6 Mar 2008

UK CHIEF SUPER RETURNS FROM MTS WITH PJS


What great news at last! What ridiculous defensive remarks for Clarence Mitchell to make "the friends will not be changing their story and we dont know if Kate and Gerry are to be re-interviewed but that is not an issue". If the friends had told the truth in the first place the issue of them changing their story would not be a problem that he needed to comment upon. Why did they feel the need to book a hotel to get together with soliciotors at the end of November. This must surely have been to get their stories straight. Why was not held at Rothley Manor - were they afraid the police may have bugged it - they certainly do this in serious criminal investigations. Face bovvered Kate and Gerry may need to be re-interviewed - well given what they are accused of he really ought to be bothered and I reckon he is!


Given the Daily Mail is Clarence's pet paper that prints his spin - the content of this is very encouraging - I wonder what it would say if it was not Clarence's favourite paper?


As I have mentioned previously it is likely we will now see newspapers becoming increasingly careful about what they print. They can be held in contempt of court if they print details on any criminal case where the defendants have been charged or charges are imminent suggesting they are guilty because this pre-judging the criminal trial. Perhaps people should take care what they say now. We would not want the McCanns to start saying they cannot get a fair trial now would we? Innocent until proven guilty as Rosiepops would say!


Viv x



Madeleine: British police meet Portuguese detectives to plan fresh interviews with Tapas NineBy Neil Sears - Last updated at 21:09pm on 6th March 2008


British police have met Portuguese detectives to plan new interviews with the group of friends who dined with Gerry and Kate McCann on the night their daughter Madeleine disappeared.
Portuguese police continue to believe the so-called Tapas Nine - the McCanns and their seven friends - could still hold the solution to the unsolved mystery that began in May last year.

Madeleine was three when she went missing from her family's holiday apartment while her parents ate dinner 50 yards away
And Leicestershire Police said yesterday that Detective Superintendent Stuart Prior had returned from the Algarve after three days of meetings with counterparts in Portugal about how fresh interviews would be conducted.
Madeleine was three when she went missing from her family's holiday apartment in Praia da Luz while her parents ate dinner at a tapas bar 50 yards away with their friends from England.
Portuguese detectives, who have been widely criticised for their failure to find any solid evidence or charge anyone, remain unsatisfied by the witness accounts given by the so-called Tapas Nine, as they try to establish a timeline of events on that evening.
Leicestershire Police said Det Supt Prior flew to Portugal to discuss the issue of mutual legal assistance, the process whereby evidence is gathered in one country to help an investigation in another.
A Leicestershire police spokeswoman said: "Since Madeleine's disappearance, we, together with other law enforcement agencies, have been working closely with the Portuguese authorities.
"Mr Prior has attended a series of meetings with his Portuguese counterparts. He travelled to Portugal on Tuesday and returned this morning.
"He went to discuss how the request for mutual legal assistance is to be executed, and to seek clarification over elements of the request."
The process could involve Portuguese police writing questions to be put to the friends on their behalf by their British counterparts.
But officers involved in the investigation in the Algarve also fly to Britain to sit in on the interviews, which are likely to be held at a location in Leicestershire.
Scroll down for more...

Fiona Payne, Jane Tanner, Russell O' Brien and Rachael Oldfield were dining with the McCanns
The McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell said: 'The sooner this re-interviewing takes place the better.
"The friends are very keen to help police understand their original statements. No one will be changing their story.
"We are not aware that Kate and Gerry are to be re-interviewed at this stage, but if so, that's not an issue
."
Scroll down for more...

Portuguese police continue to believe the so-called Tapas Nine - the McCanns and their seven friends - could still hold the solution to Maddy's disappearance
The McCanns, from Rothley in Leicestershire, were joined at the tapas restaurant on by Dr Matthew Oldfield and his recruitment consultant wife Rachael, Dr Russell O'Brien and his partner Jane Tanner, and medical researcher David Payne, his wife Fiona, and her mother Dianne Webster.
A Home Office spokeswoman said: "We have already confirmed that we have received a mutual legal assistance request from the Portuguese authorities in connection with the investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.
"We are currently awaiting clarification from the Portuguese authorities over elements of the request.
"Home Office officials continue to work closely with the police to assist the Portuguese authorities with this investigation."
British expat Robert Murat, 34, a sometime estate agent, was made an official suspect two weeks into the inquiry when police suddenly swooped on the villa he shares with his mother less than 100 yards from the McCanns' holiday flat.
He has not been charged, but remains under official suspicion.
Portuguese Police later made Gerry and Kate McCann themselves their chief targets, but again no charges have followed.

151 comments:

Anonymous said...

Penelope1 says:

Did anyone notice the programme on BBC last night about children being neglected in creches, and their investigation into Mark Warner?

I think the fact they targeted Mark Warner for criticism, and the toming of this documentary (which even mentioned Madeleine) was well planned.

It was critical of Mark Warner - so te Pro McCann lobby is well connected in the BBC!

Another diversion/smokescreen.

No smoke without fire!

felicity said...

From yesterday's Correio de Manha. The mum of Rui Pedro who disappeared 10 years ago, playing on his bike, continues to need psychological counselling. Contrast this with Kate and Gerry McCann. He is particular stressing he just wanted to get back to normal and return to work. Both saying the first two days were the worse..I think this does emphasise the shock and revulsion people feel at the reaction of the McCanns. A complete lack of concern able to start laughing and jogging again after just a few days. Kate popped off and got her highlights done...bizarre! I know I would never get over losing my child or be able to stand laughing on the beach a few days later on her birthday letting go of balloons in some sick publicit stunt to raise masses of cash - this "event" was synchronised all over the world!

The McCanns are no ones charity case. It is really horrible to think of all the kindly people, out of their income support and pension etc who gave money to this couple.

Viv


2008-03-05 - 00:30:00

Lousada
Rui Pedro disappeared ten years






Rui Pedro will now 21 years
Rui Pedro disappeared from Lousada ten years ago, on March 4, 1998. The couple, who now have 21 years, is particularly remembered by family at this time, reviving the pain of parents who never spared any effort to try to find.







The Judiciary Police cyclically reopens the case and carry out various steps whenever an event that evidence is suggested. Rui Pedro were last seen in a descampado the rear of the Preparatory School of Lousada to cycle.

The mother of Rui Pedro, who was traumatized by the situation, to which continues to rely on psychological help, tried to avoid over the ten years since the disappearance of the child caísse into obscurity, the case came to gain new impetus after the disappearance of girl English Madeleine McCann.

The case of Rui Pedro remains of justice in secret at least until the end of April, as requested the lawyer of the family, Ricardo Sá Fernandes, who at the end of last year revealed that the operation was underway for a new line of research. After this period, access to the file will no longer be forbidden.
L.L.

leigh3 said...

Hi Penelope.
I agree with you, but then this: Mark Warner staff are witnesses; Mark Warner is a wealthy company which can afford to bide its time, and sue for libel at a later time.

6 years. That's how long their right to sue lasts. It's less than a year since lil Maddie went 'missing'.

Time is on the side of truth, imo.

lizzy said...

Hi Penelope,
Once again though, Team Mccann are looking to blame somebody else, Mark Warner, when it was their responsibility a parents to look after their children. My 17 year old daughter made a valid comment just after Madeleine was said by the Mccanns to have been abducted, at the beginning of June, she said Why are they leaving the twins in the care of the Creche after the eldest daughter has just been abducted? She then said you wouldn't want to let your other children out of your sight would you mum, I thought it was odd and this was before there was any suspicion voiced about the Mccanns possible involvement. But my daughter for all her youth ,hit the nail on the head. If your child had been genuinely abducted, you would not leave your other children with anyone. Well the majority of parents wouldn't in my opinion. Yet the Mccanns day after day put the twins in the creche until they were eventually told by staff not to bring them anymore, as it was disruptive with all the media attention for the other children. Lizzy 12.14

felicity said...

Hi Penelops

I did not see it unfortunately but other posters told me about it. Was it really helpful to the McCanns? I think there is another way you could look at this. This couple showed a complete disregard for the care and safety of their children. In fact they demonstrated they did not want to spend any time with them at all really on that fateful "holiday". Doctors and yet they just dumped their three precious little children in this creche every single day. How did they know or care whether those staff were skilled and capable of properly caring for their precious little ones. Then at night, they just left them alone completely. If I were the pro-McCanns I would not be bothering to use this as propaganda. Concerned parents will not leave their children with just anyone. They like to leave them with relatives or make very careful checks before they trust anyone or any nursery or child care facility. The discovery of unqualified staff working at Mark Warner just demonstrates their negligence for the care of these three little ones that is their responsibility at the end of the day, both morally and legally, no one else's. Those children would have been far safer and happier if they had been left at home with their grandparents.

Just an alternative viewpoint.

Viv x

leigh3 said...

Good Evening Felicity.
'Mutual legal assistance' - what a great phrase that is, imo.
All us true Friends of Maddie and every child have always trusted in the ongoing investigation; the cooperation between Portuguese and British Police, and other agencies including FSS, Interpol, and child protection agencies.

This trust is the reason why the McCann Machine of media manipulators was deployed to undermine public faith in legitimate inquiry, and divert attention from the facts being investigated.

The McCanns are prime suspects in the 'disappearance' of Madeleine. There are 'inconsistencies' and 'contradictions' in statements made by the McCanns and some of their holiday friends. Certain UK Government staff will also be interviewed by the Police, and face criminal charges.

Psychopops on the DE and elsewhere has taught us all a very useful lesson: the 21st Century of the world weird web will be abused and misused by liars.

Hey ho. Twas ever thus. The internet is just the latest target of thugs, and honest folk have resisted such corruption. Long may it be so.

felicity said...

Hi Lizzie

It sounds like your 17 year old will make an intuitive and lovely mum. This was my own immediate thought but I am treble her age and a bit, sadly ;-(

I know for a fact I would have clung like glue to the other two. They would have been the only thing that could possibly have helped to cope with such a terrible burden and I would have been simply terrified of something happening to them also. The McCanns clearly knew nothing could happen to them. But they also demonstrated a complete lack of empathy and concern for the twins themselves facing the loss of littel Maddie - they did not just dump them in the creche every day, they left them completely to go on their self-serving, money-spinning European tour. They just do not demonstrate normal parental thoughts, feelings and emotions and certainly not concern for their own little children. This has always been what has made them so suspicious apart from all the ridiculous spin, the perceived need to do what no other parent has found necessary, hire a Whitehall spin doctor. Also Alistair Clarke a University friend of Gerry's and an image consultant/media manipulator was one of the first people he rang. He made it very plain from the outset what his train of thought was -protect me and Kate/cash in big time.


Viv x

felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

There has been so much flying around the net about governmental preferential treatment for the McCanns and seeking to impede the enquiry to the point they would never be prosecuted anyway, I just cannot help but wonder whether this was also just part of the spin. I have always had the feeling there were right wing elements at work, seeking to undermine Gordon Brown over this issue. It does seem to me now there is no real lack of co-operation or interference, just two different police forces working in harmony to net a couple of serious criminals and a few more besides.

It will be interesting to see whether CM is also found to have aided and abetter or done acts tending to pervert the course of justice. I do not believe he could categorically state the pronouncements he has made have been an example of him "acting in good faith". He deserves all the condemnation he has receieved IMO.

A sure sign of bad faith, in my experience, is when people have to tell deliberate and obvious lies and resort to being abusive. As you say Rosiepops has taught us that such characters exist on the weird wide web, and no matter how often they abusiveness or lies are exposed, still they persist. Clarence gets angry and aggressive when speaking to members of the press immediately going on the defensive or offensive. Neither of this should be necessary from a reasonable person, reasonably telling an honest story. His conduct is very telling IMO.

Viv x

leigh3 said...

Yes, Felicity. Actions speak louder than words.
The McCann Machine of media manipulators scream 'innocent until proven guilty' while they find everyone else guilty of questioning their version of events; guilty of being 'unhelpful'.

Unhelpful? Like what? Asking legitimate questions in the pursuit of truth over the 'disappearance' of Madeleine, aged 3, left alone night after night in a foreign hotel room with her brother and sister, aged 2?

Were they left alone every night? That is my most worrying question.
Time will tell.

For the Police and other genuine investigators/child protection agencies, every question is valid; every question must be answered. The McCanns and others have refused to answer every legitimate question...so far. So: they will get their day/s in court, imo.

Criminal court. Libel court. The court of public opinion. All of it.

Poor lil Maddie, aged 3, and her brother and sister, aged 2.

To hell with anyone who let them down, imo.

felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

Whilst the investigation was ongoing we have been free to oppose their media manipulators and I think an excellant job has been done of that. They really did not bank on the hammering they would get on the Daily Express for example. Very soon we will not even need to bother to counter their spin because they will be charged and will just have to shut up. We will then get a period of relative quiet I think during the build up to the trial. Once the trial is over the McCanns are going to get all the publicity their little hearts desired, and it just serves them right.

I know what you mean querying were they left alone every night. The fact of leaving them alone has always been sold by Gerry as the reason why little Maddie could have been abducted. He was bragging about it to the Wilkins etc. Any parents who were as rotten as that would be ashamed of what they did and would certainly not wanting to brag about it. He was staging, plain and simple. I think when you put it all together the police have an overwhelming case, particularly includng the mobile phone evidence. This is why that solicitor was such a prat trying to get them prosecuted for neglect, causing me to wonder whether he was even on their side! The fact that they neglected them was exactly what Gerry wanted us all to believe. There was that story that came out they cancelled the babysitter for that night, wasnt there, I do not know how credible that is.

Viv x

leigh3 said...

Yes, Felicity. So many lies told from the outset by so many.
Faith in Justice, my dear. This is what we must pursue, as you do.

Wizard on the DE had a lot to say about 'staging'. At first, I found that incredible, although I never dismiss incredible :-)

Time and perseverance. Focus on facts, not intepretation. That is what we need, imo.

BTW: just for your amusement: 'Face. Bovvered?' No. Not 'bovvered'. Just impassively asking awkward questions which WILL be answered, one way or another.
See you next time. Focus is the key word, imo.
Night night.
xo

felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

Sometimes it has been difficult to hang on to my faith in justice, given everything we have seen and heard, but somehow I have. Now I think we are almost there and all those doubts and concerns are ebbing away. The McCanns are not going to spin their way out of this and although they patently did destroy evidence, even her precious little body, they will not get away with this.

I have always really enjoyed Wizard's posts and have a lot of faith in his insight. He has made some extremely intuitive assessments of their conduct and does have a psychology background which is really helpful. I remember him telling me Gerry has the ability to just compartmentalise things and that is a very good way of putting it.

Neither of us are bovvered by threats and intimidation. They are pathetic and desperate. So they should be, like a couple of rabbits caught in the headlights- something is moving very rapidly towards them now, it is called Justice for Maddie. What I have always longed for.

Night Night My friend

Viv x

hope4truth said...

Good Morning All

A strange remark by CM (again) if you are inocent of a crime and your friends make statements then why would it need to be made clear they were not going to be changed? If you have done nothing wrong then it would not matter what your friends have said and for the most part all statements should be very similar ok some times may be slightly out but everything else should be more or less spot on.

I posted here last night about MW (could not find anyone and it was on one of the recent threads) that the Pro's should watch what they say about MW after all there must be many witnesses there esepcialy if the story about Chaplins and Mrs Fenn are true most people I know are not intrested in the McCanns but a lot find them dodgey and cant believe the children were left. The few that think the Tapas bar was very close are shocked when I say it has been sugested that all of the childen may have been left and Maddie may have been crying for a long time before MW staff dragged them back to the apartment.

Now if that is true and it hits the papers or MW come forward and state it happend as a fact I think a lot of the public that may think they were very near by will change their minds.

Lizzy your daughter is very wise I hae allways thought if my child was taken it would be a cold day in hell that I would ever again feel safe being away from my other child again. I would imaginea lot of counceling would be needed as obviously the remainding child would need to return to a normal life but I dont think leaving them with family while I get on a plane to meet the pope would be something I could do (maybe if I thought I was going to bring my child home but then I would take the other child with me)....

I hope the Tapas 9 all tell the truth and if that means they have to admit they hardly checked on the children all week so be it but something is not right and if Kate and Gerry are guilty of no more than neglect (along with the rest of the parents) then tell the truth as it is obvious things are not right. If they think K&G and others did something worse then tell the truth. This is about a neglected 3 year old little girl and she deserves the truth in her memory and the Twins need closuer maybe they can cope now but when they get older they need to know that there are no dark secrets and the truth was told.

What a mess...

I am off see you all later xxx

LittleGreyCell said...

9.05

Morning All,

Just dropping in briefly.

I rather think the prog about MW heightens the cuplability of the McCanns, not exonerates them:-

1. The Tapas Lot left their kids with the young girls in the nursery every day. They presumably took MW's word for the fact that the staff were registered childminders, and also for the fact that they were who they said they were (in the prog it showed that the management didn't even check their passports to confirm their identity).

2. Kate KNEW there was no 'night listening service', and yet STILL went out night after night, leaving the children alone.

If Madeleine had gone missing from the day care centre, the McCanns would obviously have every reason to blame MW.

But she didn't.

Whatever happened to her was at a time when nobody other than her parents had been entrusted with her safety.

The programme was shocking, and Mark Warner - along with some other nurseries featured in the documentary - deserve all that the authorities can hit them with.

But it only served to highlight how carefree Kate and Gerry's attitude to childcare was. It does not in any way put the blame at MW's door for what happened to Madeleine, and I think the management of MW at least don't have to worry about that aspect of their lamentable practices. (Unless, of course, one of their staff was ultimately foun to be responsible for whatever happened to M, although that's highly unlikely).

See you later!

X

dylan said...

Hi LGC,

Entirely agree. When people go on holiday to these resorts, they know, beforehand about the creche/childcare arrangements.
personally, i think it's a bit pointless taking children on holiday if all you do is leave them, day in, day out.

It's really harsh to point the finger of blame at MW because they are merely acting to provide a service that they are required to, by demand alone & they have met this through consultation with their customers.

I didn't see the programme, but would have been livid if i had. The McCanns, themselves are representative of the faction of people who are responsible for the services that MW do provide. To blame MW is to blame their customers, the Mcs included.

It seems to me, IMO, that they only wish to point the finger of blame to detract from their own negligence. And the fact that the beeb just rolled over and fed them this shite is just shameful!

Dyl x

2345 said...

Felicity,

My thoughts entirely. The onus is on parents to strongly vet any creche and it's staff, more so in a foreign country. The more the McCanns continue to cast doubts on others - PR brainwashing techniques - the worse they appear as human beings - let alone parents. Have the McCanns also failed to do similar checks on the nursery they use in Britain ? I doubt it despite yesterday's article of appalling standards in many. The twins were undoubtedly left in nursery when their 'caring' parents were attending Amber Alert Meetings and the Richmond Charity !!

J eeeeeeeez - I don't know anyone who would leave a dog or cat in kennels without a thorough inspection and confirmation of care standards do you ?

Leigh3 - I hope MW sue the pants off them, quite frankly, along with every other innocent person the McCanns have defamed to save their own 'reputations'. At best, grossly neglectful parents, at worst, death and disposal of the eldest. 10.35 a.m.

Shannon update - Police are searching area of scrubland ...

News Blackout on Jersey Case. Report 2 days ago - more bones unearthed - Eddie & Keela's successes continues .... hence the silence due to discomforture.

Do you think a Government minister chaperoned British Police to monitor their reported recent meeting with PJ ? My instincts say 'yes' - anyone else feel the same ? 10.40 a.m.

dolores said...

Viv/all,
A refresher of external assistance,
give to PJ.

Throughout the investigation support has been provided by the British authorities for the Portuguese police. Immediately after the disappearance experts from Britain were flown out to assist the Portuguese police experts and Leicestershire Police sent family liaison officers to help the McCann family. On 9 May, Interpol released a yellow notice, issued to help locate missing persons who are not able to identify themselves, to all member police forces. A team of mobile phone experts flew to Portugal on 29 May 2007 to analyse mobile phone data from the area at the time of the abduction. They used triangulation techniques to track mobile phone movements down to a couple of yards.More experts, this time from the British Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre, flew into Portugal on July 31 to assist the local detectives, for whom all leave had been cancelled, by developing a psychological profile of a possible abductor.
In early August, British detectives again flew in to assist. They were accompanied by specially trained sniffer dogs and equipment for underground detection'.'
and ultraviolet instruments for identifying blood.

Zodiac said...

'No one will be changing their story'. So the inconsistencies should be the same.
"We are not aware that Kate and Gerry are to be re-interviewed at this stage". IMO team McC are not aware of very much regarding the PJ. Team McC were not aware the PJ were coming the last time they visited the UK and look how they reacted.

dolores said...

Zodiac,Hi,

How does CM know no one will change their statements!
How can he be so sure,surely he has not been questioning witnesses, as this would be illegal.
And one of them at least has,according to the press.
Has he put his foot in it again?

Cláudia said...

Just wanted to say Hi to all of you! :-)
Viv, if you're around, keep fighting the good fight.
xxxxx

dolores said...

Claudia,
Hello to you also :)

Zodiac said...

Dolores,
Exactly how does he know and to state it publicly in a newspaper. Team McC IMO think they are above the Law. I wonder what the outcome of the PJ visit will be. What kind of Press/News coverage or should I say Spin coverage will be printed. More sightings, more Saint G & K involvement with missing children Charities, etc, etc the usual distraction from the TRUTH, IMO. I do hope for Madeleine's sake that at least one of the group has a conscience.

isis said...

isnt clarence working outside his remit in making a statment on ..no one will be changing their statments ?? Too late i think as i imagine oldfield has spoken already,why do the pj not want to speak to him again??

dolores said...

Zodaic,
I hope more than one of the tapas 7will be truthful, I will never understand their loyalty to 2 criminals.
Maybe if they are faced with a jail sentence, as accomplices they will change their tunes.
And to let Madeleine rest in peace.

isis said...

9 September 2007
BRIT POLICE WATCH AND LISTEN NEXT DOOR
Exclusive by Andrew Gregory
British detectives secretly listened in as Portuguese police grilled Kate McCann over daughter Maddie's disappearance, The People can today reveal.

They hid in a room next to the interview suite at the police station to watch the mother's every response to her gruelling interrogation.

It is understood the Brit officers even fed the local cops with questions through tiny earpieces - and used body-language experts to monitor Kate's reactions.The People has discovered that Kate and husband Gerry were made official suspects after:

Local cops set up surveillance teams to monitor their movements 24 hours a day for three weeks.

Kate was hauled back in for a tough second interview after they claimed she had dramatically CHANGED her version of events.


The body-language experts compiled a secret report which is thought to suggest her demeanour indicates she has something to HIDE.
Emails and computer data are thought to have been closely examined.

The dramatic twists in the case of four-year-old Maddie come after Portuguese investigators received guidance from Britain's FBI, the Serious and Organised Crime Agency.

A dossier of covert electronic and physical evidence coupled with forensic reports led to the McCanns both being labelled suspects.

A source close to the inquiry revealed: "Following the request by the Portuguese to the British police to get involved the pace of the investigation has massively increased.
"Many of the failures made by local cops have been highlighted by the Brits and they are now working hard to find out what exactly happened to Madeleine."

The source explained: "It is common practice for those closest to a missing person to be watched closely and the McCanns are now no different.

"They, like all suspects, are being closely monitored as no stone is left unturned."
Taken from the 3As site.

dolores said...

Isis,
It is welcoming news, that Leicestershire police will be doing the interviews,we won't hear 'framed' as some of their family and pro's have accused PJ of,and no excuses of translations and langauge barriers,being misunderstood.Also enlightening to kmow that their questioning in PDL was being monitered by UK police. Those who have squeeled they were 'framed' need to be very careful what they say in future.

ratonthebeam said...

Dolores
.....nah. Haven't you heard the pros squealing "framed" at Eddie and Keela. "They only went to the McCanns car because it was full of Maddie posters" was one classic. (I knew these dogs were smart; I didn't know they could read, as well). No matter who does what, there will still be those who squeal "framed" for the want of anything better to say.

ratonthebeam said...

...and "The People" is hardly the most reliable source of news....

isis said...

Rat, are you serious about the posters on the car?? No you have to be pulling my leg!! BTW i think you have real grounds to sue the DE for their most unphotogenic and biased reporting on your relatives some week or so ago! The article is still there ... do you have no influence ???

LittleGreyCell said...

12.45

Have just discovered this on the Sky News website concerning the McCanns planning to sue the DE:-

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91248-1308414,00.html

X

ratonthebeam said...

Hey, have you all seen Supertrolls blog recently. Apparently I am now an intelligent and articulate woman with a good career! (This time last week I was stupid, vaccous pratonthebeam). A week is a long time in politics and blogging. This is even better than getting a worse poster award.....

LittleGreyCell said...

13.15

Rat,

I do believe you're just declaring your intention to make a bid for our George Clooney...

Get to the back of the queue, girl!

X Little Grey Clooney

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ratonthebeam said...

Anon troll,
WTF was that last post even trying to say? It's not even coherent! Maybe if you can ask me properly, I will be able to give you an answer. Until then, I think it says a hell of a lot more about you than it does about me.

ratonthebeam said...

MUST READ, FOLKS!
Now we know why the DX articles all got pulled. This really does take the bloody biscuit!

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ratonthebeam said...

Anon
Why are you here? What are you hoping to achieve? Because all you are doing is making a fool of yourself.
Conversation over. I don't feed trolls.

2345 said...

isis,

In and out here today .. thanks for the article from 3 A's -
British Police Monitoring Interviews - all is revealed.

BBC were notified and given the FSS information for public broadcast - Jane Hill 7th September. Ditton Martin Brunt on Sky News.

Well done the 'boys in blue' - wake up call to death, cover up and obtaining £1.3 m under false pretences. It's great to know that British Police acted in the public's best interests as well as the victim's.

Police are doing exactly the same in the Jersey case - ongoing success - reponse is news black.

Same procedures in Shannon's disappearance - lots of media coverage. 4.00 p.m.


Much more to BBC's despatch of Jane Hill to cover breaking news that

2345 said...

littlegreycell,

Thanks for the link ... taking a leaf out of Hogan's book ? 4.05 p.m.

2345 said...

isis,

Clarrie's remit, along with Metado 3 & Hogan, is to endeavour to confound a criminal investigation on behalf of prime suspects in their child's death and disappearance. He gave the totally false and misleading impression at LSE that he was 'best mates' with the Police and informed accordingly.

CM is a menace to the Police and the public - globally, law and order and democracy. 4.10 p.m.

2345 said...

ratonthebeam,

Hello ... must read what ? I've always believed one reason DE pulled articles was to prevent honest public reaction being published.

Same tactic as Brown's actions over the Lisbon Treaty. Most of the British public objected - so he bypassed our rights and broke manifesto in the process. 4.15 p.m.

LittleGreyCell said...

You're welcome, 2345!

I think it's nothing more than scare tactics and smokescreens.

How on earth can they sue anyone when they're still the prime suspects?!

It really doesn't pay to make an enemy of the press, either. Suppose they come out of this either not charged or found not guilty, the press will sniff around and find all sorts of embarrassing stuff about them.

They are their own worst enemies...

X LGC

isis said...

Madeleine Parents Set To Sue Newspapers
Alistair Bunkall
Sky News reporter Updated:12:18, Friday March 07, 2008
Lawyers for Kate and Gerry McCann are considering taking legal action against British newspapers whose coverage they feel to have been incorrect and unfair.
Principally they are looking at the publications in The Express Group: The Daily Express, The Sunday Express, The Daily Star and The Daily Star Sunday.
Clarence Mitchell, the spokesman for the McCann family, confirmed that their lawyers were in discussions, but denied that any writs had yet been issued.
"It's wrong to say that we're actually suing, but our lawyers have been assessing all articles, in all papers.
"We are extremely unhappy with The Express Group's coverage. We always said it was the worst amongst all the tabloids."
He also added that the figures that have been quoted in the media are wildly speculative and that The Express Group had made no initial offer for an out-of-court settlement.
Under UK law, the McCanns and their lawyers have a year from the publication of an article to decide whether they wish to take legal action against its content.
It is thought that in the case of the coverage they are assessing, that year would be up some time in mid-May, and a decision must be taken by then.
Clarence Mitchell denied the family were taking this action because the Find Madeleine fund was running low.
He said: "Yes, it's true that the fund is roughly half-way spent, but the main thing we require is an apology."
He added that any money won as a result of legal action would go straight back into the fund.

isis said...

monitor blogsWill brief UK.gov on major online debates
By Kablenet → More by this author
Published Tuesday 21st August 2007 09:07 GMT
Find out how your peers are dealing with Virtualization
The Central Office of Information is developing a media briefings service to inform government about major online debates.

The COI's Media Monitoring Unit (MMU) is working on an online monitoring product to track public debates from blogs.

It aims to highlight those that generate significant debate on government policy and send them out in the form of an MMU online campaigns briefing to government departments.

The move reflects concerns within departments that government is largely ignorant of much of the debate taking place online.

MMU director Clarence Mitchell said: "Clients have told us that campaigning and debating are taking place online to such a degree that there's a whole new medium out there. They don't want to be blindsided by material appearing from the web out of the blue in the external media, so the online monitoring product we've been working on over the last year is really going to help."

It has been working with internet intelligence company 23 Ltd, which uses software to trawl the web electronically searching for blogs that are generating significant public debate. Blogs that generate a significant number of threads and posts register on the system. Human analysis then takes place to consider issues such as how many positive and negative comments have been posted.

Mitchell told GC News: "What we're trying to do is provide a service on a more organised and widespread basis.

"If we get five or six departments to contribute via their regular subscriptions to the MMU service, then we'll be able to launch it."

About 100 blogs could be monitored in the first phase, and these will largely be specified by individual departments. Mitchell said he hoped the briefings would eventually become a daily alerts service.

Several trials have already taken place, including one directed at the "silver surfer" community, and another at debate generated from counter terrorism measures.

"We looked at an online debate among pensioners in a recent budget. The debate looked at how the budget impinged on pensioners, their council tax payments, winter fuel allowances, and so on," said Mitchell.

The MMU is also digitising its equipment to capture incoming media. This will allow it to replace a lot of VHS and DVD recording and enable faster searching and distribution of media to government officials.

It is also at an early stage in developing an electronic cuttings service to complement its regional newspaper monitoring service. This, however, has some way to go, said Mitchell, as the COI's Government News Network regional managers are concerned that such a service could jeopardise the income they gain from print cuttings.

This article was originally published at Kablenet.

Kablenet's GC weekly is a free email newsletter covering the latest news and analysis of public sector technology. To register click here.

Hmmmmmmm

felicity said...

Hi Isis and thanks for that. I like to think that because of public reaction the government are very well aware how the public view the McCann's conduct and wish for Justice. This may well have changed their policy to better co-operate with the Portuguese authorities and bring these two to justice, or suffer the backlash from such a large volume of the public.

The blogs generally have been far more informative than any spun offering in the press, clearly so often provided by Clarence Mitchell. How interesting he can then read what we think!

Viv x

isis said...

Viv, i think it is that public opinion that has clarence worried. He cannot control it.

isis said...

Viv, i think it is that public opinion that has clarence worried. He cannot control it.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
isis said...

New In Town

Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 6:54 pm
Posts: 3 cassen wrote:
Spanish TVs are informing that the body of a young girl has been found in the sea near Huelva. It is not confirmed it is Mari Luz's.



Now it is. Descanse en Paz - Rest in peace.

ratonthebeam said...

More sad news from Jersey too.

Rest in peace, little ones. God bless XXX

dylan said...

Isis, that is tragic news.
I had hoped that her disappearance was, maybe a set-up to help show the world that Mcs could be telling the truth & that she would be found, alive.

So horrible. Why would anybody do this to a child?

What a horrible world we live in.

Dyl :(

ratonthebeam said...

Ironside and Claudia are confirming now that the body of Mari Luz has been found ;-( sorry I am going off for a while to have a wee cry

2345 said...

Anonymouse,

The McCanns lawyers have issued no writs nor won a libel case against any party(s) since British Police gave FSS information for public release. The forensic evidence was presented to the McCanns on the day they were named 'arguido's'.

The question, therefore, remains in the publics' mind as to why the McCanns did not remain in Portugal with a lawyer and clear their names immediately. This question would arise in the event of Court proceedings where allegations of libellous/slanderous comments were being attested.

This question will continue until such times as the McCanns prove their innocent to Portuguese Judiciary. 7.00 p.m.

docmac said...

Sleep peacefully, Mari Luz. All strength to those close to her.

2345 said...

isis,

Thanks for the artice .... hmmmmmmmmm indeed. The question is the name of ananymouse trolls' employer ?? 7.05 p.m.

isis said...

2345, again ...hmmmmmmmmm. Have been watching this develop. So sad little mari-luz.

dolores said...

Riposarsi nella pace,Mari Luz.

Rest in peace little one,in the safe arms of God.
Condolences to her family
xx

Atardi said...

Dolores,

Only read last post.
Please tell me it's not what you said true about Mari Luz.

ratonthebeam said...

Sorry Atardi, it looks like it is true ;-(

2345 said...

Felicity,

Mari Luz:

There's something very odd and worrying about this case. A few days ago it was reported that the Police had found a child who could be Mari. The father was quoted as saying that "she was barely recognizable because she had been malnourished for 45 days and could barely speak".

My first thought was why did he make time speak to reporters as opposed to going immediately to identify and bring home the child the Police had allegedly found ?

The father's comments and behaviour did not 'ring true' ....
Something's wrong in this case as well ... 7.45 p.m.

supertroll said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
2345 said...

isis,

Mari Luz ... just posted my observations to Felicity. 7.50 p.m.

Atardi said...

Rat,

Wat is er gebeurd? Hebben ze haar gevonden?

Ik durf niet verder te lezen. Laat het niet waar zijn.

2345 said...

Supertroll,

Make of it what you choose. My comment is valid ... how did Mari's father know she had been malnourished for 45 days ? Why, when the report of Police finding a child who could be Mari did he not take immediate action ? the child in the report was clearly in desperate need. 7.55 p.m.

ratonthebeam said...

Atardi - het spijt mij, Ja hoor het is de waarheid = zo'n tragedie. Link hier (het is in Spaans) ;-(

2345 said...

Supertroll,

Lateral, logical thinking does not equal 'despicable'. 8.00 p.m.

isis said...

2345, meant hmmmmmm in relation to the situation i had been watching develop with the anon poster !! Mari-luz death is as a result of an inter gypsy feud as many spanish have said.

dylan said...

Rat, I hope you are ok. Very distressing news & i know how you feel.

ST - can't you leave 2345 alone just for one second? She is not a despicable, she is just trying to put things into perspective in the hope that things might make sense.

The fact that a child has died and we are upset that this has happened, means that we ask questions. Means that we try to find reason in all of this madness. If it helps 2345 to think around things then that is her right. Not your right to question.

Dyl

supertroll said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ratonthebeam said...

Dyl, I am fine, thank you; I just took it really hard and am still trying to get my head around it. I hope it was an accident rather than foul play (not that it makes much difference either way)

supertroll said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
dylan said...

Hi Rat,

I know. And my hopes match yours. We saw her face, eventually, next to Maddie's and we all hoped (and i was convinced) that she would come home, alive.

Such a shame.

dyl x

2345 said...

isis,

Inter gypsy feud - where did you read that ? Is it being suggested that she died and was then reported missing ? I have to dash ... hope to read your reply tomorrow. 8.20 p.m.

Atardi said...

Rat,

I read your link. The parents didn't wan't to comment when they left. But because of the jewelry they know it's Mari Luz.

And she had also an injury on the back of her head?

What a sad day. I don't even dare to read back posts.

Is it official yet?

2345 said...

Supertroll,

Lateral thinking is exactly the line those who uphold law and order will take ... in Mari's case and as in Madeleine's. 8.25 p.m.

isis said...

2345,..
New In Town


Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:46 pm
Posts: 66 Does any of our Spanish friends know if this place where her body was found, is near or far from the location she went missing?

If she was a victim of some "revenge" and if there's a God up above, whoever did it, can't get away with this. And at this point, I entirely agree with Ironside: there will be no peace among the gypsy community, if one family "marks" another to "death". No police wil handle it.

MariLuz,
Descansa en paz, cariño. xxx


Whatever the circumstances her death is so so sad,small angel. My heart breaks for her poor family.

LittleGreyCell said...

20.40

Super Troll,

What I can't understand is why you persistently read this blog if it upsets you.

I don't go onto many websites because I would find them repulsive and they would make me angry.

So why do you keep reading here if you hate it so much?

Or is it your job so to do?

In which case, if you're talking about morals, perhaps you'd better redefine the term in your own mind.

dolores said...

She disappeared almost two months ago and her body was found on Friday
Five year old Mari Luz, missing from Huelva since she left her home in the El Torrejón area of the city on 13th January for a short trip to the local sweets kiosk, has been found dead.

El Mundo said her body was found on Friday evening in Huelva province in the Torrearenilla marshland, in a river close to the Cepsa refinery installations, by an employee of the petroleum company. It’s understood that Mari Luz’s body was found with the clothes she was wearing when she disappeared , and that her body was badly decomposed.

There was news just last week that the family of the five year old had received a ransom demand for two million euros, via an anonymous caller who demanded the money to release the child.
While it was thought to be a hoax, the family said they were prepared to negotiate in the case of serious calls. Mari Luz’s uncle, Diego Cortés, said at the time that the family would personally go to rescue his niece if necessary, but said they would only be able to raise around 300,000 €.

El Mundo said Mari Luz’s parents, Juan José Cortés and Irene Suárez, had arrived at the scene to identify their daughter’s body, and that Juan José López Garzón, the central government delegate for Andalucía, was also en route to the site where Mari Luz’s body was found.

felicity said...

Hi All - I seem to be having trouble with the internet and accessing this blog. It is not that I am not bothered by this terrible news.

I am simply heartbroken about poor little Mari Luz. What devastating news.

Viv x

felicity said...

Supertroll

I have told you time and again personal attacks will not be tolerated. Your posts are being deleted.

Viv

Zodiac said...

Super Troll,

You really should stop posting for the moment anyway. Have some respect. As has been suggested why do you not stop posting on the sites that you object to. I would not post on the 'House of Filth' or 'Rotting meat and dirty nappies' site because I did read some of the posts and thought this is not for me. You have a choice, post where people agree with you if you cannot accept the views of others on here or elsewhere, stop trying to incite an argument, there is no troll food here.

Atardi said...

To everyone,

In my last post I said when the parents left but it's when the parents entered.
I also said that she had an injury on the back of her head but it's an injury on her head.

Dolores,

Thank you for the translation.

The grandparents blames the Guardia Civil and the Policicía Nacional because they didn't search instantly on boats/ships and places where boats/ships load their stuff.

Rat, can you please put the whole article on here without a link? I'm as sick as a cat after reading the article. I need time to read it several times.

I'm so sick because another child who maybe wanted to become a teacher, a firewoman or anything else was found dead.

When I lay in bed I always think of the parents and suffer with them.

We came here on this blof because we have a goal. We want the truth about the disappearance of Madeleine.

But please don't forget all abused,neglected and abducted children all over the world.

Together we are strong.

Rust in vrede Mari Luz.

Descansa en Paz.

irina said...

Hello everyone.

What a tragedy about Mari Luz! I do not believe gypsy’s feud is involved, it is too cruel.

Troll there is nothing you can do for McCanns now they are getting what they deserved. You can’t do anything for Madeleine either, you were not there when she died, were you?
Unless you know were her body is, and then you better tell.

Otherwise we will wait till interrogations and criminal investigation which they are subject of is finished.

And I do not give a damn about mccanns they only interest me as much as dr. shipman will..

ratonthebeam said...

Well, as I feared, it didn't take them long.

http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/world/mccanns+in+prayers+for+spanish+girl/1733047

leigh3 said...

22.12GMT
Good Evening All.
Mari Luz, Madeleine Beth McCann, unnamed Jersey children, hundreds missing in the UK every year, thousands killed the world over through the neglect or cruelty of adults; the list goes on and on.
Children's charities do good work long after headlines fade, as many of us believe, and support them.

On an optimistic note: 'mutual legal assistance'. What a great phrase in the interests of truth for Maddie, and other missing children.

Arrogant McCann Machine of media manipulators are busted, imo, but they are just too conceited to admit defeat...for now.

I look forward to their day/s in court, although nothing can compensate for the loss of yet another child; in this case: poor lil Maddie, the 3 year old left alone night after night in a foreign hotel room with her siblings, aged 2, whilst her spoilt parents went to the bar...the restaurant...the ? Leaving their kids with...what?

P.S. British Police run one UK charity called 'Child Victims of Crime'. The high flying politician s and McCann mechanics failed to see how futile it was to run back to this country, expecting refuge when in fact they walked straight into the lion's den, imo.

felicity said...

Hi all

Let us hope that little Mari Luz also gets justice for what happened to her. True, we are not just concerned about Madeleine McCann we are concerned about all abused children and want their abusers caught and convicted.

I think Clarence increasingly sounds like a megalomaniac. How can he declare the friends will not be changing their statements - did he threaten them? I think it was Irina a bit further back who noted - why do they not wish to re-interview Oldfield. What he did was to say he checked the children at 9.30 - that was a lie. That can be proved to be a lie due to so many other witnesses being available, e.g. other diners and waiters etc. I believe he would have received appropriate legal advice - if you continue to lie in a homicide investigation, then, just like Maxine Carr, you can expect a sentence of about three and half years. If you change your statement now and admit the truth it is likely the police will not prosecute you. I believe that is what he has very sensibly done. OB and Tanner on the other hand are in it up to their necks IMO, although I think it is even possible OB has admitted the truth to migigate his sentence, but his conduct is so serious he will not avoid a custodial sentence.

So far as the McCanns and the Daily Express are concerned. I had noted for some time that Clarence was particularly annoyed with the Daily Express. I am sure I cannot be the only one that noticed the Daily Mail printed the story and the next day an almost identical story appeared in the Express. So what is it that Clarence was really upset about? IMO it just has to be the unmoderated comments, in vast numbers that were being posted on the Daily Express. In spite of the best efforts of the trolls to fill the pages with rubbish, annoy, insult and upset, get posters banned etc. this did not stem the huge tide of adverse public opinion against the McCanns.

The McCanns and their entourage have been desperately casting around looking for a way to make another huge pot of money. NO stone has been left unturned in this search. The anger and frustration that they cannot command high fees on TV etc due to their arguido status has been thinly disguised. We have had a non stream of threats to sue from Clarence, even stating he would spend the rest of his days doing so. The battle for public opinion is so important to the McCanns because they can only make loads of money if they have it. They need the public to believe in their innocence but we just do not, and their campaign has been ill-advised, desperate, downright nasty and pathetic.

When lawyers are talking about proposed legal action they choose their words very carefully. Note here Clarence is not saying the McCanns are innocent and that has been printed is false. No the words are much tamer than that "unfair and inaccurate". No doubt it would not be that difficult to find aspects of the Daily Express's articles that fit that description. Even so, how much damages would a court order for a couple in their situation, who are not, after all, trying to allege they are innocent? In Grobelaar - a dodgy footballer, the Court of Appeal agreed that technically he had been libelled, but his reputation was so poor the correct sum in damages for him was £1. This is the Court's was of punishing people who never should have brought an action for libel in the first place. Grobbelar spent tends of thousands mounting this action to get £1 - now that is what I call justice! The McCanns are likely to be looking at being dealt a similar harsh blow and the timing of this, just prior to them actually being charged, could not be more contemptuous.




I have to say the standard of posts on here again has been excellant and I have found it very helpful reading them (with one slight exception from one who hates this blog and its contributors but cannot stay away).

I have always firmly believed that British Police were involved in this investigation from the earliest stages and that is why the McCanns are netted and their talk of framing quite absurd.

irina said...

The interviews are imminent next week. The conclusion of investigation is near, whether UK Gov. cooperates or not, we will know the truth of what happen to Madeleine, because traces have been left.

Hope same will happen to Mari Luz case. Poor girl! I wish it was not true, so sad.

leigh3 said...

Hiya Felicity.

£1.00, it is then :-)
Always a pleasure to read your measured, thoughtful words.

Justice is complex, but it can be done, in time, yes?

Oh happy days ahead, imo. Ta for your persistence.

felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

Yes £1 would be my assessment of an appropriate sum in damages, as in Grobelaar. It is not possible to ruin a reputation that is already ruined.

Rat

Unfortunately I see we do have the predictable self-serving spin in the Mari Luz case. Just how do this couple sleep at night? Pity they cannot admit where little Madeleine's body is..

McCanns in prayers for Spanish girl
Print this page
Last Modified: 07 Mar 2008
Source: PA News


Gerry and Kate McCann have offered their prayers and sympathy to the family of a missing five-year-old Spanish girl whose body is reported to have been found.

A spokesman for the McCanns said they were aware of reports that the body of Mari Luz Cortes had been discovered in the southern Spanish city of Huelva, just 120 miles away from where their daughter Madeleine disappeared.

Reports in the Spanish media said a body found by an oil refinery worker had been identified as that of Mari Luz, who disappeared on January 13.

ratonthebeam said...

Funny thing, I used to quite like C4. Not now. I am disgusted that they could allow such disgusting tripe on their website.

leigh3 said...

McCann prayers = nothing of worth, imo.
God loves truth, and forgives liars, imo.
McCanns and their supporters need forgiveness; they are a danger to society, imo; serial child neglectors, suspected of causing the death and/or disappearance of 3 year old Maddie; thereby, causing untold harm to her twin siblings, aged 2.

McCann prayers? Just another attempt to push their vain agenda on the public, and we don't buy it; we hope they will pay dearly for it. They will, in time, I think.

hope4truth said...

Viv

I have been posting on Alsabellas well not much as what can we say it is all so sad.

What a sad sad world we live in..

I am off but I have mailed you...

Speak to you all tomorrow cant think of anything to say now I really thought she had a chance feel really empty her poor family..

See you all tomorrow xxx

ratonthebeam said...

I believe God only forgives liars if they are truly sorry for the damage their lies have caused; and they try their best to make amends; and try not to repeat their mistake again in the future. At least, that's my understanding of how it is written in the Torah.

And IMHO the McCanns have a long, long, long way to go....

leigh3 said...

Ratonthebeam.
I agree with you 100%. Well said. Time will tell...

Atardi said...

hey Hope4truth,

A very sad day. Isn't it?

How was your day?

felicity said...

Hiya Rat

I suppose the McCanns comments re Mari Luz is "news". The media is supposed to be fair and unbiased in its reporting and so maybe this is what they are doing, allowing people to hear what they have to say and then form their own view?

Additionally there is the issue that the media must not be seen to be trying anyone accused of a serious criminal offence by media. In the States, judges are far more biased towards a free press, allowing the press to report their opinions. Unfortunately this is not the case in the UK - the Contempt of Court Act 1981 can be quite draconian against the media if they do seek to suggest that someone is actually guilty prior to the court making a finding of guilt. So, I think the public will become increasingly frustrated by what we see in the British press. The nearer the McCanns get to actually being charged the more paranoid the media will become about being prosecuted for breach of the Contempt of Court Act. We do not have genuine freedom of press here. It is not true to say that allowing such freedom does actually preclude the right to a fair trial. IN the OJ Simpson case, US newspapers were openly and very hostilely proclaiming his guilt, but still he walked. Maybe it is time we started to allow a genuine free press and granting the public the right to be honestly informed about pending legal cases, rather than so strictly applying our sub judice rules. The archaic thinking goes, that such reporting would adversely influence jury members against the accused, depriving them of the right to a free trial. This is a paternalistic attitude of the judiciary towards the general public and their ability to fairly and honestly judge their peers according to the evidene presented to them in court.


Viv x

hope4truth said...

Hello Atardi

I had a good day thanks feel really sad now and am off to bed after checking my girls...

I cant imagine how I would ever carry on if anthing happend to them..

Hope you are well will speak tomorrow xxx

ratonthebeam said...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30200-1308522,00.html

It's on Sky now. And guess what, it's all about Clarence Bloody Mitchell and Mr and Mrs Praying Mantis.

Just for once, why couldn't they have kept their traps shut? Poor Cortez family - their little girl turns up dead and they are still second class citizens to the Wonder Couple.

The press in this country really have hit an all time low.

felicity said...

Hiya Rat

Unfortunately, it is a feature of those who are seriously violent towards others, that they do not have victim empathy and are self-serving and narcisstic. Thus, like Shipman to his dying day, they are not prepared to acknowledge their guilt, demonstrate remorse and seek atonement for what they have done. It is these sort of people who are assessed to present a serious risk of harm to the public and get refused parole. Only when a prisoner is able to start demonstrating victim empathy and sorrow for what they have done, does the risk they present start to reduce. In some, they are so personality disordered this will never happen. Their only concern is self preservation. Even when convicted, this continues.

IMO there is simply no question of the McCanns admitting what they did and demonstrating remorse. They just do not have the capacity to do so.

Viv x

leigh3 said...

Ahh, Felicity.

Yup, it is paternalistic, alright, and a reflection of the UKs publishing history. Is it better or worse than the U.S. example et al? That's debatable, I guess.

Meanwhile, slowly slowly catchy monkey. That's the English way for better or worse. We're stuck with it :-)

Libel court: a nasty place for nasty people; a draconian counter balance to deep seated English secrecy; the right place for rich liars, imo.

Imperfect systems for imperfect people, perhaps.

leigh3 said...

Ratonthebeam.

Mr and Mrs Praying Mantis? A perfect description.

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...

Goodnight Anonymouse.
You are as predictable as ever, and confirmation that the McCann Machine is desperate. That is such a consolation in these grim times of missing Maddie and other children; evidence that Maddie's neglectors or abusers know they will be held to account, and pay for their crimes, in time.

Have a great weekend, Anonymouse. We will. Justice for Maddie, and all children is coming, in time :-)

felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

Yes libel laws get used by tories who lie, lie and lie again to quote the Guardian who Aitken sued for libel. He received 18 months for perverting the course of justice and sat in his prison cell writing his memoirs so that he could cash in on his release - just like Lord Archer. Aitken never got around to paying the Guardian the £1.8M he owes for their legal costs, neither did Hamilton get around to paying Mr Al Fayed back. Now who do these rats remind us of?

Viv x

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
felicity said...

Are you going to go into one of your little rages soon Troll?

leigh3 said...

Dear Felicity,
I wish you a happy, peaceful weekend, so that we have the benefit of your thoughts again.
Libel law is a 'rich man's law', as the old saying goes, but that applies to liars of all kinds, regardless of political affiliation, as I'm sure you know.
The stain of libel is indelible. I hope that this case of missing Maddie does ensure that wrong doers of any kind or political affiliation pay for their deceit.

See you next time, sweety.
xo
Leigh3

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
felicity said...

Hiya Hope

I found your email and responded:-)

Luv Viv x

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

I intend to have a great weekend thanks and am so excited by the positive developments in this case, whilst also saddened of course about Mari Luz. I share the disgust of others with the McCanns repugnant statement again seeking to link themselves with other innocent families.

Libel normally goes with the tory mentality, liars, money grabbers, selfish prats who look upon the rights of others with disdain and hence we have some good examples from the higher tory ranks. Maybe the McCanns are an unpleasant by-product of "New Labour"!

Viv x

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
leigh3 said...

Have a fab weekend, sweety.
As for Tories and libel: my fear as a former paid up member of the Young Socialists is that we now see the Orwellian nightmare - a powerful political elite betraying any sense of serving the public; most interested in their own egos and expense accounts, even if that means borderline fraud, ie undeclared income, abuse of Parliamentary procedures etc.

Abuse of 'procedures' and 'expenses'/income? Now who is like that?

Poor lil Maddie. God rest her soul.

See you soon. Let's all be grateful for the days ahead, imo.
Night night, Friend of Maddie.
xo
Leigh3

felicity said...

Hiya Leigh

I have always been die-hard labour supporter and agree what we are seeing now is Orwellian and frightening. Tony Blair may have got labour back in power but it was New Labour sold out to the devil and tory ideology. Tony and Cherie had a love affair with anyone who was rich enough and allowed principled behaviour to fall by the wayside. Alistair Campbell brought politics to a new low of dishonesty and these people only represent their political masters and lust for money and power. Somewhere Gerry McCann would feel right at home.

Nite Nite darling

Viv x

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
supertroll said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
mtoosad said...

Hi Viv
Today is a very sad day particulary to Mary Luz parents. She is with the angels now.
I found this article in Portugal Diario that you may find interesting:
http://www.portugaldiario.iol.pt/noticia.php?id=925112

Google translation

Dozens of people, among friends of McCann, tourists and former officials of the Ocean Club, in Praia da Luz, will be surveyed over the next few days in England.

According to information collected by PortugalDiário, the investigation was requested by the Portuguese authorities through letters rogatory and will be met by British police over the coming weeks.

Apart from interrogations, which should not include the couple McCann, it will still be complied with the search warrant, in order, inter alia, to the seizure of the diary of Kate McCann, the mother of the minor disappeared, May 3 last year, described the relationship with their children.

Maddie: Portuguese and English police met
Parents of Maddie gratified by Portuguese

The steps will be met by British authorities but count with the presence of Portuguese researchers.

"Testimonials divergent and collection of new information"

The eight friends of Kate and Gerry, who passed vacation in Praia da Luz, last May, and other British tourists who were, a pair of former officials of the venture will be reporting on steps aimed essentially determine possible different testimonies and gather new information.

Also according to information collected by PortugalDiário, the process simply no longer be covered by the secrecy of justice, after the full implementation of the investigation.

It is recalled that at the beginning of the year, the prosecutor asked the investigating judge, and this granted, the extension of the secrecy of justice for a further three months. The prosecutor relied on the exceptional complexity of the case.

Abduction, murder and concealment of corpse

Under the law, after eight months on the formation of the first defendant in the case, the Portuguese-British Robert Murata (May 14), the prosecutor should file the case or inferred accusation. Do not having done until January 14, the prosecutor had to request the extension of the period for another three months.

This request of the prosecutor to prohibit the access of parties and the public to the proceeding may be postponed for a maximum period of three months, renewable once by [particularly in crimes against the life and liberty of the people], for a period objectively indispensable the conclusion of the investigation.

It should be noted that throughout the process the thesis of abduction and murder and subsequent concealment of corpses have been addressed.

Besides Murat, also parents of Maddie, Kate and Gerry, consisted defendants in September, for suspected involvement in the disappearance of the minor.

Madeleine McCann, four years old, disappeared May 3 to an apartment in a resort in Praia da Luz, while parents jantavam a restaurant, a few metres away.

Anonymous said...

Penelope1 says:

Hi Viv, like your words about "New Labour". Some formerly die hard Labour neighbours said that they were forced to admit that the Tories had Tony sussed before he even got into power. "New Labour New Danger" Yes, and Tony turned from the cuddly lamb into quite a demon - effectively he is a mass murderer with regard to his contribution to Iraq.

On another thread - an aunt of mine is a social worker, and she says, strictly speaking, the twins should have been removed from the McCanns, as they were guilt of leaving the children alone on successive evenings.

She says when Social Services "went around for tea", the social workers would have given the McCanns a thorough grilling, and should not have taken their "doctor" status into account. (Why should it make any difference anyway? Being a doctor is a job, it doesn't mean you are a superior/more worthwhile human being or even better able to look after children, as the Tapas 9 have proven).

Anyway, my feedback on Labour and the twins.

felicity said...

Hiya Mtoosad

That is a very interesting article and thanks so much for posting it for us.

At least as you say Mari Luz is with the angels and the police have her body for forensic examination which may help to lead to the culprits. Unlike little Maddie, she can also now have a decent burial, but we were still hopeful and it is very sad news. When children go missing like this the prospects are so bleak. Abused children are so often killed to prevent them from giving evidence that may lead to their abuser.

It is very interesting the way the emphasis is on re-interviewing the friends and not Kate and Gerry McCann. Maybe they are just not going to be allowed a second opportunity to explain. They had the chance and they blew it. I think pressure will be brought to bear upon the friends of what they themselves will face, if they do not start telling the truth. Then they can make a clear choice - do they really want to do a long stretch for Kate and Gerry?

I have never seen the word murder used in a press article before - and Noticias is a very reputable newspaper. It would seem we are being prepared for the worst. I recall that as soon as Rebelo took over he drafted in specialist murder squad detectives onto his team from Lisbon.

Great to hear from you again and please continue to post any other useful articles you come across.

Thanks.

Viv x

felicity said...

Supertoll I see you realised how foolish you were to make such a post and decided to remove it. I am afraid I am going to have to put it back. You should remember that all posts on this blog, including deleted ones are recorded on my email programme.

Viv

Auntie Viv,

If you don't like the picture, please let me know.

I know I have been very very naughty and libellous lately, and I don't want to get into any more trouble with the authorities.

Is the picture OK?

Lots of love
ST



Posted by supertroll to JUSTICE FOR MADDIE AND THE TWINS at Friday, March 7, 2008 4:22:00 PM PST

felicity said...

Hiya Penelope

I agree that in relation to Iraq Blair and Bush have an awful lot of human blood on their hands - this was simply terrible. I hope, and I actually believe, that the behaviour of Tony Blair was the source of the constant conflict between Brown and Blair and that now we have Brown in charge, we will see a more accountable and humanitarian approach being adopted.

I also have a close friend who is a child protection social worker and she belives other steps were taken by the Social Services to ensure the safety of the twins. I do not feel able to say any more than that. However, we also agree that unreasonable leniency was demonstrated to the McCanns here, on the basis that removing the twins from their care would have amounted to a clear indication that SSD believed in the guilt of the McCanns. It would have been simply disastrous for them. Deference was being shown to their position in life, effectively putting the McCanns needs ahead of the twins which is contrary to their statutory duty under the Children Act that the welfare of the child must always be paramount - ahead of any parental needs. I am quite certain that if this was the behaviour of the proverbial income support couple from a council estate, the twins would have been immediately removed from their care. I do feel that further harm has been done to the twins by leaving them with the McCanns when, ultimately, they are going to have to be removed. Had this happened when they were just turned two, the damage would have been far less. No matter which way you look at it, the future of these two little ones has been forever blighted by the conduct of their parents and social workers do not always make the right choices to protect children from harm

Viv x

dolores said...

Viv,

Gazeta Digital, 7.12.07


British Police want to question Foreign Office envoys and McCann spokesmen

Alex Woolfall, Sheree Dodd, Clarence Mitchell, David Hughes and Justine McGuiness are some of the personalities that may be questioned, soon, by British Police, in order to clarify specific details of the movements and contacts of the McCann couple, their friends and relatives, in the weeks following Madeleine's disappearance, according to sources from Leicestershire Police. These details are considered “important” to help Portuguese Police to collect more evidence, after investigations in UK produced a new set of informations, given to the PJ team that has been in Leicester, recently. But another inquiry is under way, to find out exactly what was the role of some of the elements sent to Portugal by the Foreign Office, after reports to the British Government raised suspicions about the intention and purpose of several contacts between some of those envoys and the Portuguese authorities.

xx D

Anonymous said...

Penelope1 says:

Hi Viv,

Thanks for your reply. Very informative. Its very sad that it seems to be one law for the middle class and another for the working class. Those poor twins.

Something else that really strikes me, it was once pointed out already, just the once, that no neighours of the McCanns got on the TV to say what good people there are etc etc, as is normal in cases like these. So far its just been Auntie Phil and Kae's parents. The neighbours are being very quiet. I wonder if they have overheard domestic violence?

In Ireland where I live, the "real story" generally comes out through the "mother network". Have you heard any leaks/feedback from the neighbours?

2345 said...

Felicity,

I've e-mailed you. 8.15 a.m.

Atardi said...

Dolores,

Thank you for the article from Gazeta Digital.
It seems like justice will be done for Madeleine.

I just read this one:

McCanns in prayers for Spanish girl

2 hours ago

Gerry and Kate McCann offered their prayers and sympathy to the family of a five-year-old Spanish girl whose badly decomposed remains have been found.

The Civil Guard said the body of Mari Luz Cortes was found floating in an estuary near the southern city of Huelva, just 120 miles away from where Madeleine McCann disappeared.

The child, who disappeared on January 13, was identified because of the clothes she was wearing but further DNA tests will be carried out.

Madeleine, three, went missing from her family's holiday apartment in Praia da Luz, Portugal, on May 3 last year while her parents ate dinner at a nearby tapas bar with friends.

Reports in the Spanish media said the body was found by an oil refinery worker.

Mr and Mrs McCann, from Rothley, Leicestershire, sent Mari Luz's parents messages of support after her disappearance and the British couple had also planned to include her in their poster campaign in Spain.

The McCanns' spokesman, Clarence Mitchell, said: "Kate and Gerry are aware of the reports and it's clearly very upsetting for them.

"Their thoughts and prayers are with her family at this time.

"Kate and Gerry had kept a very close eye on the search for Mari Luz and they felt there was a degree of connection between the two families.

"They sent messages of support after she went missing."
Hosted by Google
Copyright © 2008 The Press Association. All rights reserved.

It's the first article that doesn't end with "The spokesman of the couple said..........".

dianeh said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
2345 said...

Jersey Case - Today's Press :

A victims of the former Jersey Care Home yesterday praised police for showing "light at the end of the tunnel".

A dog trained to detect blood was sent into the basemens and discovered two different spots in the bath .... excavations continue today but will be halted tomorrow to give forensic teams a day off.

Police investigating crimes of sexual abuse at a 2nd childrens home - Portsmouth - have been given a chilling map which pinpoints where suspicious holes were dug.

Shannon - no progress reported.
Mother was reported yesterday as saying she believes she was taken by someone who knew her. 10.30 a.m.

LittleGreyCell said...

11.30

Hello everyone,

Horrible news last night about Marie Luz. What is there left to say?

Dolores: Thanks for the extract from Gazeta Digital. And so there should be an investigation of the underhand stuff that our dear government has been trying to pull off.

THERE NOW FOLLOWS A BLOG HEALTH WARNING: RANT FOLLOWS. READ AT YOUR OWN PERIL

I'm in despair about British politics, to be honest. I was very much a Labour supporter until Tony Blair and his cosy coterie started to treat Parliament as their personal fiefdom.

Of course, dodgy stuff has happened in politics all over the world since organized society became the thing, but for a country supposed to be a liberal democracy, the last 11 years have taken the biscuit...

...the crumbs of which you are not allowed to throw away to be collected by the refuse collectors, excepting alternate Thursdays when Pluto is in Gordon Brown's Uranus. 600 agencies have a legal right to bug your house, council tax has been overcharged to the tune of billions of pounds and kept quiet by the authorities, you're going to have to have your fingerprints taken if you want to fly from Heathrow's Terminal 5, AND give your personal bank account details in order to leave the country from any airport.

Oh, and the Commons is neatly bypassed when the PM has ALREADY committed troops and VAST sums of money to invade other countries for political gain, killing thousands of civilians into the bargain.

And now the powers that be pull all the strings available to them to protect two suspects in the death of their own child, who are determined to avoid justice at all costs, and very likely protecting somebody important who should not have been there, as well. With hysterical consequences.

I've long had the feeling that the British Government would be much happier if we would all leave. Then they could do whatever their over-inflated egos and feelings of superiority required to make them happy.

Personally, The Husband and I have had enough, and when the conditions are right, as Gordon Brown would say, we're off to live elsewhere for the rest of our days.

My son plans a career in the US, and so I won't be abandoning him to a life of ever-decreasing civil rights and ever-increasing governmental observation in every area of his existence.

END OF RANT

This poster will self-destructed in 10 seconds, judging by the stead coming out of her ears...

10, 9, 8......

LittleGreyCell said...

That should have been STEAM coming out of her ears, but that's probably against the law now, too.

ratonthebeam said...

LGC I hope you put the top on your bin right, or the council won't even empty it now! (Headlines in online DX)

LittleGreyCell said...

Yes, I saw that, Rat.

Actually, I'm a little concerned about the bin at the end of my posts here - have I put it out too early?

My local council Bin Monitor (2nd Class) appeared in the Daily Mail a couple of years ago, giving an interview which was subsequently reported in other national outlets: the article concerned what told someone when she wrote in to complain about the new fortnightly rubbish collections - he said we should only eat roast chicken a couple of days before the bin men were due to come, and have fresh fish the day before, so the remains wouldn't have to be smelly for very long. Oh, and we could all keep our perishable rubbish in the freezer.

I wrote to this man (I know you're surprised!) and asked him if central government, who were campaigning to get us all to eat healthily in order to save the NHS money, knew that his council was advising their constituents to survive on Pot Noodles for the best part of two weeks, until such time as the bin men allowed us to have 'real food'.

(I also wrote back to his moronic
response, and he then passed this up the chain; after a few weeks, I got a whole file of bland council policy - which, appropriately enough, was a load of rubbish!)

Cretins.

ratonthebeam said...

I keep all my perishable rubbish in my tyre well. Apparently that is what posh people do.

LittleGreyCell said...

Rat,

Now why didn't I think of that?!

2345 said...

littlegreycell,

Great post .... SPOT ON.

How many husbands sons and fathers gave their lives for Britain's freedom ?

Bliar's sights were obviously set for years on EU Presidency .....
Labour have happily made the British a sacrificial lamb.

I would never have believed the lengths taken to monitor and silence public opinion. Akin to Kenya minus the bullets and torching - same attitude. Now there's steam coming out of my ears !!! 1.05 p.m. .

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
2345 said...

ratonthebeam,

You are hilarious - a real tonic.
1.10 p.m.

2345 said...

Felicity,

I have to say that Kate looks scared absolutely witness in the photo above. When was the photo taken ? 2.15 p.m.

2345 said...

anonymouse,

Yet again, wrong assumption !!!
2.15 p.m.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
hope4truth said...

LGC

I have left a post for you on Alsabelas site re tiny flippers ...

Loved your rant by the way I have been a strong Labour suporter all my life but after the war and what is going on now I will not be voting for them...

I dont think I will be able to put my X in the Con box so will have to find an alternitive maybe I will vote for the Freedom of Refuse collections party???

Di said...

Littlegreycell

Love your posts, just don't get me started on the state of this country, I think the majority of this country feel exactly the same, but we are not able to have our say. Maybe, we should set up a site where we can all have a moan and get it off our chest, or would the powers that be have it shut down!!

Anonymous said...

There are now no blogs on Blogger left operational, to discuss rubbish bins or anything else for that matter. Google have been hacked. It's nothing to do with the McCann case - it's just a major Google server in general. Someone has instigated a DoS (Denial of Service) attack on Google - for whatever perverted reason.

The blogs HAVE NOT repeat HAVE NOT been shut down!

So hopefully we will all be back in action soon.

ratonthebeam 18:29

Anonymous said...

There are now no blogs on Blogger left operational, to discuss rubbish bins or anything else for that matter. Google have been hacked. It's nothing to do with the McCann case - it's just a major Google server in general. Someone has instigated a DoS (Denial of Service) attack on Google - for whatever perverted reason.

The blogs HAVE NOT repeat HAVE NOT been shut down!

So hopefully we will all be back in action soon.

ratonthebeam 18:29

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
felicity said...

Hiya Dolores and all

I have been having real trouble with my internet connection and the ISP's had to call at my home to resolve today, hopefully, I can now stay on line! Also, once I got back on google was down..

Re the report from Gazeta Digital. I think testimony of Woolfall will be very important because he states quite categorically in The Times that Kate was adamant Maddie had just wandered off and had either had an accident or was being cared for by someone. And yet in the very interview within days given to Jane Hill BBC news the McCanns were adamant they knew immediately Madeleine had been abducted. They also changed their account from stating the window had been jemmied/shutters damaged to they just left the door open! These very serious contradiction in their accounts are almost enough to get them convicted without all the further evidence the PJ have. In Jersey we see the dogs producing exactly the same type of evidence they found in the McCann case. Minute specks of blood invisible to the naked eye. The bath in Jersey no doubt got cleaned, just like the McCanns apartment, thanks to these wonderful dogs and other investigative techniques such as luminal/ultra violet, killers cannot completely clean up a crime scene where blood has been spilled. I think it really did not help the McCanns clean up operation that flooring was wooden -parquet. Remember the fuss Rosiepops kicked up about this - trying to insist the floor was tiled, even when there were press pictures of this flooring. Sheree Dodd it would seem was reporting back to Whitehall her concerns about the McCanns attitude and lack of co-operation with the police.

Great to be able to get back on my blog, just reading through some of the rest.

Viv x
Getting on to make this post has been like pulling teeth!

felicity said...

Hiya all

google seems to be working again.

A read of the reports concerning the McCanns setting Carter Ruck onto the Daily Express confirms Clarence is stating it is no article they wrote in particular - it is just that the Express are seen as the "worse offenders".

I can certainly understand the McCanns wishing to silence the press from reporting the testimony of Pamela Fenn, demonstrating the McCanns exposed Madeleine to serious physical and emotional harm - not a parental style one would wish to have broadcast, I am sure:
Daily Express - Thursday August 30,2007: "Mrs Fenn, 81, told the police that two nights before the incident she heard a little girl loudly crying, “Daddy, daddy” in the apartment.

She said the crying had lasted for some time, but stopped when the McCanns returned to the apartment after dinner

2345 said...

ratonthebeam,

How do you know the hackers intentions weren't designed to silence Forum debate ?

DE, yet again, barred online commenting on today's article.
"We'll tell you and you'll keep quiet" attitude !!! 8.55 p.m.

Clarrie must be tearing his hair over his inability to stop blogs and Forums. I'll lay money on him being behind today's disruptions.
9.00 p.m.

felicity said...

Hiya 2345

I think you make a good point. The money and power behind the McCanns knows no bounds it would seem. Just as the PJ are about to return there is a concerted attack on the media emanating from Team McCann - picking out the Daily Express as the "worst offenders" which is somewhat perverse given they just copies the Daily Mail almost every single day.

It is not inconceivable that as part of this concerted attack to stop adverse comment they would also target google, given that it is their blogs, such as this one, that are enabling former contributors to the Daily Express forum to continue to post their comments, which the McCanns quite obviously wish to stop as the case against them builds yet stronger.

Viv x

2345 said...

Felicity,

It's the behaviour behind the money that knows no bounds and is, frankly, mind blowing. 1.30 p.m.