23 Sep 2009

Kate goes back to Portugal, but not PDL


Breaking News

The McCanns giving one of their very rare "press conferences", well rare in Portugal anyway. They are also hiring some PRs over there to try and make the Portuguese people like them again, I am sure that will be one big success. Just as they deserve...Shame Gerry always looks so shifty though! Nothing shifty about people who think they need PR people, people who say their daughter was abducted by a stranger.

10:46am UK, Wednesday September 23, 2009
Kate McCann has returned to Portugal for the first time since being quizzed by police over her daughter Madeleine's disappearance, her spokesman has told Sky.

Sky News: First For Breaking News

"Kate and (her husband) Gerry have gone to Lisbon for a series of meetings with their lawyers and other advisers," Clarence Mitchell said.

"They are planning to be there for one day. They are not going to Praia de Luz."

Madeleine was three when she went missing in the resort of Praia da Luz in May, 2007.

Mr Mitchell continued: "It is Kate's first visit back to Portugal since 2007 and it is difficult.

"It's something that has always been daunting for her but she knew she would go back at some stage - and she's always said she'll do anything necessary to keep the search for Madeleine alive.

"If it means a trip to speak to the Portuguese media, then so be it. But she's always said she'll do anything to keep the inquiry alive.

"What keeps her going is a sense of momentum, and important meetings with lawyers and advisers are critical to the campaign."

More to follow...

Kate e Gerry McCann stated today in Lisbon that they have returned to Portugal to "find new leads and a strategy that allows to maximize the search" of their daughter Madeleine, who disappeared more than 2 years ago in the Algarve.

"It's a very important day for us and for the search of Madeleine. This can be a turning point in the search and we are willing to do whatever needs to be done to keep searching for our daughter" said Kate McCann, who spoke to the journalists together with her husband Gerry, in a press conference at a Lisbon Hotel.

The McCann couple, who have arrived today in Portugal, started by recalling that there were two judicial processes that concluded "that there are no evidences that Maddie is dead, or that we are, in anyway involved in her death".

in News Agency Lusa


Video excerpt of the Conference


Read more: http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2009/09/mccanns-lisbon-press-conference.html#ixzz0RxDaoPPU
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution Non-Commercial No Derivatives

85 comments:

hope4truth said...

"It's something that has always been daunting for her but she knew she would go back at some stage - and she's always said she'll do anything necessary to keep the search for Madeleine alive.

"If it means a trip to speak to the Portuguese media, then so be it. But she's always said she'll do anything to keep the inquiry alive.

"What keeps her going is a sense of momentum, and important meetings with lawyers and advisers are critical to the campaign."

Ok lets say I buy the above can I make some sugestions?

Kate go to the PJ and ask them to reopen the enquiry you had your chance to do this before it closed but did not bother.

While you are there answer the 48 questions that you could not be bothered to answer they were very simple and a yes or no would have been enough to answer most of them.

Drag your friends back over and do a reconstruction.

As for the lawyers YES I would absoloutley suggest having one with you when you answer the questions as I would for any innocent person arrested NEVER answer questions without a lawyer present!!!

But you only need the one for the few hours you are being questioned and it shold not cost a fortune.

As for the others you do realise people are asking why all you and Gerry do are Sue anyone who goes against you. It is actually making you look guilty dear. You had a fund of over 2 million and in your first set of accounts (which lets face it were made to look as good as possible) you spent less than 12% searching for your child. That is shameful!!!

I have been asking people recently if they have ever seen one of your posters abroad and only a few people had seen the odd one about and out of them 1 said it looked like it had been taken from a newspaper. I have never seen one (well apart from when our town centre had an area for Maddie but those were coppies) and did not stay long....

Where did all the money go Kate? I know by sueing a man who did more for your child than you did whilst in PDL may be nasty for saying she is dead but come on those dogs are not stupid and seeing them work are hard to doubt. Perhaps if you had not found Madeleines 4th Birthday such a good laugh people may still belive you???

If Madeleine is missing you are the most evil Mother I have ever read about playing the games of spin not searching for her and holding back from answering those questios you cant play with her life it is cruel and unforgivable.

If she is dead then there is no more you can do apart from keep it all together and be there for the twins. I can understand that and cant imagine the pain of loosing a child in this way (whatever happend)but leave people alone sadly there are thousands and thousands of people who dont belive you they may not all blog about it but dont belive a word you say.

You could do something to put that right Kate if she really was taken stop playing games your own detective now wants the LCN DNA that you rubbished does he belive you? Oh and a tip if you are not trying to set up Jane and Madeleien was really taken would there be a reason she had to give anyone an alibi??? I cant belive if she was taken you still trust your freinds I would not trust anyone who was with me worked there and would even be looking at my Husband a man I have been with for 20 years and is my best freind and a fantastic father who I trust with my life and wondering what if???? I would not welcome the thoughts but as much as I love him nothing comes before my girls....

Wizard said...

Call me cynical but Kate steadfastly refused to return to Portugal until the call of the cash registers – ker…ching ££££.

The McCann’s are only returning to discuss with their lawyers how to winkle out money from Amaral. It doesn’t matter how Mitchell spins it this is their motive.

What a crock!

viv said...

Great post Hope

There is one specific question I would like her to answer and I find it very strange "as Madeleine's mummy" that she refused to do so:

were you considering transferring custody of Madeleine to a relative?

The Police surely must have had a reason to answer that question and Kate surely must have had a very guilty reason to refuse to answer it. But what she did manage to say when it was put to her the refusal to answer question would hinder the investigation into Madeleine

"yes if the investigation says so"

So she can manage to be rude and sarcastic. To me that demonstrated zero concern for her little girl because the real police have a damned sight more chance of finding her than "Metodo 3" or Dave Edgar or Oakley International. They are just a criminal disgrace.


Wiz, I agree there is only one reason Kate wants to go back to PDL, the ring of the cash registers, dreaming about how much cash they can sting Goncalo Amaral for. Do they care about his children or many others he is supporting, well no, they want countless thousands for their own, including one who they did not care about on 3 May and they claim have no idea where she is, so what does Madeleine need all that money for? Do they think we are stupid?

hope4truth said...

Hello Both

Saw it on the news that they want 1.2 million from Amaral while I was at work what kind of people sell thier daughter the way they have???

Portugal is a beautiful country and it is about time it took to task these two scummy parents who thought leaving their children alone every night to go to a bar was ok and after the people of PDL gave up over a week to help search for their child (something they never did)they employ people to take away the livings and the peace these people once enjoyed...

I hope they take thier 30 pieces of silver and explain one day to St Peter how he cant refuse them entry into the kingdom of Heaven because if he does they will trash its reputation and sue him...

Portugal has evidence not released on the DVD it is about time they took a chance and charged the McCann's over the disapearence of their child. Let all the evidence come out in court for everyone to hear I dont care if they are found guilty or innocent but let the world see how these two parents have created a circus around a 3 year old child and turned her into the forgotten victim of their own sick parenting...

viv said...

Hiya Hope

I just had a look on Joana Morais blog and she has a video where Clarence is saying they are there on a short working trip to meet their lawyers and OTHER ADVISERS he used that rather innocuous phrase a few times. I suppose he did not want to tell us they are PR bods because it just makes them sound a bit crap and naff really, but the Mirror hve the story:

From Daily Mirror

«Mr Mitchell said discussions between the couple, both 41 and from Rothley, Leicestershire, would remain private. But it is understood that, as well as updating lawyers about the search for their daughter, who would now be six, they will be meeting representatives from a new PR agency, whom they hope can turn public opinion in Portugal in their favour.»

I wonder how the Tell Isabel campaign went and how much that cost!

viv said...

They attack and ridicule Portuguese Police, they threaten to sue the PJ, they even sue Goncalo Amaral, they commit a cardinal sin to most Portuguese parents, they left their beautiful little children alone to cry and then they think a PR AGency can make the Portuguese people love them again?

Well I think they better remember how they laughed and jogged whilst Portuguese people and Portuguese Police were looking for their little girl. Then they better try and drag themselves back into reality., Popularity and innocence are not commodities you can buy and chilren are not a valuable commodity you can trademark for masses of cash. Children are priceless. They disgust me.

viv said...

Wednesday September 23 2009 by Emily Garnham for express.co.uk
THE MCCANNS have returned to Portugal together for the first time since being grilled by police over their daughter Madeleine's disappearance.

Kate McCann and husband Gerry travelled to Lisbon to update their lawyers on the ongoing search for Madeleine, who was just three when she went missing in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz.

Although her husband has been back, this is Kate’s first visit since 2007.

The couple’s spokesman, Clarence Mitchell, said: “They will be attending a series of meetings with their lawyers and advisers in Lisbon and they are planning to return to the UK tonight.

“Obviously this is Kate’s first return to Portugal since Madeleine’s abduction and, whilst this is undoubtedly difficult for her, she remains determined to do whatever is necessary to assist in the search for her daughter.”

One of the topics discussed will be the recent injunction against further publication of a book by disgraced former Portuguese police detective Goncalo Amaral, who was involved in the initial investigation.



Maddie and the ground floor apartment in Praia Da Luz where she went missing

In his book, The Truth Of The Lie, he claims Madeleine is dead and questions the McCanns’ account she was taken while they were eating with friends nearby.

Earlier this month a Portuguese judge banned further sale or publication of the book and ordered Mr Amaral not to repeat his claims about Madeleine or her parents.

At one point Portuguese police made Mr and Mrs McCann “arguidos”, or formal suspects, in their daughter’s disappearance.

They were questioned by detectives but their arguidos status was later lifted.

Mr Mitchell said discussions between the couple, both 41 and from Rothley, Leicestershire, would remain private.

But it is understood that, as well as updating lawyers about the search for their daughter, who would now be six, they will be meeting representatives from a new PR agency, whom they hope can turn public opinion in Portugal in their favour.

Earlier this month, Gerry criticised Mr Amaral, labelling claims in his book “unforgivable”.

He feared the book's damaging claims had hampered the search for missing Madeleine.



SEARCH UK NEWS for:

Commenting after the injunction was imposed, he said: “There’s a lot of people in Portugal, who might have evidence, that believe Madeleine is dead.

“If people believe that, they won’t search for her and they won’t come forward with information.

“I know for a fact people have been told Madeleine is dead. There is no evidence to support that and that is unforgivable.”

RELATED STORIES ON EXPRESS.CO.UK

'POSH SPICE' APPEALS RAISES 1,000 LEADS IN MADDIE HUNT
MISSING MADDIE: I KNOW HOW SHE WAS TAKEN



Kate and Gerry McCann at a church in Portugal, 2007
MADELEINE SEARCH 'WRECKED OUR LIFE'
MADELEINE SEARCH FOCUSES ON AUSTRALIA

The decision to impose the injunction came after a year-long campaign by the McCanns’ lawyers to prevent the publication of the book and a subsequent DVD.

Another topic of discussion between the McCanns and their Portuguese team today is thought to be a possible compensation claim against Mr Amaral.

The couple said earlier that any money awarded by the courts would be ploughed straight back in to paying for private investigators to probe their daughter’s disappearance.

In our exclusive video above, Donal McIntyre conducts a cold case review. Click here to read more about his findings in our Sunday Express news report.

viv said...

Just read on MM ITV ran a similar theme, our media are playing up to the fact that Kate has only just returned to Portugal and the topic of discussion will be them suing Goncalo Amaral.

Now you would not need to be mastermind to see that Kate is not doing all she can to search for her daughter given it took her two whole years to return, she is doing all she can to cash in. Making herself look really bad. Another big PR disaster, but never mind they are hiring some PR people to put that right.

viv said...

THE MCCANNS have returned to Portugal together for the first time since being grilled by police over their daughter Madeleine's disappearance.


What an opener, nice one Daily Express!!

viv said...

Kate e Gerry McCann stated today in Lisbon that they have returned to Portugal to "find new leads and a strategy that allows to maximize the search" of their daughter Madeleine, who disappeared more than 2 years ago in the Algarve.

"It's a very important day for us and for the search of Madeleine. This can be a turning point in the search and we are willing to do whatever needs to be done to keep searching for our daughter" said Kate McCann, who spoke to the journalists together with her husband Gerry, in a press conference at a Lisbon Hotel.

The McCann couple, who have arrived today in Portugal, started by recalling that there were two judicial processes that concluded "that there are no evidences that Maddie is dead, or that we are, in anyway involved in her death".

in News Agency Lusa


Video excerpt of the Conference


Read more: http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2009/09/mccanns-lisbon-press-conference.html#ixzz0RxDaoPPU
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution Non-Commercial No Derivatives


So at the same time as they are suing people and closing webpages down for daring to state they killed Madeleine, they feel the need to go to Portugal at last, and tell us

"there is no evidence that Maddie is dead, or that we are, in anyway involved in her death".

Ah, so now we see what it is all about, defending themselves and trying to make out they are searching whilst they are cashing in and suing, OK we understand.

viv said...

Di emailed me, her little grandson is having a hard time with really bad colic and so nan has been doing a lot of nursing to give her daughter a break. I hope they will all feel better soon.

She asked me to post this for her because she was having trouble posting and obviously has more important things to be worrying about right now!

I think Di is probably right, they realise these actions they are taking to protect themselves are having a bad effect on public opinion. The timing of this alongside actions against both Tony Bennett and Goncalo is pretty obvious really. They just cannot have it all ways, I think they need to realise that. But yes, it has to be bad to get Kate over there!

Hi all

I can't understand why Gerry and Kate needed to make another circus out of their visit to Portugal. They could have easily slipped in and out, like celebs do all the time, without anyone knowing.

Something imo is clouding their horizon, and they are desperately trying to get public opinion on their side, and I hope I am not wrong. For Kate to go back to Portugal something is not right.

viv said...

Oh dear, I have also had an email from Wizard saying he cannot post on here. I do not know what is going on but can assure I have had no contact from certain lawyers!

This site continues to maintain a lawful approach that there is no evidence to confirm that Madeleine died in the apartment and that any form of harassment/vigilanteeism against the McCanns is strictly unlawful and I would never support or condone such behaviour.

Please keep trying to log in guys and remember no matter what your thoughts on this case, even if you do think Madeleine died, you are entitled to express your opinion, so long as you do not try and state that is a fact, because it is not.

xx

Oh and Clarence Mitchell or any other McCann groupy if you are messing with my blog, do one!

hope4truth said...

Testing

hope4truth said...

Oh I seem to be able to post...

How strange???

xxx

viv said...

Hiya Hope,

yea me too, it is weird!

Have you heard Goncalo went to the border Spain to speak out against the McCanns (serves them right, he may be legally in the wrong but morally he is right). There is also another report from Pt and not sure whether it is accurate where it claims the McCanns will be on a crusade to shut up blogs that dare to question them.

viv said...

Oh and guess what, for the first time I can now see my avatar, weird things going on. No one has the key to this blog other than me, so far as i know:-)))

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

yes had heard they now want to close blogs down which means there are now people out there trying to read blogs they knew nothing about they are very good at advertising things they dont want people to know about!!!

Dont they realise it is too late their is Skype hotmail mobile phones e mail letters and actually meeting in person to discuss what happend to poor Madeleine.

if kate and gerry go back to PDL answer the questions do a reconstruction people may belive them but with the 100s of random sightings all over the world and then 2 years later we are told she is 10 miles away from PDL which was not enough spin for them so we are told it is a lawless town????

I printed a whole load of stuff off the other day and put it all on a disk then stuck it in our saftey deposit box at the bank (now if that gets robbed in the next few weeks I really will be paranoid lol) but how can they stop what is already out there...

Why dont any of our papers give a damn about a neglected missing 3 year old her parents have behaved in an apaling way the laughter on her birthday was shameful but they cant see anything wrong with it...

that I am afraid is their probelem they have shown no remorse or regret for their actions blaming everyone and anyone else for what happend. If she was taken the person who took he had no right to do so but her parnets had no right to be sat in a bar out of sight and earshot of her either as for leaving the apartment unlocked when we have been told over and over she was a bad sleeper how the hell was that safe???/

Wizard said...

Testing

Wizard said...

Hi All,

Something very strange going on here. When I use my laptop I can post but cannot when I use my desk top.

Hmm...

Wizard said...

Hi,

It appears the reason I cannot post is because:-

"This webpage contains contents that will not be delivered using a secure HTTPS connection, which could compromise the security of the entire webpage."

Hmm... not sure exactly what that means. Any idea?

viv said...

Hiya Wiz

I do not have a clue what that means and still have no problems logging in at all, but cannot see my avatar again now.

Very odd

xx

Wizard said...

I see JM has been asked by solicitors to remove an article by the Evening Standard's Mark Hollingworth (published in late August 09.

The solicitors are quoting a 'D' notice restriction on this.

viv said...

Hiya Wiz and thanks for that. Very interesting, the ex MI5 man that has also been on the McCann's team, charged a fortune along with Halligen but did not last.

There just has to be more to this case than meets the eye, but in the meantime what on earth happened to poor little Madeleine?

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,
You are right whatever happened to Madeleine – I read the article below on the Mirror website – dated 25:09:09.

Nothing to do with Madeleine more her parents as usual.

“Kate and Gerry McCann were furious yesterday as it emerged the ex cop they are suing for £1.2million over claims that Madeleine is dead has written a SECOND book.
The couple have already taken legal action to ban former Portuguese detective Goncalo Amaral’s first book, The Truth of the Lie.

In his second book, The English Gag, he suggests there is something significant about a pink blanket which he claims disappeared on the night the three-year-old vanished from the resort of Praia da Luz in 2007.
A source close to the McCanns said: “They just despair. This is the level of distortion and lies they’ve been up against.”
The source refuted any suggestion that a blanket had disappeared. He said: “You could see it on the bed in the first photographs taken of the room. Amaral wasn’t even there.”

Di said...

Hi all

Just pressed preview and Hi all is in yellow so assume I am now up and running again.

I spoke to a friend yesterday and he said someone could be messing with individual isp addresses, I did not understand the jargon, but I gathered it does not mean anything sinister is going on, just idiots with nothing better to do.

Wizard

I cannot understand why JM would get a Solicitors letter saying there is a D notice on this ex MI5 person, Google and you can find him easily on the internet. They must be really worried about the JM site.

Wizard

The pink blanket again. I cannot understand what GA is trying to tell us, any thoughts?

viv said...

Hiya Wiz and Di

Oh lol, Goncalo is at it again!

Early reports in the press always said that Madeleine was seen being carried off in a blanket. Interestingly they also said that Jane saw this when she had just left her apartment, rather than going back to do a check.

I wonder if Goncalo's second book is going to scare the McCanns even more in that it is nearer to what really happened. May he just wrote the first one to draw them out as it were?

Googling provides a link to here with the full unexpurgated version:-))

I think just too much of the truth is coming out for the McCanns and find it impossible to believe this solicitor's letter is nothing to do with the McCanns, as you say he is already all over the net!

viv said...

See this extract from The Times Oct 07 referring to the pink blanket, you can actually see it on the picture the McCanns released, also she was returning from her apartment NOT GOING

A picture of the man suspected of abducting Madeleine McCann from her bed has been given to private detectives investigating her disappearance. The image has been compiled from evidence given by a woman who says that she saw Madeleine being carried away from an Algarve holiday flat shortly before she was reported missing 176 days ago.

It shows a white man carrying a girl wearing pink-and-white pyjamas similar to those worn by Madeleine on the night she disappeared, wrapped in what appears be a child’s pink blanket.

The man is approximately 35 to 40 years old, of medium build and about 5ft 10in. He has dark collar-length hair and is wearing a dark jacket, light beige trousers and dark shoes. He was allegedly seen by Jane Tanner, one of the McCann family friends, at 9.15pm on May 3. About 45 minutes later Madeleine was reported missing from her bed in Praia da Luz.

Kate and Gerry McCann, from Rothley, Leicestershire, commissioned the picture from a British artist because they are convinced that this is the man who abducted Madeleine and that he may still be holding her alive.

Ms Tanner, 36, says that she saw him as she returned to the tapas restaurant in the Ocean Club resort where the McCanns were dining with seven British friends. She told police that she did not realise the significance until Mrs McCann checked on her three children at 10pm and found Madeleine, who was almost 4, missing.

viv said...

and in the second half of the article, the MCCANNS THREATENED TO SUE THE PJ IN THE FIRST FEW WEEK for not releasing the image, the PJ claiming they were concerned because Tanner's account kept changing. Too right it does, blanket or not blanket, coming or going!!

Portuguese police had refused to release details of Ms Tanner’s claims for more than three weeks and only made a public appeal after the McCanns threatened legal action. A senior police source said that they had not released the description because Ms Tanner’s evidence had changed over time and they feared it could hinder their inquiry. A previous police impression of another suspect was described as “an egg with hair”.

The new picture is far more detailed and clearly bears no resemblance to Robert Murat, a British man who was made an official suspect ten days after Madeleine’s abduction. Mr Murat, 33, who lives less than 100 yards from the McCanns’ holiday apartment, has strenuously denied any involvement.

Mr and Mrs McCann have been deeply unhappy with the Portuguese police investigation and are using private investigators in Britain and Spain as part of an international hunt for their daughter.

The picture of the suspect has been handed to investigators who are working across Europe and North Africa but are legally banned from operating in Portugal.

The McCanns believe that their daughter is being held on the Iberian Peninsula or North Africa and, on Wednesday, promoted a new confidential information line staffed by private detectives to collect details of possible sightings.

The picture was handed to the Spanish Antena 3 television channel before they gave their first interview since being made official suspects in their daughter’s disappearance.

During an emotional interview Mrs McCann, 39, told the 360 Grados show: “I think she is possibly being held by someone in their house but I don’t know. I strongly believe Madeleine is out there and we have to do everything we can.”

However, in a telephone vote held after the programme was aired on Wednesday night, nearly 70 per cent of callers said that they thought the McCanns were not telling the truth.

Mr and Mrs McCann hope that a review of the Portuguese police investigation will uncover evidence missed by the original inquiry team and prove that they were not involved in their daughter’s disappearance.

Ms Tanner and her partner, Russell O’Brien, a hospital consultant from Exeter, are expected to be reinterviewed by Portuguese detectives.

Mr McCann will return to work next week as a consultant cardiologist at Glenfield Hospital in Leicester. He wants to bring some normality back to family life for the sake of his two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie.

viv said...

It is interesting The Times, in October 2007, above tell us Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien are to be interviewed again by Pt detectives.

Then we have this from the book of Goncalo Amaral, referring to the thinking of Harrison, NPIA, drawing on research statistics, that in only the most tiny minority of cases of child homicide including sexual abuse is the perpetrator a stranger to the child. "In only 4% of them is the murderer or abductor a total stranger to the victim" So in his book, Goncalo himself is suggesting that Madeleine may have been murdered or ABDUCTED by someone close to her :

The figures quoted in the report he hands over give us the shivers. The crimes, including those of a sexual nature, are committed by the parents in 84% of cases; 96% are perpetrated by friends and relatives. In only 4% of them is the murderer or abductor a total stranger to the victim. In this roundabout way, Mark Harrison points out that the guilty party may be a person close to Madeleine, and even her own parents. From now on, we have to explore this track, especially as the others have proved fruitless."

Wizard said...

Hi Di,

The pink blanket was seen clearly on Madeleine’s bed, near the pillow, along with cuddles cat. The photograph was taken by the pj just after Madeleine went missing.

However it appears to have disappeared later on and Amaral’s view is that it was used at a later date as a funeral blanket.

Well who knows may be he is right. It’s strange when KM was on Oprah she mentions the blanket saying she hoped whoever took M was keeping her warm in her blanket. Which of course was not possible as it was left in the apartment after M went missing.

Amaral thinks the missing blanket is significant and the McCanns say they do not know what happened to it. Hmm..

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,

Yes – Tanner did say the man who she saw was carrying the child in a pink blanket but appears later to change her story – no doubt when she found the blanked was still in the apartment.

viv said...

Hiya Wiz

Well maybe Gerry did carry Maddie off in the pink blanket, but having handed her over again, brought it back?

I see Goncalo has now filed a defence to their action and says he is going to call some British Police Officers. Interesting! I am wondering whether Brit cops will be allowed to give evidence in a civil action given this is an ongoing criminal case and confess I do not know the answer to that, but think it could put them in a very difficult position. I do not think they could be forced to go and give evidence for Goncalo in Portugal.

Even ex police officers are still bound by The Official Secrets Act.

If Goncalo is simply hoping to rely upon them because they also thought Madeleine died in the apt I do not think that would help him. Because he has gone further than saying that is what he thinks, in the documentary for example he said, I will prove, I think that is what gave the McCcanns a cause of action against him given what the Pt prosecutor ultimately said. But I still think they will live to seriously regret taking this action against Goncalo, it will open up a can of worms, that they should have had the sense to keep the lid tightly closed on. Because they obviously are involved in her disappearance even if not in the precise way that Goncalo claims.

A Brit police officer's opinion would not prove anything as a fact but even so looks very bad for the McCanns because if they were allowed to willing to give evidence they would perhaps set out all their reasons for thinking that way and there are so many powerful reasons for thinkng the McCanns were involved. They are right to be fearful and they really ought to look before they leap. How much good did the High Court action do them!!

hope4truth said...

Morning

that is the thing though isnt it Viv sadly when a child goes missing it is very often the parents who are suspected of what ever happend to them...

It is not nice fair or helpful if the parents are not involved but even in the case of cot death police question the parents (which is so very cruel) but I suppose it has to be done (Gently I would hope)....

My Dad thinks the McCann's are strange but thinks they cant possibly be immune to prosecution if the evidence is there. I told him there is loads of evidence of them behaving in an odd uncaring way (from the first time they left their children)to the ribbons in Kates perfect hair and all the other strange things I guess they just have not got anything concrete.

Mum said yesterday they had both ended up with a copy of the same paper in the week and Kate was on the cover and she had said to my Dad I wonder what Hope makes of all this. He replied that he had asked someone for the first time what they thought and it was not long before the whole office was giving their opinion and he was shocked that no one believed her and some of the comments were very harsh... I dont think any of the opinion was from the web the leaflet it was bassed on the fact they look so damn happy and try as they might to look sad it is so false...

Kate looks ill but I am sure the stress of being found out and someone producing DNA that was kept back from the FFS must be scaring her half to death.

It is sad that Madeleine has been sold out and her parents care more about sueing anyone who dares to say they are crap parents and not just buying what they are selling but when a 3 year old neglected child is missing and it is not being investigated by anyone other than the main suspects something is not right and I dont care who the child is if we just say they are not as important as the parent who neglected them many more will be in danger....

They cant refuse a reconstruction refuse to answer questions hire spin dr's and many expensive lawyers to sue people without making themselves look guilty. Guilty of what I dont know but they left her in an unlocked room to go to a bar so the blame starts with them and ends with what ever happend next.

Wizard said...

Hi,

Joana Morais has a very fair article from today’s Sunday Express which does not appear in online editions or has been removed.

“THE wife of Portuguese detective Gonçalo Amaral has denied they are locked in a personal battle with Kate and Gerry McCann and has spoken of their pity for the distraught couple.”

Well worth a read as it isn’t all one sided for a change - which is refreshing in itself.

hope4truth said...

Thanks for that Wizard

It was a very fair article and the first I have read to show GA in a good light in a well balanced way.

The DX was where most of us started to post and to me it was obvious the paper did not belive the McCann's version of events although they did seem to take the Pros side more in moderation some of the articles were bang on and when the rogs came out much of the speculation and rumours turned out to be true....

I think they made a huge mistake with their choice in spin if Madeleine was not taken and they are involved in a huge cover up they would be home and dry now if they had not spun laughed blogged and said yes to interviews. They would have faded away as "remember that poor couple who's child was taken when they were on holiday a couple of years ago"

They have not spent much on searching for her out of a fund of 2 million they spent less than 12% on searching for her and as I have said before I have yet to find anyone who has seen masses of posters anywhere and they say they spent a small fortune on them?

Investigate the fund and it may all come tumbeling down it is very very sad but very very true money is the route of all evil...

viv said...

hiya Hope

I think that yes parents are automatically the main suspect when a child 4 goes missing. This is the most dangerous age for a child to be victim of parental homicide.

But I think there was a unique situation here.
The McCanns were not in their home country and used a large amount of political pressure to deflect attention from themselves. The Pt Police were in a very difficult position not being able to really go for the McCanns as they would have done without interference if they had been Portuguese subjects. That, I believe, caused a lot of damage to the investigation because there was so much pressure on them to focus on a stranger abduction instead of doing the obvious and looking really long and hard at the McCanns and their friends who were obviously telling a lot of contradictory lies. Saying they are being helpful but in reality providing stunted statements where it can be seen they were saying as little as possible.

There seems to have come a point where British Police were saying but this couple are obviously involved and the dogs were brought over but by this stage, perhaps the trail had gone pretty cold.

You can just feel the frustration of Goncalo Amaral. He knows they were involved but was hampered in his attempts to fully investigate precisely how, but was writing that book, setting out one version of how they may have been involved such a good idea? I regret to say I really do not think it was.

viv said...

Hiya again HOpe and Wiz

I like the article in the Daily Express. It seems to go a long way in setting the record straight about Goncalo and his family. Showing them in a very different light to how some lower levels of the British press have decided to portray them.

I think Goncalo made some mistakes in the McCann case and it cost him his job, that is very sad. Losing his job, it can be seen, has had a deep psychological impact upon him. He loved his job and it is down to this McCann family that he lost it, that is bound to cause bitterness. He lost a lot of his pension too, who are we to really say he was so wrong to write that book? Sometimes that is what people feel they need to do to set the record straight, I hope it will work out well for him and his family, in the end. But am under no illusions the McCanns will stand on their strict legal rights and have no sympathy for Goncalo and his family, all they care about is doing what they set out to do in the first place. Make a fortune out of getting rid of their own little girl.

It can never be the case that two wrongs make a right, but no one can be in any doubt who is really in the wrong here, it is most certainly not Goncalo Amaral.

viv said...

Hope

I still believe this was a planned crime and the main motive was to make lots of money. I also still believe that is why agencies like SOCA were involved (but for other reasons too) and the financial side of the behaviour will cause that pack of cards to collapse in the end.

There is just no way in my opinion that Gerry McCann wil be allowed to get away with this. But I still believe Madeleine may still be alive, and the priority of the Police will be to recover her, that will come before anything else, and rightly so.


xx

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

If Madeleine is alive and well somewhere it really would be wondeful news...

What I have always found hard to understand is why the T7 have stood by them which is one of the reasons I belive she is dead.

If there was something evil going on between the adults and they could be told if they dont help and go along with the abduction theory they would be brought down with them then I can see a reason why they have not spoken out.

If it was an aranged adoption it seems strange that any of them would go along with that there lives have been tipped upside down never to be the same again I am not sure they would think it was worth it if Madeleine was safe and there was nothing to hide???

Reading between the lines in the papers they do seem to be turning Donals 3 minute op with 2 abductors and a complete clean up of their DNA was bizare and he looked so uncomfortable repeating the rubbish he was saying and today the DX tells Sofias story and Amarals family sudenly seems very close clever and decent god fearing people...

viv said...

Hiya Hope

I think you are coming the closest with this:

"If there was something evil going on between the adults and they could be told if they dont help and go along with the abduction theory they would be brought down with them then I can see a reason why they have not spoken out."

Even if Madeleine is by some miracle still alive, I doubt is she is well, any more than the children Kate and Gerry take comfort from are well, Dugard, Frizl, Kampush.

I believe Stalker was correct when he said they are hiding a terrible secret but it is not the death of Madeleine. If Maddie suffered an accidental death or even a death where Kate or Gerry lost their temper, there is absolutely no reason for the rest of the group to become embroiled in a serious criminal conspiracy and put themselves at risk. I think you just have to ask yourself what would normal doctors have done in that situation? In spite the friendship with Kate and Gerry they would not have risked a custodial sentence themselves by telling such lies. This is not just one couple we are asked to believe helped cover up Madeleine's death but three plus the mother of Fiona Payne. It is beyond belief.

I am afraid I continue to believe this was something that they were personally involved in and something so terrible the women are prepared to admit the most sickening child neglect to cover that up, rather than admit the awful truth.

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I have to wonder why the Gaspers have not been sued or turned on for daring to make a mountain out of a mole hill over the conversation between Gerry and Payne???

Then we have the Smith sighting clearly saying when Gerry returned home with Sean in his arms that he was very sure it was Gery he saw on the 3rd May carrying a child...

Two facts that are never mentioned by them and lets face it if they are innocent they have managed to spin everything else why not this???

If nothing untoward was going on then there was no need for a pact of silence or refusal to help the PJ... There is no way on earth I would cover for anyone I have my own family and looking over my sholder and having people whispering about me behind my back for the rest of my life would not be worth it...

However if the gossip is not as bad as the truth then I guess it is better to allow the gossip to go on???

Wizard said...

Hmm..Mail in sycophantic mode again today with photographs.
“Kate McCann, the mother who'll never give up the search for her missing daughter Madeleine
By Chris Brooke
Last updated at 11:15 AM on 28th September 2009
Never giving up: Kate McCann takes part in the Great Kibworth Run in Leicestershire to raise awareness for her missing daughter Madeleine
It has been a long hard road for Kate McCann over the last two years.
But the 41-year-old mother of three showed a different kind of endurance yesterday to complete a two-mile fun run.
Last week she returned to Portugal for the first time since her daughter Madeleine's disappearance in 2007.
After a visit in which she and husband Gerry met with lawyers and the local media, she was back in Leicestershire to join 800 competitors for the Great Kibworth charity run.
She ran in a vest emblazoned with a picture of Madeleine, who would now be six.
During her Portugal visit Mrs McCann told reporters she cried every day for her daughter and remains determined to 'find her and bring her home'.
Later, speaking about the visit, she said: 'I think it was a positive move and it actually felt good to be there.
'I actually felt there was a bit of support for us there now so that helps. Fingers crossed this is the turning point.
'We’ve had a lot of information come in even this far down the line, there are various reasons why they don’t come forward in the early days.
'We just need to keep going, just need to get more information and hope we get the bit we need really.'
Mrs McCann has continued her passion for jogging despite the strain of coping with the Madeleine investigation and she was one of around 800 competitors in the Great Kibworth run.
Welcome back: Gerry McCann welcomes his wife Kate McCann at the finish line
Mr McCann, who is also a keen runner, was on hand to support his wife who chose the shorter distance rather than compete in the half marathon event. “

Wizard said...

Commenting on the same story the Mirror says:-

“Kate McCann is clearly still doing all she can to make the search for missing daughter Madeleine run and run.

Taking part in yesterday's Great Kibworth Run for the Macmillan Cancer Support and other local charities near her Rothley home in Leicestershire, her vest said it all as she was met by husband Gerry.”

Di said...

Hi all

Wizard

The Mirror saying Kate is doing all she can to make the search for Maleleine run and run, there is no doubt about that as long as it suits the McCanns term of searching.

The one thing I can't understand is why the Smiths have not come forward. They alone could put a stop to the theory of them seeing Gerry carrying Madeleine that night. Why are they not doing this? Got at perhaps or too scared, been warned maybe! Keep quiet or!

R Murat has also gone very quiet, I am sure he has much to say about what went on that night and the next few days but nothing again why? or is Max Clifford waiting for the perfect moment, maximum impact!

Viv

Why did the PJ ask if Kate & Gerry were going to give Madeleine away, who mentioned this? It had to be someone very close to the family, who would have known otherwise? Who did the PJ get this information from? I for one would like to know.

viv said...

Morning all some interesting posts.

Hope, it is not possible to sue people who have given evidence to the police in a criminal investigation, their statements are privileged from any legal action based upon them.

There are aspects of the criminal inquiry the McCanns are clearly comfortable in dealing with. The dogs and anyone who dares to suggest they killed Madeleine and disposed of her body, they will sue people for saying that. That certainly suggests to me that is not what they did at all. But there has never been any question of them suing people for repeating what the Gaspars have said or the Smiths, those are areas they are clearly not comfortable in seeking to deny. I think that speaks for itself!

xx

viv said...

Wiz, I find that story in the Mail very interesting because it is entirely from the point of view of Kate, not Gerry. Her pain is etched in her face, she has been prematurely aged by this. He looks just the same. I think the Mail are perhaps dropping a few hints here.

viv said...

Back now just been doing me and Nanday our toast x

viv said...

Di/Wiz

Rather eerie the Mirror seem to be adopting the same angle only saying Kate is doing everything she can, the comment "her husband" seems a bit odd!

I am sure the press know a heck of a lot more than they are allowed to tell us.

Police witnesses would have been warned not to speak about this case. As for Murat, I still think he may have been involved. It is odd the way he dashed back to PDL on 1 May, very odd I think. But it couldbe mere coincidence. But Gerry's reaction..do you know Robert Murat, I am not going to comment on that. As we know, suspects in very serious criminal cases like to go " no comment".

Like you Di, I believe the person who told the police Kate was considering transferring custody must have been a close family member to know that, but I suppose close friend is also possible. They clearly had intelligence that led them to ask that question and it was highly abnormal for Kate to refuse to answer that, indeed answer it with complete fury I can certainly say that would have been my own reaction.

I just think Gerry worked on those feelings..but even so, she was distraught, and "they have taken her" involuntary anguish, pure agony in fact.

I think Kate is in really deep and genuinely does have this forlorn hope she will get her back.

viv said...

But why would she have been thinking of transferring custody. Would that have been because she did not bond with this little girl who she claims cried for 18 hours a day. Or would that have been because she feared for her safety? I am thinking of those comments she just had a really bad feeling and did not want to go on that holiday.

I am not sure about Kate, but deep down something tells me, instinct really that woman is in deep pain and does deserve some sympathy, I just think she is in the most terrible situation and in her own way is doing what she thinks is right for Madeleine.

hope4truth said...

What I am about to type is terrible but it is something i have felt for a long time.

Madeleine was lovely I would have been very proud to have her if she were my child but she was not beautiful in fact the picture they use of her all the time with her make up on actually makes her look very vague she is either deeply unhappy or something just does not look right.

The tennis ball picture she looks cute the one by the pool she looks lovely to but he one chosen to make us all know her the second we see her is completly diffrent in fact it does not look like the same child...

Then look at the pictures of Amelie she is a petty little thing lovely blonde hair in a pony tail cute and happy looking (even though her family are going through the hell of loosing Madeleine)...

Something is not right all children are beautiful and no matter what they look like it really does not matter they are loved just the same...

I cant help wondering if Kate never bonded with her she is a good looking woman slim and atractive was she disapointed that Madeleine looked awkward? Why put make up on a small child??? Ok children like to play but to go out with make up on is wrong somehow...

We have been told Madleine was beautiful with a special quality for the amount of time she spent in a creche or home alone on that holiday I would be amazed anyone noticed.

If my child was missing I am not sure what I would say about her I do know if I thought she was givig a peadophile her tuppence worth it would frighten me to death and I would not be laughing about it...

This is all so sad if Kate has the slightest hope her child is alive she should stop messing about and tell all now no matter what she felt about Madeleine even if she had wanted her adopted she deserves to be found and be kept safe.

hope4truth said...

Damn knew I hit that twice Viv please remove one post I have lost my bin(very careless of me) x

Wizard said...

Hi Viv and Hope,

Just been reading back.

I’ve always thought there was a strong possibility that there was something wrong with Madeleine and at 3 it was undiagnosed.

If Madeleine was difficult, as I think we have been lead to believe, the impact on her carer when the twins arrive would have made life very difficult.

I suspect Kate did not truly bond with M - perhaps if there had been a bigger gap between M and the twins Kate would have learned how to deal with her eldest daughter and bonded.

Combined with this I think the McCanns appear to believe they are still single, or just a couple and do not fully understand the responsibility of children.

They go out night after night on holiday leaving the kids alone when most of us would think twice about leaving a puppy on its own let alone 3 small children.

Physically Madeleine was a pleasant looking little girl and imo Kate wishing to give her up, if indeed she did, had nothing to do with looks.

I think it would be behaviour and the mother’s difficulty in coping especially if she wanted to gad about with her husband like a childless couple.

mandarinn said...

Hi Viv and all

Hope ,
Very interesting your reflexion about Maddie pictures.I also fell the same, not all pictures seem to be the same child, i think it is because the ones where she look more beautiful (with make up and probably taken by a person very good in photigraphy) show a a little girl almost a baby, i guess about 2 years and 6 months or so.
The more recent pictures like that with the tennis balls show a older little girl not happy.
Viv,
IMO they are so fussy in say that Maddie is alive because of money....Hope you and Nanday enjoyed the toasts

viv said...

Hiya all and Mandarinn great to see you again.

Nanday simply will not allow me to make myself a couple of slices of toast without cutting a nice juicy corner off each for him!

I agree that the picture the McCanns have wanted to focus on as representing Madeleine is very odd in that it does not really look like her. I would say she is about two and half to three and the expression, the tinted red hair and the makeup have always caused me to feel very uncomfortable. She does not look happy, she looks as though she has been made to pose for that picture and I just have to ask myself what on earth would Kate and Gerry want with having what appears to be a professional picture taken of a two years old looking like that? This would have been not very long after they had the twins and if I am being honest I have always had this feeling there was a long term plan, now we have her replacement. I really cannot handle the comments of Gerry McCann and Jon Corner describing this little girl as beautiful. It is almost like they made her up, tinted her hair and got her to pout to make her look more beautiful and just why on earth would they want to do that with a two year old? I have to say that given this clearly very old picture of her has been at the centre of their campaign I find it extremely sinister.

I tend to agree with you Hope that whilst Maddie is an average pretty little girl there is nothing special about her, she is not a child who you would mark out as being stunningly attractive as the McCanns have sought to suggest. I think there has just been so much hype to market this "commodity" it is quite repulsive.

But I do not think there was anything particularly wrong with her either other than a lack of normal love and being allowed to just be what she was, a bouncy little girl.

I do think that in some of the pictures we see, Maddie looks sad and wistful. I also think of her crying and being so upset about being taken out onto the little toy boats and given what I think happened find this particularly sad. If children have such unnatural fears at something they should find great fun, what on earth has been happening to them. What did Kate mean when she said she had a fear of pain?

There is something terribly wrong and terribly unnatural about all of this, I know that and I still think that when the truth is told, we will be horrified.

Poor little Madeleine xx

viv said...

I think I would also just want to say, they have portrayed this image of this cute, beautiful little blond girl with images of her with makeup when she was two.

But when we look at the tennis balls pic she looks so different and clearly does even have blond hair any more at all. I think I have previously mentioned, when my boys were little they all had beautiful blond hair, but now they all have mid brown hair, it is often a thing children grow out of, blond hair. Although I have always stayed blond, much darker than when I was little and with Maddie we can see Kate resorted to the hairdressers to even change the colour of her hair to co-ordinate with the dress.

I have always thought the very last thing the McCanns want is for a realistic image of Maddie to be known so that she could be recognised. What they have wanted is this marketable image of a made up little baby. Gruesome! This was a long time in the planning IMO and it is truly grotesque.

hope4truth said...

I have come to the conclusion it is now all about money...

Madeleine was a lot younger in the picture they use of her which will not help find her at all. Her face has lost the baby look from 2+ to nearly 4 is a huge stage in a childs developement.

Then we had Gerry's video of an even younger Madeleine it's soul purpose was he was being really nice to he what a lovely Daddy (still find it strange but it showed him in a very good light and where was Kate?)...

Kate who crys for her child everyday has recently been so brave and did a fun run with Fiona Payne (descriped in the press as a T7 member what a crap club to belong to child neglectors are us) and at the finish line we have a beaming picture of Kate Gerry and Fiona although to be fair it was not as beaming as the one of Gerry and Kate 9 days after she went missing on her 4th birthday...

Still maybe some fool will help pay for their legal team by sending a fiver...

Who is going to help Madeleine because the UK authorities just dont seem to care about her at all...

viv said...

Morning Hope, you are bright and early as usual!

I do not think this is just about money, I think it is also about very serious child abuse and it does remain a mystery to me as to why the McCanns are allowed to keep the twins, even though I am sure they have never planned to cause them harm, by their actions they have.

I think that Christmas 2008 video was the biggest farce with them showing pictures when the twins were still babies crawling around on the floor, therefore Maddie was only just turned two.

From having the image of Maddie aged two, we suddenly get this quantum leap to age progressed pictures of her aged 6 and even so I would say that may well have been in response to all of the criticism they have got themselves by using old pictures.

I still have the same thoughts I had in the first place, what a vile couple who could not care less for their children. Dumping them day and night instead of having the sheer joy to normal parents of lovingly caring for them and seeing them in sheer delight playing on the beach and having the fun of being allowed to stay up late with mom and dad because they are on holiday. My memories of holidays with my children when they were that age are some of my fondest memories and the way they just dumped those children at every given opportunity still fills me with horror. Even after Maddie had supposedly been abducted by a stranger they carried on dumping them and started their around the world publicity stunts. As parents, they really do beggar belief!

I do not think it is fair to say the UK authorities do not care about her. I read that every single police authority in the country has worked on this case and special grants have had to be given to LP due to the massive costs. Then there were the costs of a number of agencies having to fight the McCanns i the High Court to keep their investigations confidential, including to them. They have always been in the business of wanting to pervert the course of justice by knowing what the evidence is against them before they are even charged. Good job UK authorities see right through them!

xx

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I suppose it may be unfair to say the UK authorities do not care but it is so frustrating when no one seems to be aloud to say they have spent Madelines fund on their own leagal costs, wages and very little on what people gave their money for searching for her....

I do hope they are being investigated and the truth for Madeleine comes out if she is safe somewhere it will be fantastic but I am afraid it may all be too late for her now...

Up since 5 as it is my Baby's 16th Birthday today finished putting balloons up at midnight but was so excited I could not sleep either!!!

xxx

viv said...

hiya Hope

If the UK authorities took the attitude the McCanns are innocent then they would not hesitate to say so. The reason they cannot pass any comment is because the case remains open and they remain suspects. The Pt AG was also careful not to state he was expressly clearing them of any involvement.

If there is any prospect of finding Madeleine, no matter what condition she is in, I know that British authorities will do that, and any other country in the world, most especially Portugal and Spain would bend over backwards to assist us, but telling us what is happening could harm the police search for her.

Gerry now speaks of wanting to get the case opened in Portugal but of course he knows that Portugal would only have jurisdiction to re-open it, if there was evidence that it was a stranger who took Madeleine and not arranged by them. Given Portugal know that is not the case, it will never be re-opened there.

It is very perverse of him to say that over two years later anyway given he and his friends refused to co-operate with Pt authorities point blank at the time and of course did not ask them to keep the process open because they knew Pt would not do that. They only had three suspects and two of those are British! But I am sure they had other British suspects who did not get named. That may have prevented Russell and David going back for the rogatories as "witnesses".

How lovely of you to get up at 5 am to put on a great birthday bash for your lovely young daughter. I hope you all have a fantastic time!

xx

Di said...

Hi Viv

I have not read that Gerry wants the case re-opened, I am missing so much at the moment you will all have to forgive me.

I will post as and when I can, and try and read up as well.

Even our dog is subdued, she is not sure what to make of all the screaming :o((

x

hope4truth said...

Hi All

It is so frustrating they seem to be allowed to call all the shots and have spun themselves as the victims but the truth will out of that I have no doubt...

Love the Girls Birthdays and Christmas so much fun. Not sure where 16 years have gone to but have just got back from dinner with my parents Mr Hope and our youngest daughter and she was delighted when she walked in and her boyfriend and best friend were waiting for her (although I think it may have been easier when she was 6) we all laughed a lot though especialy when her cake came out and the staff started to sing Happy Birthday only to stop after the first line with me waving my arms about as she was in the toilet!!!!!

Di poor little boy and poor dog but mostly poor Mum Dad and Grandparents hope he grows out of the colic stage soon xxx

viv said...

Hiya again both

Di, please do not worry about being up to date, your own family must come first. Sorry to hear your new grandson even subdued your dog, it must be unsettling for him too. I am trying to imagine Nanday with a collicky baby but perhaps not, he would join in, he loves noise!

Sounds like the party went really well Hope, and yes, how quick they grow up. My eldest (35) gives me a long suffering look when I comment ooh I can just see you running around aged about 9 months and climbing out of everything:-))

My step father did not call him toady for nothing!

xx

Wizard said...

Good Evening,

This weeks Private Eye is commenting on the law and the freedom of the press to publish against a backdrop of censuring and clamping down on the freedom of expression.

There is a new breed of super-injunction which is far more oppressive than the traditional court order under which a newspaper of TV channel is (perhaps temporarily) prevented from publishing a particular allegation.

This usually includes an order that “the publication of all information relating to these proceedings or of information describing them or the intended claim is expressly prohibited.”

In other words, nobody can report that an order has been granted in court, or who applied for it. Even the identities of the judge remain a secret, and anyone who even hints at any of this “may be held to be in contempt of court and may be imprisoned, fined or have their assets seized”.

According to PE - who is one of the leading lights of the super-injunction?

None other than Messrs Carter-F@ck”,

Hmm…..

viv said...

Hiya Wiz

Is that only in the print edition because I would like to read it as I am no expert on libel and media law.

But I do think that British Police have probably asked the media not to comment further on the ongoing investigation in this case and I have always thought that if Goncalo attempted to publish his book here the Attorney General would seek an injunction to prevent that which has certainly happened in other cases.

It is certainly established in UK law that books cannot be published declaring someone guilty of a criminal offence where the case has not as yet been taken to court and guilt officially determined where it should be!

Shipman and the Wests are being cited but there were no publications until after their trial. To do so at the investigative stage would be a breach of the Official Secrets Act and to do so when there are charges but the case is sub judice is a contempt of court - breach of the Contempt of Court Act 1981.

I think that given the McCanns are prepared to sue people for suggesting they killed Madeleine they are very confident they will never be charged with that offence. If you have actually killed someone it would be extreme folly to believe that no evidence would ever be forthcoming to back that. They are not threatening to sue people like me who suggest they were involved in her disappearance in some other way, are they?

viv said...

Is Goncalo going to defiantly publish another book whilst at the same time pursuing an appeal?

What a Freudian slip from Kate, where I cuddled my daughter ONE LAST TIME if she was innocent how could she have done that??

Do we actually need to hear from Gerry he is learning to live without Maddie. He could not wait to get on with his "wider political agenda" and get back to work. In short making money was of far more concern to him.


September 24, 2009 - 00h30

If Madeleine: McCanns returned yesterday to Portugal
Amaral challenges McCanns
Gonçalo Amaral swore he would not shut up during the ban, the Civil Court of Lisbon, the circulation of the book 'True Lies' and the video in which it is claimed of death or the concealment of the body of Madeleine McCann parents. Kept his promise. The former coordinator of the PJ now comes with the book 'The Gag English' to be presented on 3 October, in the Algarve.


It is recalled that Gerry and Kate claim compensation of 1.2 million. The court's decision also prohibits Gonçalo Amaral's statement. Doing so will have to pay a thousand euros to the English family for each comment.

Amaral is not intimidated and challenges the McCanns to get the book with a quote from Mário Soares after the April 25 on freedom of expression.

Yesterday, Kate and Gerry were in Lisbon to "explore strategies" with their lawyers and advisers. The aim, according to Gerry, is "back on course and continue to demand" of Maddie, disappeared in Praia da Luz, Lagos, in 2007. To represent him before the Media, the couple hired the company announced Lift Consulting.

Visibly nervous about the first return to Portugal, Kate said they believed that her daughter is alive. "The Madeleine deserves to believe it," he said.

With a choking voice, Kate also admitted back soon to Praia da Luz: "I want to return to the place where I embraced my daughter one last time." Since Gerry says: "Although it is painful, we are learning to live without Maddie. ".

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,

I emailed you the PE article as it was a bit too long to type.

viv said...

Another one from Correia da Manha, anyone have a clue what this means? I am struggling to understand what "resources" the court accept, is it suggesting that Goncalo has had to hand over money due to his conviction in that case? If the Pt courts are taking the money he has made from the Maddie case and applying it due to his conviction in the Leonora case one could certainly say they have got it in for him, but I am probably misunderstanding and of course google translation.

But on the face of it, you can just see what Goncalo is up against, a finding in one case that he made false declarations hardly puts him in a good light when considering his declarations in the Maddie case. If it were not for the fact that the allegations in the Joanna case surfaced in 2004, long before the Maddie case, it would be tempting to think there is a conspiracy against Goncalo. I am struggling with all of this because we were being asked to accept, and I certainly do, that the McCanns were orchestrating a conspiracy to suggest how hopeless Pt Police are. But now it seems we are being asked to go one further and actually believe that Pt Judges are useless and corrupt also, but not this time from the Pro McCann lobby! There is something very wrong with all of this and I would certainly not be on the side of suggesting judges are hopeless and corrupt. Pt has the eyes of the world trained on them in relation to these matters, are we to believe they would allow their judges to behave in this way? Very odd!

26 September 2009 - 01h41

Faro: Resources in the case Joana
The Court accepted Faro resources Leonor Cipriano, the former coordinator of the PJ, Gonçalo Amaral, the inspector and Nunes Cardoso. The latter were convicted of making false allegations and document. Three inspectors were acquitted of the crime of assault to the mother of Joana. The funds went to the Evora.

viv said...

thanks Wiz will go off and have a read, these guys certainly know the law in this area!

viv said...

Thanks Wiz and I am just going to transcribe a bit more from that article, dare I say more:-)))

“In one recent application for a super injunction the QC for the Claimants explained to the Judge why a newspaper must not only be stopped from publishing its story but also banned from alluding to the gagging order: if it was allowed to rept the injunction, it would probably run a piece accusing his clients of trying to muzzle the press. Which, of course, is precisely what they were doing. The super-injunction was duly granted. “

In the previous paragraph Private Eye refer to a super-injunction obtained by “Messrs Carter Fuck”. (their spelling, not my own)

viv said...

Having been hit once and paid up, the London Evening Standard were at it again, what naughty peeps they are, this flew off the online edition ever so quickly


http://justiceformaddie.blogspot.com/search?q=exton


Full text of the article about how devastatingly hopeless and corrupt the McCanns "private investigators" are (I could think of a better way to describe them)

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,

Carter Fuck is connected to the McCanns and are also is involved in “Super Injunctions”.

Private Eye was talking about another case but CF could just have easily placed a “Super Injunction” on TV stations and newspapers etc forcing them to keep quite about the case we are interested in.

This could explain an awful lot if true. I’m inclined to think the press have been Carter F*cked with ‘super injunctions’.

As pointed out by Private Eye the press cannot mention if they have received a super injunction as, if I understand correctly, that would place them in contempt. It appears to me, if this is true, some papers get around this by criticising the McCann detectives etc rather than the McCann’s as at this point in time they would not be in contempt.

As Private Eye was talking in riddles so as not to disclose who they were talking about - because of contempt - it is difficult to understand exactly this new super injunction. I think it isn’t to far fetched to suggest that CF may have issued a number of ‘super injunctions’ on behalf of the McCanns.

What do you think?

viv said...

Morning Wiz

I think you are broadly and quite possibly correct and found your post /email to me so interesting that is why I highlighted the most recent article that I think really upset the McCanns.

So, it follows I do not think you are correct to suggest they get around it by criticising the McCann detectives because that is a direct criticism of the McCanns. We know they are very worried by this, Gerry previously posted a defence of Oakley International, as he put it following recent press comment. And when the London Evening Standard again had a serious go, they immediately had to take the article offline, I would say they were almost certainly Carter Rucked for that article that I give the link to on here, above. Additionally, we know that Joanna got a letter from Exton's solicitors.

In fact from all the evidence I can see I believe the newspapers get around it by seriously taking the piss out of the McCanns, I have seen examples in The Daily Mirror and the Daily Express that particularly highlight what I think is going on!

The Daily Mail/London Evening Standard are very hard hitting contrary to what people say, but the Daily mail are very clever in not going quite far enough to be got at IMO.

Having said all that, I still believe it is highly likely the police themselves have told the papers to seriously cool it, because they certainly do in cases like this! Not that there is really a comparator of quite so much press speculation in a serious criminal case where the police are clearly struggling to get a result. Generally the press are pretty quiet on serious criminal cases where the police are taking years to get the main suspect, but of course, we had the Pt press and the Portuguese file! Not to mention Gerry throwing blood soaked mackerals at a bunch of sharks having a feeding frenzy..

xx

viv said...

Just had an amusing thought whilst making myself a cuppa actually Wiz.

You know how Clarence used to like to comment how pleased they were Rebelo etc was considering the abduction scenario (ahem!). Well how come he is not treating us to this wisdom now loudly clapping the Daily Express on the back for so fully endorsing their views as to exactly how Maddie got, erm, ahem, abducted by a stranger?

He is uncannily quiet about something you would think he would be so, so utterly pleased about xx

In fact, when you come to think about he is uncannily quiet, full stop!

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,

I was just looking on JM's site and she has two very funny videos to view. If you haven’t seen them yet they are well worth a look at.

Yes Clarencio is very quiet. It could be to do with Amaral’s book. CM spun this story to give the impression that the book had been banned world wide.

However if I understand the book injunction correctly it is a temporary ban until an appeal is heard. The appeal could well lift the ban as the ban appears to contravene the Portuguese constitution.

If the ban is lifted on appeal the manure will certainly hit the fan. LOL

viv said...

Hiya Wiz, I will go and have a look at the videos thanks!

I think there was a lot of confusion about what the temporary injunction meant and it seems it has less teeth than we were originally led to believe with this talk of he had to gather all the books in worldwide or suffer this £1000 per day fine. I imagine it means he cannot distribute any more from Portugal or sell the copyright any further than he already has done. This almost raises one of those hysterical laughs, given they waited until he had done that in so many countries before they took any action. I am sure they were waiting until they had counted up this one million figure they are dreaming of.

Claudia was telling me last night he had 10 days to appeal the fact he was not at the hearing to make representations and 30 days to appeal the injunction itself. I would love him to be successful but somehow do not hold out a lot of hope. If he can persuade that was just his opinion and obviously a reasoned one he may be in luck, but I think he certainly seemed to go further than that, particularly with the documentary. For the most part the book is logical and reasoned it does seem a shame.

It cannot be a temporary ban until the appeal is heard, that is not how the law works. Once a judge has made an order that is in force until you appeal. But the order was interlocutory within the proceedings meaning it will stay in place until the full trial of the matter, unless of course he gets it overturned on appeal in the meantime. I hope that procedurally the judge overstepped the mark in making the order without giving Goncalo the chance to be heard, I did comment to Claudia last night, if that is correct it does not sound much like justice, that would be a great blow for the McCanns and it would be such fun to hear Clarence spinning that one. As you say maybe due to the uncertainty he is currently having to close it!

We will have to wait and see!

xx

viv said...

Well Wiz, I think Jo is very kind to give such good Portuguese lessons to all the thick Brit lawyers looking in who do not understand Portuguese and they have all the relevant words they could possibly need to know to properly advise the McCanns and swear back at Gerry even in Portuguese which he would no doubt find very impressive and think was a great way to spend the Find Maddie Fiddle, educating the Carta Mucks and Co xx

hope4truth said...

Just read the McCann Files and on the News Ticker it says Madeleine probebly being held captive in an underground cellar says Dave Edgar (or words very close to that)...

So every other child in the world goes missing and after a few days parents are prepared for the worse as it is unlikely if it was a stranger abduction that the child would be allowed to live...

Yet they know Madeleine is still alive (and of course all parents keep their hopes up that a mirical will happen)but Dave Edgar knows and the McCann's know she is still alive...

No wonder people dont believe a word they say,...

Dosent Dave think Kate is one sick bitch for not helping the police with their investigation or will he take his 30 pieces of silver from anyone who offers it...

I would sugest he has a look at here pictures from Madelines 4th Birthday not a look of fear on her face for her child just pure joy at being the centre of attention.

viv said...

Hope, I think they are all a bunch of sick bitches for blatantly refusing to attend a police reconstruction to explain all of their contradictory lies and then two and half years later telling us she is alive in a dungeon.

I am all out of words to adequately express just what i think about that!

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

Hard faced cows the tapas woman all smug on the steps of the high court (well apart from Jane she looks scared to death but I dont think her fear is for Madeleine or I could be wrong and she may look fearful for a missing child...

Fiona Kate and Gerry managed another sick smile for the cameras after the fun run fair play to Fiona though if people thought my husband was a sick twisted pervert I would not be able to hold my head up in public especialy if he did nothing to refute it....

Madeleine can stay in her cellar as far as they are concerned no help from any of them unless the press are involved and it is one of their leads...

Grrrrrrrr xxx

viv said...

Meanwhile from the Jornal de
Hiya hope, I think it is obvious the only thing that forces the Lady Kate back to Portugal is her own flagging image and purse strings, as ever they consult with their lawyers to co-ordinate the attack on Goncalo Amaral and how they can acquire his wealth. What on earth has this to do with them finding Madeleine!

From Joana Morais:


Noticias we can read the following:

Legal battle on the way

7 thousand books seized

The lawyer Isabel Duarte said that she was only authorized by the couple to speak about two cases against Gonçalo Amaral. “This does not mean that there aren't more claims”. She also said that until now seven thousand books have been seized.

Conferences in Europe

In the Civil Court of Lisbon entered today the “counterclaim” of Gonçalo Amaral to the injunction that ordered him to be silent. Pending the decision, he is considering accepting various invitations to participate in conferences all around Europe.


Read more: http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2009/09/english-gag-amaral-defies-mccanns.html#ixzz0SuAS1mGG
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution Non-Commercial No Derivatives

viv said...

Oh I forgot to mention they also engage yet another PR company in Portugal to improve their image, for what??

Would you give two hoots about your bloody image if your little girl was being sexually abused in a dungeon!

viv said...

'The English Gag’: Amaral Defies the McCanns


Gonçalo Amaral pledged that he would not be silenced by the injunction ruled by the Lisbon Civil Court, prohibiting the circulation of the book ‘A Verdade da Mentira’ and the video, which defend the theory of Madeleine McCann's death and the cadaver concealment by her parents.

He fulfilled his promise. The former PJ Inspector appears now with the book ‘A Mordaça Inglesa’ [The English Gag], to be presented on the 3rd of October in the Algarve.

Gerry and Kate seek compensation of 1.2 million. The court's decision also prohibits Gonçalo Amaral to make any statements. Doing so he will have to pay a thousand euros to the English family, for each comment.

However, Amaral is not intimidated and challenges the McCanns by starting his book with a quote from Mário Soares after the 25th of April 1974 on freedom of expression.

Yesterday, Kate and Gerry were in Lisbon to “explore strategies" with their lawyers and advisers. The objective, according to Gerry, is to “get back on course and continue to search” for Maddie, who disappeared in Praia da Luz, Lagos, in 2007. To represent them in the Portuguese media, the couple hired the Public Relations company 'Lift Consulting'.

Visibly nervous with the first return to Portugal [since they run away returned to the UK], Kate said she believes that her daughter is alive. “Madeleine deserves that we believe in her”, she said.

With a choking voice, Kate also admitted to return to Praia da Luz: “I want to return to the place where I embraced my daughter for the last time”. Gerry on the other hand said: “Although it is painful, we are learning to live without Maddie”.

viv said...

Whilst it has to be said I do not approve of Goncalo defending his theory on what apparently happened to Madeleine without any clear evidence to back that, I do applaud his stand against them and wish him well!

But I cannot help but wish that he had just stuck to the indisputable evidence against them, demonstrating their involvement and thereby avoided any case against him for "libel".

viv said...

Processo/16 - VOLUME XVIa.pdf P106 ]
Vol XVI p. 4237

xx xxxxxx xxxx
Exeter
Devon
xxx xxx

23rd April 2008

Re: Re-enactment of Events of 3/5/2008

Dear Stuart, Many thanks for your email, and for forwarding the reply from Senhor Rebelo. Also, thanks to you and your colleagues for arranging the re-interviews.

It is somewhat reassuring to see in writing from the PJ that there are “no suspicions over [us] regarding the commission of any criminal acts.” However, we heard something similar in the weeks before Kate and Gerry were made arguidos! Additionally, the thrust of the PJ’s closed questions during the re-interviews seemed only to focus on Kate and Gerry’s culpability, suspicion about our written timeline or who involved the media.

After a year of lies, accusations and intrusion, I am sure that the Mr Rebelo can appreciate our complete revulsion at what Kate and Gerry have been forced to endure. Furthermore, we cannot help but feel that the re-interviews and re-enactment are all too little and far too late.

However, the last thing we would ever want is a standoff between us and the PJ, something that would only delight and benefit the press. Kate and Gerry desperately need the cloud of suspicion over them to be emphatically lifted, and the PJ need to complete their investigation. We also appreciate the legal obstacles to removing Kate and Gerry’s arguido status, but would request that prior to us agreeing to the re-enactment the PJ:

• publicly dispels the damaging and disturbing lies churned out by the Portuguese press regarding alleged changes to statements, re-interviews or alleged lack of co-operation.

• publicly states there are “no suspicions over [us] regarding the commission of any criminal acts.” This in no way compromises judicial secrecy.

This in no way compromises judicial secrecy. But without some official intervention on their part, a return for the re-enactment seems little more than a perfect opportunity for the press to speculate and libel us all once again.

We are very keen to help an investigation aiming to establish what’s happened to Madeleine, but have no desire to assist one that seeks only to d**n our innocent friends. By actively restoring the focus on Madeleine and robustly dispelling the countless speculation, the PJ can expect our continued co- operation.

Yours sincerely,

Russell O’Brien & Jane Tanner

PS: We certainly do not request any specific reimbursement for travel or accommodation.

viv said...

So Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien were demanding the PJ publically state every one of them is completely innocent in the demise of Madeleine and never told one single lie, then they will agree to come back for the reconstruction.

Talk about demanding the impossible!