26 Mar 2008




ITV cameras have followed Madeleine McCann's parents since January
Thursday March 27,2008
Have your say(7)
The parents of Madeleine McCann are taking part in an ITV documentary to mark the first anniversary of their daughter's disappearance.
Cameras have been following Kate and Gerry McCann since January for the programme, which will feature extended contributions from the couple.The one-hour ITV1 special follows Madeleine's parents as they launch a campaign to introduce a US-style Amber Alert system in Europe when a child goes missing.The couple have already been filmed at their home in Rothley, Leicestershire, and travelling to Washington in the US to pursue their campaign. Cameras will also be with the pair when they intend to highlight the issue in Brussels.The alert system would see law enforcement agencies empowered to commandeer airtime on TV and radio when a child goes missing.ITV said the McCanns hope a European-wide scheme would help other families in similar circumstances.In the documentary, the McCanns also talk about Madeleine, the night the four-year-old went missing, becoming "Arguido" suspects in Portugal and the decision to return to Britain.A statement from the broadcaster said: "ITV has commissioned Mentorn Media to make a documentary marking the first anniversary of Madeleine McCann's disappearance and focusing on the campaign to prevent others going through a similar ordeal."It said no payment has been made to Madeleine's parents for making the programme and the broadcaster will instead donate £10,000 to the Find Madeleine Fund.Madeleine went missing from her family's holiday apartment at the Ocean Club, in Praia da Luz, Portugal, on May 3.


wasting huge resources in the States and then getting locked up. I wonder do Gerry and Kate McCann wish to flag up this abuse of amber alerts when they appear in the alleged documentary for ITV?

Seems about as farcical to me as the DE just giving them half a million for libel, whilst they remain not just the prime, but now, the only suspects in Madeleine's disappearance..
Viv x

Filing False Reports

Why would you notify Police your child was abducted if you knew they weren’t? While parents or guardians are seeking any assistance they can to find their child, what could be going through these peoples minds?

In what seems to be happening with greater frequency parents are falsely reporting their children being abducted to police. The problem is they are treated as actual abductions requiring tremendous resources. They can diminish the reaction to future Amber Alerts as the public becomes more skeptical. Should states have harsher penalties for filing false missing child reports? Should abusers of the Amber Alerts systems pay for the cost associated with their activation? In most states filing a false report is a misdemeanor so the parents in effect suffer little consequences, but that depends on the circumstances..

“…Police said Monday’s Amber Alert in Alabama was a hoax.
It was originally reported that a 5-year-old boy, Geontae Glass, was abducted from the parking lot of a convenience store after his mother went inside. The boy was found dead early Tuesday morning, and his mother and her boyfriend were taken into police custody.

A Memphis mother is in trouble with the law, after police say she falsely reported her child was in her car when it was stolen.
That mother now facing possible charges of filing a false report. She is in police custody tonight along with two people who live at the apartment, who may have had a role in hiding the child.
ABC News video
A domestic dispute and a possible false report.
PEORIA, Ariz. — Peoria police said Friday they have found no evidence to support the story of a man who triggered an Amber Alert by claiming that his abusive wife had disappeared with their daughter.
Mike Tellef with Peoria Police said if detectives conclude that Frankie Abassi’s claims were bogus, he could be charged with false reporting.

Since 1999, Oklahoma has issued 13 Amber Alerts. However, four of those 13 alerts have been false reports.

Police briefly issued an Amber Alert Thursday afternoon after a woman said her 10-month-old son had been kidnapped by two female social workers, but the story turned out to be false, investigators said. Later, the woman told Long View police that her mother and sister had taken the child with her permission.

The parents reported two women pretending to work for the Department of Social services took their boy. Police said the two women were the boy’s grandmother and aunt, and that the mother knew the whole time.

The mother is Asian and the father Latino.

Police said that per cultural custom, the boy’s father owed his in-laws a dowry, or payment, for marrying their daughter and that dowry had not been paid.

In Midwest City, Ok.police issued an Amber Alert today for three children whose biological parents allegedly abducted them at gunpoint. Their foster mother, 26-year-old Carmen Hipshire called 911, on Thursday around 4:30 p.m. claiming Rhonda Anderson and Marcel Bonds, had taken the children. She left out one small detail, they had not.
After an Amber Alert was issued for Jesus “Lilliana” Vega, it appears she was “vacationing” in Mexico.

“…Eloy police spoke with Jesus “Lilliana” Vega on Wednesday afternoon by phone and she told them that she is in Colonia Guadalupe in Mexico with her boyfriend, Jose Garcia, said Amanda Villescaz, a spokeswoman for the department.

In the case of two children ages 7 and 8 years old in South Carolina they were returned safely by a family friend the day after being reported missing and an Amber Alert issued. Reddie Hopkins Ramey Sr., 54, of Columbia was believed to have known they were in the care of a family friend.

An Amber Alert was issued across North Carolina for a missing 2-year-old girl, Mariah Poland, who was inside a vehicle that apparently was stolen from a convenience store in eastern North Carolina. Amy Elizabeth Calvin, the mother of Mariah Poland, was arrested and charged with misdemeanor child abuse.

Yet another:

“…Early this morning, investigators found a Brunswick County teen who was last seen at a Winnabow convenience store Sunday, less than 12 hours after issuing an Amber Alert for her.

The Brunswick County Sheriff’s Office says officers found 15-year-old Alex Elizabeth Spriggs with her 17-year-old boyfriend Johnny Miller. Miller is charged with obstruction of justice, deliquency of a minor and marijuana possession.
Deputies say Spriggs could also face juvenile charges…”

David Williams, 22, of Philadelphia, was sentenced to three years in prison in 2003 for reporting that his 2-year-old child was inside his car when it was stolen in Pennsauken. Williams admitted he made up the story so police would look more urgently for his car.


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viv said...

Interesting article - flags up the difficulty for mothers with young children who have substance misuse problems e.g. alcohol and suffer domestic violence.

Mothers Thinking of Murder: Considerations for Prevention


Filicide with maternal suicide

Raising the issue

Filicide and the insanity defense

Recent high-profile cases, such as those of Andrea Yates and Susan Smith, have drawn national attention to the crime of maternal filicide. Yet mothers have killed their children for thousands of years. While many parents fear that strangers might kill their children, a parent is actually more likely to be the perpetrator. In the United States, from 1976 to 2004, 30% of children younger than 5 years who were murdered were killed by their mothers, and 31% were killed by their fathers.1 Having a mother kill her children while under your psychiatric care is likely to be traumatic. Furthermore, malpractice suits may result, as in the Yates case. This column will focus on the prevention of these tragedies, in addition to forensic issues.

Maternal filicide has various motives:

Altruistic filicide, in which a mother kills her child out of "love," occurs because she believes death to be in the child's best interest. Altruistic filicides can occur, for example, when a psychotic mother believes that she is saving her child from a fate worse than death or when a suicidal mother does not want to leave her child to face the uncaring world that she sees through her depressed eyes.

Acutely psychotic filicide occurs when a psychotic or delirious mother kills her child with no rational motive. For example, she may experience command hallucinations to kill.

Fatal maltreatment occurs when death is not the anticipated outcome but rather the result of cumulative child abuse, neglect, or Munchausen syndrome by proxy.

Unwanted-child filicide occurs because the mother thinks of her child as a hindrance.

Spouse-revenge filicide--the rarest--occurs when a mother kills her child specifically to emotionally wound the child's father. A classic example from mythology is Medea, who killed her children in order to seek revenge on her husband, Jason.

Neonaticide is the killing of a newborn in the first day of life.

This column will focus on filicide rather than neonaticide, since mothers who commit neonaticide usually have not come to psychiatric attention before their crimes.

Child murder by mothers is a public health concern. Psychiatrists are most likely to be able to intervene in cases associated with maternal mental illness. Mothers with altruistic or acutely psychotic motives for filicide may be depressed, psychotic, manic, or delirious. However, the majority of filicides are related to fatal maltreatment rather than maternal psychiatric illness. Some mothers with severe mental illnesses, substance use disorders, or personality disorders may abuse or neglect their children, and psychiatrists are in a unique position to inquire about child-rearing practices.

Research studies have examined different populations of filicidal mothers. General population studies indicate that mothers who committed filicide were often socially isolated full-time caregivers of lower socio-economic status who experienced substance abuse and were victims of domestic violence. Studies of women in psychiatric populations who killed their children documented high incidences of psychosis, depression, suicidality, substance use, and difficulties in their own childhood. A small New Zealand interview study found that psychotic mothers who had committed filicide often acted suddenly and without much planning, whereas depressed mothers had been contemplating killing their children for days to weeks before their crimes.

Most psychiatrists underestimate the percentage of depressed mothers with young children who experience filicidal thoughts. More than 40% of a sample of mothers with depression who had children under the age of 3 admitted to having filicidal thoughts. A study of mothers with colicky infants found that 70% experienced "explicit aggressive fantasies," and 26% admitted to filicidal thoughts during colic episodes. However, mothers are often reluctant to share these thoughts for fear that their children will be removed from the home.

Back To Top

Filicide with maternal suicide

Maternal filicide may occur in the context of maternal suicide. Five percent of mothers who kill themselves take at least 1 of their children with them into death. Sixteen percent to 29% of mothers commit suicide subsequent to filicide, and many mothers make nonfatal suicide attempts. Just as some of our medical colleagues feel discomfort inquiring about suicidal thoughts, some psychiatrists are uncomfortable asking patients about thoughts of harming their children. American Psychiatric Association guidelines for the treatment of suicidal patients suggest helpful questions to ask in assessing suicidality, which can be modified to inquire about filicide-suicide. Specifically, mothers can be asked whether their children would be able to go on without them. Mothers with suicide risk factors can be asked about their plans for their children if they were to take their own lives.

Back To Top

Raising the issue

While some psychiatrists inquire about filicidal thoughts in both psychotic mothers and suicidal mothers, others only vaguely ask about homicidal thoughts in general. One patient with postpartum psychosis came to psychiatric attention after calling the operator to ask whom she should call about having thoughts of harming her baby. Unfortunately, this mother is the exception rather than the rule. While psychotic mothers may have less forewarning about filicidal impulses, they should still be asked about hallucinations regarding their children. They can also be asked about thoughts or fears of harming their children. Threats should always be taken seriously. Mothers who express delusions regarding their children should be asked about filicidal thoughts. In our recent experience, some mothers with depression have brought up the case of Andrea Yates. Mentioning this or other similar cases can serve as a vehicle to begin the inquiry.

Detailed information about a mother's motive for her filicidal thoughts should be elicited. For example, a mother who is depressed and suicidal who speaks of removing her children from this "awful world" would be treated differently pharmacologically and psychotherapeutically than a mother who reports hearing the voice of God telling her to kill her children.

Psychiatrists have a good opportunity to inquire about child discipline and to evaluate parenting skills. Increased awareness of parenting problems could help attenuate the risk of fatal maltreatment filicide. Levels of subjective stress can also be assessed to determine whether a mentally ill mother feels overwhelmed.

Because of the potential for the loss of more than one life, a lesser threshold for hospitalization should be considered for mentally ill mothers with young children. Symptoms that may merit hospitalization include a mother's fears of harming her children, delusions regarding a child's suffering, unrealistic concerns about a child's health, and hostility toward the favorite child of a despised husband or partner. Familiarity with child abuse reporting laws in your state is necessary.

Screening postpartum women for mental illness is important in the context of filicide. It is estimated that as many as 4% of mothers with untreated postpartum psychosis will commit filicide. A prompt response from the mental health system is warranted. Although filicide victims may be of any age, the greatest risk of filicide is in the child's first year of life.

Back To Top

Filicide and the insanity defense

States employ diverse insanity statutes, with a few offering no insanity defense. The reader is referred to Noffsinger and Resnick for an in-depth discussion of insanity law and evaluations. In brief, insanity requires the element of mental illness; in addition, a defendant may need to not understand the wrongfulness of her acts or be unable to conform her actions to the law. Further consideration, applicable in some states, is the distinction between whether the mother understood the legal or moral wrongfulness. For example, while Andrea Yates was aware that the killing of her children was wrong in the eyes of the law, she believed that what she was doing was right, in order to save her children from eternal damnation in hell.

One recent study characterizing women found not guilty by reason of insanity (NGRI) for filicide in 2 states established that most mothers had previous mental health treatment. Maternal motives in the sample were predominantly altruistic or acutely psychotic. Most were experiencing auditory hallucinations, often of a commanding nature. Half were depressed. Most had experienced considerable developmental stressors themselves, such as incest or the death of their own mother. Holden and colleagues studied mothers referred for forensic evaluation after filicide, comparing those found NGRI with those adjudicated criminally responsible (CR). When compared with women found CR, mothers found NGRI were significantly more likely to have made suicide attempts and to have experienced hallucinations or delusions, while they were significantly less likely to have other children who were not victims.

In summary, the motives for maternal filicide provide a framework for understanding the phenomenon as well as considerations for prevention. No single profile of the filicidal mother exists. Each mother that the psychiatrist is concerned about merits careful evaluation. Finally, we must become more comfortable inquiring about filicidal thoughts and considering filicidal risk.

By Susan Hatters Friedman, MD and Phillip J. Resnick, MD

dylan said...

Good morning folks!

Docmac, if you are around later, check out this link: http://web.uct.ac.za/depts/geolsci/cape.htm

It's on the geology of Cape Peninsula. Although basic, it's very interesting and shows I was wrong, it IS sandstone (with a hefty underpinning of a granite) It is interesting that the peninsula is home to some of the oldest rocks in the world: the pre-cambrian slates and granite. We only have rocks that old, here in the UK in Wales (although I think they are Cambrian) and in the far north of Scotland where there are rocks attributed to the Torridonian (>850mya) and lie just North of the Moine thrust zone. This part of Scotland was accreted from having originally been a part of N America along with everything north west of Belfast Lough!
So there you go: Scots and N Irish are really American!

Changing back to topic, I just read RPs apalling post on Islam and "Machete weilding". This really is the lowest she has sunk imo. How dare she. What a bigoted, ignorant and utterly crass person!

Thanks for the article on mothers and murder, viv. Some very thought provoking stuff.

Dyl x

viv said...

I see grasping Heather Mills is not satisfied with her divorce settlement of £24M that she managed to obtain in the end representing herself.

She has indicated she is employing forensic accountants to prove Paul is worth about £800 rather than £400M. Even though requests for further information from Paul within the proceedings were refused.

Divorce settlements are based on the reasonable needs of the ex wife, the needs of the child, the duration of the marriage and the wife's contribution to that marriage.

So, if it was Paul's former wife, Linda, finding out how much he was truly worth would make a difference because wives who have a very lengthy marriage under their belt and have been there supporting their husband and thereby making a contribution to all that wealth can be entitled to anything up to half his assets upon divorce. Not only that Linda was very wealthy in her own right reported to be worth approximately £150M so all in her all her contribution to the marriage was vast.

Contrast this with a woman who was earning no more than about £100,000 per year when she met Paul, a relative pauper and a marriage that only lasted four years. What did she contribute towards the marriage, precisely nothing apart from their little girl. She moved into a life of fabulous wealth and unimaginable wealth. Now divorced, she expects to continue in that. She says she cannot possibly keep their little girl on a mere £35,000 per annum, with £24M in the bank does she really need to?

Apparently, her motivation is to embarass Paul into giving her a greater annual allowance for their daughter. Paul has been kind and generous to them both and would no doubt do this anyway. She is not acting on good legal principle and as a lawyer has reported in the Daily Mail probably will not even get the right to appeal against the High Court decision. What she is doing is frittering the money she has in hate and bitterness, even though the settlement has still left her in the super-rich bracket. A long way from where she was before she met the unfortunate Mr McCartney, how he must rue the day meeting with this bitter and grasping woman.

viv said...

Hiya Dillie

Thanks for the interesting points on geography on geology!

I agree re the racist bigotry which is simply horrible. I read on their site, last night, that they believe racism is simply to do with skin colour! Maybe they should consider the word itself..this post displays deep insult directly a very polite Muslem and hatred of Muslims generally, one of the most serious examples of racist prejudice. For this reason I have often considered whether the motivation behind some of these people, given the repeated racist insults to Portuguese also, is actually a racist agenda, for example supporters of the BNP who have latched on to this case because they can generally promote their vile agenda, to actively promote hatred and fear of other races, cultures and religions.

I though the article about fillicide was very interesting and pertinent.

Great to hear from you darling.

Viv x

docmac said...

Mari Luz news:

A man, who was arrested in Spain yesterday is reported to have confessed to his involvement in the death of Mari Luz Cortés, the five year old girl who vanished in Huelva on January 13. The man, named by the victim’s father Juan José, as Santiago, lived locally in the same Torrejón district of the city, but has recently moved to Cuenca with his wife to avoid reprisals.

The suspect, who has a previous criminal record for child sexual abuse, was arrested with his wife in a village in Cuenca province.

Read you tonight. Thanks for link, Dyl. I did geography at school, but geology is not a strong point.

viv said...

Hiya Doc

I hope that news is correct re Mari Luz and he really is the killer but it seems strange, the report Mari was not sexually abused.

Let us hope they have the right man for the benefit of the parents who always feel a lot better when the killer is brought to justice.

Thanks so much for that

Viv x

LittleGreyCell said...

Hello Viv and everyone,

Do you have a link to RP's site? I take it we're not talking about ST's site here, but the one which was supposed to be secret?

I'm sure you're right about those with racist agendas latching onto the Pros. It's like football matches, where much of the violence comes from rent-a-mob. What do these people think life is about??

Oh, might have an interesting picture to send to your Pets page later (need my son to sort out the technology in case I press the ejector seat button!). Will keep you informed...



viv said...

Hiya LGC

Link to the Apologists, to put it rather blandly:


Currently they are refining the art of defining the parents as the victim, no mention of Madeleine and laying the blame firmly on Portugal. Oh why did they not ask for help from British Police they complain. Excuse me? Did they forget Senior British Police officers were immediately despatched to Portugal. Did they forget about Eddie and Keela and Det Super Prior etc..How convenient. I have never seen such utterly perverse prose.

Good analogy with the football thugs who are not interested at all in football, just organised violence. Again, it can make one ashamed to be British..

Look forward to your pets pic but I hope the Pros do not suggest it needs a brick, as they did with my lovely little parrot - JaneGT with others cheerily joining in. Organised thuggery indeed.

Viv x

viv said...


Forgot to mention they are also linking the hopeless conduct of the Portuguese and Indian authorities in Goa. You know if it was not for the authorities both these children would still be alive, apparently.

Seems to me parents who just like to clear off and leave their children should learn to take the blame on the chin!

Wizard said...

Daily Mail 13:02 today

'Spanish paedophile' arrested for murder of girl may be quizzed over Madeleine
Last updated at 13:02pm on 26th March 2008
Kate and Gerry McCann have demanded Portuguese police find out where a Spanish paedophile arrested yesterday was on the day their daughter Madeleine disappeared.
The 52-year-old convicted paedophile was arrested late yesterday on suspicion of killing Mari Luz Cortes, the five-year-old whose disappearance was initially linked to Madeleine's.
The McCanns printed thousands of posters with pictures of their daughter and Mari Luz on them in a bid to solve the two cases.
Don't forget us: One of the posters handed out during the search for the two missing girls
The Spanish child's body was found floating in an estuary in Huelva near the Portuguese border on March 7 shortly after the posters went up around Spain.
The man being quizzed by Spanish police is reported to have convictions for child abuse and indecent assault on minors, and is already said to have confessed to Mari Luz's murder.
Clarence Mitchell, spokesman for the McCanns, said today: "We hope the Portuguese police will be liaising with the Spanish police to establish this man's movements around the time Madeleine disappeared.
"We have no indication there is a direct link between the two cases.
"But given the proximity of the places Madeleine and Mari Luz disappeared from and the similarity in their ages, we believe it's important the Portuguese police make absolutely sure there's no connection now there's been an arrest."
Madeleine, four, vanished on May 3 as Gerry and Kate, both 39, ate tapas in a nearby bar in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz.
Mari Luz disappeared from her home town of Huelva, a 90-minute drive away, on January 13 as she went to buy sweets.
A post-mortem carried out after her body was discovered showed she had been suffocated. Her parents subsequently ordered a second post-mortem whose results have not been made public.
Spanish TV station Telecinco today named the man arrested on suspicion of her murder as Santiago del Valle Garcia. Police have not confirmed the name.
His sister, named unofficially as Rosa, and his wife, named unofficially as Isabel, were also arrested - although one of the women is thought to have been released early this morning.
All three were detained in a rented house in Cuenca, an hour and a half's drive south of Madrid.
The arrested man is a former neighbour of Mari Luz's family and lived less than 100 yards from her parents Juan Jose and Irene on the route the youngster would have taken as she returned from a local sweet shop.
He had already been quizzed by police before his arrest yesterday after arousing the suspicion of locals by leaving Huelva with his wife the day after Mari Luz disappeared.
Police are also reported to be quizzing him over a plot to kidnap a schoolgirl in Seville and a friendship he struck up with a 12-year-old girl over the Internet after allegedly fooling her into believing he was a youngster of the same age.
Speaking shortly after the arrest, Mari Luz's dad said: "This comes as no surprise to me. We know it's him."

LittleGreyCell said...

Thanks, Viv!

I'd love to know whether Team McCann really believe the Tapas Lot don't have a case to answer. I think CM is a game-player, and likes the confrontation and challenge - not to mention the worldwide fame this case has brought him. He thinks he's a bit smooth, doesn't he?!!

But I'm more interested in people like Rosiepops, who is obviously a close relative. Has she really not had any long dark nights of the soul where she's questioned Kate and Gerry's version of events? Can she truly believe that Madeleine was abducted, period?

Is it denial, arrogance, panic, over-developed family loyalty, shame? What can they not see that most of the rest of the population can see so clearly and question?
What is missing in their make-up that they don't recognize behaviour SO at variance with the common reactions of all 'normal' people ?

I was listening to something on Woman's Hour the other day about lowering cholesterol. The doc was saying that the things he was suggesting - cutting down on various foodstuffs - had a tiny effect on their own, but when you combined all the things together, they had an enormous effect.

I feel the same with the McCanns. I've had enough of people saying that each of us reacts to things in different ways; yes we do, within limits!

But if you put all the odd discrepancies and strange behaviour in the aftermath of Madeleine's disappearance together, they give you an extremely uncomfortable feeling.

There are far too many idiosyncratic reactions to be true, in my opinion.

It's the big picture, I think, not random pieces of the jigsaw, that ultimately gives it away.

By-the-way, I was out of the country at the time of the Poll Tax Riots, but I know that the major damage - shop windows being smashed and so on - was done not by the majority of the angry, but peaceful, protestors, but by rent-a-mob gits.

Don't worry about my 'pet', Viv (he'll go beserk when he reads I've called him that); he's quite au fait with the tactics of the Pros.

(Don't think JaneGT could have been a Brownie, somehow. Well, I don't remember a Special Brew or Bomb-Making badge in MY pack...)


viv said...

Hi Wizard

This does sound like a typical case of a local man seising his opportunity. It is very sad for her poor parents and must have been terribly frustrating for them if they knew this all along.

I suppose also, typically, Clarence Mitchell vaguely attempts to suggest a link. I am sure this will be quickly dispelled but thank goodness the Spanish authorities have apprehended this very dangerous man before he can strike again.

Viv x

Wizard said...

Hi Viv,
Thank you for the interesting article “Mothers Thinking of Murder.” I think reading through this article (imo) Kate might fall into one of those categories.

Exploring mitigating circumstance in this case, I’ve always thought she might have been depressed on have a bipolar disorder and the holiday again imo would have cause further stress. One hyper active child and twins under the age of 2 of two to deal with, whilst husband sits round the pool chatting or playing tennis. Enough to make most women feel irritable add to this a desire to mix with other members of your holiday party but feel held back by the duties of child care. Most people would grit there teeth and get on with it but in others this could have turned into an explosive mix.

Just theorising but possible I think.

viv said...

Hiya LGC

I do not believe that any reasonably intelligent person, without mental health problems, and with normal levels of human empathy could possibly believe the McCanns had no involvement in their child's disappearance.

I have always been a big picture person, that is exactly how my supervisor described me when working as a Probation Officer. It is the totality of the picture that we see that says, hang on a minute there is something decidedly wrong and moreover overtly money oriented and dishonest about this couple.

Many, many times, I have noted RP write things that he/she knows for a fact are simply not true and are deliberately misleading. Clearly hoping the reader will not be well versed enough to know any better. I think RP's fury is directed to those of us who so clearly demonstrate that we do.

For example a few nights back RP posted they were "charged" purely because the law was about to change and Mr Ribeiro admitted they were "charged hastily". This person is more than bright enough to know, of course, the McCanns have not been charged. What Mr Ribeiro actually said was their may have been haste in making them arguidos and that it may have been better to leave it until further on in the investigation given all the furore and media circus it caused. Clearly meaning something very different indeed to what RP was intending to suggest i.e. that they were actually charged on the basis of no evidence because the law allowed them to do that. Of course it does not which is why they still have not been charged. Making the McCanns arguidos actually ensured they had their right to a lawyer and right to remain silent protected. Now just how much would we have heard from RP about how wicked the Portuguese Police if they had not done so! Mind you they are far too smart to make a serious error like that and give the McCanns the chance to say their human rights were infringed...

Jane Gin and Tonic ummm what can you say, raving drunk on Christmas Day making an exhibition of herself on the Daily Express. To think I actually felt sorry for her, then..

Anonymous said...

Great posts as usual,
Viv and all.

Anonymous said...

Sorry I am not posting much.
On holiday right now in lovely Spain.

viv said...

Hiya Stormbreaker

Great to hear from you and that currently, it does not rain in Spain, as it is doing here:-)

Hi Wizard

I did think the article was very important for a number of reasons.

Firstly it flags up just how relatively common it is for depressed mums to kill their children under 5. I was quite staggered that actually the thought had crossed the mind of 40% of depressed moms.

I also thought it was very relevant the high correlation with substannce misuse and domestic violence. As you say, we have a very clear picture of Gerry swanning around being selfish and Kate left to cope with three children that would be an immense strain on any woman, particularly a fairly old mum like Kate, approaching 40. We have heard reports of how her hyperactive children exhausted her and one can imagine how resentful she may have felt when supposed to be having a break. Having said that, getting a break from the kids was all this couple actually seemed to be doing, dumping them day and night. As we both know, alcohol is the worse thing you can turn to when feeling depressed and due to its disinhibitory effect can lead to violence. I cannot remember the figures for UK but it is something like 40% of all crime is linked to alcohol and for violent crime I think it is about 80%.

Then there was the high incidence of mothers who kill where the baby was collicky. It is alarming really that Kate gave an interview where she stated Maddie used to cry for 18 hours a day due to colic and that she used to shriek for attention etc. It was almost like she was trying to justify it to herself.

I also thought some of Kate's mums comments about her have been alarming, suggesting pscyhosis. Particularly, I said to Kate do the twins come to you in the night...no Madeleine does. Very worrying. Bipolar can cause psychosis and I can clearly see where you are coming from. She does seem to have mood swings as well that can include being very loud and angry.

Overall, I think this article does sum up the situation that we are probably looking at here which entirely fits with the police case we know about. They place a lot of significance on her diary giving her state of mind and they want to interview the psychologist that worked with her and also Justine McGuiness. I do not think their initial view of who was responsible has changed, but that does not excuse Gerry McCann in the slightest. He has not made this better for his wife, he has made it a heck of a lot worse and for himself also.

Viv x

Dogmad said...

Hello Viv
I have just read your reply to Stormbreaker and I just wanted to say that there is a small part of me that sympathises with Kate. It certainly appears that she was very much left "holding the babies" and we have seen from their various interviews that he seems, IMHO, to be quite controlling. I do not think much of the McCann's but as a mother I do feel for Kate having lost a child, in whatever circumstances. Nothing will ever be the same for them again.

I keep wondering why on earth they didn't leave the children with Mrs Healy - hindsight is a very great thing.

viv said...

In the transcript below Russell Yates demonstrates nothing but compassion for his wife in spite of the loss of all his children, referring to how ill she was with depression and psychosis. He has to be greatly admired for his understanding, as he explained, Andrea was a kind and loving mom, often appearing completely normal and had demonstrated no propensity to be violent to the children, but when she drowned her children she was completely psychotic. It was a terrible tragedy that she must now spend 40 years in jail for. An extremely harsh penalty in all the circumstances, but this is Texas, US!


Russell Yates is our special guest for the hour tonight. He's the husband of convicted murder Andrea Yates, the father of the five children that she drowned. Earlier today in Houston she was formally sentenced to life in prison for the murder of three of those five children. She'll be eligible for parole in 40 years

viv said...

Hiya Dogmad

I had already posted the link above before seeing your post but in a way it does kind of answer it.

I have always felt extreme sympathy for Kate McCann. I do feel Gerry is a controlling and violent husband and I think she has suffered a lot and continues to do so.

Like you I have also said if only they had left those children at home with Nan Healy. They would never have been left, I am sure they would have been nurtured and cuddled and utterly safe and Kate could have had the break she obviously needed. A terrible tragedy could have been avoided.

Viv x

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

I have e mailed you...

Just reading back xxx

viv said...

Could not resist posting this..Supetroll is having nightmares about us, not that she admits to being insane of course, just a little obsessed with what she considers to be "vile" people on "vile blogs" which she then proceeds to advertise, due to her fascination, she wants her audience to share it with her.. Sassy thinks it is "dead" funny..ummm, what a perverse sense of "humour".

Take a trip on the seriously dark side of a psychotic mind:- (you dont have to, just dont read it, if it bothers you)

Viv x

Dreams and visions

There was a lot of talk in the blogs last night about posters having dreams and prophetic visions.
Viv as usual with no trace of irony went to describe some dreams of her own, and then stated that people who have such visions suffer from mental illness. Some posters in the vile blog then went on to describe their own dreams.

While not stating that I am mentally ill, I must admit that some of the posters in the vile blogs drive me mad... This and their insane postings have led me to have visions* about them and the lives they may lead....

I have a vision of her in a dark room, sitting in front to a computer talking to herself aloud, using different voices. These voices correspond to whichever identity she is using to post bile about the McCann family on the internet. Her pet parrot is feeling pretty annoyed about this as he cannot keep up with all the voices. The rest of the family are now used to this, but have learnt to keep out of the way when it is Plainwater's turn to come out, or when Rosiepops has posted a few home truths...

I see her spending much time in the library reading old Victorian books and British Empire stories. This accounts for her bizarre style of writing, and for her constant use of the extremely annoying phrase 'slowly slowly, catchy monkey', which originates from the days of British Colonialism.

I have visions of him wherever he is(wherever Africa is) swearing loudly every time someone posts asking him for medical advice. In this vision he types the symptoms into google and wrongdiagnosis.com, while wishing he had claimed to be something else, like a premiership football player or a rugby player. It is so much easier to answer sport questions and it doesn't take as long to come up with an answer. Something those nasty pro's always pick on...

Notdoc again, swearing and throwing thing across the room when one of those evil pro's questions some of his claims (triplets, grandma....) after having extensively checked them out and found...nothing to substantiate them. This makes him very angry because it means he has to bring Southerncross out again and chat away to her in Afrikaans AGAIN, and discuss South African life in general...South African food...South African places, customs...Not realising that two south africans having a real conversation would probably not go on so much about all things South African.

In my vision she is at home watching the Teletubbies in the morning, followed by the Tweenies, Fimbles, etc. She find these programmes extremely funny, and they give her all the inspiration she needs when she later goes and posts all those witty and funny comments on vile unfunny blogs which involve discussing sick theories over a missing little girl.

In this vision she also watches the Teletubbies. Dipsy is her favourite.
She seems very concerned over an 'escape goat' in Dewsbury. She would like to help the authorities find this goat, but she cannot locate Dewsbury anywhere in the whole of Portugal.

I have a strong vision of her dressed up in a full SOCO suit, watching over and over again an old Jane Hill report regarding the McCann's. She now knows all the words by heart.
Training to become a forensic scientist, she also taken to watching episodes of Quincy every day. I also see her in her local Sainsbury's, solving a case involving a spillage of brown sauce,...stating that 'the fine spray of brown liquid is commensurate with a certain type of broken HP sauce bottle and the fluid, indicative of a broken neck or fractured glass. Well done!!

This dream is very disturbing indeed. Somewhere in Portugal, nowhere near PDL. PJ agents are called to attend what seems like a domestic dispute. Neighbours report hearing a female screaming 'I hate you Marla', 'look at what you have done to me!', 'what are they all going to be thinking now?'. The yelling is followed by the sound of crockery being broken.
When the officers enter the house, they find only Alsabella, who immediately falls on her knees and starts to thank them for all their wonderful work regarding the McCann case. The bemused officers can't make any sense of her and there is no sign of Marla anywhere. A missing person's report is filed and the PJ are now very concerned over the fate of Marla and may borrow cadaver dogs Eddie and Keela again, to see if they can find any new clues to this mystery.

In my vision I see her skiing in the Turkish mountain resort of Alanya.

In my vision she goes to her local shop and when the cashier mistakenly gives her the wrong change, Claudia calls her a child neglecter. As she walks home, a man pushes past her...she calls him a child neglecter...A car doesn't stop for her in a zebra crossing...Child neglecter! she screams...and so on...and on...

(*These accounts are transcribed directly from dreams and visions, and do not imply that the characters mentioned are actually carrying out these activities or that these events have indeed ocurred)


Posted by supertroll at 00:07
Sass said...
Hiya Supertroll

Cracked up laughing at that little lot!

You are going to get so much flak for that (from a whole bunch of people who "never come here"), but I thought it was dead funny, especially the ones about Leigh, Notdoc and Clawdia.


26 March 2008 12:31
The author of the vile blog...

Is in love with the wizard of Oz (not doc)
The vile blogs...

Make me as sick as a parrot

Auntie Viv's blog:

Another vile blog run by a not very nice Portuguese woman:

How dare they run such blogs in Madeleine McCann's name?

The author of this blog wants to make clear that she is in no way associated with the vile blogs or shares the views of those who post there regularly.

Should court action be taken against the vile blogs for libel and defamation against the McCanns?
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viv said...

Hiya Hope

I Hope it will come as a relief Supertroll is not having dreams and premonitions about you:-)

Will check my mail.

Did I send you a blank email last night because although I typed a lot the copy of it was blank!
Luv Viv x

viv said...

Hiya Hope

They were both quite lengthy emails the second one an attempt to try again. Something weird going on there. Will email later from a different address but going out to eat now, need to jump in shower quick.


Viv x

hope4truth said...


Yes nothing in them I thought you were not talking to me LOL...

What a strange post I must admit I dont really think anything about them at all really just used to imagine them when we were on the DX chatting on hotmail to decide how they were going to put the next victim in their place...


hope4truth said...

See you later Viv I am at work and as I have taken the rest of the week off had better look like I care xxx

dylan said...

Hi viv, thanks. I can't stay long again, but I see what you mean about rosiestrops thinks racism is about skin colour. It has far more to do with acceptance of other people, in that "race" is ethics, morals, customs, ethos and philosophy. To embrace other races, is to embrace these and to accept that, even though these factors differ between us, they are non-the-less just as human and just as worthy of acceptance. I myself thank whichever god is "up there" for giving us such diversity and for bringing the world so much closer to our doorsteps so that we can have the chance to get to know different cultures. How awful would it be if we all thought, felt and spoke exactly the same as the great Queen Rosie??!!

Docmac - you are a doctor. I would be more than a tad annoyed if you were an expert geologist as well - lololol! You can't have it all you know! (even if you do google your remedies ;-) )

Hope, looking forward to you having the rest of the week off so we can have a chat! Don't work too hard!

Dillie, slightly less fluffy today, dog xxxxx

lizzy said...

Hi Viv,
I can't believe the mentality of the Pro's , I used to think one or two were unbalanced but after reading their blog and the comments from ST you posted they are clearly a bunch of nutters...I find it hard to know why anybody would want to engage with these people, they are nasty bits of work also, i'm just glad the Express was closed down and they are only posting the occasional bit of madness on your site which is easy to ignore as they generally post as Anon...Lizzy.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
hope4truth said...


Not a problem George was worth it x

leigh3 said...

Dear Viv,

More fascinating information from you, as always. Very thought provoking. Thank you. Is this the way of the world weird web in the future? I hope so. The free flow of information between individuals, States, continents; some insightful souls ignite further inquiry. It's inspiring, I think for all of us who seek truth, break free from the rigid, self serving world of Politics or petty ego.

Supertroll: you are very interesting to someone like me. I never meet people like you or the McCanns, and their apologists. My people are sincere, and admit when they are wrong; give credit where credit is due; have utmost respect for sincerity, whether we agree with it or not.

I do respect you Supertroll, although you annoy me sometimes when you fall below your aims, e.g. use trite rhetoric instead of trust your instinct; speak plainly, and allow others to speak plainly, and respect their right to agree or disagree with you.

BTW: I have spent much time with books, and libraries. Your dream is correct there, but your judgement is wrong. I am a radical, not a sophist, not a cosy no brainer. Beyond that: words are cheap; actions speak louder than words.

Nothing you or I say will make any difference. What we do will make a difference. Mind how you go, Supertroll, and so will I.

LittleGreyCell said...

Hello Viv,

Just sent you an email (at 19.45)...



Anonymous said...

Hi, here's an interesting video interview, cautious. Interviewer cautious too.

leigh3 said...


Will take look, with caution :-)

Supertroll: take a look at the four pictures below Viv's headline 'Great News for Murat'. I see in their four faces, from left to right: smug, psychotic, stupid, cynical.

What do you see? Just curious.

leigh3 said...

Oops, Supertroll.

Maybe I should have said each word applies to each picture, just to be crystal clear about this.

Left to right: the blond is smug; the brunette is psychotic; the dark haired woman is stupid; the man is oh so very cynical. Cynics are the worst, imo.

Just curious.

viv said...

Check out the Pet's page, there is a new addition OPUS, ~The Penguin, pic sent in by his Proud Owner, Littlgreycell - He has promised to behave and get on nicely with Nanday, my Amazon parrot, we dont want feathers flying everywhere:-) http://justiceformaddie.blogspot.com/2008/03/pets-page.html

Dillie, I hope they look in and have a read of your post - it could be diversity awareness night for them:-)

Lizzy - bunch of nutters truly, that, on any level, it is clearly impossible to engage with. Supertroll knows she is barred from this site, but still posts, even though she knows the inevitable will happen..

Hope, if I did not like you so much I would not have allowed you a little turn with George. I am very big hearted, but there again he is so gorgeous it would seem a shame not to share nicely:-)

Hiya Leigh

I think bit by bit we do learn more about this case, and our confidence that justice will be done has been restored. The internet is such a vast place for sharing and learning, I dont know how we ever managed without it:-)

We have been able to provide an alternative to all the spin in this case with forums such as this where many people can gather and give a more informed and accurate assessment and opinion that we could ever hope for from the traditional press, fed by an ex government spin doctor. Our chance to have our say, is truly enhanced by the weird wide web, even if we do meet all sorts in the process.

I think it is a pity Supertroll cannot learn to focus on the real issues in this case instead of individual posters, we are part of the debate, not the subject of it. When behaviour on behalf of the McCanns is so bizarre however, it quite naturally becomes part of the debate and I think it is reasonable to question the motivation of such people.

LGC Have answered your email and he looks real cute on Pet's Corner with his new friends, dont you think?


Going to get a cup of tea and will then have a look at your vid. Cheers

Viv x

leigh3 said...

Night night Viv.

As you say: we are not the debate, we are all just part of the debate...

The debate about what we want the 21st Century to be.


Niki said...

Hello everyone, hope you are all well:)

Thank you Viv for interesting articles as always!


I have this regular "roundtrip" for news, and today at the "findmadeleine" site I stopped for a moment longer than usual... Maybe you all have read it and even discussed it here, then I apologice, if not, heres a link to what Kate sais on that site:


I felt sooo sad reading that page... There is no way a mother who genuinely belives her daughter is kept by pedophiles could have written that!

And I got SOOOO angry reading this, quoted from Kate telling about Ambert Alert

"Needless to say, the Americans have a great deal of experience and knowledge to offer, and we need to learn from them if we wish to make Europe and the rest of the world a safer place for our children."

So we are going to make Europe and the rest of the world a SAFER place for our children, with being able to find them when we have neglected them and they go missing!!!!!:(:(:(


viv said...

Nite Nite

Yes a less Dickensian attitude towards the rights of children viz a viz their parents would be a great step forward.

I think we have an awful long way to go, judging by attitudes I have read today, where little Madeleine does not get a mention, her parents are the victims, apparently..

Weird indeed.

Viv xxxx

viv said...

By the way Leigh

Your assessment of the pic of the TAPAS 4

Fiona - Smug (arrogant and superior)
Jane - Psychotic (scheming at a low level and under direction)
Rachel - stupid (led, rather than a leader and decidely unnerved)
O'Brien - cynical - the most dangerous

A good assessment IMO just added a few further thoughts in brackets on amplifying really, OB, needs no amplification..on a par with Clarence Mitchell and Gerry McCann but taking it harder now, I think.

lizzy said...

Hi Viv,
Rosi/gerri/pops has just been on Alsabella's site threatening a few posters with the libel courts, he is clearly revelling in the win from the Express, or should I say settlement.Amazing what a bullying arrogant poster Rpops is..quite odd the way they can't help themseves coming on your blog and Alsabella's yet nobody from here would want to post on their site.Hope you are well by the way Viv, was reading one night you had high blood pressure? My mum has this and swears by her low fat high fibre diet, wiith a cod liver oil capsule and garlic tablet taken daily in addition to her usual medication, she was advised re the garlic tablet from my brothers doctor friend, its good for the heart evidently..hope you don't mind me discussing health matters, just thought you might be interested. Lizzy

leigh3 said...

Dear, dear Niki.

All credit to you for looking at the McCann side in all your deep, heartfelt desire to know.

I have no desire to know them. Trust your instincts when you read their shallow words; trust your deep felt feelings, and thoughts, I think.

Dear hearts are most offended by the liars and superficial sorts who prey on kindness in order to conceal their cynicism, in my view.

Niki, trust what you feel and know; stay away from harlots, charlatans, cynics. They will only disappoint and upset you, I think.

Actions speak louder than words. That is how truth speaks. That is what liars fear.

I could be wrong in that. Hey! So sue me, Clarry :-)

God bless you, Niki, for your kind heart. Best leave the cynical fight to others, imo. Yet I hope you speak out for your values, your honesty. The Greek way is a good way, I think. If it wasn't the world weird web, I'd say more :-)

leigh3 said...

Dear Viv,

We agree on the four pictures and the four personality types.

Your amplification is appreciated.

Now, what's to be done about Alsabella under seige again? Portugal is suffering most from UK petty politics and petty vanity, imo.

Once more into the breach?

hope4truth said...

Hi Viv

Thanks for being so understanding about George but I know my place and will now stick with Angel...

Best stick with Angel as my Husband and I have the rest of the week off together so being a wonderful wife I asked what he would like for Dinner and his reply was a take away indian for 2 and he has taken it to his friends house to watch the footie?!?!?

When I say he has taken it I have taken him and it and will be going back to get him later... Dont think I am in for a romantic time as thre are not enough mints in the world to mask the smell...

Never mind there is allways tomorrow (or Angel) LOL x

viv said...


Thanks very much for the interview with John McCann commenting on the half a million the McCanns managed to extract out of the Daily Express.

Two things that really stood out from memory, at no stage did he protest their innocence, which was guardedly clever of him I thought but also very interesting.

Secondly, the interviewer pressed him on why legal action was not taken several months ago, "well we did not think it was appropriate at the time". No I am afraid it was not. They wanted to wait until it had gone on for several months to maximise the cash they could extract from it. Had they genuinely had any concern at all about their "reputation" which is what the law of libel is there to protect after all, they would have acted far sooner.

Finally he claimed that the rumour spreading had actually slowed down the supply of information to them in the search for Madeleine, I cannot imagine how, and that they intended to "spend the money as quickly as possible" speeding the campaign back up again. Well they had half a million left, didnt they, how does another big slice of cash change that? Ah perhaps my elderly mum provided the answer to me this evening, she said, well this means they are innocent surely..I explained but one can imagine it has had the desired effect on a large chunk of the public, I do hope they are not so gullible as to start sending more cash in brown envelopes..

Viv x

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...


Cheese. Fetch! See you at Alsabella's una momento, senor, King Rat.

viv said...

Hiya Niki

Good to hear from you again.

Thanks very much for the link to Kate's sickening comments which I have added in full below, the timing is great with my post about how parents abuse the amber alert system in the US, parents just like Kate and Gerry McCann. We have hitherto seen Kate take a completely backseat in this campaign and one wonders whether she even wrote this. Suffice to say it smacks of sheer desperation that their audacity grows ever stronger, as the PJs draw ever nearer.

As you say it is simply not an option that a mother who truly believed her little girl had been abused for almost a year by paedophiles could write this sickening stuff. I never fail to be utterly repulsed by how low these people will stoop in what they would have the public believe, rather than just admitting what we know to tbe the truth. When are they going to step back and realise, this is not a game they are playing with the police? Adopting a high risk and aggressive strategy as Gerry puts it, is far more than high risk, it is repugnant and a game they are bound to lose, one way or another, in time, they will lose. Madeleine and her memory deserve so much more than parents who just want her to thinking she is suffering unimaginable torture. They make people feel very bitter towards them.

The truth is children will always be at risk from parents like Kate and Gerry McCann who will always abuse "amber alert systems" in a desperate attempt to exonerate themselves.

Trust me Kate, we know only too well, you are not the victim, but repeatedly your husband seems to have forgotten to mention Madeleine when casting the two of you in that role, you do not belong there.

It is only since Madeleine was taken from us, that Gerry and myself have become aware of just how many children go missing each year from all around the world. The scale of the problem is huge. In fact, it is terrifying. I have asked myself many times “why did I not know about this? Am I that naïve or is it the fact that the problem itself is not well publicised for whatever reason?”

It is impossible to give a number for the amount of children that go missing but suffice to say it is hundreds of thousands. This includes ‘runaway’ children, parental/family abductions and ‘stranger’ abductions such as in Madeleine’s case. The reason for the lack of precision with regards to number of cases, appears to be that there is as yet (in the UK and many countries throughout Europe at least), no standard method for collecting, recording and categorising data. Without this, it is not possible to implement strategies to tackle the problem - recover children and reunite them with their families as soon as possible. PACT (Parents and Abducted Children Together) is one of the organisations in the UK trying to propose/request such national policies be brought in to place by the Government. Surely our children deserve this?

Madeleine’s abduction itself was quite unusual, in that it was the abduction of a ‘foreign national’. This introduced unique difficulties, not least a language barrier. Given that people and families travel quite extensively nowadays particularly within a ‘borderless’ Europe, we believe that a Europe-wide response to the problem is mandatory. I would think that not an unreasonable request of countries belonging to a ‘European Union’?

It is fair to say that the USA is probably at least 20 years ahead when it comes to dealing with the problem of missing and abducted children. NCMEC (National Center for Missing and Exploited Children) was founded in 1984 by John and Reve Walsh after they sadly experienced the frustration and lack of effective response available, when their own son, Adam, was abducted and subsequently found murdered in Florida in 1981. NCMEC now offers a vast range of invaluable resources to law enforcement agencies, helping to investigate cases of missing children and child exploitation cases as well as training and education. These resources along with the AMBER Alert system which operates in the USA (a nationwide effort between police departments and the media to blanket local airwaves immediately with information and photograghs when a child is abducted) have led to the safe recovery of many children. Needless to say, the Americans have a great deal of experience and knowledge to offer, and we need to learn from them if we wish to make Europe and the rest of the world a safer place for our children. In recent years, similar ‘Child Rescue Alert’ systems have been introduced in certain European countries- Belgium, France, UK and Greece but we have a long, long way to go.

Gerry and I have been criticised at times for publicising Madeleine’s disappearance. We did what we felt was best at that time, obviously having no experience of such ordeals. Thankfully NCMEC has assured us that this was the right thing to do. People have asked (usually in a critical manner) “why has Madeleine received such attention when there are thousands of missing children around the world?” My feeling is that the publicity surrounding Madeleine’s abduction was not inappropriate- Every child in such a situation should receive this same amount of attention, but it shouldn’t be down to the family to instigate it. The public awareness of Madeleine’s plight has at the very least, highlighted cases of other missing children and the extent of the problem as a whole, and from that we can take a small bit of comfort.

All missing children are vulnerable to exploitation including sexual exploitation, with this being the motive in many of those cases of stranger abductions where a motive can be determined. Child sexual exploitation and child pornography in particular, is sadly and shockingly extensive worldwide. It is a multi-billion dollar industry aided by the use of the Internet with the ‘thirst’ for younger victims growing. Once again, my ‘bubble’ of a life burst as I began to discover the facts relating to this now global crisis. As we travelled through Europe in an attempt to raise awareness of Madeleine’s abduction and appeal for help, we were repeatedly made aware of the unbelievable existence of such a horrifying activity and its vastness in our so called civilised and ‘child-loving’ society. How can such ‘businesses’ be condoned or tolerated by us all? What are the benefits for our children of being in a European Union where several member countries offer child pornography as a LEGAL past time? The most vulnerable members of our society are our children and they deserve better than this. Lack of sex offender registers, lack of reliable tracking systems for known offenders and no CRB check requirements , not even for those working with children are other major areas of concern within many parts of Europe. My eyes have certainly been opened to a whole new world out there – a very worrying one.

As a parent of an abducted child, I can tell you that it is the most painful and agonising experience you could ever imagine. My thoughts of the fear, confusion and loss of love and security that my precious daughter has had to endure are unbearable – crippling. And yet I am not the victim, Madeleine is. No child should EVER have to experience something so terrible.

viv said...


I can never remember a time when I have not seen eloquent and calm Alsabella deal with the likes of Rosiepops with just one manicured little finger. I would not worry at all about that:-)

Viv x

Anonymous said...

Hi Viv, I agree, the only thing that the articles slowed down was the supply of cash. But the fund didn't dry up, and with it's double-glazed backers too there was still planty. This is someone I would prefer not to play poker with!

hope4truth said...

"I have asked myself many times “why did I not know about this? Am I that naïve or is it the fact that the problem itself is not well publicised for whatever reason?”

The above quuote taken from Kate is the most astonishing thing I have read in this tragic case. Every parent knows about the danger of abduction.

My Oldest daughter is nearly 15 and even then security was in place at the Maternity unit to stop her being taken. I remeber a midwife asking if she could borrow her to show the pregnant class she was showing around at the time and my very clear NO as although she was wearing a uniform I had never seen her before and at a day old I was not handing her to a stranger. My Husband checked with the staff and she was for real and 10 minutes later her class walked through...

As a Dr Kate must be aware of the dangers of leaving children alone yet she thinks she may have been Naive???

Bloody ridiculus Madeleine was at an age whre sureley she was taught about Stranger Danger...

If she really did not know that these evil Bastards are out there then there is little hope for anyone Kate is an educated woman there are plenty of uneducated women who have children are they all blind to the reality of the world we live in?

I dont like living in a Nanny State but maybe they need to stop worrying about children getting fat and start telling people about the dangers of leaving children alone night after night...

viv said...

Hiya Hope

The indian take away sounds like a good way to relax and you could just kid yourself you even like the smell. Maybe he goes round to his mates to allow you a little free time to just what the heck you like..laze back and enjoy.

Who knows what may be in store when he comes back.

You stick to Angel then and I will stick to George...when I can fit him in, because according to the Pros I am on this board 24/7..funny I never noticed..maybe they think I have a laptop,,,nah cant be doing with that fiddly wheely thing, they gave me one of those at work and I told them to er..well never mind!


Just who is this Rosiepops character going around threatening ordinary people with libel courts. Does she not understand how Carter Ruck work? They only pick on big corporations with loads of cash, otherwise how would their fees get paid. Besides as she pointed out the McCanns are interested in millions, not a couple of quid:-) Does it think libel is a one way street, if I could be bothered I could take its house for what she has written about me. Libel is for big guns Rosie, get a life! The DE were fair game to greedy money grabbers, watching the till going clink with every article printed, I bet they sat there lapping it up!

Who would want to pop in for a chat on the House of Hell or the House for the Criminally Insane? Poor choice?

I do have high blood pressure yes unfortunately. I have put on a lot of weight, had to give up work..ankles etc and smoking, bad combination, I guess. Thanks for the health advice. I will get myself some garlic capsules to save upsetting people when I go near them. I already take aspirin which is very good and cod liver oil for arthritis etc, maybe it has a good side effect. I think I do need to cut down on fat and try to eat plenty of fibre but will certainly remember your advice and it is lovely that people are concerned rather than just taking the mick on the two horror blogs. Very sad really, no reasonable arguments as ever, just like when they were on the DE just chit chat, abuse, chit chat, abuse, poor poor Kate and Gerry, wicked wicked PJ. They never change.

Luv Viv x

lizzy said...

Hi Viv,
Glad you weren't offended by my health remarks, its just my mum had had it for years, she has had angina and high blood pressure since she was 40 and was 81 last week. She also has had very swollen ankles by evening time whihc I have tended to have lately, but for the past few years she has been so much better with the garlic tablets, sounds mad but she looks great for 81 you would not know she has quite a bit wrong with her. I gave up smoking 3 years ago next month and have put on 2 and a half stone....gone from size 10 to size 14 - 16. So really should lose the weight.Re the smoking I didn't use patches just threw them away and eat chcoolate,hence the weight...but thats the best way just throw them away and after a couple of weeks its easier....Lizzy

viv said...

Hiya Hope

It is maddening isnt it. Dumbo Dr Kate McCann would have us believe she never heard of abduction before. Oh I get it we need her to come on the TV and tell us all about it. Again shows what a responsible parent she is, she cannot educate her little kids about "stranger danger" because no one even got around to telling her. What utter OMG I nearly swore. Just how thick does this woman want to claim to be, who managed to keep going on the piss at med school but still sail through all her exams. Now you cannot have it all ways, Dr Kate!

Did she even get to hear about burglars you know, you are supposed to lock your door. Was she too naive to think, oh if I leave the door open, Maddie might be able to get out and she is only three she could drown in that pool. Words fail me.

There was no abduction Kate. Why dont you just shut up and wait for the police to arrive. No option. Stop making such a fool of yourself and pretending to be oh so thick!

Viv x

hope4truth said...

Viv He goes round to his mates house as he knows I dont like football at all and he can enjoy the match without me and the girls moaning LOL

I have just spoken to him and he is going to get a Taxi back as my friend has had to leave early and wont be here with the girls when I go and get him (so I can put my PJs on and veg)...

Think I will order a pizza with extra garlic on it then we can eat mints together late LOL

viv said...


I am delighted to hear about your mum, still alive and well at 81, same age as my dear old mum who did not give up the filthy fags until aged 70!

With your mum it just goes to show that with the right care and sensible diet you can still stick around and do OK. That is a big comfort.

Maybe one day I will have the courage to just bin the cigs like you did, I really hope so.

Luv Viv x

hope4truth said...


have you re sent the e mail yet??? I need to check it on a diffrent PC x

lizzy said...

I think that is the reason that they keep posting on here, nobody is going to go on their blogs except themselves, so they are talking to the same 3 or 4 people daily.So they come on here to disrupt and also Alsabella's blog. Pretty sad really. I was reading on the 3 arguidos earlier , on a thread re Extradition, there appears to be a conflict of opinion between a couple of posters, one seem to think if there is an EAW the courts and judges act on it, another poster was saying it is the Government, tthe Home office and they can refuse to implement it...do you know what is correct? Lizzy

viv said...

Hiya Hope

I have not got around to dealing with my emails tonight. Will do tomorrow. Tired today, I think I need an early night, got up very early.

Good of your husband to take his boring football elsewhere and leave you in charge of the remote:-)

Viv x

hope4truth said...


That is good I can sit here in front of the TV with my laptop and not move then...

Tried ordering a pizza but they are not delivering so just cracked open another Easter Egg...

Husband not daft and as I have been so nice he can repay the favor tomorrow and take me out for lunc (diet amnesty extended as I could not focus away fromt he chocolate eggs)....x

viv said...

Hiya Lizzie

It is the responsibility of the Home Office to deal with mutual legal assistance to another EU Member State. They would pass it to the relevant police force to execute the warrant. We sign treaties saying we will comply with EU law and can be heavily fined if we do not. It is no longer anything to do with the courts as in the old extradition procedure unless the person can claim exceptional hardship but it would have to be something like they are just about to have a heart attack!

Viv x

viv said...

Naughty Hope all those choc eggs - now watch it darling otherwise you will have all those nasty size 18 labels hanging in your wardrobe:-) (like me) still got the 12s 14s and 16s though as I went through the size range and even the smaller bras and pants, some day I tell myself they will fit again!

hope4truth said...


LOL it is like a never ending stack of eggs it is just not going down (I will help it)...

Never mind the waistline I am off for the next 4 days will worry about it again on Monday x

viv said...

Hiya Hope

Sounds like you keep pretty busy one way another and the two men lololol I am sure you will burn those gorgeous eggs off again, and choc is soooooo delicious. I have been pretty good this year though did not help the granddaughters anywhere near as much as kind nanny usually does:-)

hope4truth said...


I will keep being kind and help my two out I feel sick now :o(

lizzy said...

Hi Viv,
Thanks for that I thought it might be the Home Office myself but knew you would know for certain. Lizzy

viv said...

ok darlings!

Anonymous said...

On the subject of European Arrest Warrants I reproduce a news item in the (Brighton) Argus newspaper,

Ex-Guantanamo pair face extradition hearing

Spanish authorities were "deeply implicated in the ordeal" of two former Guantanamo Bay detainees whose extradition from the UK they are now seeking, a court heard.

It is "obvious injustice" and "obvious oppression" for the proceedings against Omar Deghayes, 38, from Saltdean, and Jamil el-Banna, 45, to continue, City of Westminster Magistrates' Court heard.

The pair returned to Britain last month after being released from the controversial US camp in Cuba.

But they were immediately held under European Arrest warrants alleging they were members of an al Qaida cell operating in Spain.

Senior District Judge Timothy Workman extended their bail, which includes stringent conditions such as wearing an electronic tag and obeying curfews. He ordered the men to return for a further hearing at the same court on February 14.

Edward Fitzgerald, representing the two men, said: "The Spanish authorities are deeply implicated in the ordeal of the last five years.

"They acquiesced to and facilitated their interrogation at Guantanamo and indeed participated in that interrogation process.

"They took no steps or adequate steps to say we want them for trial in Spain.

"They left them to be interrogated in Guantanamo, and now after they have been exonerated by US authorities, after English police have said they don't wish to bring any charges, the Spanish authorities are saying we want to question them on the self same charges."

He said it was "obvious injustice" and "obvious oppression" to "now extradite them for the same allegations that have been fully investigated in Guantanamo".

He said it was an "overwhelming case of abuse of power and abuse of process" as the Spanish authorities had themselves facilitated the interrogation by providing materials to the US authorities.

He added "the Spanish authorities were not at arm's length from the interrogation process.

"There is compelling evidence that they were first acquiescent in the flight over Spanish airspace" when the two men were taken from Bagram, Afghanistan to Guantanamo.

Mr Fitzgerald accused the Spanish authorities of themselves participating in the interrogation of the men at Guantanamo and said it was in the interests of justice for them to provide all documentation relevant to any information the Spanish authorities had provided to the US.

He also asked for the disclosure of information relating to their alleged flight through Spanish airspace, the alleged involvement of the Spanish authorities in the interrogation of the pair, and all documentation relevant to any extradition request which may have been made between 2002 and 2007.

David Perry, representing the Spanish authorities, said that Spain was "a trusted and valued proven partner".

He said the ability to stop the proceedings, if they were judged to be unjust or oppressive, was "simply limited to the defendant's physical and mental health".

He said: "They are not wanted for questioning. They are wanted for the accusation of belonging to a Spanish terrorist group which was the al Qaida terrorist group in Spain operating through the late 90s and into 2003."

Mr Deghayes sported just a moustache and wore an open-neck blue shirt with a black jacket.

El-Banna, a father-of-five from Dollis Hill, north west London, appeared in court with his grey beard and hair neatly trimmed, wearing a yellow shirt and brown jacket.

An earlier court hearing, on December 20, was told Spain wanted the extraditions over claims the men were part of an al Qaida cell called the Islamic Alliance.

It also heard that el-Banna was a Pakistani national who travelled to Britain on a false Kuwaiti passport before applying for asylum and being given indefinite leave to remain.

The court was told of allegations that Mr Deghayes went to Spain in 1996 and hid in the Madrid flat of a man later convicted over bombings in Casablanca.

He was also accused of associating with one of the men involved in the 2004 Madrid train bombings.

Human rights campaigner and activist Vanessa Redgrave put up half of el-Banna's £50,000 bail surety and also put £15,000 towards a surety of Deghayes', which was set at the same amount.

It seems that magistrates are involved and the request from Spain was refused.


LittleGreyCell said...


Just sent you an email. I'm so proud of little Opus, he looks just like his mother...

X :>)

viv said...


I gave as an example 'about to have a heart attack' as serious physical or mental health is normally a valid reason for seeking to oppose extradition to another member state under an EAW. Looks like that was another one, but such cases are clearly rare.

I am sure they would not be able to allege such serious oppressive conduct by Portuguese authorities. Activities in Guantanemo breached Articles 2 and 3 of the European Convention on Human Rights, the right to life and freedom from inhumane, cruel and degrading punishment. The UK clearly cannot be seen to condoning this and I am surprised at the conduct of the Spanish. We have tried to secure the release of all prisoners unlawfully held in that American hellhole.

Viv x

ultraviolet said...

Good evening viv et al. Is the 14th of April of any significance?

viv said...

Hiya Ultraviolet

It seems it is of significance to Rosiepops who apparently feels the McCanns will have their arguido status removed on that date.

The only significance it has for me is that the PJ are reported to be arriving on 7 April and plan to spend a week interviewing TAPAS - the 14th would therefore mark the end of that week. I really do not think it will have the outcome predicted by Rosiepops, more likely I feel further arguidos may be announced, unless the prosecutors decide they would be more useful as witnsses, rather than defendants.

Maybe the 14th is also significant to Murat because I am not sure but think it is around this time his status is due to be reviewed and I am in no doubt, he is no longer a suspect in any true sense of the word.

Good to hear from you again.

Viv x

hope4truth said...


Very fetching pic of Opus is he going to post one of you on there???

How are you feeling??? xxx

ultraviolet said...

I read somewhere today that 14th April would be of significance. I know already it was reported that the arguido status of the McCanns would be taken off, on or round about, April 11th.

I am curious to see whether this will be true.

viv said...

Hiya again Hope

Opus does look awfully cute doesn't he and has not given me a bit of trouble, to date with Nanday. What good birds:-)

He even shared his candy floss nicely. Nanday had not tried it before and gratefully shouted eeewhip and thanks. I normally offer him a healthy little piece of banana or apple for his special treat. He generally speaks parrot first but OPUS readily understood. They are both a little wary of Dylan but I am sure they will all settle down nicely.

LittleGreyCell said...

Hope, are you still around or buried under the remaining eggs? (If you find Opus nesting on top of them, just send him home straight away please).

I bought some maple syrup (not the posh stuff, but delicious nevertheless) and have been drinking it with grated ginger and a slice of lemon in hot water. It's fab! Seeing as I can't now drink Ovaltine (which I didn't particularly like before it was so cruelly snatched away from me), I needed something warm and comforting and this drink really does it. So many thanks! Goes very nicely with the kilos of natural sponge and wincyette (un-dyed, naturally) I get through every day in lieu of my beloved chilli and curry dishes. (It does settle your stomach - amazing).

My boys aren't really into the footie except for the major matches, but I do get to sit through Cops and their Cameras (and others of its ilk, which are mushrooming like, er, mushrooms) and also things like Pimp My Ride (!) and Scrapheap Challenge. Well, when I say sit through, it's a good opportunity to post on the blogs...

How are you? I bet you're looking forward to some days off.


hope4truth said...



Must get a pic of my dog off to you they are on another PC will have a look tomorrow (on my day off one of 2 + weekend = 4 days) bet I end up doing some work LOL xxxx

viv said...

Hiya again Ultraviolet

I would not get too carried away with Rosie's "dreams". I think it could be quite a while after this date before the McCanns are actually charged. I am not sure but I would imagine, following the interviews with the TAPAS, psychologist and Justine McGuiness the Prosecutor will report back to the investigating judge for his approval as to what they have got and consideration of appropriate charges depending of course on what they have evidence to prove beyond reasonable doubt.

dylan said...

Yay!! I made it into troll's "visions". My life is made & I no longer need to worry about where my next penny is coming from!!!!!!

Apparently, I wear hippy skirts, patchwork tops and have never seen a razor in my life. Well I did wonder why all my cat's fur fell off when she rubs against my legs! Maybe I could earn some money peeling new potatoes? I should patent my legs and insure them as one of the new wonders of the world! looool!

LGC, Opus is so cuddly. Has he had few too many tarte-de-herring lately tho? Or has he been indulging in easter goodies? I need a jogging partner & i'd love to have him accompany me if he feels up to it some day;) Mind you, he wouldn't need to jog very fast to keep up with me!

Hi Hope, Lizzie et al. I feel for you Hope. I really hate football unless it's the world cup where i can sort of see the point to it all. I tease hubby, my dad & son when they watch it over the weekend. I call it football for the sake of it (FFSI). Especially when they stage a "friendly" as if they have, somehow, been deprived of the beautiful game!

My littlest just came through and told me she gave some of her pocket money to a blind charity today, whilst she was with my mum. She's such a sweetie, cares about everyone. I am a very lucky mum as the worst thing that she does is make a mess everywhere - bless!

Does anybody know if we have anymore news yet re the PJ visit and questions? Last I read is that the date has now been put back.

Message for the girls; stop worrying about weight and size. We have our dear children and then the pounds never seem to go, whatever you do. I'd love to have an extra couple of pounds up top but it always goes on my tummy! I have given up worrying. I eat healthily (& only have lentils occassionaly, ST, and usually in a very nice home-made, trendy Italian dish) walk everywhere, cycle and generally try to enjoy what I do to keep fit. Because I don't enjoy the Gym, I don't go! Life is too short to hate trying to lose weight!

Dyl xxxx

dylan said...


Would you like one of my tie-died skirts to go with your syrup drink? Just a thought, might slip down easier than the carpet! x

ultraviolet said...

Whenever there is an international element, anything takes a very long time. It has to be established that the leggal charges are compatible with each other in the different countries. I have some experience of this from work, companies based in different countries have to comply with each others law too and contracts have to be very carefully written. I think it will be the same for any criminal charges. The PJ must work very carefully if the MCann lawyers are not to find loop holes. This is why it is taking so long, perhaps?

hope4truth said...


Will have a look for Opus but the herring has all gone so bet he has as well...

Husband back now and very happy (he is such a ray of sunshine well after a few Stella Artois)... Yes looking forward to a couple of days together the year is racing past so going to make the most of a couple of days of peace (well until 3.30 when the girls come home from school)...

I hope the maple syrup works for you it is so boring when you cant eat what you want (makes you want it more)...

We have to watch cops with cameras he loves it (must admit I cant believe the stupidity of some of the people) and I dont mean us for watching it...

I have not started the Maple syrup detox again as we have so many eggs left so maybe Monday...

Just looked at Trolls site and someone has an image of me (yay) aparently I wear a dressing gown all day eat chocolate and spend the day drifting (well they got the chocolate right)SO it is official I am Waynetta Slob (allways did love Kathy Burke and Harry Enfield) might give the drifting a go tomorrow sounds fun LOL xxx

ultraviolet said...

I have to go now as I have to get up early tomorrow morning. Goodnight.

dylan said...

Hello UV,

I have thought for some time now that silence speaks louder than words, especially wrt the PJ in recent months.The pros see it as a sign of weakness and also that the PJ are floundering. I see it as a sign of meticulous scrutiny and that they are clutching thier trump card well and truly to thier chest. That in itself must be really annoying for the media which is why they published material with increasing desperation and ultimately made a payout.
£500,000 is a drop in the ocean for the DE and they will have their day, in time. L3 puts it very well in her own way but I won't mention her quote as Troll has used it to try to intimidate her. Troll can take a run & jump tho, as L3 is by far its superior!

Dyl xx

viv said...


I am getting the healthy message from now on I will sit here with glass of maple syrup,grated ginger and a slice of lemon instead of all those cuppas. Should I put garlic in too or would that make it taste funny:-)

I will let you know in a couple of weeks if I am back in those size 12s and registering normal BP again.

Seriously though what a healthy drink, in the summer I like to add lemon balm and brew it all up in a stainless steel teapot - not aluminium of course.

My middle son turned up at my house one day some years back, went rooting through my kitchen looking for aluminium pans and then announced he was taking them outside to kill them..he always was the really scientific one:-)

LittleGreyCell said...


Oh, I'd love some tie-dye, thanks! My favourite is purple - it's got that extra zing!

I love your happy dog! Having a dog is a great way to get exercise (so I'm told). My husband has an ex-dog (that doesn't sound quite right, does it? It's still a dog, hasn't turned into a mongoose) and he has so much energy (the dog, not the husband. Well, he has his moments...) Think I'll shut up now.

It's difficult for me to get much exercise, sitting, as I do, in front of the Teletubbies all day. (Is this why the Pros all seem to be a bit La La and one of them quite seriously Dipsy? Probably best not to mention Po and Tinky Winky - that reminds me, must get to the dentist...)



hope4truth said...

Hey DIllie

You get hippy skirts and I get an old dressing gown...

Funny thing is now I have an image in my head of a dirty chewing gum grey tatty thing with bed socks I like the new me no more suits (Result)...


dylan said...

Goodnight, UV


hope4truth said...


I never thought to buy root ginger and grate it I bought Schwartz and shook it...

Never was very healthy :o(

viv said...

Dillie I was just going to talk to you and you are going!

Oh well, I will say a la Leigh:

Slowly, slowly catch monkey

Just because I love Leigh to bits, I know exactly what she means, eventually, even if we have to wait far longer than we thought we will get Justice for Little Maddie.

I will also say it for Supertroll, because it drives her even more crazy than she is anyway.

Of course the PJs are being clever, no serious litigator lets the other side know what they are up to. They can carry out their furious rants till the cows come home but we know they are dedicated and intelligent professionals scrupulously getting on with the task, a tough one, but they are doing fine and so is Det Super Prior!

Nite nite
viv x

dylan said...

Oooooh purple tie-dye! You shouldn't have said that as it's got me all excited - my favourite!!
Speaking of ex-dogs, mine will be soon, if he doesn't stop barking everytime someone drops a pin outside of my front door!

How is Opus coping with the exposure on the WWW? He is so cute. I bet he has all of the girlie penguins waddling after him? My dog quite fancies his chances too although he always did confuse himself with the old species conundrum. Hang on a minute.....sorry, just had to pull a hair out that was trailing on the floor and got stuck in the air vent in my bathroom!

Hey hope! Nice to speak to you. I hope you have the twin tubes of polos ready! Actually the dressing gown should be me. I love mine and have had it for years & dare i say, it is actually purple! Glad hubby enjoyed the footie. xxxx

hope4truth said...

Dillie, Viv, LGC and anyone else still up...

I am off to bed Polos at ready will speak to you all tomorrow (when I roll out of bed into my dressing gown and drift a bit with an easter egg in each hand)...

Have a nice day tomorrow see you later xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

Dear Waynetta,

(Second time of typing this - one of the cats decided to leap onto the keyboard to order his Whiskas and everything disappeared. Hmm).

Glad your hubby is happy. Mine's just gone to ; after all, nothing can top the first show in the new season of The Apprentice. Did you see them? Most of them don't even look bright enough to sue the Daily Express! Wonderful entertainment!

Viv: I can recommended a severe digestive disorder for losing weight...I'm doing things up now I didn't even remember having buttons. AND it saves on the shopping bill. Problem is, it's no bl**dy fun. :(

Well everyone, I'm off to my bed now - have to be up in time to catch Teeny TV in the morning...

Sleep well, folks!

X LGCBeeby

dylan said...

Viv! I was just saying nite to UV as she is going to bed. I do have to retire, myself in a mo, tho as I have a story to finish with my littlest & she is tired now. It's about a pitbull who is much loved by a boy but his abusive father dumps it on wasteland and the boy is heartbroken. It's called "dog lost". It is really for kids but the language is beautiful and i would recommend it to any adult.

I can't wait to see how it finishes & so I will away for now. Speak tomorrow. Not sure i can sleep with all of the excitement of being a "vision" though!

Goodnight all

Dillie xxxxxxx

viv said...


Very good post and could not agree more, conflict of laws and jurisdictional issues clearly has added a great deal of time and complexity into prosecuting a couple that were never going to make it easy, what with all their demands the PJ go running off to Morocco, Spain, Saudi Arabia et al ad nauseum chasing all those Maddie sightings. Did they really believe PJ were going to do as Clarence and Gerry said ummm poor deluded fools..

Ultra said:
Whenever there is an international element, anything takes a very long time. It has to be established that the leggal charges are compatible with each other in the different countries. I have some experience of this from work, companies based in different countries have to comply with each others law too and contracts have to be very carefully written. I think it will be the same for any criminal charges. The PJ must work very carefully if the MCann lawyers are not to find loop holes. This is why it is taking so long, perhaps?

viv said...

Hey Waynetta

I just have visions of you in the morning drooling over your breccy going eeny meeny miney mo and all that choc running down the side of your mouth, then wiping hands down old dressing gown as you mooch around the house making sure you did not miss any hidden eggs...loool will you have a can of special brew as well or two and a fag?

Luv Viv x

LittleGreyCell said...


To be honest, I'm getting a little worried about Opus these days - he's looking at himself in the mirror a tad too much for my liking...

I wouldn't be surprised to see him posing outside the White House before long, and queuing up to meet the Pope (does the Pope converse with Jewish penguins??).

And yes he IS getting a bit cuddly, as you've pointed out. How slowly do you jog, Dillie? About as slow as a normal waddle? Let's fix something up...

Well, time for me to waddle up the Teletubby Hill.

Sleep well! (Eh oh!)


viv said...

Dillie darling you are a vision and I am a blind old bat who cannot read the difference between uv and viv, maybe I got used to vivicity, vile et al and not sure what to look for anymore...moi?

As the Portuguese would say I think

ate amanha
(until tomorrow)
and when I get it wrong Alsabella usually comes and helps me out:-)

viv said...


Can you send me a link please for

"severe digestive disorder"

I need the evidence you see and will then put it to full forensic examination and stringent field trials on my brave little self..

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...

Night night Viv.
Have posted on Alsabella's site whilst doing other stuff because Lizzy said Alsabella was having trouble; Lizzy is usually right.

Am very ashamed that Portugal, our oldest ally, suffers because of two spoilt brat parents. Am very ashamed that three children were left alone in a foreign country because 2 spoilt brat British parents thought their dinner/drinks were more important than their children.

Shame on the UK. We have amends to make in many ways, as responsible adults. I wish every child had what we give our children.

Love is flawed, frail, but it is priceless, in my rare (!!!) humble opinon :-)
Ta for the info.


Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...


Not nice. Not right. Not what you are capable of, imo.

viv said...

Hiya Leigh

It does not really matter which blog we are on, our message opposing spin and seeking the truth for Madeleine continues.

I read you earlier on Alsabella's and also the barmy anons printing out the google rules, what a sad, boring little dictator that Supertroll is. Then Rosie too. I am almost glad Alsabella was not around to delete them immediately because some of it is genuinely funny.

On a serious note yes I have also shared that sentiment, I genuinely feel sorry for a great old ally of ours that they had to host the holiday of this bunch of child neglectors and try and clean up the terrible aftermath of it all, a missing little girl who they believe is dead. What did Portugal do to deserve the arrival of Kate, Gerry & Co. No country deserves this, least of all the abuse that has been heaped upon them by the same bunch of "parents" and their glib little fan club ever since. The whole world feels for Portugal I am sure. Thanks to the McCanns own thirst for publicity they are a truly international disgrace.

At the end of the day I do not believe our respective governments will allow these two to tarnish such a good relationship. Together we work for Justice for Little Madeleine, two united neighbours in a quest for decency and for justice for a little girl who deserved so much more than justice, but her parents denied that to her.

Nite Nite darling

Viv x

viv said...


Strange how Supertroll always brings her anon little colleague with her and then accuses US of double posting. Projection.... Supertroll, recognise your own faults and issues and deal with them, you make yourself look so silly by accusing others of what you repeatedly do yourself. Very sad.


Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...

Tis true, Viv. Diplomatic relations rise above petty domestic disputes. The long march of civilisation, however long it takes.

Night, Viv. See you next time. Sadly, there's always a next time.

Shoot me if say that again!!!
x to you and dear Luke.

ICantThinkOfAName said...

I see that the DE is publicising the forthcoming McCann TV Special. I wonder how long the associated HYS will last?

viv said...

Good Morning Ictoan

You are bright and early.

Could it be the DE are being a little cynical here?

They are clearly very well aware of general public opinion to the McCanns..I think they will allow public comments, in the hope that Rosie turns up again! but then have to pull it again. Maybe they plot just as good as the McCanns..they are old campaigners after all!

I will go and have a read.

Viv x

hope4truth said...

Morning Viv

HYS being allowed whatever next???

I wont be commenting I have nothing to say on there poor Madeleine her parents are going to Washington???? Why???? I know the US has the Amber Alert system in place I also know had they been on Holiday in the States when she went missing they would probebly be in jail for neglect now as the US is not as sympathetic to parents who neglect children and as a result they go missing.

It amazes me how they hold their heads up it is tragic for them if their child was taken (and tragic whatever happend) that night but to try and show themselves as saviours of missing children with the Amber Alert System is crass...

I dont know how I would be in their situation but bereft full of guilt and remorse would hit the mark. I would also never want to let my remaining child out of my sight (I dont know if the twins are off to the US?) but leaving them to meet the Pope (who was not going to be able to find Madeleine) was one of the many un real things they have done so far...

Well sitting around in my dressing gown all day really will save me some time. I am off out for lunch later will have to phone ahead to make sure there is no strict dress code xxx

Niki said...

Good morning/Kalimera all!

Dear Leigh, thank you for your kind words yesterday! I do try to be objective, thats why I read the find Madeleine site too. As you, I can not stand liers! I do not read RP's or ST's blogs. After reading their posts at the DE-forum, I am not impressed and I don't have the time to read everything... But I do respect "the other side" for what they are doing! They are using a lot of time seeking the truth too!(The fact that they support child-neglecters is hopefully just words, and not a real lifestyle...) I do not like though, when I see attacks on posters or blogs, eighter from the "antis" or "pros"...

"Unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other,"

Morning ICTOAN and Viv

I was reading this at sky news:

Kate And Gerry Filming TV Special
Updated:07:47, Thursday March 27, 2008

The parents of Madeleine McCann are taking part in a television documentary to mark the first anniversary of their daughter's disappearance.

Kate and Gerry McCann have spent a year in the pressCameras have been following Kate and Gerry McCann since January.

In the documentary, the couple talk at length about Madeleine, the night she went missing, becoming "arguido" suspects in Portugal and the decision to return to Britain.

The parents have received no payment for their part in the one-hour ITV1 programme, with the broadcaster instead donating £10,000 to the Find Madeleine Fund.

They are also filmed launching a campaign to introduce a US-style Amber Alert system in Europe when a child goes missing.

The alert system would allow authorities to demand airtime on TV and radio whenever a child goes missing.

Kate and Gerry have already been filmed at their home in Rothley, Leicestershire, and travelling to Washington in the US to pursue their campaign.

Madeleine went missing on May 3Cameras will also be with the pair when they intend to highlight the issue in Brussels.

Steve Anderson, executive producer for Mentorn Media who are behind the project, said: "Amid all of the controversy, what should be remembered is that a little girl is still missing and her family is trying its best to find her.

"They are determined to do whatever they can to make sure that what happened to Madeleine doesn't happen to another child.

Madeleine went missing from her family's holiday apartment at the Ocean Club, in Praia da Luz, Portugal, on May 3.


"They are determined to do whatever they can to make sure that what happened to Madeleine doesn't happen to another child."

So just what happend to Madeleine? They left her alone, to babysit her younger siblings!!!



hope4truth said...


Your last sentance ....

"So just what happend to Madeleine? They left her alone, to babysit her younger siblings!!!"

That is it the whole thing sadly if they had not done this she would not be missing (if she was taken) and if they could do this night after night what else can they forgive themselves for and make right in their minds?

Have a good day xxx

viv said...

Hiya both

Well, as Gerry predicted in June last year we get the one year anniversary special. Pass me the sick bucket!

On 3 January the Portuguese Judge ordered that the case against the McCanns continue with the rogatory letters being sent for further questioning of witnesses, seisure of evidence etc. Meanwhile from January the McCanns invite the TV cameras into their home. Their televised defence campaign continues, no matter how repugnant we may find it!

Similar article from the Daily Express but I think they know just how inflammatory the general public will find this...


ITV cameras have followed Madeleine McCann's parents since January

Thursday March 27,2008
Have your say(7)
The parents of Madeleine McCann are taking part in an ITV documentary to mark the first anniversary of their daughter's disappearance.

Cameras have been following Kate and Gerry McCann since January for the programme, which will feature extended contributions from the couple.

The one-hour ITV1 special follows Madeleine's parents as they launch a campaign to introduce a US-style Amber Alert system in Europe when a child goes missing.

The couple have already been filmed at their home in Rothley, Leicestershire, and travelling to Washington in the US to pursue their campaign. Cameras will also be with the pair when they intend to highlight the issue in Brussels.

The alert system would see law enforcement agencies empowered to commandeer airtime on TV and radio when a child goes missing.

ITV said the McCanns hope a European-wide scheme would help other families in similar circumstances.

In the documentary, the McCanns also talk about Madeleine, the night the four-year-old went missing, becoming "Arguido" suspects in Portugal and the decision to return to Britain.

A statement from the broadcaster said: "ITV has commissioned Mentorn Media to make a documentary marking the first anniversary of Madeleine McCann's disappearance and focusing on the campaign to prevent others going through a similar ordeal."

It said no payment has been made to Madeleine's parents for making the programme and the broadcaster will instead donate £10,000 to the Find Madeleine Fund.

Madeleine went missing from her family's holiday apartment at the Ocean Club, in Praia da Luz, Portugal, on May 3.

PS Hope I am still in my dressing gown too. Shame on us!

Viv x

hope4truth said...


My husband says I cant go shopping in mine and says I had to get dressed (no fair)...

The girls are at school and we are off out to go where we want to go for a few hours...

Have a nice day see you later xxx

Niki said...

Hi there Hope!

I always agreed with you when I was reading DE, and you constantly pointed out the neglect of leaving the children alone, and if it was an abduction (witch I do not belive) and Madeleine is returned to her family safe and sound, it will make us all very happy to say that we were wrong!

On another note:
Please leave some easter-eggs in the stores for all the orthodox living in UK!!!! Orthodox easter is not before end of April:):):)

Whish you a nice day too!


viv said...

Hiya Hope /Niki

I hope you both have a good day and I know it is not fair but we must get dressed and go out!

Good advice though Hope, even if the eggs are now half price in Asda try and save some for everyone else:-)

Saw your post on Trolls: titter

Luv Viv x

2345 said...


Bad examples have set a precedent for those seeking fame and fortune by claiming false abduction.

Shannon's family failed to co-operate with the police by withholding the identity and address of the Uncle.

Had they provided ALL relatives' details requested, British taxpayers would have been saved the cost of a multi million pound unnecessary search. Whilst they may be forced to give back £1,000 raised by their local church, they are not in a financial position to repay the multi million costs they themselves caused by withholding critical information for 24 days.

. in pursuit of fame and fortunte. and following; claiming false abduction

Niki said...

Hi Viv!


"Well, as Gerry predicted in June last year we get the one year anniversary special. Pass me the sick bucket!"



Better do some "body-work" to get my agression out...

See you later, and have a nice day!!:)

viv said...

Hiya 2345

That is a pretty serious charge you are levelling there - obstructing the police in that way. Currently the police are emphasising there are no further charges and her mum is not a suspect. I would take care what you say.

The person who caused this wasted search is the man who is in custody.

The people that truly have wasted inestimable millions are Kate and Gerry McCann, including the donations they received from the public. That will continue to be the focus of this blog.

I hope that you will not continue to point the finger at people who are not police suspects and feel I do need to point this out to you to protect my own position.

Viv x

Wizard said...

Good Morning All,
For those who like to read you may be interested in "Born Yesterday". Todays Guardian gives an interview and book review of this novel with strong links to the McCanns and media manipulation.

“Born Yesterday” by Gordon Burn’s

Gordon Burn's new novel blurs the boundaries between fact and fiction. Based on the events of last summer, its characters include Kate and Gerry McCann, Gordon Brown, Kate Middleton - and a news-obsessed dog-walker called Gordon Burn. He tells Esther Addley about his urge to get to the heart of the story.
Now, from reporting the news, from imagining alternative futures for those who made it, from creating characters who work within it, Burn has taken his career arc to its logical next stage. His latest book, Born Yesterday, carries the subtitle The News as a Novel, and explicitly sets out to fictionalise real events, both those familiar to consumers of Sky News and the Guardian and the Daily Express, and those personal to Burn himself. Set in the summer of 2007, it is populated by a cast of characters we know well - Kate Middleton, Clarence Mitchell, the Glasgow airport "hero" John Smeaton, Carol Thatcher, Jacqui Smith, the bereaved Iraq campaigner Reg Keys, Fiona Phillips, David Abrahams - its point being, in part, that the instant they appear in the news and take on a reported life, these people immediately become fictions.
.Burns says "The news has become a kind of super-fiction, in which one unlikely, inexplicable yarn after another - the Portugal Child, the Perugia Murder, the Deadly Teddy Bear, the Secret Donor, the Panamanian Canoeist - play out across newspaper pages."

Burn’s is a journalist turned writer and has written book on Sutcliffe, Fred & Rosemare West Myra Hindley and is a Whitebread prize winner.

viv said...

Hiya Niki

It is a cynical move by ITV, there is nothing moral about it, they just know for a fact we will all watch it and that is what gets them advertising revenue. The McCanns continue their defence campaign. Not that they are convincing anyone but the most gullible.

Have a great day

Anonymous said...

ITV have been filming M's parents since January for a One Year Anniversary. Thought their was no evidence whatsoever to indicate any harm had come to M and her parents maintain she is still alive. So why the Anniversary? Surely these parents would hope evry day their feet touch the ground is the day their child will be found. As for an Amber Alert what a joke these two are associated with it. They neglected their children and as a result their eldest is missing. Will this be highlighted in the Anniversary programme, or as usual missed out. Surely the message should be Never Ever Leave Your Children Alone To Have A Night Out. IMO. Selfish neglectful parenting is not acceptable it is morally and legally wrong. IMO.

As always Viv good articles.



viv said...

Hiya Wizard

I really like the satirical title he has chosen "Born Yesterday".

That is the problem for Kate and Gerry McCann, I think, we were not.

It sounds like a really interesting read and that this man recognised the high human interest in serious and infamous murder cases, his previous subjects including Hindley and the Wests.

We have seen some furious reactions to Portuguese novels based on the McCann's sickening campaign. I imagine they will be similarly furious about this but it does sound like a riveting good read by an author who clearly knows his subjects and their typology rather well..

Viv x

viv said...

Hiya Zodiac

That was the point of my original post to flag up the research that guilty American parents are seriously abusing the Amber Alert System on occasions even to cover the fact they murdered their child.

Somehow one can just imagine Kate and Gerry McCann will not be focussing on this aspect. It is just another of their sickening big media events, cynical, self-serving, really, really nasty.

They will get what is coming to them, in the end!

Viv x

Anonymous said...

Hi Viv,

I hope the out come is Justice will be served. IMO it is really sickening that two parents can just leave their children alone to self indulge and are able via the Media to latch onto respected causes to try and make themselves look respectable. They ruined whatever reputation they considered they had the moment they made a conscious deciscion to leave 3 little children aged 3 and under alone while they enjoyed themseleves elsewhere. Their behaviour is not acceptable and it is morally wrong that they are able to use Charities etc to try and project an image that they are responsible parents. IMO.


viv said...

Hiya Zodiac

I always think that people who are genuinely decent and caring, just are that way. They have no need to tell people they are kind, concerned adults. Actions speak far louder than words, long after the event.

When they made a conscious and calculated decision to leave their children home alone in bed every single night, they acted like the sort of parents we know them to be.

When they sought to use the fact of that neglect, even adding they left the door open to suggest Madeleine had been abducted, they acted like the sort of parents we know them to be.

When they turned Madeleine into a brand image and publicised her eye defect, against police advice..

When they chose to leave two grieving little twins to go on a self serving publicity tour..

When they turned Madeleine's birthday into a fund raising event on the beach, releasing balloons and laughing

I could go on, but it is their actions, month in month out the public will judge them on, nothing they say or do will put that right now. The more they exploit the media the worse they look. The more desperate they look to try and change our minds. Nothing and no amount of words can ever forgive the way they treated their own precious little children. We know better than that, we compare our own parenting style and the sense of genuine loss that we would have had. WE see such a huge contrast.

Viv x

viv said...


27.03.08, 10:55am

ITV should be ashamed of themselves for having two parents who left three young and vulnerable children alone as part of a programme about missing children..

If I wish for information as to how I can keep children safe, it certainly would not be from these two irresponsible people.

I wonder if they will have the guts to tell us all not to leave our children alone. I very much doubt it as they would have to admit to being in the wrong.

We should have an 'Amber Alert' in our country without involving the McCann's.

They are the last people I would want to see telling us about this subject.

I already know about 'Amber Alert' and if it is adopted in this country it should be publicised by Sara Payne and not people like the McCann's who failed their own children.

Let us have a 'Sarah or Amber Alert' for missing children all over the world by all means, just don't ruin it by making these people out to be victims of their own actions. Madeleine is the victim here, not her parents.

• Posted by: grandmavera • Report Comment
27.03.08, 10:54am

The same as paying directly to the parents ?

Why dont the programme makers donate the money to " Save the children " or " NSPCC "

So many children are suffering in the world.
Madeline is but one child and sadly she probably is not in need of money.

Children are precious.
Protect them from the evils that surround us.

• Posted by: abuela • Report Comment
27.03.08, 10:41am

Are they anticipating that by then their arguido status may be lifted so that they may speak freely...???

• Posted by: isis • Report Comment
27.03.08, 10:39am

The campaign is called don't abandone your kids to go out on the lash. Snappy eh?

• Posted by: nedd07 • Report Comment
27.03.08, 10:01am

...Lecture people on child care.
Is it not a fact that the McCanns left their 2 twins aged 2yrs old alone on the night of May 3 whilst they went out drinking in a bar ? I believe this is a fact.
Was Madeleine also in the apartment alone with them....who knows ..as I believe we only have the McCanns word on that one.
To promote the Amber Alert System would it not carry more weight and sincerity if it was promoted by parents who didnt leave thier very young children alone in the manner that the McCanns are reported to have done ?

• Posted by: Konan • Report Comment
27.03.08, 9:43am

The last couple of weeks have been great no posturing from Clarence or the parents of the 3 neglected children and no pictures of madeleine
Wasn't happy with the declarations of the DE.
Please leave this story alone until the poor child is truly found [not some fantasy of Meturdo]
We now know its a fact this child has received far more media coverage than any other missing child is ever likely to and for that I think all newspapers and all other media should be ashamed. Lets just concentrate on Saras law and if we need an amber law please let us have decent parents heading it not the type who leave their children night after night while they go boozing.

• Posted by: Beth • Report Comment
27.03.08, 9:10am


albeit rich and famous frauds off the back of their daughter.

• Posted by: GordonBennett • Report Comment
27.03.08, 8:55am

have parents of missing children been asking for an Amber Alert system to be implimented. Its not a new idea from the McCanns or Clarence Michell. Then again, this story has received more coverage then any other missing child has so maybe finally an Amber Alert system will happen.

Thinking of you Maddie.

• Posted by: V • Report Comment
27.03.08, 8:41am

Well as the 'famous duo' have succeeded in shutting down every site that have critised them and even getting paid for it, I now believe that we wil never have closure on this.
No paper will risk running articles that could show them in any light other than with a halo.
Nothing their PR guru can say and no amount of globe trotting will take away the fact that G&K alone are the only reason that Madeleine went missing !
If they have the time and money to travel the world promoting missing children - why not use some of this to return to Portugal. This is where Madeleine was last seen - wasnt she?

• Posted by: Stormin_thru • Report Comment
27.03.08, 7:56am




• Posted by: ANNR • Report Comment
27.03.08, 7:45am

They blame everyone else for this terrible incident, and many of us have tried to understand their actions and attitudes in the matter.HOWEVER is it not time for them to reappraise their own position to clear the matter up.We are no nearer finding Madeleine now than we were on the first few days of that fateful night.The McCanns appearing on T V will do nothing to clear the matter up and how can they say or do anything constructive if they are still Arguido's and should not be discussing the issue openly.The rights and wrongs of who said or did what should be cleared up once and for all and the only way to do this is to go to court in a neutral enviroment.

• Posted by: RobertG • Report Comment
27.03.08, 7:35am

It will be the n anniversary of a story blown out of proportion and exploited to the n'th degree, the story of "friends who find themselves in the centre of a story" (Clarence Mitchell's own words).

I don't know what the McCanns sued the Daily Express about and won a libel award, but I assume it was clever manipulation of the truth once again. And I note that the Daily Mail also ran afoul of this most loathsome couple. The facts speak for themselves about them, and no more so than their responsibility for the loss and possible death of their child because they chose to wine and dine in a bar and leave her in danger on the night of May 3, 2007. There is no disputing that fact. Nor the fact that the Portuguese police still suspect them of much worse.

Unfortunately you cannot always print facts even if they stare you in the face, and newspapers can unwittingly fall victim in their dedication to printing what is known and what is suspected, that's their job, and that's a fact.

I am confident of this fact: The rope of Cause and Effect is long, but it does have an end (Ralph Waldo Emerson). Some day, sooner or later, the McCanns will come to an end to their manipulation of the tragedy of May 3, 2007. Madeleine's life as she had known it ended on that night. Anniversary? They should hold a wake and be filmed doing it - and preferably not in their favorite bar.

Keep on reporting Daily Express, it is appreciated.

• Posted by: Rothaymere • Report Comment
27.03.08, 7:12am

Arranging to be filmed wherever they go but never actually going anywhere to look for their child. Always filmed planning a campaign to find Madeleine, but never quite making it. Greedily raking in money for the "Madeleine Fund' but spending it on anything and everything. Throw in a few lawsuit awards to sweeten the pot.

This couple are the biggest frauds of all time.

The ends have become the means. This is no longer about Madeleine and hasn't been for a long time.

May 3 can come and go for me, I for one will not be marking the advent of Couple McCann and the Departure of Madeleine McCann.

• Posted by: Rothaymere • Report Comment
27.03.08, 7:00am

Is it not correct that these two took substantial amounts of money from the Madeleine Fund to pay for their mortgage?
I believe the Daily Express have always behaved as they should - with absolute integrity. The media is there to report on the news as they find it and the McCanns were only too happy to be in the limelight when it suited them.

• Posted by: Grevillea • Report Comment

Anonymous said...

Hi, so ITV will not pay the parents for their role in the documentary, but will make a donation to the Fund. Well, that's ok then because the Fund can help to support their needs. It's obvious that something is influencing parts of the British Media to rashly ignore the fact that there is a criminal investigation in progress. Where is the normal prudent propriety one would expect in these circumstances? It really appears that at least in the UK, money is the be all and end all of everything rather than proper decent values. The pervasive spin has taken over.

I won't be watching the programme as I don't want to vomit.

Anonymous said...

does anyone know why we cant post on alsas site

Zodiac said...

There is a problen with Alsabella's site. No access to post on it. Are you in contact via e-mail with Alsabella?

2345 said...


It simply confirms the influence and connections running the case in opposition to the Police and hard forensic evidence.

Defence by political/media manipulation - controlling public opinion. CM has direct connections to Brown, BBC & DE - political/media network defending medical old boy network.

CM was appointed to pervert the course of justice ... fraud, corruption specialists Metado 3 have had their lucrative contract renewed.

The influences in this case from day one are at Government level.

Anonymous said...

Zodiac they think its been pulled on rosies site cos all her archives and everything have disappeared

Anonymous said...

Zodiac they think its been pulled on rosies site cos all her archives and everything have disappeared

ultraviolet said...

Is this documentary about the Poor, Poor McCanns? Or is it about their poor little DAUGHTER?

If it is the first one I will not be watching it. If it is the second one, maybe.

BTW Alsabella's blog has now no place for comments. All the earlier articles are gone too. I hope the McCann lawyers and their nasty little employees have not shut it down.

Zodiac said...

Thanks Anon,

Probably a fault. I think Viv and Alsabella can contact on another, will check back later to see if Viv has replied. I can understand if Alsabella has pulled it, yesterday was a bit like being on the DE.

Anonymous said...

zodiac, it started off a nice day today until alroy came on. Hope it hasnt gone for good.

Anonymous said...

Actually, noone thinks it's been pulled on Rosie/Tinks/Sassy/Maureen site. They think it's been moved.

Actually, it would be a shame if Arepa had caused it to be pulled. She caused chaos on the pro site and made the anti site look ridiculous.

Hi Zodiac, how you doing?

Zodiac said...


I do not think the McC's have closed it down. If anything a fault, or Alsabella has pulled it, understandably so.

The Amber Alert, how ITV can justify having parents who blatantly neglected their children, as a result of the neglect their eldest child is missing, on this programme is a disgrace.

ICantThinkOfAName said...

Have the twin causes of truth and freedom of expression suffered again?

Anonymous said...


Truth and freedom of expression on Alsabella's. Think you've got the wrong site, mate.

Zodiac said...


Hi, I am fine. Hope you are too.

Arepa did not make Alsabella's site look ridiculous. Arepa made herself look ridiculous. Her avatar was in extremely bad taste.

Take care.

ICantThinkOfAName said...

Alsabella did say when threats were made against her blog the other evening that she had a contingency plan in readiness.

Anonymous said...


I agree with you about Arepa to a certain extent, but Alsabella's blog is the only one she can actually post on. Even Viv had to have words with her.

To be fair, if the so-called pros try and post (usually a 10 second wonder as they always get deleted) the first thing people say is to insult ALL pros and their blog, whether they post or not. Following that logic, Arepa made Alsabella's blog look daft because she normally posts there.

Have a nice day Zodiac - we got on well on the DX.

ultraviolet said...

I do not think Alsabella is scared off that easily. She probably just needs a rest from aoll the nastiness yesterday. Today is maybe a day for reflection, not posting and fighting.

Especially as today, the culprit in Mari Luz story has been caught. Poor family. But now they know, they can grieve properly and start to move on.

Anonymous said...


The other blog had a far worse time of it yesterday.

Anonymous said...

Interesting article.

I wonder if the British politicians who are interfering with the case are simply trying to deal with the McCann's disaster in their own way. The McCann's published statement that Kate will no longer be practicing medicine raises questions, IMO.

Anyone else find their published statement odd?

Normally, when a professional woman makes the decision to stay home to raise children, she leaves the door open to the possibility of returning to the work force.

IMO, KM's banishment from medicine, whether it was self-imposed or otherwise, is highly suggestive that a medical disaster took place.

If I were the PJ, I would question the politicians. I think they know something.

Anonymous said...

maybe arepa was all part of their plan

Anonymous said...

Bravo Arepa,

We trolls salute you!!!
You tried it on here as Muldoon and it didn't work, but you can always try again.

One blog down, one to go...

Anonymous said...

Arepa probably was a plant. Strange how its the first time Rosis moderators let the abusive posts from areepa keep flowing. They are usually deleted asap, but no they let them come thick and fast. Wonder why. Its strange also that they have a new poster today that knows nothing about vivs and alsas blogs.

Anonymous said...

I noticed Alsa's blog has hit a glitch.

I posted information from Ironside - direct from Spanish Police in Mari Luz's highly questionable case :

"Police DO NOT BELIEVE the story of Mari Luz's abductor, he said she fell down the stairs, he panicked and threw her in the water. Police forensics say Mari Luz was held from behind and either suffocated or was strangled... ". She was NOT sexually abused.

Police stated at the time Mari was found that they did not believe she had been in water for the duration of her disappearance.
Forensics include geological soil testing due to suspicions. Metado 3 then attended reservoir activities.

Ironside has knowledge of the gypsy clan in question ... poor, rough and knife wielding. Alleged abductor lives in a shack. Had, as the parents say, they suspected him the day Mari disappeared, the clan would most definitely have dealt with him themselves ... beaten the truth out of him and disposed of him p.d.q. This clan are known for settling scores without police interference.

PJ did not believe Madeleine's parents story. Spanish Police do not believe the 'abductor' in Mari's case. Metado 3 are illegally involved in both ... on their advice Mari's parents pre-empted the need for a second autopsy prior to knowledge of Police pathologists findings in their autopsy.

Abnormal thinking immediate upon discovery. First press release - " "Correio da Manha" ascertains that they (parents) were advised to do so by the detective agency that was investigating Mari Luz's disappearance'.

Ironside has knowledge of this gypsy clan ... boys are more worthy than girls who are seen as cooks and cleaners -'gofers'.

FSS information released by Leicester Police six months ago confirmed Madeleine was NOT abducted. PJ did not believe Madeleine had been abducted as her parents said.

Spanish Police do not believe version of events in Mari Luz's disappearance.

I'm supporting Police in this case as well a PJ & Leicester Police in Madeleine's.


Metado 3 is, however, deeply involved ....

Anonymous said...

I know for a FACT that Arepa had nothing to do with Rosie's blog.

Rosie and co would have kept their blog to themselves if it had not been for one stupid rat.

Arepa was a lone player.

Don't start looking for scapegoats, Alsabella brought it all on herself for allowing Arepa's comments in her blog in the first place.

Anything goes as long as it is against the McCann's and the pros?

Think again.

isis said...

2345,there is a thread on the 3As that may be of interest to you. It is on page 2 and is called sky news blogs,the author is o0bubbleso.Have aread.

2345 said...


The only DEFINITE in this case is FSS information released by Leicester Police on 7 September.
It confirmed Madeleine was NOT abducted as her parents told the Police. She died in her parents apartment on or around 3 May.

PJ had the evidence to arrest the McCanns but political connections and Government intervention prevented it.

Every person in every Forum who supports the sterling work of PJ, Eddie, Keela & our Police is hounded and attacked.

People are at liberty to support the Police, law and order and accept fully substantiated, damning forensic evidence.

The need to infiltrate and silence Alsa's blog is for one simple reason. Police information in Mari's case is not to the McCanns' liking.

PJ did not believe the McCanns and have been proved to be correct. Mari Luz's death is being used in their own gruesome cover-up. The 'abductor' is no more than a victim of Metado 3's methods of operation on McCanns' behalf - bribery and corruption. The Police do not believe the 'story' they are being told.

I'm frankly not surprised .... the story of Mari's disappearance was written by the same author of Metado's 3's corrupt false sightings. Same format, same amateurish content.

The TRUTH in Mari's case is as feared by her parents as the TRUTH Police discovered in Madeleine's case.

Hacking into Alsa's site simply confirms the need to suppress Police findings and statements in Mari's case as well as Madeleine's. Metado 3 cannot sink any lower on their employers' behalf .... vile, evil, illegals.

Gypsies in question in Mari's case also have links to Metado 3 through drug trafficking.

Anonymous said...


For the 25th time, noone was around to delete the comments. As soon as someone turned up they started moderating comments. Not everyone has 24 hours a day free to gawp at a computer screen. This was mentioned on Alsabella's and on the other blog.

Anonymous said...

... Strange how its the first time Rosis moderators let the abusive posts from areepa keep flowing. They are usually deleted asap, but no they let them come thick and fast...

isis said...

Have i missed somthing or has alsas site done a whoosh cluck?

Anonymous said...

Had a bit of change of heart I see.
Not that long ago it was YOU who condemed Mari's parents the same as you do the McCann's.
It seems you flow with the tide.

Anonymous said...


Crash bang whallop hopefully!

isis said...

anon, not in the mood for you today thanks.

ultraviolet said...

Alsabella said she would start another blog. Maybe that is what she is doing right now. And maybe she will not permit anonymous comments on it.

2345 said...


Many thanks ... I enjoyed one of yours yesterday.

2345 said...


One thing's for sure, Alsabella will not be hounded out.

2345 said...


You sound just like the McCanns ... blaming everyone else for the mess they are in.

The TRUTH will always out - six months ago in Madeleine's - slowly but surely emerging in Mari's untimely death.

More and more material for the books .... the dafter you act the better.

Di said...

Just back in, can anyone fill me in on what has happened to Alsabella's site?

Anonymous said...


Alsabella faced with the consequences of allowing what she did on her blog has decided to cut her losses.

YOU were a great contributor to her downfall with your rubbish, libellous, amoral and disgusting posts.

Thank you.

Why are you so obssessed with gory details about missing and dead children? You seriously need help.

Please, please keep posting your crap here so that the same thing happens to this blog as well.

Anonymous said...


Where are you?
Please come and post here.

ultraviolet said...

There will always be a blog somewhere that will question the McCann version of events. If not here, then someplace else.

You may not like it but you cannot prevent it.

isis said...

Hi Di, it seem s that alsabellas site has closed down for some reason, the only tpoic left is the one posted today and there is no facility to post a comment. I really dont know what has happened. There were some really outlandish comments left there yesterday so it may have something to do with that but im omly guessing.

Zodiac said...

Anon 14.16pm,

I agree it gig start off as a nice day until that poster arrived.

Anon 14.33pm,

The published statement is rather like it was at her behest Social Services were invited for tea. IMO. Who gives up a career to sit and watch DVD's or read while her little ones play in the garden, what stay at home Mum gets time to have time to herself.

Anonymous said...


One thing is questioning the McCann version of events, which is a perfectly legitimate IMO.

Another is using the diappearance of Madeleine and death of Mari Luz to make up sick stories for entertainment purposes.

question yes, be the blog's ghoul, NO.

Zodiac said...

LOL! gig should be did.

Zodiac said...

LOL! gig should be did.

ultraviolet said...

It looks to me as if no-one is even permitted to question the McCann version now.

Anonymous said...


Question it all you like.

But don't use your doubts to persecute and hound the parents, they are innocent until proven guilty. Some do nothing else here.

Remember also that the case involves a little girl and have some decency. some here have none.

ultraviolet said...

I do not see any parents being hounded. I see the parents receiving preferential treatment and I want to know why. In any other country, the other children would have immediately been taken to an emergency childrens' center. Instead, these parents are paid half a million GBP. It is just not right and does not make sense.

Anonymous said...

Oh and BTW Ultraviolet,

You complain about no one being able to question the McCann version of events..

Some of us are not allowed to question their innocence in these blogs.

ultraviolet said...

I was not aware I made a complaint. You sound very angry. You are saying that no-one lets you state your argument? Do you not have your own blog?

Di said...


Many thanks.

I find it odd if Alsabella's site has been pulled and not the other one as well, to me that speaks volumes. I did think there was something amiss with Arepa's posts so I decided not to get involved. Maybe Arepa was a plant maybe not, who knows, but as far as I am concerned, Alsabella has always been fair in allowing everyone to have there say unless, they were attacking her country, the PJ, or fellow posters that had not caused any trouble.

I did have a look at the other site yesterday and I thought their comments were just as bad, so if Alsabella's site has been pulled, then several posters have been right all along, there are certain members on there with alot of influence in the right places. IMO

Anonymous said...


The most outlandish statements were made on the other blog, yet that is still running.

Did you even see the filth that was written by Arepa? Absolutely disgusting.

Zodiac said...

Anon 16.46pm,

They are not innocent of neglect, they are guilty of that and an innocent 3 year old is the victim of her parents behaviour.

Gina said...

Hi Di

Just look in over here to see what is going on. Re Alsa site, well I am not sure what happened but I was on line when it did. Everything was fine, usual banter, then along came an Anon with a few of the usual comments, nothing new, then Annon Alroy posted a long post. I replied whilst I agreed with some of what he was saying I did not agree with the McCanns featuring in this documentary as I felt there were other parents better suited (or something to that effect). He then slammed into me with the usual I am two faced, like the sound of my own voice, bla de bla, and a few minutes later the blog was gone.

Don't know why, maybe Alsa just not have time to monitor so she decided when she is not there to pull it, or maybe she has just had enough, I really do not know. What was said to me was water off a ducks back because earlier I had challenged any pros to answer something I had written with a sensible answer, that was ignored, not takers on that one, much easier to personally attack. They honestly think they are hurting and annoying me with these attacks, but to be honest it is flattering really because my posts obviously hit a nerve.

I hope Alsabella or Claudia post on here to let us know what is what as at the moment we are all only guessing-

Viv hope you don't mind me posting this on here. I did leave you a message this morning in reply to your message to Alsa saying that I would not hold my breath if I was her that her appeal would do any good.

Gina said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

I don't believe that in any other country they would have given 'emergency treatment' to the other children.

The whole world was grieving at one stage. No one could have predicted the media phenomenon that came after or the outpouring of grief.

Preferential treatment? Money?

Whatever preferential treatment they may have been given there is no way I would want to be in their shoes...

And I cannot see them living a 'Posh and Becks' lifestyle will all that money either.

People seem so jealous and resentful because of that I cannot understand this.

This is such a short sighted and narrow minded point of view...

I am sure they would give everything back and give up all the preferential treatment that so many resent, if they could only get their daughter back.

Anonymous said...


Oh do get a grip.

Roberto Sanz said...

Hi, congratulations for this site.



Lil said...


Yet you are on the pro site asking for help.

"earlier I had challenged any pros to answer something I had written with a sensible answer, that was ignored, not takers on that one, much easier to personally attack. They honestly think they are hurting and annoying me with these attacks, but to be honest it is flattering really because my posts obviously hit a nerve."

Anonymous said...

Ok Zodiac,
If they had not left their kids alone all this would not have happened. No one has ever denied this.

But they are not guilty of all the rubbish Viv, 2345, docmac, Arepa and all the other sickos that hang around here accuse them of.

This blog is not for discussion, and neither was Alsabella's.

Allowing comments from nutters such as 2345 and Arepa just showed what a gorefest these two blogs are.

And this has been the main downfall of one of them.

Anonymous said...
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Gina said...

lil now report it the way it was will you. I was having probs doing something on my computer, Mum21 offered to help me so I took up her offer, so your point is ????

lil said...
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Gina said...

Yes annon I am two faced that I why I can see those trying to stab me in the back so quickly. You are not going to draw me into an argument so you might as well give up now

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...
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Gina said...

lil Take that up with Mum 21 it was she that asked me if I wanted help. As for bicking about them elsewhere, what a stupid argument, I always post in my own name so I know they are going to read anything I say anyway. You obviously haven't noticed that I have defended them too when I felt the need, like when someone was calling Rosiepops racist, and having a go about Arepa posts. If that is a two faced shit stirrer then that is what I am. Think what you like

Anonymous said...
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Gina said...

Anonymous said...

In the end no one is going to want you anywhere.And you deserve this.

I suppose I could change my blogger ID or become a coward and post annon like you do

Any further comments will be wasted as I have spoken to who I WANTED TO and said WHAT I WANT TO say and am now going to do WHAT I WANT TO DO, and your comments have changed nothing

Anonymous said...
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isis said...

Lil/anon, Gina is not 2 faced and has never posted under anything other than her own name. Im sure if you read back you will see that mum offered her help with computer problems she was having.

Di said...


Ignore as I am doing to the anon who tried to get me to rise to the bait.

The only objective is to get this site closed down as well, as we saw earlier, one down one to go, please don't give them the satisfaction.

However, it makes no difference, as far as I am concerned, this desperation only points to one thing, absolute panic.

Maybe the post on 3 As was true, the PJ are really here.

It makes sense.

Lil said...
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