4 Dec 2008

DID MADELEINE DIE BEFORE 3 MAY?

IMO, THERE ARE THREE SUPERMOMS DESERVING OF A COMMEMORATIVE PLATE BEING ISSUED:

1. Kate McCann
2. Karen Matthews
3. Casey Anthony

All moms had an unshakeable conviction their beloved daughters would be restored to them quite safe and well. All did not wish to discuss matters with the Police, indeed reacted with anger at the suggestion they would know where their kids were or what happened to them. They do not think it is reasonable that a mummy should know at all times where her little girl is and like to point the finger of blame a long from themselves. They do not understand mummies have a duty of care for their little girls to keep them safe from harm (including from themselves). In the case of contestants 1 and 3 cadaver dogs detected an unnatural odour they are specifically trained to find in Mummy's car. Fortunately perhaps, contestant 2 did not have a car. Mummy's 2 and 3 are now in custody, hey ho, two down, one to go. Then their little children will have really achieved justice, until such time we will continue to be the voice of little Madeleine, because all her mum is concerned about is herself and staying away from where mums 2 and 3 quite rightfully belong! Well we know where you and your husband belong Kate, and some of your ahem "friends" too! Children deserve to be really looked after and loved whilst on holiday, especially tiny children and they deserve to come home again, too! YOU never even took Maddie to the beach, did you, your mate Jane Tanner says so!



Victims of abuse and neglect Madeleine McCann and Shannon Matthews but for Madeleine there is no happy ending
Hiya all - Claudia referred me to this highly illuminative new post from Paulo Reis and I just knew you would be very interested. The "bottom line" that Kate was in the apartment with Madeleine when she was crying Daddy, Daddy on 1 May is simply horrifying. I always did think it was a strange thing for her to keep calling..but confess it never occurred to me that was because Kate was actually there. It is really starting to make sense now!

Viv x


3.12.08

More on the deleted call records

Where Was Kate McCann? (*)

The CD issued by Ministerio Publico de Portimao in July 2008, contains a great deal of information on the mobile calls made and received by the “Tapas 9” but it is dispersed, difficult to retrieve and with important pages and charts missing. The main documents of interest from the CD are:

* A 3 page report by the Policia Judiaria (undated, but probably 4th May 2007) listing call records retrieved from the handsets of Mr and Mrs McCann
* A detailed (and excellent report) by Inspector Paulo Dias, Inspector of UNI-Sector de Análise, Lisbon, dated 9th November 2007
* Schedules provided by Vodafone on 14th December 2007 covering a period from 29th April 2007 for Gerald McCann, David Payne, Rachael Mampilly, broken into four separate sections for incoming and outgoing telephone calls, incoming and outgoing SMS traffic
* A second report by Inspector Dias dated 5th February 2008, containing time bars, link charts and maps pinpointing where the “Tapas 9’s” sets were when they activated antennae
* A third report by Inspector Dias dated 2nd June 2008 which includes details of activations of the Luz and other mobile antenna from 28th April 2007 to September 2007
* The Rogatory Letter requests and correspondence dated from 5th December 2007 to May 2007 and responses from the Home Office in April and May 2008

The PJ used a program, called the “Analyst’s Notebook” as well as “Excel” to handle what were very large datasets. Inspector Dias pointed out that “Excel” was far from ideal, because of its limited capacity and it seems that much of the data provided was paper based and had to be rekeyed. Also the main focus of the research was limited to the evening of Thursday 3rd May 2007. But, despite the problems, the PJ’s work is impressive, innovative and very detailed. For example, there is a brilliant analysis (which unfortunately led nowhere) based on the hypothesis of two abductors each working with mobiles in the Ocean Club area immediately before Madeleine was reported missing. There is another excellent piece of work which tracks down a misrouted call, from Swansea, to Kate McCann at 11.21 on Wednesday 2nd May 2007.

However, there are potentially serious omissions:

* The most important records were not available when Mr and Mrs McCann attended their “Arguido interviews” on 6th and 7th September 2007 and it is doubtful that they were ever reviewed by the very experienced analysts from the Leicestershire Police, whose team left the Algarve soon after the McCann’s return to the UK in September 2007
* There are no detailed call records from the mobile operators for Kate McCann, Russell O’Brien, Matthew Oldfield and Jane Tanner
* When the PJ obtained the McCann’s mobiles they do not appear to have retrieved deleted data or to extract their contact lists
* None of the telecom records show triangulation co-ordinates but are limited to identifying the single primary antenna on which calls were registered
* The details of over 50 UK subscribers contacted by the Tapas 9 in the critical period, as well as their onward local and international call records, was included in the Rogatory Letter request in December 2007. If this information was provided, it is not in the CD
* A critical link chart (Anexo 37) for Tuesday 1st May 2007 is missing from Inspector Dias’s report

These omissions make interpretation of the data difficult but what is available provides an interesting picture. First, it is obvious that the memories in the McCann’s mobiles were incomplete and, in Kate McCann’s case, selectively deleted.

Her mobile memory held details of 39 calls from 18.28 on Wednesday 25th April to 16.35 on 27th April 2007. After her arrival in Portugal on 28th April 2007, with the exception of one incoming call on Wednesday 2nd May 2007 at 11.21 (which, very interestingly, was the Swansea “wrong number”), and one call from her husband at 23.17 on Thursday 3rd May 2007, everything else has been “whoosh-clunked” from memory. These deletions could have been accidental, but a high degree of cunning could be implied. Why would she selectively delete everything up to Thursday 3rd May 2007 with the exception of one wrong number and what was her reason for deleting three of the four calls, between 23.14 and 23.17, from her husband on that critical night?. A possible answer is that she wished to avoid alerting the PJ to evidence that details of around 40 calls had been erased and she felt happier leaving something uncontroversial (or misleading) in memory for them to find. Another answer is that, unsurprisingly, she was under the most extreme stress imaginable following the disappearance of her daughter: but why, in that case, give priority to deleting anything. It is the last thing most parents would think about in the circumstances.

The first call found in Gerald’s mobile memory was timed at 00.30 on Friday 4th May 2007. Again matching antenna records to memory suggests that by the time he gave the handset to the PJ the records of 24 calls or SMSs had been erased, including the one from him found on his wife’s handset and timed at 23.17 on Thursday 3rd May 2007. It appears that he had deleted details of the four calls he made to her that night and she deleted just three. It was this simple discrepancy that first led the PJ to suspect interference with the handsets.

If the deletions were deliberate (and it is an “if”) it implies the McCann’s were both “forensically aware” and crafty and wanted to hide something from the PJ. For this reason, it is important to explore the call record data and to match it against other evidence.

On Saturday 28th April 2007, after their arrival in Luz, Kate McCann’s mobile triggered the antenna 9 times. It is not possible to say, from the available records, whether these were incoming or outgoing calls or SMSs or for how long they lasted. The last activations were at 20.55 and 20.59 when (based on their statements) the Tapas 9 returned for an early night after eating at the Millennium Restaurant with their children. All of these records were erased from the memory of Kate McCann’s mobile. Gerald McCann’s mobile did not activate any of the Luz antennae that day.

On Sunday 29th April 2007, the first activation of Kate McCann’s mobile was at 9.23, but again there are no Vodafone logs or time bars to provide further detail. However, by internally matching the antenna records it appears that she called her husband at 12.26 and 17.02.

The crèche records indicate that he collected Madeleine at 12.15. He also picked up the twins around 17.00 but mistakenly recorded the time as “12.30”. Chances are that the calls from Kate McCann were to check that he had picked up the kids. At 10.13 Gerald McCann received a call from a UK mobile xxxxx3899. The last activation by Kate McCann’s mobile was at 19.30 and Gerald’s at 17.02.

A pattern on this sheet (and it applies to all of the Tapas 9) is that no activations took place at any time during the week while they were at dinner. So maybe Clarence Mitchell was right, after all, and that they were so “into each other” that they didn’t want to be disturbed while sardine munching and left their mobiles in their rooms. They were never specifically asked this question, but it is very important and the point will be addressed later.

On Monday 30th April 2007, neither of the McCann’s telephones activated the Luz transmitters. This looks very odd, especially as they were around the Ocean Club to shuffle the kids to and from the crèches. On this afternoon, Madeleine remained in the crèche for only 15 minutes and was picked up by her mother at 15.30. We do not know what Madeleine did for the rest of the day, but it is possible she was being fractious. Interestingly, a friend of Mrs and Mr McCann supposedly told the “Dispatches” team that made a TV program on the tragedy, that “Madeleine was a screamer”. This could be interpreted in one of two ways, but any use of the past tense in referring to Madeleine would be very significant. It was such a past tense referral, to her supposedly living children, that alerted the FBI to their murder by Susan Smith, their mother.

On Tuesday 1st May 2007, Gerald McCann’s handset was silent all day. Kate McCann’s mobile first activated the Luz antenna at 10.16, but all details of the day’s calls have been deleted from the handset and there is no nothing in the CD from her mobile provider. Another activation took place at 12.17. The crèche records show that Gerald McCann picked up Madeleine at 12.20 (a bit earlier than usual) but Kate McCann’s call at 12.17 does not appear to have been to him, (because his mobile was not activated at all that day). Kate McCann dealt with her last call before leaving for the Tapas Bar at 20.35.

At around 8.45pm on Tuesday 1st May 2007, Miss Nejoua Chekeya, the Ocean Club’s busty Aerobics Instructor, held a “Quiz Night” and was later invited, allegedly by Gerald McCann, to join his table which she did sometime between 9.30pm and 9.50pm. She did not say how long she had remained with them, but she is not the sort of woman men would wish see to leave too quickly. Miss Chekeya stated that one dinner setting was unused and that she could not remember seeing Kate McCann.

However, both Jane Tanner and Russell O’Brien have stated that he did not go to the Tapas Bar on the “Quiz Night” (ie Tuesday 1st May 2007), but had stayed in their room looking after his sick daughter. Jane Tanner took his dinner to the room; thus explaining the unused plate setting. Russell O’Brien was not asked by either the Policia Judiciaria or Leicestershire Police whether he had heard Madeleine crying!

Kate McCann’s mobile was next activated six times, in rapid fire, between 22.16 and 22.27, after she had returned to Apartment 5A after dinner. The antenna traffic proves that these calls were not made to any of the “Tapas 9”.

The evidence from the call logs gives the strongest clue that the “Tapas 9” left their telephones in their rooms when they went to dinner. Clarence Mitchell, the McCann’s spokesperson, confirmed this. In an interview, reported on 6th April 2008 by Ned Temko of “The Guardian”, Mr Mitchell said: “You had nine people in a bar without watches on, without mobile phones and absolute panic set in when they realised what had happened…. We would say that, if the police had a perfect time line across nine people, that would be a damn sight more suspicious than the fractured, illogical, composite statements they might have got”

Mrs Fenn, the McCann’s neighbour, reported that Madeleine had cried for her father between 22.30 and 23.45. The evidence shows that Kate McCann was in Apartment 5A 14 minutes before Madeleine started crying. Tuesday 1st May 2007 is the only night (except, of course, for Thursday 3rd May 2007) that either of the McCanns or any of their friends made calls after dinner.

Mrs McCann volunteered to the PJ that on the night of Wednesday 2nd May 2007, she had slept in the spare bed in her children’s room because her husband had not paid her enough attention over dinner. Or put another way, does she mean the amorous Scot was paying someone else (like Miss Chekeya) too much attention, causing her to stomp out of the Tapas Bar before him: ultimately leading to the spare bed in a strop? Gerald McCann said he thought the reason his wife had slept in the children’s bedroom was because of his snoring and that he did not even bother asking her the following morning what the problem was.

Could it be that their timings are wrong by 24 hours and that Kate McCann’s nocturnal shenanigans took place on the night of Tuesday 1st May 2007? It would fit, but why be untruthful about it? A possible reason is that they wanted to conceal both Kate McCann’s state of mind and the fact that she had returned to Apartment 5A, just before Madeleine’s cried for help.

On Wednesday 2nd May 2007, Kate McCann called her friend “Amanda” at 7.36.41 and again at 7.36.45. This was around two hours earlier than any of mobile activations on any other morning: so Kate McCann was “up with the larks”. Amanda returned the calls at 7.50. There is no record of how long any of these calls lasted or whether they were SMSs. They were all deleted from memory.

At 8.07 Gerald McCann received a call from the SMS message centre (447818520047), but does not appear to have responded. At 8.50 Kate McCann received a call from a UK mobile xxxxx27010 and returned it at 8.53, before going to play tennis. Gerald McCann received a series of calls from his SMS message centre between 9.10 and 10.47, again without response.

At 11.21 Kate received a call from what appears to be a landline in Swansea ( xxxxx0023). The report by Inspector Dias researched this call in detail (Page 21 in his report of 9th November 2007) and discovered that it had not activated any of the Luz antennae. But digging deeper, he found that another UK mobile (xxxxx 1583) had triggered the Luz antenna when connecting to the same Swansea number at 14.01. He dug even deeper, tracked all of the calls made from Luz by xxxx1583 and established it had no connection whatsoever with any of the “Tapas 9”. The Swansea call to Kate McCann was simply a “wrong number”, misrouted and thus not logged by the Luz antennae.

What Inspector Dias did not realise was that the Swansea call had become so special to Kate McCann that, when deleting all of the other Portuguese call records from memory, she decided to leave this one intact.

Gerald received five further calls from the SMS message centre and at 15.50 called 91121, probably to collect his messages. He received further calls from the centre at 17.49 and 19.49. The records provided by Vodafone show these calls but that they originate from a different mobile number (0xxxx014310)

At 20.08 Kate McCann received two calls from a UK mobile xxxx7624 and six minutes late Gerald McCann called 91121: again to collect messages before he left for the Tapas Bar. This was the last activation of the day by either of the McCanns; probably confirming that their mobiles remained in Apartment 5A when they went to dinner.

On Thursday 3rd May 2007 (the critical day) at 8.23 and 8.24 Kate McCann’s mobile activated the antenna to call xxxx7624. There is nothing in file to indicate the owner of this mobile but it does not appear to be any of the McCann family or friends.

At 12.24 Gerald McCann received a call from a UK Mobile xxxx1746. Again there is no clue in the file to the subscriber’s name. At 12.31 Kate McCann received a call (or SMS) from her mother’s mobile and responded an hour later.

Neither of the McCanns appears to have had any further activity on their telephones until after Madeleine was reported missing when Gerald McCann called his wife four times between 23.14 and 23.52. At 23.40 he called his sister – Trish Cameron and at 23.52 -Janet Kennedy.

The batch of SMS messages received by Gerald McCann on Wednesday 2nd May 2007 seems to have caused him some anxiety. Although the number “07818520047” is in a block allocated to Vodafone, the company has no record of the subscriber’s name. When the number is dialed, connection is made to a recorded message which explains that changes have been made to the way customers can access their mailboxes and that they can now dial “121” from their handset or “07836121121” from any other telephone.

Thus the number appears to be a message box for Gerald McCann that sends him an SMS when his mobile is unable to accept a call (because it is out of range or turned off). However, when he was asked by “Expresso TV” on 6th September 2008 about the “sixteen SMS messages” received, he flustered:

“No one has ever asked to see any of my text messages. There is no way that there 16 messages on that day or even the day after, you know. You know, the day after, you know that we got…” Kate McCann came to his rescue and interrupted; “Gerry hardly ever sends text messages until the day after, the day after Madeleine was taken”. Gerald McCann continued: “so you know that it is actually rubbish”

Their McCann’s denials were, of course, technically true although perhaps disingenuous - because there were only 14 messages received on the day before they reported Madeleine missing and two on the day after.

There were 16 SMS messages, in total, so why prevaricate and deny an allegation that was never made. The question was about received messages, not those sent, and on the day before not on 3rd May 2007 or the day after! In the field of forensic linguistics you must always concentrate on the precise wording of denials and especially on those of allegations not made. The denials made by the McCanns are suspicious. However, Mrs McCann’s statement about her husband not sending SMS messages, until after Madeleine’s disappearance, is confirmed by Vodafone’s records.

Mr and Mrs McCann were never closely questioned by the PJ about the detail of their calls, but Gerald McCann excused the deletions by saying that his telephone’s memory only retained details of the last ten calls made. This obvious inaccuracy (It already had retained details of 17 calls) does not appear to have been challenged by the PJ and it does not in anyway explain the selective deletions from his wife’s handset.

So the bottom line is that Kate McCann was in Apartment 5A when Madeleine cried for her father between 22.30 and 23.45 on Tuesday 1st May 2007, leading to a unique flurry of late night calls and to unique calls very early the following morning. A forensic examination of the records of Madeleine’s attendance at the “Lobsters” crèche on Wednesday 2nd and Thursday 3rd May 2007 is critically important because if they have been falsified, to establish she was there when she was not, this case takes on an entirely new dimension and sets different search parameters.

Secondly, if the memories of the mobile telephones were deleted in way suspected, a level of cunning is implied that would be capable of conceiving plan to deliberately delay reporting Madeleine’s “disappearance”; if for no other reason than to disassociate it from the crying incident on Tuesday 1st May 2007.

Of course, this is speculation and it is entirely possible that further investigation and the much awaited transparency by Mr and Mrs McCann will totally exonerate them. But why don’t they simply produce the SMS messages and explain why call details were deleted?

By Paulo Reis and associates

(*) This report is a result of cooperation with a leading international investigative firm that is in the closing stages of an 18 month intensive investigation that is expected to reopen the case in Portugal and to start new proceedings in the UK.


606 comments:

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Cláudia said...

Hi, Doc!

Cláudia said...

And hey, Callum! You take care of your dad, will you? :-)

Dinner time! Hope you're all well and Christmas shopping like there was no tomorrow!

docmac said...

Dyl

Keep the bees, just send honey :-)

Hope

Vicks on the soles of you feet? LOL! Should have included that in my email post :-)))

Di

Nothing wrong with adding a little alcohol to your vitamin C and honey ;-)
Sorry to hear about Max Clifford. By all accounts he seems to be the only PR around that possesses more than a modicum of decency and honesty. Good luck to him.

docmac said...

your feet :-)

Hi Claudia. Enjoy the dinner. I for one have not done any Christmas shopping at all yet.

nancy said...

Di -

Prostrate cancer!! LOL

That's the funniest thing I have heard on here so far!!

I shouldn't laugh though because it's not funny really and I feel for poor Max Clifford!

Your husband probably numbers among many who are sick of their wives blogging about the Madeleine case, because even there are some men, like Docmac, Bath Theory, ICTOAN, the majority seem to be women. It's nice to get the male point of view though.

My husband just humours me, but more or less agrees with us all that there is something far more than meets the eye in poor Madeleine's disappearance.

nancy said...

Docmac -

Thanks for your good advice about honey - I rarely get colds and I eat it every day, but even if I do get a cold, it never hangs around for too long - mind you I do have a flu jab each October.

Don't tell the pros, but I also have two glasses of red each day and spend the rest of the evening in a pleasant haze!

ratonthebeam said...

Honey is also a natural antiseptic and good for minor wounds. You can make a hot toddy with it for colds - a good stiff belt of whisky, a large tablespoon of honey, add some lemon juice, top up with hot water to taste, drink it all up then go straight to bed. Never fails!

nancy said...

Hi Dillie,

I don't understand either - in fact it's one of the most puzzling things about this case - the connection of Murat with the McCanns, and everyone, including the media, keeping quiet about it! Gerry gave the game away when he wouldn't answer whether he knew Robert or not.

If they really did know each other before PdeL through friends or family, then whey don't they just admit it? What's the secrecy for?

I'm sure the truth will come out with time though!

ratonthebeam said...

Hello Callum! Elle and Dee send their love! :-)

nancy said...

Rat -

Well that's something new to me - honey, a natural antiseptic!

I'll remember that if I get a wound of any kind in the future.

Thanks!

ratonthebeam said...

Why did Gezza drag Kate away from the reporters after being asked whether he knew Robert Murat? Study the video again. He is so desperate to get away from the hacks that he almost pulls her shoulder out of the socket. I have always wondered what he was so afraid of that she might let slip ??????

Cláudia said...

Rat, I agree. The video is very interesting to watch.

docmac said...

Hello Elle and Dee!

Callum sends his love by proxy :-)

docmac said...

Hello Nancy

There are no longer any pros to tell about your rather healthy habit of imbibing 2 glasses of red each evening.

bath theory said...

May I suggest Gezza the hospital porter was dragging her off to have some food with their KFC buddies. Family buckets all round !!

docmac said...

BT

Gezza the porter, LOL! That would p*ss Rosie off if she read this blog. Luckily she does not, ALLEGEDLY ;-)

bath theory said...

Yeah like Gezza and Cath from lower class council estate with their mates who they go to KFC with...

This whole case is farcical and thus in my opinion must hold a deep dark secret beneath it somewhere. Almost sinister if you like Doc

docmac said...

BT

Sinister, for sure.

Goodnight all.

ratonthebeam said...

Bonnybraes from the 3As once wrote something like "the man is nothing special, he studies X-Rays for a living". Oh dear!!!

Anonymous said...

hI all,

Dylan,

I look forward to seeing your bees pic. With regard to propolis I used to buy that years ago, don't know why I stopped.

BT,

LOL!

I have seen the vid where he asked if he/she knows RM a few times. It does look odd when all he had to say was 'no'. IMO he always looks like a spoiled brat who is not getting his own way.


I had to go to the Doctors yesterday. I actually have bronchitis. I thought I was having a heart attack and could hardly breathe because of the pain in my chest and every time I had to cough was extremely painful at one point I thought I was going to pass out. I feel a little better today, much more comfortable, the antibiotics must be working. I thought I was just a bit run down (I have Lupus) and the way I was feeling was related to my Lupus, how wrong I was.

BBFN

Anonymous said...

Forgot to say.

Hi Callum.

Seb, Jake, Ollie and Cookie say hi to you also.

nancy said...

Morning all -

Zodiac -

I hope you are feeling much better; you must be alright for the Christmas festivities eh!

Your'll need all the energy you can muster with your crew!


Nx

Cláudia said...

Zodiac, get better soon!!!

ICantThinkOfAName said...

Hi All

Interesting development that Goncalo Amaral has opened an account with 3A.

Perhaps we will now get some extra information "straight from the horse's Mouth".

mandarinn said...

Zodiac
I wishe you get well soon and can have a joyfull christmas.
Breath problems are hard , i know it by experience, but it can be fighted and if you are carefull it will be ok

ratonthebeam said...

If indeed it is the "real" GA....

docmac said...

GA has joined 3A? If this is true it would be a major coup. They should organise a seminar or Q&A with him as the honoured guest. I'm pretty sure there are enough posters on 3A who would chip in to make this possible.

Invite Rosiepops too. I'd love to see her trying to discredit GA in person. I think he would rip Rosiepops to shreds (figuratively speaking, of course :-)))

ratonthebeam said...

I think he wouldn't even bother wasting his breath on Rabidpops.

Unknown said...

Hiya guys

have been having internet probs. It would seem the dust has damaged our wireless router so we are now connected with the standard modem from Talktalk but can only use one computer.


Rob, Rabidpops lol, like that and find it almost as applicable as my Psychopops. I would be staggered if Goncalo has actually joined 3 As, probably a joker!


xx

ratonthebeam said...

I don't know what it is, Viv, but I don't have a good feeling about it. In fact there is a lot about the 3As that I am very wary of now. I could, of course, be completely wrong, but I think I will wait and see what Claudia's opinion of it is.

Unknown said...

Zodiac, I am sorry to read you have lupus and now bronchitis as well. I hope you soon feel much better in time for Christmas.

Love Viv x

docmac said...

Rat, you are probably right. I'd love to see him bury this person though.

Viv, it would seem that GA was personally invited to join by Nigel Moore and contacted Bren personally to set the account up for him. That is pretty convincing in my book. I'd give it a much better than 50% chance then.

ratonthebeam said...

I am still going to reserve my judgement. Sorry :-(

Unknown said...

Hiya ROB

I suppose it is understandable they would target 3As given the size of it and the information it generates.

The thing is, if they genuinely believed the PJ had declared them innocent and they had no fear of any future prosecution in the UK why bother? I think we know the answer to that! There is nothing wrong with the British Police they can and frequently do bring child abusers to court, their time will come and I know they will get lots of support from their Portuguese colleagues they worked with x

All decent adults want to justice for a little child who has really suffered. Did you watch the doc last night featuring Jamie Bulger's mum, she was absolutely inspirational in her current determination to start a school for children who have been severely bullied in the name of James, to celebrate his life for what would have been his eighteenth birthday. She said at the time ALL the family were out searching for James, unlike the gruesome McCanns who could not even pretend to search, they were too busy kicking their fund off and talking to lawyers! Oh good news on that front last night, two greedy lawyers who swindled miners out of £23M got struck off. Justice again!

xx

docmac said...

Zodiac

Hello to Seb, Jake, Ollie and Cookie from all the Macs!

Sorry to hear about the Lupus. It's very common here in the Western Cape and although I don't remember the fine details any longer I know it can, like most of the autoimmune diseases, be an absolute bastard to live with. Hopefully your specialists have it well under control.

xxx

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc

Well Goncalo clearly wants to spread the word in UK and the 3As would be a good way of doing that!

50:50 sounds fair enough!

xx

docmac said...

No problem with your scepticism, Rat.

Unknown said...

We have had some more wit statements released,havn't we? Any thoughts for a new post, volunteers?

xx

ratonthebeam said...

I also read today about the paedo who got 4 years for raping an underage girl; some vigilantes just murdered him and mutilated the body. Now I am not condoning vigilante justice at all, but I can understand why people get frustrated and take the law into their own hands. Four years for rape of a minor is not a sentence, it's a joke!

If the McScums truly are guilty of anything, and are reading the likes of that, they must be very afraid indeed.

And thank G-d that that appalling Shoesmith creature has gone! Hopefully never to return in any position working with vulnerable people, ever again. Although the guy they have wheeled in to replace her is getting £200k a year, reportedly, I just hope he's worth it!

docmac said...

Rat

25 years for raping anyone is wholly insufficient. Double that for raping a minor, minimum.

I read some news today for the first time in a while. Haringey is in the news a LOT.

Unknown said...

Hiya RAT

Some British judges seem to view child abuse very lightly and I have to admit in my mind it sometimes begs the question precisely why that is. I do not support vigilantes either but I doubt many will lose sleep over him. At least it may trouble the judge's conscience!

I felt very sorry for Jamie Bulger's mom, it was recommended here that Venables and Thompson should be moved to an adult prison when 18 and serve 15 years but the European Court of Human Rights overruled this and they served just 8 years, which is clearly agony to her. She now has three others boys, one is fourteen but still she is terrified to let them out of her sight and the children have to accept this. What about her human rights and the suffering such a sentence has caused to her. Too often the law still forgets the victims, that is very sad!

JUSTICE FOR MADDIE AND ALL VICTIMS OF ABUSE!!

docmac said...

BTW

The Daily Mail says he got 4 months. Can this be correct???

ratonthebeam said...

Apparently the dozy bint of an MP who phoned 999 because her boiler was rattling a bit is from Haringey as well! I'm sure the good people of that burgh are happy to see their Income and Council Taxes are being well spent.

Unknown said...

Replacing Shoesmith at Haringey with someone on double the salary, is that really the way forward? Surely the more of a manager they are the less they understand the job!

Anonymous said...

Hi all,

I am feeling better just going to take it easy. I must be on the mend as I am missing my Friday night couple of glasses of red.


Doc,

Your description of living with Lupus is spot on.

ROB,

'I think I will wait and see what Claudia's opinion of it is.'

Me too. My own opinion is:

Goncalo Amaral has written his own book. If he opened up his own blog/forum he would be inundated with bloggers from around the world and he and Sofia could answer questions to those who support him himself via his own monitored (keep the nasties under control) blog. I am sure there would be no problem with the translations. He could post his blog/forum address on reputable sites. The success of the site would at least, imo, be reported by Press/Media all around Europe (except McUK) and possibly farther afield.

Unknown said...

Doc, 4 months is the typical sentence for driving whilst disqualified or repeated shoplifting. I never heard of anyone getting this for rape, let alone of a child, surely this is a mistake??

ratonthebeam said...

I just re-read the Mail article, Doc is right, it says four MONTHS. Put it this way, if that had been MY daughter, I would have been waiting for him myself on the outside after four months, with the bloody biggest knife I could get my hands on. And I wouldn't even kill the b'tard, but I'd leave him unable to ever rape anyone else.

Anonymous said...

'She now has three others boys, one is fourteen but still she is terrified to let them out of her sight and the children have to accept this.'

And what did the parents of the child whom mysteriously disappeared in Pdl do. The parents who claim their child was taken by an organised paedophile ring.

Left them in the crèche, left in PdL (where their child they claim disappeared from) whilst they visited other countries to kiss the babies and children on their political election campaign, sorry to work hard looking for their missing child. Then when they returned to the UK to give they’re remaining siblings a normal life. They left to go to America, Brussels etc, hmm that’s normal isn't it!

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc I had a look at the Mail. It was not rape but a sex attack on a 15 year old girl. Probably an indecent assault which could not have been that serious given he did get 4 months according to this. However it states he was also suspected of molesting a 2 year old, one could understand the parents if they had a hand in this!!

Anonymous said...

Oops children not siblings.

Unknown said...

Hiya Zodiac

Well good point. You could still see the terrible pain in Denise Bulger's face almost 18 years later, nothing will ever be normal again for her. Clearly there are no paralells that can be drawn between a genuinely bereft mother and victim of the most terible crime against her child, and the repulsive would be victims, Kate and Gerry McScam!

Glad you are feeling a bit better!

xx

ICantThinkOfAName said...

Zodiac

Sorry to hear about your problems. I hope you recover soon.

ratonthebeam said...

I have seen the pain that is still on Patsy Simpson's face, 12 years on. No "getting back to normal" for them! I am just so revolted and disgusted with Gerry McCann for even suggesting that Madeleine would have "come to no real harm" after being taken by "paedophiles". The man is just p*ssing on the feelings and grief of parents who really did lose a child to a predatory paedophile. He really is a reptile of the very lowest order. And so is the Pink Ponce, for egging him on.

LittleGreyCell said...

Evening all,

Have just read the telephone analysis (thanks for this, Viv, extremely interesting) but think my Little Grey Cell has already left for the weekend...

...why is it "the bottom line" that Kate was in the apartment when Madeleine was crying that night???

There appears to be a fair amount of surmising, without any evidence that I can make out, that Kate didn't have her mobile with her at the table, and also that she returned to the apartment at least 14 minutes prior to Madeleine starting to cry.

I'm not trying to pick holes in what is obviously excellent research, I'm just mystified about what are for me some missing links.

Help!!!

Cláudia said...

Hi, guys.
Olá, all!
Sorry for not being around much. To be honest I was in bed. Have a bad cold and am not feeling that good. I feel like I'm freezing and have a terrible cough besides the damn headache.
Unfortunately, I still wasn'r able to confirm the information, but I have reasons to believe it might be true. When I find out, I'll tell you all, of course.

docmac said...

Viv

The article states:

"Linda Whelan, 43, a friend of Mr Cunningham, said: 'He was a lovely guy. He did used to like younger girls. Andrew was in his 50s and liked girls who were about 19 but that doesn't make him a paedophile. I can only imagine if he slept with someone under 16 that he didn't know she was underage."

Also, the attackers seem to have known what happened. They cut off his genitals.

I think they knew exactly what happened...

docmac said...

Claudia

Honey and vitamin C!

LGC

Hi! I have expressed the same doubts. Hope you and Libs are well. I'm home for the night and will be heading back tomorrow morning. Nice to see you. Love to Opus. Is he OK? He never arrived here. Water's probably too warm for his taste.

Cláudia said...

Thanks, Doc.
Only problem is I really can't stand honey.

Just confirmed it. Yes, as I suspected it's true. As true as it gets. It's the real GA.

Anonymous said...

'Have a bad cold and am not feeling that good. I feel like I'm freezing and have a terrible cough besides the damn headache.'

Aw Claudia hope you did not catch the virus from me via your blog and Viv's blog. I did wipe the keyboard and screen with antibacterial wipes due to all the coughing and sneezing. Hope I have not started a new computer virus!

Take care Claudia and hope you feel better soon.

Goodnight all.

docmac said...

Since joing these blogs and fora I have not been wrong yet :-))

Drink the honey, honey xxx.

docmac said...

"joing", that's an African word :-)))

Cláudia said...

Zodiac, LOL I forgot to mention the damn sneezing too. I think I just broke a world record or something.

Doc, I really don't like, honey. It tastes bad. :-( But I can handle lemon tea.

LittleGreyCell said...

Hiya Doc!

Hope the book is progressing well. We're almost fine, ta - Libs has had Man Flu and I've had a virus, but apart from that, we're very good!

I suppose Opus couldn't get hold of you at your retreat, so sorry - he'd packed and just set off for your place but what do you know, he immediately ran into the postman who was about to deliver a lovely silver penguin from Hope. Well, it was love at first sight, so that was it I'm afraid. Hope you didn't go to too much trouble, Doc...

(The beautiful silver penguin has a very clever trick of opening wine bottles, so I'm afraid I can't let her go anywhere).

:)

Oo, Claudia - zinc helps you absorb the Vitamin C (excuse me Doc, don't mean to usurp your position!)

X

docmac said...

Night Zodiac.

Claudia

Aspirin and paracetamol taste cr*p. Honey's great! There's not enough lemon in lemon tea to make a difference. You need 1 gram of Vit C a day during a cold or flu.

LittleGreyCell said...

Dear Zodiac,

So sorry to hear about your ill health. I wish you better.

Used to know a Lupus specialist, it's not a pleasant ailment, I know.

Our very best wishes to you.

XXX LGC, Libs and Opus

Anonymous said...

Claudia,

The honey is very soothing. If you cannot stand the taste you could try this. Really not a wind up.

Get a swede or turnip and carve out the middle like you would do with a pumpkin at Halloween. Pour some honey into the well and leave for a few hours. After a few hours the honey is diluted with the turnip/swede juice and both properties according to a natural remedy book I have (is that Doc I hear laughing all the way from S.A.) help to heal a sore throat. Take as often as you wish and cover and cool in a cold area.

BBFN

docmac said...

LGC

The book is ahead of schedule right now :-)

We went to no trouble at all while waiting for Opus other than buying him a one season fishing license. We're quite disappointed he did not arrive as we've had poor luck with the fishing this week and have had to struggle by on lamb chops and steak :-(( You can not believe the hardships we have had to endure.

LittleGreyCell said...

Doc,

What can I say? Opus will be very ashamed of himself (I'll make sure of that).

Mind you, how many fish do you think would have ended up on your dinner table if Opus had caught them?

And just ask Hope about the pervading smell of herring crispie cakes...

Maybe the lamb chops and steak look a little more appealing now. ;)

Cláudia said...

LGC and Zodiac, thank you. I've had a problem with honey since I was a kid. My parents tried hard, but I can't stand anything too sweet. I'll try your trick, Zodiac. Thank you very much.

Doc, pills are easier. You just hold your breath and swallow them. :-)

docmac said...

Zodiac

I never laugh when it comes to honey. Smear a mixture of lemon juice , honey and garlic (to taste)on your chicken and leave in the fridge for a minimum of 2 hours before you barbeque it. Keep basting while cooking. Is that tender enough for you? :-))

Sleep well and look after them kidneys!

xxx

docmac said...

LGC

I was under the impression that Opus was trained to bring you whatever you wanted. Oh well.

Herring crispie cakes? I'm feeling a little queasy now, not sure why :-)

hope4truth said...

Hello All

Sorry for the Silver Penguin getting in the way of Opus's travel but I know LGC has a love of Penguin and Wine and it was ideal...

Sorry everyone is feeling ill I feel rubbish today as well do you think it is an internet virus we all have???

xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

Wishing you better, Claudia!

(Opus suggests rubbing herring on your chest, but I can't personally vouch for that one).

X

LittleGreyCell said...

Are you trying to be funnier than me, Hope??? Well, it's working!!! Internet Virus indeed... :)))

Doc, do I need stronger glasses? Thought I read in your post the words 'Opus' and 'trained' in the same sentence...

hope4truth said...

Hello LGC

Sorry your influence has rubbed off on me and I dont think I could be funnier that you in a million years...

BRB e mailing a mad pal xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

On the contrary, Hope - we've always said there's something funny about you...

:))))

That was a very funny line about the internet virus WHICH I AM GOING TO STEAL!!!

Cláudia said...

LGC, :-) Thank you!

Boa noite, all. Going to bed.
xxxx

hope4truth said...

LGC

Something very funny about me but dont tell anyone else!!!!

Have the line for Christmas (It's Kosher) xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

Night Claudia!

Sleep well...

X

LittleGreyCell said...

לאַנג לעבן זאָלט איר

hope4truth said...

LGC

"לאַנג לעבן זאָלט איר"

Oh yes that makes perfect sense LOL x

Unknown said...

Well I just popped off for a bit and there you all were!


Claudia, I have a rotten sore throat etc too, so I think there is a bad computer virus going on and it probably even killed my router. I am going to fetch Luke from work and get some honey and lemons (huge numbers of them Doc). Think I better get some garlic too:-))

Great news Goncalo is really on 3 As, that is going to really upset a few people but hey, not us.

Doc, I loved the friends comment he WAS a nice man and used to like young girls, she is such a brill or pathetic apologist, depending on your pro or anti stance, I think she could join Team McCann. I read they hate that expression so have been trying to drop it in as much as poss.

I really wish Kate and Gerry a Happy and thoroughly normal Christmas and I know Goncalo does too xxxx

hope4truth said...

Night all I am off hope everyone feels better tomorrow xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

Night Hope!

Sleep well!

X

LittleGreyCell said...

Well, I'm off now too.

Sleep well everyone!

XXX

docmac said...

Night LGC

Was off elsewhere for a while. Going to bed myself too.

Goodnight Viv and all who are awake. OK never mind, you can read this much later :-))

Unknown said...

Goodnight all and take special care of yourselves given Rosie has sent us a nasty virusxxxxxxxxx

nancy said...

Hi everyone -

I couldn't sleep, so I was up early reading the 3A's this morning.

I hope all those of you who are feeling under the weather get better soon!
--------------------------------

The persistence of Tony Bennett knows no bounds! He has started a new thread on the 3A's which is well worth reading. He is urging everyone to send an e-mail off to the Attorney General's office:

correspondenceunit@attorneygeneral.gsi.gov.uk

If you go to his thread you can just click on that and an e-mail comes up.

He is starting another petition to get Madeleine's case looked into.

He also wants an inquest or some form of enquiry into Madeleine's disappearance and also asks whether the McCanns should be prosecuted for child neglect.

This is part of what he wrote to the Rt.Hon Baroness Scotland:

"The 2002 Hague Convention on matters concerning issues of child protection quite clearly state that any legal proceedings regarding child protection matters should take place in the country where the parents are habitually resident and not where the offence occurs"

---------------------------------

I've sent an email today and put my name and address to it more or less saying that I thought Madeleine deserves some form of enquiry or inquest because she seems to have been forgotten and the whole thing swept under the carpet by the authorities and that those responsible for her safety in PdeLuz are not being called to account.


Nx

ratonthebeam said...

היא תהיה כועסת שהבלוג לא Rabidpopsעכשיו באנגלית.

Claudia, if it is really true and it is the real GA, I just hope the posters on 3As behave in a more dignified manner this time and don't completely trash him like they did to Duarte and Paulo. And of course, your good self. I hasten to add that that was just some of the posters, not all of them, of course, but I was pretty disgusted that they were permitted to get away with it.

Chicken soup with Matzo Balls in it is the Jewish cure for EVERYTHING, and I must admit it does make you feel better, even if there is no real medical value to it! In fact I think I might make some today as the weather is just disgusting outside here and we are all freezing.

Here is a good foodie joke for you Doc (I'm told it's a true story...)

A Laird sent his Ghillie down to London on the train to do some estate business. The trip involved an Hotel stay of several nights, and the Laird was worried about the cost.

"Now, Donald" he said gravely to the Ghillie, "I don't want you going daft and spending a fortune when you are down in the city. You just live exactly as you would at home."

Well, the Ghillie duly went down to London and completed the estate business. But soon the Laird got the shock of his life, when the bill for the Hotel arrived, and it was astronomical.

The furious Laird called the Ghillie in. "Donald, look at the size of this bill! I said to you that you were to live just as you did at home, what the hell were you eating down there???!!!"

"Just exactly what I eat at home, sir!" responded the Ghillie.

"Trout, pheasant, salmon, grouse, venison...."

docmac said...

LOL, Rat! Even if that particular story were not true there is an intrinsic truth in the tale :-)

GA has posted a thread on 3A btw.

LittleGreyCell said...

HELLO VIV!!!

Have just sent you an email on behalf of someone else...

XXX LGC

(Around 11.00am Saturday)

hope4truth said...

Blimey LGC

The sooner Christmas is here and opus gets his new laptop the better you are not his PA you know xxx

Unknown said...

Hiya LGC

I got a call from our lovely Doc alerting me to your mail as that lazy Flissy, well you know. So I have answered in person, as it were!

Anyway hopefully we will have a new member soon, so that will be nice!

Thanks for going to the trouble darlingxxx

xxx

Cláudia said...

Hello, all.

Yes, Rat, Mr Amaral has opened an account on the 3 Arguidos. Of that I'm sure. :-)
And yes, I also hope he isn't treated like Mr Reis and Mr Levy. But if he is, it's their loss, not Mr Amaral's. :-)

Hello, Doc and Viv! :-)
xxxx

docmac said...

Hello Claudia and Viv

Just enjoying a swim before heading back into the wilderness :-)

Can't wait! If there was a local school, we would move there permanently.

Great news about GA, Claudia. I did go and read a few pages eventually. Some of the posters who are putting his identity to the sword have surprised me with their scepticism.

Cláudia said...

Doc, I'm not easily surprised anymore... :-)

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc and Claudia

It is great news about Goncalo being on 3 As. People who are afraid of the truth sometimes know no better than to react to it with abuse and aggression. I hope the moderators will allow all, whether they believe him or not, to be polite and not abusive.

I was just reading all those
Tanner transcripts on Joana Morais. So, she got questioned on no less than seven occasions by Sophie Ferguson a detective attached to the Major Crimes Unit, Operation Task. At one point Sophie reminds her she must not worry about her accounts conflicting with previous statements and she must try not to be influenced by what others have told her or by what she has read. But my overwhelming impression is that Jane is fearful of
Gerry McCann, does not like to contradict his accounts and indeed avoids talking about him as much as possible, is very defensive when he is mentioned in particular.

She could be very clear Kate was next to her at the dinner table but not so clear about where Gerry was and interestingly she says Russell stayed behind babysitting because her children had only been asleep fifteen minutes when she left just turned 8.30. Kate and Gerry were already there, but standing up talking to another couple..

There is a lengthy and very interesting account of how they all went down to the beach for the very first time with the children that afternoon, BUT NOT THE MCCANNS. She excused this by saying it was the first time the weather had improved and her children live near the beach anyway! Sadly, she admits the very last time she saw Maddie was about 2.30 that day. It has not escaped my notice that the faked last picture of Madeleine is timed at 2.29, what a coincidence eh Jane!

So, what we hear is that poor little Maddie never got taken to the beach, even once during that ahem "holiday" by her parents although she was apparently there on the morning, taken by the creche.

She says that whilst the rest of the group were meeting and playing on the beach that afternoon, Kate and Gerry had a private tennis lesson. She says that they all had tea at Parisio cafe right on the beach and they saw Kate go running along the beach alone. Sophie Ferguson was keen to question her about this.. Jane was clearly upset insisting it was definitely not before 5.30. Again, her timing here is quite deliberate IMO and protective of Gerry. I believe creche finished at 5.30 and she was anxious to stress Maddie was not left in the care of Gerry McCann, but I am afraid, I think that she was..

I also think it is very odd that Kate went for a solitary run on the beach and just ignored all her friends congregated there. Again, the overwhelming impression you get from Jane is the McCanns just did not join in with the others and treated their children differently. Jane made a point of saying her own children were just not used to set bedtimes and she would have kept them up and taken them with her but.. Why was it the McCanns children could always be asleep far earlier than the others so that Kate and Gerry could arrive first? According to Jane, Fi and Dave were repeatedly late on parade whilst settling their kids...Jane says that the arrivals that particular night were far more staggered than usual, the McCanns were very early and the Paynes very late, so there seemed to be more checking than normal on a more staggered basis brought about by the differing arrival times..

docmac said...

I am. Some of the posters who called his identity into question astonished me. It's similar to the amazement I would experience if certain pros were to post that they don't mind immigrants in the UK.

nancy said...

Really exciting news that GA is now a member of 3A's! This brave man deserves all the support he can get.It's true to say that he has received a fantastic welcome, apart from a few cynics, and I'm sure he'll be over the moon by his reception.

He got a special message from Tony Bennett too which was good and quite witty!

Well done to everyone involved in his joining the 3A's, including of course our Claudia!

docmac said...

Viv

The overwhelming impression I get from the statements I have read thus far is that the T7 (excluding David and Fi, whose statements I have yet to see) are at pains to stress that they hardly knew the McCanns. One also gets the impression that the McCs were unpopular with the rest of the group.

Having seen their odd, narcissistic behaviour this does not surprise me at all. Question is, what does McCann have on (some) of them that keeps their mouths tight shut?

J J said...

Hello All

Viv

I read most of the Jane Tanner transcripts on Joana Morais' site.

Is it just me ??

She kept saying how cold it was at night and quite chilly during the day, but in the 'last' picture of Madeleine by the pool, it looked like a lovely warm day.

I know it can be sunny and cold. But they are all dressed for the sun.

Unknown said...

Nancy link please darling!

xxxxxx

nancy said...

Hi Viv -

To be quite honest, my head is spinning with all the differing accounts,times of checking, who was sitting where etc. If JT can remember sitting next to Kate then why can't she remember where Gerry was. Surely K&G would have been talking to each other, unless of course they were getting over a row! None of JT's numerous accounts hold water in my opinion, and I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't make all the checks they claimed at all, but tried to make themselves look more caring by adding a few extra checks here and there!

JT and O'Brien have never been above suspicion as far as I'm concerned. In my opinion, she made herself a laughing stock with her description of the eggman abductor which was blatantly made up on the spur of the moment and beyond any feasibility.

I seem to remember one of the waiters saying he didn't see them making all the checks they stated in their statements to the PJ's.

Let's hope they end up lying themselves into a corner they can't get out of!


Nx

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc

I do tend to agree they are trying to distance themselves and that is hardly surprising given the trouble they could be in. I also agree entirely, that Kate and perhaps more so Gerry were not popular members of the group. I noted Jane say on arrival she went upstairs to Fi and Dave's flat, but no mention of going to Kate and Gerry's ever, the other odd thing is they took breakfast and lunch alone, usually in their apartment.

As to what is the hold, why do they keep quiet, maybe they have allegiance/sympathy with Kate but not him and they just respect her wishes? If she were not so involved herself I have a feeling things would have been different.. but that is just my view, I have never liked him - it stems from the very early stages when he and his sister were at pains to point out how mad Kate is (tales of her furious screaming etc) and how she could never be left alone with the children. He was setting her up from Day 1, very much aided and abetted by the one who is the size of a lorry (love you Claudia Hun)

Anonymous said...

Hi all,

I read some of the posts earlier on today on the GA thread. Going back in a mo to read the rest.

JJ,

I find the chilly thing a bit odd also.

Claudia,

You should be fighting fit with no need for extra vitamin C, with all the orange juice that Viv pays you with. Hope you are better today.

Anonymous said...

The video clip on the bus shows him up, imo, as right pain in the @rse. Perhaps he was like that all holiday and folks were p'd off with him. I know where I would tell someone like that who was on holiday in a group with me to go!

Anonymous said...

Addition to above post.

We only have to look at the pics below of Viv's holiday to see everyone having a great time. Where are the Tapas 9 fun holiday group pics. You know PR, look everyone this group of friends were having a great funfilled family holiday and then there was a DISASTER, you have to believe this was a disaster!

Unknown said...

Hiya Nancy

Well yes Jane Tanner is doing her best to lie through her teeth and yes, I do still think OB was ahem more directly involved.

I think Leics Police quite deliberately chose a female officer to take a softly softly approach with her. I also think that the seven different interviews was again, quite deliberate to make Jane confused and lose the thread in her lies, it is precisely the contradictory statements they wanted but all in that space of time, as it were! At one point DC Ferguson makes a point of stopping Jane before she gets to the main bit, insisting come on it is lunch time. This IMO was to unsettle and unnerve Jane still further. Anyone in that situation would just have it all rehearsed in their head and want to go straight through and get it over and done with but DC Ferguson was causing that terror break. She obviously transported Jane to the interview all the way from Exeter and was chatting to her and no doubt chatted to her right through lunch as well, clever tactics IMO!

xx

janz1956 said...

Hi

Just wanted to sat Hello to everyone, and thanks to LGC and Viv for letting me join!

XXXX

Unknown said...

Hiya Zodiac

I think Gerry is an aggressive gobby wife beater and the group are and probably were aware of this. Kate, like so many abused women does not take a stand against him. In a holiday group like this it is hardly going to make them popular. Abusive men like to isolate and control their partner. They will often deliberately seek to exclude them from the company of others, keeping her away at breakfast and lunchtime, keeping her away when they all went down the beach, private tennis lesson, in her own way, Jane is actually telling us quite a lot!

Cláudia said...

The idea I get is that the Mccanns are disliked by their supposed friends...

Zodiac, you're right! So much Vitamin C from Viv and even so I get a damn cold! LOL I'm feeling better, thank you!

Nancy, I had nothing to do with Mr Amaral joining the 3 Arguidos. To be honest, I think he is too good a person to subjected to what I believe he will be subjected to there. The only thing I did was confirm that it was indeed Mr Amaral. And I am absolutely positive it is.

Doc, Mr Amaral joining the 3 Arguidos will awake many of them.. You'll see.

Unknown said...

Oh HELLO JAN AND WELCOME ON BOARD!!!


We all say a great big hi to you!!

Luv Viv xxxxxxxx

Unknown said...

Oh Zodiac by the way

As ever you make a very astute observation about the total lack of photographic evidence of this happy holiday group. Apart from everything else could this be because we would never have seen the children in these er.. happy pics and even more rarely seen Kate and
Gerry?

As you say there is evidence they could have produced as I did to say yea we had a nice time, but I do not think they really did or want us to know just how they neglect their kids whilst on hol. Simply staggering they do not even take them to the beach until the last day there!! and Kate and Gerry could not even do that..(!)

Unknown said...

Hve to go out now guys but BBL after I have read the lovely Goncalo:-)))

Cláudia said...

Welcome, Janz!

Cláudia said...

See ya, Viv!

nancy said...

Hi Viv -

I'm afraid I can't do links, but the topic number is 26618 and Tony Bennett comments on page 5 of the thread started by Goncalo Amaral.

Nx

Unknown said...

Oh just a parting comment from RAT, ahem control freakery in action: One suspects a lot of work had to be done on Gerry to convince that it was OK to let Kate open her mouth!

Blogger ratonthebeam said...

Why did Gezza drag Kate away from the reporters after being asked whether he knew Robert Murat? Study the video again. He is so desperate to get away from the hacks that he almost pulls her shoulder out of the socket. I have always wondered what he was so afraid of that she might let slip ??????

Thursday, 11 December 2008 20:45:00 o'clock GMT

Unknown said...

Thanks Nancy:-)))

nancy said...

Claudia -

You may not have had anything to do with GA joining the 3A's but as far as I'm concerned, you have fought for him tooth and nail and deserve the credit more than anyone else.

Wouldn't it be great if he blogged on here one day - now that would be something to celebrate!

Glad your feeling better Claudia!

Nx

nancy said...

Janz!

Nice to have you aboard and look forward to your posts!


Nx

nancy said...

Docmac -

Reading back I see you mentioned that the pro forums are now lost in cyberspace.

Although I miss your great repartee with them, especially Rosieplops, it's not surprising because they were not only running out of things to throw at us but were also incapable of saying anything that didn't bore the pants off everyone!

LittleGreyCell said...

Hello Jan!

Welcome! Although it's nothing to do with me letting you in, all completely up to Viv (who's obviously now relented on the riff-raff element :)))) )

Happy posting! You don't have to be mad to post here, but we are...

XXX

janz1956 said...

Thanks everyone xxxxx

Anonymous said...

Nancy,

'Wouldn't it be great if he blogged on here one day - now that would be something to celebrate!'

Oooooh! Nancy I got a tingle down my spine reading that.

Going back to the bus video. I remember seeing it on Sky and hearing the Sky reporter ooohing and aaahing how K lovingly stroked one of the twins head. Yet she made no mention of the obvious gap between GM and his family. Now even if there had been someone sitting there (perhaps the guy doing the filming) you would all squash up and Mum and Dad would have their arms around the kids laughing and smiling for the holiday video. The reporter made no mention of how imo KM looked embarrassed by jackass and his swearing. What a way to start a fun filled family holiday eh! I am surprised that video was released to the public.

Anonymous said...

janz1956

Welcome and I look forward to reading you.

LittleGreyCell said...

hope4truth said...
Blimey LGC

The sooner Christmas is here and opus gets his new laptop the better you are not his PA you know xxx

I'm not???

Then why all the buckets of herring??? (He says it's payment in kind, but I don't know what's kind about it).

X

LittleGreyCell said...

Hi Claudia,

Very pleased to hear you're feeling better. Was it the herring rub??

Just read what you wrote earlier about what may well be lying in wait for Mr Amaral at the 3As...is it best to warn him perhaps?

Cláudia said...

Nancy, thank you for your kind words. But I don't think I deserve them all. :-)

LCG, it must have been! :-)))
He's been warned. But Mr Amaral is not easily intimidated, if you know what I mean. ;-)

Di said...

Good afternoon all

Welcome Janz.

I would also like to send good wishes to all of you who are feeling under the weather, get well soon x

Great news about GA joining 3A's. I will have a read when I have a minute.

Viv

The fact that Madeleine never went to go to the beach with her parents, reminded me of something, I think it was Auntie Phil who made the comment but can't be sure. Madeleine had her first icecream whilst on holiday. I remember thinking at the time, how odd for her to mention something like that. It seemed to me Madeleine knew few pleasures in life.

Di said...

Oops ignore the to go, I must remember to read before I post:o((

Anonymous said...

Claudia,

You could mix honey with herring I am sure that will dull the taste!

Cláudia said...

Zodiac, LOL!

Di said...

Does anyone have the link to the video of Gerry yanking Kate away from the interview.

Thanks in advance.

Di said...

Off now

Enjoy your evening everyone.

bath theory said...

The fact that these pro abduction sites are not seemingly there could give credence to the opinion that some of these folk were paid and the plug has been pulled. Alternatively, the friends and family who were blindly backing Gezza + Cath + KFC gang, have woken up to facts rather than relying on dressing up opinions.

bath theory said...

Hi Di
Arsenal are erratic this year

hope4truth said...

Blimey The day I go to bed and relax because my head hurts everyone is here!!!!!

Welcome Jan nice to see you I keep missing you on your site (or are you hiding behind the smilies when I come on???)...

Has the Pro blog bloggered off then???

It is unreal isnt it that a 3 year old child means nothing to those evil people yet her Neglecting parents are worshiped as Gods by them (I wonder if they care about Karen Mathews as much)cant have a word spoken against them. If my child were missing I would not want a single one of them offering any words of comfort because children just dont matter to any of them...

I am off to a black tie event tonight (thats all Im wearing a black tie LOL) so will see you all tomorrow or later xxx

nancy said...

Hope -

Have a good night - you should get plenty of partners with that get up!


Nx

bath theory said...

Doc
What is the property in honey that works so well. My wife swears by it ans so did a previous neighbour of mine who claimed she has not had a cold for over 20 yrs cos of her daily honey intake.

nancy said...

Hi Zodiac

He certainly didn't look like someone about to go on holiday with his family - more like he was going under pressure!

And the tapas 9 not having any photos together as any crowd going on holiday with their kids would, seems really strange as you so rightly say.

Off to watch - SCD now - and see which poor couple will get thrown off - they certainly don't take any prisoners on that show!

ratonthebeam said...

Zodiac, that's a question I have been asking for a long, long time. I have yet to receive a satisfactory answer.

Just who put that video on YouTube? And why? It completely contradicts the happy picture of the Caring Sharing Brilliant Heart Surgeon And Loving Family Man that we are all meant to be buying.

What was the motive for releasing it to the public?

Shalom to Jan, great to "see" you again!

janz1956 said...

Shalom to you too Ratonthebeam, good to see you again xxxxx

dylan said...

Hi all,

Hope, you naughty girl ;-)) Have a lovely evening xxx

Jan, welcome! Looking forward to seeing more of your posts.

ROB and LGC, nice to see you both again.

I haven't been around much this last week and I swear I don't know where the time goes!
BT - I think it is propolis that has all of the health bearing qualities. The bees use it to guard against infection in their hives. They have such a close-knit community, that any infection could wipe out [up to 80,000 bees] at a time. It's also known as "bee glue". Royal Jelly is also supposed to have properties that help your skin to stay looking young and healthy. This stuff is used to feed the queen when she is still in her pupae state. The workers select which cell will become the queen and deliver the Royal Jelly to her to feed upon. Without this, she'd be the same size as the worker. Another intersting bee fact is that all, except the drones, are female and the drones do not have a father, only a grandfather as they hatch from unfertilised queen eggs.When the queen lays her eggs, she somehow knows which are the drones and lays them in the larger cells as the drones are bigger than worker bees. Nobody knows for sure how the queen "measures" the cells to know they are big enough! As the winter approaches, the females kick the drones out and if they don't go willingly, they kill them - watch out men ;-)

Also, BT - do you know the final Arsenal score?

Anyway, sorry about that, back to topic, does anybody have a link to the you tube video?

I read the Amaral thread on 3As. It is very touching that he has gone to the effort of posting there and a great shame that some are already arguing about the authenticity of the post. I hope he sees through that and takes in all of the lovely messages that people have left for him.

Off for a nice hot bath to warm up and then taking daughter to her God parents. Have a good one folks.

xx

janz1956 said...

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6qNhoWz0rQw

Thats the clip of Gezza being asked about Murat, hope thats the right one

xx

janz1956 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
ratonthebeam said...

There is also a team of scientists using whatever bees have in their stings to treat the symptoms of MS. The programme said that they didn't exactly know what was in it that worked, but that for some sufferers it did. Can't be bad!

nancy said...

Dillie -

You certainly know plenty about bees. I think you should write into Mastermind and have that as your subject!

This week has just flown by and Christmas is getting closer and closer and I've still got loads to do. My daughter had me walking my socks of yesterday - talk about shop till you drop and I almost did!!

docmac said...

BT

Looks like Dyl is the expert on honey here :-)

Welcome, Jan. I don't know you other than as an ex-mod from 3A. It is however nice to welcome someone who may be able to talk some sense into that meshuggener who shares a taste for choc-coated raw herring with her penguin friend :-))

janz1956 said...

Haha thanks for the welcome, that meshuggener is stalking me all over the place :))



Thanks for the welcome!

janz1956 said...

(whoops sorry for repeating myself)

docmac said...

No problem with you repeating yourself Jan. I do it often. Mostly including the words McCann and a profanity.

docmac said...

Oh

The 'boss' has just made her second ever post on 3A. I'm sure Claudia will echo my complaint that she has been so busy holidaying in Egypt, renovating her home, pandering to Luke (who has the strongest midlands accent I have ever heard!) and taking her tablets that she has forgotten to send us our orange concentrate. I haven't received any since June.

Just remember, Viv, the T9 gang exchange favours that smell of new notes. I could always change sides you know. I'm fresh out of pink shirts.

Must say, when I was at home earlier I went back and read some more about JT. Don't have the links with me right now, but I can see her sh*tting bricks if she ever came face to face with GA :-))

ratonthebeam said...

I want to see Rabidpops come f2f with GA. In fact I would pay good money to see that. Let's see if she is so brave with her 48 questioins then!

docmac said...

Rat

The very thought makes me all drooly and rabidy.

ratonthebeam said...

Questions, not questioins - see, it's made me go all drooly as well ;-)

docmac said...

Would like to see Clairsey trying to justify her 'he should be drawn and quartered' to him too! Drool, drool.

LittleGreyCell said...

Meshuggener?! Meshuggener?!

It's the only worthwhile trait that's been passed down the generations of my family, I'll have you know!!!

Teapot.

Cláudia said...

Poops would poop herself if she ever was face to face with GA.

Cláudia said...

Football time! :-)

docmac said...

LGC

LOL! :-)))
No more kvetching from me :-)))

LittleGreyCell said...

"No more kvetching from me :-))) "


Boobalah!!!

Unknown said...

Hello guys, lovely post from Goncalo on 3 As and have added my appreciation with all the othersx

Ho hum who on earth is this Fox on 3 As then, just for old times sake could not resist a pop:-)))

I tell you what that particular Fox would be useless in the fields trying to teach the others how to be sly x


xxx

docmac said...

"Boobalah!!!"

Well I could take that two ways ;-) Thinking good thoughts here :-)

docmac said...

You know Fox, Viv ;-)

Anonymous said...

'Poops would poop herself if she ever was face to face with GA.'

Claudia,

Poops poop would poop itself if she/he/it ever came face to face with GA.

Anonymous said...

Viv,

I think Fox posts poops.

ratonthebeam said...

Fox has been on the 3as for a very long time and actually seems quite rational and intelligent. So it's definitely not Rabidpops.

LittleGreyCell said...

Choochie Docmac!

Just emailed you, princeling!

:)

docmac said...

No, it's not Rabidpops.

Replied, LGC :-) Choochie? LOL!! You've got chutzpah talking to me that way, putz :-))))

Unknown said...

Well guys Poops had three to four brains on the DE and one of them could be rational and intelligent and another even grovelling as Poops clearly needs to be on 3 As:-)))

What a shame eh, that must be real hard for it!

Doc, the prose was instantly recognisable, even the lengthy drawl saying the same thing over and over, you know, Mr Bennett I really cannot stand you! I even found myself defending him and must confess now he has or appears to have stopped the barmy argument they should be prosecuted for neglect (which would put a total block on them being prosecuted for anything else as he should know if he is a solicitor) I think he bats for the same team, and fair play to him. An enemy of Poops just has to be a friend of mine and the argument he is making money out of Madeleine at £3 a go really was Poops at its sickening best! What about the Retardos at £1M a go or £50K per month, now that is what you call making money out of Madeleine, or "off of" as Poops would say - how ignorant!


xx

xx

ratonthebeam said...

He would have to sell a hell of a lot of £3 books to make a "profit" out of Madeleine. He'd have been better off having a Race Night, you can increase your take from 2 grand to 5 overnight at that!

docmac said...

I must agree, Viv. Tony Bennett is now knocking the right nail with the right hammer. Good luck to him. If I were over there I would support him to the hilt. I mean I still do, but I can't get further involved from this far away.

LittleGreyCell said...

I know what you're saying about Tony Bennett, Viv, but I can't quite bring myself to back him on anything, if truth be told.

It's really a question of does the end justify the means?

Tony Bennett has a history of aligning himself to single issues in order to promote his agenda of quite distasteful politics.

It's a tricky one, though - do you support even the nastiest person if they stand up for a cause which is close to your heart, or do you eschew their interest as being inappropriate because of who they are?

I'm not saying there's a right answer, just expressing my feelings.

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc

I think we need to remember this is not the first bandwagon he has jumped on and there does seem to be an element of self-publicity.

There is no point petitioning the Attorney General - he will only take a case on when the evidence is ready for him to do so.

I am afraid I am not always with Mr Bennett's means of doing things!

xx

ratonthebeam said...

Some of the sites TB has aligned himself with make me extremely uncomfortable too. However in the very early days when we were still on the DX, I wrote to him and offered him money for a fund and he refused it. So unlike the McScums, I don't think he's in it for the money. Iam still trying to make up my mind about him, TBH; however at least he has the balls to be doing something, unlike a lot of others who could have stood up for Madeleine but didn't.

Unknown said...

Hiya LGC

Well your post crossed with my own and clearly you are in similar mind to me. I have to do what I think is right in the right way. I am surprised that a solicitor would say and do some of the things that he does. Having said that, I have met many solicitors who really do not know what they are talking about. It can be very specialised too, maybe he is just not from a criminal law background.

I am loathe to knock him because he is essentially, it would seem, on the same side. But by the same token, I would not get into bed with him either !

docmac said...

I think TB has reined himself in enough for me to have changed my mind about his objectives. I agree with Rat in a sense. He appears not to be in it for the money. You all know the history behind the man much better than I do. I don't know much about his past at all. He just strikes me as being genuinely concerned about the truth. I'll take the pills and the scorn if I'm wrong. No problem with that.

LittleGreyCell said...

Viv,

UGH!!!

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc

I certainly do not think he is in it for the money he can make, but self aggrandisement, I would not like to say, other than, on the face of it, that is what it looks like.
And, that is what it looks like with Clarence Mitchell too!

Maybe me, Rat and LGC have an issue with his particular style of doing things that just rings some distant alarm bells! It is difficult to know what motivates him. I was very put off by the proceedings he tried to institute in the Magistrates Court against the McCanns, this just was NOT the behaviour of a reasonable solicitor who knows his stuff. Or, indeed someone who actually wanted to see justice for Madeleine, it did seem far more like him getting on the telly!

ratonthebeam said...

Well let's be honest, the telly and press in this bloody country are so biased in favour of Team McScum, that if TB can get on the telly to promote the truth by whatever means possible then the best of luck to him.

docmac said...

As I said Viv, I don't 'know' the man nearly as well as you guys. Just giving the impression I have formed of him from his posts on the 'net. To me he seems quite genuine. I am willing to accept that I may be wrong. No worries :-)

Unknown said...

The negligence was an issue for me from a personal point of view. But, from a criminal law point of view it was no more than a red flag as to what kind of parents they are and what they may be capable of. Along with so many other things like hastily setting up the fund and hiring a team of lawyers etc. From a criminal law standpoint you just have to be looking at the most serious behaviour that they can be charged for from that particular set of facts. The negligence was no more than part of that set of facts, I never thought it was the issue they should be prosecuted for. They should be prosecuted for homicide, fraud, perverting the course of justice and disposal of the corpse. There is a big difference between criminal charges and the evidence that goes towards proving them, the negligence is part of that evidence. A prosecutor will always go for the most serious charges. Mr Bennett displayed a fundamental lack of understanding or worse he did not care!

LittleGreyCell said...

What a great idea, Rat - TB on next year's Strictly Come X-Factor!

ratonthebeam said...

Maybe it's because homicide, fraud, perverting the course of justice etc can't actually be definitively proven yet - whereas neglect can! Although personally I would rather hold out and get proof of the more serious stuff, rather than go for the quick fix of neglect charges, now. I still think the PJ are continuing their investigations on the QT, which is why they haven't released all the files.

LittleGreyCell said...

Well, I'm off to bed like a good Surrey woman. (That means in my headband and wellies).

Sleep well, everyone!

X

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc

I am sure I do not know him any better than you do. In fact you have probably read more of what he has to say, because he did really put me off from the outset. He has done some catching up and the work he did to put together the 60 reasons was a very good piece of work. He has clearly got publicity for that and he is honest when he states well if they see something wrong with it tell me and I will put it right. Not just honest, clever!

But I suppose I will always have an issue with him, I think there is something about self esteem going on..

Unknown said...

Hiya ROB

I do not think there was ever any serious intention on the part of either UK or Portuguese Police to just put them on trial for negligence. They could not be prosecuted in UK for this because it happened abroad and it would now be time barred I believe in Portugal.

IMO the intention has always been to prosecute this couple for the serious offences they committed and I firmly believe that is still very much the intention of British Police with the aid of the Portuguese Police. The McCanns are British subjects in Britain and ultimately they will stand trial here,not in Portugal.

xxxx

nancy said...

Viv -

I must admit I'd never even heard of Tony Bennett before Madeleine disappeared. I don't know what he has done in the past to put people's backs up and maybe I am seeing him through rose coloured spectacles.

Having said that, the fact that he has been pulling out all the stops to get this very baffling crime taken seriously by the British Establishment makes me warm to him. I sincerely hope his efforts on Madeleine's behalf are successful.

Fox on the 3A's tried to get him rattled but didn't thankfully. I saw your responses to him/her and you were spot on as usual!

Whatever the rights and wrongs of Tony Bennett, the most important thing is to get the whole truth and nothing but the truth of how Madeleine disappeared out in the open. Right now he and Goncalo Amaral seem to be the only ones putting themselves on the line for Madeleine.

It takes a lot of courage for them to take the stand they have because who knows what menaces could be waiting for either of them from powerful people who would stop at nothing to prevent the truth coming out.

Of course GA has laid more on the line than anybody, losing his job and his credibility in the career of his choice. That must be so painful for him and his family.

I just hope when GA's book is published in the UK the tide will begin to turn in his favour.


Nx


Nx

docmac said...

Viv

I must dive into the hot sack now.

My feeling is that if the 3A meeting with GA happens TB will be one of the posters nominated to attend. I think that would be a good thing. There are so many duplicitous posters on 3A that I would trust few of them to represent the UK and more especially Maddie. I believe he would be a great advocate (no pun intended) for truth.

Goodnight to you and everyone else. Duvet ready? :-)) Hello Claudia ;-)))

nancy said...

Goodnight Docmac - sleep well and wrap that duvet around both of you - don't pinch it all yourself like my other half!

I'm off myself now - it's been a long day!

Nx

Unknown said...

Hiya doc and Nancy

There is no doubt Tony Bennett is doing some good work in publicing the fete of Madeleine and how we, the British public feel about that. His approach to Baroness Scotland who has chaired inquiries into child abuse can certainly do no harm, although I feel she will just refuse to comment because the case is an ongoing investigation. At least he makes it clear we, the public, are not going to just shut up and forget dear little Maddie. The case is symbolic IMO of child abuse in UK,just how serious it is, yes even middle class doctors, and that there is insufficient action at governmental level to put a stop to this. Well at least try to take some effective measures! That just has to include taking all possible measures to prosecute Kate and Gerry because it will send out such a powerful message to others - for all their money and media machine at the end of the day they are just child abusing criminals and have been dealt with accordingly. So you, stop what you are doing now because if they cannot get away with it, how the heck do you think you will??

Nancy, it has always given me great pleasure to put Poops well and truly in its place. I have rarely seen such bizarre and sickening propaganda, he is an insult to the human race!


Sleep well my lovelies

xxxxxxxxxxx

Unknown said...

and yes Rosie if you are tuning in which I suspect you may well be, we are ALL ONE RACE. It is you that has the machete and insults little Madeleine, every single day of your miserable existence.

I see you connected to your own little hell hole Purple blog in the last 24 hours but did not bother to post. Fed up of the likes of Clairsey who supports murder stroking your ego, going for a little cut and thrust on 3 As instead. Well tough! No one loves you and no one cares!

dylan said...

Boy am I up late tonight! I could not get a taxi home for love nor money this evening being a Saturday night and this close to Christmas!

Viv - your last post - well said! Poops hell-hole makes my hairs stand on end, and not because it's electrifying but because it makes my skin crawl!

Off to bed & not sure I'll make my early start tomorrow.

Nite all xx

dylan said...

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dylan said...
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