2 Jan 2009

KATE MCCANN PJ STATEMENTS AND TO THE TIMES!

Kate McCann seems to be able to express how she really felt with her true friend, Fiona Payne, away from her husband, Gerry McCann..







5 August 2007 is reported to be the day that Kate McCann washed Cuddlecat, some three days after Eddie the Cadaver dog had found it in a cupboard in their apartment. It seems to me there was a sudden flurry of defensive activity by the McCanns at this stage with the knowledge of what the police had found. For the very first time, Kate is let off the leash to actually speak to the press herself (see article The Times, below) with no interference from her controller. But what does she let slip, that she found Maddie missing at 9 pm not 10. It is very odd there would be such a fundamental mistake in an interview she would surely have checked before allowing it to go to print.

I am sure when she was making these comments to the press she had no idea that one day we could ultimately look at all of the statements she has made to the Portuguese Police, I also list the three, starting with the final one when she was made an arguida on 7 September, not very talkative then was she! All four statements including to the Times are set out in sequential order, she should not be surprised she is a suspect! One thing that really sickens me, in this article below she says how happy Madeleine claimed to be. But in her statements below she claims she was very upset the rest of the group just went to the beach that day without telling her and even said to Maddie are you unhappy they went to the beach without you. Maddie would have been left in the creche on her own, if you had done such a spiteful thing when all the other children were with their parents playing on the beach, would you rub the child's nose in it. The only conclusion you can draw is that everything was engineered by the McCanns to ultimately get rid of Maddie, but where did that idea come from, I will always feel it was Gerry. He is the one who has seriously connived and schemed, stood outside the door at 11 that night telling his relatives on his mobile there was a gang of Portuguese Paedophiles and they had snatched Maddie. Imagine being Maddie's aunt or nan and being on the receiving end of such a call. He has certainly not spared anyone's feelings has he! Then he employs a blatant liar, Clarence Mitchell..Maddie could not have been crying before because Rachel was in her apt all night right next door and never heard a sound. The thing is the apt next to the McCanns as we now know was empty, Rachel was next door but one. Another little example, none of them had mobiles that night to clock watch, well funny that because Kate actually says that they did! Who do you get your instructions from Clarence, oh, need we ask, a scheming liar just like yourself, Gerry McCann. Kate was asked if she had a hand in the disappearance of her daughter, she chose not to respond. Shame on you Kate McCann and do not tell us again you love this little girl and want her back! Maybe you do, but you know that is not an option, don't you. Maybe it is high time you moved out of your fantasy world and started telling the truth, just for Madeleine. Your mum reported you have nightmares where Madeleine comes to you in the night, there is only one cure for those, Kate. Tell the truth about your husband and his friends and what they did, that night and what you did too!

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Name: KATE MARIE HEALY

Asked if I wanted to respond on the facts that you are charged, said: ----------

------ What is of British nationality unknown to English in its oral and written form, so this is an interpreter for the defendant indicated in the list provided by the Consulate, Armanda Duarte Salbany Russell, contactable by telephone 282,48#####. ----------
------ This act is also present the representative of the defendant Dr. Carlos Pinto de Abreu, the CP 9786L
------ Come to the file now as a defendant, and it explained the rights and duties that assist, and subject to the IRR.
------ Posta informed of the facts on which you fall, said not wish to make statements.
------ Asked on May 03, 2007, by 22:00, when entered the apartment and saw what they did, where he sought and handling, did not respond.
------ If tried in the locker room of the couple, did not respond. Displayed two photographs of the closet of his room, and asked for a description of the contents, did not respond.
------ Asked why the purdah behind the sofa opposite side of the window, whose photograph was displayed it is stirred, did not respond. Did not answer the question if someone went behind the couch.
------ Wondered how long it took the search was in the apartment after the detection of the disappearance of her daughter MADELEINE, did not respond.
------ Ask why I said from the outset that the kidnapped MADELEINE was not answered.
------ On the assumption that Madeleine had been kidnapped, because the twins left alone at home to go to Tapas give or alarm, because the alleged kidnapper might still be in the apartment, did not respond. Why not asked to twins at that time what had happened to his sister, or because they are asked later, did not respond.
Questioned when ------ gave the alarm in the Tapas said that specifically, that the words used, did not respond.
------ Questions about what happened after giving the alarm at Tapas, did not respond. Asked if had any phone, I can at that time, did not respond. Peguntada was because warn their friends rather than shouting from the balcony, did not respond.
------ Ask who contacted the authorities, did not respond. Asked who participated in the (blank) responded. Asked if anyone outside the group got to know, at times thereafter, the disappearance of MADELEINE, did not respond.
------ Asked if any nearby offered assistance after the disappearance of alarm, no response.
------ Ask what the words mean "we let her down", did not respond.
------ JANE asked whether he reported having seen a man with a child, that night, did not respond.
------ Ask how the authorities were contacted and that police force was warned, did not respond.
------ Questions, during searches already with the police presence, where local MADELEINE was sought as to what form, did not respond. Asked why the twins did not (blank) during this search, or when they were in the top floor, did not respond.
------ Questions for those who telephoned after the facts, did not respond. Asked to be called the "Sky News" has not responded. Questions about the danger of connecting to the media alerting them of abduction, because it could influence the kidnapper, did not respond.
------ Asked asked if the presence of a priest, did not respond.
------ Asked about how to disseminate the face of MADELEINE, where photographs or other, did not respond.
------ Ask if it is true that during the search was sitting in his bed in his room without moving, did not respond.
------ Asked about his behavior during that night, did not respond. And asked if able to sleep, did not respond.
------ Asked if before the trip to Portugal made a comment from a feeling or bad omens, did not respond.
------ Prompted for the behavior of MADELEINE not answered. Asked if she suffers from any illness or take medication, did not respond. Asked which MADELEINE's relationship with siblings, friends and colleagues from school, did not respond.
------ Asked about their professional lives, and how many hospitals and at what worked, did not respond. As medical, and asked what his specialty, did not respond. Questions about whether working in shifts in emergencies or other services did not respond. If you worked every day, did not respond. Asked one time if not stopped working and why, did not respond.
------ Asked whether or not it is true that the children have difficulty sleeping twins, who are restless and that it causes uneasiness, did not respond. Asked whether or not it is true that at certain times felt by the desperate attitude of the kids that left much to restlessness, did not respond.
------ Asked whether or not it is true that at certain times felt desperate for the behavior of their children and that the left much restlessness, did not respond.
------ Asked whether or not it is true that in England came to think of MADELEINE surrender the custody of a family, did not respond.
------ Asked whether at home (England) gave medication to children and what kind of medication, did not respond.
------ In this self you were shown several films Inspection cinotécnica with forensic character, where you can observe the marking on their part for indications of human cadaveric smell blood traces and also human, and only in human nature, as well as the comments of the expert responsible for the investigation.
------ After viewing and further signs of the body odor in your room next to the closet and behind the couch handkerchief to the window of the living room, said he can not explain anything more than already mentioned.
------ Also noted, now the dog for the detection of human blood behind the couch above, said he can not explain anything more than already mentioned.
------ Noted the smell of corpses from the car that rented for about one month after the disappearance, registration 59-DA-27, said he can not explain anything more than already mentioned.
------ Attention to the presence of human blood in the trunk of the vehicle, said he can not explain anything more than already mentioned.
------ Faced with the outcome of the collection of DNA from MADELEINE, whose analysis was carried out by a British laboratory, behind the couch and trunk of the vehicle, situations described above, said he can not explain anything more than has already said .
------ Asked if had any responsibility or involvement in the disappearance of her daughter MADELEINE, did not respond.
------ Asked if is aware that failure to respond to questions calls into question the research, which seeks to know what happened to her daughter, replied that yes, if the investigation does so.
------ Asked if you have anything to add, replied negatively.
------ Given the floor to the distinguished advocate, it said nothing Tuesday to plead or requires.
------ By 14H30 was given for ending this interview.
And most did not say. Read this thought as the self, ratified and will sign, along with Defensor and Interpreter.

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Note on this date Kate was heard as a witness in the proceedings and was therefore prepared to answer questions. But on the following day, when named arguida, as we can see, refused to make any statement when the police wished to put the damning evidence they had to her. They had to make her an arguida before doing this, so that she had safeguards enshrined in law, the right to a lawyer and the right to remain silent, clearly by the nature of the questions above, they were directly accusing her of being involved in a crime by putting the evidence to her and therefore could no longer just treat her as a witness. It is also noteworthy that both before and after this time, via their lawyers Kate and Gerry requested that they be made "assistants" in the investigation which would have meant that they could have disclosure of the police file. This was consistently refused, as we know they had already instructed lawyers to start working on their defence before even being made arguidos. Not the actions or behaviour of innocent parents. (Viv)

KATE MARIE HEALY – STATEMENT
(from DVD)

September 6/2007 3pm at Portimao

Of British nationality, cannot speak or write Portuguese, therefore an interpreter is present taken from a list provided by the Consulate, ADSR.
Also present Carlos Pinto de Abreu, attorney.
KMH confirms all of what was stated before the Policy on May 4, 2007, the day following the events under investigation.

When asked about May 1, 2007 (holiday), she says that on that day they left the apartment around 8:30PM, the same time that was repeated every night. This time was marked at the restaurant as the beginning of dinner, except Saturday, arrival day, when they had dinner at the Millenium. On this day, May 1, the children were asleep, as she put them to bed around 7:15/7:30 and was sure they were sleeping.

They arrived at the Tapas around 8:31, taking the direct route, i.e. left by the verandah door, went down to the road and entered the secondary reception of the complex. As they left by the verandah door, this door remained closed but not locked, as this is only possible from the inside. The curtains were closed.

When they arrived at the Tapas, she thinks that nobody from the group was there, but is not sure.

During dinner, every half hour they went to the apartment to check on the children. This was done by KM and Gerry. Does not remember if on this night any of their friends went to the apartment. States that Russell was not present during dinner, so his wife Jane, or somebody took him dinner to the flat. The reason for his absence was that their youngest daughter was sick. ON 1 MAY, NOT 3 MAY!

Finished dinner around 11 PM, and together with Gerry, left for the apartment.

She thinks they went to the flat four times: Gerry twice and she twice. Approx. 9,9:30, 10, and 10:30PM. STRANGE THAT NOT ONE OF THEIR "FRIENDS" ARE ABLE TO CONFIRM THEY DID THIS! AND CLEARLY A LIE OTHERWISE MRS FENN COULD NOT HAVE BEEN LISTENING TO MADDIE CRY IN BETWEEN 10.30 AND 11.45 - SHE HAS NO REASON TO LIE!

When asked about the fact her daughter had been crying on the night of the Tuesday for one hour and 15 minutes, between 10:30 and 11:45, she says it is not true. She says that on that night, after midnight, Madeleine went to their room and said that her sister Amelie was crying, and slep with her and Gerry in their room. She says that before Madeleine appeared in their room, she had already heard Amelie crying, however she did not go to the room, as Madeleine went to the room almost at the same time she head the crying. She does not remember if afterwards she or Gerry went to the childrens’ room, however she states that Amelie cried for a short time.

She says that on that night the twins slept in the room where Madeleine slept, each in their own crib.

Regarding the layout of the apartment, she says that on the first day the moved the furniture: they moved the two cribs out of their room and put them in another, where the children were to sleep; they separated the two twin beds in this room. They also joined the two single beds that were in their room. She presumes that the cribs, when in their room, remained at the foot of the beds.

She also says that when she arrived there weren’t two but three cribs in the same place, one was lent to the Payne family.

When shown a diagram of the room (attached), she said the cribs were located at point A, chair B at point C, and the cribs in Madeleine’s room were placed horizontally.

Regarding cleaning, this was provided by the complex on Mondays and Wednesdays. This was never modified, and it is not true that a crib was in her room or in a room other than Madeleine’s. SO THEY KNEW THEY WOULD NOT HAVE THE NUISANCE OF A CLEANER COMING IN THE NEXT MORNING..PRESUMABLY PJ HAVE A STATEMENT FROM THE CLEANER ABOUT COTS MOVING AROUND, HENCE THE PJ ENTERTAINED THE IDEA OF ALL CHILDREN BEING PLACED IN THE ONE APT WHICH IN A WAY FITS WITH PAYNES TEDIOUS ROGATORY INTERVIEW (ABOUT 3000 YOU KNOW AND ERRS) WHERE HE SAYS THEY WERE ADAMANT THEY GROUP ALL WANTED TO BE PLACED CLOSE TOGETHER TO ASSIST IN CARING FOR THE CHILDREN, WHAT ELSE COULD THAT MEAN!! PAYNE SPEAKS A LOT ABOUT KATE'S FEAR OF GOING ON THE HOLIDAY TO PDL BUT BEING OVERRULED BY GERRY - THINK SHE KNEW!

She also says that after the day they arrived, April 28, this was the layout of the furniture and this was not altered during the forthcoming days.

When asked if she ever slept in Madeleine’s room, she says that this happened on the Wednesday, because she was annoyed with Gerry. He ignored her after dinner when they went to the Tapas bar, which only happened that day. She decided to retaliate by sleeping in the other room, in the bed next to the window. She doesn’t know if Gerry realized this because he was sleeping when she left, and if in fact her husband was aware of this, he made no comment.

(more to come)
next bit:

Regarding this night she says that none of the children cried, she would have noticed as she was in the room. Regarding the fact that Madeleine on the next morning, Thursday, during breakfast said to both of them that she had been crying and that nobody had come to her room, she presumes that this crying must have been before she and Gerry returned to the apartment. When she asked Madeleine about this however, the child gave no importance to the matter. On this night they also checked on the children every half hour; however she thinks that 45 minutes had gone by from the time of the last check to when they arrived, as exceptionally they went to the Tapas bar. On this day she thinks that Gerry arrived at the apartment around 23:50 and she arrived 5 minutes afterwards. She went to sleep in Madeleine’s room 15/20 minutes afterwards. Before this she spent a few minutes in her bed next to Gerry’s.

From reading her previous statement, mainly lines 34-40 it can be understood that on the Wednesday night she slept in the couple’s bedroom, but that did not happen since she slept in Madeleine’s room.

When asked if Madeleine slept in their room, she says yes, as mentioned, on the Tuesday night. SHE ADMITS THAT MADDIE WAS A DISTURBED CHILD WHO THEY KNEW WOKE UP AND WANDERED INTO THEIR ROOM, SHE HAD ACTUALLY DONE SO!

When asked about the schedule of her children she says that in England Madeleine slept in a room by herself and the twins slept in another room. At home the twins go to bed between 7 and 7.30 PM, Madeleine half an hour later. During the holidays, the three children went to bed at 7:30PM. She says that during the holidays it is relatively easy to put the three children to sleep when they had not slept during the day (DID NOT ALLOW THE TWINS TO HAVE AN AFTERNOON NAP LIKE THE PAYNES CHILDREN BECAUSE THEY COULD NOT DUMP THEM EARLY ON THE NIGHT) and were tired after the day’s activities. When on holiday the twins and Madeleine went to sleep at the same time. They never went out to eat unless the three were actually asleep. Normally when they left the apartment the three children had been asleep close to 1 hour. With the exception of what has been described above, during the holidays, she does not remember if any of the children was awake during the night. However, in England Madeleine sometimes woke up during the night, around 2 – 2:30 AM and went to her parents. During holidays it was normal for the children to be awake by 7:30/8:00, in England, at home, they would normally wake between 7 and 7:30 AM.

Regarding a British custom of having a behaviour chart for the children, she says that she has several notes about Madeleine because with some regularity she gets up during the night. This situation was reported from April 2006 up to her birthday that same year, when she stopped having this problem. These notes correspond to the stars given on the nights Madeleine did not get up and go to her parents’ room. When she had 20 stars she got a present and if she woke up at night and did not stay in her bed, she did not get a star.

During these holidays Madeleine usually slept clutching a soft toy, a pink cat, and sometimes wrapped in a pink blanket. Sometimes she slept on top of the bedcover and at other times was covered with it. When shown a photo of Madeleine’s room and bed, she recognizes the soft toy and the blanket of the same colour.

The interview was stopped at 5PM for a rest period, to be recommenced at 5:15 PM.

more to come
next piece

On May 3 they all woke between 7;30 and 8:00 AM; doesn’t know who woke first. They washed the children and had breakfast at the apartment between 08:00 and 08:30 AM. Food bought by her and Gerry at Baptista supermarket. Previously they’d had breakfast at the Millenium, but as it was so far they’d decided to have breakfast at the apartment. During breakfast the “crying episode”, already described, took place. She noticed a stain, supposedly of tea, on Madeleine’s pijama top, which she washed a little later that same morning. She hung it to dry on a small stand, and it was dry by the afternoon. Madeleine sometimes drank tea; the stain did not appear during breakfast, maybe it happened another day, as Madeleine did not have tea the previous night and the stain was dry. PYJAMAS WERE SENT TO THE FSS FOR ANALYSIS!

After breakfast they got dressed and left the apartment by the main door. All children went walking. The verandah door was closed and locked; she doesn’t know whether the main door was locked or unlocked.

After leaving the apartment they left the twins at the creche next to the Tapas; at the same time she supposes that Gerry took Madeleine to the creche next to the 24-hour reception area.

Once the children had been delivered, they went to the tennis courts for a scheduled tennis lesson. Kate’s group lesson was at 9:15, Gerry’s an hour later. She doesn’t know what Gerry did during that free hour; she presumes he went to the apartment. When her lesson ended at 10:15, she went to the recreation area next to the swimming pool to talk to Russell until Gerry’s lesson was over. Afterwards, she is not sure, they went back together to the apartment until close to 12:15 when she went to Madeleine’s creche to pick her up, together with Fiona Payne. She signed the register and went to the twins’ creche with the intention of picking them up, she thought she would meet Gerry there, not knowing if he already had the twins with him. Together with the three children they went to the apartment for lunch, with food bought at the supermarket. This would be around 12:35/12:40. They ate sandwiches, mainly she and Gerry, and the children maybe ate pasta. Lunch lasted around 20 minutes. After finishing lunch they stayed for a while at the apartment, then they went to the recreation area next to the pool, as the children were somewhat restless, maybe tired or bored. They remained at this area an hour, maybe more, then they left the twins at the creche next to the Tapas and both of them took Madeleine to the other creche. They went via a path in front of the small reception and then through gardens and stairs, taking a short cut. This route was the one mentioned by Gerry.

After leaving Madeleine around 2:50 PM, they both had, this one time, an individual tennis lesson just for the two of them, and as the court was empty, they began hitting some b*lls until it was time for their lesson.

She doesn’t remember if they were wearing appropriate clothes or if they went to the apartment to change.

The lesson ended an hour afterwards, close to 4:30PM. Gerry continued playing tennis with a guest called Jxxxxn who belonged to his tennis group, while she went for a jog along the beach, for around half an hour. She saw the others of the group, children and grownups; she was disappointed as nobody had told her they were going to the beach and Madeleine would have loved to have gone with them. She cannot confirm whether she went to the apartment between the tennis game and the jog.

When she finished jogging, around 5:20/5:30PM she went to the Tapas area. Gerry was there, as well as the twins and Madeleine who were eating at separate tables. Madeleine had been taken to the Tapas by the nannies. Her parents were required to sign the register when the meal was over. During the meal Kate asked Madeleine if she was sad because the other children in the group had gone to the beach without her: she replied that she wasn’t, but was rather tired. She asked Kate to carry her back to the apartment. Kate agreed, and Gerry led the twins back to the apartment. Tiredness was due to the intense daily activities, not to any sickness.

They arrived at the apartment around 5:40PM, earlier than usual, because Madeleine was tired, their other friends were at the beach and Gerry had an all-male tennis game at 6:00PM. At the flat they both bathed the children, and close to 6:00PM Gerry went to the tennis courts, soon after the children had finished their bath. They entered the apartment by the main door, with the key. She does not know if it was locked, and presumes it was Gerry who opened it. At lunch time they also entered by the same door.

After the children’s bath, already alone, she put pijamas and nappies on the twins, gave them each a glass of milk and biscuits. Before bathing the children and because it was early, they had thought of taking them to the recreation area, but then decided against this because of tiredness.

While the children were eating and looking at some books, Kate had a shower which lasted around 5 minutes. After showering, at around 6:30/6:40PM and while she was getting dry, she heard somebody knocking at the verandah door. She wrapped herself in a towel and went to see who it was. This door was closed but not locked as Gerry had left by this door. She confirmed it was David Payne, because he called out and had opened the door slightly. David’s visit was to help her to take the children to the recreation area. When David returned from the beach he was with Gerry at the tennis courts, and it was Gerry who asked him to help Kate with taking the children to the recreation area, which had been arranged but did not take place. David was at the apartment for around 30 seconds, he didn’t actually enter the flat, he remained at the verandah door. According to her he then left for the tennis courts where Gerry was. The time was around 6:30-6:40PM.

After David left, Kate dressed and sat with the children, Madeleine on her lap. She was wearing a top, she doesn’t remember what colour it was, a green long-sleeved t-shirt, blue denim pants. Trainers (tennis shoes) and white socks.

She read a story to the children in the living room, on the sofa in front of the door to the verandah, identified on the diagram with the letter D. At 7:00 PM Gerry arrived and entered via the verandah door. He sat on the sofa identified with letter E. Doesn’t know if the story was finished, but thinks she was sitting on the sofa.

She doesn’t remember having changed the layout of the furniture in the living room, the sofas, the table or others. She says that the sofa (letter E) supposedly was against the side window, because she doesn’t remember anyone having gone behind it. She does not know if this window was open or closed, she does not remember it ever being open, or of it being watched.

After Gerry arrived the children went to wash their teeth and she then read them another story, this time all four of them sitting on Madeleine’s bed. She thinks that Gerry entered the room, but does not recall him sitting on the bed. During the story Madeleine was lying on the pillow, alert and paying attention to the story. After both twins kissed Madeleine, she thinks that Gerry was in the room, and each (Kate and Gerry) placed a twin in its crib at the same time, between Madeleine’s bed and the bed next to the window. They also kissed Madeleine, who was lying down. She was under the covers, she thinks because she was a bit cold. She normally clutched the soft toy and if she wasn’t holding it then it was next to her, on the left. She remained lying down on her left side, with the soft toy and a pink blanket, to cover her. The twins were laid down on their backs, covered with open weave blankets. She says that she doesn’t know if the children were in the same positions when they left the apartment.

It was around 7:15PM when they put the children to bed and checked they were sleeping, she says she is sure of this.

As the children were asleep, she dried her hair and put on make up. Gerry maybe had a shower and they sat on one of the sofas in the living room, she doesn’t know which. She had a glass of wine, poured by Gerry, and he had wine or beer. The wine was from New Zealand, white.

Gerry was wearing blue denim trousers and trainers (tennis shoes). She doesn’t remember what else he was wearing.

They talked while they drank. Around 8:30-8:35 they left for the Tapas restaurant. Before leaving they checked on the children, she doesn’t know who; however Gerry says it was him. She only knows the children were quiet. She doesn’t know if they were in their same positions. She says she is sure that they were asleep, because Gerry told her all was quiet.

They left by the verandah door, which they left closed but not locked. Main door was closed but not locked. She thinks it could be opened from the inside but not from the outside. She thinks she was wearing a cream coloured polar fleece with a zip, and on top a blue raincoat also with a zip. As regards Gerry, she doesn’t know if he was wearing other items of clothing.

With respect to the objects she says they took with them: their mobile phones. Gerry might have taken a wallet with money. Not sure if they took a camera.

Regarding the apartment: windows were closed but she doesn’t know if they were locked. Verandah window closed but not locked, curtains closed. The second window in the living room was probably closed, she did not touch it and does not know if the blinds were closed. The kitchen window was probably closed but with the blinds open as there was light in the kitchen.

The window in Madeleine’s room remained closed, but she doesn’t know if it was locked, blinds and curtains drawn. The window remained like this since the first day, night and day. She never opened it. If somebody saw the window blinds in Madeleine’s room open, it was not Kate who opened them, she never saw them open.

The window in Kate’s room was closed and she admits they used the blinds, because Gerry broke them and they were repaired on the Monday; the incident occurred on Sunday.

Before they left she took some precautions: put the medicine inside a bag with a clasp in her room inside the wardrobe or the dresser. These were Calpol (paracetamol) and Nurofen (Ibuprofen), for fevers and pains, both for adults and children (liquid form for children). In this bag there was also a small pair of scissors. In the kitchen were cutting elements used to prepare the meals and which were not put out of sight. During their trips it was normal for them to take these medicines. During these holidays she never gave any medicine to her children, nor did Gerry. She now says that Gerry took medicine for acidity called Losec (omeprozole) which they also possessed.

The interview was stopped at around 8PM for a rest period and food; it was recommenced at 10:00PM.

K says that on the 3rd they left the apartment leaving the children sleeping. Knowing that Madeleine sometimes woke and got up, she did not worry about leaving her alone, because when this happened, and it wasn’t always, it was around 2 – 3 AM at which time they would be back in the apartment.

They left the apartment between 8:30-8:35PM, and headed straight for the Tapas where they arrived 1 minute later maximum. None of the group were at the Tapas because they were usually the first to arrive, but she isn’t sure this was the case every night. There was a couple there who they knew, S and C xxxx who belonged to Gerry’s tennis group. They talked with them for a few moments before sitting down. Meanwhile, while they talked to S and C the rest of their group arrived and sat down at a round table, where they sat every day. Order of arrival: Kate and Gerry, Jane alone, Mathew and Rachel, Russell, and then she thinks David, Fiona and Diane. She makes a sketch of the table and says that both she and Gerry were not facing the apartments. Sketch attached.

Dinner began around 9PM, and she thinks the nine adults were at the table. She ate steak and maybe sardines. Drank white wine and water.

She doesn’t know if anyone took photographs that night, however she thinks that Rachel took photos on one of the nights. Fiona also took some photos but she thinks it was probably another night. She doesn’t know whether Fiona had a camera with her that night. She remembers hearing a comment that night about a camera being forgotten, but she doesn’t know who said this or who the camera belonged to.

Gerry was the first one to check on the children, this was decided on the spot, close to 9-9:05PM. He got up from the table and entered the apartment through the verandah door. He came back to the table after 10 minutes; he implied that the children were asleep. He’d met a tennis friend by the name of Jez, with whom he had a chat. During this check, she thinks that Gerry did not check on the children of any other couple, because it was usual just to check on their own children. She never checked on any other child, other than her two.

At 9:30PM she got up to go and check on her children at the same time as Mathew, who said he was going to check on his daughter Grace in apartment 5B and could check on her children. She hesitated, however he said not to worry he was going anyway.

After less than 10 minutes Mathew returned to the Tapas, saying all was quiet. At that moment she did not ask him if he went inside the apartment, however she assumed he had checked on her children, entering by the verandah door which was closed but not locked.

Aside from Matt, she does not remember if anyone else got up from the table.

At 10PM she got up from the table, as it was her turn after having been replaced by Matt. She entered the apartment by the verandah door which was closed, but as already said, not locked.

At this moment, and because it was so late, 11 PM, the interview was interrupted and will be continued tomorrow morning.

She says nothing further. Reads the statement, finds it OK and signs it together with the Interpreter and Attorney.




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THE TIMES

August 5, 2007
Madeleine, I’m sorry I left you alone
As it approaches 100 days since her daughter’s abduction, Kate McCann tells Steven Swinford in her first solo interview of her sense of guilt and the pain when her infant twins ask: where’s Madeleine?

The mother of Madeleine McCann has apologised to her absent daughter, saying she is “desperately sorry” for leaving her alone on the night she was abducted.

She also revealed some of the little girl’s last words to her — and that her toddler brother and sister still talk of Madeleine.

Kate McCann, 38, was speaking last week nearly 100 days after the four-year-old was taken from the family’s holiday apartment on the Algarve.

It was the first time she had given an interview without her husband Gerry. The tension showed on her face as she described the regret still plaguing her.
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“I feel desperately sorry that we weren’t there for her,” said Kate. “Every hour now I still question, ‘Why did I think that was safe?’”

She recalled how happy Madeleine had been during the holiday, particularly at the children’s club where she played.

“Madeleine had a ball. They did swimming, went on a little boat, went to a beach, did lots of colouring in and face painting,” said Kate.

“On the evening before she went missing, before she went to bed, she said, ‘Mummy, I’ve had the best day ever. I’m having lots of fun.’

“They had a little dance prepared for Friday.”

Her voice dropped to a whisper as she added: “I don’t know what it was. I never got to see it.”

On that evening, Thursday, May 3, Kate and Gerry left their three children in the apartment while they went for dinner at a nearby tapas bar in the beach-side complex at the resort of Praia de Luz.

They were 20 yards from the villa and checked on the children every half hour, she said.

But when she returned at about 9pm she found Madeleine had gone. She immediately realised she had been abducted.

“I never thought for one second that she’d walked out. I knew someone had been in the apartment because of the way it had been left. There wasn’t a shadow of a doubt in my mind she’d been taken.

“There was about 20 seconds of disbelief when I thought, ‘That can’t be right.’ I was checking for her. Then there was panic and fear. I was screaming her name. I ran to the group. Everyone was the same; it was just total fear.”

Ever since then she has had to confront the guilt of knowing that, if she had not left her children on their own, Madeleine would not have vanished.

“I’ve gone through all my life and said I never want to have any regrets, but you can’t not regret something like that,” she said. “But it did feel safe and it did feel right. Maybe it was because it was family-friendly. That week we had left them alone while we had dinner.

“I can’t describe how much I love Madeleine. If I’d had to think for one second, ‘Should we have dinner and leave them?’ I wouldn’t have done it.”

She has found that other mothers understand her mistake.

“I’ve had so many letters from mothers, really kind words. People have said, ‘Kate, we’ve done this a hundred times over ourselves. Why would you for one minute think this would happen?’”

The letters have helped her to keep perspective.

“It is important not to lose sight of the fact we haven’t committed a crime. Somebody has. Somebody’s been there; somebody’s been watching. You don’t expect a predator to break in and take your daughter out of bed.” Kate, who has stayed in Portugal since the abduction, was speaking in the town of Lagos, a 10-minute drive from the scene of the crime.

As she spoke, she clutched her daughter’s pink toy cat. Around her neck was a silver locket containing a picture of the four-year-old and engraved with the words “Tower of Strength”.

The loss of Madeleine is all the more painful for her because she was a desperately wanted child conceived using IVF.

“When we were trying for a baby and it wasn’t happening, it was really hard. When I got pregnant with Madeleine it was just fantastic,” Kate said.

“It was a really uncomplicated pregnancy. I had no sickness, nothing. It was so easy. I swam every day until the day she was born, to keep us both healthy.

“I didn’t know I was having a girl until she was born. There she was, perfect. She was lovely, she had the most beautiful face. It made it even more special that she was a girl. It took us by surprise.”

By comparison with the easy pregnancy, the first six months of Madeleine’s life were difficult; yet her mother became noticeably more relaxed as she immersed herself in those early memories.

“She had very bad colic and cried about 18 hours a day. She had to be picked up all the time, so I spent many a day dancing round the living room holding Madeleine. I remember trying to butter my toast with one hand and holding her in the other.”

Madeleine’s independent streak emerged at an early stage. “She’s always had bags of personality, even as a baby she was quite determined and independent,” said Kate.

When Madeleine was two Kate gave birth to twins, Sean and Amelie. The memory of the siblings’ first meeting brought Kate close to tears.

“When the time came to bring Madeleine in, it was in the evening,” she said. “She came in and . . . just her little face. She sat with the twins for the first time and it was lovely.”

For both Gerry and Kate, their campaign to raise awareness of Madeleine’s disappearance is a source of hope. But she finds the pressure of life in the public eye hard. While Gerry has answered questions with the skill of a seasoned public speaker, Kate has struggled.

“I hate publicity, interviews, anything like that. I just hate it,” she said. “I just go through the motions. Any parent would do anything they could for their child. We’re just doing the best thing for Madeleine.

“Some people say the publicity will be harmful, that she’ll be hidden away because of it. But what can you do, just sit and do nothing?”

She revealed: “I still have moments of panic and fear. I do go back to those dark moments. It would be abnormal never to touch on them. But it’s not about me, it’s not about Gerry, it’s about Madeleine.”

The twins provide a measure of normality. They are happy in each other’s company; but they show they are aware of Madeleine’s absence. Such moments are crippling for Kate.

“When we went back to the UK for a family baptism there was an empty seat on the plane and Sean said, ‘That’s Madeleine’s seat.’ That caught me, she said.

“It was a very emotional day. Amelie asked me afterwards, ‘Where’s Madeleine? I miss my sister?’ It catches me.”

How are she and Gerry coping? “I think we’re stronger than ever,” said Kate. “We don’t row; we have communication.”

Kate, a locum GP, and Gerry, a consultant cardiologist, have no plans to return to work or the family home in Rothley, Leicestershire, without Madeleine.

“We have so many happy memories of that house. Madeleine’s room is a shocking pink. She chose the colour. At the moment we’re staying and we feel happier staying. We are closer to the investigation.

“Some of that might be mad; I don’t know. We don’t know where Madeleine is; we don’t think she’s in the UK.”

The police investigation is showing little sign of progress. Last week a child therapist in the Belgian town of Tongeren claimed she had seen Madeleine with a couple in a restaurant. While police said the witness was “credible”, there have been dozens of similar — and fruitless — sightings.

The couple plan to use the 100-day anniversary of Madeleine’s disappearance next Saturday to raise awareness of the plight of abducted children across the world. But Kate hopes the anniversary will not need marking.

“I’m still hoping we’re not going to get there,” she said.

“Every day I’m hoping we won’t get to the next day without her. It’s a long time, but we have to keep going for Madeleine.”

The McCanns may one day have another child, she said, but not while Madeleine is missing.

“It takes time and I’m not getting any younger,” Kate said. But “Madeleine is irreplaceable. I want her back. We just have to wait and see what life has in store for us”.

What would she say to Madeleine if she could get a message to her now? “ “I’d tell her we love her. She knows we’re looking for her, that we’re doing absolutely everything and we’ll never give up.”


------------------

original PJ statement 4 May 2007


KATE MARIE HEALY STATEMENT


Kate's interview took place on the day after Madeleine's disappearance, 04/05/07 at 2.20pm.

On the subject of the proceedings:

The interviewee was heard as a victim, being the mother of the minor. Of British nationality, she has no command of the Portuguese language, spoken or written. Thus, the interview was done in the presence of an interpreter: Natalia C.F. de A. The interviewee says she has been married to Gerald since December 1998. She has never been to Portugal before. The trip came at the suggestion of friends, who convinced them, at the end of last year, to spend their holiday in Portugal. The trip was organised by David Payne, who made the Praia da Luz Ocean Club reservation on the Internet for the interviewee and her husband, as well as for the rest of the group, a total of 9 adults and eight children, including her daughter Madeleine. She has known some members of the group since the year 2000 and others for a year. She was a colleague of David's wife.

Comment: First thing I notice here is that Kate's statement is at a different time to the previous ones detailed by Enfants Kidnappés. Both Jane Tanner's and Matthew Oldfield's took place at the same time in the morning of May 4th 2007, but Kate's was in the afternoon, giving ample time to confer with those who had already been interviewed?

They travelled in two separate groups. One of the groups was composed of the interviewee, her husband Gerald, their three children, David and his wife, the mother-in-law and their two children. One of the groups left from Leicestershire and the other from London.

The meeting point was the Ocean Club where the interviewee's group arrived on Saturday April 28th at around 3pm from Faro airport in an airport mini bus. The other group arrived on the same day, late morning.

After checking in, the interviewee and her family were placed in apartment G5A. The nuclear family comprises the interviewee, her husband, her daughter Madeleine and twins, Sean and Amelie, aged 2 years.
The apartment has two beds in one bedroom, and two in another where there are also two cots on loan from the Ocean Club.

The interviewee and her husband sleep in one bedroom and the three children in the other. The twins sleep in cots, Madeleine in a normal bed, the other bed staying empty.

Between the day of the arrival, April 28th, and the time that Madeleine's disappearance was discovered, the interviewee says that she noticed nothing unusual. She reports only one episode where, on the morning of Thursday May 3rd, Madeleine asked the interviewee why she had not come to look in the bedroom (apartment?) when the twins were crying. The interviewee states that she had heard nothing and had therefore not gone into the bedroom (apartment?). She ignored her daughter's words because it was the first time she had talked about it.

The routines

The day after their arrival, they went for breakfast at around 7.30/8.30 at the Ocean Club, in a bar situated some distance from the apartment. On the following days, because the bar was quite far away, they started buying supplies from the "BAPTISTE" supermarket, located on the same road as the apartment and they had their first meal of the day in the apartment.

After breakfast, at around 9/9.30am, the children went to the club called the "KIDS CLUB" where they did various activities such as painting, collage etc. They stayed there until around 12.30pm, constantly supervised by several Ocean Club employees in a ratio of three children to one employee. Within the "Kids Club" because of the difference in ages, the twins were in one group and Madeleine in another, with separate activities.

At 12.30pm, they (Editor's note: the McCann parents) collect their children and have lunch in their apartment since they have provisions. After lunch, at around 1.30pm, the children spend time close to the club's swimming pool, supervised by the parents, for about 45 minutes, where they play and have sun cream applied. After this time, they take the children to the "Kids Club" until around 5/5.30pm, the time when the children eat in a bar under the watchful gaze of the parents. After the 5pm dinner, they give the children a bath, prepare them for the night and let them play for a while in a playground next to the tennis courts, still and always under parental supervision. At around 8pm, the children are put to bed until the following morning when the described routines start all over again. While the children are at the "Kids Club," the interviewee played tennis with her husband, went for walks, read or went "Jogging."


KATE'S DECLARATION



Thursday May 3rd 2007
Yesterday, after the daily routine, Madeleine and the twins went to bed at around 7.30. They were in their respective beds. The interviewee and her husband stayed in their apartment to relax until 8.30pm. She took a bath, did her make-up and drank a glass of New Zealand wine with her husband. Just after 8.30pm, the interviewee and her husband, after checking on their children, joined the other adults of the group at the "TAPAS" restaurant, about 50 metres away, where they had dinner. As usual, every half hour, and given that the building is very close, the interviewee and her husband went to make sure the children were OK. Thus, at around 9pm, her husband went to the apartment to make sure the twins, as well as Madeleine, were OK, then he went back to the restaurant. Her husband said that the children were doing well and that he had bumped into the person with whom he had played tennis, a person who has two children. At the same time, one of the group of friends, Russell, went to see his children, without checking on the interviewee's children.

Around 9.30pm was the time the interviewee should have gone to see her children, but her friend Matt (a member of the group) had just done a check in his apartment then gone to the interviewee's. He had gone into the apartment through a glass door at the side and once inside had not gone into the children's bedroom. He only looked through the door, and did not hear any noise. He went back to the restaurant and said that everything was fine.

At around 10pm, the interviewee went to check on the children. She went into the apartment by the side door, which was closed. She noticed that the door to her children's bedroom was completely open, the window was also open, the shutters raised and the curtains open, while she was certain of having closed them all as she always did.

Faced with this situations, she verified that the twins were indeed in their respective beds, unlike Madeleine, who had disappeared. The cover was pulled back and the toys were on the pillow as usual. After searching the whole apartment thoroughly, the interviewee went back, scared and shocked, to the restaurant, to alert her husband to the disappearance. The whole group then set about searching for Madeleine throughout the complex, looked in all the buildings, swimming pool, tennis courts etc....as well as in the apartment with the help of employees, who, at the same time, contacted the authorities.

Later, a member of the group, Russell's partner Jane, saw, when she went to her apartment at around 9.15pm, about 50 metres away, on the perimeter road of the club, a long-haired person with a child in his arms, walking very quickly. But she is better able to tell you about that herself.

Comment: are a couple of words missing from this last paragraph? Should it read, "Later, Jane.....said she saw..."? Or is there another way I can translate, "Plus tard," in that context?

Concerning Madeleine, she is Caucasian, white, aged four years (12/05/2003) about 90cm tall. Very slim, dark blond hair; shoulder-length. Left eye blue-green same as the right, which has a brown spot. She has a small brown spot on the skin of her left leg as well as sunburn on her right forearm. She has no scars. At the time of her disappearance, she was wearing pyjamas with white bottoms with a floral pattern. The short-sleeved top, mainly pink with a blue-grey pattern bearing the inscription, "EEYORE," an inscription which is also on one of the trouser legs. The pyjamas are "Marks and Spencer" brand.

Concerning the child's personality, she is extrovert, very active, talkative, smart and relates to other children with great ease. But she would never go with a stranger. She has no suspicions to talk about, finds no reason for this act, neither she nor her husband has enemies. She states that her daughter has no illnesses and is not on any medication.

Following a request from the inspector, she authorises a reading of the calls on her mobile phone. Apart from the Kids Club and the apartment, they only went once to the beach with Madeleine and the other children and only for a very short period of time, since the weather was changeable. They could only go to the beach between 1.30 and 3pm, the time when they went back to the club. At the beach, they only ate an ice cream then they went back to the apartment. Apart from that Madeleine went to the beach with the Kids Cub for an hour. The supervision and planning were the responsibility of the club. The interviewee and her husband were not present. She never noticed any strange behaviour during these recent days which could explain the disappearance. After having been shown the list of the Ocean Club's guests, she says she only knows the names of those of the group. Other than the child, nothing else has disappeared, neither clothes nor the child's jewellery. (? parures?) The interviewee did not have an intercom, unlike David and Fiona Payne who were able to hear crying or any kind of noise. She has nothing else to add. After having read the deed, she confirms it, ratifies it and signs it with the interpreter.

Enfants Kidnappés 26/08/08

76 comments:

hope4truth said...

Morning Viv

Not very clever the McCanns are they...

Problem with a lie it grows and grows changes and you always get caught out...

I still cant belive it was a plan to get rid of her and belive it was either an accident an overdose or someone lost their temper (hence the blood) if they had really wanted to get rid of her I dont belive there would have been any blood suffocation where the evidence could be contained if it was planned...

The shutters were obviously not forced (not even sure the window was open) but what I have always found strange (unless for obvious reasons they were setting up their story) is why phone home so quickly?

I am very close to my parents and have a close knit family and many good friends but in their situation I would be searching for her well into the early hours of the morning. Calling my Mum when there was still a chance my child had wandered out of an unlocked apartment and please god I found her???

Why put people through hell in England when there is nothing they can do?

My Mother would be much more use to me awake after a nights sleep and comming out to help me the next day..

Backfired on them though when the bar man was called and when he offered his support they told him they were fine (puts paid to all their lies about no one helping them if they had been genuine he would have been the ideal person to help them)..

As you said they never thought all the conflicting interviews would come back to haunt them but I believe they are so arrogant they really believed they could tell the PJ what to do and we all know that they send their scummy bully's out to intimidate us into silence...

Sadly there will come a day when they are found out most people are not as obsesed as we are but the fact a Mother refused to answer a single question for her daughter is unforgivable if she was in the hands of a peadophile ring how evil could a mother be not to help?

They will leave a legacy of distrust and god help any child who is really missing people just may not bother to look for them because of scum parents like the McCanns and Karen Mathews...

bath theory said...

A legacy of distrust is exactly it Hope. This case led directly to Shannon Matthews suffering as the mother obviously started to salivate at the prospect of the money that could be involved and to untold amounts of abuse and negligence from other couples who have seen the McCanns glorified by the media when they had left children alone. One reason we all want them properly tried and investigated in a court is to send a message out to all those thousands of children who are being neglected.

viv said...

Hiya both, this case clearly had unprecented media coverage in the States and I believe Casey Anthony may well, also have been influenced by Kate and Gerry McCann. She told police she did not report because she had started her own "investigation" into her daughter's disappearance. She clearly believed that if she just kept telling enough lies to the police she would get away with it, just like Kate and Gerry McCann. Just like Kate and Gerry McCann her car had the terrible odour of a decomposing corpse. Michael Wright in a statement claims he noticed a foul odour in the McCanns hire car but put it down to the twins nappies. In both cases sniffer dogs have confirmed that foul odour was the decomposing little girl.

There clearly are parents who want to do away with very young children, they see them as a nuisance an impediment to their own life. So long as Kate and Gerry are seen to be getting away with this, I believe we will get more cases like Karen Matthews and Casey Anthony where they seek to copy them. The world needs to hear the truth about what happened to little Maddie and it is a really good start that we can read all these statements. Here the mother Kate McCann refusing to answer any police questions.

Caylee's grandparents lawyers has asked for immunity from prosecution before they speak out, and the police have deferred interviewing them again until after Caylee's funeral. They may have misled the police whilst trying to stick up for their daughter in the first instance but it is clear they loved Caylee and had she still been in their care she would still be alive. I hope they are granted immunity now to speak out because I do not think anything will be achieved by prosecuting them.

Viv xxx

viv said...

Hope, it is obviously true that Gerry was standing there making these sensational calls to his relatives. There is a witness who heard him and what is more Gerry never even attempted to stop when he became aware of the presence of the witness.

I am just trying to imagine how I would feel if my middle son rang me and told me that one of my granddaughters had been abducted by a gang of paeodophiles and I believe it would make me extremely ill. That is the really wicked thing about Gerry McCann and his scheming lies, he never even considered how his own mother would feel at hearing such terrifying news. I am afraid I do find his behaviour cold, calculating, remorseless and absolutely immediate. In fairness to Kate some witnesses do claim at times she was very distressed, but no one, absolutely no one describes Gerry behaving in this way. He is a psychopath, I will say it again and I know he will not sue me, because it is true!

Viv xx

ratonthebeam said...

Good morning everyone, and I hope you are all having a pleasant 2009 so far!

Reading the latest article on the blog, I would advise everyone who has Sky TV to watch out for a program that sometimes comes on some of the documentary channels. It is called "Couples Who Kill" and it examines true crime stories, where the crime has been committed by a duo. There are married couples, hetero couples and same-sex couples featured. It really studies the dynamics of the relationships between the couples, and how these relationships contribute to the criminal behaviour. It is really quite unique and a real eye-opener. Some of the perps seem actually quite innocuous when viewed as individuals - but when paired up as a lethal combination, the reality is quite different.

In some cases, one party is dominant and leads on the other. But in some, the two parties are equally depraved. Each episode is different. It really is a fascinating and informative study into human behaviour.

Google "Dr Jeffrey MacDonald" - a US Army surgeon who murdered his wife and kids in cold blood, while in a red rage. He blamed the crime on "a gang of hippies", actively courting the press and media to press his "intruders" theory home. When the police failed to find the "intruders", he turned on them big-time, calling them stupid and incompetent and threatening to sue. Oh yes, and the handsome Dr also had a great big mortgage and lived on a very stringent budget. (Any of this sound familiar, at all?)

In the meantime, somebody wrote a book and Dr MacDonald threatened to sue them. They offered an out-of-court for $20,000, which the Dr refused; he held out for more, and got it.

Anyway, the PD saw right through his front and he got sent down for life. And guess what caught him? That's right, DNA and hair!

Spookily, there is still a little group of sycopants who refute all the evidence and are still, to this day, protesting his innocence.

The book, incidentally, was called "Fatal Vision" and was written by one J McGinniss.

nancy said...

Kate doesn't remember many things!

What clothes she wore that night - they should be etched on her memory being as she sat around in them all night.

Whether she changed the layout of the apartment, i.e. moved furniture. Who would forget that?

Who checked on the children before leaving for the tapas bar that fateful night.

The fact that they hired lawyers before even being made arguidos makes them look as guilty as hell. Any innocent parents would not even have thought about that!

They are all liars and should have been made to take a lie detector test straight away, especially Kate who refused to answer any questions in case she contradicted what the rest said!

In my opinion, Gerry is the mastermind behind the whole thing and he organised everyone into a little army and they are still saluting him!

JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE IN 2009!

viv said...

Fascinating RAT, I will certainly have a look at that.

Do you believe Gerry leads or do you think they are equally depraved? I think you know what I think, she is not quite so bad!

Gerry does react with the same fury and threats to sue, that is for sure. It is about a big ego, I think, and heaven help anyone who challenges that!

I really wish the forensic evidence was better in this case, but still he is just too far gone for any decent psychologist to not be able to see right through him and I still believe the police will be quite determined to net this couple. They have made mistakes, big mistakes!

xx

viv said...

Hiya Nancy I just saw your post after I had posted.

I think their demeanour at that first interview said it all really. Her head bowed and stood in a very submissive pose with him, reading the script and showing not a trace of emotion.

I believe Gerry thinks he is so smart he believed he could answer the police questions because he thinks he can deal with it, but had no confidence in Kate and forced her to keep quiet.."just let me do all the talking". I think she knew what was going to happen on that holiday as Payne points out and just did not want to go - but she did. Every woman has a duty towards their child, if you fail in that duty you are just as bad as the man. She had a lot better chance of standing up to Gerry than little Maddie, who clearly had absolutely no chance.

In more recent times Kate has shown herself more to be trusted, so far as Gerry is concerned and has been allowed to speak. He even accepting she can actually do better than him. She took the lead at Brussels, something he was planning from at least June 2007 as we know, but I suspect, long before that.

What has he done to her and to all of them to keep them so subdued. One thing is for sure they were her friend, not his, and have moved away from him. I note Payne had recently moved to a different hospital in Derby just a week before his rogatory interview. I really do believe they only seek to protect Kate, but know that they cannot put him inside without her going too. I particularly sensed that when reading Fiona Payne.

Viv xx

bath theory said...

1)...they see them as a nuisance an impediment to their own life...

Interesting words. Today I was shopping with my two boys. A lady was balancing a heavy TV in its box where people line up to pay. It was in John Lewis. I held my sons hands and we joined the queque. Because her box was wide it hit my son on the head. She turned and said 'leave my box alone.'

I nearly collapsed. She was standing in a place she should not of, with a protruding box and her first thought was not 'Is he alright' but dont touch her cardboard box.

So her 'instinct' went to protect a piece of cardboard rather than ask how the 5 yr old child was. Small point but it shows you that there are apparently 'perfectly decent middle class people' who instantly see children as a 'nuisance' and an 'impediment' to their own lives.

2) Kate McCann left her two youngest in the apartment before going back and informing people had abducted her eldest. Any mother of a modicum of intelligence would have chained the two youngest to her if they seriously thought someone had just taken a child from her apartment. Obvious lie right from the off.

3) The couple are doctors and know full well about DNA and the importance of fibres etc. So cuddle cat was placed up high and yet death was smelt on it and then it was washed mmmmmmm Not to mention securing a crime scene. Gerry can read police books but somehow he and Kate were unable to secure the scene themselves. If one seriously believed an abduction had taken place then two doctors would not have acted that way.

4) I believe the Mc's went on that holiday to somehow renew their relationship and thus they basically dumped the kids and neglected them in order to patch up any cracks. These cracks probably widened as the week went on and someone instantly reacted which resulted in an 'accident' Now the question is why cover up an accident. They were doctors who knew how to choose words and sound credible. One can only conclude somebody snapped with the child as that would not be deemed an accident would it. And why bloodspats ? Would an accident have caused that?

5) All these issues could be neatly and sensibly asked in a courtroom where 'no comment' would certainly imply what we believe happened. If that is wide of the mark then of course calm rational answers from the couple would enable a version of the truth to be substantiated. Either way Madeleine's voice would be seen to be heard.
JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE IN 2009

bath theory said...

I also believe that the husband is a member of an organisation liek the masons or Knight templars or Order of St John. One of those that insist on coming to a fellow members aid etc. And that organisation chose early on to 'listen' and 'believe' their story. That is the sort of blind loyalty that is being shown in the way the case has been reported etc. So does anyone have info as to exactly what he is a member of?

bath theory said...

I completely agree that it is sinister that he was the one who spoke and then only later allowed her to once he felt she was not going to let the cat out of the bag. I had a long standing friend who gestured to his open and talkative wife during conversations and the topic or words would suddenly change mid stream. Needless to say we rarely see them these days and she has completely changed. Guess what his job his. Managing Director of Finace in a very well known investment bank !!!! i.e Cold, controlled manipulative mindset posing as a serious professional.

nancy said...

Hi Viv -

Thanks for the great new thread! You obviously didn't hit the bottle too hard over the Christmas and New Year festivities!!

The interview when they landed in England after leaving Portugal showed them up for what they really are - 'ungrieving' parents who after saying they would leave no stone unturned, hit the road as soon as they were made suspects.

When they landed, Kate just stood there poe faced and Gerry read from a speech he'd obviously written on the journey back, but read as if he was reading from a script without showing an ounce of emotion or grief. They seemed to me like a couple of robots. I think that was when many of us started to question the validity of their story of what happened to Maddie.

I get the impression from the statements that Gerry is not very popular - the tapas pals seem to have more in common with Kate and Matthew Oldfield, in between his sailing, went running with her every day, but hardly mentioned Gerry in his statement.

There is something about Payne and O'Brien though that make me think they know much more about what went on than the other tapas, apart from Jane that is, but she could have been talked into making up a story of an abduction as a result of pressure.

Hi BT -

I wouldn't be at all surprised if Gerry or any of the others belonged to a masonic lodge. Professional people who like to be part of the local 'you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours' usually do. I'm sure it's on record somewhere. As far as I can tell, their slogan is equivalent to "we will not be moved until hell freezes over";

I don't think that's the only protection they have though - there are more faceless characters out there ready to snuff out any sort of discussion of the McCanns, hence the silence of the newspapers right now.

Why, for instance, have none of the media printed word for word Goncalo Amaral's book yet? They could have made a killing with sales, but are obviously holding back for a very good reason.

Nx

viv said...

Hiya BT

I think the actions of them both were just very obvious staging including Kate's discovery and rushing off to the table, if she did do that? When hatching all of their little plans, and I do think they mainly come from him, it seems to me they are so disordered they just do not have the capacity to envisage how an ordinary member of the public would view their actions. It has taken an awful lot of public reaction before they finally start to get the message.

I wonder exactly what Gerry called Kate for shouting "they" have taken her, I really dread to think! But going onto Nancy's point, I think that was a psychological flaw from Kate, because they had taken her. I do feel that OB was directly involved. He was actually missing all night from the meal a few nights earlier because Evi was genuinely ill. They take actual events and supplant them for reality at a later stage. Just like the quiz night did not happen that night as Gerry wanted us to believe it was earlier in the week, with I think Fiona trying to suggest there may have been two. That was very disingenuous, she remembers they lost but she does not remember whether that was once or twice! Payne is seriously involved in that he tried to suggest he had seen Maddie alive during the evening when plainly he did not. I do not know whether he has further involvement or whether or not he is a sex offender but even if he is, tend to think this is a bit of a red herring although I can certainly understand why the Birmingham doctors and the social worker reported their concerns. He was oddly protective when the social worker approached Kate and Gerry and particularly in his profession may have just realised that a professional woman like that could have offered a lot of comfort to Kate. She would have been very ill, she probably was anyway, but not because Maddie had been abducted, it was even worse than that!

xx

viv said...

Hiya Nancy

I would just say I think the newspapers are silent just now because the McCanns/Pinkster are, it is them that wanted to keep this story running, but I think they finally realised that is not such a good idea. This story is nearly two years old and the newspapers cannot really slate the McCanns if they are to face trial because it could offer them a get out clause. Check out Article 6 European Convention Human Rights -right to a fair trial, enshrined in our own domestic law under the Human Rights Act. The McCanns would complain about all the blogging on the internet about their guilt, effectively pre-judging a trial, but that would not be the same as the newspapers actually doing that and Goncalo's book says in clear terms they are guilty although not to the extent that I actually think they are. Goncalo is legally trained and only states what he can back up with hard evidence, and so he is never going to say they murdered Madeleine because we only have circumstantial evidence of that! He will not give them the option of saying he has libelled them, hence his comments are restrained to the hard facts and his assumptions from that are very modest, e.g. an accident and so forth. He knows that in a civil court the burden of proof is lower and the evidence from the dogs that Madeleine died in that apartment could not be challenged and the McCanns are not stupid enough to try it in a civil court, all we ever get is the stupid posturing from this so called PR heavyweight with legal experience. He does not have any legal experience, it is just that he has reported on the BBC some serious murder cases, he is not doing much different now, other than he gave up honestly reporting! Still a murder case though!

xx

nancy said...

Viv -

Did they ever clear up the thing about the dirty sheet that was supposed to have been changed for O;Brien's little girl I wonder. The staff of MW said nobody had asked for a clean sheet or handed in a dirty one for washing, so the story could have been made up. But then so could the majority of their stories, hence all the pauses and stuttering throughout their statements.

Another strange thing was that the 9th tapa didn't move from her seat when Kate came in shouting 'they've taken her', almost as if she knew something was going on. Otherwise, surely she would have been on her feet and running with the others to help to find Madeleine.

Let's hope we get the answers to these questions sooner rather than later because I fear people are beginning to forget about Madeleine's plight - even Supertroll has stopped blogging about the McCann's 'unfair and unjust treatment'! At least she's stopped slagging you, Docmac and Claudia off, which shows you must have won that argument!

Nx

nancy said...

Good point Viv!

They and their pals and the ubiquitous Clarence Mitchell are hoping it will all go away if they keep quiet for long enough.

I suppose the media are biding their time, but when the right time comes they will go for the kill! Let's hope so.

I thought CM had left their employment, but he seems to have reared his ugly head again. It makes you wonder just what his interest in all this is, if it isn't just the free publicity he gets! Are they still paying him out of the Madeleine Fund I wonder, talking of which did anyone get to see the audited accounts for that?

Nx

Wizard said...

When Kate was made an arguido she refused to answer police questions probably on legal advice. We are now aware of the case against the McCanns and understand is not strong enough to be brought to court. For the solicitor to advise Kate to say nothing surely meant he believed she would incriminate herself if she spoke. Not answering police questions makes her look guilty, therefore, to give this advice is a decision her solicitor would not take lightly because of the ramifications of this course of action. This raises the question - if she was innocent why did her solicitor believe she could or would incriminate herself by answering questions fully and to the best of her ability?

viv said...

Hiya Nancy

I have just been looking at the initial statements that Kate and Gerry gave to the PJ on 4.5. and there are some very interesting differences re the ahem checks.

Kate says that at around 9 pm both Gerry and Russell went to check on their own children. Gerry does not mention Russell doing a check at all. He says that only he did a check at 9.05 pm, he was a long while in the toilet (trying to use up a bit of time) and then met a friend and chatted (Wilkins). Kate does not mention Jane at all, but Gerry says at 9.10-9.15 Jane did a check on her children (that is very weird given Kate says Russell had just gone) and Jane noted a male carrying off a child at a distance of about 50 yards - highly weird because in her rog Jane finishes up agreeing the distance must have been about 3-4 yards.

They both say that at 9.30 Mat went to do a check on his own children and also went through the glass patio door that was always open and checked on Madeleine and the twins, the bedroom door was half open as usual. That is strange because I think it is Jane that says both Mat and Russell manfully offering to do Kate's check for her get up to do a check at 9.30 and Mat comes back and tells her that Evi is being sick so she goes off to relieve Russell.

Kate says that at 10 she goes through the open side door bedroom door and window are completely open shutters are raised and curtains open, Gerry gives the identical version EXCEPT he says that Kate used her key to get it. Gerry was grilled by the PJ again on 10/5 and this time insists that both the back and front doors were always kept locked.

There can be no doubt that even at the outset Kate and Gerry's stories just did not add up and they are both lying about Jane and Russell, proof if we needed any of their involvement and just why it was that right from the outset the PJ said the stories about the checks just did not tally! They certainly do not! I know when you look at the statements of the others there are yet more anomolies but just doing this has given me a real headache!

In relation to Rosie, Supertroll etc shutting up, that is exactly what Kate and Gerry have now done. Having worked for a dodgy government dept etc (yes the Probation Service)I can smell a plan coming together, a decided course of action, a policy if you will! The current policy is for god's sake they have all of our conflicting lies and they are having a field day, for god's sake just shut the flip up!

xxx

hope4truth said...

Wizard

Well put...

xxx

hope4truth said...

Wizard

Well said...

xxx

Cláudia said...

Hello, all.
Someone who is innocent will never incriminate herself/himself by anything that she/he might say. Only guilty people can incriminate themselves.
A great 2009 to each and every one of you. :-)

viv said...

Wizard hiya

I have flagged up before (and I have had to study criminal justice for both my LLB and BA as well as practice) that the statistics confirm only those who are accused of very serious criminal offences choose to exercise the right to silence and even so those are the ones that get convicted. You are perfectly correct Wiz to say that a lawyer would only advise a suspect to remain silent in the most dire of circumstances because it provides a clear inference of guilt. Indeed in UK law under the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act the court are entitled to assume guilt in those circumstances. It is standard procedure for the police to have a quiet word with the lawyer before the interview takes place and let them know what evidence they have against the client, they may not always disclose al of it but they will generally disclose of it, the lawyer can then take a view as to whether his client should answer questions. If the evidence is seriously damning it actually does the client less harm to refuse to answer, because you cannot explain the inexplicable – clearly Kate could not. I would like to know why they asked her to give an explanation for what they found in her closet!!! I do not know whether that could be blood stained clothes or medication, probably the latter but it must be bad!

hope4truth said...

Wizard

Well done

xxx

LOL sorry the systm crashed did not print my first post so I tried again just thought 3 times would make me look more daft...

Viv

It is to late for them to shut up now their vile comments, put downs, Bullying weirdness and Avatars that really dont belong on a page full of hearts and rainbows dedicated to a 3 year old child have been recorded...

If the truth ever comes out and these people are found to be related friends or paid for it will only do the McCanns more harm...

Gerry's Blogs have been removed as they were not about Madeleine and sounded almost happy at times but again they have been downloaded and kept...

Lets see if they sue GA even if they win Rat's post earlier shows it makes no odds as it does not stop the truth from comming out and going to jail...

viv said...

Claudia


Hello darling and very succinctly put! Innocent people who are accused of such things as "did you want to give up custody of your daughter?", "were you involved in the disappearance of your daughter" react with anger and supply 50 words for one!

BTW read you on 3 As this afternoon when we had a visit from Gezza and as ever you made me really chuckle, given the scale on there I could almost imagine I was back on the DE with you - the Poacher ha! and who is sans souci!!


xxx

viv said...

Ah Hope it crashed on me too and that post trying to explain the differences in their statements was really complex and giving me a headache anyway! What a bugger eh. I typed it in word next time but then of course it worked!

They have stopped their vile put downs and now they have nothing else to say, yes they are aligned to the McCanns and in fact just like them. Does Kate still slate Goncalo, does Rosie still call him %$^&^% and say he is going to jail, there is another can of worms about to burst with that dodgy Correia chap, now acting for the lovely Leonor, all child killers together eh!

xxx

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

Lots of cans of worms about to crash down it is so strange I have never seen anything so corupt in my life...

If this was about WOMD or Chemical Warfare I could understand the cover up (would not support it but careless talk costs lives)... But a 3 year old neglected childs voice should be heard loud and clear above all others...

xxx

viv said...

Hiya darling that is the thing, this is not about WOMD or some other massive state secret it is about a couple of common child killers. There are no government departments seeking to protect them, they just did a real good job of disposing of every last trace of their little girl. But their time will come, the police clearly have no more doubts about their guilt than we do!!


xxx

JUSTICE FOR LITTLE MADDIE IN 2009

Come on LP!

hope4truth said...

Yes come on LP...

See you tomorrow xxx

bath theory said...

One of the things to watch with people is when they use the words ...I KNOW. So the headline used in that newspaper THE PEOPLE: “KATE: I KNOW OUR MADDIE IS ALIVE -EXCLUSIVE New worldwide appeal shows that a lie is taking place.

If she did KNOW she would calmly get on a plane and go and get her. Words are cheap and this once again dresses up an opinion as a fact. Persuasive language that 8 yr old children learn in our national curriculum !!!!!!!

It is the same when you here people who are religious say I KNOW... Immediately, you realise these are insincere people wanting desperately to convince either themselves or yourself of something.

So my humble opinion says they have gone on so long with this charade and any PR person worth their salt knows that there is only so long you can brainwash the mass of the public. Maybe they know it but they just keep saying the same old thing hoping to keep convincing the influential. It is a trick politicians and manipulative people use. Keep saying the same old thing and hope it all goes away !!!

Well I believed the easily brainwashed of this country were forced to start THINKING by their continued antics and wouldn't it be nice to think that their could be JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE in 2009.

Maybe we could employ Metado 3 who could then put out a campaign to say that they promise the parents will be in a courtroom facing serious questions asked by intelligent barristers who care very deeply about missing children and it will happen ....before christmas.

Wizard said...

I was just reading about a tried and tested blame plan by guilty parties and their instant response to accusations – Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender.

Well ain’t that the truth!

hope4truth said...

BT and wizzard

If a child is missing of corse you would pray and hope they were still alive but a part of you would prepare for the worse it is self prservation as any other news is good but you are expecting the worse... For Kate to say she knows she is alive has two purposes keep the fund growing and absolve herself of whatever evil happend to Madeleine. It is like Gerry saying They have no reason to belive she has been harmed and following it up with She is in the hands of a peadophile ring???

As for Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender.... We have had that since day one and then from their evil friend who are defending child neglectors and trashing Madeleine's Human Rights by not allowing anyone to speak up for her (whilst doing nothing to actually find her)how do people who say they are god fearing set up websites to intimidate and play mind games with people sleep at night let alone walk into a church and pray to god?

Oh well I can sleep at night but anyone who has the slightest doubt, actual evidence or know for a fact she is dead and still defend them will rot in hell unless they come clean...

Zodiac said...

Hi all,

Happy 2009!

Having had a quick read through the above thread all I can say is, what a pair of morons in charge of small children. They can't remember if doors were locked or unlocked, what they wore, what they ate!


'She saw the others of the group, children and grownups; she was disappointed as nobody had told her they were going to the beach and Madeleine would have loved to have gone with them.'

WHAT IS SHE SAYING HERE? IS SHE ANNOYED THAT THE REST OF THE GROUP DID NOT TAKE HER DAUGHTER? WHY DID SHE NOT JUST GO AND GET HER CHILDREN AND JOIN THEM?

'During the meal Kate asked Madeleine if she was sad because the other children in the group had gone to the beach without her: she replied that she wasn’t, but was rather tired. She asked Kate to carry her back to the apartment. Kate agreed, and Gerry led the twins back to the apartment. Tiredness was due to the intense daily activities, not to any sickness.'

SEEMS LIKE THE MOTHER WAS MORE ANNOYED THAN THE CHILD. DID THE CHILD EVEN KNOW? LAST SENTENCE MY RESPONSE Hmmm!

'They entered the apartment by the main door, with the key. She does not know if it was locked, and presumes it was Gerry who opened it. At lunch time they also entered by the same door.'

WTF!!!

'While the children were eating and looking at some books, Kate had a shower which lasted around 5 minutes. After showering, at around 6:30/6:40PM and while she was getting dry, she heard somebody knocking at the verandah door. She wrapped herself in a towel and went to see who it was. This door was closed but not locked as Gerry had left by this door.'

SO SHE LEFT THREE LITTLE CHILDREN WHILE SHE HAD A SHOWER AND DID NOT EVEN CHECK IF THE DOORS/WINDOWS WERE LOCKED!!! HE WENT OUT AND DID NOT LOCK THE DOOR BEHIND HIM!!!


Viv,

'I would like to know why they asked her to give an explanation for what they found in her closet!!! I do not know whether that could be blood stained clothes or medication, probably the latter but it must be bad!'

SHE STATES BELOW SHE TOOK SOME PRECAUTIONS (excuse me while I PMSL)IN THAT APT I THINK THE CLOSET IS A WARDROBE.


'Before they left she took some precautions: put the medicine inside a bag with a clasp in her room inside the wardrobe or the dresser. These were Calpol (paracetamol) and Nurofen (Ibuprofen), for fevers and pains, both for adults and children (liquid form for children). In this bag there was also a small pair of scissors.'

'In the kitchen were cutting elements used to prepare the meals and which were not put out of sight.'

MORONS! IT IS CLAIMED SHE WAS A WONDER STUDENT WHO DID NOT NEED TO STUDY VERY MUCH. WELL WHY WAS SHE STUDYING MEDICINE AT DUNDEE UNI IF SHE WAS SO BRAINY?

viv said...

BT, sadly what Kate "knows" she is not prepared to disclose, she just wants to carry on telling lies about what happened to her own little girl. She knows that she left a little girl to wake up and cry every night with the door open, she admits that, the twins too! A little girl that she knew was in the habit of waking up, but still she left her even after she complained. Kate would be far better off explaining who compelled her to behave in such a callous way and why she think she can just continue to try and blame some phantom child snatchers, Gerry's gang of Portuguese Paedophiles. This really upsets me, he was getting the racist attacks in that very night, to cover his own foul deeds!



P.J.TRANSLATIONS INDEX

TRANSLATIONS BY ANNA

VOLUME I

Madeleine's disappearance, May 8th 2007 - the PJ have doubts.

Enfants Kidnappés:


Several days of interviews.

It is May 8th 2007, being the fifth day after Madeleine McCann's disappearance. At this stage, the PJ have taken statements from dozens of people. Hundreds of pages in the reports. Everybody has been interviewed. Employees of the Ocean Club, nannies, or child-care workers from the Kids Club, cooks and assistant cooks at the "Tapas" and the "Millenium", cleaners, gardeners, maintenance workers, managers for the club's various services, directors and managers of the complex, tourists, owners of apartments, neighbours, people who were at the "tapas" on May 3rd 2007, tennis coaches...in short, no one was left out. Everybody was interviewed. We are sparing you all these interviews, which for the most part bring nothing to the investigation or at least no new leads. They are mainly interviews which, in general, bring out the following common points.

1) No one noticed anything unusual about Madeleine.
2) No one noticed any strange individual at the complex.
3) No one noticed anything suspicious which could be linked to Madeleine's disappearance.
4) No one noticed any suspicious vehicles or any suspicious unidentified people.

It is to be noted that even the GRN police officers, first on the spot, were interviewed by their PJ colleagues, in spite of reports of the operation being sent.

With regards to the PJ's interviews over the past few days, a change is noted in how the case is being perceived. Thus the questions which the PJ are putting to various witnesses are implying that the PJ have doubts about the statements from the parents or friends in the group. We note, however, that the slightest info, concerning the slightest suspicion was professionally checked, immediately. Numerous pages of the case file attest to this. Up to now, May 8th 2007, every lead, or opening of a lead, has been checked and it was, each time, a false lead. Like, for example, a suspicious car noticed near the Ocean Club reception by various witnesses. In the end, it was the service vehicle of a Club employee who had come to make an urgent repair to a door lock.

Why these doubts for the PJ?

On reading various witness statements, given the number of leads checked, it seems difficult for someone to have been able to get into the complex, gain access to the McCanns' apartment, take Madeleine, get out of the apartment, leave the Ocean club, take flight via whatever means of transport and that no one, absolutely no one, saw anything. No strangers, no suspicious or unusual vehicles, not even a shadow of a person carrying a child at the times and places where there were other people...From the police point of view, if these witness statements do not totally exclude the possibility of an abduction, they make the theory less credible. As a result, the answer must lie elsewhere. Notably with the group of friends (parents included). The only person to have seen a suspect with a child is Jane Tanner, a member of the group of friends.

Note, for the record, that all the child-care workers, having contact with Madeleine, state that Madeleine introduced herself to them by her shortened name "Maddie". This adds nothing important to the case file except that it contradicts Kate's statements. On the other hand, it is noted that the Kids Club operates three free services, one of which is in the evening until 11.30pm so that parents can eat at the restaurant in peace. Finally, we know that the the Club has a, "missing alert" procedure, that it is a structured and thoughtful procedure, and that this procedure was set in motion as soon as Maddie's disappearance was announced, employees having been called from their homes to participate in the search.

Interview of an employee from the swimming pool bar.

In her interview, this employee states that access is restricted to clients and that this is controlled via the client's card at the entrance. She adds that she has not come across any unauthorised person on the site. She explains that on the day of Madeleine's disappearance, at around 8.30pm, her friend was called following a problem with a lock in an apartment situated close to the "Millenium" restaurant. She went there with her friend. At around 9pm, they went back towards the Club's reception. They passed near the "Tapas" and by the McCann family's apartment. They state that they saw nothing suspicious. They saw no one and no vehicles. Her friend left the premises at around 9.10pm with his service vehicle and she left at 9.15pm in her own car.

The case file contains numerous witness statements like that, so that together, these witness statements contradict the statements from the "tapas9" group. A reconstruction would have made this clear immediately and would have highlighted the contradictions of the informants.

So they will have finished scouring the files by Christmas with their non existent ex police officers and ready to call on a couple of useless agencies again. They are not searching for Maddie now and they never were, Kate sat on her bed!

As the Portuguese police report also below confirms, just a few days later they had reached the conclusion, having interviewed absolutely everyone, the only people who knew anything at all about the disappearance of Maddie were the TAPAS 9, so when is one of them going to start speaking the truth!


Tom Pegden in the Leicester Mercury 15th December 2008
The Parents of Madeleine McCann have scaled down the Portuguese search for their daughter to concentrate on sifting through the official police files into the disappearance.

The couple are continuing to work with a small investigative team - including members with policing experience - to work through the pages of files handed over to them earlier this year.

SEARCH FOR MADELEINE - 588 DAYS

The search of data accumulated by Portuguese Police during their investigation has been under way since August and is expected to last until at least the New Year, their official spokesman, Clarence Mitchell, said.

It had been thought they would have finished scouring the records by Christmas.

Mr. Mitchell said Kate and Gerry - who live with their twin children Sean and Amelie in Rothley - were still in touch with two detective agencies they had worked with in the past.

Metodo 3, in Barcelona, and Oakley International in he USA, are no longer contracted to the family but he said the McCanns were ready to call them in if and when any new leads appeared.

viv said...

Zodiac

Thanks for pointing out what was in Kate's wardrobe. Forgive me saying closet, it was deliberate. Some of the Pros have even suggested I must be an American and I do like to play up to them:-)))

So Kate McCann knows that Maddie gets up and goes toddling into her room and in that room are dangerous medicines and scissors, in the kitchen too, all left for Maddie to mess with in the dark!

What precautions can any parents realistically take to make it safe to leave three little kids under 4, one a known wanderer all alone, with the door open? Stretches my imagination, Kate. Shame on you lady! What of the emotional, not just the physical danger, does not even occur, does it! But so often that is what our courts and social workers look at, parents are causing their children serious emotional harm, like when they get up crying in a strange flat in the dark, all alone!

Poor little Maddiexxxxxxx

viv said...

Zodiac

Is there something wrong with Dundee Uni then?

WHY WAS SHE STUDYING MEDICINE AT DUNDEE UNI IF SHE WAS SO BRAINY?

Have to confess to being ignorant of which are the best places north of the border or indeed med schools!

viv said...

Dundee is rated fifth in Scotland with Edinburgh the best, Glagow where Gerry went seems to be somewhere in between.

Zodiac said...

Viv,

There is nothing wrong with Dundee Uni. Although I do believe if someone is very intelligent and has excellent grades they would not be studying Medicine at Dundee.

viv said...

Hiya Zodiac

Interesting that in 1999 these problems were noted at Dundee, such a pity Kate missed out on these vital learning points..I am sure I read Mr DG Man, slightly older than Kate went to Dundee..

In the past, areas of weakness which have been identified include dealing with
death and bereavement, coping with complaints, and aggressive patients. We
understand that there are plans to include a session about dealing with aggression
in all induction courses.

Zodiac said...

Viv,

Edinburgh is the place to study medicine in Scotland now, I only know that because of my youngest sons friends who were applying for Uni places. When they (K & G) both attended Uni I do not know if Edi was the best Uni then but I am sure Dundee was not the top place to study medicine then or now. Why did she not attend the best Uni in England if she was so brainy, I think the wonder student stories are a load of b*ll*cks like everything else they try to portray. Such as their behaviour was well within the bounds of responsible parenting. Well we only have to read their statements to realise what utter cr*p they spout.

viv said...

Maybe that is why she trained to be an anaesthetist:-)) but she could improve her life by learning to deal with aggressive people, also accepting reality, I think!

Zodiac said...

BBFN

viv said...

Hiya Zodiac

I think you just proved that even I have fell for some of the spin! Hot lips Healy was so brainy she could party all night and still pass her exams with flying colours! Like you say brainy people go to the best places and her choice of one of the lesser Uni's in Scotland would suggest it is where she could get in rather than where she wanted to go!

Zodiac said...

'Maybe that is why she trained to be an anaesthetist'

Did she train to be the above? I am sure I remember Docmac saying otherwise. If you read this Docmac perhaps you could let me know.

BBFN off out for dinner with friends. Have a lovely evening all.

viv said...

Hiya Zodiac

The statements reveal she worked as an anaesthetist with Fiona Payne in Leics, that is how they became such good friends! I am not clear why she dropped that and became a GP because they were both able to do this part time to cope with childcare. Maybe it was just too stressful for her/really need mind on the job! There is an anaesthitist Adomako was was sent down for three years for manslaughter for failing to notice the patient's intubation tube was not connected and he was going blue!

xx

viv said...

Zodiac

Have a lovely meal!

I will have to post Fiona!


xxxxxx

viv said...

Correction Dr Adomako did not get sent down in spite of being convicted for manslaughter he got a suspended sentence, typical! Doctors do seem to be treated with a certain leniency by the legal profession!

hope4truth said...

Hi ALL

As time goes on the fact they left their children alone gets worse I never thought about knives etc in the aprtment and doors unlocked with a road at the bottom of some very steep and hard stairs..


As for Kate asking Madeleine if she minded not going to the beach with the others that is bloody odd and bloody cruel the little girl had been dumped day in day out with the same strangers her Dad did not want to pay to take care of her at night and here is her Mother telling her all the other children had been to the beach...

I dont know why the 7 idiots who went with them feel the need to defend them maybe some of them helped cover up the death of a 3 year old little girl who like their own children had been neglected night after night....

By not admiting to what went on each of them are living on a knife edge waiting for a knock on the door that will take them away from their children and familys for a very long time if they are found guilty and the publics reaction will not be favorable either...

When did this country stop giving a damn about children and start sucking up to proven child neglectors who have acted in an odd and uncaring way with a Mother claiming she is sure her child is still alive then to help her all she could she refused to answer any questions???

God help the children of the UK xxx

nancy said...

Hope -

Kate McCann must have a sadistic streak to let her little girl think the other children went to the beach without asking her along too. A loving Mum would not have wanted her to know that.

But then we all know they left Maddie and the twins alone even after Madeleine had asked why they hadn't come when she was crying. That would have broken my heart to hear that and I would have given her a big hug and promised I would never leave them again. But then I wouldn't have left them in the first place because to me children are a precious gift and life is tough enough for them as it is without denying them the protection they deserve.

And just what was the point of a family holiday if they intended leaving the children in the creche day after day and then going out in the evening without them. They might just as well have left them in Leicester with their grandparents. Madeleine would still be alive if they had.

When my children were little and we took them on holidays, we got more pleasure from seeing them enjoying themselves than anything else.

I think they are a cold calculating pair of child neglecters who should hang their heads in shame, but the problem is they have no shame and neither do their tapas pals who were equally guilty of abandonment.

And added to that, once Maddie had gone missing they had no scruples in leaving the twins in the creche which leads me to believe they knew Maddie wasn't abducted or they would have been worried about the same thing happening to them.

I think the whole thing is a pack of lies from all of them from the moment Madeleine was 'taken' from them, which is how they put it. They were so sorry they weren't there the moment she was 'taken'!

What a weird thing to say. It's a term people use when someone dies, so maybe it was the natural thing for them to say in the circumstances.

Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we set out to deceive!

hope4truth said...

Hi Nancy

I agree it was a very cruel thing to tell her and just as cruel to neglect her again after she suposedly told Kate she had been crying the night before (although I dont belive she did this) to admit that she had been so cold as to go out again after her daughter told her how sad she had been did not make her look good...

But I am sure it was said so once again to make the public think Mrs Fenn's statement had been explained already...

Tangled web indeed but they cant keep spinning people got dizzy and began to realise something is very wrong Kate refusing to answer any questions makes her look as guilty as sin..

nancy said...

HI Hope

Yes, that is the thing that points more to her guilt than anything else. Any mother who was in a frantic state after her daughter had been abducted, if she really believed that, and there was a chance her answers could help find her, would have been falling over herself to answer those questions, whatever the lawyer advised, in my opinion.

Another thing that makes me think they are all lying is the fact that in the statements I have read by O'Brien, Oldfield, and Payne, they all say the same thing - they can't remember when they last saw Madeleine alive. And the long drawn out explanations of how they couldn't remember when they last saw her is a sure sign of them not telling the absolute truth. I think their statements were all worked out together beforehand because they were so similar.

I'm absolutely sure the Leicestershire police knew what they were saying was a load of b......t too!

bath theory said...

Carl Jung stated
...We are shaken by secret shudders and dark forebodings;but we know no way out.......

He also spoke about being between aged between thirty five and forty ie Madeleine's parents age. In his famous essay 'The Stages of Life' he writes ...
'that a significant change in the human psyche is in preparation. At first it is not a conscious and striking change; it is rather a matter of indirect signs of change which seems to take its rise from the unconscious. Often it is something like a slow change in a person's character; in another case certain traits may come to light which have disappeared in childhood; or again , inclinations and interests begin to weaken and others arise to take their place....'

Lastly maybe when Gerry went to Washington DC and we all nearly pukked at the sordid smile whilst in the US he found time to stop at the National Gallery of Art.

There are a series of paintings by Thomas Cole called 'The Voyage of Life' The first one is called 'Childhood' and it depicts an infant seated in a gilded boat. The boat is just emerging from a womblike cavern and floats serenely along the River of Life, bearing the child to his destiny.

In the second canvas 'Youth' the child has grown to early manhood. He stands in the stern of the same gilded boat, one hand firmly on the tiller, the other pointing toward a TajMahal like pleasure dome shimmering in the sky ahead of him, symbol of youthful dreams. The River of Life he navigates on flows across a placid countryside. All the youth must do to reach this vision is continue steering his course straight ahead. What the young pilot does not see from his perspective in the boat is that a mile or so downstream the river makes a hairpin turn away from this utopian castle in the clouds. It then flows through a grove of dense, tangled trees, reminiscent of Dante's 'Dark Wood' and finally emerges out the other side into a roaring rapids.

Here we pick up the third painting in the series, 'Manhood' The figure is now middle aged. He is no longer standing proudly at the helm,but crouches in the bottom of the boat in a posture of prayer. The tiller he gripped so assuredly in the previous picture has snapped off somewhere in the churning waters, and his boat zigzags wildly through a maze of rapids, rocks and whirlpools.

JUSTICE FOR MADELEINE 2009

viv said...

Bt - What a great depiction of the journeys of Gerry McCann. I have tried to imagine just what turmoil and terror a suspect must feel when in the grips of this situation, being literally hunted by the police and knowing your very existence, your liberty is about to taken from you, helpless really to change that. In those terms it kind of exlains the, I know she must still be alive fantasy world of Kate McCann and the fury of Gerry McCann directed currently it would seem toward Martin Grime and his wonderful dogs who showed the world the truth.

If Maddie had a trafic accident perhaps ingesting deadly paracetamol from mums's wardrobe because of their terrible neglect, how much better would it have been to admit that and face the music. But no, they were all neglecting their children and they thought of another way. They started that journey of hell when they made that decision, decided to turn to "religion" but denied their little girl a decent burial with her family. Her "loving" family as "Rosie" would say..Unfortunately her parents demonstrated they obviously love themselves far more than their children, not once have they thought what the twins life will be like, in the future. Only self preservation..

Nite Nite x

Lindy123 said...

Hello and happy new year to you all!

From the Times interview:

She has found that other mothers understand her mistake.

“I’ve had so many letters from mothers, really kind words. People have said, ‘Kate, we’ve done this a hundred times over ourselves. Why would you for one minute think this would happen?’”

The letters have helped her to keep perspective.

Mistake? You are having a laugh.

Mrs McCann I don't believe you.

No amount of soft focus photos or fake tears will ever convince me that you are a "mother". Yes, you bore those children but that was it, job done. Children were needed to add icing to your cake, trophy children to drag around and look pretty as another badge of your success. Children that were only welcome in your world when it suited you and did not impinge on your social life or get in the way 95% of the time. Quiet little malleable ornaments that were shoved out of sight or left with others to take care of them the majority of the time.

Poor Madeleine, wherever she is. Her "mother" more concerned with saving her own skin than affording a three year old girl peace and rest.

nancy said...

Good morning all

I've just been reading the McCann files - I had read this before, but reading it again certainly gave me a wake up call!
----------------------------------

An article by Nigel Moore 3/1/2009

Thanks to Dr. Martin Roberts for quotes.

It may be remembered that Gerry McCann's choice of bedtime reading whilst staying at the Vista Mar villa, was "The investigation of a Murder" by Jed Rubenfield.

A seemingly inappropriate choice of book for a man whose daughter was allegedly in the hands of a predatory paedophile. Although perhaps not so peculiar when one considers some quotes from the book:

"The announcement was pure invention, but it was believed, and therefore within 3 weeks it was so. Mr Banwell had mastered the great truth, that truth itself like buildings, can be manufactured" (p9)

"I cannot be expected to solve a murder if the evidence is trampled on and tampered with before I arrive" (p22)

"In this heat, he explained, decomposition rapidly sets in if the corpse was not refrigerated at once" (p28)

Littlemore studied the bedroom.

"Miss Acton, he said, "how do you think one man got in here last night?"

"Well, he must have - why, I don't know"

It was, Littlemore reflected certainly a puzzle. There was only two doors to the Acton house, the front and the back.... Could the intruder have climbed in through the window?" (p299)

----------------------------------

Was it just an amazing coincidence that Gerry McCann was reading a book that so eerily matches what happened on the 3rd May in PdeL!!

Wizard said...

I wonder, Nancy, if he bought 'The Investigation of a Murder' before May 3rd or later.

bath theory said...

Nancy
Very good to remind us of this. Certainly, the Portugese and Leicestershire police would know about this. From all our perspectives it is just incredulous that these two managed to get out of from Portugal like they did.

Actually it is beginning to look like a completely pathetic attempt from the moment she went missing isnt it. But for the Portugese being railroaded to believe it was an abduction and the political influence from above which may have been misguided kindness initially this case would have been solved if the PJ were allowed to have considered with an equal playing field all possibilities from the start, free of British diplomatic pressure etc.

Especially if the British hierarchy had a modicum of common sense to say hey guys be careful there is the possibility the parents were indeed involved. they usually are in these type of cases.

In terms of Jung he goes on to basically say early interests and ambitions lose their fascination around this age and a search for enduring personal values begins. Importantly though (you'll like this one Viv) we either begin that quest for meaning or we become simply 'AN APPLAUDER OF THE PAST, AN ETERNAL ADOLESCENT - ALL LAMENTABLE SUBSTITUTES FOR THE ILLUMINATION OF THE SELF.' and then he says later
... 'Whoever carries over into the afternoon (of life) the law of the morning must pay for so doing with damage to HIS SOUL...'

I believe that holiday marked a point in the McCann's relationship where at least one of the couple were experiencing a growing sense of dissatisfaction.

JFM 2009

bath theory said...

It would not be that hard to find out when he did buy that book if they accessed his bank and credit card details. It may be a book the police monitor the sales of anyway. More likely a masonic police friend gave him it perhaps?

bath theory said...

For those who need the link to Nancy's comment about what was on the McCann files re The interpretation of Murder book this is it

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id79.html

It shows a picture of the book on Gerry McCann's bedside table mmmmmmmmm

I shall repeat it if you dont mind Nancy as it provides a 'follow the evidence' trail to my mind.

"The announcement was pure invention, but it was believed, and therefore within three weeks it was so. Mr Banwell had mastered the great truth that truth itself, like buildings, can be manufactured." (p.9).

"I cannot be expected to solve a murder if the evidence is trampled and tampered with before I arrive." (p.22).

"In this heat, he explained, decomposition would rapidly set in if the corpse was not refrigerated at once." (p.28).

"Littlemore studied the bedroom. 'Miss Acton', he said, 'how do you think the man got in here last night?'

'Well, he must have – why, I don't know.'

It was, Littlemore reflected, certainly a puzzle. There were only two doors to the Acton house, the front and the back... ....Could the intruder have climbed in through a window?" (p.299).

bath theory said...

And finally I repeat a quote used very early on in my postings. I thank Bob Dylan for it

'...How many times must a man turn his head and pretend that he just doesn't see...'

:)

nancy said...

Wizard -

I had the same thought myself! Or perhaps someone gave it to him after Maddie disappeared to give him a few ideas - who knows? But it does make you wonder whether Maddie disappeared before they all say, i.e. before the 3rd May, (remembering how the three tapas' men, i.e. Oldfield, Payne and O'Brien, in their statements couldn't remember the last time they had seen her) and the book was to give Gerry some ideas as to how to make things look completely different to what they actually were.

I personally think it's more than a coincidence.

nancy said...

Lindy123

A very happy New Year to you too!

I would like to see the evidence of letters written from these so called mothers who have of course done exactly the same thing themselves! Even if it were true, this doesn't excuse the McCann's behaviour or their tapas pals. Being doctors they should be even more ashamed of themselves and come out readily to admit their awful neglect which led to Maddie's disappearance.

I think that hell will ice over before that though.

nancy said...

Bath Theory -

I always enjoy your posts!

It will remain a mystery why those two are still being fawned and pampered by the media and the police haven't put the handcuffs on yet!

Just why were they allowed out of Portugal when they were obvious suspects. I definitely think they are all being protected.

hope4truth said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
hope4truth said...

Morning ALL

Re the book yes there are lots of points in it that would give him some ideas but I never took much notice of the title before as I assumed it was a true crime book (like a forensic detective one) but I took this book on holiday a couple of years ago as it is a crime fiction book (a bit like taking a Patricia Cornwall book with you)...

It is about Freud arriving in New York and a rich woman being found murdered the Freud and some colleagues set to talk to a survivor of a similar attack and it is obvious people are lying and trying to cover it all up...

So I would assume he took the book to read as any of us would take a book on holiday but maybe either consciously or sub consciously he used some of it to make up the story of what had happened to Madeleine...

My take on this now after 19 months I have realised which book it was (DUH) I would say he may not of realised just how close to the book his story was a bit like reading a book a few years ago and writing a story only to realise that you have plagiarised most of what you read...

If I remember correctly this book was on the Richard and Judy book list (just a coincidence I am sure) but the good thing about the book is they caught the Murderer and uncovered all his deception...

I have probably given it to a charity shop by now but may go and get another copy Asda were selling it for about £4 last week and I Paid full price at an airport for it.... Actually thinking about it I either bought it in Feb 07 when I went to Portugal or Oct 07 when I was in Majorca and the book store at Gatwick had 100s of copies of it and it was well advertised as were the rest of the book club choices...

I don’t believe this was pre meditated the book has so many twists and turns I can’t remember it all clearly (it was a good book though and I could not put it down finishing it in about 2 days) and it is something you think about afterwards... My unprofessional theory would be he may not have realised where he got his inspiration from because if he had he would have hidden the book...

xxx

bath theory said...

The book could well have been bought innocently at Gatwick you are right. There again his body language and mannerisms have often not matched his words. I like this qoute and will repeat it.

Carl Jung stated
...We are shaken by secret shudders and dark forebodings;but we know no way out.......

Wizard said...

Hope, I now remember this book and I like you saw if for sale at the airport. I agree he probably bought it to read on holiday but I suspect, as you suggest, he used some of the ideas from the book to conceal what really happened. I may well try to get a copy as well as it will make an interesting read in the light of what we already know.

hope4truth said...

Hi BT and Wizzard

The book is really good and is full of cover ups and I wont spoil how he did it (in case you read it) but he was protected because of his class and he had to cover up a lot of what he had done (people in places they should not have been)amazing what innocent things people see that when put in the puzzle are no longer innocent...

I believe Gerry may have got ideas from the book but if he was smart he would have got rid of it so am still left thinking he thought it was all his idea and the stupid PJ would never see through him...

xxx

Wizard said...

Hi Nancy,

I thought for sometime that Madeleine might have died prior to 5.30pm on 3rd May primarily because it allowed more time for a plan to be hatched and executed. Although I do not believe in all the conspiracy theories I suspected the crèche records and statements by the nannies might well be wrong – simply because they had 10 little girls that all looked similar to Madeline at that time, the crèche records had her signed in therefore she was there. It would look very bad for them to admit they did not know who was there and who was not and twice as bad for MW holidays to admit this. The problem I have with my argument is how could the McCanns be sure the crèche would not notice if she was there or not, it would have to been totally chaotic. Perhaps it was but I now think it unlikely as the whole scenario that was played out on the evening of 3rd May would crumble if the crèche said she wasn’t there that day or afternoon it would be a far too risky a plan to pull off with any certainty.

Wizard said...

I was reading 3A’s yesterday when I came across a quote from a pro McCann who suggested an explanation for the eau de corpse in apartment 5A. They suggested the abductor brought it with them – unwittingly they solved the case of course – the abductor was the local undertaker!

Talk about clutching at straws ha!

hope4truth said...

Wizard

If my daughter was missing and I was told there was the scent of death in the apartment I would be distressed to begin with as it may mean she was dead and if I found out she would have had to be dead for two hours and I knew she had not been left alone that long then I would have no explenation. I would not offer theorys or discredit the dogs I would have to say I dont know...

As for the Creche I have seen kids clubs on holidays and kids are running in the door out the door in groups while the parents sign them in and out and it is manic they could have put diffrent child in the chances of the staff checking who is who is remote and who is to say when siging in one child someone did not add Madeleines name?

I am sure there are some good child care workers abroad but I would not trust any of them with my girls as for Charlote Penington she is hardly the kind of person I would trust to look after my Puppy let alone my child...

xxx

Wizard said...

Hi Hope,

So you think it a possible that Madeleine may not have been at the crèche during the whole day or part of the day. This always made more sense to me other than the nagging doubt I mentioned. However if the crèche was chaotic they could well have pulled it off. Perhaps who dares wins – well maybe.

hope4truth said...

Hi Wizzard

I think it is very likely she was not there. It was only a week's holiday and with all the children in and out it would be easy to change the records...

My Nephew attended a club when we were in Portugal and the list was on a clip board when his Mum signed him she could have added another name as it was just put back on the desk and she picked it up again on the way out to sign him out unless there was a fire I dont think anyone would have bothered to look at it...

To be honest I think their main concern is that the parent is the right person collecting the child so none are taken by strangers...

God knows what happend to Madeleine but they have shown her no respect since she went missing just talked about themselves xxx

viv said...

Hello guys

I have been on the 3 As reading OB's statements and then come back to Wizard saying:

I thought for sometime that Madeleine might have died prior to 5.30pm on 3rd May primarily because it allowed more time for a plan to be hatched and executed.

I agree! OB makes a point of saying that whilst down at the beach he suddenly decided to sprint down to the creche to get Evi BEFORE she was taken for high tea by the nannies. He is completely obscure and obtuse about whether he saw Maddie there at the creche, I did not actually see here there know, but my gut instinct is that she was etc.

I think at one point he even suggests that Maddie may have been with Kate and Gerry and I think she was, that afternoon. I also think it is quite possible that Gerry rang OB and asked him to come and get Evi quick because he did not want anyone to know that Maddie had not been taken to the creche or had been taken out.

It is particularly sinister that aside from I think Fiona who says she thinks she saw her that morning none of them can remember seeing her that afternoon, aside of course from Payne's obviously lying account of going to the flat at around 6.30 and seeing those three little angels dressed in white!

I think Maddie did die in the afternoon somewhere just before 5 when he called OB and caused a sprint and this explains how they got it all planned. But, when reading OB's statement on the 3 As I am confident he is at the very least looking at a charge of perverting the course of justice.


This is what I have just posted on 3 As on the OB rog thread:

I may be wrong, but is it not the case that the only one who has been asked to come back and sign a statement/various statements is ROB? When you sign a statement as a witness you are swearing that it is true and confirming that you know if you are telling lies you are likely to be prosecuted. He was interviewed on 8 July and then brought back on the 10th. There were two separate police officers interviewing him. I thought it was particularly significant that when he made the further comments wishing to retract his statement concerning Murat the one officer left, came back in again and said oh that needs to be on the video again as well.

All relevant evidence is admissible in a criminal case and so all the statements that ROB has made and all of the videos are admissible evidence including the fact that Jane and ROB wanted to get their heads together and change it again. By the police getting evidence of them changing their statements they are just giving them the rope that they asked for. If you want to change your statement it proves that you are telling lies. Here, ROB was wanting to go into finite detail changing what he had just said on the video only a few days earlier. Not only that he was doing what a classis suspect does, he was wanting to go into finite detail on the trivia in theRO desperate hope he could avoid the real issues. Whenever the questions got really difficult he resorted to his stock "OMG" type of answer, well 11 months on I cannot remember, including the last time he saw Maddie. And yet, he could remember the trivia in finite detail, note he just wanted to keep talking about the Sunday!

Police officers are trained not to get into an argument with witnesses, they ask very brief open questions to get the witness to talk, particularly when it is a suspect witness. The thinking behind this, they do not want the statement to be a load of what the police officer was saying. It needs to be the witnesses account, including all of the times he wants to change his mind because that is evidence of telling lies/conspiracy. These officers were clever and very professional IMO and ROB just did not appreciate what he was up against, in other words they did an excellent job! All of the statements he has made will be subjected to intense behavioural analysis to get at the truth, and the lies and telling lies in such a case is a very serious offence in itself, apart from what his own degree of involvement was! ROB did not have the benefit of legal advice at these interviews but he will have done now, and he did not go and stand on the steps of the High Court did he!!


Edited:
* 8 and 10 April, not July*


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viv said...

http://www.the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=26540&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=345

Cláudia said...

Just wanted to wish you all a good night.
Been preparing myself to go back to work tomorrow in the last few days. :-)
xxxx

atardi said...

Good morning and a Happy New Year to every one.

Cláudia, I had my first working day after the Christmas holidays. (2 weeks!)I'm so glad I didn't had to work the whole day.

-------------

Viv,

About 3 may 2007.
I remember that I read that the McCanns didn't leave the apartment that afternoon because of Madeleine's behaviour.