen.

I also find it very sinister that the nannies describe what you would expect from an abused child, she was shy, subdued, nervous on the little boats. But Kate and Gerry seek to describe her as just the opposite, I believe they do that because they know exactly what they did to that poor little girl.

I was watching a video last night, I think it is on Jo's blog, mostly in Portuguese but there is a chap who was once a detective. He was saying exactly what you have just said really. He said something about there have been lots of twists and turns and he would not like to say exactly what he thinks this case entails, but, he was clear, these things do come out some years later, people develop a conscience, they cannot hold it in any longer and they start to talk, that is what he said will happen here. I think he is right.

Gerry has involved all of them and I do not think they are all involved to quite the same extent but they do know what happened. British Police can be brilliant, utterly brilliant, people should make no mistake about that. When push comes to shove, their tongues will loosen to try and save themselves.

viv said...

In fact I remain convinced that Gerry's determination since January 2009 to drag the case back to Portugal is due to his terror of what he faces here.

That is his last desperate escape route, a further delaying tactic to try and avoid the inevitable. If only he could persuade those Portuguese cops that any of his leads were real, that they should investigate someone else for the disappearance of Madeleine, he would be off the hook. But the Portuguese are working with the British against him and that is simply not going to happen.

Di said...

Hi Viv

I have not seen the video on Joanna's blog but will certainly have a look.

I have just read on twitter MWThomas is still waiting for a reply as to who advised the McCanns to use such inappropriate photographs of Madeleine for their video.

Another person has asked Mark to check out Paul Grover who they claim took the photographs of Madeleine and not Jon Corner. Interesting!

viv said...

Hiya Di

Will try to find the investigator, he was good and post you a link to it.

I do recall Grover had taken "professional" pictures of Madeleine.

This just is not right is it!

Here is Gerry saying he just has to convince the police, give it up Gerry you fool, why did you ever believe you could con and deceive all of these police officers, profilers, psychologists, they have overwhelming evidence it was you! Now you even put out a sick video of Maddie to suggest she made herself up!

Eye witnesses?

KM - We will not enter in any details so we don't place in danger our findings.
GM - I am not saying that we have someone who saw Madeleine. But leads take to other leads and we have to convince the police to investigate them.

Have you made a formal request to reopen the process?

GM - Not yet. But we will ask for the reopening of the process. Surely. That was what we came to Portugal to do., not that they have anything, totally desperate!

viv said...

here it is Di!


It is the same man who initially says please come to the Algarve but if you do so, please treat it as a family holiday and do not leave the kids,

then he says we think Madeleine is dead

then later more interesting comments still..


viv said...

The main things he says are about one third into the video, white haired tall ex pat, also playing drums at one one point. He also says what a wonderful place it is where he chose to live 23 years ago, but Portugal is very family oriented, don't come here and do that!

viv said...

The McCanns tell a lot of serious and inconsistent lies about the night Maddie was crying, heard by Mrs Fenn.

They try to change the night, they try to suggest on differing occasions it was the twins. On one occasion they even try to relate it to an incident when they were in bed.

This therefore tells us they are trying to hide a major piece of highly incriminating evidence here in relation to what was going on, on Tuesday 1 May, when Maddie was pitifully sobbing Daddy, Daddy for one hour and fifteen minutes.

That poor little girl.

viv said...

Amsterdam playgroup friend on 14 May 2007, at least seems to clear up why the Camerons described Kate as "very ill" when having the twins. Confined to bed throughout the pregnancy, again, poor little Madeleine. Then as Kate tells us, once she had the twins Maddie was "shrieking for attention". I think a 20 month old who had no mothering really could be forgiven for that!

Seija Rutter: "They came over because Gerry, errr... was working at the VU hospital doing some research - he's a cardiologist. So, that's the reason why they was over here. And, errr... when they fell pregnant with the twins they almost, errr... miscarried the twins and they were advised that, errr... Kate has to have complete bed rest for the rest of the pregnancy and I think at the time she was only 7 or 8 weeks pregnant, so they decided to move back to the UK so they could have support of friends and family around them."

Seija Rutter: "She's a very strong-willed child. She's, errr... very witty. Always was a happy child, always was a... ehhh. Just... just bubbly and... yeah. And I... I'd imagine right now that she's probably feeling very scared and being away from her family and... I just, yeah. I dread to think what she's going through right now... I just... "

viv said...

Well so much for Gerry's favourite paper The Sun printing his latest vile picture of Madeleine and sob stories for him and Kate, read it and weap you two, this is what Jo Public think: And Yes, we do think you have done a Karen Matthews, but you are just a bit smarter, no matter, police may not get you so fast, but they will!

With all sympathy and understanding to the McCann's grief.
But why so much concern and coverage on this one family?
Are they the only parents to have lost a child?
Thousands go missing every day around the world..aren't they just as important and precious as any young innocent who is missing?
Why is this one so special? is there something else going on here?
0 0 7:18PM, May 03, 2010Spooner

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2957499/Our-twins-keep-gifts-for-Maddie.html#mySunComments#ixzz0mucRd3Tm
Spare a thought for poor ( but a bit dim ) Karen Matthews. Her only crime was to try and do what the rest of the country thinks K&G have done.

I bet she would have been charged with abandonment on her return to the UK !
0 0 8:49PM, May 03, 2010tommy85
the make up is a bit unchildlike.. bad parents.
0 0 8:15PM, May 03, 2010hugo
one question ,,why do we never hear about the reward anymore?
0 0 8:11PM, May 03, 2010manager5

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2957499/Our-twins-keep-gifts-for-Maddie.html#mySunComments#ixzz0mucg0quI

viv said...

I just asked Luke to have a look at the makeup picture:

Oh my god no way did a little kid put that lot on!

Keesh said...

re: cheap package holidays, back in 2007-8, the best choice for the Mccann family would have been Thomsons Holidays, flying from Coventry. (Thomsons has since moved out of Coventry to EMA)

According to the Press, Gerry's first trip home 21 May 2007, used Coventry airport.

hope4truth said...

So the photo was not taken on the spur of the moment by Mum or Dad but was a profesional shot????

Very disturbing if true...

For my daughters 11th Birthday her Aunt bought her a phto shoot at a local studio and they put make up on her... But even at 11 years old it was all sparkle and very subtle it does not scream out in the pictures...

She felt special having it put on and had fun and the photos are a lovely reminder of her time there...

Had they plastered it on and had her looking at the camera in a seductive way I would have knocked the photographer off his feet...

So not an innocent shot of a child playing dress up at all...

FFS Social services need to wake up fast I know we are only supposed to worry about poor Gerry and Kate but one of their children is missing and two more are still in their care...

What the hell was going on and even if it turns out nothing was surley the twins should be protected just in case I know Gerry has told us Kate is never alone with the children but who is with them because so far their choices re child care and apropriate behaviour have been dangerous.... Do we need to hear Kates visions of pushing a button and it is all over come true or will someone step up and put the children first for once????

I have never felt like this before I cried for Kate when she was interviewed as I thought tragic accident dont take her away from her twins...

To find out Months later when I was feeling sorry for her she was sat arrogantly refusing to answer a single question for her child I realised what a mug I had been...

Now they are talking about clues and re openeing the case yet they have still to ask for that to happen and have still not shared these important clues...


They either know where she is or know she is dead I dont know if they abused her when she was with them but they are abusing her now if there is half a chance of finding her they would have shared anything worht sharing not just keep on about how clever they are and what they have found....

Very depressing and totaly tragic for a forgotten 3 year old child...

viv said...

Thanks Keesh, this is the point isn't it. Why would Midlands based families in fairly close proximity to East Midlands, Coventry and Birmingham International book packaged holidays flying from London and with, as they say, little tots to cope with. So to rectify that they then have to pay a pretty hefty sum for further flights, local. It just does not make sense!

viv said...

Hiya Hope

It is a horrible shot of Madeleine in a seductive pose, just of her head, even the top of her hair is cut off. Is that so that we do not see the dark hair roots? If she was supposedly dressing up, where is the rest of her and what was she wearing?

Not only does she have heavily applied eye shadow, she also has the usual carefully applied eyeliner.

In conjunction with the other shots depicting very clear sexualisation of her in that foul video it just makes me very upset and angry and more convinced that what I have always thought was right.

Wizard said...

Hi All,

Well…words almost fail me. The McCann have a bevy of highly paid media savvy people to assist them in dealing with the press and PR. What do they come up with for this year’s anniversary of her disappearance - a photograph of their daughter in a totally inappropriate pose for a campaign of this nature.

Dodgy private detectives, dodgy PR advice and a front man whose delivery puts everyone’s back up. Please……give me strength.

viv said...

Hello Wiz

I think it just goes to show that you can spend just as much money on lawyers, PR advisers, media manipulators, whatever you like. But, if you are inherently in the wrong and acting in an unlawful way, none of those advisers can actually extricate you from that situation.

I also get the feeling that sometimes the McCanns only listen to that advice with one ear open.

They have an overwhelming desire to defend themselves and it just gets more and more desperate.

I am sure no media savvy advisor would have told them to put out the latest film of Madeleine. It has actually been produced by Jon Corner, Kate's long term friend.

It seems to me that the McCanns know they are in big trouble and under a great deal of suspicion due to the nature of some of the pictures they have of Madeleine and the manner in which they have used them. It smacks of sheer child exploitation and hence the involvement, always, of CEOP.

It also seems to me that the McCanns are now so desperate they once again try to give the impression there is nothing actually wrong with these pictures and that heavy makeup was actually applied by Madeleine herself, a ridiculous notion and one they have only just sought to introduce by bringing out this image in conjunction with two others that are highly suggestive.

It is the constant need to defend themselves and the increased desperation of that, that forces the serious errors from them.

They do it time and time again and each and every time they do, they just show themselves up to the public in a progressively worse light.

I know that after the announced £1M action against Goncalo Amaral people were just saying, well it is now more than obvious what these two are about, making money out of Madeleine.

Now with these pictures they have released and in conjunction with the released statements of the GASPARS and all the other confusing and differing pictures of Madeleine, where she invariably looks like an abused little girl, they have caused themselves yet further damage. The public are obviously just outraged by this picture and the video. Even the former pretty helpful Mark Williams Thomas is publically commenting how unwise these pictures are. They demonstrate pure contempt for Madeleine and her image, and desperate concern for their own. It is just disgusting.

There is no way out of this for them, increasingly they are just going to have to accept that and the lower they stoop in their desperation, the worse they look.

It just serves them right.


viv said...

The bottom line is the tennis balls pic of Maddie with dark hair and what appear to be bruising to both her arm and legs is the only genuine last picture of Madeleine, acknowledged to be so by the Police and on the PJ file.

But now the McCanns have completely expunged that accurate image of Madeleine as she looked at the time of her disappearance on their webpage, it is just gone!

There is no logical reason why parents who actually wanted to find their little girl would use that image of her, aged about two, with highlighted red hair and makeup that actually looks nothing like her in preference to the tennis balls pic. And there is no logical reason why they would consistently fail to ever mention the reward monies on offer. If it was my child you just would not shut me up on that one!

They have never wanted poor little Maddie to be found and more than they have ever wanted people to know what they actually did with her, or how they planned to cash in from their child abuse and become multi millionaires out of it.

Their arrest is long overdue!

Di said...

Hi Viv & all

Thanks for the links Viv. The expat gentleman on the video is totally correct. If you take your children on holiday spend time with them, don't leave them alone. Spending time with their children was something the McCann's failed to do.

I won't knock the rest of the tapas as it would seem they did spend some time with their children during the day, although if believed, left them alone during the evening, so no excuse for that. Covering for their so called friends in also totally beyond belief when a child is missing.

I have been thinking about what I said yesterday about one of them having a conscience and will come forward. Maybe I am wrong, if I was keeping a dark secret, I don't think I could possibly continue with a lie, keeping it from family, close friends and my children for three years without being ill.

I admit we have not seen all of the tapas recently but Fiona Payne looked absolutely fine whilst supporting Kate in Lisbon, although I am not quite sure why it was not a family member. Gerry looks possitively healthy. Sadly, it is Kate that has gone rapidly down hill in the last few months, the reason I believe is that something is weighing very heavily on her conscience, will Kate confess no I very much doubt it as Gerry IMO has the controlling hand.

No offence to any people of devout faith, but I believe Kate believes if she prays she will be resolved of all sins. If you look at Kate and her mannerisms when she met the Pope she was very troubled.

viv said...

Hiya Di, I liked the expat man as well, he is the sort of straight talking honest person you could feel comfortable listening to.

Having worked in the police he also knows a thing or two about discretion. He was not prepared to state precisely how he saw this case, that is something I am noticing from a number of commentators. But clearly if he just thought the parents were not involved would not have had a problem in saying so.

Sadly, he did not have a problem in stating in his view Madeleine is dead, that has to be the most likely scenario now, particularly given the images the McCanns have just released and their possible motivations for doing that.

I think that was what he was broadly trying to emphasise, it was not natural or normal behaviour and these people are not exactly chavs who would struggle to come up with the price of a babysitter, are they! But they went away with the aim to behave like them and there has to be a good reason why doctors would choose to deliberately keep on doing that. Even to brag about it so no one was the least surprised when Maddie got, apparently, "stolen from her bed", not that there was any sign according to the police of her having been in it that night!

I won't knock the rest of them either because like you, I am not the least bit convinced they actually were neglecting their children. Mat Oldfield makes a lot of slip ups, saying how they planned to share the childcare. It is not sharing the childcare to just go out and leave them is it! Rachel's story about not wanting to even enter the room because of the smell of her baby and how dark it was etc is just so far fetched it really does take some stomaching. I have always thought about that horrified look on her face when photographed back in PDL in July for the confrontation with Murat.

By contrast Fiona Payne looks as bold as brass. I think she is just a much tougher player with probably a lot more to lose than Rachel. That email between Paiva and Marshall clearly marks Fiona as a smooth talking liar, covering for her husband and the McCanns. Maybe it is Fiona's training that enables her to stay so calm under such pressure?

In relation to Gerry, Wiz has previously summed him up very well, he is able to compartmentalise, put problems into their invididual boxes, deal with them and file them away again. He is typically psychopathic IMO and so does not have the burden of a conscience that would make him ill with worry, like a more normal person. His only concern will be continuing to plot and scheme to keep himself (mainly) out of trouble.

Kate, of course, is very different. The strain of the last three years is etched on her face and every time you see her she appears more mentally frail and utterly stressed out. Whilst Gerry knows he can keep on holding it together, he must be deeply concerned about Kate.

Then there is Jane Tanner and Russell, somehow I do not think those two are so tough either. The police will know what they are doing.

And Fiona's mum, wanting to be honest and law abiding, but drawn into a terrible secret.

There are plenty of places for cracks to appear and Gerry to be losing his iron grip.

viv said...

Hiya again Di

On religion, I do not believe that either Kate or Gerry were the least bit religious. They have merely turned to this for expediency.

With Gerry the audience before the Pope would be seen as a good marketing strategy, getting everyone on side to his stranger abduction scenario. But even at that stage, I do wonder about Kate and whether she had other ideas as to what she might take from gaining the religious experience.

Some people when they are very ill, in the depths of despair, a problem is so bad, they do turn to God. I agree with you Kate looked very troubled before the Pope, and was apparently getting very anxious that night demanding a priest. She also texted her friend "I need help". The rogatories confirm Kate was wanting those friends to go over and support her. Kate had repeatedly stressed how much people are supporting them and how important that is to her. That tells me that actually she craves support but is not getting quite what she needs in that regard.

People like priests, vicars, Aled Jones, will support Kate in a non judgmental way, no matter what she has done recognising her as a very troubled soul who just cannot cope with the situation she finds herself in. I do think that in her desperation and probably as friends and family her turned more and more away from her, she has moved closer to those few left that actually will support her and give her some degree of comfort.

Getting the keys to the local church, she may try to convince herself that will put things right, but in her heart she must surely know differently to that. She must do what is right for her children and that means putting them before herself. That is what a really loving mum would always do.

viv said...

I suspect Lorraine Kelly may come into that category also and does not deserve the savaging that many people have given her.

Di said...

Hi Viv

I agree, Kate's own Mum said K & G were not religeous, I also believe she was surprised that they had asked for a priest during the night of Madeleine's disappearance.

Myself also, I believed you would only ask for a priest to give the last rights at that time of night, otherwise you would wait until morning and attend the church to pray. Unless of course, something very sinister happened which you feel the need to be absolved from which can't wait until morning.

Kate & Gerry care to answer!!!

Di said...

Hi Viv

I think LK may have been sadly drawn in like many. For all we know Lorraine, Oprah and many others may now be questioning what they have got themselves into, but getting out and saving face will be much harder imo.

viv said...

Hiya Di

Kate's mum certainly was surprised and I recall loathe to explain Kate's reaction. She had no problem pointing out Gerry's because he is a far more open book and she would be less concerned about causing him any problems.

I think she knew that Kate asking for a Priest that night was quite bizarre and must have told her that Kate knew something terrible had happened to Madeleine. Of course, as a mum, you would want to kid yourself that yes, some stranger abducting Madeleine is terrible. But Kate's mum I am quite sure would have got the full details and worked out that stranger abduction scenario was faked.

I do think people are fundamentally wrong however to assume as so many have, and keep on repeating it for the last three years, that means for a certainty Madeleine died and there are simply no other options as to what they did with her. In fact that would be to suggest one of the major questions they wanted Kate to answer was nonsense really, were you thinking of transferring custody to a relative?

I think Kate wailing we have let her down could mean very bad decisions have been made for her. She was the outcast of the family, abused and gotten rid of and Kate was immediately feeling this was just not right, she was feeling some terrible pangs of remorse that she had allowed this to happen.

People with Gerry's sort of personality can act in rash and impetuous ways. Their life is ruled by recklessness and what they can plot to get away with.

Kate I believe is very different sort of person. Deep thinking and weighing the risks and the consquences very carefully.

I think she got taken along with events and pushed down a helter skelter far more quickly than she felt was safe to go. Things became a blur and events went far to fast for her more calculated approach. The scheme was essentially Gerry's and it was hair brained, grandiose. Gerry positively thrives on high risk strategies, but Kate feels all of the agony and all of the worry in relation to the terrible thing that they have done to rid themselves of what had become a burden, a risk of being found out.

I think this is why sometimes she comes across as even more scheming than him, because she did go along with that plan and is carefully weighing the risks, probably far more carefully than he ever could. And there have been occasions when that burden upon her without him to keep giving her encouragement, cajolence, instructions, intimidation has almost proved too great. I think she nearly confessed to Ricardo Paiva, he is an excellent officer and knew she was a weak link. He worked to build her confidence and then when Gerry was in America received that distraught call from Kate.

It is a call that I think Gerry is very angry about, because it did make the police even more certain of their involvement. Sometimes I see him looking at her and it is such a terribly menancing look. YOu have done enough damage now lady, just shut up and listen to me now or else. She has been taken along with this and knows the alternative is a prison sentence for her and loss of the twins also. But she should ponder one thing, if there is the remotest chance of rescuing Maddie, the twins will know that when they are older and if she does not do something now to put that right, they will turn their back on her. So whilst she clings to them now, she is not thinking of what the future holds for her and how she could actually improve the future for all of her children.

viv said...

In relation to Lorraine and Oprah, they are journalists with a feminine edge, a caring side. That is their approach. I think most reasonable people see a deep fear and sadness in Kate and an understanding that this is simply not all of her doing. They are both very knowledgable about domestic abuse and probably feel a certain empathy with Kate for all her faults.

I also think that what a lot of people just simply do not want to take on board is that public figures simply cannot offer any comment on this case. They cannot say anything at all that suggests Kate and Gerry are guilty. Lorraine and Oprah probably act as good journalists and bear that well in mind, also the state of mind of Kate McCann.

viv said...

It is great to see the media doing what they often make a very good job of, uncovering paedophiles and handing them over to the police, well done SKY!

Paedopholia is one of the most massive, serious and hidden crimes, there is one living in every street. The Police need all the help they can get because there simply are not enough police to tackle this without help and our precious children need help to protect them, to save them, to end their suffering.

Breaking News

10:18pm UK, Tuesday May 04, 2010

Arrest Follows Sky News Sex Grooming Probe

* Share
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A 57-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of internet related sexual offences after an investigation by Sky News.

Simon Beard
Simon Beard, a youth consultant, has been questioned following a sting operation by Sky News journalists after he arrived at a pre-arranged location with a girl who had pretended to be 13.

A police statement said: "A 57-year-old man has this evening been arrested on suspicion of internet related sexual offences."

Police said colleagues in Northamptonshire made the arrest.

The man is in custody at a Northants police station and will be transferred to London on Wednesday where detectives from the Metropolitan force will interview him.

viv said...

In the Independent Terence Blacker talks about destructive thoughts and depression highlighting that males are more likely to commit suicide, perhaps when all sense of control of a situation has gone, and them promptly moves onto this:


Can the McCanns be thinking straight?

Three years have passed since the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and her parents are determined that the search for her should not slip out of the world's headlines. To keep the story alive, they have just released a moody video, complete with a musical soundtrack, which includes a photograph of the three-year-old wearing make-up and gazing into the camera. It is that image which, predictably, has featured in the media,

It seems a bizarre and unsettling development. Clearly, Kate and Gerry McCann have been living through a nightmare of unimaginable horror and perhaps, even after three years, they are not thinking straight. If so, someone should surely have pointed out to them that, in a case over which paedophilia casts an obvious shadow, it looks downright weird when a photograph which has the effect of sexualising the missing child becomes part of the campaign to find her.

Obviously, the make-up game and the photograph were innocent at the time but, when the private picture is released into the public domain in these circumstances, something altogether nastier kicks in.

What was the point of this exercise, apart from getting more news coverage? At a time when there is justified concern over Primark selling Little Miss Naughty padded bras for eight-year-olds and allegations that Playboy brands are being aimed at the primary school market, the circulation of this can only feed prurience of the very worst kind.

Maybe it was a misjudgement, but it confirms a niggling sense that the McCanns' publicity–at-all-costs campaign has seriously lost its way.

hope4truth said...

The campaigns has seriously lost its way....

They had the perfect campaign to begin with anyone of us who doubted them could easily be told how nasty we were for putting more pain and stress on two poor parents who were already in hell "How could we be so cruel"

So in the first few months they spun and made up their sad tale as they went and the press printed their tale word for word the tale got stranger there were obvious questions yet they remained the heros...

I found things strange and as I had doubts the first time Gerry opened his mouth I could not belive that no one else had any questions? The press was going along with it word for word so I typed in McCann on Google and most of the results were about poor Gerry and Kate... Then I found a link to the DX and read 100s of comments and found many people felt the same way I did....

Once I joined it was not long before the paid pros started their games of lets be nice and put this prat in her place by poiniting out how mean she is to doubt...

That was their problem they fought their media spin with the deluded view that they knew our peronalitys and there for could tell us what we were...

They got me so wrong it would have been funny if it was not fast becoming obvious that these people had one purpose and that was to stop anyone changing the McCanns version of events.... Above everything including Maddie the only thing that mattered was keeping the parents in the clear....

As time went on we were bullied by some very sick individules who told us that we would be so ashamed when the secrecy was lifted as the poor McCanns could not speak freeley but once they could all would become clear....

Well that has not happend all that did become clear was none of the 9 adults on that holiday helped Maddie at all and Kate refused to answer a single question for her child....

More and more people doubt them everytime they spin another odd tale...

The problem they and their paid help have now is 3 years has gone by 3 years of maddie in a peado hell hole...

They want to ask to get the investigation re opened...

They have vital clues that will find Maddie...

Fantastic!! my only question is if they belive she is in a Peado Hell Hole why are we hearing about it why have they kept hold of it and not shared it with the PJ or Police?

Do they really belive that Maddie is having so much fun that a few more Months, weeks, days, hours, minutes or seconds wont do her any more harm? Because if they really belive their child was taken by a Peadophile ring the very fact they are holding onto the information they say they have makes them one of two things....

Liars and they have nothing....

or the most evil twisted parents ever to walk the earth....

Being the nasty person I am I just cant belive for one second they are that twisted and my evil mind tells me they know there is nothing more they can do for their child and have to protect their freedom or they know exactly where she is she is safe and they are working to bring her back to clear themselves....

Pro Monkeys may be able to accept the fact Maddie has been in hell for 3 years whilst her parents have skipped round the country having a good laugh as they went (being replaced by a few tears and sad looks now people have pointed out how odd they are) but I dont belive they are that sick if that makes me twisted what the hell.....

Justice for Madeleine and I think she will have it this year....

viv said...

What a brilliant post Hope and first thing in the morning too, I just don't know how you do it.

I absolutely agree with every word you say, and what is more, I think those unpleasant Pro McCanners who were seeking to tell us how sick and abusive we are have now crawled back under their stones.

The reality is we are incredibly compassionate people who primary concern has always been little Maddie and the twins and not sick, selfish and abusive adults who simply will not co-operate with the police and help them find what happened to little Maddie.

And that is the way we are going to stay, Kate, Gerry & Co deserve what is coming to them, the due operation of law to protect the vulnerable. There is a price to pay for those who simply will not love, honour and respect innocent little children.

S.B. said...

Hello Viv.....

I found a comment I posted somewhere about 18 months ago about the curious location for the groups holiday - my opinion has not changed during that time, I remain convinced that this crime was premeditated and Portugal was the chosen destination for a specific reason. I think maybe because of its location (close to North Africa and within easy reach of southern Europe), it's size and it's police force (hoping them to be restricted by lack of experience and financial support with inadequate facilities to conduct an investigation into a serious crime).

You may by now have gathered that I live in North Africa and can confirm that tourism operates all year round due to the climate. Last week the daytime temperature was hovering around 33 degrees, my little office at the moment is 29 degrees so you can imagine nights can be unbearably hot. I can also confirm that charter flights run between this country and different regions of the U.K. regularly. So why Portugal when there are many other destinations to choose from that are easily accessible and with a better climate at that time of year?

I can speak for this part of North Africa when I say that it would have been impossible as foreigners for them to commit a crime of any description and get away with it. I think they underestimated the tenacity of this countries natives when they assumed they could successfully 'hide a child' in the wilderness, never to be found again! Although many natives are uneducated, they certainly do not lack communication skills. There are many areas within the country which appear to be isolated or cut off from the world but I can assure that if any stranger appears therein, the rest of the country would know within about 48 hours. Perhaps a slight exaggeration but nonetheless true in principal. Nor in such a country as this could they easily access the press/media as they found to be so convenient in Portugal in fact they would not have been able to manipulate anything or anybody! Imagine the prospect of been thrown into a North African jail whilst the authorities decide your fate!

Portugal it had to be!

Wizard said...

Listening to this morning news I hear that there are currently 1143 unsolved murder cases in the UK. The Police say they never close an unsolved case and periodically review them for new leads. A police spokesman said he knows that those involved in the crimes are aware of this and have great difficulty sleeping at night due to the worry of eventual detection.

Wizard said...

Morning Viv,

I just read your reply, Tuesday, 4 May 2010 16:30:00 GMT+01:00, to my post - it's spot on – no amount of money can really make the guilty look innocent.

viv said...

Morning SB and Wiz!

No SB I did not realise you lived in North Africa but certainly agree this was a planned crime and the venue at the Ocean Club in Portugal was strategically chosen by David Payne and Gerry for a number of reasons.

Leaving the children unattended was a vital part of this plan, had they not done so, it could not have been claimed that Madeleine was abducted by a stranger. Presumably the Paynes took the baby monitor and the mother in law because they did not want to actually completely leave their children unattended.

I also think the language and jurisdictional problems would have been obviously considered to be in their favour, let alone the relative inexperience of the Portuguese compared with the British in investigating parental child abuse, possible homicide or abduction etc.

They have savagely attacked Goncalo Amaral which is pretty extraordinary given he admits vital items were not seized and that had British procedures been adopted a better result would have been obtained.

Gerry went armed with the relevant telephone numbers to start ramping up support for his claims immediately both in the media and with contacts to Gordon Brown, Blair, The Ambassador etc. At the outset he knew he could slew the investigation towards his claims as a British doctor. He relied upon his own status in life to be believed. Not only are the police obviously very curious about the plans for this holiday but also the lack of searching and amount of time that was instead spent speaking to various contacts, relatives, the press. That was simply not a reasonable or normal thing to do.

Wiz, I think we do have to accept that this could have been a planned murder. I do think Maddie was removed from the apartment early in the evening in the blue tennis bag and she could just as well have been dead at that time as alive. There is no real evidence to confirm that either way. The Paynes did not arrive at the restaurant that night until about 9 and neither did Gerry. I believe that when Wilkins bumped into him exiting the apt via the rear gate he was only just coming out and staging the apartment by leaving that patio door open. He probably intended to go on and stage the blinds or maybe that was the job of Russell, but both got cold feet due to the noise it would make/risk of being seen.

One comment that has always really stuck out in my mind from Gerry, he had never seen anyone around at night before prior to bumping into Wilkins. That clearly suggests to me that was a major fly in the ointment. They had already got rid of Madeleine, all they needed to do later in the evening was stage the abduction, but it did not go according to plan. All Kate could do was come up with the rehearsed story regardless, no matter how stupid it sounds.

As you say Wiz, there are a number of murderers where the police know who the culprit is but are still waiting a breakthrough to be able to charge them. But the terror of that knock on the door means that when that person decided to commit such a heinous crime, they also took away their own life, because that fear of being arrested and convicted will never leave them. It is with them every waking moment. Kate McCann clearly demonstrates that is what she is living with and no amount of media manipulation is going to give her that normal, believed, supported life that she craves. You blew it Kate when you chose to go along with getting rid of your own lovely little girl instead of protecting her from harm. There is no way out!

viv said...

A written warning and his identity revealed by The Times for a police detective who blogged, giving away confidential details about child sexual abuse investigations he had been involved in and generally acted in clear breach of police disciplinary rules of conduct. I have to say he should have seen that coming!


viv said...

Gerry now wants to tell us about this erm special Daddy bond he apparently had with Madeleine...I could be wrong but in conjunction with the issue of those photos, is he looking around for someone else to sue, fed up of the dogs now and milked it for as much as you could Gez?

Gerry McCann speaks of 'special bond' with missing daughter Madeleine

May 4 2010

GERRY McCANN has spoken of his "special daddy bond" with daughter Madeleine.

In an interview on Spanish TV to mark the third anniversary of Madeleine's disappearance, the Scots doctor said: "We always thought Madeleine was a very special person.

"She was quite extroverted, like me and the rest of the family. I had a special daddy bond with her."

Gerry said Madeleine would sometimes stay up with him and her mum Kate after the couple put their twins, Sean and Amelie, to bed. He added: "I got to sit with her as she enjoyed a treat, a glass of milk with some biscuits.

"She's great, good fun. She always asked me to chase her in the garden. She was a fast little girl, very athletic, with a lot of energy."

Madeleine vanished in May 2007 from the family's holiday flat in Praia da Luz, Portugal.

Gerry and her mum Kate released a new photo of her, wearing her mum's eye shadow shortly before she went missing, to mark the anniversary.

viv said...

Strange the way they had to shuffle off to Portugal and Spain to get some paid interviews. Did no one want them in UK, aside from Lorraine Kelly?

At least the McCanns got a nice break abroad without the burden of their children, having sensibly dumped them on someone safe before they even left, presumably.

hope4truth said...

Gerry says she is an extrovert like he is???

I would not describe him in that way arrogant prat but extrovert???

Odd how they describe their child as an extrovert outgoing inteligent when others say she was nervous and quiet???

viv said...

Hiya Hope darling

I entirely agree with you again.

"Extrovert" conjures up the image of someone who is full of fun, the life and soul of the party, great to have around.

Whereas Gerry is the type who people avoid like the plague, move house and job for etc. That is abundantly clear from all the statements we have read. I think if you were unfortunate enough to be at a party with that arrogant loud mouted prat you would probably make some excuse to leave early, well I know me and you would, lol!

Jez Wilkins wife summed him up very well if I recall, loudly bragging about his tennis stroke, (with Kate quietly sitting there patronising him which he clearly "needs") the loud Glaswegian accent that could be heard above everyone else.

I have to say the phrase "special daddy bond" made me positively cringe.

Sadly, Maddie was a quiet and subdued child and with him for a "father", that is hardly surprising, poor little mite. Even in the early stages he used to forget to mention her, so concerned was he with his "family", that he had already excluded little Maddie from.

What a vile man!

viv said...

Unashamedly Labour Says, PLEASE DONT LOSE GORDY XX

docmac said...

Unashamedly not said:

Hope you slept well, Viv. Gordy did not :-)

Anonymous said...

Kate McCann told the BBC in a recent interview that Maddie's case wasn't one of murder, and this time I really do believe her.

viv said...

Hello guys and oh what a shambles,

Cameron is bleating I won I won and Gordy is saying no you didn't win good enough, lol!

I think Gordy should back down and then give the tories a real hard time which is probably a good thing for the country as at least it will rein in extreme conservatism.

I doubt that either Gordy or Cameron are completey happy chappies, but at least Cameron has earned the right to serve an eviction order I think, it was quite a heavy swing against Labour but I think that given the economic situation that was almost inevitable.


I am curious to know what you mean by that given you have always, well I think, felt the dogs found something.

Have you changed your mind, because the police have a huge amount of evidence this was a planned "event".

I know it is hard to believe Kate because she clearly does tell a lot of lies, but somehow I have always felt that she actually does believe Maddie could be recovered from wherever her husband sent her. Of course that is the bit she tells a couple of lies about!

viv said...

In a recent interview on Spanish TV, the McCanns state, well how could we have been involved in her kidnapping, we did not even have a car.

My forensic answer to that would be, well Murat has a car, Geraghty has a car, Kennedy could have arranged a car, and lastly the police clearly felt Russell O'Brien was using a hire car.

So, sorry to say Kate and Gerry but whether Maddie was dead or alive when you bundled her into that blue bag, the lack of a car would hardly be a problem to you, more like a feeble excuse it seems to me and just part of your plans. How clever not to hire one until so much later, and then get it nastily contaminated with bad smells and everything, erm tut!

viv said...

Surely it is not just me who has noted that it is one of the McCanns own family who gives evidence to the police about the smelly car.

Do people not find that just a tad contrived? You can create suspicion of a death, but fail to produce enough evidence to be able to prove it. Then you can start suing people for saying that is what you did, can't you Gerry?

viv said...

You could even seriously ramp up suspicion of that death in the media, by coming up with some sensational excuses for smelly things. Like rotting meat and dirty nappies. That you intend to go to the States to prove that dog evidence is not much cop.

If you knew that death could never be proved because that is not actually what you did, but by ramping the suspicions up in that way you could make a fortune out of libel payments and that was always your intention, to just cashin big time, you would have a mind just like that of Gerry McCann.

viv said...

You could even drop a quote in the media and attribute it to Kate McCann, that she had been around 6 dead bodies to account for the smell. It does not matter if that is ridiculous, it does not matter that Kate never said that, it does not matter that Kate was not even working, she was still on so called "maternity leave" from having the twins.

What it does is get everyone convinced that is what happened, get them talking about it, making the allegations and then Gerry can sit there with Carter Ruck and Isabel working out his "libel awards" and laughing that everyone thinks Kate killed Maddie.

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,

I’ve just seen that Esther McVey has won a conservative seat in Cheshire - I think. So her tactic of disassociation with the Mc’s to further her political career has paid off.

The elections – if we had taken on board what the newspapers were telling us the Conservative would have had a landslide win. Well that never happened. Gordon, he of the charisma of a coffin lid, lost the election for Labour. Just a thought I think the Dark Prince Mandy should take over the leadership of the Labour party – what fun that would be lol.

viv said...

You could drop it out to your very large and loud mouthed sister who just loves gobbing off to the press to help her wee brother, that Kate got offered a deal by the police to admit killing Maddie, that is if you had a mind quite as perverted as Gerry McCann's.

viv said...

Hiya Wiz

Well much as it obviously pains me to say to a Tory well done, in Esther's case, absolutely yes, severing the cord with Kate and Gerry McCann was a flipping good idea for her political aspirations.

Don't say that about my Gordy, the charisma of a coffin lid, lol! he is a dour Scotsman but as politicians go is a thoroughly decent bloke. He is just not PM material really, but me and my mom love him! I would not like to be his secretary when he is under pressure of course...but I would not like to even be in the same building as Cameron.

Dark Prince Mandy for new Labour Leader, well hummm, maybe not, but an amusing thought nevertheless!

viv said...

So I think Goncalo's case against the McCanns is a hopeless one that cannot be proven and he got set up by scheming Gerry.

But is it right that Gerry and Kate should take a load of money off this man for pointing the finger at them?

That would be a serious "abuse of process" IMO.

viv said...

well jump for joy on these two results

The Vile, Disgusting, Odious, Racist Nick Griffin lost to Labour!!

The Dishonest and discredited Jacqui Smith lost to the conservatives. Whilst a win for the conservatives is not good news to me that woman was extremely bad news for Gordon Brown and the Labour Party and now very deservedly finds she will be fiddling whilst on a fat pay packet no more, gravy train over love!

viv said...

Strictly on the light side, Lord Mandy finds himself a partner he still cannot cope with but probably find her age less challenging;


hope4truth said...

Hi All

I can go with TTW4 it may not be a case of murder but a simple accident...

Perhaps Kate can clearly say that because she knows Maddie is dead and it was not an act of Murder???

She cant belive her child has been abducted to say such a thing though...

Once she had been taken she could have been Murdered at any time the fact she clearly says it is not a case of Murder must mean she is lying about the abduction and knows where her child is????

viv said...

hiya Hope

I think what Kate was saying was if this was a murder investigation the police would still be actively investigating it.

Of course British agencies tell us this still is an active investigation and so I do not think we can take too much from her remark, other than it would be rather odd to use that word if that is what they actually did.

To me, it does tend to suggest she knows exactly where Madeleine is and had hopes of bringing her back. But those hopes are forlorn in terms of thinking she can have Madeleine back because Mrs Justice Hogg made Madeleine a Ward of Court in April 2008. If you get rid of your own child and think there is a chance of getting her back, a full three years later, it is perversity in the extreme for her to even countenance the idea of British authorities letting her have Madeleine back.

viv said...

Aside from the ones where posters suggest the latest sexualised picture of Maddie is actually one of her standing up dead !

This is a good post IMO from J Morais blog. Gerry even talks of little Sean storming in with his sword, it is dreadful what they are instilling into the brains of these two little ones.

Thank you for letting us know. The Independent spot It but The Sun, Daily Mail and Sky News, feed it.

At the Channel 4 ( Spanish TV4- Las mananas de 4), Mccann's strategy did not go so well. The main programme was clearly manipulated and it was ridiculous to see the journalist highlighting that they answer the questions without censorship ( Sandra Felgueiras repeated the same at RTP), showing that this must be one of the requests of the Mccann's to give the interview- Passing to the public the message that the questions and the answers were free. Laughable.
Going back to 'Las mananas de 4', the programme was manipulated but Antonio Cabreras and the other periodist ( man), sorry I don't remember the name, Not. They clearly criticise the Mccann's and made clear that for them this campaign it is only marketing.

I agree, marketing to sale again the image and the drama of an innocent 3 years old. I don't know what is more dramatic for Madeleine, if Being abducted by the egg man or if being raised inside a family like that their parents show to the world. And they both have a high education ( university degree), top lawyers and top Media advisers, a lot of money and VIP relations.
They already show how they manipulate and use and abuse the twins by raising them with the idea that their sister was kidnapped by a monster which can come from nowhere into their rooms and disappear without traces. The twins are growing with nightmares and developing a kind of revenge behaviour, since they feel responsible for the hunting of the monster to kill him. Too much disturbance on their brains, specially when we look at the cases of Adults who become rapists and childs abusers because they have been themselves abused during their childhoods.

viv said...

Top cop spearheads new probe into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann

PROBE: Det Chief Insp Colin Sutton

Reward for missing Madeleine
We offer record reward for info that helps find Maddie
Maddie hunt vid
Brits launch Maddie probe
Kate: Mother's Day too painful
1,000 lanterns to mark missing Maddie's 1,000 days
Maddie: It IS kidnap

By Lucy Panton, Crime Editor, 09/05/2010
BRITAIN'S top murder cop has been lined up to spearhead a new probe into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, we can reveal.

Det Chief Insp Colin Sutton, 49, who has been involved in some of the UK's biggest inquiries - including the murder of Milly Dowler and the terror reign of the Nightstalker sex beast - is seen as the best man to handle the challenging review.

Senior child protection officer Jim Gamble has asked Scotland Yard to take a fresh look at the three-year investigation.

He blasted Portuguese cops for their handling of the hunt for Maddie - who vanished aged three from her family's Algarve holiday apartment in 2007. Now the Met Police are set to review all leads in the case, using technology and standards expected in a UK homicide or kidnap.

It will delight Maddie's parents, Kate and Gerry McCann. A senior police source said: "They deserve reassurance that everything that can be done has been done."

viv said...

So firstly, let us think, News of the World? Probably spinning for the McCanns.

So what is being spun here?

It is admitted there has been a 3 year UK investigation. It is reasonable to think Jim Gamble may want that reviewed to try and get a breakthrough. It is not reasonable to think he has blasted Portuguese cops (with the exception perhaps of a certain one who forgot the basic rule for police officers duty to keep what they know confidential).

It is admitted this is a homicide or kidnap investigation. The Holmes technology has always been used in UK on the massive Maddie case.

Now for the bit that is pure spin, "Kate and Gerry will be delighted".

What that UK cops continue to investigate them for the homicide or kidnapping of Madeleine? They have a perverse sense of "delight" that much is true.

I wonder if they are expecting some "revelations" and seek to get some favourable spin out first. Sorry Kate and Gerry but there is nothing favourable about a three year investigation of your by Brit cops, you are costing British tax payers a fortune and probably will do with your Legal Aid bill as well, so stop messing about and cough up to what you did with little Maddie.

viv said...

Would our possible new leader Cameron, seek to score some political points out of being in charge when the Maddie case finally gets cracked and Kate, Gerry & Co get their collars felt? Yes, I think he would, so watch out you two!


viv said...

Tomorrow Madeleine’s mother Kate, 42, from Rothley, Leicestershire, will meet Prince Charles at Westminster Abbey during a service to remember young victims of violence. She will be among 1,000 guests marking the anniversary of teenager Jimmy Mizen’s murder in 2008, during a fight in a bakery shop in Lee, south-east London.

Interesting Gerry will not be there?

From the further sickening old rehash of Gran Cooper and her man in the rain with goofy teeth in the Daily Express - heard it a couple of years ago, not impressed, still not impressed and neither are the police, that is for sure!

viv said...

So is Kate now accepting Madeleine is a victim of violence, as opposed to trotting out the Gerry rubbish, "there is absolutely no evidence she has come to any harm"!

Di said...

Hi Viv & all

So NOTW admit this is an investigation either homicide or kidnap. Kate & Gerry will be delighted, I somehow don't think so. Delighted that their daughter Madeleine is possibly dead. Oh dear Gerry then what about the fund and more importantly what about poor Madeleine who you hardly ever mention by name. It is always a little girl is missing, a child is missing, there is a child out there.

For once it would be wonderful to hear you both say, "Our daughter Madeleine is out there frightened and lost. There is a reward for any information that will lead to our precious daughter Madeleine being found and brought safely home to her Mummy, Daddy, Sean and Amelie where she belongs. We all miss Madeleine dreadfully and our hearts are torn apart."

Sadly you just can't bring yourselves to say these words can you, I wonder why!!!

S.B. said...

Evening all!

Firstly, how do we categorize this NOTW article? Fact or fiction? Not being the most reliable source of information generally, I am inclined to think fiction.

Questions been asked here, there and everywhere as to why the substantial reward has not been repeatedly publicized ~ et-walla a side link appears attached to the article!

A senior police source said that this will be welcome news for the Mccanns? Au contraire Mr Policeman ~ if there be any truth in this they will be extremely worried!

The article is written in such a way that suggests Gamble is responding to a directive from the Home Secretary following the Mccanns 'private' meeting. Not in words but I think that to be the implication. By declaring the Mccanns probable reaction again it suggests that they are responsible for initiating the directive - rather like the Amber Alert initiative! I think we all understand enough of the law within the U.K. to know that suspects in a serious criminal investigation do not dictate who/what/why/where! Excepting of course any dodgy dicks that can be bought for a few thousand bucks.

As for this particular crack detective being appointed to probe the past months of investigative work, is this a solo effort or does it involve a squad of detectives? Is he to override 'work in progress'? Or is he a figment of the vivid imagination of the NOTW and clan Mccann?

To think I commented on the lack of hype surrounding the lead up to the latest anniversaries ~ how naive can you be! To think Kate is going all the way to London on her own (?) to personally meet Prince Charles at Westminster Abbey, what an honour! Do you think he will 'lend an ear' to her plea for clemency? Or do you think he will pursue the job in hand i.e. remembrance of abused children!?! No doubt the Mccanns or their flunkies will let us know in due course!

hope4truth said...


I dont understand what the hell this has to with Jim Gamble... This man has been quiet for 3 years when is was clear to anyone with a single brain cell that Maddie could have died in the apartment, walked out of the apartment and fallen down a hole and died. She could have been killed by any one of the 9 adults on that holiday but probability would make it more likely her parents....

So Jim Gamble the expert on child exploitation has allowed Maddie to rot for three years in a peado hell hole...

He has watched her parents acting odd not helping the investigation and blowing her fund on lawyers spin drs and media experts not to mention keeping the directors in caviar...

He now says the PJ did a bad job (even though they were advised by us Brits at the time) he has finaly told a detective in the real police to investigate???

If this is how switched on Jim Gamble is I sugest he quits his jobs as children cant wait for 3 years to be rescued from any type of abuse or exploitation...

As for Gerry and Kate being delighted I very much doubt it they went after Amaral for daring to say she was dead so do I assume they will be suing Jimbo some time soon...

After all "There is no reason to belive she has been harmed"

viv said...

Hiya all and some interesting comments.

I do agree with Di, it is interesting the News of the World are saying it is a murder or kidnap investigation in UK.

There is no mention of Portugal.

Of course UK do have jurisdiction against the McCanns and other Brits who were involved in harming and disposing of Madeleine.

From what we were allowed to know of the investigation it was always considered to be homicide or abduction. That is the problem for the police, without clear evidence they cannot say whether Madeleine was dead or alive when removed from the apartment, but they clearly are quite certain it was at least a couple of very well known British offenders.

SB Given that Stu Prior is a Detective Superintendent I would personally find it very surprising if anyone of lower rank was appointed to review the whole case. Review does seem to be something coming from the McCanns in that they are just a little disgruntled that the whole investigation is clearly looking straight at them, rather than their man in the rain or whatever. Is this their vital new lead? It is almost laughable!


I think Maddie was/is an abused and exploited little girl, IMO, they planned to get rid of her because keeping her had become very difficult for them and they planned to exploit her still further by cashing in, even though they no longer had her. The pictures of her clearly suggest serious exploitation. There is every reason for Jim Gamble to be involved and every reason he would not be speaking about what he knows concerning this case. That is just not done!

After any conviction and time for an appeal has elapsed he would probably comment though..........

viv said...

SB - this visit by Kate where Prince Charles will remember abused children, it is almost like an admission, a real sense of backing down from her, isn't it. I wonder if that is why it is pointed out she goes alone, if that is true. Are there signs of these two pulling in different directions again. Gerry ever the optimist, let us maintain full top spin, Kate, you prat we are sunk!!

Attaching themselves to celebrity figures who support the cause of missing and abused children, a good idea? It would be nice to know what Prince Charles, Richard Branson or Peter Bowles et al really think, not that they can tell us of course.

viv said...

But this attaching seems to be emanating from Kate, the celebrity bash in London, arranged by Kate. The fun runs, only Kate had a sponsor page on Virgin, not Gerry.

In August 2007 Kate started to branch off on her own briefing the Sunday press and Womens Own etc.

Now she is off to see Prince Charles.

Are there some people in the know that feel she is far less to do with this than her husband, he is the real ogre? After all, it was him and David Payne the Gaspars were talking about.

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I agree Jim Gamble should stay quiet about what he knows...

But I have to ask just how good his unit is if it has taken 3 years to get someone to investigate?

Although he may well have been behind the limelight for the last 3 years working with the police for answers and we just dont know about it...

But giving Gerry a platform to air his lies was a strange thing to do unless again he wanted to analyse what he had to say...

Who knows it is the strangest case I have ever followed and can guarantee no one else has been able to drive an investigation their own way especialy when there is no body and there is the slightest chance the child could be saved...

The Jon Bennet Ramsay case is about as close as I have come to this one how the parents were never jailed is beyond me the Mother even wrote the ransom note????

Who knows but if they dont solve this I fear other people will belive they can get away with something similar...

Wizard said...

Does Det.Ch.Insp.Colin Sutton know his name has been put forward to spearhead the MBM case or is this just speculation? Sutton certainly has the experience to look into the case and with a large team of officers to help him perhaps he could unearth something further.

Looking back at some of the murder cases he has successfully dealt with all seem to hinge on lucky breaks brought about by good old fashion police work over a long period of time. This type of police work is labour intensive, taking months if not years before a break occurs and I just wonder if the new investigation will only see Sutton on the case and if so what will this achieve – very little in my opinion.

Wizard said...

Judith Woods in the Mail on Sunday’s You magazine urges women with “come on, girls show your inner strength!” She continues in this pollyfilla item to name women who in her opinion have inner strength commenting. “These resilient women shine like beacons amid the poor-me celebs bleating on about their weight-gain ‘hell’ or the ‘tragic’ loss of yet another rutting footballer boyfriend.

She goes onto name the Duchess of Devonshire, Sara Payne, Jackie Kennedy, Christina Schmid, Eleanor Roosevelt to name a few and I kid you not Kate McCann.

These women she tells us are “hard-wired to cope with whatever life throws at them, and some are extraordinary in the way that they deal with the most horrendous crises.”

Perhaps dealing with whatever life throws at them takes in concealing a corpse and evading detection – hmm Ms Woods could be spot on.

Wizard said...

Hi All,

I was just thinking – over the past 3 years we have had thousands of bloggers looking in minute detail at all the known facts of this case. The released Portuguese police files have been placed under the magnifying glass with relevant fact teased out and discussed for hours and weeks on end by bloggers.

I came to the conclusion that ‘blogger power’ is one of the most extraordinary tools to problem solving in recent years because of the multi-faceted views expressed by bloggers from all walks of life. OK there are some crack-pot ideas expressed but using the blogger-sphere as a “storming” session of free floating ideas is one of the most effective ways of getting views from a far large spectrum of opinion and is far more than any police force could muster.

Sutton et al would do well to look at some of the unexplained anomalies in the police files raised by the blogger-sphere and ensure the police have checked them out. As we know most bloggers are not ill-informed ‘nutters’ and blogger power is a very useful tool.

S.B. said...

Hi Viv......,

Yes, the magic word "review"! The repeated reference to a "review of the case" is starting to really annoy me, definitely a Gerry instigated phrase! What exactly is it that he wants reviewed? The ongoing investigation? The Portuguese case files? The vital evidence previously ignored? The British police force? The CEOP? Your guess is as good as mine but whatever he will never achieve his main objective ~ getting his filthy little mitts on details of the ongoing investigation!

Kate and her level of involvement in the subterfuge still remains a mystery to me. Whilst I respect your various comments relating to her I am still not convinced by her outer image. Certainly I agree with you about our narcissistic Gerry ~ he has tried everything his cunning little mind can think of, even when faced with the inevitable I think he will still have some trump card up his sleeve. Who knows he might even have a master plan to frame somebody else when he finally realises he is done for!

Many of Gerrys cunning plans have failed so it is possible he was forced to change direction by using Kate as a good will ambassador for their defence 'campaign' and 'fund'. Make her out to be a caring, mumsy, overall do-gooder, a responsible parent, incapable of harming even a fly, a campaigner for charity blah blah blah! The royal/celebrity connection I believe to be a ploy to improve their image at no cost to the fund. (Not that I am convinced that the celebrity bash ever even happened ~ just a few bodies relating to charity. If you study the press photographs supposedly taken outside Kensington Gardens, they are standing on some very shabby looking steps, in dark surroundings ~ hardly glitzy neon lit Kensington nor Bransons luxuriant, very expensive venue!)

Not forgetting the same old facial expression when on camera. Surely if she where genuinely tormented by guilt and remorse she would at least change her expressions from time to time. I think she is acting ~ badly!

viv said...

I won the last leg of my employment tribunal case today on pension loss.

A very expensive exercise for bullying bosses who really ought to know better!


hope4truth said...


Well done you that is brilliant news...

So where are you off on holiday to celebrate???


S.B. said...


Don't know what you are talking about but congratulations anyway!

Perahps it's a reward for all your hard work maintaining this site.

Happy spending!

Di said...

Hi Viv


viv said...

Thanks guys :-))))

SB, I have had a massive claim ongoing against my ex employers since Sept 05 in relation to disability discrimination, victimisation and constructive dismissal.

I won on liability a long while ago, then got general damages, then loss of earnings, now loss of pension, finally END OF CASE


viv said...

In relation to comments on the McCanns above, I think their agenda for a long time has been seeking to re-focus the police investigation away from them and back to mystery abductors, hence the drive to get it going again in Portugal, because it would be their responsibility in that case.

I have absolutely no doubt Hope that Jim Gamble has been plugging away at this case for the last three years and he most certainly would not publically discuss that. I think Gerry's appearance before CEOP in January and his failure to offer any public comment is highly significant because as we know, when any of his "lectures" have good PR for him, he likes to get them on Youtube/ the web generally.

The ability of a criminal to get away with it for any period of time is always affected by their intellect and how well they can conceal and distort vital evidence against them. In this case the most vital evidence of all has been expertly concealed, little Maddie. As soon as the Police had got little Shannon back to safety it was all systems ago against her mother and others. Very sadly, Madeleine was taken abroad to be got rid of and finding her or her body is clearly not going to be an easy task, but would always come ahead of any prosecution of the McCanns.

This is the second senior police officer in UK who has been suggested in the McMedia to be heading up a "?review", starting to descend into farce and I think the McCanns and their Team work on the premise the proper Police as opposed to their Pretendy Defectives, who like to hold up Goofy Teeth Pics and PoshaLike pics, offer no comment!

viv said...

In relation to bloggers Wiz, I have become very disheartened by so many, who even three years later, still want to discuss gory death theories without a trace of evidence to back those claims. DNA spattered up the walls was found to belong to a European male but this does not stop so many from insisting that was Madeleine's blood. I think the most sick and disgusting comment I have seen recently is that the made up pic of Maddie she is actually dead!

There are genuine people who are interested in what happened to Madeleine and with sensible observations to make, but IMO there are just as many who do deserve the title "nutter".

I am still struggling to understand why bloggers do not wish to discuss what the Portuguese Prosecutor said, they could have been charged with kidnapping and trafficking Madeleine. Do they think they know better than him? I think there is a certain arrogance from many bloggers who think they would know better than the police. The reality is we just do not know what British Police know, other than it is a massive investigation that has been ongoing for three years and therefore probably one heck of a lot. We also know that some of the best investigators in the UK have worked on the case, it still amazes me that bloggers attack these people, purely on the basis the McCanns have not so far been arrested. That just cannot happen until they can formulate charges based on precisely what they did with Madeleine, and, so far as we know, that does remain a mystery. People can be forgiven for being interested in that mystery and furious with the conduct of her parents, including their latest "promotional video" full of sick innuendo and imagery.

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,

Glad to hear your legal action is now done and dusted and you have proved your case. Five years is a long time to have to wait for a result on the final part of the action and you must be absolutely delighted. Congratulations - Wiz

Wizard said...

Bloggers wild accusations not back-up by facts. I was just reading the article below which sums up where the case is today very well.

It is fustrating that after all this time the authorities are no nearer bring anyone to book. No doubt it is this that gives rise to some of the off the wall speculation.

I think we are back to the position police often find themselves in and in this case, like others, it is only solved after a unexpected lucky break.

Tuesday, 4 May 2010
Portugal – Interior Justice Ministry
.Translation with many thanks to KAREN on the 3As

Portugal – Interior Justice Ministry

The Lack of News in the Madeleine Case Impedes its Re-Opening

Lisbon, 3rd May. The Portuguese authorities have not made any step to re-open the case of the British girl Madeleine McCann, who disappeared three years ago today, as no new evidence has emerged that justifies another investigation.

According to legal sources consulted by Efe, in spite of the statements periodically made by Madeleine’s parents and those that they made in their libel case against the ex PJ officer who related them to the death of their daughter, no new news has been made public about the case being re-opened.

With the event of the third anniversary of the disappearance of their daughter, Kate and Gerry McCann have appeared on various European TV stations and printed media to insist that their Daughter is alive and to ask for help in looking for her.

The couple, who in 2007, organised the biggest media campaign to gather funds ever seen in a case of a disappearance, have repeatedly said, without giving details, that they have new leads about their daughter’s possible fate.

But Portuguese Justice, which officially closed the case a year after the disappearance, can only re-open it with new evidence and formal denunciations made before the police.

The Portuguese Public Prosecutor, upon archiving the case on 21st July 2008 discounted the indications linking the McCanns to their daughter’s death as well as those that pointed to the abduction of the girl by some stranger.


Wizard said...


After having declared them as official suspects in the case, the prosecutors also discarded acting against the couple for having left Madeleine, who was three years old on the night of her disappearance, alone with her younger siblings, whilst they dined with friends.
The couple state that they took turns in going to see the children, but in their statements and those of their friends, as well as the cadaver traces detected in their car and belongings, is where the Portuguese police found the greatest number of contradictions and suspicions in the case.

The Portuguese authorities, accused of not having acted rigorously during the first hours of the disappearance and neglecting the crime scene, never found a trace of the girl and were not even able to bring the couple’s friends back to Portugal for a re-construction of the facts.
The evidence they collected with the help of British police and dogs remained for months in a British laboratory which finally issued a report without sufficient certainty to implicate the parents or shed some light onto the case, according to statements by the then responsible Portuguese police officers.

The McCanns, who suddenly left Portugal when they were declared suspects in September 2007, returned last year to quarrel with the police officer who led the investigation, Gonçalo Amaral, dismissed and retired early and now in danger of ending up in ruin because of the couple’s law suit.

The book in which Amaral covers the details of the investigation – also gathered from the public summary of the case – and suggests that Madeleine died in an accidental manner and that the parents disposed of the body - was banned last February after a first victory of the British couple in the Portuguese civil courts.

Madeleine disappeared on 3rd May 2007 from an apartment in Praia da Luz, in the Algarve and the only thing that remains of her for the moment are the thousands of pages of a Portuguese investigation without guilty parties, and the images and comments of the web page her parents maintain.

The McCanns have always declared themselves to be innocent and determined to find their daughter to whom they today dedicated this message: “Madeleine. Still missing, still missed, we are still looking for you”.

viv said...

Thanks Wiz

It is a great relief that it is finally all over (subject to them appealing which they have never done so far, their "legal" arguments were always utterly hopeless). I just have to pinch myself and say can that be right, it is like a great weight has lifted from my shoulders in what was a mammoth fight for justice!

Now back to another great fight for justice, this paragraph from your report is the reality for me and the horror for Kate and Gerry McCann, really leaving people in no doubt whatsoever what the Pt Police now think, she was abducted and they,not a stranger are entirely responsible for that. They never are going to be able to make any "formal denunciations" giving new evidence to the PJ, unless they are prepared to start telling the truth, and quite obviously they are not. So that leaves them very firmly in the hands of the British Police.

"The Portuguese Public Prosecutor, upon archiving the case on 21st July 2008 discounted the indications linking the McCanns to their daughter’s death as well as those that pointed to the abduction of the girl by some stranger."

So if they did not kill her and it was no stranger who abducted her, it just has to be them, like I have been saying!

viv said...

Thanks Wiz

It is a great relief that it is finally all over (subject to them appealing which they have never done so far, their "legal" arguments were always utterly hopeless). I just have to pinch myself and say can that be right, it is like a great weight has lifted from my shoulders in what was a mammoth fight for justice!

Now back to another great fight for justice, this paragraph from your report is the reality for me and the horror for Kate and Gerry McCann, really leaving people in no doubt whatsoever what the Pt Police now think, she was abducted and they,not a stranger are entirely responsible for that. They never are going to be able to make any "formal denunciations" giving new evidence to the PJ, unless they are prepared to start telling the truth, and quite obviously they are not. So that leaves them very firmly in the hands of the British Police.

"The Portuguese Public Prosecutor, upon archiving the case on 21st July 2008 discounted the indications linking the McCanns to their daughter’s death as well as those that pointed to the abduction of the girl by some stranger."

So if they did not kill her and it was no stranger who abducted her, it just has to be them, like I have been saying!

viv said...



S.B. said...

Hello Viv.....,

Now I understand! Well done ~ let justice prevail!

S.B. said...

Referring to the Mail article reporting Kate Mccanns brief encounter with Prince Charles, I think we see a much healthier looking Kate compared to her appearance in that very recent interview where we were encouraged to believe her to be tormented by grief. In fact she appears to be glowing, minus the suntan of course, and much like her old self that we witnessed immediately after the disappearance of her child. Perhaps the invigorating London smog suits her temperament!

No Gerry to be seen ~ well, well, how things have changed if he can allow her to roam the big city un-chaperoned and to be presented to such an illustrious personage as Prince Charles without rehearsal. Perhaps the sanctity of the Abbey kept her wayward tongue in check. Or perhaps she was just another face in the crowd ~ no aftermath? Something must have gone radically wrong, or maybe jack-of-all-trades Clarence was otherwise engaged hopping from one foot to the other outside No. 10!

No doubt the NOTW will let us know in due course.

viv said...

Hiya SB and thanks again, I have always been on the side of Justice, even for myself:-))

I was dismayed with the Mail for making Kate the story rather than the couple who Charles had invited, I gather they invited Kate and she hugged them for the photographers. I doubt she actually got anywhere near Prince Charles and the story just has nothing futher in it for them. Of course a shot with Prince Charles would have been seriously "used"! But I am sure Charles would not allow the McCanns to drag him into their media circus..

But her increasing levels of freedom from him are interesting. /The thing is we just do not have a clue what the situation is with the police, Gerry has certainly gone rather quiet. Dare we hope?

As for her looking glowing, twice recently I have noted her in some rather capacious, smocky type outfits. 42 would be on the outer limits of course, but nothing would surprise me from Team McCann. Absolutely anything is fair game to get them sympathy and defend themselves. Are we going to get a gush making announcement sad Kate is expecting another child? Of course I could be completely wrong, but smocky outfits on such a slim lady, hummm

viv said...

and of course Judges still send pregnant/newly confined moms to prison.

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

If she is pregnant then she must have been going through a lot of IVF treatment which is very hard going...

I cant understand why she would try for a baby (apart from the obvious reason more sympathy and money) but she is a crap Mother and could not even be bothered with the 3 she had in PDL dumping them by day and night....

I know when I miscarried my first baby I was so desprate to fall again and god forbid anything happen to my girls maybe that hole could be filled a little with a new baby?

But with a child missing the hope and pain cant be replaced as easily...

Who knows with those two vile parents who dont want their daughter found (have they shared their important clues yet?)and begged for the case to be reopened? but as you say a pregnant woman can go to jail and keep her baby there with her for a year......

Tragic if only she would just tell the truth all this would go away...

Di said...

Hi all


Yes I agree, Kate is wearing rather loose clothing at the moment, perhaps deliberately to get us all talking which it is!

Then we will get, oh Kate lost the baby because of all the hate forums etc., I don't believe there is a baby but I would put nothing past this odious pair to pretend there was. They are fighting dirty now and nothing will stop them.

viv said...

Hiya Di and hope

Maybe I should remember one thing we have certainly learned about Team McCann, they do set everyone up to talk about what never happened. If it furthers their two major causes, making money and defending themselves.

Kate is probably rather cynically donning the smocky gear and she looks for another sympathy bandwagon to jump on. Talk about leaving no stone unturned eh!

I always imagine Gerry reading blogger comments and sitting laughing like some demented drain, at the same time trying to slap himself on the back and reminding Kate what a genius he is.

S.B. said...

Hi guys!

My computer is up to its tricks again so I am somewhat retarded.

Di.... Agreed, from what we have seen and heard of the Mccanns over the past three years I too believe them to be capable of anything, no matter how devious, in order to appear victims rather than perpetrators of a serious crime. I am not in the least bit interested in fashion but I can't say I've noticed a trend towards maternity smocks ~ definitely no baby forthcoming in spite of the fashion faux pas!

As you say Viv, Gerry welcomes every opportunity to fly his little flag of victory, hence no feedback from the CEOP conference. Likewise 'if' one single word was spoken to Kate at the Abbey by Prince Charles or one sideways glance caught on camera, the world would know well before now.

Somewhere I saw today that Gerry is to compete in a cross country cycle race on Sunday to raise further funds to help secure the safe return of Madeleine. Quote ~ "Please show your support for Gerry but more importantly Madeleine (whoops nearly forgot that one) by making a donation at......" ~ Unquote. Viv... perhaps a nice little investment opportunity for you!

On the subject of funds, from what they say they are still using the services of a private dick or two to investigate the whereabouts of Madeleine and bring the abductor to justice. So I ask, what 'exactly' are these dicks doing? Creating new leads for the PJ to investigate? Trolling the globe looking under every unturned stone for new evidence? Planning a long term strategy (because it will be long term)? Investigating the inefficiency of the police in the U.K. and Portugal? Undertaking a scoping exercise? Carrying out a complete review of all the evidence and case files? Or are they just taking extended gastronomic, boozy lunch breaks at the expense of the 'official fund'!

What fools these Mccanns think we are!

viv said...

Oh lol SB, I am sure Gerry would love to Halligen my Pension Fund, but think I better stick to safer investments!

That too makes me smile, certain bloggers attacking CEOP and yet when Gerry gives them a personal address about "sexually motivated child abductions" he does not want to tell us all about it? I think even one so practised in minimisation and denial must have tumbled to the fact they were studying him and looking for some rather more concrete leads than Eddie the tame poodle.

Undertaking a "bit of a scoping exercise and investigating the "efficency" of British and Portuguese Police, again you make me smile SB. As Gerry says he wants those blasted files amalgamated so he can read them and plan his strategy. Not being able to do that must be pure hell to a little Schemer, I mean runner for charity, like Gerry, so generous to his own charity.

What is this strategy of them doing things alone, going their separate ways? Is that for some manipulative and cunning reason they devised or, better still, are they genuinely panicked and pulling apart.

I think another glaring problem for the McCanns that was apparent this year, a pre recorded stint with Lorraine Kelly aside, they are not wanted on British TV. That must be a terrible knock to their egos, but still at least Spain and Portugal are still prepared to swell the coffers of the gruesome twosome.

viv said...

I think I just answered my own question, British TV are not prepared to pay the duo anymore to indulge their love of fame, so they do some stunts they can dream up to get themselves in the media.

Kate hugs the bereaved Mizen couple, in a coat with a vent in the back of it, and Gerry does another fun run, hey catch me, look at me, pay me. Sod off Gerry.

viv said...

I thought Kate and Gerry's major cash grabbing project was scheduled in a Portuguese Court in May.

So what is happening in the case of Madeleine, Amelie, Sean, & Mummy and Daddy too, v Goncalo Amaral?

Did it occur to them they took a bit of a bruising last time and the real truth got slipped out by Mr Menezes? Did Sean say don't worry Daddy I will just go after him with my sword being the aggressive little blighter you are training me to be, just like you?

viv said...

Just reminds me of someone....esp. "extreme manipulative behaviour"

How to spot a psychopath at work
commuters generic
On the way to work. But who will they find there?
How well do you know your colleagues' personalities? Researchers warn some of them may have psychopathic traits.

But they say this is nothing to be worried about.

They will not be violent, but their psychopathic traits will allow them to climb the career ladder, New Scientist magazine reports.

Professor Robert Hare, of the University of British Columbia says "corporate psychopaths'" arrogance and focus helps them succeed.

They may also be superficially charming, prone to fly into rages and likely to take credit for colleague's achievements.

Professor Hare estimates that around one per cent of the population of North America could be described as psychopaths.


He has developed the 'Business Scan 360' test, along with New York industrial organisational psychologist Paul Babiak in order to detect them.

People do say that you're a psychopath if you're violent and a successful businessman if you're not
Paul Corry, mental health charity Rethink
The test involves interviewing people working with the person concerned to get a '360 degree' assessment of their personality.

They are currently interviewing 100 people convicted of fraud or embezzlement - who will serve as a benchmark of the ultimately undesirable employee.

They will then interview a "normal" population of managers, and a group of high flyers to see if they can distinguish exactly which traits lead to career success and which have less desirable consequences.

Mr Babiak said: "If you imagine the conscientious employee at one end of the continuum and a prototypical 'corporate psychopath' at the other end, the test attempts to gauge where the individual is."

Paul Corry, of the mental health charity Rethink, told BBC News Online: "It shows that mental health is an issue all around us."

He said there was also lots of evidence that people who were highly motivated and highly successful - particularly in finance and business - had some psychopathic traits.

"These are people who are extremely focussed on achieving their goals, and who are not too concerned about other people's feelings.

"There are other people who have very narcissistic traits; they want to be centre-stage and their needs have to be put first."

He added: "People do say that you're a psychopath if you're violent and a successful businessman if you're not."

Psychopathy is defined as a lack of empathy for others, or a conscience, and can be associated with extreme and manipulative behaviour.

This is distinct from psychosis, a group of mental illnesses, including schizophrenia.

S.B. said...


Lol, brilliant posts! The last in particular wraps-up our beloved Gerry into a nice parcel, with pretty birthday paper and nice little pink bows ~ an unforgettable present awaiting the return of their abducted daughter. You remember the one Gerry?

The Lone Ranger strategy? I think it is possibly a combination of the two options. It must be very difficult to maintain a relationship if a genuine tragedy occurs but to continue to live in unison when eaten up with guilt and so desperate as these two obviously are, must be nigh on impossible. Maybe they need that extra bit of space ~ her in London and him in the Scottish highlands. The alternative? I still wonder if Kate’s sudden freedom is a Gerry concession, on the complete understanding that she maintain the solemn look of a troubled soul and only sticks to his scripted interviews. Oh and of course be seen to be charitable at all times! All his previous schemes have failed so a complete strategy 'review' is now imperative, hence Kate’s restricted freedom!

No, I don't think they dare do the crucify Amaral production again ~ far too risky, even for Gerry’s audacity!

But why oh why do they continue to behave as if nothing is amiss. Donate to the 'official' save Gerry fund, give! give! give! ~ save our souls. There is perhaps a few deluded folk out there who still believe in their innocence but not 2 million quids worth. So, as you say, they must continue to rely on a few scraps thrown to them by the lesser media magnates! Or maybe the game plan is to eventually claim the 2 million pound reward.

S.B. said...

Evening all.....,

I have just committed the ultimate sin ~ a visit to a certain website that shall remain nameless (in order to preserve my reputation).

In case you have not already been tempted by curiosity to do the same, I urge you to take a quick look at the latest verbiage of a certain professional human rights crusader, who shall also remain nameless.

A letter to the CEOP and an open letter to the Mccanns and their chief public relations pundit. Makes for some very entertaining reading ~ if the whole thing wasn't so serious! This bloke is a liability!

I don't think I need say more....

viv said...

Hiya again SB and thanks for your interesting response.

I suppose sometimes when considering the antics of these two, especially Gerry, you just cannot help but laugh. It has always seemed like a black comedy running alongside a terrible tragedy really. The two putting on the comedy show never quite managing to have the capacity to understand that losing little Madeleine was a terrible tragedy.

Only normal outsiders looking in appear to appreciate that. It is not an opportunity to become the wealthy and famed Kate and Gerry Show with one bizarre publicity and money making stunt after another. From the very earliest days, they separate themselves out from the norm in terms of being "loving parents" that is for sure.

But how are they going to explain not proceeding with this ONE MILLIONS POUNDS action against Goncalo Amaral? The interviews with someone they clearly do not like but it pays well in Portugal and others in Spain clearly suggest they are desperate for cash.

I think the first part of their action, shutting Goncalo up, would have got the backing of those in legal authority in both Portugal and UK. But scamming a load of money out of him as well? As you say every hair brained scheme Gerry has devised has been a catastrophic failure.

Now if you are talking about an inveterate funny letter writer, who also likes his fifteen minutes of fame and adulation, I think I can guess who you have been reading. Those letters just make me sharply suck in my breath with amazement and yes, quite often have a good chuckle. The allegations that are made against organs of the State based upon what he read in the News of the World are quite simply priceless!

viv said...

Oh I just logged on to Jo Morais and found what you are talking about now SB, Gerry's 81 mile cycle through Perthshire and please send the donations to me, signed Gerry, lol!

And at 16 miles per hour! I am sure he can russle up a coronary monitor bless him.

It is weird the way we are now getting personalised messages from one or the other of them on their webpage, rather than as a couple, and as you say they could not be further apart, him up in Scotland and her down in London. Maybe that is what would suit them best, but the poor twins stuck in the Midlands?


viv said...

In the Madeleine Fund accounts on Jo's page Jon Corner is listing his others interests. River Media which he has been running since 1998 and another company Keekoscape which he dissolved in June 2007. I wonder what that company used to trade in?


Kate McCann is described as Mrs McCanns rather than Dr McCann as Gerry is. Has she formally renounced all title to be a doctor and if so why?

hope4truth said...


The 81 mile ride is to raise money for Macmilian Cancer Care. As far as I can make out from other sites you are allowed to raise money for other charities though...

As Maddies Fund is a Limited Company I am not sure how he is allowed to take over this very important event to raise money for a very worthey cause to keep his defence fund company still up and running????

He will be stealing candy from babies next there is no depth to how low they will sink to keep begging for cash...

Poor little Maddie must just wait until the time is right for them to ask for the case to be reopened another year or so in a peado hell hole is fine no reason to belive she has been harmed...

When they decide it is time she came back no doubt she will be all over the world doing chat shows on how wonderful her parents are "They negelcted me and I have spent 3 years in hell but I am a stronger perosn for it god bless my Mum and Dad"

Sick twisted bastards each and every one of the T9 I hope if Maddie really was taken they each go through the hell they have left her in...

If she was killed or given away I just hope they spend time in jail for perverting the course of justice....

S.B. said...

Me again....,

The problem is 'Hope' you are looking at this through the eyes of a normal, well balanced human being, which is something that is completely alien to our friend Gerald. Although not versed in psychology I think of him as a maniac, totally incapable of self control and therefore unable to perceive normal, sane thought processes. For this reason he cannot perceive how normal people judge him to be ~ nor do I think he cares.

Viv suggested recently that he probably trawls all these blogs and has a blooming good laugh at our reactions to all his machinations. I have been thinking on the same lines for a long time. Whilst I found Viv's vision of him trying to slap himself on the back absolutely hilarious I am nonetheless angered by the idea of his source of entertainment. He can laugh at me as much as he likes but this is not how it is ~ he is actually laughing about the fate of his little daughter and how he has managed to weave such a tangled web of lies, deceit, fabrication and above all else confusion!

From my comments please do not think that I do not take this case seriously. Apart from having a penchant for humour, somehow our dear Gerald leaves himself wide open to ridicule and I can't resist the temptation to react accordingly.

Taking candy from a baby? Have they not already done that with the twins?

viv said...

Hiya both

The basic purpose of a charity, required by law is that it benefits the public, not an individual. So what are McMillan Cancer Research doing allow Gerry McCann to hijack this event.

Charities can be very aggressive about their presence in the media, need to fundraise and be very proactive in seeking donations. In that respect Gerry is borrowing from accepted practice of large charities, but in the most fundamental respect, he has made himself a charitable object.

The title of their Fund, Madeleine'f Fund is just highly offensive IMO. They alone are responsible for the disappearance of their own daughter and brought in Control Risks Group in the first few weeks to manage the risks to themselves. They obviously took on board the very real likelihood of police and public suspicion falling upon them.

But that is precisely what is so repulsive about Gerry McCann, he cares not one little bit how much the police or the public suspect him, the fact is as he shouted at Sandra Filgeiuras, there is no evidence. Of course what he means by that is no hard evidence as to what precisely they did with her, because if you just load your child into a bag, walk out with her and hand her to some other in a car what evidence would there be?

There is an abundance of evidence they were involved in her disappearance but Gerry is walking a tightrope, certainly in the earlier days very confident that will never translate into sufficient evidence to actually formulate specific legal charges against him.

His increasing displays of rage are an indication he no longer has that level of confidence in his own ability to con and deceive.

His association with McMillan Cancer is both disastrous for them in terms of their caring and charitable image and disastrous for Gerry in terms of being perceived to be prepared to latch onto any object or cause to proliferate both money and the perception of his innocence. He still does not have the capacity to understand how counter productive his efforts are. But McMillan really ought to.

That is one of the saddest things IMO about the McCanns. When parents genuinely get a child snatched off the street, being one genuinely does happen on rare occasions, will they be disbelieved because of a couple of serious scamsters called Kate and Gerry McCann who set their own daughter up to be "abducted" by deliberately and intentionally "neglecting" her. When people are asked to give to Cancer Research or to provide McMillan nurses for people who are dying a terrifying and painful death, will they say no, the vision of smirking Gerry coming into their mind's eye?

Is there just nothing that is sacred or safe from the insidious harm perpetrated by Gerry and Kate McCann?

viv said...


I am not so sure Gerry would be smirking and trying to slap himself on the back if he reads this blog.

I think it would be the other face he has, because that always make people like Gerry very angry indeed, one who can see right through them.

But those going "woof woof", he would seriously enjoy!

hope4truth said...


I will copy this onto the new thread in case you miss it here (as it is so important LOL)....

I agree I am looking at this as a normal person and the McCanns are far from normal...

Yet their problem is most of the population reading their rubbish are normal....

The latest blured image has been built up as very important yet 3 years have passed and they only release it now????

I have to wonder on which anniversary they will rescue their child because as far as I can see there is no great hurry to do so...

If she really was abducted they have to be the sickest parents ever to walk the earth with no reconstuction and Mummy still staying silent....

If she was given away to a decent family then long may she stay safe with them...

If she is dead and they hid her body then they should shut up and get on with the life they did not want to loose because of their neglect (or something more evil)...

I still have no idea what happend but Kate knows she was there???

Let them keep spinning and interviewing they say the most heartles and odd things......

99% sure the DX is taking the rise out of them by printing such odd stories 3 years too late...

If this photo is the important clue that will re open the case what the hell have they been paying their crack detectives for?