4 Dec 2008

DID MADELEINE DIE BEFORE 3 MAY?

IMO, THERE ARE THREE SUPERMOMS DESERVING OF A COMMEMORATIVE PLATE BEING ISSUED:

1. Kate McCann
2. Karen Matthews
3. Casey Anthony

All moms had an unshakeable conviction their beloved daughters would be restored to them quite safe and well. All did not wish to discuss matters with the Police, indeed reacted with anger at the suggestion they would know where their kids were or what happened to them. They do not think it is reasonable that a mummy should know at all times where her little girl is and like to point the finger of blame a long from themselves. They do not understand mummies have a duty of care for their little girls to keep them safe from harm (including from themselves). In the case of contestants 1 and 3 cadaver dogs detected an unnatural odour they are specifically trained to find in Mummy's car. Fortunately perhaps, contestant 2 did not have a car. Mummy's 2 and 3 are now in custody, hey ho, two down, one to go. Then their little children will have really achieved justice, until such time we will continue to be the voice of little Madeleine, because all her mum is concerned about is herself and staying away from where mums 2 and 3 quite rightfully belong! Well we know where you and your husband belong Kate, and some of your ahem "friends" too! Children deserve to be really looked after and loved whilst on holiday, especially tiny children and they deserve to come home again, too! YOU never even took Maddie to the beach, did you, your mate Jane Tanner says so!



Victims of abuse and neglect Madeleine McCann and Shannon Matthews but for Madeleine there is no happy ending
Hiya all - Claudia referred me to this highly illuminative new post from Paulo Reis and I just knew you would be very interested. The "bottom line" that Kate was in the apartment with Madeleine when she was crying Daddy, Daddy on 1 May is simply horrifying. I always did think it was a strange thing for her to keep calling..but confess it never occurred to me that was because Kate was actually there. It is really starting to make sense now!

Viv x


3.12.08

More on the deleted call records

Where Was Kate McCann? (*)

The CD issued by Ministerio Publico de Portimao in July 2008, contains a great deal of information on the mobile calls made and received by the “Tapas 9” but it is dispersed, difficult to retrieve and with important pages and charts missing. The main documents of interest from the CD are:

* A 3 page report by the Policia Judiaria (undated, but probably 4th May 2007) listing call records retrieved from the handsets of Mr and Mrs McCann
* A detailed (and excellent report) by Inspector Paulo Dias, Inspector of UNI-Sector de Análise, Lisbon, dated 9th November 2007
* Schedules provided by Vodafone on 14th December 2007 covering a period from 29th April 2007 for Gerald McCann, David Payne, Rachael Mampilly, broken into four separate sections for incoming and outgoing telephone calls, incoming and outgoing SMS traffic
* A second report by Inspector Dias dated 5th February 2008, containing time bars, link charts and maps pinpointing where the “Tapas 9’s” sets were when they activated antennae
* A third report by Inspector Dias dated 2nd June 2008 which includes details of activations of the Luz and other mobile antenna from 28th April 2007 to September 2007
* The Rogatory Letter requests and correspondence dated from 5th December 2007 to May 2007 and responses from the Home Office in April and May 2008

The PJ used a program, called the “Analyst’s Notebook” as well as “Excel” to handle what were very large datasets. Inspector Dias pointed out that “Excel” was far from ideal, because of its limited capacity and it seems that much of the data provided was paper based and had to be rekeyed. Also the main focus of the research was limited to the evening of Thursday 3rd May 2007. But, despite the problems, the PJ’s work is impressive, innovative and very detailed. For example, there is a brilliant analysis (which unfortunately led nowhere) based on the hypothesis of two abductors each working with mobiles in the Ocean Club area immediately before Madeleine was reported missing. There is another excellent piece of work which tracks down a misrouted call, from Swansea, to Kate McCann at 11.21 on Wednesday 2nd May 2007.

However, there are potentially serious omissions:

* The most important records were not available when Mr and Mrs McCann attended their “Arguido interviews” on 6th and 7th September 2007 and it is doubtful that they were ever reviewed by the very experienced analysts from the Leicestershire Police, whose team left the Algarve soon after the McCann’s return to the UK in September 2007
* There are no detailed call records from the mobile operators for Kate McCann, Russell O’Brien, Matthew Oldfield and Jane Tanner
* When the PJ obtained the McCann’s mobiles they do not appear to have retrieved deleted data or to extract their contact lists
* None of the telecom records show triangulation co-ordinates but are limited to identifying the single primary antenna on which calls were registered
* The details of over 50 UK subscribers contacted by the Tapas 9 in the critical period, as well as their onward local and international call records, was included in the Rogatory Letter request in December 2007. If this information was provided, it is not in the CD
* A critical link chart (Anexo 37) for Tuesday 1st May 2007 is missing from Inspector Dias’s report

These omissions make interpretation of the data difficult but what is available provides an interesting picture. First, it is obvious that the memories in the McCann’s mobiles were incomplete and, in Kate McCann’s case, selectively deleted.

Her mobile memory held details of 39 calls from 18.28 on Wednesday 25th April to 16.35 on 27th April 2007. After her arrival in Portugal on 28th April 2007, with the exception of one incoming call on Wednesday 2nd May 2007 at 11.21 (which, very interestingly, was the Swansea “wrong number”), and one call from her husband at 23.17 on Thursday 3rd May 2007, everything else has been “whoosh-clunked” from memory. These deletions could have been accidental, but a high degree of cunning could be implied. Why would she selectively delete everything up to Thursday 3rd May 2007 with the exception of one wrong number and what was her reason for deleting three of the four calls, between 23.14 and 23.17, from her husband on that critical night?. A possible answer is that she wished to avoid alerting the PJ to evidence that details of around 40 calls had been erased and she felt happier leaving something uncontroversial (or misleading) in memory for them to find. Another answer is that, unsurprisingly, she was under the most extreme stress imaginable following the disappearance of her daughter: but why, in that case, give priority to deleting anything. It is the last thing most parents would think about in the circumstances.

The first call found in Gerald’s mobile memory was timed at 00.30 on Friday 4th May 2007. Again matching antenna records to memory suggests that by the time he gave the handset to the PJ the records of 24 calls or SMSs had been erased, including the one from him found on his wife’s handset and timed at 23.17 on Thursday 3rd May 2007. It appears that he had deleted details of the four calls he made to her that night and she deleted just three. It was this simple discrepancy that first led the PJ to suspect interference with the handsets.

If the deletions were deliberate (and it is an “if”) it implies the McCann’s were both “forensically aware” and crafty and wanted to hide something from the PJ. For this reason, it is important to explore the call record data and to match it against other evidence.

On Saturday 28th April 2007, after their arrival in Luz, Kate McCann’s mobile triggered the antenna 9 times. It is not possible to say, from the available records, whether these were incoming or outgoing calls or SMSs or for how long they lasted. The last activations were at 20.55 and 20.59 when (based on their statements) the Tapas 9 returned for an early night after eating at the Millennium Restaurant with their children. All of these records were erased from the memory of Kate McCann’s mobile. Gerald McCann’s mobile did not activate any of the Luz antennae that day.

On Sunday 29th April 2007, the first activation of Kate McCann’s mobile was at 9.23, but again there are no Vodafone logs or time bars to provide further detail. However, by internally matching the antenna records it appears that she called her husband at 12.26 and 17.02.

The crèche records indicate that he collected Madeleine at 12.15. He also picked up the twins around 17.00 but mistakenly recorded the time as “12.30”. Chances are that the calls from Kate McCann were to check that he had picked up the kids. At 10.13 Gerald McCann received a call from a UK mobile xxxxx3899. The last activation by Kate McCann’s mobile was at 19.30 and Gerald’s at 17.02.

A pattern on this sheet (and it applies to all of the Tapas 9) is that no activations took place at any time during the week while they were at dinner. So maybe Clarence Mitchell was right, after all, and that they were so “into each other” that they didn’t want to be disturbed while sardine munching and left their mobiles in their rooms. They were never specifically asked this question, but it is very important and the point will be addressed later.

On Monday 30th April 2007, neither of the McCann’s telephones activated the Luz transmitters. This looks very odd, especially as they were around the Ocean Club to shuffle the kids to and from the crèches. On this afternoon, Madeleine remained in the crèche for only 15 minutes and was picked up by her mother at 15.30. We do not know what Madeleine did for the rest of the day, but it is possible she was being fractious. Interestingly, a friend of Mrs and Mr McCann supposedly told the “Dispatches” team that made a TV program on the tragedy, that “Madeleine was a screamer”. This could be interpreted in one of two ways, but any use of the past tense in referring to Madeleine would be very significant. It was such a past tense referral, to her supposedly living children, that alerted the FBI to their murder by Susan Smith, their mother.

On Tuesday 1st May 2007, Gerald McCann’s handset was silent all day. Kate McCann’s mobile first activated the Luz antenna at 10.16, but all details of the day’s calls have been deleted from the handset and there is no nothing in the CD from her mobile provider. Another activation took place at 12.17. The crèche records show that Gerald McCann picked up Madeleine at 12.20 (a bit earlier than usual) but Kate McCann’s call at 12.17 does not appear to have been to him, (because his mobile was not activated at all that day). Kate McCann dealt with her last call before leaving for the Tapas Bar at 20.35.

At around 8.45pm on Tuesday 1st May 2007, Miss Nejoua Chekeya, the Ocean Club’s busty Aerobics Instructor, held a “Quiz Night” and was later invited, allegedly by Gerald McCann, to join his table which she did sometime between 9.30pm and 9.50pm. She did not say how long she had remained with them, but she is not the sort of woman men would wish see to leave too quickly. Miss Chekeya stated that one dinner setting was unused and that she could not remember seeing Kate McCann.

However, both Jane Tanner and Russell O’Brien have stated that he did not go to the Tapas Bar on the “Quiz Night” (ie Tuesday 1st May 2007), but had stayed in their room looking after his sick daughter. Jane Tanner took his dinner to the room; thus explaining the unused plate setting. Russell O’Brien was not asked by either the Policia Judiciaria or Leicestershire Police whether he had heard Madeleine crying!

Kate McCann’s mobile was next activated six times, in rapid fire, between 22.16 and 22.27, after she had returned to Apartment 5A after dinner. The antenna traffic proves that these calls were not made to any of the “Tapas 9”.

The evidence from the call logs gives the strongest clue that the “Tapas 9” left their telephones in their rooms when they went to dinner. Clarence Mitchell, the McCann’s spokesperson, confirmed this. In an interview, reported on 6th April 2008 by Ned Temko of “The Guardian”, Mr Mitchell said: “You had nine people in a bar without watches on, without mobile phones and absolute panic set in when they realised what had happened…. We would say that, if the police had a perfect time line across nine people, that would be a damn sight more suspicious than the fractured, illogical, composite statements they might have got”

Mrs Fenn, the McCann’s neighbour, reported that Madeleine had cried for her father between 22.30 and 23.45. The evidence shows that Kate McCann was in Apartment 5A 14 minutes before Madeleine started crying. Tuesday 1st May 2007 is the only night (except, of course, for Thursday 3rd May 2007) that either of the McCanns or any of their friends made calls after dinner.

Mrs McCann volunteered to the PJ that on the night of Wednesday 2nd May 2007, she had slept in the spare bed in her children’s room because her husband had not paid her enough attention over dinner. Or put another way, does she mean the amorous Scot was paying someone else (like Miss Chekeya) too much attention, causing her to stomp out of the Tapas Bar before him: ultimately leading to the spare bed in a strop? Gerald McCann said he thought the reason his wife had slept in the children’s bedroom was because of his snoring and that he did not even bother asking her the following morning what the problem was.

Could it be that their timings are wrong by 24 hours and that Kate McCann’s nocturnal shenanigans took place on the night of Tuesday 1st May 2007? It would fit, but why be untruthful about it? A possible reason is that they wanted to conceal both Kate McCann’s state of mind and the fact that she had returned to Apartment 5A, just before Madeleine’s cried for help.

On Wednesday 2nd May 2007, Kate McCann called her friend “Amanda” at 7.36.41 and again at 7.36.45. This was around two hours earlier than any of mobile activations on any other morning: so Kate McCann was “up with the larks”. Amanda returned the calls at 7.50. There is no record of how long any of these calls lasted or whether they were SMSs. They were all deleted from memory.

At 8.07 Gerald McCann received a call from the SMS message centre (447818520047), but does not appear to have responded. At 8.50 Kate McCann received a call from a UK mobile xxxxx27010 and returned it at 8.53, before going to play tennis. Gerald McCann received a series of calls from his SMS message centre between 9.10 and 10.47, again without response.

At 11.21 Kate received a call from what appears to be a landline in Swansea ( xxxxx0023). The report by Inspector Dias researched this call in detail (Page 21 in his report of 9th November 2007) and discovered that it had not activated any of the Luz antennae. But digging deeper, he found that another UK mobile (xxxxx 1583) had triggered the Luz antenna when connecting to the same Swansea number at 14.01. He dug even deeper, tracked all of the calls made from Luz by xxxx1583 and established it had no connection whatsoever with any of the “Tapas 9”. The Swansea call to Kate McCann was simply a “wrong number”, misrouted and thus not logged by the Luz antennae.

What Inspector Dias did not realise was that the Swansea call had become so special to Kate McCann that, when deleting all of the other Portuguese call records from memory, she decided to leave this one intact.

Gerald received five further calls from the SMS message centre and at 15.50 called 91121, probably to collect his messages. He received further calls from the centre at 17.49 and 19.49. The records provided by Vodafone show these calls but that they originate from a different mobile number (0xxxx014310)

At 20.08 Kate McCann received two calls from a UK mobile xxxx7624 and six minutes late Gerald McCann called 91121: again to collect messages before he left for the Tapas Bar. This was the last activation of the day by either of the McCanns; probably confirming that their mobiles remained in Apartment 5A when they went to dinner.

On Thursday 3rd May 2007 (the critical day) at 8.23 and 8.24 Kate McCann’s mobile activated the antenna to call xxxx7624. There is nothing in file to indicate the owner of this mobile but it does not appear to be any of the McCann family or friends.

At 12.24 Gerald McCann received a call from a UK Mobile xxxx1746. Again there is no clue in the file to the subscriber’s name. At 12.31 Kate McCann received a call (or SMS) from her mother’s mobile and responded an hour later.

Neither of the McCanns appears to have had any further activity on their telephones until after Madeleine was reported missing when Gerald McCann called his wife four times between 23.14 and 23.52. At 23.40 he called his sister – Trish Cameron and at 23.52 -Janet Kennedy.

The batch of SMS messages received by Gerald McCann on Wednesday 2nd May 2007 seems to have caused him some anxiety. Although the number “07818520047” is in a block allocated to Vodafone, the company has no record of the subscriber’s name. When the number is dialed, connection is made to a recorded message which explains that changes have been made to the way customers can access their mailboxes and that they can now dial “121” from their handset or “07836121121” from any other telephone.

Thus the number appears to be a message box for Gerald McCann that sends him an SMS when his mobile is unable to accept a call (because it is out of range or turned off). However, when he was asked by “Expresso TV” on 6th September 2008 about the “sixteen SMS messages” received, he flustered:

“No one has ever asked to see any of my text messages. There is no way that there 16 messages on that day or even the day after, you know. You know, the day after, you know that we got…” Kate McCann came to his rescue and interrupted; “Gerry hardly ever sends text messages until the day after, the day after Madeleine was taken”. Gerald McCann continued: “so you know that it is actually rubbish”

Their McCann’s denials were, of course, technically true although perhaps disingenuous - because there were only 14 messages received on the day before they reported Madeleine missing and two on the day after.

There were 16 SMS messages, in total, so why prevaricate and deny an allegation that was never made. The question was about received messages, not those sent, and on the day before not on 3rd May 2007 or the day after! In the field of forensic linguistics you must always concentrate on the precise wording of denials and especially on those of allegations not made. The denials made by the McCanns are suspicious. However, Mrs McCann’s statement about her husband not sending SMS messages, until after Madeleine’s disappearance, is confirmed by Vodafone’s records.

Mr and Mrs McCann were never closely questioned by the PJ about the detail of their calls, but Gerald McCann excused the deletions by saying that his telephone’s memory only retained details of the last ten calls made. This obvious inaccuracy (It already had retained details of 17 calls) does not appear to have been challenged by the PJ and it does not in anyway explain the selective deletions from his wife’s handset.

So the bottom line is that Kate McCann was in Apartment 5A when Madeleine cried for her father between 22.30 and 23.45 on Tuesday 1st May 2007, leading to a unique flurry of late night calls and to unique calls very early the following morning. A forensic examination of the records of Madeleine’s attendance at the “Lobsters” crèche on Wednesday 2nd and Thursday 3rd May 2007 is critically important because if they have been falsified, to establish she was there when she was not, this case takes on an entirely new dimension and sets different search parameters.

Secondly, if the memories of the mobile telephones were deleted in way suspected, a level of cunning is implied that would be capable of conceiving plan to deliberately delay reporting Madeleine’s “disappearance”; if for no other reason than to disassociate it from the crying incident on Tuesday 1st May 2007.

Of course, this is speculation and it is entirely possible that further investigation and the much awaited transparency by Mr and Mrs McCann will totally exonerate them. But why don’t they simply produce the SMS messages and explain why call details were deleted?

By Paulo Reis and associates

(*) This report is a result of cooperation with a leading international investigative firm that is in the closing stages of an 18 month intensive investigation that is expected to reopen the case in Portugal and to start new proceedings in the UK.


606 comments:

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dylan said...

a......I'm gonna have to pay for this!! :-)))) xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

dylan said...

....and I even managed to mess that up big time! Sorry Claudia, it's late and I can't even keep track of a 7 letter name - blush!

Nite hunni, love a very prostrate Dylan ;-) x

Unknown said...

Nite Nite Dillie and glad you had a good one Hunx

Claudia will probably delete your account tomorrow so fare thee well my friend and that was sooo cheeky of you!

Oh I figured it Maudlin7 and Psychopops helping her out a bit because she is not overstacked in the brain department! Interesting the way their propaganda line is running now though, smacks of desperation to me:-))



xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Anonymous said...

Hi all,

Great posts lastnight. Helped me with any doubts I had about TB.

Viv,

'Well guys Poops had three to four brains on the DE and one of them could be rational and intelligent and another even grovelling as Poops clearly needs to be on 3 As:-)))'

I agree with you Viv. Fox and other posters stood out to me. If not P/Pops her/him/itself one of the trio.

ROB,

'However in the very early days when we were still on the DX, I wrote to him and offered him money for a fund and he refused it.'

I also offered money when I e-mailed him and my reply was no money was needed.


'Well let's be honest, the telly and press in this bloody country are so biased in favour of Team McScum, that if TB can get on the telly to promote the truth by whatever means possible then the best of luck to him.'

HEAR! HEAR!

BBFN.

dylan said...

Good morning Viv and Zodiac :-)

Claudia (or should I say calddia) has obviously not logged-on yet as I'm able to post!! I thought I might be latest up at night too but I see you scuppered that, Viv ;-)

Zodiac, I'm still not sure what to make of TB but whatever I think of him personally, he sure is hell-bent on getting the truth out there for Madeleine and whatever his motives, that has to be a good thing.

Janz, thank you for the link yesterday. I had a look at the video and Gerry looked furious when they were asked the Murat question. I thought for a moment he was going to punch soembody, hmmmm.....

What has been going on with Rosie and Fox, are they both the same person? Does poops post as RP on the 3As?

Have a loevly Sunday folks.

xx

Cláudia said...

Hello, all!

Dylan, I forgive you. It's Christmas time and the Christian in me says that you deserve another chance. ;-)

Have a great Sunday, everybody!

ratonthebeam said...

Rosiepops did post on the 3As at one point, and Jan banned her. She thought it was me (it was before I even became a mod on the 3As). She ranted and ranted on about me for ages on her cesspit. It did give me a good laugh though! :-)

ratonthebeam said...

Isn't a calddia the bit at the top of a volcano where the lava erupts, I think I saw that on the Discovery channel once, this should be interesting :-?

ratonthebeam said...

Sorry no, a caldia is a fancy spool thing on a posh fishing rod for reeling 'em in!!! Hahahaha!!!! Maybe we can start a wee shop or something, put them on the shelves next to the Gerry Baby Monitors, once Del boy delivers them! :-) :-) :-)

ratonthebeam said...

Ok, the top of a volcano is a CALDERA, oh well it was close I suppose :-(

Cláudia said...

Rat, LOL!

docmac said...

The part of a volcano where the eruption occurs is the vent. A caldera is a volcanic crater many times the diameter of the vent. This is formed by a volcano collapsing into itself or after a catastrophic explosion. I know this because of the Trou aux Cerfs, which is the centre point of a large caldera at Curepipe in Mauritius. I was there not that long ago :-)

Seems to be a better description of Rabidpops than Claudia to be honest. You know, big explosion and then collapse :-)))

Cláudia said...

Doc, ROTFLMAO!!!!
Off for a quick coffee. Quite cold here today. And it's snowing everywhere close to here. Except here, of course! LOL

docmac said...

Enjoy the quick coffee amiga. It's not snowing here either.

LittleGreyCell said...

Good grief! This is turning into an episode of Call My Bluff!

OK, I have three definitions for the next word - McCANN - it's your job to tell me which is correct:-

1. A piece of something you'd rather not step in.

2. A vegetable with an ego 20 times the size of the weight of the Earth

3. A grieving parent, completely misunderstood by the rest of the world.

Good Luck!

mandarinn said...

Hi there
my vote is for number 1 xd

nancy said...

Hi everyone, I hope you are all having an enjoyable Sunday with the family.

On the McCann Files today - further news of Tony Bennett and his 60 reasons booklet!

The People - Russell Myers - Sunday 14th December - here's what he says:

"Madeleine McCann's parents faced fresh heartache yesterday over a book claiming that Madeleine was not abducted.

The book by retired lawyer Anthony Bennett comes as Kate and Gerry McCann prepare to launch a 2nd Christmas appeal for help in finding Madeleine.

It sets out 60 reasons against the belief that she was a kidnap victim.

Mr Bennett, 61, of Harlow, Essex, has sold hundreds of copies of the £3 paperback on internet.

He said "readers will find things not published in any newspaper. I can prove it all"

Lawyers for the couple, whose daughter disappeared 19 months ago said "We are watching Mr Bennett's activities very closely"!

I bet they are and it finally looks as though the heat is on for the McCanns!!

docmac said...

Haha, LGC

I can see right through your trick question.

The answer is a massive rotten vegetable whose utterences smell of something one would rather not step in and which should be put in the stocks and have other rotten things thrown at it for 40 years while 13 people 'misunderstand' why this is being done.

nancy said...

LGC -

I'll go for number 2, the vegetable and I choose an onion cos they always looks as though they are trying to shed tears but are finding it difficult to bring them to the surface!

nancy said...

Docmac -

You are a clever clogs and we can't compete with your fertile brain!

LittleGreyCell said...

Blimey Doc! Did you look at the answer?!!!

docmac said...

LGC

Did I win? What's the prize, a cadavery cuddlecat?

OK, I did cheat. We had exactly the same question in our final psych exam. I got it wrong then and made sure I remembered the correct answer in case it ever came up again.

Nancy

See reply above.

:-)))

docmac said...

Beach time :-)

BBFN

Unknown said...

Claudia Hun, that was a very christian gesture towards Dillie, have you been talking to Mr Wearne!

Never mind all this clever geology stuff guys, Poops is just like a volcano, full of hot bile, explodes and then has to go quiet. I suppose he thinks that as that naughty Felicity and Bestrest went back on the DE to have their say, he could do the same on the 3 As. I mean some people just will not be silenced, aftershocks.

Nancy, that is a bit of a turn around for The PEOPLE. I do remember that was Poops favourite reference source, possibly this will no longer be the case I have to say hats off to Bennett, he must be pretty pleased the McCanns lawyers can do more than watch him closely. Now I wonder how much the Find Maddie Fiddle are being charged for that. He has managed to do the same as Goncalo, put in print what we know and challenge the McCanns to sue. By their failure to do so they clearly admit the contents of both books are indeed accurate. Why Tony Bennett even asked them to correct anything they thought was incorrect. That was clever of him!


xxx

hope4truth said...

Hello ALL

And what the betting you are all elsewhere now I am her (sob)..

Not keen on TB at all but I guess if the McCann's dont sue him people will be asking why they dont...

Let's face it when a child is missing the best thing you can do to find her is threaten to sue everyone who dares to say they are responsible for Madeleien's disapearence as they could not be bothered to look after their children prefering to spend time in a bar drinking with their neglectful friends...

Rat I think it was you who said there were no happy holiday snaps of them all together I had never thought of that...

I have been on several holidays with a big group of people and we always have many shots of us all together and certainly lots of all the children on the beach in the pool or at Dinner...

Very odd xxx

LGC I go for no 2 xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

I'd like to go for him with a hatchet, Hope...

:)

nancy said...

I wonder how many other newspapers and TV programmes will follow the People's lead and print the 60 reasons given by TB why Madeleine couldn't have been kidnapped. I hope they do but I suppose if they do hold back it will be because of fear of libel actions!

bath theory said...

Just noticed this from his blog a couple of months ago.

...Our friends were under no obligation to pay the damages in to the fund. However they have from day one indicated that this was what they wanted and have clearly demonstrated that finding Madeleine is of the utmost importance to them...

Then may I ask 3 questions for starters
1) Please tell me what date you consider to be 'day one' ?
2) Why would there be an obligation ?
3) If finding Madeleine truly is of the upmost importance then have they the group asked Kate why she chose to ignore those police questions ?
and two more
4) Did anyone of them know Murat before you left for that holiday? and why did your financial backer BK apparently visit him?
5) Do you still speak to the Catholic priest who was in PDL when this all happened ?

ratonthebeam said...

Hi folks. Why are the only holiday snaps all odd looking? Dodgy mobile phone videos too (even my cheapie digicam has a movie capture feature - most do - so why use a mobile phone at all if it's a film you might want to keep? the quality's crap!)

We usually fill up 3-4 gigabytes of SD card on holiday with the kids, doing all sorts of things; and it wouldn't take three weeks to give out photos if one were to go missing. It would take the time it takes to open the camera and take out the card, i.e. about 30 seconds. Why the delay?

Claudia I am glad you confirmed that it was really Dr Amaral on the 3As. I just hope he is treated appropriately. In a way I am sorry Jan banned Volcanopops. I would have loved to see her post her 48 questions to Dr Amaral in person, not that I think it would ever happen, but it would have been en event worth witnessing.

The People really printed TB's list??? (I have been out all weekend doing personal stuff so I missed it.) Mind you I went right off that rag after all the rubbish they wrote about poor Duarte Levy. I certainly would not pay any money for any of our so-called Sunday papers now unless they come with a fish supper inside.

bath theory said...

PS Wonder why they have not appeared on Oprah yet? :)

bath theory said...

Rat
Maybe they were busy filming other things?

ratonthebeam said...

Aye right BT, it was so much of the utmost importance that they couldn't even take a couple of days off work to go back to PDL for an all-important reconstruction.

bath theory said...

The funny thing here is the arrogance in believing all the public would believe the scamming just cos a couple of bigwig politicians fell into line. The sheer arrogance and ego is astouding. However, I repeat every police person I have met and spoken to does not believe their line but says they are well briefed.

bath theory said...

Time will catch up with them

janz1956 said...

Hiya...Rat, I cant find where theyve printed the list, I could be wrong of course...but this is the link to the article

http://www.people.co.uk/news/news/tm_method=full%26objectID=20968534%26siteID=93463-name_page.html

Its possible that the list is in the printed version, i only looked online

bath theory said...

Off to watch BBC Sports Personality of the Year ie watch the sport of this year and chill out. Something that is rare for me to do these days. Bye all

bath theory said...

Off topic slightly but just goes to show how bigwigs view the power they have once WE have put them there.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/24991066/bushs_final_fu/print

Di said...

Good evening everyone.

Jan thanks for the link to the video of Gerry walking away from whether he knew R Murat.

Not a happy chappy, definitely avoiding the truth. Maybe it is true that Kate is related to him.

There are several people on 3A's that are members of Ancestry etc., that perhaps would be able to thoroughly check this out.

Di said...

BT

Only one winner imo Lewis Hamilton.

Di said...

BT

Thank you for the link, rollingstone, very informative and not at all surprising.

Corrupt, corrupt, corrupt - EVERY GOVERNMENT.

Di said...

OK

So I was wrong, but not unhappy :o))

Di said...

However

Lewis is our first youngest Champion, what more can he do!!!

He must be gutted.

docmac said...

So who won, Di?

My 'money' was on Chris Hoy.

Di said...

Hi Doc

You won, yes Chris Hoy.

I will let you have that one :o))

docmac said...

Hi Di

I didn't win. Chris Hoy did, and well done to him. He was my pick, but I actually thought Rebecca would get it.

docmac said...

Goodnight to all. Sleep well.

Cláudia said...

Boa noite, Doc.
Very cold here. Brrr!

Sleep well, everybody!

docmac said...

Mum21 said...
Message for docmac.

doc...I want one of those wonder batteries for my laptop. You know...the ones that don't ever need recharging. Just like the one you are using.
Churchaven must be a magical place...no electric at all but it can still connect to the internet for hours on end with batteries that never run down.
I would be most grateful if you could point me in the direction of where to buy one.
Thank you

14 December 2008 22:34



Um, the nearest town is 30 km away?
I have a friend there who has real electricity and a spare wall socket?
We need to go there twice a week to buy fresh food and ice?
I have a satellite connection which I will admit is new for me?
I have a high capacity battery?
I go home now and again to check on things?
I don't give a flying f*ck what you have to say?

You did get one thing right. Churchaven is a magical place. If you knew how to use Google you would know this.

Bint.

Cláudia said...

Doc, hasn't she had any yet? It's Christmas time! Will someone please help the ugly hag?

nancy said...

I just read back before going to bed. Sorry if I misled anyone in my post about the People's article. They didn't actually print the 60 reasons why Madeleine's wasn't kidnapped, but just wrote about TB's paperback which is called just that. I think you have to pay £3 to buy it before you can find out, but I'm sure it will be found somewhere on the internet before long.

Another thing I read on the McCann Files is the McCanns fear that members of the public will inadvertently donate money to The Madeleine Foundation set up by TB, because they may mistake it for the McCann's own Madeleine Fund which pays for private investigations into Madeleine's whereabouts - (apparently)!!

They really must be losing sleep worrying about that - and where and who are these so called private detectives anyway?

nancy said...

Goodnight Docmac and Claudia - sleep well.

So Rosieposy is still blogging - I thought they had done a disappearing act - how disappointing!

Good answer you gave Docmac - caustic and to the point!

Nx

Cláudia said...

Sleep well, Nancy!
xxxx

docmac said...

Goodnight Nancy x

Claudia

The woman obviously believes that SA is without any sort of technology at all. I also happen to believe that she, like all the others that post there, would never dare to put a foot on African soil. It's called prejudice. Or racism.

Cláudia said...

Doc, she's too stupid to go anywhere beyond what her little prejudiced eyes see outside the window.

docmac said...

Remember that old Blandz saying, Claudia? Pot, kettle, black.

In this case it's nail, hit, head!

Cláudia said...

Doc, :-)

Going to bed.
Dorme bem, amigo!
xxxx

dylan said...

Evening all ;-)

Caldera, thank you for being so magma-nanimous and allowing me to stay :-) I have been eating humble pie all day today and thanking my lucky starts that the Christmas spirit is with you :) I promise not to be a cheeky moo again!!

I have finally put my tree up. I didn't want my son to go up in the loft as it is at the top of the stairs, and (much to his disgust), I told im it was too dangerous to fetch it down for me! So, I have a pinched a tree from my parents', bought a bargain pack of baubles and spent three hours making hangy things to pimp it up a bit! Even if i do say so myself, I think it looks OK! I am off to bed now and feeling Christmasy for the first time this year!

Docmac - 'Bint' - haven't used that word since the last time I was in Northern Ireland but I love it & have made a mental note to use it more often :-))) !!

Goodnight all. Sleep well. xx

docmac said...

Night Claudia x

Dyl, have a magma-nificent sleep x

docmac said...

"So Goncalo Amaral Hass 'Supposed' To Have Joined the 3 A's?"

Yep, that's our friend from the "South East", the one who has his editor correct all the mistakes. Poor editor, LOL!

Goodnight all.

Unknown said...

ICTOAN

I have just answered a post on Claudia's blog which I obviously overlooked on here, sorry I can see it was one for me!

Viv x

Here is a copy:

Hiya all

ICTOAN I was just reading this and sorry I missed your post on my blog. There is certainly no requirement for the child to be alive for a parent to be charged with neglect. Parents are sometimes charged with manslaughter by neglect, e.g. in the case of a mother who fails to protect her child from a violent partner who is the actual killer.

If you want to look at this more closely here is a legal judgment concerning this ( but it is a bit heavy and technical, not to mention very sad) ..brief extract:

It was the prosecution's case that P had been subjected to sustained, sometimes sadistic, violence at his home address at the hands of a single assailant. The Crown's case was that that person was the appellant. Their case against M was that she was guilty of manslaughter by neglect of her dying child.
It was the medical evidence that the injuries, and in particular the injury which led to the boy's death, had probably been caused on the previous Thursday.
There was ample evidence against M, consisting, inter alia, of her answers in interview, that she knew that P was being subjected to violence by the appellant and that in early October he was, as a result of that violence, ill, but that she had not sought medical help for him. There was ample evidence that in early December 1997 P had again been the subject of violence by the appellant to her knowledge and again she had not, despite the child being in great pain and obviously ill, sought medical assistance. Moreover, there was medical evidence that the damage to the duodenum had probably been caused on Thursday 4th December and that the child would, within half an hour of the injury, have exhibited obvious signs of pain and illness. Had M taken action shortly after the injuries were caused, the doctors' view was that the child would have survived and made a full recovery. Indeed, had she taken action, even up to two hours before the child died, there was a good chance that the child would have survived and fully recovered.

http://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/markup.cgi?doc=/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/1999/1474.html&query=child+and+cruelty+and+neglect+and+manslaughter+and+murder&method=boolean

Hummm, mums who fail to do anything about violent partners often do find themselves in real big trouble. They have a duty of care for their own child, just as Kate did for Madeleine. I have copied this to my own blog as well x

Unknown said...

Doc, bint, sad old slapper imortalised by Harry Enfield, who also liked to take the p^&& out of loadsamoney types too. I wonder if he modelled all this on Bum 21.

Oh waves Bum, how is Richard, tee hee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx How are your captive ducks?

Unknown said...

Doc do you mean the 18 year old web designer whose designs were not good enough, did not even have the right year on it and so got replaced with the good peoples donations to the Find Maddie Fiddle. Oh and the one who likes to have little kiddies bouncing all over him ummm x He was not concentrating on spelling at school was he, must have been sorting out his future partner!

Unknown said...

Just has a look at the Purples. DianeH tell us :

"If there is no evidence of death, then how can death be assumed. In fact, without any evidence, one must assume she left the apartment alive. And that is simply because life leaves no evidence, whereas death does."

For mind numbing stupidity this sureless has to be simply priceless! Do they never catch any live criminals/victims in Australia, Diane? Does all that forensic stuff suddenly bubble up, post mortem as it were? Well I'll be!

Just why do they bother to write such utter crap?

Unknown said...

Just have to post the next bit as well:

"So you know the saying.

If it walks like a duck, acts like a duck and quacks like a duck, its a duck.

Since there is no evidence of death, then it must either be an abduction or Madeleine wandered off (but then what happened to her, lets go with abduction). There is no evidence that doesnt support an abduction. That is there is no evidence that contradicts an abduction. So therefore any evidence (or lack of it) supports an abduction. Therefore any reasonable person has to assume it is an abduction.

Lets take the duck analogy further. If is walks like an idiot, acts like an idiot and talks like an idiot,then it is an idiot. And that is my opinion of someone who thinks they can write such rubbish and not suffer consequences."

Reasonable, idiot, rubbish hum well you said it Diane:-))))))) I think there are consequences for you if you persist in your ahem legal analysis of the McCann's ahem abduction theory! People can have a good laugh!

Unknown said...

10 May 2007:

Mr Sousa added to the clouds of doubt hanging over the inquiry by saying he was not "100 per cent certain" that Madeleine was abducted. "This is being treated as the disappearance of a little girl but obviously we have not ruled out the possibility she was abducted," he said.

I think what both British officers at the scene and Portuguese Police were certain of at that stage was, they did not believe Kate and Gerry McCann!

Let us remember that Family Liaison Officers were assigned to Karen Matthews as well, not because they thought she was a victim, but because they did not believe her. We heard how one such officer asked Kate outright "Where is Madeleine". Kate was most put out by such a question. She knows as much about the whereabouts of Madeleine as Caylee Anthony's mother!

Unknown said...

an awful lot but for some reason she does not want to discuss it or answer any questions. At least they have found little Caylee by the looks of things but mum had been charged anyway, not quite as bright and well backed as Madam McCann!

hope4truth said...

Hi All

Why does DianeH dislike children so much? Was she one of the nutters who used to bleat on about Myra Hindley's rights???

There is no evidence of an abduction at all. And if you want to discount the Cadavar and blood evidence from two dogs who have never had a false positive fair enough..

But you cant discount the evidence that Kate and Gerry McCann thought less of their 3 very small children than I think of my Daughters 14 week old puppy.

Dear god woman do you think children should be neglected?

If your child were missing would you refuse to answer a single question that might find her.

If your friends refused to return to do a reconstruction would you not be draging them by their hair and telling everyone you knew they may be guilty of harming your child as they just dont want to help you find her?

Would you leave 2 year olds asleep in an unlocked apartment while you ran a minute away to tell your friends your 3 year old had been abducted?

Would you find it odd that your friends did not imediatly go and check their own neglected children were still there?

Would you start texting people in England to tell them your version of events people who were too far away to help or would you be out in the streets screaming your childs name and checking every bush bin or hiding place praying the next place you would find her?

How happy would you be in the days after you told the world your 3 year old child was in the hands of Peadophiles (going through hell on earth)would you laugh and smile have lunch on your varander watching all the other people searching for your child.

Just stop for a second and take a look at a picture of Madeleine so small and helpless then have a look at the pictures of her parents on what would have been her 4th Birthday because I dont think I could ever smile and laugh like that again if I thought my child was dead or in the hands of a peadophile ring let alone a few days later on her Birthday.

All you can offer are insults and lies well you sick sick person I do hope if you have any children you dont have a single trait of the McCann's because if you really believe what you are writing no child is safe near you.

If Madeleine was abducted and I dont belive she was but I have no more information than you do. But if she is missing then her parents are heartless and by their unnatural actions every day since she was taken firstly by advertising her eye have made sure she will never ever be found. What kind of Mother refuses to answer questions for a missing child?

A very uncaring and self obsessed one I would spend eternity in hell if I thought it would save my child a prison cell would mean nothing as long as people had all the facts...

docmac said...

No Viv, I meant Dozypips.

There is no evidence that Dianeh is not an idiot. Or a duck. What an idiotic duck.

Hope

As Mandz loved to say; great post!!!

docmac said...

Courtesy of the red blog:

Appeal To The Person Who Knows Something About The Abduction of Madeleine McCann
On The Smallest Chance May See This, Please We Beg You Do The Right Thing.


Dozy, Despite My Thinking That Both Gerry And Kate Are A Bit Dumb, I'm Not Sure They Would Understand "On The Smallest Chance May See This". Do You Want Me To Translate This Into Real English So That They Will Get It And Do The Right Thing?

There Will Of Course Be A Small Fee Involved Which Will Go Straight Into My 'Find Out Gerry And Kate Fund'.

Cláudia said...

Doc, PMSL!

hope4truth said...

Dear God what is wrong with these people???

Appeal To The Person Who Knows Something About The Abduction of Madeleine McCann
On The Smallest Chance May See This, Please We Beg You Do The Right Thing

Her own bloody Mother would not even help just a little bit by answering very simple questions what makes them think any one else who is involved wants to help?

Because the bottom line is The Parents of Madeleine McCann were resposible for what happend to her even IF she was abducted because if they had been where they should have been she would never have been taken...

I have been reading the various statements of JT if she dosent watch out I can see her and her partner being set up as being respobsible for killing Madeleine as she looks as guilty as sin everytime she speaks. I think he has some shame though which is why he would not pose for the sickening photo of them all.

Compensation Karen Mathews deserves compensation as much as that bunch of child neglectors do...

Unknown said...

Hiya Doc, Hope, Claudinha!

Great post Hope and Doc, lol!!

Mr Sousa was practically ruling out the possibility of abduction just one week later and I recall said it was a very complex jigsaw but he thought they would fit the pieces and tell what happened. He was obviously not talking about abduction, he was talking about the TAPAS group. Red/Purples (appropriate colours, I think) have not seen fit to attack Mr Sousa, so it is odd that Diane and Co think they know better than he did just one week later!

Hope, good point. Jane Tanner was reminded by Det Ferguson she was not under arrest and free to leave. Pertinent that she needed to point that out to Jane, I think! This is the couple who I believe stated they wanted to change their accounts because they were inaccurate...they clearly are involved and as you say, better watch out they themselves do not get the blame. Russell has had the sense to avoid Panorama and the steps of the High Court, dumbo Jane could not even do that. She deserves whatever she gets and just like the McCanns, may not always be treated as a mere "witness".

DianeH is the one who liked to crack the little joke about how she was blogging away whilst her little boy played in the dog muck! Hum, truly amusing Diane, do you think Social Workers would find it funny though??

xx

dylan said...

Good afternoon!

Viv, love the PADI pic. It's been years since I've been diving. Only did it once but it makes me want to learn properly now!

Doc - hehe :-) It Is So Nice To Have You Still Posting Here on Top Form, As Per Usual :-) I Was Not Looking Forward To Having To Wait Three Months To Have A Good Laugh At Pro Stupidity Again!

Hope - glad you persevere with your principles. I never realised that Mandz always said 'Great post'! I will now have to think of alternatives for "great" and "post" which will pose a verbal challenge for me ;-) xxx

Viv, was it DH that was the dog poop woman? I remember that post but couldn't remember who wrote it. It made me feel sick at the time and still does and Plops and co defended her to the hilt whilst slating me for dozing off for a few seconds during a feed!!

I am feeling better today than I have in a long time, after putting up my tree last night and getting rid of the fish tank I had my first nightmare free sleep in a long time. This left me refreshed enough to sort out 6 months worth of post and bills today. I hope that this spells the end of a wholly rotten year and good 2009. Can't believe that I have blogging for almost a year now!

Have a good eve, all.

Dylan xxxxx

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I seriously cant believe honest child loving people would write on such a trash site..

The spin really screwed up these arrogant people who decided to plant monkeys to rebuff every decent person who belived something was seriously wrong with what the McCanns were doing and saying just made them look more guilty.

You can play the system when it comes to Car's etc but when a child is involved the whole focus should be on that child the fact that people were ready to be so nasty and to try and frightend people away from their observations showed how desprate they were to get away with what ever they had done.

I was told by Troll that I was scared of you and not to worry I could e mail him and all would be well. I must admit at the time I thought WTF? I am blogging why would they think I had anything to worry about. Then they went nuts and threw Sassy off of her own site and all becomes clear they had been telling people what to write and what sickly sweet avatars to have...

Well whoever they are the respect for Madeleine stinks all children are special and normal parents would not be acting in such a self serving way...

If they had just let genuine people post on behalf of the McCanns and not tried to bully they may have been forgotten by now and got away with it scot free..

So thanks to all of them because I dont think this will fade away like they want it to and Gerry loves the fund so much he cant let that lie either. I thought the money was going to look for other missing children? But it looks like every person who has donated a penny to it have basically paid for M3 to mis direct the truth...

Gerry should have taken note when People were anoyed they paid thier mortgage with the fund instead of using it to find their daughter (who wasnt in Rome or many of the places they jetted off to leaving the twins behind with family) another odd thing can you imagine letting your surviving children out of your sight that early on or ever again?

Strange thing is a lot of what we had heard on the grape vine turned out to be true once the DVD became available yet they still cant shut up and keep spinning on behalf of two neglecting parents who wont lift a finger to help thier child and have on many occasions looked happier than a lottery winner...

Madeleine did not ask to be born like every child in the world but once she was here should have been treated as one of the greatest gifts god has to offer instead she was neglected and has been turned into a money making Icon to provide for her parents who loved her so much they have never once searched for her or publicised a massive reward which could find her if she were really missing...

If they really belive Madeleine is with a peadophile ring on their sick site then they dont seem to understand how awful that is for a child they have made it almost a nice place to be in?

As I have said a million times if my child was missing stuff me just find my child I can cope in jail as long as the reward is being advertised and people are looking for her...

How dare people say neglect is ok it is not and all 9 of the adults on that holiday should live with the guilt and regret of what they did for the rest of their lives it cost Madeleine her life...

docmac said...

Dyl, you missed a capital letter in the word 'on'. You're forgiven though, as it was obviously a jibe at the poster who missed it in the word 'of' :-)))

Hope, whatever has come over you? You have got some serious fire in your belly lately and I'm loving your posts :-)

PS I am scared of Viv. Did you see that pic on ST of her squashing the life out of me?

ICantThinkOfAName said...

dylan

I was glad to hear that you life is now starting to turn around.

I have some idea of your recent moods as I assume they have been similar to my own.

I hope things continue to improve and you find happiness again with a new partner. I won't dwell on how my life is changing but may have some news in the New Year.

As far as diving is concerned, go for it. You are a lot younger than me yet I had my first experiences of White water rafting, canyoning and pot holing in my sixties.

hope4truth said...

Doc

I am just fed up with people making excuses for child neglect...

After seeing some of the woman who have had life battered out of them and had to run from their homes to save themselves and their children recently and them giving up everything they had ever worked for it makes me sick that people are giving to a Limited Company thinking they are helping a child...

Many people need help including 1000s of children just like Madeleine but I have never heard of people who are strongly implicated in her disapearence making money to save themselves before...

I always give people the benefit of the doubt and try and see things from both sides but I am not supposed to think about this I have to be told what I should think and feel???

Lets face it would any of us really want to put people who had lost their child through any more hell??? But these two have done everything to make things difficult to find Madeleine and that is really sick...

Oh BTW my girls both had spare batteries included in their latest laptops and they last for hours I thought Mum was supposed to be an OAP Bill Gates yet she seems to have missed this tecnology????

xxx

nancy said...

Well done LUKE!

What an achievement.

I love swimming, but diving's another thing altogether - that really separates the men from the boys!!

nancy said...

It appears that Tony Bennett sent a complimentary copy of his booklet '60 reasons' to the McCanns last Tuesday. It was accompanied by a short covering letter from the Chairman of The Madeleine Foundation, Debbie Butler.

Several dozen booklets have been sent out free to editors, jornalists, opinion formers, and politicians, in each case with a covering letter (sometimes a long one).

Tony Bennett said on the 3A's "In due course I hope to publish here a complete list of recipients, plus brief details of any responses".
---------------------------------
I expect the one sent to the McCanns will be thrown in the laugh and tear up basket!!

dylan said...

Docmac, thank goodness you noticed my "deliberate" mistake - otherwise I would have had to have eaten more humble pie and I'm sated on it now ;-)!!!

ICTOAN, I am so glad that you may have some news in the New Year and I await it eagerly - can I buy myself a new hat yet? Alas, I don't dare to hope about new men in my life. I've had nothing but use and abuse this year and so I have declared mylself celibate until I meet Mr Right! Thank you for your kind words anyway, it's lovely to know that people I have never met are thinking of me. For me, it is one step at a time and it's a major triumph that I've even been able to think about Christmas, let alone doing something about it! At the end of the day, I pulled myself together for the kids and they are my world.

Hope, ahem, better than the run-of-the-mill blog items (as per usual), I am impressed, as always ;-)
Goodness! I need to get my thesaurus out if you post any more heartfelt and totally "spiffing" items ;-))) xxx

dylan said...

ICTOAN,

I forgot to add: great respect to you for potholing!! As you know, I'm a rock hound, but you won't find me anywhere near a phreatic conduit as I'm a claustrophobe!! I'll leave it to you to describe what you find :-)) xx

nancy said...

Hi Dylan -

Don't worry - enjoy Christmas with your kids because they are the most important people in your life right now - Mr Right can wait!!

I believe in fate, and what will be will be!!

Nx

nancy said...

A bit more news on our favourite couple!

Just an extract from what the Leicesershire Mercury reports on the McCann Files:

THE MCCANNS CONCENTRATE ON THE POLICE FILES

The McCanns are sifting through the official police files in the disappearance.

The couple are continuing to work with a small investigative team, including members with policing experience, to work through the pages of files handed over to them earlier this year. They are stil going through the files.

Clarence Mitchell said that Christmas will be a private affair this year. There are however plans to issue a world wide television appeal to jog people's memories over the festive season!
----------------------------------
As if anyone needs their memories jogged and just why is it taking a team of people so long to go through those files?

I notice in the report that Madeleine's name was not mentioned at all!

JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE!

dylan said...

Nancy, thanks that's what i personally believe! I'm looking forward to meeting you in the spring as I know we'll have loads to talk about :-)

ICTOAN, another thing (groan!), read John Krakauer's Eiger Dreams. I'm an armchair mountaineer and have read so many books on the subject. I used to climb everything as a child and scare the living daylights out of my parents! I have "the fear" now and will never climb dodgy mountains without a rope again and I have whiplash after "tombstoning" a 50ft Welsh cliff which still bothers me now after 3 years! I have come to the conclusion that it is far safer just to read about these things but if you like canyoning, I can recommend this book!

xx

nancy said...

I forgot to say that the Mercury headline also said that the McCanns were scaling down their search to concentrate on sifting through the files.

I wasn't aware they ever started to look for Maddie, so how can they scale it down?

So the Christmas appeal is not to help search for Madeleine then. It is obviously just to get some of those lovely brown envelopes going through their letter box!

docmac said...

LOL!!

BTW, Rosie, wind up laptops as well as torches, radios and televisions do exist. The inventors are now billionaires thanks to Google buying into the product. Guess where they were invented :-)))

Do you ever get out of Essex?

ICantThinkOfAName said...

dylan

I enjoyed all those activities I mentioned but did hurt my back on the very last jump. Unless doc mac says it isn't possible, I will continue to blame the 2 hernias I have just had operated on on that same jump.

All the activities took place in France and I didn't try Rock Climbing (though I would have liked to) because my grasp of the language I thought insufficient if there had been a problem. I might have put others in danger whereas the other activities were less dependant on close team work.

That's my excuse, anyway.

Di said...

Good evening all

Only quickly looking in.

I have spent the last 3 hours sorting out my wireless connection.

Doc

I know, me and laptops. I think i should be banned :o(( Anyway back up and running.

Dyl

I, like you, cannot believe how long we have all been here.

Well done to VIV for keeping us all going with very informative posts, especially when you have been so busy with your private life. JFM



ICTOAN

Don't mention pot holing to me. We have a very good friend who does it on a regular basis. I can't believe what happens to him, it is totally frightening. Why anyone would want to put themselves through such fear is beyond me.

You have my respect :o))

Nancy

Tony Bennett has sent out his book. Good for him. Look forward to the responses.

Di said...

Hi Nancy

I am not looking forward to Christmas if the dodgy duo are going to be thrown in our faces at every opportunity.

Di said...

Off to watch corrie.

If I still have a connection will look back in.

docmac said...

Rosiepops said...

Quark 1 says .....Dr. Amaral....may I call you 'Goncarlo? We are not very 'formal' on here!

I just want to say that many people may ask you questions here, but you should only respond to those that you wish to. There may be many things that you do not wish, or are able, to reveal. And I think all forum members should be aware of that.

You could you dingbat but that is not his name! lol If spelling Goncalo is a problem to you Quark just call him Lardy Arse or Fat Boy, he answers to both!

15 December 2008 10:49


Goncalo must be nearly as difficult to spell as Leonor then.


Hi Nancy

They never did search, did they? Wrote a business plan if you ask me.

Hi Dyl

Great to hear it's going well. You are giving me vertigo with your descriptions of mountains and tombstoning though :-)

Hi ICTOAN

You were a very active 'young' man! As long as the hernias have been repaired it does not matter how they arose.

Hi Hope

Agreed.

hope4truth said...

Hello

Gosh I now own a non exsistant wind up Torch that is also a Radio my Mother is so stupid for buying Mr Hope a product that does not exsist 3 Christmas's ago!!!!!!!!!!!!

Best throw it in the "Nothing In Here Box" along with the torch that you shake to charge and the wind up lantern I stupidly bought!!!! How daft am I???

I remeber seeing the guy who invented the wind up Radio on The Big Breakfast and that has been off air for years!!!

xxx

Di said...

Hi Doc

Sorry if I am missing the point, is Quark Rosiepops?

Di said...

Oops Doc just read again and answered my own question- no.

I am all wired out tonight!

docmac said...

Di

LOL! Enjoy Corrie!

Cláudia said...

Wow, Poops is pissed. And I know why. But I'm not saying. Sometimes I like anons. :-)

Di said...

Hi Doc

Back in between the break.

Help.. I keep getting crash dump and close down, then restart.

What does this mean?

Cláudia said...

Dinner time!
See you later, all!

hope4truth said...

Oi Claudia

What are you not saying??? mmmm thats it run off and eat dinner lol xxx

Di said...

Hi Claudia

Oh do tell pretty please:

Just a little clue :o))))

hope4truth said...

Di

Or a great big clue would be nice x

Di said...

Hi Hope

Very nice xx

Off to catch up with 2nd corrie.

Unknown said...

Hiya all

Well blimey Doc, I did not know the Purples had all gone to hang out back in their original Pink Hole.

I see they claim I said Karen was the epitome of a good mother, whereas on checking I see that I said this, but there again they have ahem diagnosed me as a Psychopathic narcissist, leastways I think that is what they are trying to say, oh and they want to send a nice christmas message to Maddie. From a quick scan of their comments it just does not come across that way to me. Oh and does anyone on here dare to agree with their ahem "diagnosis", you know you are not allowed to say what you think!!

Dillie I love the pic of Luke getting his PADI cert too but I guess I am biased and the epitome of a good mom, after all:-))

"The police could not allow her mother to influence anything at all that she had to say and for that reason contact had to be denied. If her mother is not in any way responsible for the problems with Shannon and there are no other child protection concerns I am sure she will be returned as quickly as possible. The duty of the Police and SSD is to protect Shannon from any further harm whatsoever, she has suffered enough. Therefore they have made the right decision in this case, harsh as it may seem. We just do not know the full circumstances, as yet. Remember also Police have sought expert advice from Psychologists who are also working with Shannon.
Tuesday, 18 March 2008 07:22:00 o'clock GMT

bath theory said...

This is another link alongside my Snow Patrol and Pete Segers music tips.

I once got 7 yr olds singing this in assembly and nearly half the parents were in tears. It is a powerful one that you will know and understand.

This one is for you Madeleine. We are questioning Where is the love? and we march to a beat that goes quietly step by step with a rucksack full of questions undaunted by the evil in this world. JFM

The words in this that I will pick out amongst so many are ...If you've never known truth you've never known love...

Rock on Black Eyed Peas - Where is the love?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ojpbOJjrGBQ

PS Viv you will like this as much as Snow Patrol - Chasing Cars

docmac said...

Di

Click on start, run, type in chkdsk and let it run overnight. If this does not help you need a programme that checks and fixes your registry for you. The best and fastest is Auslogics (will cost you) but there are free ones out there that will do a good job.

dylan said...

Docmac, Re: 'LOL' - I am still puzzled as to why those bigoted, xenophobic, playground bullies over there persist in using adjectives such as: 'Fat' and 'Lardy'?? Wait a minute....I think MY adjectives answered that! Bl@@dy hell! Can they not just grow up a bit?? Gawd!

Bum, my parents have a wind-up lantern and it's great!! One minute of winding gives 1/2 hour of light - miracle! I also have "Freeloader". It is solar powered and is free energy for life for all sorts of digital equipment. Although the intensity of sunlight up in our latitude is not that great at this time of year, it sure is more than enough to power up equipment in SA :-) If Docmac really is a solar-powered sex machine, I'm sure his lovely wife is a very happy bunny ;-)

Di and ICTOAN, I have given up on the dangerous stuff but I'm hoping I might lose the fear factor in the future enough to learn ice climbing so that I can do the Eiger North Wall some day. I doubt I'll still be up for it in 20 years time, however, so I'd better get moving!
Respect to you, ICTOAN for doing what I am no longer brave enough to do :-)

xx

dylan said...

Aw, Caldera! Why is poops pissed? We all want to know, meanie!! ;-)
xx

Cláudia said...

My dear, dear friends, I'm really sorry but I can't say. A promise is a promise. :-)

Cláudia said...

Guys, don't get too excited. It's nothing important. At least not for me! LOL

Cláudia said...

Ok, now it really is dinner time. I'm starving! :-)

Unknown said...

Hiya BT and thanks for that but the latest problem is I have no sound. Luke has sorted the wireless router out but not this one yet:-)))

His present arrives tomorrow so he better pull his socks up!

xxx

Unknown said...

A promise is a promise. :-)

Aha, Claudia, caught you. I think I must follow the lead of the Purples and write to Sophie xxxxxx

Where do you go now you cannot use the police station broom cupboard Hun?

bath theory said...

This Black Eyed Peas song has a tempo, mood and message that beats the drum of those like most of us on here who seek justice a social justice that embeds itself in tolerance, openess and fairness.

These 3 things upset manipulative deviants who rely on other people to be like them and turn the other cheek when follow up questions need to be asked and answered. These odious sorts thrive on bullying and censoring open debate and delight in using tactics more commonly used by dictators in history. Words are cheap to them and they ridicule and snort at others who calmly put forward words that are considered and thoughtful. They have to lie and distort and pour scorn on the integrity of others when indeed deep down they know it is the mirror they really need to look at.

So many people in human history have perished at the hands of controlling freaks who put reputation, ego and money at the forefront of their ambition.

I can tell you I would have stood up and clapped if I had been in the audience when Bush had shoes thrown at him.

docmac said...

BT

I love the Black Eyed Peas!

Dyl

Are you trying to wind Bum up?

Viv

That son of yours with the very foreign-sounding accent (to me :-)) needs to get his act together, otherwise I'll have to come and fix it myself :-)

Unknown said...

Did Poops and Co get fed up of all the erm "litigations" on Forumotion and decided to revert to the more lenient Google so they can start writing their libellous vitriol again? It must be difficult to keep all that evil behind closed doorsxxx

At least the McCanns have decided to shut up, but their little hero worshippers are not quite so bright or well advised I suppose!

Unknown said...

Hummm Doc, like I fixed you in that picture on ST's? Pure Joy, hurry up!


xxxxxxxxxxx

docmac said...

You didn't fix me Viv. You just taught me that I needed a firmer mattress :-))

Cláudia said...

Guys, you're making me PMSL!

Unknown said...

oh lol Doc !!

Unknown said...

Hey Hun its nearly Christmas!

Di said...

Doc

Do you know of Sean Roberts Ajax feeder team?

docmac said...

Dianeh says

..."It's a pity so much time was lost by the incompetence of Goncalo's team in the begging which has left us with nothing.

The begging came from elsewhere. A very amusing slip though. Or was it?

Unknown said...

Doc, could it be true you prefer to lurk around a 65 year old Bum, please tell me she lies!


Blogger Mum21 said...

How strange it is that notdoc can only spend minutes on Viv's blog due to having no way of charging his laptop battery....but manages to keep that battery topped up whilst constantly lurking on our forum.
His battery must have selective viewing enabled.

docmac said...

Di

He is a goalkeeper at Ajax Cape Town. Why do you ask?

Di said...

Oh Doc

Selective viewing & lurking, LOL

Unknown said...

Well anyway Doc, your onboard turbocharger is clearly still giving the knitting circle something to jump up and down about:-)))

Di said...

Doc

Our best friends son.

Unknown said...

OMG I love this one, PMS !


Mum

I thought notdoc was supposed to be gone for 3 months? He could not stay away for three minutes apparently,the sad git.
Perhaps we should be privileged that he finds our forum infinitely more interesting than Vile's snot green hell hole, full of lies and vicious innuendos?
I see he has got bored with his new friend already too!

10 December 2008 22:14
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Please do not post unfounded or unproved allegations against a person, organisation or group. Your posts must not contain swear words or language which may offend ... Posts must not contain ... abusive comments."
DO YOUR POSTS CONTAIN ANYTHING ELSE????

12 December 2008 07:32

docmac said...

Viv

She lies. I have never lurked anywhere near a 65 year old bum. If I ever do I'll be 80 :-))

Di

Didn't get that one.

Di said...

Viv

Knitting circle, don't you be giving the WI something else to wine about LOL..

Well OK...

I will do January any more takers?

Unknown said...

Well quite right mate, do not even think of it, what a pong eh!


xxx

Cláudia said...

Viv, Doc cannot keep away because he's got the hots for Bum. Let's face it, who hasn't? I almost turned a lesbian after I 'met' her. First it was obviously the brains. But then, when I saw her, I just couldn't believe it. Really, I couldn't believe it!

Unknown said...

Well Hun, I know they will call me a pervert again, but it was that big black dog that really done it for me !

Di said...

Doc

Didn't get that one?

Explain?:o)

docmac said...

OK Di

Answered my question then :-)

Struggling with a Rosie-sized bottle of sparkling mineral water here :-)

hope4truth said...

Hey MUM

Gerry and Kate McCann and 6 other parents and one very slefish Grandmother DECIDED to NEGLECT their children night after night after night...

Madeleine is missing and her MOTHER would not answer a single question in an ongoing investigation to try and find out what happend to her.

Kate and Gerry look so happy on Madeleines 4th Birthday full of Joy huge huge smiles a few days after telling the world she was in the hands of a PEADOPHILE RING...

Those are not lies those are facts sickening facts!!!!!!!!

Unknown said...

The Epitome of good moms, in the humble opinion of knowitall Viv (in no particular order, I am not showing any preferential treatment here guys)

Kate McCann
Karen Matthews
Casey Anthony

All had a very strong conviction their dear little girls would soon show up again from their abductions completely safe and well. All did not want to discuss it with the Police, they knew best. Great moms always know what is best for their kids, hence I give them this award xx

Di said...

Hope

Exactly sickening facts!!!

Doc

:o)))))__

Off now

Hopefully see you all tomorrow.

Goodnight all.

x

Unknown said...

Perhaps in fairness I should just add that in the case of contestants numbered 1 and 3 cadaver dogs got positive scents in mummy's car.

Cláudia said...

Viv, actually the dog was the brains! :-)

Unknown said...

Goodnight Di

Sickening facts indeed!

xx

Unknown said...

Oh Hun, is it like some sort of guide dog for Bum? Or did I just naturally gravitate to the brainy one?


xxx

Di said...

Has anyone recieved the Shannon Plate e-amil?

docmac said...

Night Di

If you ever come down to watch him play give me a ring and I'll tag along even though it's not my local team :-)

Unknown said...

Di, I do not know what you mean but if it is as sickening as it sounds, can you post it. Delving into the thought processes of our supermums in always very interesting¬!

Di said...

Oops received

I before e except after c

Di said...

Viv

Sent it to you

x

Di said...

Doc

His parents, our very good friends from school days, have now moved back here. If you are ever over this way, you are welcome.

Cláudia said...

Viv, you certanly picked the smart one! :-)

Di said...

Claudia

Do you mean me ?

Cláudia said...

Di, I mean Bum's brain (her dog!) :-)

Unknown said...

Di, thanks very much for that, as you will see it has caused me to update the top of this thread:-))

I really think Kate deserves this award!

JUSTICE FOR LITTLE MADDIE!

Unknown said...

Whilst on the subject of Caylee, also, do you notice in this report mummy's lawyer wanted to go through as well and try and discredit the police evidence? Oh deja vous!

The McCanns have tried to discredit:

The evidence of the sniffer dogs
(we will get the court records for a now convicted American wife killer)

Using sedatives
(several months later we have had tests done on the twins and there is no sedative medication in their systems, not any more there isn't)

Kate being on anti depressants
(several months later we have had our own tests done and she is not on any such medication, not now she isn't)

There is not a trace of Madeleine in the hire car
(after UK and Portuguese cops swept the car of all forensic evidence there is no longer any trace of Madeleine being in the car)

I am sure people can think of other defensive actions by the McCanns! e.g. the shutters were damaged and the window got jemmied, on no actually we left the door open (simply priceless)

Well if we want to delete our mobile phone records immediately after Madeleine was abducted that is our prerogative. We KNEW it could have nothing at all to do with the Police investigation because we had nothing at all to do with Madeleine going missing, we were just not there at that precise moment on that cold night when those evil predators took their 8 minute window of opportunity..


Police search woods for Caylee Anthony clues a 4th day
By Associated Press
Sunday, December 14, 2008 - Added 1d 2h ago

EmailE-mail PrintablePrintable Comments(5) Comments LargerSmallerText size ShareShare Rate(5) Rate

ORLANDO, Fla. — As detectives enter their fourth day of searching a wooded area for clues in the case of a missing toddler, they’re tight-lipped on whether any more evidence has been found.

On Thursday, a utility worker found a child’s skull less than a half-mile from the Orlando home of Caylee Anthony, who was two when she went missing in June.

Her mother, Casey Anthony, waited a month to report her daughter missing and has been charged with murder.
click here

Orange County Sheriff’s deputies and the FBI are still combing the area where the skull was found. Orange Sheriff’s spokesman Carlos Padilla wouldn’t say what else has been recovered.

On Saturday, Anthony’s lawyer and his forensic investigators conducted their own investigation at the Anthony family home.






Of course innocent parents would just think bo$$ocks, we do not need to defend ourselves but the McCanns do, they have collected literally millions to do so!

Unknown said...

Just thought of a few more subjects of the McCanns obsession with discrediting:

Robert Murat
Goncalo Amaral

But all credit to Leonor Cipriano, convicted child abuser and killer! (not in my opinion)

Unknown said...

oh and of course worldwide paedophiles (Belgium, Morocco, Britain, Portugal, Spain, ad infitum, ad nauseum)

"they took my Madeleine, I hate them"

"but actually I have this gut feeling she is safe and well and will be coming back home to me"

"just like that, whoosh clunk"

Kate McCann

Unknown said...

*infinitum" (not that I thought you could spell it anyway Bum)

Cláudia said...

Got my 60 Reasons by Mr Bennett.
:-)

Boa noite, all!

Unknown said...

Querida Claudia thanks for all those great links, the page I just looked at even translates to English for you, Mercedes, bless her! I must learn how to put such a gadget on for all my foreign readers!! xxxxxxxxx

Luke is calling me!

Boa Noite darling
Viv xxxxx

Mercedes M said...

Hello Viv.

Thank you very much for your words. Here in Spain we fully agree with you. In fact we have sent several e-mails to Angelina Jolie attaching the links to all English-speaking forums and blogs so that she could get well reported on these people "with whom she sympathizes" and we will do so again to any "famous" that "publicly" says he/she will support the McCann.

They should have all the information about what is happening "before" he/she lends his/her image to negligent parents.

For every celebrity who decides to be "the face" of the McCann’s, one of us will have to be "the voice" of Madeleine.

Merry Christmas and prosperous New Year to you all. With the hope and desire that next year will be better, fairer and achieve peace for Madeleine Beth McCann.

Mercedes y Mila

ICantThinkOfAName said...

Oh

ICantThinkOfAName said...

601

ICantThinkOfAName said...

Sorry

Early morning Eyesight. Claudia rides again.

nancy said...

Mercedes y Mila


Thank you for your kind words which are reciprocated - have a wonderful Christmas and New Year 2009 and we will continue to fight for justice for Madeleine until the truth of this whole terrible tragedy comes to light.


Nx

nancy said...

Young innocent Rhys Jones'murderer, Sean Mercer, was found guilty of killing him today.

Just what starts these young thugs on the road to perdition? Gun warfare not only exists among the black community, but among many young white boys too.

So much for Labour's promise to be tough on crime and the causes of crime.

How much of it is caused by the vile videos and games they watch on their computers and on our screens which excites these young kids to violence?

And I don't believe it's anything to do with poverty - they need money to buy these things.

Poverty abounded when my parents were young but they didn't have the desire or the wherewithal to buy weapons and drugs.

I despair for the future of the decent young people of our once great country.

Zero tolerance is imperative if we are to stop more young kids dying.

Rhys's parents were just how you would expect parents to be who had lost a son so tragically, the suffering etched on their faces, but at the same time they were parents Rhys would have been proud of.

I hope they can now carry on with their lives knowing that Justice has been done!



How mu

nancy said...

Since writing the above I've just read that Sean Mercer has been jailed for 22 years. He has shown no remorse, so I hope he serves every one of those years, but I doubt he will!

janz1956 said...

I hope they mean it when they say ` a minimum of 22 years` This scumbag went out deliberately to kill someone.
Hopefully he`ll get a hard time from the other prisoners too.

Di said...

Nancy/ Jannz

I could not believe when I read his girlfriends account. Sean is now a hero as he took the fall for someone else, WHAT!

They had split up prior to this event but she got back with him after the shooting.

Another moment of fame comes to mind.

Cláudia said...

Di, are you sure she doesn't post on the House of Filth? Fits the profile.

bath theory said...

These young thugs are a product of the family life they are brought up in. To that extent it is not only them that should be judged. It is the parents of such boys.

I know this judge and he is a considered man who believes in prison reform.

Fantastic piece by the way Mercedes y Mila

Unknown said...

Hello Mercedes and thanks!

That is a really good idea. I wonder if Angelina is still supporting them! In fairness, celebrities probably live such busy lives they are only aware of the hype from Kate and Gerry. Indeed my own brother was until recently believing they were quite innocent on the basis of their press. Obviously I put him straight.

The McCanns certainly opened up a hornet's nest wanting to keep themselves in the public image and of course all those old photos Gerry managed to dig out of Maddie looking so cute in a less than four years old sort of way!

It is great that people all over the world do not forget this case, their conduct and little Madeleine have become symbolic of abusive parents who seek to get away with what must surely be the worst crime there can be - abusing, neglecting, killing and disposing of your own helpless little piece of flesh and blood. It takes a certain kind of person for that. Fortunately there are not so may Kate and Gerry's around!

Have a great time in Spain as we will here too xxxxxxx

Cláudia said...

Mercedes, welcome and thank you for all you have done.
That Angelina Jolie thing was great!

Unknown said...

I just completely agree Nancy and am delighted at the sentence which will help the parents to feel they have achieved justice, unlike poor Jamie Bulger's mother who knows those two are walking the streets and could get their hands on one of the three further boys she now has. She never lets them out of her sight, again a mother behaving exactly how you would expect an innocent mom to behave. But Kate McCann stated she now had to have the twins sleeping with her in PDL, they had become "totally protective parents", but in the same newspaper article it was announced they were going to Rome, Germany, Amsterdam etc. Their hypocrisy and callous disgregard towards their own flesh and blood is staggering, had the twins not lost enough!

Viv x

Rhys's parents were just how you would expect parents to be who had lost a son so tragically, the suffering etched on their faces, but at the same time they were parents Rhys would have been proud of.

I hope they can now carry on with their lives knowing that Justice has been done!

bath theory said...

I think this was from Daily Telegraph internet page. Just read and this stood out. As I have said many times the police will have the evidence they need from bugging Gez, Cath and the KFC crew. FANTASTIC news everybody because they have just convicted using it today, without the defence kicking it out. Mr Amaral are you reading this. GOOD NEWS !It helped this lovely couple and it will help Madeliene one day

...Another crucial factor in bringing Mercer to justice was the so-called Probe evidence acquired from listening devices planted in two of the defendants' homes.

Such evidence has rarely been put before a British jury, and defence barristers in the trial argued vehemently against its inclusion.

Even after the killer's conviction Det Supt Dave Kelly, who led the investigation, is reluctant to discuss either how or precisely where the listening devices were installed...

JFM :)

bath theory said...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/3795053/Rhys-Jones-The-teenage-supergrass-who-broke-silence-over-Sean-Mercer.html

Off course Tanner could become a supergrass too.

bath theory said...

So bugging + Supergrass = conviction mmmmmmmmmmm

Anonymous said...

Hi all,

Just read all of yesterday and todays posts. Well said everyone. Rabidpops is really scraping the barrel. Scrape, scrape, scrape....foam, foam, foam, hiss, hiss, hiss....

'...Another crucial factor in bringing Mercer to justice was the so-called Probe evidence acquired from listening devices planted in two of the defendants' homes.'

Just imagine being two people desperately trawling files and DVD's looking for all the information they need and it's not there. Then they read the above. Remember they only got 80/81 files from the British investigation and that was info they were given previously.

BBFN

nancy said...

Bath Theory -

Thank God for those listening devices and those clever cops! They proved worth their weight in gold in this case. It won't bring young Rhys back, but it's helped put behind bars the murderer who killed him, so giving some sort of finalisation to Rhys's parents. My heart goes out to them.


Viv -

I have never understood how two grieving parents having 'lost' their young daughter to a predator (their immovable opinion) could immediately leave the twins in the creche while they carried on with their jogging, tennis etc. Their own trivial pursuits were obviously more important than the safety of their children. To think that little Madeleine never even got to play on the local beach with her twin siblings is very sad.

Next week we'll be hearing their latest lament about Madeleine's disappearance and some naive and gullible people will believe every word they say, but we know better on here!

Nx

dylan said...

Good evening all,

It is turning out to be one of those weeks again where I seem to have so little time, but can't quite work out what I've done with the time!

Littlun's Xmas concert was this eve. It was really lovely this year, just as it always has been, but I prefered it as it was more traditional with singing and the children playing instruments etc. What was lovely is that each and every one of them had huge smiles and so obviously enjoyed it :-)

BT, Nancy & Di, you are right about the causes behind such a deterioration in behaviour. I think there is far too much violence in video games, on the TV and to a certain extent, within the lyrics of music. The overloading of this means that children become desensitised to it to a point that it almost seems normal and the association of pain and suffering that comes from these acts is dumbed-down. I don't like my children to see violent films or play violent X Box games, because, for me, that's the worst of the stuff that is censored. I don't mind swearing too much as long as it isn't over the top, but then my children know the boundaries that I set with swearing and I hope that they don't swear outside of my earshot either! Adult humour doesn't bother me as the way I see it, if they get the joke - then it's already too late and if they don't, well...then there's no harm done! It is just violence and gore that I protect them from (and gratuitous adult nature too) as they aren't children for long and I don't want them to know the horrible things that happen on our planet.

However, exposure to some things has crept in through the back door over the years. For example, I remember the day when the press and the media in general, were forbidden to show dead bodies in the news. Now I find, that even in my favourite reads (such as The Independent) that, not only dead bodies are shown, but also those of people that bled profusely, or have been burned beyond recognition. There's no warning on the front page so any child could pick it up and read it. I once complained to the Guradian that they did just that, without warning. It made me feel ill so God only knows how it would feel to a child.

Many seem to blame the breakdown in behaviour of youngsters on single parents. I don't think that is either fair or true. I think a large part of it is the breakdown of the community. It is not that long ago that people would know everybody on their street and they would look after each other. Those days are long gone and so are those of the extended families. If the adults fail to demonstrate what it feels like to be a part of a community, then how can we expect our children to understand that they belong? Some of it is down to lack of parental guidance but a lot of it is the loss of the sense of belonging and also that the blame culture today has effectively wiped out the respect that we used to have for each other as fellow human beings.

I try my best, as parent, to restore some of those lost values to my children. I may be a single parent but every one of my children not only knows, but feels, empathy towards friends, family, people in the world that aren't so lucky and a deep respect for the older generations and hopefully, sometimes, their teachers ;-)

I don't think there is any excuse for poor behaviour and we each need to hold oursleves accountable for our children despite the difficulties we encounter along the way in life. The problem is that not all parents know how to do this and that can only be a symptom of the lack of community where rolemodels would step in to help.

Sorry about the long post. I could go on much more (I hear sighs of relief!) as, having been a teacher for a few years myself in the past, I have seen all of this unfold and have been forced to think of reasons why. Also, I may not get around to posting again this week!

It is so sad that Rhys' killer showed no remorse and him being nothing less than a child himself. I heard today that a teenager has raped and killed a person. I look to my own son and think; 'God! How can this be?' and in the same instance, despair that many of the men who have lost their lives in war, have been no older than him too. :(

Goodnight all. I hope I haven't depressed you too much! Sleep well.

xx

Cláudia said...

Boa noite, all.

Unknown said...

Well guys - Kate and Gerry must be quite paranoid, how soft is that pillow talk, or did the Police stuff the pillows for them. High tech policing certainly gets some great resultsxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Unknown said...

Nancy

I read Pamela Fenn's statement, first words out of his mouth when she asked what was wrong, leaning over the balcony, little girl got abducted! Not his little girl, no room for doubt, just straight in there with the story eh Gerry! My my what a clever man you are...

xx

Unknown said...

Oh and she said that she asked him if he wanted to use the phone to call the police, no problem they have already been called, replies Gerry. Pamela said the time was no more than 10.30. The thing is Gerry, the Police did not get called until 10.40, I guess you were all in a panic hey?

Nite nite xxxxxx

bath theory said...

My teaching colleague at school was in the police and her husband still is. No guesses what he does but let's just say he knows all about listening devices.

The conviction yesterday in a high profile case where a considered sensible judge allowed such evidence brings the possibility of Madeleine's parents coming to court a lot nearer. I feel very peaceful this morning and hope that time does not drag before calm rational questions can be directed at the McCann parents from within the legal environment that they have danced around so far. I emphasise the words ...so far.

JFM

hope4truth said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
hope4truth said...

Morning All

I cant believe it is Christmas Eve next Wednsday I am very excited!!!

Have decided to stay home today (want to spend the whole day indoors but may have to go shopping)...

Rhys Jone's parents have been so dignified through the hell of his Murder the pain is etched on their faces I hope 22 years means 22 years and the police get more power to fast track anyone found with a gun to trial and jail with a lengthy sentence.

It was horrifying to watch all those BRAVE gang memebers who are so proud of what they do they have to hide their faces. Where are these stupid little boys parents??? The whole bloody lot of them should be forcebely taken to a family centre and forced to accept responsibility for their children and each one of them taught some respect...

People seem to think that the life of a child is worthless and it is not just uneducated scum that believe this...

xxx

Di said...

Good morning all

There is a very interesting piece on Joanna Morais.

Off shopping catch you all later.


link

hope4truth said...

Di

Thanks for the link very intresting...

Justine was bloody hopeless could not warm to her at all (or CM for that matter) but I remeber the papers trying to turn her into a money grabbing witch when she put in her payment claim...

They knew how much she cost when they hired her or did they believe the whole world owed them something and everyone should be giving their time for free in the hunt for their child who they alone had neglected in an unlocked room and lied their arses off to try and cover something up???

The only people IMHO they felt deserved money were themselves. It is about time the public became very aware of the fact M3 are a fraud investigation service and that many other firms were more qalified than them to locate a missing child...

I wonder if Justine left the documents on purpose? If she did it could all be a big smoke screen on thier behalf as there is nothing where the evidence points or maybe she knows something she shouldent and had to find a way to ease her concience???

xxx

ratonthebeam said...

Totally off topic, but here is something for Little Grey Cell. It's a nice parenting story, for a change. Something that the Tapas Nine would do well to learn from!!!

hope4truth said...

Rat

Totally brilliant xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

Oh my, Opus is going as red as his bow tie...

Thanks Ratty! How wonderful!

:)))))

XXX

Di said...

Hi Rat

That did make me smile, how clever of them to even think of replacing the eggs with stones.

Di said...

Hi Hope

More and more odd revelations keep surfacing. I feel these phone records are very important, especially the deleted ones.

Also the fact that Kate did not get on with Justine, who was sent to help them, says alot to me. Maybe Justine was very astute from the word go and Kate realized this. So who has been making sure Justine keeps quiet?

Di said...

Dylan

Can I just say a great post from you last night.

hope4truth said...

Hello Di

If anyone is trying to make this go away as they know the poor child is dead then may they all rot in hell...

Then again with the Credit Crunch in full flow may I sugest there is not a lot of news about at the moment... And finaly dropping any protection they have and allow newspapers to report would be a very good few months to bury bad news!!!

Think of what it would do for our economy with all the foreign journalists visiting to report on not only a shocking child abuse case but also fraud in the most discusting and unfealing way...

Justine never did look convincing when she was trying to cover for them maybe she was traumatised at what she had learnt?

You cant erase phone records and make them go away their service provider will have records of exactly who called whom or text etc and even if they have been ordered to delete them I bet due to the high profile of this case a copy was kept for future refrence...

xxx

Di said...

Hello Hope

You have a very good point there about burying bad news, how many times have we seen it in the past!

I agree, Justine imo knew more than she was prepared to let on and always looked very uncomfortable when speaking, which says to me the Government needed to get her replaced pretty quick with Pinky, I wonder why?

nancy said...

Di -


I reckon Justine was too canny for the McCanns and who knows, she may have left those clues under the settee to be found at a later date, on purpose, because she was warned against talking about the case or the McCanns!

Di said...

Nancy

It is amazing what can be found under the sofa these days isn't it;o))

Claudia

I do hope you don't mind me posting your comment from 3A's it summed up everything for me. Well said :o))



Do some people really want to know what happened to Madeleine? Do some people really want the truth? I think some really don't because I see too many p***** off people at the very thought that something may actually happen. Sometimes it takes only a newspaper article, the news of a book being published, the simple idea of a meeting between Gonçalo Amaral and people who have fought for the truth for many months. Personaly I want the truth. If the truth means the parents being conveniently investigated (without any interference whatsoever, without political contacts pulling strings, without ambassadors sticking their noses in the investigation and calling the Head of the PJ even before the PJ got to the scene, without phone calls to the Prime Minister, without a spokesperson who used to work for the Government, without control of the media, without all this carp) and then being ruled out, that's fine by me. But only under these conditions because anything short of that, isn't good enough.
Yes, I do believe that if it wasn' for the internet (fora and blogs) and the efforts of very few people including Gonçalo Amaral, Paulo Reis, Duarte Levy, Tony Bennett, Hernâni Carvalho, Luís Maia, Moita Flores and Paulo Sargento Madeleine would have been completely forgotten. The McCanns would be comfortably enjoying the 'fame' they acquired due to their daughter's disappearance and they would probably even be quite relaxed because no one would be asking difficult questions or challenging the enourmous contradictions in their stories. Maybe that's what some want. But I don't think that's what will happen in spite of all the attempts to silence those who still refuse to do as told. But I do understand why some don't like it.

hope4truth said...

DI

If there really is a D notice on this case (and there is something on it as I did not see anyone defending Karen Mathews before her trial)and Shannon was safe at that point.... If they are covering then the people doing so have something major to hide and is these the people who should be running the country???

Baby P was let down in by all those who should have been there to protect him and rightly so most of them have either resigned or been sacked if they were too arrogant to do so...

Parliment was in uproar condeming gross child abuse with the Conservatives slating Labour yet these same Conservatives keep quiet about GB calling a Mother and Father who went to a Bar and left their 3 very small children home alone?

These same people have not raised any concerns over the Prime Minister calling parents who are heavily under suspicion of being there when their child died?

So if there is a cover up I cant help believeing Doc is right about what happend to Madeline and if this is covered up by the people in power there is no hope for any child in England...

As a couple of Dr's are nothing special so something must be making people nervous.

Di said...

Hope

Sadly, I do wonder if the Baby P outcome came along at just the right time to bury more bad news about the economy, forgive me for my thoughts.

Off to watch tv hopefully will catch up later.

bath theory said...

After my comments yesterday re Rhys Jones murder etc I make my point today based around the haunting image of Gerry & Kate McCann smiling away 1 week or so after the 'disappearance' of their eldest daughter. We have all felt it most odd as we would all be still stratching away at the soil digging to find our eldest or fading away from exhaustion just going over and over the same ground searching and searching. This couple strolled, played tennis, jogged and entertained with small talk to complete strangers looking at ease with the world. Well read this guys and girls...

...After he killed Rhys a TV crew filmed him riding a bike at a shopping precinct.

He was laughing and joking, convinced he had got away with murder. Mercer lived at home with his mum Janette, 49, elder sister and younger brother.

Janette faces court next year, accused of attempting to pervert justice...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2008/12/17/rhys-jones-murder-teenage-gunman-sean-mercer-murdered-schoolboy-then-smoked-a-spliff-115875-20976562/

No more need be said.

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