14 Mar 2008

SHANNON FOUND ALIVE WHAT FANTASTIC NEWS




Shannon Matthews Is Found
Updated:15:38, Friday March 14, 2008
Missing schoolgirl Shannon Matthews has been found alive 24 days after she disappeared.
She was found around a mile away at the home of a man who is part of her extended family, say Sky sources.

Shannon Matthews
Police smashed their way into a flat in Lidgate Gardens in Batley Carr and emerged carrying Shannon, neighbours said.
A 39-year-old man has been arrested at the address in the Dewsbury area of West Yorkshire, on suspicion of abduction, said police.
The nine-year-old was found "concealed" in the base of a divan bed at the address, the West Yorkshire force said.
Neighbours said the young girl looked "quite calm" and officers confirmed she was OK as she was brought out.
A local resident, who did not want to give her name, said: "One of my neighbours heard banging.
"When he went outside, police were breaking the door down - the man wouldn't come out so they broke in. Apparently they found her in bed."
The neighbour believed the man who occupied the flat where Shannon was found lived alone and had children who had been taken into care.
She added: "We haven't seen him for two or three years. But apparently he's come back."

Mother Karen Matthews
The woman who lives downstairs from him tipped off police after hearing footsteps, she said.
Earlier reports claimed the little girl was found hiding under a bed in a her grandparents' home.
Police had been searching for the nine-year-old for over three weeks.
The youngster has now been taken to a police station where she will be reunited with her mother.
Sky's north of England correspondent Gerard Tubb said: "I only know that she is alive but I wasn't given any impression that she was harmed.
"They've got her, they're very excited."
Child protection expert Mark Williams-Thomas said: "It's fantastic news that she has been but now the investigation will take a different line."
He added: "They will have to find out where she's been. Clearly there are some huge issues as to why she disappeared in the first place."
Shannon failed to return home from school after a swimming trip on February 19.

Officers in the search for Shannon
The schoolgirl's aunt Amanda Hyett said Shannon's mother Karen Matthews had been driven away by police from the family home shortly before 2pm.
Former Scotland Yard detective, Mike Hames, told Sky the police "always thought she was being kept away from home by someone that knows her".
"It is quite rare that you would find a child alive after all this time," he added.
Earlier this week, Ms Matthews, 32, a mother-of-seven from Dewsbury, West Yorks, said: "She got abducted. That's all I can say."
Asked if someone she knew was responsible, she said: "It seems that way because there's no trace of her at all.
"There's no trace of her swimming costume, her towel or anything like that that she's taken with her."
Shannon had been dressed in a black jumper with a school logo, a white cotton T-shirt, black trousers and a waist-length black coat with fur round the hood.
One national newspaper offered a £50,000 reward for information about her disappearance.
Police searched more than 200 homes and received over 300 calls from the public in their extensive investigation.
Friends and neighbours also distributed leaflets appealing for information about Shannon's whereabouts across West Yorkshir

181 comments:

alsabella said...

I am very happy for Shannon and her family that she was found alive and well. God bless them all.

Penelope1 said...

CM talking ive on SkyNews now.

He said K&G have "no idea" what happened to her. I thought they knew for sure she was abducted?

Spin spin spin - but interesting it was an extended family member who abducted her.

isis said...

What a happy day for shannons parents and family. I just pray that she will get over the trauma.

southerncross said...

So happy to hear that little Shannon has been found alive and being reunited with her dear ones.
I hope that with professional help, they can work through the inevitable psychological(and physical) trauma .
Wonderful news indeed :)

viv said...

Hiya all

What fantastic news for little Shannon and her family, most especially her obviously devastated mom.

Let us hope they will all be able to recover from their ordeal in time and with the professional help they will undoubtedly get.

An example, I think, that money simply cannot buy Justice and a good outcome. They let the police get on with their job in a professional way.

Pity the McCanns could not do the same.

2345 said...

Great news. Whether or not she was abducted depends on whether she took herself to the relative voluntarily or whether she was forced into the property and held against her will under lock and key.

Circumstances suggest problems at home. Child Protection expert Mark Williams-Thomas said "It's fantastic news that she has been found but now the investigation will take a different line".

Has he heard of Maddie's case and the forensic results on the files of Leicester Police & PJ ? What line has been taken by Child Protection experts since damning results were publicly broadcast on 7 September ?

If the same forensics had been found in Shannon's home and parents vehicle they would both have been taken into custody.

Shannon had a relative to turn to in her unhappy state and old enough to walk out. Madeleine wasn't, she was left totally at the mercy of her parents and left without supervision night after night in an alien environment.

Now I'm angry ... I'm off to cook. Heartless McScams even hooked a sick PR ride on the back of Shannon's case ... words fail me.

2345 said...

penelope1,

Lack of communication between the McCanns and their highly paid mouthpiece !!

He never misses a chance to hitch a ride on other's genuine grief ...
Took full advantage of Shannon's genuine disappearance ... despicable, loathesman man.

SHAME ON YOU MITCHELL JOBSWORTH ....

Penelope1 said...

According to Alsabella's blog teh news has just cone thro that a bag of bones was found in the resevoir.

It is not known if they are human or not.

Docmac if you are there, would Maddie's body have decomposed so much (in water) in less than one year that she would already be just bones and not a body ?

atardi said...

Leigh3,2345,Hope4truth and Penelope1,

You arerepresenting my (foreign) voice in the case of Madeleine.

Leigh3,
In my last post to you I said I had nothing to add. But even if I could add something I couldn't do it like you and Penelope1 do. So both of you keep representing my voice.

2345,

After reading your posts I wanted to make comment but thought it was inappropiate after Shannon was found. I will post it later.

Hope4truth,

Hope your well now. Thank God Shannon is alive. And let's hope that she will be able to cope with the situation.

docmac said...

Hi Penelope

I'm not supposed to be here as we have guests, so I'll be brief.

There are many variables to take into account, but generally speaking a body decomposes 4 times FASTER in water than one buried under soil and HALF as fast as one exposed to the elements. Bearing in mind that in a warm climate with some humidity a human corpse can be reduced to bone and hair in around 10 days, the answer to your question is obviously yes, and FAR quicker than that..

Penelope1 said...

Thanks Docmac!

There is some speculatin that it might be animal bones, but surely they wouldn't call in the PJ if it was a bag of dead kittens.

dolores said...

Latest news on Shannon is she is being kept under police protection,as her life could be in danger.

Wizard said...

Penelope1,

Ironside is reporting the bones found were animal bones.

hope4truth said...

Good Evening Everyone

Fantastic news about Shannon poor little girl I hop.e they help her now whatever she needs...

Where is eveyone posting I have been all over the blog looking for you all..

Hi Dolores just read your post and realised there are people out there how can a little girls life be in danger what is the world comming to ?

dolores said...

Hope for Truth,
there seems to be a thread missing,and I think they lost in cyberspace,or we are.Iposted earlier and din't know where it went.
That was all I heard on Shannon,they did not elaborate on it.

Anonymous said...

Docmac,

bodies do not decompose 4 times faster in water, and you do not get decomposition in ten days in a warm and humid country.

You are not a doctor, and you are definitely not a forensic scientist either.

viv said...

Hiya Dolores

I deleted the satirical thread because I thought it was disrespectful given the possible finding of Madeleine. I am sorry for deleting everyone's posts (including my own of course) but I am sure you will understand my reasons.

I did mark the Damn of Arade thread as the current one due to this but as you all seem to be commenting on here here are the relevant posts of that thread.

Hiya 2345

Thanks for the really interesting article about the illegal activities of Metodo 3, paying witnesses to say they saw Madeleine. Clarence thinks that is just fine and they dont need to prove themselves. He would have done better to state the McCanns have been ill served by these criminals. They tar themselves the same style of investigation.

Friday, 14 March 2008 16:31:00 o'clock GMT
Penelope1 said...
2345

Thanks for your earlier post. Yes, M3 seem to be even lower than we thought.

No doubt the PJ will be determined to nail them too - the are trying to undermine their credibility and are also interfering with Madeline's investigation, as well as Mari-L's.

The whole Madeline case is so much greater than the disappearance of a small child - it reeks of dishonesty, corruption and bribery as every turn.

If the McCanns were upright they would have fired M3 as soon as they got any hint of their corrupt past and current corrupt practises of paying for false sightings.

It will take the PJ a long time to unravel this - and this seems to be the deliberate stragetgy of M3.

Friday, 14 March 2008 17:46:00 o'clock GMT
Penelope1 said...
According to Alsabella's blog teh news has just cone thro that a bag of bones was found in the resevoir.

It is not known if they are human or not.

Docmac if you are there, would Maddie's body have decomposed so much (in water) in less than one year that she would already be just bones and not a body ?

Friday, 14 March 2008 17:53:00 o'clock GMT
Penelope1 said...
Cut and pasted from Alsabella's blog:

New In Town

Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 3:13 pm
Posts: 29 Translated news

Updated at 17h24

A few minutes passed from 15 hours when the team of
Divers hired by Correia found a lawyer Aragon
Bag with "bones", covered in mud and bottom of the dam do Arade,
Revealed the PortugalDi�rio Telma Fernandes, assistant to the
Caus�dico.

"We do not know whether they are human or any animal," says Telma
Fernandes. "Bones are small and only slightly opened the bag to
See its contents. When saw what was called the
Mexemos authorities and not more, "guarantor.

"Neither is to see that color is the bag, because it is completely
Covered with mud. It was tied with ropes with, "adds the
Assistant to the attorney Madeira.

He not up for Maddie
Maddie: tens to hear in England

The GNR and the Judiciary Police are already on the site and created a
Small perimeter security. "Along the bag only are the
Authorities and some divers ", reported the Telma Fernandes
PortugalDi�rio. "All other people are beyond the
Perimeter. How, for example, the detectives of the agency Spanish
M�tode 3.

Searching for the second time

Marcos Aragon Correia is a lawyer and, for the second time in a few
Months, is the sponsor with support from a company Algarve, searches
Dam in the Arade, in Silves. It is there that believe has
"Largado been" the body of Madeleine McCann, a few days after
Its disappearance.

The search again Monday and were found
Several foreign objects. "Several ropes, a plastic and half
The child with four or five years, "said the PortugalDi�rio
Telma Fernandes. "But meanwhile, this material has followed to
Barcelona which will be analysed.

It is recalled that last December the lawyer had already hired
A team of divers and was four days on the spot. In this
Time, "was found a rope from five meters", which was
Delivered to the GNR of Lagos, recalls Telma. "We believe that after
Has been taken to the Judicial Police. But the fact is that never
Nobody told us anything about it. " So they decided, this
Instead, "does not deliver anything without analyzing first of form
Particular.

However, the "finding" of this Friday left no alternative to
Lawyer and the team of searches: "We had to draw the
Authorities. The bag was found near Tower "to capture,
Very close to the place you collected the other objects that
Week ', ends Telma Fernandes


http://www.portugaldiario.iol.pt/noticia.php?id=928079

14 March 2008 17:50

Friday, 14 March 2008 17:57:00 o'clock GMT
viv said...
Thanks Penelope

I did say a few days ago that we needed to prepare ourselves for Madeleine possibly being found in here in light of the reaction of the McCanns to the further search but nevertheless am utterly shocked. We do not know for sure that it is her, though, do we.

Viv

Friday, 14 March 2008 18:19:00 o'clock GMT
Penelope1 said...
Docmac posted this to me on one of the articles above, where I also posted news of the bone find. I asked him about decomposition rates in water. This is what the doctor said:

-----------------------------------
There are many variables to take into account, but generally speaking a body decomposes 4 times FASTER in water than one buried under soil and HALF as fast as one exposed to the elements. Bearing in mind that in a warm climate with some humidity a human corpse can be reduced to bone and hair in around 10 days, the answer to your question is obviously yes, and FAR quicker than that..

---------------------------------

I don't think the scuba divers would have called the PJ if it were a bag of dead kittens...

hope4truth said...

Annon

For gods sake get a brain if he was not a Dr he would not have answered the question without checking the Internet first to get the answer he would not have pulled it out of think air and prayed he was right...

Keep posting Annon you look more stupid everytime you do and the sad thing is it really makes no diffrence which one of you it is...

dolores said...

Daily Express,
GOA CASE MOTHER SERVED WITH SUMMONS



Scarlett Keeling

Friday March 14,2008
Have your say(2)
The mother of a teenage girl raped and murdered in Goa broke down in tears after being served with a summons under the Goa Children's Act by police.

Since the half-naked body of 15-year-old Scarlett Keeling was found on the beach in the resort of Anjuna on February 19, 43-year-old Fiona MacKeown has questioned the police handling of the inquiry.

Her lawyer, Vikram Varma, said that Mrs MacKeown, from north Devon, was served with a summons by two male police officers who went to her house.

The section of the Goa Children's Act under which the summons was served requires adults to provide a safe environment for a child.

Mr Varma said the summons required Mrs MacKeown to make herself available at a special juvenile police unit on Saturday.

"She will have to appear and they will take any kind of action they want," said Mr Varma.

He said the police had chosen that section of the Act to harass Mrs MacKeown for exposing corruption in the police.

He said she could not believe that, having taken a stand for justice, she was being harassed by the State of Goa.

viv said...

~Anon

Not only do you not state who you are, you also give no scientific basis for your assertions, let alone any indication of expertise.

I will give you just one final warning. If you come on here and attack other posters you will be deleted. Be polite to others or suffer the consequences.

hope4truth said...

Dolores

We could be lost forever in cyber space LOL

I am just watching BBC News 24 waiting for 8.00 to see what they say.

It is a sad world when a 9 year old little girls life is in danger children should be safe at least at home...

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Penelope1 said...

Anonymous/Gerry,

Please leave this forum now. I know things are tense at home, but surely you can just go off and play a game of tennis?

It kept your mind off your daughter in PDL.

viv said...

Hiya Dolores

I think it is right that Mrs Keeling is prosecuted for neglect. But for her actions in leaving Scarlett this clearly could not have happened.

It is human behaviour we will all be familiar with that when someone is in the wrong, they act defensively and aggressively. I have been very shocked by this woman's presentation on TV. As with the McCanns there is no sign of remorse or distress, just glowing and enjoying the limelight. This is sick and perverse.

I understand this lady has five or six other little children. She has demonstrated her overly relaxed attitude to parenting and these children must be protected from risk of serious harm. I admire the Indian authorities for doing just that.

leigh3 said...

Hi All,

I posted my views on Alsabella's site.

Atardi:-)

Dolores: The Child Protection Order is in Shannon's best interests, for now, imo.

Viv: your succinct explanation of the Child Protection Order would assist here, and on Alsabella's site, perhaps?

2345: words won't fail you for long! Happily :-)

hope4truth said...

Annon

Good for you when you post with your name maybe I will believe you while you hide and spin I will remain thinking you are an Idiot.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
viv said...

Well said Penelope! They have often stated it is their avowed intention to get this blog closed down. Sorry, Gerry, but we will not be shutting up and your blogging is quite pathetic and entirely in keeping with the rage on your face in the pic, top left, which again, stays right where it isx

leigh3 said...

Anonymouse.

Yup. I can see your problem with docmac.

He deals with life. You deal with death, hence your emphatic statement regarding decomposition.

Say hi to Mark for me, and U2. I liked them, despite our differences.

Re: Maddie. May the best men and women win this battle for truth.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...

Anonymouse.

You are such fun. The 'e' emphasises your cowardly intent.

Say 'cheese'! Do remember to share some with King Rat. You know how he likes to be fed by his minions.

viv said...

HI all Here is the opening section from our own Children Act 1989. I think law in India is sometimes based up our own models of justice.

It will be seen that in any proceedings the court is determing in relation to children the welfare of the child is paramount. Delay is also another important principle. The Indian authorities will be mindful that, as in the McCann case, one child has already suffered serious harm. Therefore they must act with urgency to protect others. It is not merely a question of victimising or punishing this woman. It is a serious child protection issue. In the UK the court appoint a probation officer or social worker to investigate the circumstances of the family to advise the court as to appropriate action in relation to the children and the parents. That is probably what will happen here. This woman appears to be living a somewhat vagrant lifestyle with her remaining children and has shown herself to be utterly irresponsible leaving a 15 year old in a foreign country without proper guardianship and protection. It will be argued no doubt, any reasonable parent would realise an attractive 15 year old girl was entirely vulnerable to risk of serious harm from alcohol, drugs and men and the mother should have foreseen that risk and not abandoned her daughter in this way.

-------------



Welfare of the child (1) When a court determines any question with respect to—
(a) the upbringing of a child; or
(b) the administration of a child’s property or the application of any income arising from it,
the child’s welfare shall be the court’s paramount consideration.
(2) In any proceedings in which any question with respect to the upbringing of a child arises, the court shall have regard to the general principle that any delay in determining the question is likely to prejudice the welfare of the child.
(3) In the circumstances mentioned in subsection (4), a court shall have regard in particular to—
(a) the ascertainable wishes and feelings of the child concerned (considered in the light of his age and understanding);
(b) his physical, emotional and educational needs;
(c) the likely effect on him of any change in his circumstances;
(d) his age, sex, background and any characteristics of his which the court considers relevant;
(e) any harm which he has suffered or is at risk of suffering;
(f) how capable each of his parents, and any other person in relation to whom the court considers the question to be relevant, is of meeting his needs;
(g) the range of powers available to the court under this Act in the proceedings in question.

docmac said...

Hey Anon you are very quick to display your lack of knowledge. But it's not that, is it? You just want to have a pop at me. You are perfectly correct, I am not a forensic scientist, but at least I know where to find the correct and factual information.


Time is variable.
"The time taken for a body to decompose depends on climatic conditions, like temperature and moisture, as well as the accessibility to insects. In summer, a human body in an exposed location can be reduced to bones alone in just nine days". (Australian museum in assoc. with deathonline)

You heard of Casper's Law? This is what Wikipedia has to say about it (I used Wikipedia because that's where you lot get all your scientific data from).

"The speed at which decomposition occurs varies greatly. Factors such as temperature, humidity, and the season of death all determine how fast a fresh body will skeletonize or mummify. A basic guide for the effect of environment on decomposition is given as Casper's Law (or Ratio): when there is free access of air a body decomposes twice as fast than if immersed in water and eight times faster than if buried in earth".


I hope you went back to your infested home and bragged about how you 'rumbled' me yet again, presented as a fact of course. You bunch could tie together all the neurons in your collective brains and still not have enough to stretch from your forehead to your computer screen. I wanted to say nose, but as all of your noses are rapidly elongating I might have got it wrong. Did you see how I exposed your mates as liars earlier?

One last thing. You noticed that little red dot on your feedjit map yet? The one that says Johannesburg? Zoom in and you will see Cape Town too. Well, I was always a 'liar' for saying I'm in SA. Seems I was not. Now I wonder if there was anything else I am constantly accused of 'lying' about that may in fact be the truth? Come on, try me. Idiot.

dolores said...

VIV,
Thanks for explaining where the last thread went,it is very understandable,your action to remove it.

Scarletts mother indeed deserved to be summoned,she allowed this poor child to much freedom sex and drugs for her tender years.She has nine children 7 went with her to Goa.
It was in the press today,that she served jail time years ago for attempted manslaughter,she slit a man's throat.

XX D

viv said...

Oh my God Dolores

She slit a man's throat! No wonder she went to Goa to escape the UK authorities - they would have taken her children - what a terrible woman.

Looks like we are going to hear a lot about this woman preaching on TV with no concern displayed that her child died.

Penelope1 said...

Gerry,

You are revealing yourself by being compelled prove to yourself that you are the cleverest, in all fields.

Well, pride is the sin of you know who, and it generally comes before a fall.

Why aren't you over at the reservoir with your scuba diving gear, trying to find your daughter?

Shannon's Dad scoured scrub for weeks. You just sponged flights on provate jets and ingratiated yourself to the rich and famous.

THese fair weather friends will disappear once the weather changes.

Its ironic, really, its your daughter that we are trying to defend here.

She has no voice. She is silent, innocent, beautiful.

Why you are turning her disappearance into a money-making venture is beyond me.

hope4truth said...

Viv

Did not notice the page had gone was going from page to page looking for you all.

I am glad you removed it, it was the right thing to do.

leigh3 said...

Penelope1.

Yes, it is so very sad that family can sometimes be a child's worse nightmare.

As you say, Maddie has no voice now; her dear little face is haunting; it triggers a protective response from responsible people; it reminds us of our 'duty of care' toward the vulnerable, the dispossessed, the voiceless.

If mere words of attack are all we endure in the pursuit of truth, then can easily shrug that off, in my view.

The strong must defend the weak; that is civilisation in its true form, in my opinion. If I'm wrong, then the worst that can happen is that fewer vulnerable suffer. If I'm right, then many vulnerable people will have some little protection. This is our pledge as civilised citizens in the UK, and elsewhere, imo; our heritage.

Long may it be so.

Ta ra, Darlings. See you next time.
xo

viv said...

Doc

Thanks for your helpful post about decomposition rates of bodies in varying conditions. You do not need to back up what you say however, you are among friends here and we value your opinion.

There are certain posters who have a particularly strong voice for Madeleine, you are among them. For that we have to live with their constant attacks. Continue to do so, just like Alsabella, Claudia, Leigh, 2345 and myself in particular. It shows we are hitting them where it hurts:-) Let us just continue to focus on the issues that bother them so much.

Have you heard any more news on the bones found in the damn. I see Ironside was posting they may be animal bones? Would they send this to Barcelona for forensic analysis if this were the case? Presumably a lab of particular expertise in Spain - surely not? I wonder, was this where Mari Luz body was analysed?

Luv Viv x

viv said...

Penelope

Just noticed your post about CM speaking live on SKY. No idea what happened to her. Presumably meaning Madeleine? This is very different to what they have just been saying prior to this discovery - they do not want to take part in the search, will not fund it, Madeleine is alive!

Ominous, I think, the way their position has, like Jane Tanner's, so constantly changed..

Penelope1 said...

Hi Viv,

Yes, referring to Madeline, CM said that the worst thing for the McCanns was that "they have no idea what happened to her" .

This struck me a strange as they have been bleating on about abduction since May 3rd.

Well, the PJ have an idea what happened to her. Maybe the McCanns should talk to them?

Penelope1 said...

Viv,

Maybe CM is saying "no idea what happened" as he is trying to distance himself from what may soon be proved as a "fake abduction theory".

Maybe Gerry - who according to ratonthebeam, is trying to distance himself from Kate, as his his family - is going to try to claim he didn't have anything to do with it and blame it all on Kate.

From the "anonymous" postings, someone is very angry. I'd say poor Kate has got a few thumps for landing them in this mess if it is correct that she was the one responsible for the death.

I can quite see Gerry planning the next phase, wanting to get custody of the twins eventually...

Maybe I'm extrapolating too much, but I think we can guess who "annonymous" is.

viv said...

Hiya Penelope

I wonder why it has been so important to the McCanns to find a possible link between the Mari Luz case and Madeleine. Rosiepops (AKA as Gerry) argued vehemently on the Daily Express that PDL to Huelva was just a short ride away -all 300 km of it! As you will see from the Spanish report below Gerry was immediately talking about the "probable abduction of Mari Luz" and his investigators were scouring the area looking for a link. How sick!

I was interested to note the police believe someone nearby saw Mari Luz with her killer, a word Gerry likes to avoid, but are afraid to come forward. I do hope they get this breakthrough in the investigation. Poor Mrs Cortez fainted when she heard the news..Who would want support from Gerry McCann! I really feel for this family in their terrible grief, having a couple who killed their own child, intrude on that grief. It really must have compounded the agony for them and is utterly sickening.

Viv x



The McCanns’ private investigators from the Barcelona-based Metodo 3 agency were with the Cortes family in the slum suburb to examine links between the two disappearances. Portuguese police were also liaising with Spanish detectives and the Guardia Civil to find any connection.
The McCanns and their investigators, two of whom spent the evening with the Cortes family, believe Huelva is on the route Madeleine’s abductor took to spirit the four-year-old away to North Africa.
Her father Gerry McCann, 39, offered Mari Luz’s family support through the nightmare ordeal.
He said: “Hearing of the probable abduction of Mari Luz Cortes has brought many awful emotions flooding back. We hope and pray she is quickly found and returned safely.”



Reports from Spanish T.V.Telecinco has revealed what it calls the definitive results of the autopsy carried out on the body of the five year old
There has been new information in the Mari Luz Cortés case, the five year old girl from Huelva whose body was found in Ria de Huelva a week ago.Telecinco is reporting that the definitive results of the autopsy carried out on the child, which they say has proved that she was suffocated to death, and then thrown into the water afterwards. The autopsy concludes that the child died in the following 24 hours of her disappearance, and that the injuries to her head and ribs were also carried out before she died.The child’s father, Juan José Cortés, has called for time to ‘cry in silence’ andsays that he will fight to find who is responsible and to see them pay for what they have done.Police say they think a local person may have seen Mari Luz with her killer, but is too frightened to come forward.

leigh3 said...

Penelope1.

I hope you don't mind me commenting on your last post, but personally, I'd be happy to meet Gerry anywhere, anytime, face to face, handshake to handshake...then let the court case commence :-)

Anonymouse, Psychopops and all the other pseudonymns of the McCann Machine of media manipulators are cowards; mice among men, and women; sociopaths seeking to attack our belief in the due process of law, and public inquiry.

One day, their anonymity will be gone; one day, they will come face to face with justice, in all it's forms, imo.

Ta ra.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
atardi said...

Hope4truth,

Was on the phone. I'm reading back.
Hope you will stay here.

leigh3 said...

'Comment deleted'? Darn. Anonymouse, did I miss your latest missive.

Viv's getting very quick at disposing of rubbish, isn't she? Ne'er mind, kidder. Just stick your time on the expenses form, eh?

Hi, Clarry and Co. :-)

viv said...

Hiya Leigh and Penelope

Tell you what always struck me as really odd about Rosiepops on the Daily Express. It used to start the spin before it was even in the papers e.g. the distance from PDL to Huelva. It even said it had travelled this route many times itself, so it KNEW. I could always see from its posts where it was going next. Seriously used to give itself away, time and again!

Avid, evil, little blogger our Gerry. Who, but him, would just keep writing these hate filled posts?

Re dropping Kate in it - Doc and I have been saying this for months. Remember how Philomena and Gerry dropped some hints months ago about how Kate could not be left alone with the children. Parents used to have to come and stay if he was going away. Nasty, evil, transparent.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Penelope1 said...

Hi annonymouse,

Sorry to miss you too!

Why are you being so jumpy and defensive?

Are you not anxious to help the police with their investigations?

I would be if my child were missing.

viv said...

By the way, speaking of Psychopops, did you notice how it is not posting hardly at all at night now, some of its servile maidens even commented where is Rosiepops. It is sitting watching this and Alsabella's like a praying mantis. Sometimes gets into such a rage, it just has to join in!

Today it said on no less than three occasions it was shedding real tears running down its cheeks following the news re Shannon. Really? Something seriously odd about a person who has to keep telling us this?

mark55 said...

leigh , If viv wants to delete my posts thats fine , but dont criticise other media for the supression of free speech . This makes the blg look a bit silly .

viv said...

ha ha Bark

did you forget to press the anon button?

So your son is going to meet Gerry on his medical degree course, right?

I reckon you already met him:-)

leigh3 said...

Hiya Viv,

Must go soon, but certain posts were too good to ignore.

Yes, Psychopops on the DE was transparently awful. Kate, the only child, the clever young woman pursued by Gerry the 'pet' youngest child of a large family (his sister Philomena's description), will be sacrificed for his self-preservation if the McCann Clan are backed into a corner, defending the 'pet' at all costs.

This is the source of my sympathy for Kate, no matter what happens or why.

That makes no difference to my belief that honest inquiry must pursue the truth, whatever it is, and the law must be enforced rigorously in this case, however belated that may be.

Mere sentiment never saved anyone, and it won't protect children. Deeds, not words, matter most, imo.

xo, dear. Will await your next comment, but then must go.

docmac said...

Why Wikipedia in this instance, Mark? So that if anyone wanted to look it up they have a chance of understanding it. If I gave references to journal articles very few would have any idea of what was being said. Comprehende?

Penelope1 said...

Dr Annonymouse,

Oooo, scorching comment re: Wikipedia. That kind of intellectual point scoring gives you away Gerry!

BTW, did you hear on SkyNews that they found Shannon by using a UK police database called "Catch 'Em".

I wonder if the team working with the PJ are also using "Catch 'Em"?

No where to run, no where to hide, you and your family are too well known.

As Princess Diana's sister famously said:

"Your face is on the teatowel, its too late"

atardi said...

Goedenavond Leigh3,

Just keep representing my voice. I can't do it like you do.

The Mc Canns can't use Shannon anymore.So the emphasis will be on Mari Luz the next few days.

Anonymous said...

viv
My son and all the students at liecester give Gerry full support and sympathy . He has the full support of the medical school.
the pj were supposed to be coming six months ago . They are still not here , they wont be coming , the McCanns are innocent .

leigh3 said...

Good Evening Mark,

Oddly enough, I do miss your comments regarding this sad case of missing Madeleine.

We disagree often, but I bear no personal malice toward you. Keep well.

Leigh

lizzy said...

Hi Viv,
I agree with you totally re Rosiepops on the DE, even when first came on there, I always felt she was a man, and I think the last few weeks it became more apparent. Lizzy

Doppelganger said...

Anon,

Shannon is now apparently subject to a child protection order and will not be returned to her family at the present time.

It was reported on the news this afternoon that the man who has been arrested is part of Shannon's 'extended family'.

Once again this supports NSPCC statistics which show that in all but a tiny, tiny number of cases, when children disappear the person responsible is SOMEONE KNOWN to them.

Children just do not vanish into thin air.

Penelope1 said...

Hi Mark55,

I see its you! Of course - the school holidays started today!

viv said...

Hiya Lizzie

Yes it did become even more apparent - this thing is crude and very aggressive. Frequent use of PMSL and then reference to "squirrel's farts" etc. Did not exactly exude elderly aunt persona did it!

lizzy said...

Great news by the way that Shannon has been found alive and well. Am sure though that Team Mccann will have to link this to their case though , CM no doubt will have more spin in tomorrows papers. Lizzy 21.45

lizzy said...

Hi Viv,
I know those comments were such a giveaway...Lizzy

irina said...

Hello everyone.
Too convenient of a time. Is not it? With the bones.
Whatever McCanns will tern out now9 false or real) does not matter, they are facing the serious charges of killing and disposing of their daughter! Whatever excuses they will come up - this is a crime. "I will never do it again" or " I want to do what the best" does not work in a matter of murder (which it is as far as I believe: when one is super violent towards child it is murder!)
If that is a desperate attempt by the Mcs to disrupt the interviews... by sending M3 to plant Madeleine finger bones... WOW!!! ... It is the most evil yet!!!
Let’s hope for Madeleine sake that it just a bag with picnic leftovers...

Great news about Shannon!!!!!
Hope she was not heart, just scared to go back with all that attention.

mark55 said...

Docmac
Excuse my lack of bloggig . This time I think I have posted my correct identity .
I find your posts particularly sad . Im sure every doctor has heard of "evidence based procedure " .
In this instance you seem to prefer to concur with 2345 who seems to think that her parents were involved with her death . what has happened to your scientific training

atardi said...

Niki,

Where were you today?

viv said...

Hiya ~Doppelganger

Great to hear from you again!

Thanks very much for the news Shannon is subject to a child protection order.

As you say, families are almost always involved in the death or disappearance of a child. They do not just disappear into thin air as the McCanns would have us believe.

Although it is sad and shocking, it would be a major breakthrough for the PJ if these bones found to turn out to be little Madeleine. Reverting back to we dont have a clue what happened to her sounds very defensive and ominous IMO.

Sudden rush of posts - will answer you all!

Doppelganger said...

Lizzy,

Sorry, but speaking as a man Rosiepops definitely comes across as a woman.

I won't insult women in general by elaborating on my reasons for saying this

But I have the knitting needle stab marks in my back to prove it!

;-)

dolores said...

Lizzy,
Rosie is a male on her profile in the House of Filth.Proves he lied on DE.

XX D

Penelope1 said...

Lizzy,

You were right in your post at 2145 - "coming up next on Sky, Kate & Gerry McCann's reaction to the finding of Shannon"

atardi said...

Doppelganger,

On the DE Rosiepops said she was/is a grandmother. And don't forget the present she got . But she still don't feel like a really "grandmother" to me.

viv said...

Mark

You are very welcome on here to defend the McCanns and explain why, in your view, they are innocent.

But, I am going to have to tell you again, as I did earlier on, you are not welcome if you are simply going to repeat the Daily Express behaviour and attack other posters. This does nothing whatsoever to support the McCanns. It shows them in a very bad light.

I have been in contact with Docmac for several months now. I know all about him and know for a fact he is a South African doctor. So if you are just going to attack his credibility, you will be deleted. YOu are NOT GOING TO BE ALLOWED TO TURN THIS INTO A DX SLANGING MATCH - LISTEN TO ME GOOD!

irina said...

As far as GOA CASE goes... I am sorry that mother is a new age hippy,, that is her choice, but she is to be kept as responsible for her children (who did not choose to be hippies) as Mcs. her daughter was allowed to use drugs, to have sex, she was left unsupervised in the place where people are going exactly for drugs and that stile of life!!!!
I have as much sympathy for her family as for Madeline’s, and as much sympathy for her as for Madeleine. Parent’s choice of life stile kills the children!!!

ratonthebeam said...

Which one of your five kids is at "lie-cester", Mark? Is it Stella or Artois?

Doppelganger said...

Viv,

Ironside posted on Alsabella's blog that the bones are animal not human.

I'm really too busy to post at the moment, but I am having a half hour break.

No doubt the 'knitting circle' are beginning to think they have managed to 'assassinate' me but that is far from the case.

Got to go now - see you all another time.

leigh3 said...

Dear Mark,

The McCanns cannot possible be 'innocent', as you insist. They left 3 infants alone in a foreign apartment whilst they wined and dined with friends; only one of them had a baby listening device (not the McCanns); the apartment could not be seen from the Tapas restaurant, as Gerry asserts; it was certainly behond sight and SOUND of the adults.

This alone means the McCanns are not 'innocent'. Child neglect is a very serious offence, Mark, particularly when it results in the death of a child. Do doctors really support the McCanns?

No, they do not, Mark. Time will tell.

docmac said...

Mark I answered a question directed to me pertaining to body decomposition. I fail to see what bearing that has on Madeleine's parents. It has been quite a while since I last offered a direct opinion on their possible guilt or lack thereof.

leigh3 said...

Doppelganger.

Nice to see you again, making pertinent points, as usual.
See you another time.
Leigh

viv said...

Hiya again Dolores

Rosie was a male on its DE profile too. How sick to then try to pretend it was a woman. The only thing this horror understands about women is how to control and abuse them.

Doppelganger said...

Atardi,

Don't forget even Dr Harold Shipman had a Grandmother

Got to go now

See you all another time

viv said...

Doppel

Thanks for information posted by Ironside the bones are animal, not human. He is generally pretty accurate! We will have to wait and see I guess on that one.

viv said...

Doppel

Sorry you can't stay - see you later

Viv x

viv said...

Mark

Do you think the action the Indian authorities are taking against the mother is fair and reasonable, or do you think some other excuse should be found, rather than pointing out the parent broke the law by neglecting her child? That by doing so, the child, on the parents' own admission, came to serious harm?

Indefensible isn't it?

The McCanns cannot re-write the law according the McCanns, can they? Even money does not buy them that, does it?

atardi said...

Doppelganger,

Thank you for your comment.

Even Rosiepops have and I hope still have a grandmother.

Jopeyou will post again.

irina said...

The profiles of pros, typical features:
Grandmothers,
Love flowers and angels and other sweet avatars,
Nonconsistant: can go from lovely sweet hearts who just so compassionate to rude swearing drunks,
Gender is undetermined: can’t keep it up,
Weep a lot about Madeleine and her parents (watch it in new posters),
Sometimes come out of role play with genuine remarks to other posters (which stand out), like "I respect you".

Conclusion ....whatever they are... they are playing games for a fee or pleasure or favor

viv said...

Hi Irina

You make a good point - children, very sadly, do not have the option of choosing their parents' lifestyle and conduct. The law is there to protect children who find themselves in that very sad position.

I too have every bit as much sympathy for the unfortunate children in this case as the McCanns. Strong laws, strong adults, to protect vulnerable little children, who need love, nurture and proper care.

dolores said...

Viv,
He is not succeeding here,the women are to strong here and none of us are subserviant.
xxD

irina said...

As we all, I am desperate to know if the interviews have begun. But I think the PJ will keep professional and full us all, including McCanns. Well done to them. And of course UK police, who is playing so well so far.
By the way new Grand Master of Order of Malta was elected in February after the death of the old one. Is it a reason of the change in inquiry? Just joking...

leigh3 said...

Irina!

It reminds me of the story 'Little Red Riding Hood.'

'My grandma, what big eyes, you have; what big teeth, you have...'

The wolf deceiving innocents hides beneath the cover of a sentimental, harmless guise whilst it's intentions are to aggressively pursue it's need to conquer.

Fairytales existed long before written law as moral tales; warnings about ethics, and proper conduct.

Granny Psychopops preys on innocents, imo.

Nice to see you, Irina, and your close observations.

hope4truth said...

Hello All

I am so relieved Shannon has been found and she is recieveing the help and protection she deserves.

I also hope that the investigation reveals the truth behind what happend to her and why she was taken.

viv said...

Hiya Irina

Just checked BBC news site - absolutely nothing about Madeleine but really good report on Shannon confirming she is indeed subject of an Emergency Protection Order under the Children Act 1989 and is in the care of the police. Sadly the ordeal for this little lamb clearly has not ended yet. However, they must carry on and find out what happened to her and at least she will certainly be protected from further harm now. Mum has been allowed to see her. Sometimes parents are just not able to adequately protect their children from harm. This could be such a case. I am sickened to think of the McCanns even offering their two pennuth on this case also, when are they going to remember their Arguido status and stop acting like a couple of child protection experts!

Missing girl Shannon found alive

Shannon Matthews had been missing for three weeks
Missing nine-year-old Shannon Matthews has been found alive, more than three weeks after she disappeared after leaving her school.
Police found her hidden in the base of a divan bed in a house in Batley Carr, West Yorkshire, a mile from her home.

Shannon has been put under an emergency protection order and will remain in police care while officers establish what happened to her.

A 39-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of abduction.

Neighbours in Batley Carr said police smashed their way in and emerged carrying Shannon, who was last seen leaving Westmoor Junior School in Dewsbury on 19 February.

'Over the moon'

West Yorkshire Police said medical checks had been carried out on Shannon and the force would now begin to interview her.

A spokesman said: "This may be a long process but throughout this enquiry our main focus has been and continues to be Shannon's welfare."

Neighbours said Shannon looked "quite calm" as she was taken from the house and officers confirmed that she was OK.

Shannon's father Leon Rose said he was "over the moon".

During a search of the house, officers located Shannon Matthews who was found concealed in the base of a divan bed

West Yorkshire Police

"Believe it or not, where she's been found, I'd actually been in that area a number of times and probably just walked straight past the house that she was in," he said.

Shannon's uncle, Neil Hyett, said Shannon and her mother, Karen Matthews, had been reunited at Dewsbury police station.

Earlier, a West Yorkshire Police statement said: "As part of ongoing investigations, detectives and specialist search officers attended a house at Lidgate Gardens, Batley Carr, Dewsbury, at 1230 GMT this afternoon.



Map of where Shannon was found
"During a search of the house, officers located Shannon Matthews who was found concealed in the base of a divan bed.

"A 39-year-old man was arrested on suspicion of abduction at the address and is currently in custody at a West Yorkshire police station.


Police smashed their way into the property

"Shannon is currently in the care of West Yorkshire Police. Investigations are ongoing."

Neighbour Christopher Heaps witnessed Shannon being brought out of the house by police.

He said he heard police breaking the door down then saw officers carrying Shannon in their arms.

"She was very calm and didn't look upset," he said.

Children returning from school to houses in Shannon's road were crying and hugging each other after hearing she had been found.

Mayor of Kirklees Jean Calvert said she was delighted Shannon had been found.

"It's an immense relief for the family, relatives and friends of Shannon and those who've supported the efforts to find her and have shown so much concern over what's been a very traumatic few weeks for them and the local community," she said.

More than 200 officers and 60 detectives have been involved in the search, which police said amounted to 10% of West Yorkshire Police's operational strength.

The force said the operation was its since the hunt for the Yorkshire Ripper.

Officers have searched nearly 3,000 residential and commercial premises in the hunt for the schoolgirl.

The police hunt for Shannon had always focused on the local community.

leigh3 said...

'...they are playing games for a fee or pleasure or favor...' wrote Irina.

It is as succinct as that, I agree.

atardi said...

Hi Irina,

My tulips are doing very well thank you.
I love flowers and gardening.

But still I'm one of the posters who keeps fighting for Justice for Madeleine. And will do untill Justice is done.

viv said...

Hiya Atardi

Yes we are the people who genuinely love flowers and gardening, rather than one who just has to choose a flowery name and keep telling us it is crying..for itself no doubt!

viv said...

What happened to Mark?

As ever, difficult questions, no answers, just wants to abuse others..

atardi said...

Viv,

I never wanted to comment about gardening. But I really like gardening. And I do it all by myself. I remember some people of the DE who loved to watch birds too!

viv said...

Hiya Hope

There are set procedures that will now have been put into action to protect Shannon. Social Services will be working with her and the police and will be responsible for any care proceedings that are necessary to protect her from future harm. If it is decided that it is not safe to return her to her parents she will be placed in foster care.

If there are care proceedings it is ~Social Services job to undertake these and a guardian ad litem will be appointed by the court to represent Shannon in those proceedings. They are trained social workers, often also trained lawyers, have very close contact with the child and stand in their place in the court proceedings because it would obviously be harmful for the child to actually be involved directly in those proceedings.

Her welfare and best interests will always be the paramount consideration.

hope4truth said...

For anyone that has UK Style EXTREME MAKEOVER HOME EDITION is on it is the episode where they fix up a house for a family who's daughter Morgan was snatched from a little league game when she was 6 she is still missing (I think 10 years on) and her mother has set up a missing persons charity reunited lots of familys but sadly not her own.

If you watch UK TV STYLE + 1 at 11.00 you will see the whole thing it is on for two hours and made me cry so much the first time I saw it (getting a little sad now)...

xxx

dazedandconfused said...

I often read here as I'm really concerned that the Macs might get away with it and do like to find others who feel similarly that they are as guilty as hell, but it does seem to have degenerated into a name calling fest. Don't you think this could be ammunition for the pro-macs when they read these blogs, calling them "it" etc. We're all adult (hopefully) and can discuss the case without resorting to juvenile arguments.

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I am sure she will be treated with kid gloves now and I hope they do the best they can for her poor little thing must still be very confused..

xxx

viv said...

Hiya Atardi

Previous chats with other posters on this blog confirm we have similar interests that demonstrate an empathic person. Interested in gardening and nature etc. Encourage and enjoy wildlife in their gardens.

Rosie has cynically sought to emulate this type of personality - as you noted even saying on its profile it likes birds. Those of us who genuinely behave this way don't need to keep telling people. This thing is a sick play actor and writes repeated effusive and overly sentimental posts as it tries to convince us. Dream on Gerry horror! You kid no one but yourself, least of all intelligent police officers..

atardi said...

Hallo Hope4truth,

Been trying to catch you.
Have you had a good day (working)?

irina said...

Atardy,
No offence intended for lovely flower of yours. My favorite. But unfortunately the wise advisers to antis recommended flowers to fool us all (and they did fool me at the beginning). But of course we can see true from false. And I have great respect for you, and your country. Good people all love flowers, and that what antis counted for.

Viv, in connection to Shannon, I am so pleased that she is alive!!!

I think that her mother should have more sympathy then other ones.
She clearly wants best for her children. And her need in some man to be the guardian of them led to more children, more men (sorry mail people, but your ability to care about children is undermined by the History. She might made mistake in men... but she is there for her children.
Anyway, Shannon will be OK now...

viv said...

Dazed and confused

sounds like you picked the right name!

I suggest you read their posts and stick with them..then you can really enjoy a bitchfest. Rosie has now written about 8000 so you wont be short of Pro-McCann bile and hatred of those that dare to suggest the police are right about them, will you?

dolores said...

Leigh,
This statement has always greatly concerned me,and for the safety of the twins.

Kate said: "It really isn't easy," coping. "Some days are better than others. ... There's days when you think, 'I can't do this anymore,' and you just want to press a button, and we're all gone, and it's all finished, and we're all together and gone. Wherever. But you can't, you know. Just occasionally you'll have a -- if you're having a really bad day, which we do. And you can't help but think that."

This is an extremely disturbing quote Leigh.

XX D

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
supertroll said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
hope4truth said...

Hey Atardi

I have had a lovely day thanks yes

I have been working but we delivered 90 easter eggs to the Womens Refuge today they were so pleased with them so hopefully all the children there should get a couple of eggs each next Sunday (I am sure others will have donated as well so maybe they will get more)...

How are you have you been working today???

Fantastic news about Shannon I have been smiling ever since I heard she was alive (cried a bit as well) I am hopeless with happy news and weddings allways end up in tears...

Has your daughter got a match tomorrow???

xxx

viv said...

Hi Irina

Yes, maybe Shannon's mom does deserve sympathy, her ability to care undermined by her history.

Sometimes Social Services will insist that if mom wants the child back, then the man who is causing the problem has to go first..that can be a way forward and a chance for moms to start getting things right, with help and support from SSD. Taking children away is always a last resort.

Educated moms like Kate McCann ought to be able to make the right choices all by themselves..Even if she is very ill, she knows exactly where to get help.

irina said...

Attardy, about tulips..
I love my garden, and I love plants, that do not need too much care, that are growing naturally.
This is the second year I have tulips, and I am surprised that they are so growing and flowering.
Back in my native country, I could never grow them, as they will freeze in the winter. But in my home now - Ireland they are feeling really well.

In my next life I want to be a gardener.

I think PJ are arriving this weekend.

atardi said...

Irina,

I have read so many posts of you. So don't even think I might be think you are on "the other side". At this moment I have white tilips in my garden. But soon I will have different colourss.

Nice to see we are both posting for Justice for Madeleine.

viv said...

Irina

Could it be the PJ were putting off further interviews until the search in the Arade damn had gone ahead?

There is a Portuguese construction engineering firm from Portmao assisting with the cost and expertise necessary in this search. Is it a coincidence that it is Portuguese business helping to fund this, and a business in the same town as the PJ? There is also reported to be firemen assisting. Fire and police always work closely together in any country..

hope4truth said...

RE the Extreme Makeover program I am watching it form the begining again and the emotion from the mother is genuine grief and devestaion for her own daughter and other missing children...

She even moved so she could be closer to where she was taken from... Crying again now why do I do this to myself??? xx

leigh3 said...

Hi Dazedandconfused.

I like your name, and think it sums up how many people feel about this sad case of 'missing' Maddie.

However, some of us recall the antics of the McCann Machine of media manipulators on the Daily Express, Daily Mirror, Daily Mail ... etc, blah, blah, blah.

These creatures, this 'it' has mechanical traits: everyone it employs is simply a cog in a machine without feeling, grinding down anyone or anything that questions it's version of events.

The Police, public, child welfare organisations - all of this is attacked whenever the McCann Machine is questioned.

See why some of us call it 'it'? It has no thought of feeling for anyone beyond it's own self preservation.

Sorry to go on so. Librarising on the DE would have stated this stuff more succinctly, and humorously.

Doctordoom on the DE would give you the 'inside story'...

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
irina said...

Dolores,
I do not know if you heard Scarlet Keeling mother speaking... But if compare her and Kate it is so clear that one is telling whatever on her mind (and really very articulate for uneducated poor Irish woman) and the other trying to deceive (confused speech - Kate).

They are certainly both responsible for what happen to their children, but one is directly involved and lying!!!

Anonymous said...

Irina,
Scarlet Keeling's mother was born in Britain from Irish parents, she also is educated.
Not KGB material are you?
Why post about stuff you don't know anything about?

leigh3 said...

Hello, HelenM. Bananas: fetch!

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
viv said...

Hiya Leigh

~Amazing how so called educated parents children finish up dead.

Before I got my degrees, thanks to a lovely mom and dad, I got myself a big dollop of emotional intelligence too.

hope4truth said...

leigh

make sure you throw those bananas far far away...

Anonymous said...

Leigh / Luke,

you really are an obnoxious pratt aren't you ????????????????

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...

Anonymouse,

Learn to spell. There's a good lil laddie, eh?

viv said...

Luke is at work, aggression levels rising again? Dear, dear, you need to learn to enjoy nature, art, soothing music etc and calm down a little.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
irina said...

Viv, I think that the tight arrangements with UK police are need to be kept, regardless of findings in the lake. I think that evidence is so irrefutable that any findings are irrelevant to the questioning. Only thing what matters, that all witnesses will be interviewed in correct order and circumstances. That means as well the avoidance of media and McCanns knowledge (unfortunately our as well).
Finding the body is significant for Madeleine the most and conclusion of the thread, but not as much for the charge of the parents (though it is last point).
I think it there is enough evidence of what really happen...
And we will know it, even if justice will fail in UK.

Attardy, my favorite are dark red, purple, black. French would remember the film "Back tulip" with Gerard Philipe

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
viv said...

Leigh

Anonymous learned how to cut and paste, likes the sound of its own voice. Shame it does not get one on here, too boring..oh, it thinks the parrot will be posting, schizoid..

atardi said...

Hallo Hope,

Nice to see, I mean read you again. Yes they will be playing against Noordscheschut. Last week they won 2 to 0. And she scored one.

I had some furniture delivered last week. Not from Dorset.

What a lovely thing to do. "Sisters are doing it on themselves". Keep doing this work. Like Leigh3 said,the next generation can change the world.

And we are the ones to start the changing.

Together we are strong.

Yes,it was great news to read about Shannon.

leigh3 said...

Hope and Viv.

Please excuse my moment of frivolity with the 'it'. I shouldn't laugh, but 'it' is amusing; a little toy, a bit of fun.

Sorry, Hope. When faced with sociopaths, I get blunt - if they're lucky; something worse if they are unlucky.

Viv: God bless good parents.

dolores said...

Irina,
I never thought of it that way,and I see where you are coming from.

XX D

Anonymous said...

You think Gerry posts here.
That is even more schizoid...
Come on Viv bring the parrot on,we miss him. His posts make more sense than anyone else's here.
Has he also moved to Alsa's blog?

irina said...

Well, you see anonymous,
She is better speaker then you and Kate, and Gerry.
That is what I mean.
Love your KGB reference, dear boy.

hope4truth said...

Leigh

I just want you to throw the bananas far far away so the stupid prat will be running after them for a while and may not find its way back LOL x

viv said...

Hiya all

good old wiki again - recognise yourself, praying mantis?


Schizoid personality disorder (SPD) is a personality disorder characterized by a lack of interest in social relationships, a tendency towards a solitary lifestyle, secretiveness, and emotional coldness

Be honest with yourself and get some help, otherwise we keep on laughing at you:-)

viv said...

Who is we? Do you think because Psychopops allowed you to post on its blog, it is your special friend?

Do you get lovely emails from Pyschopops?

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
viv said...

Sorry Supetroll I got bored playing with you now, I really like all the sane posters on this blog, not you x

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
viv said...

Hiya Hope

Supertroll has a morbid fascination with my parrot, I really need to keep him safe from harm! By the way he loves bananas. I just gave him some. Every day he has some of my apple and some of my banana. He loves to share nicely and try to stick to a healthy diet, just like his mom:-)

atardi said...

Viv,

I remember all these comments about gardening inthe early days when we had Hys on the DE. But you know I'm here for Madeleine. And not only me. This case has affected my children also.

My children also want to know the tru th about Madeleine.

hope4truth said...

Atardi

She must have been pleased to score a goal I am pleased they won..

We must all stand together against child neglect in any form and make each and every parent realise they have a responisbility which will be the most rewarding experience of their lives if they just try and enjoy being parents take the good with the bad and ask for help when things get tough.

xxx

leigh3 said...

Hope,

Your wish is my command :-)

Bananas to be flung far and wide in future...far, far away from you. Happy you forgive my earlier cynicism. It's not a nice thing for nice people to witness; it is necessary sometimes.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
irina said...

I think I will say for many of us (and that is not for the annons attention, but genuine people) that at the start we could find the understanding for pros. In the sense of compassion and doubts that existed in our hearts as well as doubts. But as the case went further and our doubts were strengthened day by day, and antis became so obviously unrelated to the truth. Then I and many became furious with them, deceiving us so long with their sweetness, which changed into nastiness when no reasons have been left.
Rose, Old hippy and others, there is no credit left. And this is my take on you. Whatever you say, it is sounding the sane as if child killer speaks to me. It is not a game. It is a battle. And we are winning... Ups...

viv said...

Hiya Leigh

Yes we can both be tough when necessary and sometimes they do need reminding of their personality disorder and how no one likes them. That is a job for me and you:-)

Hope is much too nice!

WE are a good team here - all with our own great qualities!

atardi said...

Irina,

I have black/purple tulips too here. With some effort they will "overcome" the freezing period.

leigh3 said...

Atardi.

Yes, one aspect of this case rarely commented on is it's effect on children beyond the McCann Clan.

My children and their friends were just disbelieving when they heard that the McCanns left infants in a foreign apartment, unsupervised. My children and their friends were perplexed.

Suddenly, they became aware that the world does have nice looking, safe looking, respectable people (doctors) who would sacrifice their children for the sake of a drink with mates.

Now that is a very scary picture for children who have been loved, protected, and cherished. It's a shock.

I want my grandchildren to be safe and happy, just as my children are safe and happy. That won't happen unless we protect our right thinking values: children first.

irina said...

Viv, can you give me advice?
My parrot failed to learn any human language, but easily barks, growls and meaus.
Does yours speak?
He also tries to sing as canary.
I think I am a frailer of a teacher.
What is a secret?

hope4truth said...

Leigh

I found your cynicism funny If they had been intrested in debating on the DX they may have converted me (I can see all sides) but the more no one was allowed to have an opinion the more I thought there was something to hide.

And who hides anything when a child is missing???

SO throw those nannas far and wide should keep them busy... xxx

viv said...

Hiya Irina

You just echoed my sentiments really well. In months gone by, yes there were doubts and we wanted to give them the benefit of that doubt and explain to us. But what we have seen is very deliberate lies and downright nastiness. What we have seen from CM and the McCanns directly is a bizarre circus, employing a bunch of criminals to pay "witnesses" for them. We no longer have any doubts at all.

I remember Old Hippy, who I believe may have been one of Gerry's sisters, seriously lose it one day on the Daily Express, having about 15 or 20 posts removed in one day. After that there were a few brief appearance prior to her giving up altogether. She knows the truth.

irina said...

Leigh3,
I agree about the children affected.
As well as that children are so intuitive.
My daughter (the youngest is 12), who I kept away from it as much as possible. She cane once and have read I think you post and said: “I agree that Kate did it. She is so does not care. You would not be like that if I will disappear". I was shocked.

lizzy said...

FOUND HER ORIGINAL THREAD

There is not a listening service at MW's in Portugal and never has been.

The reason I know this is that I was at MW's in Praia de Luz at the same time as the McCann's.

I was there with my daughter and granddaughter at the time Madeleine went missing.

I saw a lot of things while I was there but I can't say what as both of us have given statements to the PJ.

We alternately went out and searched for Madeleine while her parents stayed indoors.

People on holiday and the people of Praia de Luz searched and some of the people took a week or more off to search for her.

The parents were far too busy going for a jog or playing tennis to do such a lowly thing as search for their own daughter.

When you do eventually learn of what did happen and what was seen, your jaw will drop down to the ground in complete shock.

As for Murat saying that he didn't know any of the Tapas nine. What do you think when Gerry was asked in front of a camera, "Do you know Robert Murat". His answer was "No comment". I found that's a very strange think to say. Why not just say 'yes' or 'no'.

The only people who said that Murat was there that night are the McCann's friends. All the other witnesses said that there was a man who 'looked' like him. Look for a picture of David Payne, you will see that they are very alike and one could be mistaken for the other especially as it was quite dark by then. I have seen the two of them and the likeness is startling! I thought that they were the same person until I saw them standing nearly next to each other.

Not one of the McCann's friends said they had seen Murat that night. Not until later in the week was it mentioned when a female reporter said that he was being very helpful just like Ian Huntley was when the two girls went missing in England.

She pointed out the similarities of how Huntley had been helpful when the reporters spoke to him and so mentioned it to one of the McCann's friends and that's when they started pointing the finger at him.

She was one of the reporters who were there when the murder of the two girls was being investigated and that's the only reason that she mentioned it.

I am not saying Murat did or did not have anything to do with Madeleine's disappearance as I really don't know if he did or not. Nor do I know if Madeleine was abducted or if something else happened to her by accident or at her parents hand.

I can only tell you the same things that are known to the public already and that is that the parents left their three kids every night alone and vulnerable. A disaster waiting to happen!

I do wonder if people would be as supportive to the McCann's if the children had died from a leaky gas boiler or burnt to death in a fire. Maybe even drowned in the pool or had an accident while they were left alone, or would they be pointing the finger at them and saying that the parents are guilty of wilful child neglect and would they still be supportive of the parents if they had done the same thing in England.

Still, everyone is entitled to their own opinions and beliefs.

The one thing that has always puzzled me is, why do the McCann's say that being an arguido stops them from looking for their daughter. Nobody has ever stopped them looking for her or made any attempt to do so. They have not been charged with anything as yet and are free to go anywhere they wish unless it takes over five days and then all they just have to do is inform the police as to whereabouts they are.

They do have Metodo 3 searching for her, although how a company with no history of finding missing children/people and who's only qualification as private detectives is to deal with fraud cases as the norm was ever hired to find Madeleine is beyond me!

Posted by: Vera ,Essex 13 Mar 2008 01:27:06


Hi Viv, found this posted by ferret on 3 arguidos, found it interesting from sky web site,a woman who was at resort same time as Mccanns called Vera, her views. Lizzy 23.58


Top

leigh3 said...

Ladies,
A pleasure to know you. See you next time.

P.S. Irina. Oh well, I remember those times well; we gave the benefit of the doubt; our sincerity was horribly manipulated because 'it' thought that kindness was a weakness. Ha! Kindness is a strength, as we agree on Viv's forum.

Night night, Ladies.
xo

viv said...

Irina

I read that having a parrot from a baby will be the best way to get it to talk because by the time they are about two it is an uphill battle.

But I did not get Nanday until he was two and he was practically wild. He was terrified and used to try and bite Luke and I whenever we put our hand in his cage to try and change his food.

I had to work really hard with him. It took me six months before he would allow me to stroke him through the cage. He is very frightened of human hands and obviously had a bad experience. To this day, I am the only one who can pick him up and stroke him. It has just took endless time and patience. When stroking and loving him, I speak in a low soft voice and repeat things many times. It is when they are receiving love and attention, feeling calm, they are receptive to mimicking you and learning to talk to you. You can see when a parrot is particularly animated and excited because their pupils dilate and contract, they do this deliberately. This is when you really have his attention. Keeping eye contact is important but you need to be very calm gently talking and kind, otherwise they will see the eye contact as a threat. Nanday has learned to say hello in all three voices of me, Luke and my eldest son. When offering him food we always taught him to mind his manners saying thank you. So now when he sees food he will say thank you, clearly making that association. Often when Luke was just getting up I would say where's Luke. Then Luke will appear in the room. He has learned this. When he hears Luke getting up, he will look up, listen, his eyes will sometimes flash with excitement and he says where's Luke. He often follows this with good boy, because I told him so many times he is a good boy for talking or just because he has been cute. I think people underestimate how much work a parrot is. They are so highly intelligent. In the wild they have the same mate for life. The principle human carer of a sole parrot effectively become their mate and friend. If you do not spends loads of time every day talking to them, looking at them, playing with them etc. they become lonely and depressed and will not talk. But I think just because a bird does not talk it does not mean these things. Your parrot is mimicking which is the natural thing for them to do. Nanday is so intelligent he flew off my shoulder one night in the garden. We found him on a nearby roof in the early hours. When he heard Luke and I he was making emergency siren noises to us! He also does the doorbell, the phone, other birds, next door's dog. Persevere with him, but just love him for what he is and dont hope for too much. Nanday does not speak really well like an African grey can but I adore him.

atardi said...

Hope4truth,

That's why I like to read you here. At this moment the flu is controlling here.

Of course I hope her team will win tomorrow.

You are right. It's not about England vs Portugal.It's about the whole world.

That's why I'm here too.

irina said...

Leigh3,
That is exactly - manipulated, but no more!

Good night everyone. PJ are doing their job.
Poor little Mari Luz ( hope the truth will come out).
Lucky Shannon! (Hope her close ones will appreciate it)

southerncross said...

Good night ladies,
I have been lurking tonight,enjoyed reading your posts.
Viv,I am so glad that Shannon is safe, I have my own theories about what might have happened,but I'll rather reserve my judgement re that issue. Hope you all have a lovely weekend

atardi said...

Leigh3,

Keep representing my voice.

Goodnight everyone.

It's almost 01.15 here.

Read you all tomorrow.

hope4truth said...

Atardi

Are a lot of people ill with flu? Most of us here are all over colds and flu (I hope for a while) hope you feel ok???

Good luck for the Match tomorrow are you going??? xxx

viv said...

Irina

I just remembered one more very important thing. Parrots love noise! If your home is very quiet your bird will be. If Luke and I are going out in the day and leaving him for several hours, we leave the music playing for him. Sometimes if leaving him for a shorter period we put the cartoon channel on TV because, just like a little child, he simply loves it and gets very excited!

He loves Pink Floyd and other rock music. YOu can almost guarantee when I want to listen to it, he will start whistling along first and generally parrot babbling, but then he will start talking! He simply loves it! In order to make him noisy and then start talking for my mom, she has to listen to Pink Floyd as guaranteed that will start him off!

irina said...

Viv,
My one is called Polly (though it is a boy, which we did not know as he was young).
He defends his cage (which I appreciate, as we all defend our homes). But he likes the company otherwise. He sits on my head (tried the shoulder, but did not work). He walks around the room throwing everything he finds down (so I have to pick up my pencils).
We were spending hours by his cage saying "Hello Polly" in vain. We still love him. But he fools me with his imitations of cats and dogs (we have a little zoo).
Good night Viv.
Madeleine is a great soul to keep us together.

atardi said...

Hope,

No I will not be there, I have another child who has the flu.

hope4truth said...

Atardi

Oh that is worse than having flu yourself I hope they get well soon and wish your daughter good luck from me see you tomorrow xxx

viv said...

Hiya Irina

Your parrot sounds very tame and really good fun! I read you need to be careful of a parrot that only wants to sit on your shoulder and will not perch on your hand - it means they want to control you! Nanday does have Luke under control - he will allow him to get his face right up by and kiss him, but no hands - he gets a nip. Male Amazons are renowned for being rather controlling, if you allow it. I do keep Nanday in his place and never showed any fear. If he gets territorial about his cage I always just carried on touching his things. They do need to know who is boss! However, my step father annoys me intensely with him, Nanday gets very upset by his attention and he just wont leave him alone. One can easily see Nanday simply hates him and is quite frightened of him.

leigh3 said...

OMG. That is the cutest thing: Nanday learning to speak.

I have dogs. My dear Mother classed anything else as vermin or livestock.

Yet the idea that a little wild bird can live happily in a family, and learn to speak. !!!! That is just so cute.

Night, Darlings. 100% going now. Just couldn't resist the bird stories.
xo

viv said...

Nite Leigh

He is so cute - thanks. Talking about him I thought I just had to go and fetch him, so as I type now he is helping me! I have to keep on looking at him and talking to him though otherwise he chews my ear!

Luv Viv x

So carried away talking about him I missed other posts. Will now have a read!

hope4truth said...

Viv and ayone else still up

I am off to bed cant belive it is nearly 12.30 I am not used to being up this late...

Lets hope Shannon sleeps well tonight and what ever danger she is in is sorted out and if it does not involve her Mum or real Father they get the help they need to protect her whatever changes they may need to make in her life.

Take care all see you tomorrow xxx

viv said...

Nite Atardi and Hope - sorry I have been keeping you up too late!

Yes let us hope for a really good outcome for Shannon and that problems between her and her mom can be resolved with help. Children are always better off with their real parents. If not mom, maybe she can go to dad.

Luv viv xxxxxxx

viv said...

Nite Southerncross

I think it is right that we reserve our views about Shannon and Mari Luz until we know a lot more.

Viv xx

viv said...

Lizzy thanks so much for your 23.58 copying post of Vera who was actually in PDL at the time - truly fascinating THANKS

Confirms of course McCanns did leave their kids every single night, did not bother to search for Madeleine, left everyone else to, and went off jogging and playing tennis..just an extended holiday. Disgusting!

Anonymous said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpp7uQXWPmA

Watch this video.

2345 said...

Cries For Help -

It's good to know that any problems in Shannon's household will be dealt with in her best interests, first and foremost.

Madeleine's cries for help weren't heard by her parents; the authorities acting in her best interests have suffered continual political interference.

A disturbing reminder of how the police and welfare of children does and should operate whatever the parents' status.

If cadavers and police had found the same evidence in Shannon's home and parents vehicle, they would have been arrested.

As opposed to Maddie's tragic death, everything in Shannon's case has and will be dealt with properly.

A deeply disturbing reminder of the forces at play

hope4truth said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
2345 said...

Read a bit about Shannon's family background. The relative she was found with is the brother of the mother of Shannon's mum's 22 year old partner. Presumably they're not on speaking terms.

2345 said...

Hope4truth,

My husband's laid low with a cold virus ... hope your children are soon better and you don't catch it.

2345 said...

Lizzy/Felicity,

Thanks for Vera's comments - it's refreshing to read something honest and straightforward !!

I read a while ago that Tapas group lied about time checks for fear of neglect charges on top of the cover up !

2345 said...

Interesting article from alsa's blog:

Anonymous said...
This is in Correio da Manhã and reading it is spooky!

I am sorry I cannot translate it but I am sure you can help with a good translator online.

It seems that Robert Murat has had his real state internet site invaded and unknown people have been sending suspicious emails pretending being him. The pirates also tried to get passwords from the Internet provider.

RM also found GPS stuff under two of his cars and it seems the PJ has now taken the cars to check them as PJ denies to have anything to do with the GPS stuff.

It seems to me that someone or several people are indeed trying to frame RM and I cannot believe one second PJ would ever did such a thing. PJ do not frame people.

Therefore I am astonished by the stupidity of those who could believe that framing the PJ is possible. If what Correio says is true, RM did the very right thing in handing the whole matter to the Portuguese Police. One would expect innocent people to act thus, IMHO.
What do you think about this matter?


http://www.correiomanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=281889&idselect=9&idCanal=9&p=200