"We can't even make a consistent prognosis of her fate, including... whether she is alive or dead." UPDATE JANUARY 2010 THE MCCANNS COULD HAVE BEEN CHARGED WITH CHILD KIDNAPPING AND TRAFFICKING (Pt Prosecutor giving evidence in an ongoing case in Portugal where the McCanns are demanding ONE MILLION POUNDS IN DAMAGES FROM THE OFFICER WHO INVESTIGATED THEM!!!
18 Jul 2008
PJ INVESTIGATION: INEVITABLE MADELEINE DIED
rocesso: PJ failed to discover the child's corpse Research reports abduction impossible Thirteen months after Madeleine had disappeared, the PJ concludes an investigation which is still marked by uncertainty. The final report shows that today the CM in isolation, does not determine guilt, but leaves new and strong doubts on the thesis presented by the parents of the child English. It describes in detail the steps taken by the researchers - who tried in every way, confirm the hypothesis - and shows that it was theoretically impossible to have occurred. They do not make sense to witnesses, nor how one of the friends says he has seen a man carrying a child around one hour before it was given the warning of the disappearance. It is Janne Tanner, which ensures there surprised the unknown in a street where he also was the father of Maddie and another witness. Both secured after having seen nothing, although the same angle of vision. Tanner, who later made a portrait of the supposed-robot raptor, says that the man took the child in a horizontal position. The size of the window shows that this could only have happened if the child was transported upright. Still, the PJ tried by all means find out who could have taken Maddie. They did dozens of steps to be suspected of sexual abuse. Have been collected on the registered elements that could have been on holiday in the Algarve during that period of time, to see if there any relationship with the small Maddie. They have also investigated the other users of the resort. The PJ entered into more than 400 homes from around the Ocean Club and found nothing. In the window where Kate said that Maddie was abducted were not collected traces of the girl. Only brands that confirmed the mother of the girl's DNA. The final report of PJ shows the details of an investigation that has reached levels never seen. It was investigated a couple allegedly tried to kidnap another child, were past the fine comb the tracks that gave to that Maddie had been sighted in a petrol pump. It operated a crematorium and compared the genetic profile of Madeleine with the body of a child found on the coast of the United States. The PJ investigated a supposed beggar and followed thousands of clues in the most remote places in the world. Debalde. Nothing confirmed this theory of abduction. PJ INVESTIGOU TRANSPORT One of the most lengthy research was to gather and analyse all the information on possible avenues of transport / escape, by land, sea and air. We also explored the images collected by tourists on vacation at the same time, but, again, no decisive found. This information was compiled in an annex all that is beside the process, with another only for those suspected of sexual offences. APJ also has a file of all individuals connected with violent crime, and esmiuçada the lives of those in detail. It was important to determine whether could have any relation with the abduction. MADDIE The final report of PJ does not give suggestions to the prosecutor. But lists the convictions of an investigation that points inevitably to the death of Maddie on May 3 in Praia da Luz MORE OF A TIME The CHORAR The parents of Madeleine never denied that it was a habit the three children being left alone inside the apartment in Praia da Luz while jantavam, as witnessed by several testimonies from officials of the resort, but defended itself saying that every night to visit the children of half in half an hour. The testimony of neighbor Pamela Fenn leaves completely undermine the version of the couple McCann, when assured the PJ have heard Maddie in tears during one hour and 15 minutes two nights before the crime. The British lives in the 1st floor above the apartment occupied by McCann and told investigators that on the night of May 1 last year, to 22.30, heard a child cry, that the sound would be Madeleine. The Judicial Police ensured that the child remained inconsolable one hour and 15 minutes, until their parents arrived. A neighbour heard the noise of the door at 23.45, when Kate and Gerry ended the normal coexistence with friends in Tapas bar - the restaurant of the resort where daily jantavam around the pool. This testimony contradicts the daily routine of visits that the couple was keeping with their children - and McCann is not free from criticism of other British. Yvone Martin, an official of the social security of British holiday in the Light, criticised the behaviour of negligent Kate and Gerry. DOGS FOR DECISIVOS PJ The actions of British dogs specially trained to detect odor of corpses and human blood that was decisive for Kate and Gerry were made defendants. Given the coincidence of the actions of two animals, which sinalizaram the same places and objects related to McCann, the authorities were obliged to admit any involvement of Kate and Gerry in the case of the disappearance of her daughter and provides them to the defendants face elements that could result in their prosecution - as witnesses could not refer to the silence. According cleared the CM, in the final report of investigation prepared by the Judicial Police investigators explain that animals have only signs of detection in places and objects related to the couple McCann: in the apartment where Madeleine disappeared (the fourth of the couple in the room, and be attached to the window side), in the backyard, the vehicle used by the family McCann (rented 24 days after the disappearance of the girl) in two pieces of clothing, Kate and Maddie in the plush - not that Kate dropped in the days following the disappearance . Already in the apartments of friends of McCann, in the village of Luz and on all vehicles used by Robert Murat, the first defendant to be made, nothing was detected by dogs. Faced with such evidence, reinforced by other expert examinations carried out in Portugal and England, PJ questioned Kate and Gerry and represents them as defendants. The animals, race springer spaniel, are widely used in the United Kingdom in search of missing persons or in the search for victims of murder, with positive results. KATE JUSTIFICA ODOR OF DEATH Kate McCann did not deny the fact that two pieces of clothing and plush of their daughter have been flagged by the English dog trained to detect odor of corpses and justified that with his profession. The mother of Madeleine argued that while the medical Health Centre Leicester, has witnessed six cases of death in the days immediately prior to his coming to Portugal on holiday, giving the same justification for the plush, Madeleine, which has accompanied the following months the disappearance of her daughter. 'A SENTI PONTAPÉ RABO NO' (Goncalo Amaral, former coordinator of the process madeleine mccann in the interview TVI) -- You are convinced that Madeleine McCann is dead? Gonçalo Amaral - I have this conviction. It is an interpretation in the light of law based on concrete facts, I have no knowledge of the investigation and carried out in steps. I am convinced that yes, that died there. -- If both parents have been made is because defendants were suspects? -- There were suspects and evidence for the constitution as defendants, moreover, strong elements on two types of crime: concealment of corpses and simulation of crime. That was public and when he left the investigation was in that foot. -- And the crime of abandonment, why parents are not accused? -- The question whether there is through the children were safe or not. It seems obvious, even if their own parents speak of abduction, that there was security. -- Do not be frustrated by no breakthrough in the case? -- Do not feel frustrated by the courts. Ando here for many years and I have great admiration for the judges. I understand how far can have the work of judges. -- Men do not understand why they came though? -- It does not. Respeitei the decision as a professional. There was an understanding between the Portuguese and English police that the girl was dead ed we had to solidify the evidence that existed and proceed to find where is that it could be. -- Do you think the reaction of PJ had to do with the politicization of the case? -- I think there was more political than police. But inside the ground did our best and never felt any defence. -- He felt the pressure of politics? -- I felt was a kick in the tail on 2 October. -- Do you think the normal case be shelved? -- I am not shocked. RECUARAM ENGLISH IN EXAMS It was the most remarkable volte-face in research. The first tests made by the English laboratory, regarded as pioneer in the analysis of trace organic, gave account of the likelihood of waste collected in the car of McCann be compatible with the genetic profile of Madeleine. Months later - after the Judicial Police already has moved to form accused of parents, according to the final report only on evidence that they hid the corpse of the child English - the laboratory was correct to informaçãoinicial. After all, the examinations to vestígiosrecolhidos naRenaultScénic rented by the couple were not conclusive and was not even possible to ascertain the quality of the material, or whether tratavade bodily fluid or a trace of blood. This change science, not yet completely settled, the investigation eventually lead to a dead end. The use of dogs to detect odors from cadaver or waste of blood is not validated in the Portuguese legal system was necessary and scientifically corroborate the markings canine. In addition, the option of the Judicial Police for submission of tests for England had its genesis in a matter of credibility. The researchers did not want that the results could be challenged by the English, then accepting that the remains were examined there. The IDA ENGLAND ACABOU BY SE REVELAR INÚTIL In April this year, Paulo Rebelo and two of the researchers of the process in which they tried to understand the contours of the disappearance of Madeleine Leicester were now investigating the English holiday on the beach of Light with the couple McCann. It is known now by the final report that nothing conclusive was found of such interrogations. The PJ out there who maintained close collaboration with local police, but anticipates that the testimony brought nothing new. The friends of McCann confined themselves to confirm what had already said in previous interrogations and PJ came out empty-handed this city north of London. CHANGE PauloRebelo, new leader of the research after the departure of Gonçalo Amaral, was repeatedly in the apartment of the Ocean Club, where they were collected the most varied traces. He was also in England, where witnesses heard. FIGURES 443 interrogations door to door in the Ocean Club apartments, made by PJ, are part of a total two million steps, formal and informal, carried out in research. 134 officials of the resort were heard by the inspectors in the days after the crime. The PJ also heard the 12 soldiers who passed by the GNR apartment the night of May 3. 130 elements police and Civil Protection were involved in the first 24 hours of searching. The following day the figure rose to 300. 188 boxes of trash were issued to fine comb in Praia da Luz, Lagos, in an attempt to find the body of Madeleine. 30 square kilometres is the area that the searches were extended to all land forces in the first days, in addition to the Maritime Police. NOTES 3 May 2007: DESAPARECE Between 21.05 and 22.00, Madeleine Beth McCann, of three years, disappeared from the apartment of the Ocean Club in Praia da Luz 17.30 only after the parents contacted with girl. 14 May: FIRST SUSPEITO The British Robert Murat is questioned and is accused. The PJ has made home visits and telephone tapping, but never managed to relate it with the crime being investigated. 4 IN AUGUST: BLOOD Two sniffer dogs, from England, detect odor of corpses and traces of blood in the apartment, in the backyard, in clothes from Kate. 11 OF AUGUST: MORTA One hundred days after the disappearance of Madeleine, and after searches with dogs in England, researchers admit publicly that the child may be dead. 7 DE SETEMEBTO: defendants Based on the performance of the team cinotécnica, Kate and Gerry McCann are again questioned by the Judicial and they also made defendants. 29 NOVEMBER: TEST OF DNA Technical Portuguese and English shall meet at the headquarters of Leicestershire Police to discuss the results of DNA tests on traces collected in the investigation. 20 January 2008: PORTRAIT The couple McCann discloses a portrait-robot on the basis of testimony. Later turned out to the man in question was not involved in the crime. VESTÍGIOS: DELAY The remains of the vehicle used by McCann were collected in August 2007. The results of the examinations should only take a few weeks. IML: TESTS IN PORTUGAL The first traces collected by the investigation were sent to the IML. The tests were not conclusive and also not helped the clarification.
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976 comments:
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Doc, lolololol
It's Sunday! I wanted to make you happy, my friend. Bliss is only bliss when it's shared! :-)
Claudia
Be truthful. You were caught napping!
ICTOAN, no, absolutely not!!!!
I was caught in the bathtub! lolol
ICTOAN
I can't find the exact video I saw before, but have seen a number of compilations that include part of what I thought was most amazing. That being the slow motion sequence of that huge male lion chasing and then catching the hyena by the foot.
Off to a braai. BBL.
PS Claudia you are a liar, but at least you are a pretty one :-)))))
BTW, read Molly2's posts starting halfway down this page. She sounds genuine enough. Really interesting.
Doc, I'm pouting now. Noone calls me a liar. I'll have to hire someone to kill you now! :-)))))
Check my blog. I wrote a little something to cheer the pro's Sunday! :-)
Good evening!!
Claudia, are you there?
Yes, Mandarinn. I'm here and elsewhere. I'm everywhere, really! lolol
Cláudia:
What is your blogname?
Regards
;-))
Claudia you are like santo António , ubiquous, he was in italy and at the same time in lisbon to save his father from hang...
Please see a post i did in you blog , not to last thread, to the before one
Mandarinn, I already did. :-)
Ecolab,
http://proud-of-the-pj.blogspot.com/
bye of to nimas. read you later
bjs
Cláudia : Thanks
Wrote you a greeting
;-))
Bye, Mandarinn! Have fun.
Ecolab, thanks. I've seen it thanked you. :-)
WOW! Great post by the famous yet elusive Spudgun.
I can only repeat these words by someone who has read Spudgun's article already
those words were...
Thank you Spudgun. In the name of children who have no voice, let the people speak.
Doc, that post was just phenomenal.
fantastic thread!! what a pity it does not be publishid in british newspapers for can take knowledge of what are happening in their old democratic country
Hiya all
Great post as ever from Spudgun!
Am I the only person who thinks Leicester Police are going to pursue the McCanns?
Well, we shall see:-)))
Viv x
Viv, probably, my friend! :-)
But hey, I would be the happiest chic alive if you were right, as I'm sure you know. :-))))))
Hi VIv !
Nice to see you. I hope frojm heart you are right, but i have to confess i feel sceptic about it.
Claudia, when you give to us the pleasure of see a new baby's Sara picture, now she is becoming fat :)
Just popped in to say hi and bye as I'm off to bed. Have been reading & did try to post on Claudia's PJ site but it didn't post. Not sure why, I'm such a technophobe!
Anyways, thanks Doc for the link to Spudgun's "letter". I was so impressed that I have pasted into a word document just in case any of my friends (so-called) decide to smarm about the the headlines tomorrow! Cheers again :)
Nite xx
To be honest, Mandarinn, I have more recent ones but I forgot my camera so took them with my mobile so they are not as good. :-) But yeah, she's a bif girl now! :-)
Dylan, your post went through. I just have comment moderation on. I have to check all posts first. So I put the pro ones in the trash bin.. :-)
Hiya Both
Well it just makes perfect sense to me. It was a British Officer we read who really put the McCanns in the frame. To suggest Stuart Prior is trying to orchestrate a cover up is to accuse him of being a very bent cop! an done that the whole world would know is bent. I do not think he is, I think he was there in Portugal for the obvious reason that if the evidence against the McCanns goes into the public domain that would not only seriously frustrate the police enquiry but also enable them to claim they could not obtain a fair trial. That is the law, that is the truth!
Viv x
Hi Viv
Notice I have removed my insider info posts in anticipation of you opening the blog up to public view tomorrow afternoon after the McCanns get the bad news...
What am I saying? I mean tomorrow around midnight when you wake up of course :-))))
Doc, lololol
You always make me PMSL!
I do believe she's dozed off again Claudia :-))
If she's not careful she's going to wake up one night and find she's died.
Doc, how mean!!! lolololol
Viv, Doc is in a good mood...
Claudia did you guys ever get that Kellogg's TV ad for all bran flakes with the jingle that goes something along the lines of "I got it all this morning..?"
Well I got three times as much ;-)
Doc, yes, we do! lolol
E-mailing you in a few seconds.
Replied
Thanks, Doc.
See this from our old friend Penelope. Don't say I didn't tell you so, Claudia.
Doc, :-(
Claudia
I got your messages, just can't reply now as my better half may get suspicious if I text under the duvet :-))))
Doc, lolololol
Gina's back for another bite at the ST cherry...
Doc, Gina is a pathetic soul.
Sorry Claudia, I just did a 'Viv'. I closed my eyes for a moment and...
I'm going to rest now. Big day for me today. Got to move to a new desk...
To Claudia and all other guests here, dorme bem.
To Viv, dorme dorme dorme dorme dorme dorme dorme dorme dorme dorme....................................................................................................
Doc, lololol
Sleep weel, dear friend.
Hope I'll write to you soon...
xxxx
...morning all, specially doc.
Doc I'm not going to post anything from this closed blog until after we hear whatever we hear today, and until after you and I talk further. Anyhow you can post yourself I see!
I thought - what if we hear today that judicial secrecy is not lifted, and the McCs thus still can't get access to the witness statements they so dearly wish to see?
Maybe your info would tell them something they want to know about a witness?
It struck me that there was just a chance this scenario might occur...
Viv
Your words'...Am I the only person who thinks Leicester Police are going to pursue the McCanns?'
No, count me in
JFM
Good Morning BT
I was reading £A yesterday evening and one of the posters there had come to the same conclusion.
This was specially so of certain forensic results left out of the final report of the PJ which would not satisfy a PT court but would be OK in an English court.
Morning!
I've read a post in the 3A from a Portuguese poster who reminds me of someone I really liked reading in the past months and whose comments I always found balanced and thoughtful.
I'm glad she also finds in the bible strength to cope with the problems she is facing now as well as to behave at the moment toward the latest or future developments of this case.
I paste the link here.
http://the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18706&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
More proof, as if it was ever needed. that posters of the pink persuasion have absolutely no respect for the law or any sense of common decency.
by maria Today at 8:41 am
"calcite51 wrote:I think Gonc should be sued - how can these people live with themselves? I will NOT be buying his book."
I believe no one should buy the book. Well just buy one and spread paper copies all over. It is more expensive and agressive to the environment but at least will not give him money to face the huge damage that I hope the McCanns and their friends will claim.
Doc, it's just a shame that her wish will not be granted.
. = ,
:)
Yep Claudia
I see Viv has not stopped dorming since we last spoke. And on this day of all days! The lady must need a new mattress every 2 years or so :-)
Gotta go.
Hi all,
Just a quick hi and bye.
Hope today does have a twist/surprise to it. Will read later on to hear the real news from PT. Thanks in advance to all our PT posters for keeping us updated. UK Press/Media, imo, their papers are not even worth using if you run out of bog roll!
Hi and bye Zodiac
Let's hope so. I hope there is a twist so unexpected that Gerry would need a hosepipe rather than either bog roll or the papers.
I find it interesting that after crowing for so long that the arguidos would be dearguidofied, the pink lot are TERRIBLY quiet. One could hear a pin drop. There have also been lots of disagreements there recently. I can think of at least two stalwarts who would probably leave if one threw a stick...
Cláudia,
Bom dia!
Sorry for my manners.
Doc and all, Good morning!
it seems the PG is going to announce the "solution" at 4pm.
I'm in a meeting which will last until 6. Not going to see it live.:-(
Bom dia, Marga.
Bom dia Marga
I am just off now for the afternoon and will probably also miss the news.
I think Claudia's gone for a poo..
Oh, she finished :-))))))
BBFN!
Doc, you silly boy! :p
See you later!
Doc,LOL
dearguidofied??
Cláudia,
desaguardizar? Oh my, languages are indeed not static!
Cláudia,
I wish I had Doc's humour!
But apropo today's developments.. how do you feel?
Kalimera everyone:)
---
PGR statement released this afternoon, at 4:00 pm
The Portuguese Public Prosecutor's Office will release an official statement about the Madeleine McCann case today, at 4:00 pm. For those who can understand a little bit of Portuguese or want to “google” a quick translation, this is the link where the statement will be posted, in the official web site of “Procuradoria-Geral da República” (Public Prosecutor's Office):
http://www.pgr.pt/portugues/grupo_solta ... indice.htm
_________________
Paulo Reis
pjcv.reis@gmail.com
http://gazetadigital.blogspot.com/
---
Let's go to do some work until 16.00 then...
Have a nice day everyone:)
PS. Astro has translated todays CM article:
http://the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18766
From what I have read the Br (de)press is sooo confident.. shame the innocent girl is being almost forgotten. That's all about the parents.Muito mau...
Doc,
LOL!
'But prepared also for what may be a surprise.'
Mee too, Claudia.
Marga, how do I feel? I am sadly prepared for the worse because it's what I have been suspecting for quite some time. But prepared also for what may be a surprise.
'Me'
BBFN. BB@ 4PM.
Sorry, guys. Deleted the first post because the spelling was resembling a pro's! lololol
See you, Zodiac.
Cláudia, Zodiac,
Well, let the surprise come!
According to this article in CdM the PJ was refused everything.
let's see how the Br police and authorities are going to deal with this case up now.
I repeat what I said in January. I would be glad the Br side would continue the investigation also because this case cannot be concluded as the girl is still missing.
http://proud-of-the-pj.blogspot.com/2008/07/oh-really-interesting-timing.html
I don't think I am going to be able to bear it if the Portuguese shelve the case and remove arguido status from the McCs. It is what the British press are speculating will happen, with such confidence it's hard not to believe they have been given a press release about the decision already.
Have to go out now, but I guess the 4pm timescale for announcement is Portuguese time - I'm an hour ahead so will have to wait until 5pm here!
Will be back later for the announcement!
Stonemaid
I just publsihed this on my blog:
"This is the comment I submitted to the Daily Mail regarding the artice I copy pasted in this thread:
"Oh, so now the bungles were on the FSS not on the PJ? Interesting timing. It couldn't be because the files which will soon become public will show the whole world the preliminary report from FSS, could it? It couldn't be because as soon as the files become public the world will see why they were made arguidos, could it? Too late now."
What the Daily Mail published was the following:
"Oh, so now the bungles were on the FSS not on the PJ? "
Interesting or what? Isn't the UK a democracy? Was my comment insulting in any way? Or wasn't it approved by a certain team?"
Cláudia,
It really stinks!
Poor little girl. This is all about the parents.
According to Sandra Felgueiras who is in Rotley the Lab is going to be "investigated".
Marga, I heard.
There are tons of shit about to hit the fan. In my opinion, this is very, very far from over. Even if the investigation is shelved.
Cláudia,
WHAT A FARCE!!!
One reason more to the MP decide about new diligencies. In a neutral country, of course!
BBFN
MArga, in my opinion this is bigger than our MP. The problem is on a governmental level, in my opinion. And I truly believe that when the PJ arrived at the scene it was probably already too late. O destino estava traçado. But let's not forget that the files, once open, will be seen by avid, thirsty investigative journalists. There are many, many people who will not let go.
See you, Marga.
While you are waiting have a look at the Virgin Media website before it's pulled.
It works like the old DX site where the oldest posting is on the highest number page. At the moment it is up to 16.
http://boards.virginmedia.com/news/
soundbites/20080721_madeleine_parents
_set_to_be_cleared.html?page=1
Hi all
Thanks for keeping me updated particularly our Pt posters with real news. It is amazing really that it is those in foreign countries who can tell us what is going on!
Great to hear from Niki again also and thanks for really good links you provide!
BT - It did occur to me after I wrote that you are the one that steadfastly agrees that Leics Police will not let this very serious case drop. If they had interviewed Kate and Gerry under caution we would not be told about that under any circumstances and you can rest assured their friends would not want to be telling us about this. The McCanns actions in seeking to get the file from Leics Police, the police resisting that and then going to Portugal again resisting disclosure says it all for me! Nowhere in any press statement does Clarence positively declare they are going to be given full disclosure. To do so would enable them to interfere with witnesses which is what they are most certainly about. Remember their recent new hotline? Remember both British and Portuguese officers who have been directly involved in this case have confirmed Madeleine died!
Disappointed we still have to wait until 4 pm for the PT AG to tell us how they intend to deal with this but I suspect the statement when we get it will be pretty brief! Something along the lines the Pt have taken the enquiry as far as they can but...
Hi ICTOAN
Posts from antis are now being pulled.
How's the sleep going, Viv? Only 15 hours now, no pressure :-))
BBL (in around 4 hours).
Jeez! When I pulled Claudia earlier for going for a poo she reappeared in seconds. And here is the second one!
I'm going to start a website called docspredictions.com :-)))))
OH NO! She's nodded off AGAIN!!
ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!! :-))))))))))
Doc
I always arrive when it's too late!
Hi All
It is interesting that Correio de Manha are also refusing to print details about the McCann case on the internet, only in their paper edition do we get the damning detail, in Portugal and of course in Portuguese. This would be difficult for the McCanns to complain about, it clearly could not affect any UK juror!
Doc, maybe Claudia and I do have other things to do! My house is literally being gutted by various workmen!
Doc, ah ah ah
Hey, Viv!
This post by "me from here" is still on line:
These parents are as GUILTY as sin! They know full well that they killed their daughter - and so do the rest of us. Hang them!
BTW me is not me if you know what I mean.
Various workmen! Lucky you. Viv!!! I remember Di had some in recently and we have hardly heard from her since ;-)
I never laugh at my own jokes, but I'm crying here! I know it seems cruel, but I am really, REALLY enjoying my newfound freedom already. I am in an incredibly upbeat mood :-)))
ICTOAN, I missed many of the posts myself.
Really have to go. BBFN.
heheheeee!!
Hiya Claudia
WE may be pretty happy, but I would not want to be Kate and Gerry McCann. Whoever said being a rotten child abusing criminal and then trying to manipulate and lie your way out of it was a good way to carry on, Clarence Mitchell! Gerry will fall out with him big time IMO!!
Serves them all right!
Let us see Clarence manipulate the media if you are right about the level of terrible detail that is about to come out!
Pleased to hear the Pros do not know what to say!!
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Viv, I hope so, hun.
xxxx
Hiya ICTOAN
I know you would not mean hang them, that is barbaric and ridiculous!
I read a post I think it was from Dolores that Kate no longer mingled in the community, they only ever saw Gerry, going into the local Co-op etc. She is a prisoner in Rothley Manor because of what she did and because she cannot persuade the public otherwise. Gerry has to continue to brazen it out and cope with his devastated wife. They are living the life they deserve for what they did to their "beautiful" little girl.
Walking about in the local community (or jogging), going into the supermarket to get dinner is part of normal life and what keeps people normal and happy. Not for Kate McCann!
Viv x
Viv
Coventry is not too far away from them.
Meaning??
Sent to Coventry!!
Oh! that's OK then:-))))))))
It is just that I claimed my own location was Coventry on the DE!!
Yes but expect you chose to go there.
Hiya ICTOAN
I do not actually live in Coventry but it has been huge fun letting Supertroll try and locate me there and making all her silly comments about it. She even said it would have been impossible for me to live in Coventry and be operated on at a Leicester Hospital, not realising of course I got that surgeon because of a private referral I had to pay for so could go just where I liked to have the surgery as indeed NHS patients can now. It is funny to watch them sit and ponder when actually they know nothing!
Viv x
Hi all,
The recent pic of the duo, a twin and an aunt cannot remember the paper. KM looks awful, devastated she never looked liked that when her daughter first disappeared (fear for herself IMO), she looked like she needed support from her aunt. I do not think everything is rosie in la la land. Recent press coverage of Robert Murat he looks calm and dignified as if he knows something. I do beleieve it has been speculated in the recent press The Muc's and Claz know hee haw. Claz looking for other business....why? Whatever happens today,IMO, I do not think it will be plain sailing from now on for them, Archived is not cleared, IMO. Karma, Karma, Karma I believe.
Viv A friend of mine when first introduced claimed to be from Coventry.
One she realised that my knowlege of geography was quite good, she admitted to be from Ashby-de-la-Zouch.
I can think of other large towns that would have better filled the bill.
shelved.
Claudia,
Is there a surprise?
Arguido status lifted. WTF????
Docmac, I hope you are kidding.
Where can I find the news?
Doc. what did I tell you?
E-mailing you in a few seconds.
Zodiac, no, no surprise.
Dylan, it's official.
Hi all
Just having a quick look and cannot believe what I am reading.
Where is the justice in this for Madeleine.
I am utterly gobsmacked, although I suppose if the case is shelved there's not much point in keeping suspects on file.
So there will be no justice for Madeleine - shameful :(
xx
Nothing about neglect either. Poor Maddie
I hope Viv is correct in her assumptions about LP. That's all JFM has left now. Poor little girl.
xx
I am pleased to read on Sky that the case can be reopened at any time if new evidence comes to light.
Claudia
I remember you saying there are many people who will not let this go, I do hope you are right.
Maybe there will be justice after all, but we will have to wait a while longer.
Hi Doc
I have just seen your earlier post, yes still have workmen driving me mad but we are getting there. Sorry I have not been able to post much, I did explain to Viv, I have tried to read when possible but it has not always been easy with workmen looking over my shoulder. I am hoping I will get more time over the next few days.
What a sad sad day this is. Poor Madeleine, I hope she will never be forgotten.
This is too depressing.....I just cannot believe that there is not even a sting in the tail for the McCs...they must be feeling cock-a-hoop that they have reached this point unscathed. As for little Madeleine - well, that was all just too boring for them, wasn't it.
Once the files are opened, things will heat up.
Stonemaid, I totally agree. But I also agree others who have said that this will not be the end of it & if K&G are ecstatic about this then that can only mean that they don't give a fig about Maddie as surely the best news and the only news that can make them happy is if she returns. No matter what transpires, I have to say that I will never believe whatever comes out of their mouths.
This from the Daily Record:
Portuguese police lift arguido status for McCanns after shelving Madeleine investigation
Jul 21 2008 By DailyRecord.co.uk
THE investigation into the disappearance of missing British girl Madeleine McCann is to be shelved, the Poruguese Attorney General has announced.
Attorney General Fernando Jose Pinto Monteiro said today that the case was being closed due to a lack of evidence, but that it could be reopened at any time.
It means the arguido, or official suspect, status of Madeleine's parents Kate and Gerry McCann has now been lifted and they have been formally cleared of any involvement in her disappearance.
Ex-pat property consultant Robert Murat, who was also a suspect in the case, has had his arguido status lifted.
The girl was the subject of a worldwide appeal after going missing, aged just three, from her parent's holiday appartment in Praia Da Luz last May.
Clarence Mitchell, the McCann's spokesman, said Kate and Gerry had been informed of the attorney-general's decision.
"It's far too early to give their immediate reaction yet, but they are, of course, liaising closely with their lawyers in Portugal and Britain," he said.
"I know they will welcome this news but the whole thing has been a distraction since September.
"The main thing now is to get everything back to finding Madeleine. All of this has damaged their good reputations and they will have to assess where they go from here.
"The only thing they care about is finding Madeleine. We hope that the Portuguese authorities will continue to cooperate with their private investigation."
Claudia,
I sicerely hope you are right. xx
Off for a nice warm bath. It is like winter here today :(
Hi Stonemaid
I totally agree with you, very depressing, I suppose the Pros are delighted with todays outcome.
I am not looking forward to seeing the pink one on tv and on every front page over the next few days. No doubt interviews galore!!
I remember Coldwater on 3A's saying we would have many ups and downs but justice would eventually come for Madeleine, I hope he is right.
Dylan, I hope I'm right too.
See you later.
Hi all,
No wonder Robert Murat looked quite pleased, I think he must have known last week. Hopefully the PT posters will keep us up to date with the real news.
Claudia have they been formally cleared? As suggested in the Daily Record, noticed The Record did not say the same for R. Murat merely he has had his status lifted.
Hi Claudia
The opening of the files, I hope you are right, also hopefully the book launch. Could they now appeal for the book to be blocked? as their arguido status has been lifted.
I am just watching Richard & Judy and waiting for them to pass comment, nothing yet which has surprised me. They are so Pro McCann.
Hi Zodiac
Your comment about Robert being pleased and perhaps knowing last week.
All the radio reports I heard today kept stating that the case would be shelved and their arguido status would be lifted. So, are we to believe that this statement had already been leaked to the 3 arguidos, if so that is very worrying.
BBFN,
Going out for dinner.
Nothing will ever change the fact that 3 little children were left alone in a holiday flat, not responsible parenting. There is still the Law of Karma.
Bye Zodiac
Enjoy your meal.
Hopefully catch up tomorrow.
Off now.
If I can I will look in later.
Let us set some records straight. Under Portuguese law the Attorney General's Office could not release the news without informing the lawyers of the arguidos first. Last week, two days ago, yesterday, today, 5 minutes before the world knew, it doesn't matter. Lawyers had to be notified first for legal reasons.
Di, as for the book, they could probably try but I suspect the publisher thought about that. And there are ways around it, I believe.
Zodiac, the Attorney General's office cannot say if someone is innocent or guilty. What has been said is that the arguido status was dropped because there was no evidence. Yes, under the law, not being charged, all three of them are innocent, obviously. However, in the real world the only place where an arguido can clear his/her name without a shadow of a doubt is inside a courtroom.
A very , very interesting thread has started at The 3Arguidos, called SSHHHH....DO YOU HEAR ANYTHING?
Another thing.
The time is right now at the 3 Arguidos 4:58 pm =16:58
(UK time 17:58 - DK time 18:58) that is one houer time difference. Where has the 3 Arguidos home? Anyone knows?
I_Should_Coco said:
"I'm straining my ears, but no .... I don't hear any fat lady singing ...not even practicing her scales ... do you?
THIS IS NOT OVER! NOT BY A LONG SHOT.
A hurdle on the track, that is all. A terrible crime has been committed. The case has not been solved. No-one has been brought to justice. Madeleine has not been found. This is all still to come.
So the case files are put on the shelves for now. But they won't be out of arm's reach - far from it - they will be photocopied, examined, and details revealed.
This could be just what is needed.
As more information - real information, is put into the public domain - there will be a lot more to go on.
People can speak.
We have Amaral's book to come.
Murat can speak.
The McCanns can't use the secrecy excuse to avoid answering questions. Hey - they could even go back to Portugal - why wouldn't they now, if they want to really find out what happened to their daughter?
We might learn exactly who (else) was in PDL that night.
Some people might be more forthcoming with their evidence.
The T9+? will relax a little. The Mcs will be even more cocky. Then they will start tripping each other up.
Look at yesterday's news about Payne. That is only the beginning. What's next?
I'M NOT GOING ANYWHERE. I WILL REMAIN POSITIVE. ONE DAY, THE TRUTH WILL COME OUT. IT'S JUST A MATTER OF TIME."
Ecolab
3A's time is UCT (otherwise known as Greenwich Mean Time)and I think it is "hosted" in the USA.
Ecolab
Typo it should have been UTC
Well I can hear Philopoops singing from 6500 miles away and it still sounds like a chainsaw cutting wet wood.
However, methinks the celebrations are a little premature.
With today's news, SICK AS A PARROT comes to mind.
Yes ICTOAN, UCT would be my Alma Mater!
I am not going to post much tonight as I feel a little irritated by the announcement and I would not want to say something rash.
It won't last.
ICTOAN
It cant be USA, because the timedifference is bigger. FX the timedifference between Newyork and London i 4 hours.
It has to be a centraleuropian country without Summertime like we have here in Denmark.
It might be Portugal??
Well it does`nt matter anyway. I were just curious.
1) McCanns live interview at 19.00hrs on Sky reported
2) Radio 5 stated something along these lines. Gerry went to work today and did soem MRI scans... he will pick up Kate after work ...as she has been staying with the children at a friends.
3) So the holiday was not a true holiday (IMO) but time spent preparing for this interview and thus we shall get the once again prepared answers.
4) I am prepared to state that the way society will deal with these two will be the punishhment until some evidence enlightens the case.
5) I predict things will be very 'interesting' once the twins start school and they have to hang around the playground to pick up their children.
WE SHALL OVERCOME - just a matter of evidence and importantly time.
Zodiac, BT, Docmac & Ecolab,
Earlier I said that I for one will never believe a word that comes out of their mouths. What I should have said is myself and millions of others around the world.
Claudia is right in that "cleared" does not mean innocent and that the only way they can prove their innocence is in a court of law. Do you think they will offer themselves up for this? I think not!! Especially with what is about to be revealed to the world at large ;)
xx
Docmac... remember Russell Crowe
...My name is Maximus Decimus Meridius...I shall seek my vengeance in this life or the next...
It is only a matter of time but I personally believe they will not have to wait until any 'afterlife' before the past creeps up on them and becomes an overpowering burden.
Chin up
:)
Ecolab
The 3A blog states that it is set to UTC.
From Wikipedia:
Coordinated Universal Time (UTC,--Fr. Temps Universel Coordonné) is International Atomic Time (TAI) with leap seconds added at irregular intervals to compensate for the Earth's slowing rotation. Leap seconds are used to allow UTC to closely track UT1, which is mean solar time at the Royal Observatory, Greenwich.
A blog can use any time regardless of its host country.
You may remember that this blog (which I also believe is hosted in the USA)used to show Eastern Standard Time before it ws changed to UK local time.
Dylan
They are now lifted out of the Arguido status. It is now up to them( and only themselves) to clear their Names.
They are not getting my help and they can`t say or do anything to change my opinion. They can find/provide Madeleine safe an sound. Then I shall believe.
"He has made the bed, now he must lie on it - As you make your bed, so you must lie on it."
BT
I very much hope you are right.
I have had more than enough tonight, of people telling me I was wrong about thinking the McCanns were involved in Madeleines demise.
I hope they are wrong and I am right, however I really do not know where this is going anymore.
I have had a look at 3A's and there is a thread saying this announcement today is good, people will now come out of the woodwork and spill the beans on what was seen and heard. Also Robert Murat is free now to talk and hopefully he will, he also has a very good PR agent Max Clifford.
We all live in hope.JFM
They are only reading a report
Planted question one is asked
do you have plans to return to Portugal
GM ... no plans etc
Any legal plans to take Portuges eauthorities to court
GM priority is Madeleine...
3 brief questions and then disappear
Hi Guys
Cannot stop as supposed to be getting ready to go back out.
Archived, by Portugal, does not mean the end of the road, far from it, just wait and see!
Be of good cheer xxxxxxxx
Now the stage managed 4 minute statement is finished I think they will have gone for a drink now !!
Indeed Viv
It's incredible. Not even at this stage can they answer question which aren't agreed? That's revealing...
Hilarious Claudia, Clarence just popped up on Sky again. 2 minutes of him saying ...the search for Madeleine continues blah blah blah and guess what ? the interviewer then talks about the fund and says '...you can still donate..' etc.
:)
Hi Viv
Enjoy your evening
x
As the Radio 5 commnetator said earlier, Kate is staying with friends at the moment. I may be wrong but the way he said it seemed to mean she is staying with friends with the children ie are they separated? I may be wrong here but it seemed to be said that way
Hi Di
Hi Bt
I missed Clarence on Sky but, I cannot believe he is still asking people to donate to the fund. Have they no shame!
Just seen a repeat of the 4 minute bland statement and her final words were... ' I can assure you we will never give up on Madeleine'
And then looked down to the left.
Gerry was sitting on his hands for once. Obviously under orders (IMO)
No it was the SKY reporter mentioning it.
Well time will tell. Now I must run the bath for the boys.
Cheers all
Bye BT
Thanks for letting me know it was the Sky reporter mentioning the fund.
Off now myself
Hopefully see you all tomorrow.
A heartfelt posting from our old friend Big L on 3A.
WE ARE NOT WORTHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HAVING BEEN BROUGHT UP ON THE WRONG SIDE OF THE LAW ALL MY LIFE , I APPLAUD YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i was brought up too be truthful=well that was entirely wrong wasn,t it
i was brought up to be honest and upstanding=well that was entirely wrong wasn,t it
i was brought up to protect my children= well that was entirely wrong wasn,t it
i was brought up to respect the police=well that was entirely wrong wasn,t it
i was brought up to expect and respect justice=well that was entirely wrong wasn,t it.
I WISH I HAD SPENT MY LIFE LIKE YOURSELVES YOU ESTEEM DOCTORS TO LIE CHEAT NEGLECT MY CHILDREN AND MAKE A WAD OF MONEY OUT OF IT .
GORDON BROWN SHAME ON YOU A CORRUPT PRIME MINISTER AND AS A LABOUR STALWARD YOUR PARTY WILL NEVER EVER HAVE MY VOTE AGAIN .I CAN TAKE THE CREDIT CRUNCH, I CAN TAKE HIGHER FUEL PRICES ,I CAN TAKE HIGHER PETROL PRICES, I CAN TAKE SERVICES BEING UNDER FUNDED .BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I CANNOT TAKE THE CORRUPT PROTECTION OF THOSE 2 DESPICABLE PEOPLE OVER THE LIFE OF A CHILD , YOU SIR SHOULD BE ASHAMED AND PREPARED FOR YOUR EXIT FROM OFFICE AT THE NEXT ELECTION AND I HOPE THE NEXT TIME YOU LOOK INTO TO YOUR CHILDRENS EYES LITTLE MADDIE LOOKS BACK AT YOU.
THE COUNTRYS CORRUPT, THE PORTUGESE JUDICAL SYSTEM HAS SHOWN TO BE CORRUPT AS WELL
GOD HAVE MERCY ON ALL DECENT PEOPLES SOULS BECAUSE THIS WORLD BELONGS TO THE RICH AND CORRUPT.
Anything new?
Karen Matthews been released?
Harriet Harman voted FHM's personality of the year?
McCann booked his ticket to go and search for Margaret in Portugal?
Hell frozen over?
I wish just ONE journo with BALLS would ignore protocol, stand up and ask MRS McCann just ONE question:
"What would you say to Madeleine if she could ask you why her Daddy is lying to protect you?"
Dodmac
She'd probably say: "I can't find that question in the script".
Hi all,
My opinion will never change. This is 2008 and I believe that it is totally unacceptable and is most certainly not within the bounds of reasonable parenting to leave 3 little children aged 3 and under alone in a holiday flat to fend for themselves whilst their parents wine and dine elsewhere and as a result one disappears. If those little children had not been left I believe that one of them would not have gone missing. I do not find my opinion boring or avoiding the issue. I will continue to go over old ground until the day I die. I do not care if I sound like Nanday, I would rather be accused of sounding like a lovely little parrot than being called a supporter of child neglect. I have faith that the truth of the 3/5/07 will be revealed in many shapes or forms and it will filter through to the public who will undoubtly judge whether the McC's and Co like it or not. Are cracks already appearing if the Press are correct that only the Paynes and the Gran of the group were prepared to go back to PT, then look how DP is paying for that now. I said that yesterday and I say it again today, could he be the new patsy. A welcome... ooh everybody look over there, only an opinion. I have faith in Viv's faith that she believes this is not the end. I am here to discuss with people that treat each other with respect. For as long as this blog continues in whatever way Viv chooses I will use that as an indication as to how things are really going with this case. When Viv calls it a day I will too, she knows the Law, I do not. However when or if I call it a day, I will not be giving up my right to Freedom of Speech or my right to having an opinion. Whatever happens from this day on I will always be of the opinion that in May 07 in PDL children who were on their family holiday were grossly neglected and as a result of that neglect a child is missing and the neglect was the catalyst to the situation that the missing child may or may not find herself in. I have been a parent for over 23 years and I will not have 2 Doctors from Rothley, their extended family, friends and their PR man dictate to me what I can think or say when it comes to parenting or anything else for that matter. I have 4 children and none of them have ever been left alone especially for my husband and I to social with our friends. I will always have an opinion and I will always have Freedom of Speech. I believe it does not matter a jot how I or anyone else feels about the news today. Just think for a second if M is still alive how is she feeling what is she thinking about what is she suffering? If she is no longer in this realm what took her to where she is now and what did she suffer before getting there? I will always remember this missing child as will millions of others the world over, I will also never forget that her parents never physically searched for her and their behaviour from 4/5/07 to thus far has always made me suspicious of them and the Abductor story, IMO.
Zodiac x
PS. I am also sick of the threats thrown at the general public for having an opinion, is that what is important the public are no longer donating so lets get the publics money another way, imo very poor taste.
ICTOAN
No, Gerry or the pink shirtlifter would say that for her.
Just popping over to 3A now.
Hello everyone
Doc, if you have "popped over" kindly come back and tell me what the heck is going on? The justice for maddie section is now " to read only"
Hi SC
Sorry I never e-mailed you yet. I've been BUSY! I'll do it as soon as I get a chance :-)
There is a new thread replacing the old one as far as comments go here.
SC
I don't know if this helps:
See threads: problem with JFM forum and
This New Forum
Docmac:
Could you please send a link to the report in a html file and not in a pdf file. Then I just put it in The Translater ;-))
57 pages - you must be kidding ;-))
ICTOAN,thank you as well
Bye all,
Off for a couple of days with hubby and daughter.
Zodiac
Have a nice time, hun
See ya
Ecolab
It is only available as a download at the moment unfortunately, so we need to get Claudia busy.
Zodiac have a great time!
OK I have heard from Claudia. She has the file.
Zodiac
Well said...
There is something wrong when you can choose to neglect 3 children aged 3 and under to go to a bar and enjoy yourself and on your return find one of them missing.
Then refuse to answer quesions or go back and help out in any way you can to find your missing child.
God knows what went on in PDL maybe the only thing was she was neglected and because her parents neglected her she was taken.
I dont believe that and neither do the PJ they could have said sorry cant find her along time ago but she was to important to the PJ and they wanted to know what had happend to her. It is a shame England seems more keen to hold her neglectful parents up as the victims while brushing Madeleine off as a nothing...
God will judge one day and spin wont work...
Let's see what happends when they dont sue Amaral over his book and when the secrecy is lifted and some of the reasons that the PJ did not believe a word they said become clear to the general public let's see what people who are not as obsesed as us make of it all..
When the press finaly wake up I wonder how much shock the joyus pictures of them a few days after their beautiful daughter was in the hands of Peadophiles will generate and if the preasure will finally make the peole spinning for them run for cover?
Whoops! The new 3A forum is down. Teething trouble no doubt.
Doc, which part of 'don't spread' did you not understand? Big mouth! lolololol
I deleted my post now, lol! I did not quite know what you meant :-))
Hey ICTOAN
I see the big bad wolf is sniffing around here now. She can smell that 401 all the way from Viseu. We need to hatch a plan...
Doc
Isn't there a procedure where you get a young child to keep pressing the send key 20 times?
Reconstituion was deemed very important by the PJ but the witnesses made it eimpossible to happen.
I think I've heard that somewhere before! lolol!!
Don't be fooled ICTOAN. She's at her most dangerous when she deliberately misspells English words..
All possibilities were investigated, even the wandering one.
Yes, Claudia, keep it coming.
ICTOAN
You can install a little program in your computer with a counter to press the send key up to 10000 times /second. It is used on "youth sites" for cheating purpose....getting cyber money, weapon, amery and that kind of stuff. The key is free for download.
Why? Are you gambling the slotmaschine?
Thousands of sightings, many on the same day and even two at around the same time 4000 km apart.
Sexual offenders lists were checked, small, local criminals ands delinquentes also checked as well as many photos taken by many people in PDL at the time.
Ecolab
We are trying to stop Claudia claiming posting 401. Your idea looks like a workable method.
What do you think, Doc?
The PJ worked hard, no question about it. Of course, they are going to be kicked in the teeth by many Brits now, even by some who believed in them before.
40 minutes to call the police.
two checks during dinner.
I think it looks like Claudia already uses that software ICTOAN. She's building up quite a head of steam.
How many PJ actually worked on the case Claudia?
Was it 401?
Lots of people entered and left the room before the police arrived at the scene.
Oh no.
damn way!
Ok, fun enough. Back to work.
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